Eligibility Rules, Okay

[BonnieShels]

Like Marc Wilson?

[ArdeeBhoy]

Er, no.

Clearly BS, you need to read up on the current Finance minister for the North's talking shop...
;)

[Not Brazil]

Gerry got a few things wrong in the Sunday Life.

He was eulogising about our great young prospects across the water and cited, amongst others, Daniel Devine and Neil Dougan at PNE.

I thought Daniel Devine has opted for the South?

Neil Dougan came home in the summer and is currently playing for, err, Linfield Swifts.:rolleyes:

[Not Brazil]

http://i805.photobucket.com/albums/yy337/Mr_Parker2009/scan0099.jpg


Didn't take long for Gerry to do his "research", did it?


http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/15936970.stm

[dantheman]

"As a young Roman Catholic growing up in loyal West Belfast, I enjoyed a successful career on the mainland after I ditched the old bogball. But being a proud Ulsterman, I loved nothing more than pulling on the green (lol) jersey of British Ulster. My favorite match was against the Eire (or the Bosco XI as I called them - lol), I took great pride in jousting with the old enemy. Just like my hero King Billy in 1690.

Now lets puts this anthem issue to bed. GSTQ is our anthem, our British anthem. Ulster is British soil, just like the Falklands. Or Gibraltar. I cannot see why those young RC's (like James McLean - Would you like a chicken supper? lol) can't raise their little papist heads in pride to bless her Protestant majesty. Typical RC's, they hate everything English bar their dole cheques (lol). Now sing up Taigy, sing up with pride..


"God save our gracious Queen,
Long live our noble Queen,
God save the Queen:

No surrender!!!

Send her victorious,
Happy and glorious,
Long to reign over us:
God save the Queen.

Lord, grant that Marshal Wade,
May by thy mighty aid,
Victory bring.
May he sedition hush,
and like a torrent rush,
Rebellious Provos to crush (raise your head Darron Gibson lol),
God save the Queen."

[Predator]

Weren't there murmurs that this column was ghost-written by the sports editor?

[The Fly]

Someone alert the FAI about that Eastleigh player :D

...or just get Sean Scannell's brother Damian on the case.

[ArdeeBhoy]

According to RTE, Agent Gerry has applied for a certain sports management job based in Beal-feirste. Surely not? Or are we into the silly season stories now...
http://www.rte.ie/sport/soccer/2011/1213/armstrongg.html

[The Fly]

Weren't there murmurs that this column was ghost-written by the sports editor?

I'd say that's probable as I can't imagine a Catholic using the 'Roman' prefix.

[BonnieShels]

Er, no.

Clearly BS, you need to read up on the current Finance minister for the North's talking shop...
;)

Yeah, Mr Sammy "I'm British not Irish" Wilson isn't a soccer player though...

[ArdeeBhoy]

Well spotted. He's a bit past it, age-wise. But they do share, er, the same name!

And thought you were the one who enjoyed 'the circularity of the topics' ??
:rolleyes:


@ The Fly;Unless of course they were singing " Roamin' in the Gloamin' ", though that would doubtless be considered unsuitable by some on here.

[BonnieShels]

Well spotted. He's a bit past it, age-wise. But they do share, er, the same name!

Ah come on!!!

[boovidge]

...or just get Sean Scannell's brother Damian on the case.

Has Gerry Armstrong written about him?

[DannyInvincible]

So what we would gain in support from one side of the great divide that still sadly very much exists, we would lose from the other.

That's kind of what compromise is...


Those from backgrounds where political views are more extreme will never be persuaded...

It has nothing to do with "extreme" political views. It's a simple matter of national identity.

[geysir]

Marc Wilson could switch back to NI if he was so inclined. He has not been capped competively at senior level for us, therefore he is not tied.
He wasn't capped by NI at any underage competitive level before he played for us. He still can use the option in Article 18 to change once and decide to go North, if they wanted him, i.e. if he hasn't received their version of the indelible mark of Cain.

[The Fly]

Has Gerry Armstrong written about him?

No, he plays for Eastleigh FC.

[Olé Olé]

Has Gerry Armstrong written about him?

Actually, isn't the Scannell's father from Armagh? Hence, they can play for the North, as well as Ireland. Another one that slipped through the North's fingers, if that is the case. Scannell's consistently played under-age with Ireland and a name like Scannell is slightly suggestive of a nationalist background so I presume the North was never an option when he was choosing which side to play for.

[Olé Olé]

Actually, isn't the Scannell's father from Armagh? Hence, they can play for the North, as well as Ireland. Another one that slipped through the North's fingers, if that is the case. Scannell's consistently played under-age with Ireland and a name like Scannell is slightly suggestive of a nationalist background so I presume the North was never an option when he was choosing which side to play for.

http://www.cpfc.org/forums/archive/index.php/t-189817.html

F (http://www.cpfc.org/forums/archive/index.php/t-189817.html)ound the answer. Is grandfather was from Monaghan.

[Lionel Ritchie]

So Gerrys been talking to his neighbour Gary about a new NI specific anthem?

So is it going to be called "Towering wet-knickers chorus" or will that just be the mantra from same?

Xylophone dinks (2 barres), downstroked tele (2 barres), mumbled verse (4 barres), pause (4 beats), Towering wet-knickers chorus (4 barres).....

[liamoo11]

Rauiri Croskery striker from annsborough signed for man utd he is under 16 and played for the norths under15s this year. Possible ireland player for future if the north does not manage to become more visibly inclusive

[DannyInvincible]

It remains to be seen what impact, if any, the appointment of Michael O'Neill as manager of the IFA's senior team will have on matters. I recall MNS did a feature on the eligibility issue during the Summer (I think it was around our fixture with NI in the Carling Nations Cup) and O'Neill gave his two cents on things. He didn't appear to be up-to-speed with the rules, but then he was with Rovers and wasn't the manager of an international team at the time. I remember he talked of limiting the number of times a player eligible for more than one association may change his allegiance throughout his career, seemingly failing to realise there already was a limit of one change in place, and also suggested the introduction of an age cap by which a player's allegiance ought to be decided if already capped by an original association. The problem with that is that FIFA scrapped the age cap from their statutes a few years ago.

[French Toasht]

The appointment of O'Neill is completely inconsequential with regard to the eligibility issue. The CAS judgment has dealt with this issue comprehensively and whatever personnel come in and out in the IFA will have absolutely no impact when it comes to changing the status quo.

As regards footballing matters, NI have got themselves a good manager, without a doubt but I feel the task he faces is similar to that with Rovers in the Europa group stages, the gulf in class is simple to vast to make a difference.

[DannyInvincible]

The appointment of O'Neill is completely inconsequential with regard to the eligibility issue. The CAS judgment has dealt with this issue comprehensively and whatever personnel come in and out in the IFA will have absolutely no impact when it comes to changing the status quo.

That's true. I'd been more wondering how young undecided players from nationalist backgrounds might take to him as someone from a nationalist background who played for NI and managed a team in the League of Ireland. If even they're aware of his story. I'd heard the name before, but it wasn't until he took over at Shamrock Rovers that he really entered my conscience of thought.

[Charlie Darwin]

How did they take to Sammy McIlroy?

[geysir]

Is O'Neill the first NI manager with a nationalist background?
Sounds to me, the IFA wanted to appoint someone like that, with some football credentials of course and he was their only candidate.
He won't rock the IFA boat.
It's an unusual situation for an association to have to think for ways to persuade players, who not that way inclined, to chose the IFA.

[seanfhear]

Is O'Neill the first NI manager with a nationalist background?
Sounds to me, the IFA wanted to appoint someone like that, with some football credentials of course and he was their only candidate.
He won't rock the IFA boat.
It's an unusual situation for an association to have to think for ways to persuade players, who not that way inclined, to chose the IFA.
In fairness based on most recent managerial performance I would go for O'Neill myself.

Dowie started well a few years ago but it went downhill at a fair belt. Magilton was average at Ipswich and was again average at QPR. And there has'nt exactly been a stack of clubs after Dowie or Magilton which is a tad surprising because when you get on the managerial carousel the same people often keep re-appearing.

[Not Brazil]

Is O'Neill the first NI manager with a nationalist background?
Sounds to me, the IFA wanted to appoint someone like that, with some football credentials of course and he was their only candidate.


His "nationalist background" will not have been a factor in the IFA's decision making process.

None of the candidates on the IFA's final shortlist of three are from a "unionist background", unless you bracket Dowie in that categoiry.

[geysir]

His "nationalist background" will not have been a factor in the IFA's decision making process.

None of the candidates on the IFA's final shortlist of three are from a "unionist background", unless you bracket Dowie in that categoiry.
I did not claim that any of the candidates were from a Unionist background, however, Dowie is not from a Nationalist background. And O'Neill is the first nationalist manager appointed as manager of NI.
It's true that I can't read the minds of the IFA but I would not dismiss the 'nationalist background having an influence' theory out of hand.
There are 2 issues, NI needs a capable manager and the fear that the trend of nationalists declaring for the FAI will continue. O'Neill has genuine credentials but nothing too spectacular that would stand him above Dowie and Magilton and none of those 3 come close to the experience of Kerr whose interest in the job was not even acknowledged. I would guess that O'Neill would have been third choice of the 3, by the OWC fans.
Seeing as you can read the minds of the IFA, what was the factor in the IFA's decision making process that perceived Kerr as not even being worthy of a response?

[Predator]

Seeing as you can read the minds of the IFA, what was the factor in the IFA's decision making process that perceived Kerr as not even being worthy of a response?This, too, confused me. Those who were against Kerr, suggested that he "started the poaching".

[geysir]

Well, Kerr had made welcome (from the IFA perspective) statements about how the eligibility situation, as it developed, had unfair affects on the IFA and was in favour of some restrictions being imposed.

[Predator]

Well, Kerr had made welcome (from the IFA perspective) statements about how the eligibility situation, as it developed, had unfair affects on the IFA and was in favour of some restrictions being imposed.Indeed. Like Iain Dowie, he also has "blood connections" to OWC, so to exclude him on grounds of not being connected to Norlin Airlann, would be strange. I wonder does his being a Dub have anything to do with it? Or the fact that his Faroe Islands team frustrated the IFA's efforts during qualification and managed what Worthington could not in beating Estonia.

The IFA will hope that Michael O'Neill can replicate the success he achieved at Shamrock Rovers: bringing an Irish team to the group stages of a European tournament. Although Kerr's past successes with Irish teams seem to have been unduly overlooked.

[ArdeeBhoy]

Of course Michael O'N's background was an issue.
As in potentially appeasing nationalist defectors.

But to be fair to the North, Fergie, Moanrinhio & Guardiola could all jointly be in charge and they'd still be sh*te.
They just don't have the players, currently.

And be interesting to see if they ever will, again...

[Mr_Parker]

Well, Kerr had made welcome (from the IFA perspective) statements about how the eligibility situation, as it developed, had unfair affects on the IFA and was in favour of some restrictions being imposed.

You mean Kerr talked out of his arse like so many others. :)

[DannyInvincible]

Interesting photo of Liam Boyce with two Cliftonville players in the Felons Club, Belfast the other night (tweeted by himself): http://yfrog.com/od8x1vtj

Didn't go down too well on OWC.

[ArdeeBhoy]

Maybe Michael O'Neill will also pop in, along with 'Agent Gerry'?

[Not Brazil]

what was the factor in the IFA's decision making process that perceived Kerr as not even being worthy of a response?

I honestly don't know - he would have been my choice, for sure.

[ifk101]

Good luck Michael O'Neill anyways. Any word on his number two?

[DannyInvincible]

I honestly don't know - he would have been my choice, for sure.

Isn't Kerr friendly with figures within the IFA? I know he shared the IFA's flight from the Faroe Islands after their game and I think I recall you having spoken of his attendance at functions or something of the sort run/organised by the IFA.

[geysir]

A beggar getting a lift with the IFA, with the barely concealed satisfied grin of a job well done.
Maybe the IFA have a different recollection of their time, sharing the ride home with Brian :)

[ifk101]

That is my primary objective – to restore a sense of belief and pride in what it means to represent Northern Ireland so that our players will want only to play for their country. That is how it should be.

http://www.irishfa.com/news/item/6981/irish-fa-announce-new-international-manager/

Off to a good start.

[BonnieShels]

Taking bets on the first usage of "Roman".

[Predator]

O'Neill has not disputed the right to change, but he has said that he doesn't think playing for your national team is what international football is about. One wonders what he thinks international football is about. Confusion reigns.

[Not Brazil]

Isn't Kerr friendly with figures within the IFA? I know he shared the IFA's flight from the Faroe Islands after their game and I think I recall you having spoken of his attendance at functions or something of the sort run/organised by the IFA.

Indeed.

He has spoken at various events organised by the IFA Community Relations Department.

I interviewed him at one such event.

To be effectively ignored for the post surprised me and many others.

[DannyInvincible]

"New NI boss Michael O'Neill 'will tackle' eligibility issue": http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/football/16353548.stm

Contains an audible interview with former NI goalkeeper Tommy Wright.


Tommy Wright believes new Northern Ireland manager Michael O'Neill will tackle "head on" the issue of players switching to the Republic of Ireland.

Former Northern Ireland keeper Wright, a close of friend of O'Neill, believes the new manager will use his "personal skills" to convince players to stay with the country of their birth.

...

"Also some of the players who have gone to play for the Republic haven't been capped yet (by the Republic) so the door can still be opened to them.

"Michael will work hard to get as many people as possible available for selection."

Northern Ireland-born players who have switched to the Republic but have not yet been capped in competitive internationals include Stoke's Marc Wilson and Preston's Daniel Devine.

Not sure about Devine but surely Marc Wilson has been capped in a competitive international given he's been playing for our teams since under-18 level?

Also came across this nugget on OWC yesterday:


Another question surrounding eligibilty..

Is there an existing NI international, born outside of the UK, that posseses only an Irish passport?

If so, would that prove that irish nationality allows you to play for 2 diffent countries and therefore the same conditions that apply to the home nations would also apply. i.e. you, your parents, or grandparents have to have been born in the area of the association that you want to play for.

The subsequent face-palm hurt more than my Christmas hangover, and that had been pretty bad.

[DannyInvincible]

"Capello hits out at player 'theft'": http://uk.eurosport.yahoo.com/29122011/63/capello-hits-player-theft.html


Fabio Capello has questioned Germany's use of players with Turkish origin at last summer's World Cup and called upon football's rulers to end the "theft of talent" that goes on between teams.

England's 4-1 defeat to the Germans in Bloemfontein remains a major stain on his otherwise impressive managerial CV. The Three Lions were completely undone by a squad that contained 11 players who had an opportunity to represent another country, including star man Mesut Ozil, plus Miroslav Klose and Lukas Podolski, who both scored in the rout.

"A line needs to be drawn," Capello said, in comments reported at the Dubai International Sports Conference. "Richer clubs are talent-scouting and stealing players by bidding higher and not thinking about the consequences for those countries."

He added: "These players are acquiring new passports. Germany had five of Turkish origin who opted to represent them and we all know what happened. Problems need to be addressed. Decisions need to be made. Players can be bought, especially when they come from poorer backgrounds, where their families need the financial resources.

...

He denied the accusation of double standards given he has capped Manchester United striker Danny Welbeck, much to the frustration of Ghana, who were hopeful of persuading the 21-year-old Mancunian to represent the country of his parents' origin.

Capello said: "Ghanaian journalists have asked me why I selected Danny Welbeck to play for England because now he cannot represent Ghana. But this isn't true. He was already at Manchester United. Before the selection I called his father and asked if I could select the boy. The father took time before agreeing to the selection."

"It was a personal decision, I spoke to the family and they were fine with their son playing for England. He was born and brought up in England. The rest of the German national team players were born in Germany or have never played for the national team of their origin."

I think Capello could do a bit of homework. There is no difference in theory that I can see between, say, Mesut Özil and Danny Welbeck.

Matthias Sammer responded critically: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-2080424/Fabio-Capellos-recruitment-comments-shared.html


But Federation sporting director Matthias Sammer insisted Germany were blameless and that Capello had failed to grasp how immigrants settling there deserved equal opportunities.

Ozil was born in Gelsenkirchen, as a third-generation immigrant, and although his World Cup team-mates Lukas Podolski and Miroslav Klose were born in Poland, they moved to Germany as small children.

'Immigration is a social development that we react to in a proper way and I can assure Capello that we never entice players away from other countries,' said Sammer.

'That is something we would never even contemplate and I simply cannot understand what he is saying. It is the duty of sport to welcome players under these circumstances.

'When our country opens its doors to immigrants, so does the Federation and that is only right.'

[Charlie Darwin]

It's probably worth pointing out that Capello is a moron.

[BonnieShels]

Sure wasn't it only fairly recently that the DFB relaxed the rules on who could actually represent Germany.
As far as I am aware and someone correct me if I'm wrong but there was some rule in placed that said that only "pure" Germans aka those with a German mother and father who have a German mother and father could represent Germany hence the seeming influx from the year 2000 or so.

Heading out the door now for beer so haven't got time to check that one out but it is in my mind's eye that some rule like this existed.

Also, whilst we are on the subject, It seemed that Capello didn't see France from 1998 onwards eh?

[Stuttgart88]

If Capello's point relates to clubs poaching players from all parts of the world, rather than national federations poaching players, then I'm fine with that.

Of course it's great that a kid from a latin American backstreet can carve a career at a club like Barcelona or wherever, but let's face it - despite FIFA's rules on exploitation of young talent, exploitation is exactly what goes on. Nobody hears about the losers separated from their families as teenagers who don't become stars. An article in 442 recently (the same issue that highlighted the holistic and unified approach taken to youth development in Uruguay - October?) spoke of children being lured from desperately poor African villages, just as young girls are from poor eastern Europe. Modern day slavery basically.

One one hand Arsenal can be commended for blooding Cesc Fabregas at 16, but the only reason they got anywhere near him was because the minimum legal age for awarding a prefessional contact was lower in UK than in Spain.

Football does great things for underprivileged children globally, but the flipside is that many are badly exploited and we casually support it by admiring the end-product of the relatively few who benefit. Football needs to get serious about its moral responsibilities, and international labour law needs to recognise the exceptions posed in the football context.

[Wolfman]

Except that's as likely as the equally admirable aim of 'World Peace' ?

[geysir]

It's probably worth pointing out that Capello is a moron.
Quite an astonishing display of ignorance by Capello.