Eligibility Rules, Okay

[DannyInvincible]

Isn't it largely a convenient (if lazy) shorthand? The GFA confirms a long-existing situation, rather than creating an entitlement. Feighan must know that, but also probably feels he needs to be emollient towards the IFA, NI fans, Unionist politicans and the Belfast media.

No harm in just making sure, and no reason for him to be so lazy. He's an elected member of Dáil Éireann, after all.


Has Feighan made any specific suggestions (eg, 'guys from NI shouldn't play for the Republic', or with qualification 'if they've already played U-19, U-21 or in a friendly up there'). Or is he just throwing out vague platitudes?

He's been pretty vague, but considering he felt bothered enough to write an article about the matter and assuming he wasn't merely talking baloney for rhetorical effect, it would appear that he would prefer northern Irish nationals to be playing for the IFA or would rather they were limited in some manner, further to the rules as they stand at present, from opting to represent the FAI. As far as he is concerned, there's a problem that needs intervention, careful consideration and protocols to solve it. Considering his popular profile and public position, I’m sure you can appreciate why I feel it worth critiquing and challenging the sentiment of such ignorant rubbish, for fear it was to further misinform and influence other parties or individuals similarly bereft of knowledge on the subject.


Maybe he's more interested in cosying up to his colleagues on the cross-border junket? Also, never underestimate Fine Gael partitionism...

I would never. And the session he was hosting was purportedly about understanding and reconciliation, so I thought he'd be eager to be educated on all perspectives relevant to the discussion.


The way you characterise it is somewhat exaggerated. Nobody's comparing it to a press gang. NI fans are ****ed off that someone can agree to a call up for a latest cap for us one day, then move to your squad the next.

No exaggeration necessary from me. NI fans have been making it very easy for me for years. The whole thing has been a litany of insanity and delusion. It was a pretty clueless-sounding Sammy Douglas who declared himself a fan and used the term "poaching" at the BIPA panel discussion.

An hysterical and innuendo-laden banner also springs to mind. What did it say again?:

http://i218.photobucket.com/albums/cc12/poguemahone85/nikids_zpsjl8vs4hh.jpg
"FAI, stop interfering with our kids."

If that wasn't a downright crass and scurrilous means of framing matters and insinuating that something underhand, or indecent even, was going on, I’m not sure what was. As if "kids" were being unduly influenced or manipulated by FAI predators...

Spin-doctor Owen Polley used the phrase "systematic plunder (http://threethousandversts.blogspot.co.uk/2010/10/ifa-set-to-gag-northern-ireland.html)" and the term "raids (http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/opinion/will-football-score-an-own-goal-on-nationality-issue-28548332.html)". Polley spoke of Daniel Kearns having to be "persuaded to defect". Why couldn't he acknowledge that the lad might simply just have wanted to declare for his country? Polley was desperate to shut the whole thing down by trying to feign some concern for the "identity rights" of nationalists through a pretty twisted argument that, more so than anything else, ultimately just exposed his own narrow-minded self-interest and wish to claim nationalists for himself. As if that charlatan had the best interests of nationalists at heart… I’d be fairly confident that many NI fans still possess such extreme views whereby they’d gladly deny northern Irish nationals the fundamental choice to play for Ireland. Worryingly, Polley is obviously one of the more educated fans, yet still harboured such cloaked and crooked intolerance. If I had access to OWC, I’m sure I’d be able to find opinions expressed as bad and much worse. Sure even the head-honcho of the Amalgamation of Official Northern Ireland Supporters Clubs, Gary McAllister, was alleging that youngsters were being abused, intimidated and threatened into playing for the FAI (http://foot.ie/threads/147164-Eligibility-Rules-Okay?p=1565945&viewfull=1#post1565945). And then he cowered behind the "breach of confidence" excuse in order to avoid backing up his ridiculous claims before resorting to crude, infantile jibes and disengaging.

The FAI have often been accused of breaching the general rules, of behaving illegally (as far as FIFA’s regulations are concerned) or of having had some special and unfair exemption decreed specifically for them by FIFA, so I don’t think it’s at all inaccurate to portray the hysterical nature of the accusations as I have. Indeed, Trevor Ringland still seemed to possess the belief that the FAI weren't conforming to the rules as they should be applied when he spoke in Croke Park to the BIPA. These types of guys have influence and stature. People listen to them when they speak because of the positions they hold.

I really shouldn’t forget the bat-sh*t crazy "End Footballing Apartheid in Ireland" farce either. I mean, if NI fans really wanted some unity and an end to "apartheid" (apart-hood or the state of being apart) in Ireland or if they truly wanted an ensure there was no automatic imposition of British citizenship upon Irish nationalists in the north, they’re more than welcome to advocate a single all-island team or to vote for Irish nationalist/republican parties intent on ending partition. Just an idea, like… Or maybe those ideas wouldn't actually appeal to them and they're just full of bullsh*t.

And it is actually just our association with whom NI fans seem to have this issue. I was surprised that there were no such howls of disdain and anguish (like Gibson, McClean and Duffy got) when a young IFA player "defected" to the FA a while back. I can't recall his name - I'm sure someone can clarify - but he was mentioned on here and the OWC response was pretty much zilch. Some of the very few posters in a less-than-two-pages-long thread who were actually interested enough to respond even wished him well!


Surely he means effectively all-Unionist fanbase, not players? If so, it's not scaremongering, some exaggeration at worst.

If he was suggesting that northern-born Irish nationals declaring to play for Ireland would lead to that, I think he’s getting his cause and effect mixed up. Don't the teams kind of inherently represent the two respective traditions anyway? And it's not because of the FAI, but more to do with the socio-political reality. I know they run FFA and all that, but can the IFA genuinely or fully represent nationalists who identify with Ireland as a nation? As I posed in one of the pieces I'd written, would a tricolour be welcome in Windsor Park, for example? Not that I'm suggesting it ought to be embraced by NI fans or anything; just pointing out a reality and demonstrating how it's rather insincere for NI fans to demand or expect loyalty from the nationalist community and then accuse then accuse the latter of bigotry when they're naturally not interested. Nationalists in the north already support Ireland en masse and it is for the reason that they broadly and culturally identify with the FAI team that northern-born Irish national players opt to play for the association.


I've suggested some explanation above. Broadly Frank's motive may be mainly to boost his own career and contacts. He's probably cuter than you give credit. You don't need to over-rate his importance, though.

Well, if that’s the case, he should stop playing dumb. And he’s got a higher profile than I, unfortunately. :p

[Stuttgart88]

I presume Frank never responded to you Danny?

[DannyInvincible]

I presume Frank never responded to you Danny?

Nah, not even an acknowledgment. I e-mailed him and tweeted him around the time of the BIPA and did the same again there at the weekend to alert him to my analysis of what was discussed.

[Gather round]

I can reply even if the Deputy for Roscommon & Leitrim won't.

On mature reflection, I have to concede there is some quality ballix/ mopery in the replies DI quotes above. Particular from 'spin doctor' Polley :(

As for your old mate McAllister, of course he should back up his allegations. But you have to remember that in a still volatile post-conflict scenario like OWC collusion can't always easily be proved...

PS the Green Party in Norwich has a press spokesman whose real first name is actually Spin(oza)

[DannyInvincible]

I've, at last, written some smaller pieces for Slugger O'Toole after an invitation from Mick Fealty. The first was published today: http://sluggerotoole.com/2015/04/13/football-eligibility-an-issue-for-the-misinformed-and-those-seeking-to-deny-national-rights/

There are two more to come. It's certainly got NI fans commenting anyway. I'm a quick typer, but I don't think I can keep up with this onslaught. Help!? :p

[gastric]

I've, at last, written some smaller pieces for Slugger O'Toole after an invitation from Mick Fealty. The first was published today: http://sluggerotoole.com/2015/04/13/football-eligibility-an-issue-for-the-misinformed-and-those-seeking-to-deny-national-rights/

There are two more to come. It's certainly got NI fans commenting anyway. I'm a quick typer, but I don't think I can keep up with this onslaught. Help!? :p

You started this Danny, so live with it! ;) At least it seems to be a mature discussion.

[Wolfman]

http://www.the42.ie/10-best-players-could-have-played-ireland-2107305-May2015/?utm_source=facebook_short

[tetsujin1979]

http://www.the42.ie/10-best-players-could-have-played-ireland-2107305-May2015/?utm_source=facebook_short
According to Wikipedia, Walcott is the youngest player to make his debut for England, not Rooney

[DannyInvincible]

http://www.the42.ie/10-best-players-could-have-played-ireland-2107305-May2015/?utm_source=facebook_short

I was never aware Gazza was eligible.

Steve Bruce claimed he was reluctant to declare for Ireland on account of the limit on "foreign" players imposed by the Premier League (Football League?) at the time, as far as I know. He claimed it would have caused problems with Unites and would have impacted negatively upon his club career. I dunno if that adds up though. Even if he had declared for Ireland, he'd still have been a non-foreign British national at United, as far as the rules at the time were concerned, no? Was the international team for whom you played relevant in ascertaining your foreign-or-not status. My own suspicion is that he was rendered ineligible on account of his under-age caps with England.

Rooney's grandmother is from Dublin, according to this: http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/rooney-is-part-of-a-generation-irish-on-the-inside-26359427.html

AB tells me otherwise though; that he was possibly fifth-gen, according to scousers he knows.

Indeed, this seems consistent with the reference to Patricia Fitzsimmons (Rooney's supposed-Dublin grandmother) here: http://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/former-scotland-manager-berti-vogts-2360133

Says she was born in Liverpool.

And David McWilliams wrote about her too here: http://www.independent.ie/opinion/columnists/david-mcwilliams/david-mcwilliams-irish-emigrants-are-glue-that-binds-our-countries-26733733.html


"I sat in the back of a pub with Rooney's granny, Patricia Fitzsimons, listening to stories about these people -- our people -- and their love of, and affinity for, Ireland. Rooney's grandparents went to Bray for their honeymoon and constantly referred to themselves as Irish."

That'd suggest she wasn't born in Ireland, wouldn't it? It would surely only be notable in this context that they refer to themselves as Irish if they weren't actually born in Ireland.

I always remember Rooney was eligible for us in the Football/Championship Manager series of games, however, and their research has always been pretty solid. It's even used as a professional database by clubs now. That's not to say they're immune from making the odd mistake though.

[Stuttgart88]

I can't wait to see the Danny Collins movie with Al Pacino. Who'd have thought Hollywood and the great actor himself would take such an interest in the player eligibility debate and its key authority in the blogosphere?

Who's going to play Gather Round?

[TrapAPony]

I can't wait to see the Danny Collins movie with Al Pacino. Who'd have thought Hollywood and the great actor himself would take such an interest in the player eligibility debate and its key authority in the blogosphere?

Who's going to play Gather Round?

Verne Troyer:D

[DeLorean]

Stephen Rea the bookies early favourite.

[Gather round]

Ha ha. Be careful or one of you comics will be sleeping wid da fishes...

My cousin's brother in law is Tom Hagen from Holywood, believe it or not.

http://images.amcnetworks.com/amc.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/02/the-godfather-tournament.jpg

[Stuttgart88]

Be afraid...

[tetsujin1979]

Be afraid...
Wrong movie

[DannyInvincible]

Michael O'Neill says he has a grievance with the FAI and makes some vague/stupid comments in relation to the (still ongoing?) eligibility dispute: http://www.goal.com/en-ie/news/3942/ireland/2015/05/31/12270722/oneill-wants-eligibility-agreement-between-ifa-and-fai


O'Neill, who has been manager of Northern Ireland since December 2011, says that some players have made the decision to switch "and their international careers have gone nowhere" adding that the two associations on the island of Ireland should come to an agreement on the matter "over and above" the current Fifa eligibility rules.

"This is my grievance with the FAI. There are some of our young lads who have made that decision and their international careers have gone nowhere," O'Neill told the Sunday Times.

"Why put them in that position? For the ones who are playing it is great, but what about Eunan O'Kane? It is a big decision to make at underage level knowing that you can't go back.

"There should be an agreement between the associations over and above the Fifa rule, but that doesn't exist.

"I don't think the Republic have benefited tremendously from the rule. Darron Gibson, James McClean and Marc Wilson. That's pretty much it. The other players have fallen by the wayside and their international careers have been damaged because of that."

Quotes taken from a piece by Paul Rowan here (http://www.thesundaytimes.co.uk/sto/sport/football/I_nationals/article1562453.ece).

Good examination of why the comments are nonsensical here: http://www.everthecynic.com/2015/06/01/michael-oneill-the-fai-and-grievances/


...

Understandably, there is a lingering resentment attached to the matter. Somewhat surprisingly though, O’Neill, who has generally been quite diplomatic with regard to the eligibility issue, went on to air what he termed as his “grievance” with the FAI, insinuating that they were somehow “damaging” the careers of certain Northern Ireland-born footballers by selecting them at under-age level. He questioned why the FAI was “[putting players] in that position” as if to suggest the players had no part to play in the entire affair whatsoever, as if they didn’t make the decision themselves, of their own accord.

...

Ostensibly, O’Neill is merely expressing concern for the careers of young Northern Ireland-born footballers, but the truth is that he is ultimately looking out for his own interests as manager of the Northern Ireland team and unfairly using players such as Eunan O’Kane as a sort of international cautionary tale to dissuade potential defectors in the process. These guys decided NOT to play for us and look how it turned out for THEM!

It is disingenuous and insulting to those young players who have made the decision to declare for the FAI. In any case, who is to say that 24-year-old O’Kane will never taste senior international football? He is relatively young and part of a team that recently earned promotion to the Premier League. As in life, nothing is guaranteed in football, so who knows what the future holds for O’Kane or, for that matter, anyone?

...

[DannyInvincible]

I've not actually read the entire piece by Paul Rowan above as it's behind a paywall, but I understand it suggests Michael Duffy (formerly of Derry and now at Celtic) is considering a switch to the FAI. If he was to go through with it, he'd be the first player to switch since McClean/under O'Neill's management.

If Michael O'Neill is so concerned for the careers of switching players, why doesn't he impose a moral expectation upon himself to select out-of-favour Alex Bruce?

[Charlie Darwin]

What about Eunan O'Kane?

[Stuttgart88]

The first part of his first name and the first part of his surname, when put together, gives EunOK. Does he lack balls?

[tetsujin1979]

You're thinking about this too much.

[DeLorean]

Bamford thread closed?

[TheOneWhoKnocks]

If I was Eunan O'Kane, my grievance would be with the fact that Michael appropriated him for his own agenda. If anyone is doubting Eunan, it's Michael. He could be in Martin's thoughts for all we know. What we do know indisputably is that Michael doesn't think he's good enough to play for his chosen country.

These comments seem as unprofessional, discourteous and damaging as Trapattoni's comments about Steven Reid and Stephen Kelly. I think Michael should issue an unreserved apology for this. He can make whatever point he is trying to make without bringing up specific players and throwing them under the bus.

[Gather round]

If I was Eunan O'Kane, my grievance would be with the fact that Michael appropriated him for his own agenda. If anyone is doubting Eunan, it's Michael. He could be in Martin's thoughts for all we know. What we do know indisputably is that Michael doesn't think he's good enough to play for his chosen country.

These comments seem as unprofessional, discourteous and damaging as Trapattoni's comments about Steven Reid and Stephen Kelly. I think Michael should issue an unreserved apology for this. He can make whatever point he is trying to make without bringing up specific players and throwing them under the bus

Agreed it's vindictive and not classy.

Not sure why Michael O'Neill is getting involved. it can't be to curry favor with the fans, he's got that anyway after this season's huge improvement.

[SwanVsDalton]

To be honest, I'm not that steamed about O'Neill's (the bould Michael) comments - when it comes to eligibility, I have every sympathy for a manager who wants to pick more and better players, and can't. Sounds like frustration, can't say I blame him.


If I was Eunan O'Kane, my grievance would be with the fact that Michael appropriated him for his own agenda. If anyone is doubting Eunan, it's Michael. He could be in Martin's thoughts for all we know. What we do know indisputably is that Michael doesn't think he's good enough to play for his chosen country.

These comments seem as unprofessional, discourteous and damaging as Trapattoni's comments about Steven Reid and Stephen Kelly. I think Michael should issue an unreserved apology for this. He can make whatever point he is trying to make without bringing up specific players and throwing them under the bus.

Maybe, though ultimately O'Neill is saying 'I would really, really like to pick O'Kane' and I can't see Eunan getting too annoyed about that.

O'Neill was earwigging him at the Brandywell recently, so maybe this is him being discourteous and damaging to his face?

2278

[TheOneWhoKnocks]

TBH Swans you're entitled to your opinion and I accept that. I knew before I opened the thread that you were going to go out of your way to disagree with me and take the opposite viewpoint - complete with the trademark predictable sarky quip at the bottom of the post.

[TheOneWhoKnocks]

Eunan O'Kane has been playing Championship football for the sum total of two seasons. Just over three years ago he was in League Two. He is 24 years old. Glenn Whelan was the same age and Keith Andrews was older when they made their debuts. If O'Kane thinks he should be playing senior Intl. football after one season of playing regularly in the Championship and one season of being on the bench and struggling to make squads, then that is his prerogative, but honestly I think Michael is talking nonsense.

Instead of belittling O'Kane and other players who have switched, glossing over their reasons for declaring in the first place and using the career trajectories of Daniel Kearns, Anton Rodgers and Daniel Devine as a word of warning to O'Kane, maybe Michael should warn O'Kane about how little football Paul Paton, Will Grigg, Ben Reeves, Jonny Gorman, Niall McGinn and Paddy McCourt have procured since declaring for Northern Ireland.

Is he honestly pretending that players like Kearns & Devine should hold regrets about declaring for Ireland? They wouldn't be playing International football either way!

Alex Bruce is the most blatant example of hypocrisy.

Really. There is a game coming up between the two sides in a few days. Both sides have important games coming up. Michael should start being a bit more diplomatic, at least until the games are over. It's very disrespectful. The FAI are the only party leaving the ball in the players' proverbial court. People like Michael O'Neill are exerting undue influence, pressure and inappropriate comments over players that (no longer) belong to them.

Leave players like O'Kane alone. They are adults capable of making a decision like this without being publicly belittled and patronized because of another person's agenda.

[SwanVsDalton]

TBH Swans you're entitled to your opinion and I accept that. I knew before I opened the thread that you were going to go out of your way to disagree with me and take the opposite viewpoint...


Maybe, though ultimately O'Neill is saying 'I would really, really like to pick O'Kane' and I can't see Eunan getting too annoyed about that.

Seriously?!

That's me going out of my way to disagree with you? For god's sake, don't be such a crybaby - my comment was so inoffensively bland, if anyone is going "out of their way" it's you.

Also added kudos for the 'you're entitled to your opinion, but it's invalid' comment - nice one.


- complete with the trademark predictable sarky quip at the bottom of the post.

No offence intended. Genuinely, in the light of the conversation, I thought the photo was funny and meant it in a lighthearted way. Tough crowd and all that...

It's the second time recently in a thread it has to be said but relax, TOWK, I'm not (and no one else) is out to get you.

[geysir]

What can you say about these guys, pure unadulterated, eternal IFA victimhood.
It was Blatter, not them statutes, not them at CAS, which let us down (http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/sport/football/international/northern-ireland-were-let-down-by-sepp-blatter-says-kennedy-31276971.html)

[Gather round]

maybe Michael should warn O'Kane about how little football Paul Paton, Will Grigg, Ben Reeves, Jonny Gorman, Niall McGinn and Paddy McCourt have procured since declaring for Northern Ireland

All of the above bar Gorman (an absurd indulgence by his rumoured dad, Worthington ;) ) and McCourt (with the best will in the World an indisciplined chancer who was lucky to get as long a run in full-time football as he did) play regularly in EL1 or the SPL. Third-level players have a good chance in our squad as we just don't have enough at higher levels to make up the numbers.

Afternoon G, sun shining in Keflavik?

Pure, unadultered victimhood, like you say. And never-ending with it too...

[ArdeeBhoy]

By who...

[DeLorean]

Bamford thread closed?

Okay then. Are we to take it that Bamford is getting the foot.ie Grealish treatment until he's tied one way or another? Are we allowed to mention him at all?

[tetsujin1979]

It's being investigated, I didn't close it so I'm trying to find out why

[DannyInvincible]

What can you say about these guys, pure unadulterated, eternal IFA victimhood.
It was Blatter, not them statutes, not them at CAS, which let us down (http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/sport/football/international/northern-ireland-were-let-down-by-sepp-blatter-says-kennedy-31276971.html)

Beacom still seems to believe in the "FIFA ruling" theory:


After the meeting, chaired by then IFA President Kennedy, Blatter blindsided local football chiefs when, in a press conference, he declared the FAI could take their pick of players born, bred and developed in Northern Ireland as long as they had an Irish passport, effectively leading to a ruling of the same.

[Olé Olé]

James Galway's comments on the Nolan Show earlier today (http://www.judecollins.com/2015/06/james-galway-hits-a-discordant-note/) might be of interest to you, TOWK. He's an Ulster Protestant (grew up in a loyalist community) who, it appears, has "committed the faux pas" of rejecting the "Northern Irish" label, instead preferring to identify simply as Irish.

You'll be able to listen to his comments, which have left unionists seething (and even threatening legal action), here: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-33020329

Not wanting to stoke the fire here but have you read much of Carl Frampton's opinions/views/identifications on this matter, Danny? I assume you have read some of these..
http://www.sportsjoe.ie/boxing/youll-never-guess-who-carl-framptons-irish-sporting-hero-is/19143 He supports NI in the football, it appears. Also, supports Crusaders- club of former Irish under-21 and Celtic player, Diarmuid O'Carroll.
http://www.irishexaminer.com/sport/review/boxing-the-face-of-2013-217570.html Before his more recent success.
http://www.the42.ie/frampton-avalos-utv-ireland-1962240-Feb2015/ In light of his more recent success.

[geysir]

Originally Posted by DannyInvincible http://foot.ie/threads/147164-Eligibility-Rules-Okay/images/buttons/viewpost-right.png (http://foot.ie/threads/147164-Eligibility-Rules-Okay/showthread.php?p=1822486#post1822486)
James Galway's comments on the Nolan Show earlier today (http://www.judecollins.com/2015/06/james-galway-hits-a-discordant-note/) might be of interest to you, TOWK. He's an Ulster Protestant (grew up in a loyalist community) who, it appears, has "committed the faux pas" of rejecting the "Northern Irish" label, instead preferring to identify simply as Irish.

You'll be able to listen to his comments, which have left unionists seething (and even threatening legal action), here: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-33020329

I use to think Matt Molloy ruled supreme but now I'll also give some consideration to the merits of James G.

[Gather round]

Not wanting to stoke the fire here but have you read much of Carl Frampton's opinions/views/identifications on this matter, Danny? I assume you have read some of these..
http://www.sportsjoe.ie/boxing/youll-never-guess-who-carl-framptons-irish-sporting-hero-is/19143 He supports NI in the football, it appears. Also, supports Crusaders- club of former Irish under-21 and Celtic player, Diarmuid O'Carroll.
http://www.irishexaminer.com/sport/review/boxing-the-face-of-2013-217570.html Before his more recent success.
http://www.the42.ie/frampton-avalos-utv-ireland-1962240-Feb2015/ In light of his more recent success

Frampton showed his World title belt to fans at Windsor before our Faroes qualifier. Looked like he'd just been beaten up, which I suppose he had ;)


James Galway's comments on the Nolan Show earlier today might be of interest to you, TOWK. He's an Ulster Protestant (grew up in a loyalist community) who, it appears, has "committed the faux pas" of rejecting the "Northern Irish" label, instead preferring to identify simply as Irish

So, Swiss pensioner declares for united Ireland. Maybe he'll slip the fighting fund $5 million from the latest greatest hits CD sales?

If he's not too busy shagging C Ronado's girlfriend obviously...

[ArdeeBhoy]

Your posts become ever more 'cryptic'...
:eek:

[TheOneWhoKnocks]

Straight talking Rooney never considered playing for Ireland.

http://www.rte.ie/sport/soccer/2015/0607/706431-rooney-rejected-ireland-opportunity/


I have Irish grandparents, so if they wanted to play for Ireland I'm sure they could have, but it was never something I thought about.

"I was born in England, I'm English.

Meanwhile, amateur flautist Paul Gascoigne never got the chance to consider it.

http://www.balls.ie/football/it-transpires-one-of-englands-most-famous-ever-players-could-have-played-for-us/295878



The problem was getting him to play for Ireland and if only I’d spoken to his mother a week earlier, I might have had the chance.

He actually qualified to play for Ireland but no one knew it at the time and we only just missed out on him.

If we could reach the quarter-finals of the World Cup without him, but with the quality players we had in the team at that time, what would we have been like with him in the side, in his prime?

I think I could have persuaded him, if I’d known. He still calls me his second dad and I do think I could have talked him into it.

[DannyInvincible]

I use to think Matt Molloy ruled supreme but now I'll also give some consideration to the merits of James G.

Plans by unionist councillors to put Galway forward for the freedom of Belfast have been swiftly shelved: http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/sunday-life/news/james-galway-attack-on-ian-paisley-sinks-freedom-of-belfast-plan-31285432.html

[Gather round]

Plans by unionist councillors to put Galway forward for the freedom of Belfast have been swiftly shelved: http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/sunday-life/news/james-galway-attack-on-ian-paisley-sinks-freedom-of-belfast-plan-31285432.html

Ha ha. Silly old goat :)

My Ma is well disappointed at his comments. She went to the same school, a late uncle was in the same flute band as the young JG.

Civic honours need not be unanimous, so the Nationalists and the rest could do the needful. My local Council stalled for some time before agreeing on Shakespearian actor Lenny Henry, seemingly on the grounds that he was neither an elected member nor held the Victoria Cross (top Brit military gong).

[geysir]

It just keeps getting worse for the (Jamaican born) Sterling, even his own team captain, Wayne Rooney, has publicly derided him, the other day (http://www.independent.ie/sport/soccer/international-soccer/wayne-rooney-i-never-even-considered-playing-for-ireland-31283527.html).

"I'm a firm believer that the country you are born in is who you should play for"

[osarusan]

It just keeps getting worse for the (Jamaican born) Sterling, even his own team captain, Wayne Rooney, has publicly derided him, the other day (http://www.independent.ie/sport/soccer/international-soccer/wayne-rooney-i-never-even-considered-playing-for-ireland-31283527.html).

"I'm a firm believer that the country you are born in is who you should play for"

Ryan Bertrand was asked a couple of cringey questions by Tony O'D yesterday - firstly about his own Irish connection, which is a grandparent from Crumlin (iirc), and he was trying to be polite/diplomatic:

'Ah, yeah,...got a grandfather from Crumlin....but ah...ah...England born and bred really.

'So how about Jack Grealish, he has a big decision to make?'

'Ah...yeah...ah...a big decision.'

Tony waited for more, but there was no more.

[geysir]

Plans by unionist councillors to put Galway forward for the freedom of Belfast have been swiftly shelved: http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/sunday-life/news/james-galway-attack-on-ian-paisley-sinks-freedom-of-belfast-plan-31285432.html

That's gas, but seeing as he is already affectionately referred to as "The Man With The Golden Flute",
what possible honour could out-endow that one?

[DannyInvincible]

Came across this very interesting "cutting" on Twitter (https://twitter.com/ScotsFootyCards/status/600269343839166464) earlier:

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CFSVyUWWEAAFMrY.jpg

It's from a 1969 edition of Goal, but, as Crerrand and Byrne were each first selected by Scotland and England respectively in 1961, they must be referring to the 1962 change agreed at the 33rd FIFA Congress in Santiago, which introduced the following rule:


“Any player who is a naturalised citizen of a country in virtue of that country’s laws shall be eligible to play for a national or representative team of that country.”

That rule remained in place until 2004 and was the one under which players like Alan Kernaghan, Ger Crossley and Mark McKeever qualified to play for us.

It was also the same rule that was in place when Jimmy McGeough was infamously restricted from playing for us by Harry Cavan in 1969, so why was McGeough treated differently from the former three? Interestingly, the article above spoke of the association of a player's birth-country having to give the green light first before another association for whom the player was also eligible could take advantage. Was this something in the general rules, I wonder? When did this "convention" cease to be? Perhaps this is what the modern IFA think was the discredited "gentlemen's agreement between the IFA and the FAI". Of course, in the end, despite Cavan claiming NI couldn't afford to be letting "their" players play for Ireland, Jimmy was never given international recognition by the IFA either.

I actually spoke to Jimmy over the phone a few months ago and it's an open book, as far as he's concerned. He was very critical of Cavan. His son in the US was happy to give me his number for a chat after exchanging a few emails. Ended up chatting away for about three quarters of an hour. I was then in touch with Peter Sherrard at the FAI and he was to have someone look over minutes from around 1969 for me for further info, but I haven't heard anything back since despite a few emails so will give him another call soon. Was hoping to get the FAI's official version of events - why they asked Jimmy to seek permission from FIFA (not the IFA, importantly; according to Jimmy) when the rule at the time would suggest he was fully within his rights to play for Ireland - and maybe then do a write-up on that and the "interview" for someone to publish.

Here's a bit of what was said:


Me: “Do you think Harry Cavan might have wielded some sort of undue influence due to his role at FIFA?”

Jimmy: “No question. He was a big hand within FIFA at the time. He was the vice-president at that moment in time of FIFA. He was in that category that he pulled a lot of strings for some people and not for others.

Me: “And that would be your suspicion or you’d be fairly sure of that?”

Jimmy: “Well, there’s no confirmation to be sure of it, but I know deep down inside that’s what happened, and the answer I got was, ‘Northern Ireland don’t have enough players that we can let you play for the South’…. I had thought the reason behind it was sinister. It might have been a religious thing; I dunno.”

[Gather round]

Came across this very interesting "cutting" on Twitter (https://twitter.com/ScotsFootyCards/status/600269343839166464) earlier:

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CFSVyUWWEAAFMrY.jpg

This explains the mystery of what Crerand is ranting in/ about in punditry interviews. I was pretty sure it couldn't be English.

[ArdeeBhoy]

Not unlike a certain rotund man specialising in WD...
:rolleyes:

[geysir]

Even when Paddy is on the bender of all rants he speaks a lot more sense than that round lad.

[TheOneWhoKnocks]

Michael O'Neill finds a sympathetic ear in Ewan Murray for his latest sob story.

http://www.theguardian.com/football/2015/jun/11/michael-oneill-northern-ireland-euro-2016-qualifying

The role has been made tougher still by regulations that state any player born in Northern Ireland is eligible to play for the Republic, a route accepted by Darron Gibson, James McClean and others albeit none, pertinently, under O’Neill’s watch.

“The rule is very unfair,” he insists. “It is grossly unfair for us to develop young players, train them, take them to tournaments and then if the option comes up for them to play for the Republic of Ireland, there is nothing to stop them doing it. I have no problem if there is a bloodline there; that is the same as any other country.

“I think the associations should be able to come to an agreement on it. My understanding is we have tried to do that and they have said ‘the rules are the rules and we are allowed to do it’. It is pretty hard for a country of our population, with so few players.”

Then what is he complaining about?!

[geysir]

What is he complaining about? Michael O'Neill denies, contrary to evolution, intl government treaties and state constitutions, that irish nationality is a birthright, that players born in the 6 counties are born as dual nationals and can choose whatever national identity their blood shall have. Michael is a creationist, perhaps he's under the illusion that NI is an actual country created in a figment of his imagination, instead of what it is (whatever it is). Or he's just getting in his excuses early, playing upon the evident paranoia of owc fans who just gobble up nonsense like that and install it seamlessly into their default belief system.

[BonnieShels]

Maybe it's all part of his jealousy of never getting to play for the "true" country of his birth/bloodline as opposed to the jurisdictional anomaly in which he was birthed. And therefore he has to wage this petty war with the dastardly FAI.
It's mad that as mental and annoying and downright [insert insult] Nigel W was, he never went on or bleated as much shoite about eligibility as Mícheal Uí Néill.