Eligibility Rules, Okay

[French Toasht]

More blinkered ignorance here. The guy at 1.10 takes the biscuit ...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U9eUqQY3ukc&feature=related

[Carrigaline]

I think you'll find that the "hard core" OWCers will be secretly quite happy for you to reach the FinalsPull the other one.

[Predator]

A kid from the college described Gerry as "an absolute legend". There was a lot of talk about the requirements of the modern day footballer.

[DannyInvincible]

A kid from the college described Gerry as "an absolute legend".

I'd be surprised if he can still remember the visit come Friday night. :p

[Predator]

He may have been referring to Gerry's comedy career, we just don't know.

[nigel-harps1954]

More blinkered ignorance here. The guy at 1.10 takes the biscuit ...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U9eUqQY3ukc&feature=related

Shay Given? He was born in Lifford...last time I checked thats in the Republic..


EDIT: ..and Darron Gibson was born in Derry, not Belfast? Open to correction on that though..

[Charlie Darwin]

As far as I know, the closest hospital to Lifford is in Strabane. The rumour was that Shay had been born there so was technically Northern Irish. He's since clarified that he was born in the family home, which just goes to show the lengths sectarians like Mr. and Mrs. Given will go to in cahoots with the FAI to poach our wee players.

[DannyInvincible]

Shay Given? He was born in Lifford...last time I checked thats in the Republic..


EDIT: ..and Darron Gibson was born in Derry, not Belfast? Open to correction on that though..

That video's done the rounds, but never fails to amuse. Funnily enough, had the Boundary Commission gone through with amending the then-provisional border as was planned, I'm pretty certain Lifford and surrounding towns like Convoy and Raphoe in the Laggan district of Donegal would be on the other side of the border today. And of course, you're correct; Gibson was born in Derry.

So, beware, folks; that's what happens when you mix drink and raw, unbridled ignorance on the bus down!


As far as I know, the closest hospital to Lifford is in Strabane. The rumour was that Shay had been born there so was technically Northern Irish. He's since clarified that he was born in the family home, which just goes to show the lengths sectarians like Mr. and Mrs. Given will go to in cahoots with the FAI to poach our wee players.

Ha, that drew a bit of an unexpected guffaw out of me. There's actually a community hospital in Lifford, although I believe its focus is mainly on geriatrics. Not aware of any hospital in Strabane, mind. I think the rumour always was that Shay was born in Altnagelvin hospital in Derry city. It was actually Shay's younger brother, Paul, who was born in Altnagelvin though; an especially sly move by the Given clan given that the general hospital in Letterkenny was equidistant from Lifford and Paul would later turn out to be an inferior goalkeeper. Quelle surprise! And worse; Mrs. Given a Castlederg native herself! The utter shame...

[gastric]

I aplogise to all contributors for my earlier utterances as this thread is certainly back to life. It will even more alive after we qualify next week!

[ArdeeBhoy]

A kid from the college described Gerry as "an absolute legend".

Gerry has a nephew (or love-child) in Doire shock??

[ArdeeBhoy]

Shay Given? He was born in Lifford...

Aye, met his auld fella, who assured me young Shay was born in the homestead and guffawed at the bigots suggesting otherwise....

[DannyInvincible]

Some more on Gerry's visit to St. Columb's (including video): http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/northern_ireland/15668049.stm


Northern Ireland legend Gerry Armstrong pays a visit to a school in Derry as part of his role as an ambassador for the IFA.

Armstrong has been tasked with persuading young players from a nationalist background to declare for Northern Ireland.

The former Tottenham Hotspur, Watford and Real Mallorca player outlined to pupils of St Columb's College how he played hurling for Antrim before playing for Northern Ireland.

Another former Northern Ireland player, John Crossan, says he still has work to do.

[BonnieShels]

I think you'll find that the "hard core" OWCers will be secretly quite happy for you to reach the Finals - it'll give them at least three teams to cheer on next summer.

I think that people completely missed your point here. Gave a me a wry smile. :)

[gastric]

I think that people completely missed your point here. Gave a me a wry smile. :)

No, I don't think a lot us did, just expected such bitterness from a delusional individual.

[Charlie Darwin]

Ha, that drew a bit of an unexpected guffaw out of me. There's actually a community hospital in Lifford, although I believe its focus is mainly on geriatrics. Not aware of any hospital in Strabane, mind. I think the rumour always was that Shay was born in Altnagelvin hospital in Derry city. It was actually Shay's younger brother, Paul, who was born in Altnagelvin though; an especially sly move by the Given clan given that the general hospital in Letterkenny was equidistant from Lifford and Paul would later turn out to be an inferior goalkeeper. Quelle surprise!
Ah that sounds familiar. Not sure why I thought it was Strabane - probably just have such a dim view of the health service down here that I think every town in de North is packed with beautiful NHS hospitals.


And worse; Mrs. Given a Castlederg native herself! The utter shame...
Turncoat!

[BonnieShels]

Gerry on being asked had he ever thought about playing for Ireland: "I've been asked the question loads of times... and the answer is absolutely not. I've asked the same question to a lot of other team-mates; the likes of Pat Jennings and people like that (People like what? Fellow "Taigs"?)... that has never been something that I would have considered, but you know, it's something that has been considered obviously, we've lost players from the north, there's a boy, Paul George, who plays for Celtic who has now thrown his hat (His bowler?) in with the republic and I would wish them good luck and I hope they have a good career, but as I say, I'm just trying to make sure that they are aware that there are pitfalls (What pitfalls? He may not get selected for his country?). Sometimes family and friends think it's a good idea and they are higher-ranked than us in world football and they have had more success, and they might even qualify for the European Championships in the next 7 or 8 days. But it's just the ?feeling/fear? of an identity, an identity that I felt that I was always very proud to play for Northern Ireland and very proud to come from Belfast and represent Belfast, Ulster and Northern Ireland; so those are the things that I taught the players. You know we've interviewed some of the boys and the boys that we have interviewed; and it's nothing to do with me, have all said that they want to play for Northern Ireland. They want to give back what Northern Ireland has given to them because we've coached them over the last 5 or 6 years and the reason they're actually performing at this level is because of the coaching they've received."

[BonnieShels]

No, I don't think a lot us did, just expected such bitterness from a delusional individual.

I think NB is one of the less bitter ones.

[BonnieShels]

What sort of amazing bloody coaching do the IFA give these players? We need to know about this!

[DannyInvincible]

Gerry on being asked had he ever thought about playing for Ireland: "I've been asked the question loads of times... and the answer is absolutely not. I've asked the same question to a lot of other team-mates; the likes of Pat Jennings and people like that (People like what? Fellow "Taigs"?)... that has never been something that I would have considered, but you know, it's something that has been considered obviously, we've lost players from the north, there's a boy, Paul George, who plays for Celtic who has now thrown his hat (His bowler?) in with the republic and I would wish them good luck and I hope they have a good career, but as I say, I'm just trying to make sure that they are aware that there are pitfalls (What pitfalls? He may not get selected for his country?). Sometimes family and friends think it's a good idea and they are higher-ranked than us in world football and they have had more success, and they might even qualify for the European Championships in the next 7 or 8 days. But it's just the ?feeling/fear? of an identity, an identity that I felt that I was always very proud to play for Northern Ireland and very proud to come from Belfast and represent Belfast, Ulster and Northern Ireland; so those are the things that I taught the players. You know we've interviewed some of the boys and the boys that we have interviewed; and it's nothing to do with me, have all said that they want to play for Northern Ireland. They want to give back what Northern Ireland has given to them because we've coached them over the last 5 or 6 years and the reason they're actually performing at this level is because of the coaching they've received."

Gerry goes on about northern-born players from the nationalist community experiencing family and peer pressure in the BBC video as well, but that's a very cynical way of viewing things. "Pressure" is just a pejorative term used in an attempt to disparage or invalidate what is in reality nothing more or less than a national-cultural identity.


I think NB is one of the less bitter ones.

Aye, but what about his delusions? :p

[BonnieShels]

Can't help residents' of Narnia with their delusions. I can help their bitterness. Show them the light and they will see positivity.

[TrapAPony]

:giggle:Gerry Armstrong is deluded. There is nothing going to stop players from a nationalist background from playing for their country no matter what he does.

[ifk101]

So Gerry's sales argument comes down to three points;
1. You'll regret it (players regret switching. Nobody regrets staying with the North)
2. Comaraderie, 1980's style
3. Opportunity (you won't get your game with the Republik - ie you're useless, accept it, we're useless, play with us)

[ArdeeBhoy]

Point 3 is his only 'selling' point. No self-respecting nationalist with any ability would really want to bother their ass at this stage?

[nigel-harps1954]

As far as I know, the closest hospital to Lifford is in Strabane. The rumour was that Shay had been born there so was technically Northern Irish. He's since clarified that he was born in the family home, which just goes to show the lengths sectarians like Mr. and Mrs. Given will go to in cahoots with the FAI to poach our wee players.

Uh...yeah. There's no hospital in Strabane..and there is one in Lifford. No idea where you got that out of!

EDIT: Didn't see your other post. Sorry.


probably just have such a dim view of the health service down here that I think every town in de North is packed with beautiful NHS hospitals.


Turncoat!

You'd be surprised to hear it's probably worse up the west end of the north. Apart from Altnagelvin I can't think of a decent hospital apart from Enniskillen on the west side of N.Ire

[geysir]

:giggle:Gerry Armstrong is deluded. There is nothing going to stop players from a nationalist background from playing for their country no matter what he does.
John Crossan concurs with you, quote from him in the BBC video "Gerry is a cult hero around here, ….. maybe,….. maybe he can persuade a wee bit but it's still going to be very difficult for him"

Gerry appeared reluctant in the BBC video to use the nationalist identity as a reason why kids looks south, instead he concedes that a 'kid maybe has an affiliation' ….. perhaps arising out of being brainwashed by family and friends?

[Predator]

Jobby Crossan might be a wee bit out of touch these days. I wouldn't consider Armstrong a cult hero. I suppose he's being diplomatic.

[DannyInvincible]

Jobby Crossan might be a wee bit out of touch these days. I wouldn't consider Armstrong a cult hero. I suppose he's being diplomatic.

Speaking of Jobby, and going slightly off-topic, the interesting story of his 1959 life-ban from football featured on the Guardian site the other week: http://www.guardian.co.uk/sport/blog/2011/nov/02/forgotten-story-john-crossan-ban?CMP=EMCFTBEML853

[DannyInvincible]

So Gerry's sales argument comes down to three points;
1. You'll regret it (players regret switching. Nobody regrets staying with the North)
2. Comaraderie, 1980's style
3. Opportunity (you won't get your game with the Republik - ie you're useless, accept it, we're useless, play with us)

Are these the motivations NI fans want players representing IFA teams to possess?

[geysir]

Jobby Crossan might be a wee bit out of touch these days. I wouldn't consider Armstrong a cult hero. I suppose he's being diplomatic.

Then I will alter his quote to read "Gerry is a cult hero around here - maybe,….. maybe he can persuade a wee bit but it's still going to be very difficult for him".

[Predator]

Then I will alter his quote to read "Gerry is a cult hero around here - maybe,….. maybe he can persuade a wee bit but it's still going to be very difficult for him".It's all about the nuances. Maybe I underestimated Jobby, he's always got his (good) eye on the ball.

[DannyInvincible]

'Gerry Armstrong warns Derry footballers about Republic switch': http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-15656709


The 1998 Good Friday Agreement ruled that anyone from Northern Ireland can designate themselves to be British or Irish and FIFA have recognised this by letting players decide to pursue an international career with the Republic.

:rolleyes:

[BonnieShels]

Jaysus. When will it end?

[geysir]

It's all about the nuances. Maybe I underestimated Jobby, he's always got his (good) eye on the ball.

How about -

It's all about the nuances maybe. I underestimated Jobby, he's always got his (good) eye on the ball

[Not Brazil]

No, I don't think a lot us did, just expected such bitterness from a delusional individual.

Say, what?:D

[TrapAPony]

Good to see that Northern Ireland youth players are taking Gerry Armstrong seriously :

shaymccartan shay mccartan
Really hope ireland win tonight,can't believe its been nearly ten years since the world cup in japan #gettingold

CBrennan44 Conor Brennan
Estoina down to 10' brilliant opportunity to get a few goals for Ireland! #qualification

rmckeown23 Rory McKeown
Can't believe that Estonia team beat N.Ireland 4-1 haha. Cmon the boys #trapsarmy

RyanMcL2 Ryan McLaughlin
What a great night, the Irish are taking over Poland cmonnnnnnn :)

lee_toland Lee-ryan Toland
Ireland for the euros #sohappy ☺☺☺

[Predator]

How about -

It's all about the nuances maybe. I underestimated Jobby, he's always got his (good) eye on the ballYou're like a cat with a ball of yarn, toying! I did underestimate Jobby. There I said it!

[boovidge]

Those guys on Twitter are predictably getting a fair amount of abuse.

[Sullivinho]

Those guys on Twitter are predictably getting a fair amount of abuse.

Rory has a solution:

rmckeown23 Rory McKeown
@Liambo9 mo chara! We'll speak in irish and they can't abuse haha.

[co. down green]

Good to see that Northern Ireland youth players are taking Gerry Armstrong seriously :

shaymccartan shay mccartan
Really hope ireland win tonight,can't believe its been nearly ten years since the world cup in japan #gettingold

CBrennan44 Conor Brennan
Estoina down to 10' brilliant opportunity to get a few goals for Ireland! #qualification

rmckeown23 Rory McKeown
Can't believe that Estonia team beat N.Ireland 4-1 haha. Cmon the boys #trapsarmy

RyanMcL2 Ryan McLaughlin
What a great night, the Irish are taking over Poland cmonnnnnnn :)

lee_toland Lee-ryan Toland
Ireland for the euros #sohappy ☺☺☺

Come on lads..you know you want to... :D

[Predator]

It must be a bit of a blow to hear that the players you support don't even support the team they play for. Sure, they give 100% on the pitch, but they're more passionate about watching their real international team.

[dantheman]

It must be a bit of a blow to hear that the players you support don't even support the team they play for. Sure, they give 100% on the pitch, but they're more passionate about watching their real international team.

The day will happen when a NI player refuses to play in a match/meet up with a squad because he'd rather watch the Republic on telly.

Mark my words

[liamoo11]

some interesting future talent there in fairness. Mcloughlin is supposed to be a very good attacking right full for liverpool and Conlon highly thought of striker at celtic

[Predator]

It's very silly of OWCers to seize upon this obvious reality and chastise their own players.

[Olé Olé]

Good to see that Northern Ireland youth players are taking Gerry Armstrong seriously :

shaymccartan shay mccartan
Really hope ireland win tonight,can't believe its been nearly ten years since the world cup in japan #gettingold

CBrennan44 Conor Brennan
Estoina down to 10' brilliant opportunity to get a few goals for Ireland! #qualification

rmckeown23 Rory McKeown
Can't believe that Estonia team beat N.Ireland 4-1 haha. Cmon the boys #trapsarmy

RyanMcL2 Ryan McLaughlin
What a great night, the Irish are taking over Poland cmonnnnnnn :)

lee_toland Lee-ryan Toland
Ireland for the euros #sohappy ☺☺☺

Haha Gerry has his work cut out for him. A few alleged whispers in the ear from someone in the FAI would be one of the last things needed to urge those young lads to play for the South. Also, qualifying for the Euro's could see a spike in Northern players switching allegiance.

Is that the same Shay McCartan that I saw playing for Down minors before? I'd say there's a fairly comprehensive list of present or past professional footballers who have played for their county minor team in the Ulster Championship; McCartan, Lennon, O'Neill, Ferguson, McGinn...

[Olé Olé]

Brilliant post about the tweets. Sums up the scenario fairly well.

Is that the same Shay McCartan that I saw playing for Down minors this year or last? I'd say you could draw up a fairly good list of Northern professional soccer players who represented their county in GAA too; O'Neill, Lennon, Ferguson, McCartan, McGinn...Armstrong himself?

[Charlie Darwin]

The players dealt with it very well from what I saw. Seem like a level-headed bunch.

[gastric]

Good to see that Northern Ireland youth players are taking Gerry Armstrong seriously :

shaymccartan shay mccartan
Really hope ireland win tonight,can't believe its been nearly ten years since the world cup in japan #gettingold

CBrennan44 Conor Brennan
Estoina down to 10' brilliant opportunity to get a few goals for Ireland! #qualification

rmckeown23 Rory McKeown
Can't believe that Estonia team beat N.Ireland 4-1 haha. Cmon the boys #trapsarmy

RyanMcL2 Ryan McLaughlin
What a great night, the Irish are taking over Poland cmonnnnnnn :)

lee_toland Lee-ryan Toland
Ireland for the euros #sohappy ☺☺☺



It's this kind of crap that continues to alienate Catholics in NI. It angers me at this Unionists type attitude to those who decide to play for us, as being in some way treacherous in their decisions. This antiquated attitude is something even the English themselves don't possess. Hopefully, many of those who are mentioned above will play for a country which judges them on their abilities, not their background.

http://www.independent.ie/breaking-news/national-news/orangemen-at-no10-over-catholic-ban-2933227.html

[Gather round]

Hopefully, many of those who are mentioned above will play for a country which judges them on their abilities, not their background

They already have.

[ArdeeBhoy]

Like who??

[DannyInvincible]

'Gerry Armstrong: 1972 withdrawal has caused player problem': http://www.derryjournal.com/sport/football/1972_withdrawal_has_caused_player_problem_1_323765 0


GERRY Armstrong believes Derry City’s withdrawal from the Irish League in 1972 has had a long-standing and detrimental affect on the association’s image within the North-West region

Whilst the club's membership of the League of Ireland may aid its players' access to the FAI and vice versa, I don't think it would be correct at all to attribute the declarations of northern-born players for the FAI to Derry's withdrawal from the Irish League in 1972. To do so is to completely misunderstand the crux of the issue, again. Derry's withdrawal from the Irish League was a symptom of a beast similar and very much related to that which has caused and prolonged the eligibility dispute. Anyway, plenty of non-Derry players have also opted to play for the FAI. How does this theory account for those lads?

Likewise, I don't think the image problem is limited exclusively to the north-west; the NI team is viewed either in a negative light or as largely irrelevant within broad nationalism.


With the increasing regularity of Derry-born footballers opting to switch national allegiances in favour of the Republic of Ireland, the impact on the N. Ireland international squad has been significant.

Increasing regularity? Has the impact even been significant? How does one gauge in the absence of impact? Sounds like filler to me, or nonsense; whichever...


However, in his new role as ‘Elite Player Mentor’ for the IFA, the former Real Mallorca and Tottenham Hotspurs striker, insists he can help repair the damage as the powers that be at Windsor Avenue intensify their campaign to win over the hearts and minds of young players from Derry.

...

"And the set-up in the grassroots level here has been very good but we know that there is a gap when they get to between 12, 13 and 14 years of age until they get to 18 or 19 years, and we need to fill that void."

See folks, it's not just the FAI who'll fiddle with your kids. :rolleyes:


“That’s the problem - the fact Derry City players and supporters look to the south and are more familiar with the League of Ireland. We can’t change the fact Derry City play in the League of Ireland, that’s something that was done when the police made a recommendation 30 or 40 years ago.

I think Gerry could also touch up on his history after he has had a read of the Kearns judgment and articles 5 to 8 of FIFA's Regulations Governing the Application of the Statutes.


Outlining the potential pitfalls facing young N. Ireland-born players who have opted to play for the Republic, Armstrong hoped that his advice would help alter the opinions of young footballers facing that particular dilemma.

...

“I just want to point out that it’s not always the right decision because some of them have actually made the change and regretted it and had been able to reverse the decision to come back to play for N. Ireland.

“A lot of these lads in the past few years have decided to go and play for the Republic U17 or U18s, have then changed their mind, didn’t feel they were apart of it and then we welcomed them back again.

Who's Armstrong referring to here exactly? Michael O'Connor and Tony Kane are the only two of whom I'm aware that switched back to the IFA. And has he actually outlined these supposed "pitfalls"? What are they? A healthy challenge for places, I gather? Sure why not just tell the poor craiturs straight out they're ****? :bulgy:


“But because of the Good Friday Agreement that’s not always going to be able to happen in the future and I have to concentrate on anyone who wants to play for us.

Blah, blah...


“This is not a charm offensive,” he insisted.

Awk now Gerry, who on earth would ever have thought such a thing? I mean, really...