Stadium Updates (All Clubs)

[oriel]

Seems fairly reasonable point Charlie, but I have noticed it has become a much more serious issue since we got promoted the last time for the start of the 2009 season.

I would dearly love a new away section in OP, but there are limits on where it could be built due to enter and exit arrangements. The only area is where it is, maybe take it around the corner a little for improved view, and of course a roof, proper toilets and better access to food and drink.

On a fine summers evening, it's actually not a bad view but only for one end, pretty poor for when your team is attacking the town end. A lot of home fans stand/sit in the new seating area on the town side of the main stand, and same applies there, no cover and really only a good view of one half.

The ideal solution would be to extend the main stand in oriel both sides, then all areas that side would have a perfect view. Then the away support could all be seated where it is now, but that's not going to happen anytime soon. Cost would probably be over 1m.

OP is an ageing ground, and has slipped very badly down the ranks, it only looks half decent with a good crowd in, and it generates an even better atmosphere then, but it needs a major revamp, we all appreciate that.

[Charlie Darwin]

Put it this way, if Dundalk won the league they'd be 300k better off and I suspect, given the work that's been done on the pitch over the past few years, would put some of it towards ground improvements but the situation right now is that their only focus is on using their resources to put out a team that can challenge at the top of the league. As Longford have learned, having a lovely stadium doesn't mean much if your attendances are halved by playing in the First Division, so clubs realistically have to prioritise what happens on the field over the costly business of improving facilities.

[fieldofmarkets]

I appreciate its a fine balancing act at all clubs with not enough money to go around. I wonder though if investing in facilities that are available to away fans might not be a bad bang for the buck. Clubs find it tough to draw in non LOI fans. Away fans are ready made new fans that don't have to be convinced, might be the easiest new customers to acquire.

[Charlie Darwin]

I appreciate its a fine balancing act at all clubs with not enough money to go around. I wonder though if investing in facilities that are available to away fans might not be a bad bang for the buck. Clubs find it tough to draw in non LOI fans. Away fans are ready made new fans that don't have to be convinced, might be the easiest new customers to acquire.
Away fans will turn up twice a year max, maybe three with a cup game. A home fan could stay the whole season. The choice isn't a hard one to make.

[Jofspring]

Personally when I travel to away games it doesn't really bother me too much what the facilities are like. All I want is the option to be covered (seats not necessary as I don't actually like sitting at games), a toilet and to not have a big pillar in front of me. I rarely eat at the ground and I see a bar as a bonus.

It's vital to have the home fans well looked after first and then if you have the luxury to do so look after the away fans to a higher standard than currently at a lot of grounds.

[fieldofmarkets]

But can't they turn up to every game....different groups of people obviously.

[Louth4sam]

I appreciate its a fine balancing act at all clubs with not enough money to go around. I wonder though if investing in facilities that are available to away fans might not be a bad bang for the buck. Clubs find it tough to draw in non LOI fans. Away fans are ready made new fans that don't have to be convinced, might be the easiest new customers to acquire.

So spend hundreds of thousands on decent away facilities to get 50 away fans and gate receipts of less than a grand every second week. Yes that sounds very "bang for the buck"

[Eminence Grise]

Grants? Naming rights/sponsored stand? Fundraise for a few years, and save the money in a post office account until there's enough for basic facilities? Where there's a will, there's a way.

Away fans don't want corporate boxes and gold taps in the toilets - a roof, a burger, a pint and a reduced risk of contracting typhus would keep most happy.

[Dodge]

I'd settle for somewhere safe where I can see 95% of the pitch. It's crazy how some fans get real defensive about their grounds. All of them, bar maybe Turners Cross and Tallaght could do with major upgrades. I think people know that most clubs can't afford them but at the very least you have to know that most aren't good enough

[Louth4sam]

I'd settle for somewhere safe where I can see 95% of the pitch. It's crazy how some fans get real defensive about their grounds. All of them, bar maybe Turners Cross and Tallaght could do with major upgrades. I think people know that most clubs can't afford them but at the very least you have to know that most aren't good enough

I'd add Terryland Park to that list also. Is it any coincidence that funding for these grounds have not come from the clubs that play at them? There are very few boards/CEO/Chairmen that would drop their player budget to invest significantly in infrastructure. Sligo seem to be the only club bucking the trend.

[Dodge]

Well there's a few who are OK. Terryland is included there. Showgrounds has one great stand, one open stand and a terrible stand (with a fence in the middle). Pats spent money on the open stand behind the goal last year too but I agree with the gist of your post

[nigel-harps1954]

Nobody is suggesting Dundalk, or any club, goes out to spend hundreds of thousands on a state of the art stand just for away fans.

A simple upgrade though isn't overly expensive. Over the space of one season along with grants and fundraising as EG was saying, a club like Dundalk with solid crowds should be able to save enough money for new safe concrete steps and some form of a roof over a small area for the fans. Stuff like that goes a long way in a small league like our own.

I've seen some very impressive stands built for not a lot of money. Letterkenny Rovers a couple of years ago built a lovely new 400 seat stand along the side of their pitch for reportedly under €100,000 euro. Most of the cost was grant money with the rest raised through fundraising.
Not suggesting spending that much money on an all seated stand, but just pointing out, it doesn't cost a huge sum of money to build something small that is comfortable for the fans travelling sometimes a very long distance to watch a match.

[Partizan]

I'd settle for somewhere safe where I can see 95% of the pitch. It's crazy how some fans get real defensive about their grounds. All of them, bar maybe Turners Cross and Tallaght could do with major upgrades. I think people know that most clubs can't afford them but at the very least you have to know that most aren't good enough

The RSC received a major upgrade a few years ago with a new 1,800 seated stand built opposite the existing Cork Road stand which holds 1,300 bringing seating capacity to 3,100. It is by far the best ground in the First Division and one of the best in the League.

Its in far better nick than Inchicore.

[nigel-harps1954]

The RSC received a major upgrade a few years ago with a new 1,800 seated stand built opposite the existing Cork Road stand which holds 1,300 bringing seating capacity to 3,100. It is by far the best ground in the First Division and one of the best in the League.

Its in far better nick than Inchicore.

Arguable re First Division. The RSC is a poor place to watch a game, simply because you're so far away from the pitch. Superb stadium as a whole, but could definitely still do with upgrades like another exit, a perimeter wall as well as more turnstiles.
I prefer Longford to be honest. It could do with some big upgrades too, but is a far better place to watch a match.

[Dodge]

The RSC received a major upgrade a few years ago with a new 1,800 seated stand built opposite the existing Cork Road stand which holds 1,300 bringing seating capacity to 3,100. It is by far the best ground in the First Division and one of the best in the League.

Its in far better nick than Inchicore.

2 fine stands. No doubt about that. Personally I don't like grounds with nothing behind both goals (like Tallaght, the RSC) but for what's required it's definitely OK.

I think one of the best in the league is stretching it, but there you go.

[Louth4sam]

The RSC received a major upgrade a few years ago with a new 1,800 seated stand built opposite the existing Cork Road stand which holds 1,300 bringing seating capacity to 3,100. It is by far the best ground in the First Division and one of the best in the League.

Its in far better nick than Inchicore.

I don't like the RSC due to the distance from the pitch. Plus there will be issues if/when Waterford are promoted with the lack of TV gantry. The temporary one for the play-off last year was a joke and blocked off a lot of the pitch.

[Jofspring]

Agree, the rsc is a great ground facilities wise but you do feel very far away from the action, especially if something is happening on the other side of the pitch.

[Nesta99]

Nobody is suggesting Dundalk, or any club, goes out to spend hundreds of thousands on a state of the art stand just for away fans.

A simple upgrade though isn't overly expensive. Over the space of one season along with grants and fundraising as EG was saying, a club like Dundalk with solid crowds should be able to save enough money for new safe concrete steps and some form of a roof over a small area for the fans. Stuff like that goes a long way in a small league like our own.

I've seen some very impressive stands built for not a lot of money. Letterkenny Rovers a couple of years ago built a lovely new 400 seat stand along the side of their pitch for reportedly under €100,000 euro. Most of the cost was grant money with the rest raised through fundraising.
Not suggesting spending that much money on an all seated stand, but just pointing out, it doesn't cost a huge sum of money to build something small that is comfortable for the fans travelling sometimes a very long distance to watch a match.

Agree with everything you say. How much would it cost to put a small glorified 3 sided barn in a section of the ground? Dundalk will do something at some stage i'm sure. But as has been said over and over, and as selfish and dismissive as it seems there are simply other things that have to be done and even a few thousand euro isnt spare for non necessities.

Floodlights need serious attention and is a licensing issue; the most popular pitch in the country will either be relayed or returned to grass - consider the cost and loss of income if UEFA inspections are failed due to the surface and another ground has to be nominated. Non essential covering of areas for home supporters would be of greater financial return as if crowds up in the 3000+ turn up many of those will have to suffer the inclement weather just as away fans would.

The Shed, Stand, and Stand terracing have limited capacities and to state the obvious, with a large attendance people will get cold and wet especially when the damn gale is blowing toward the stand. I assure you that it is just as miserable in this situation - with this in mind i'd reckon covering the remaining two ends of the Shed and possibly town end terrace would get the nod before the Carrick Rd terrace.

I myself think that a minimum that must be done for away supporters is a proper permanent toilet facility before cover. The turnstiles condition that side also i feel is inexcusable where minor refurbishment can happen. Weeds, debris etc that lie behind the terrace should be gone. Rusted barbed wire should go etc and just simply have a better aesthetic, no excuses! I stood with away fans that side on a few occasions with friends from other clubs and while the view isnt perfect it is rare that so many away supporters are in attendance that people cant move to get an angle of sight. The town terrace doesnt have a remarkably better view.

Credit where credit is due, under Gerry Matthews the lane way used by away fans was tarmaced with the rest of the front concourse at significant cost, the issue of wet feet prior to this was a major bone of contention previous. The area behind the Carrick goal is no longer the danger and disgrace it was. Little improvement occurred to Oriel from the 70's which is incredible considering the huge European nights late 70's to early 90's - thats a big question asked by Dundalk fans regularly! Indeed the terrace that is getting so much discussion is the development that i most recall 1990's, along with the row of pillars under the stand canopy being removed.

The Stand has recently got a new roof, the side glass of the stand was replaced which improved view as the previous perspex was opaque unless you could look through the holes in it. Steps and walkways in the stand had to be modified to meet regulations (i know i know Pats fans have issue, how is the chap that fell anyhow?). I dont think Dundalk fans are particularly defensive about Oriel, its antiquated and just about serves purpose by todays expectations but we have to be pragmatic - it is what it is until we slowly address infrastructure issues bit by bit and in a way that, like it or not, suits Dundalk FC and our fans financially and otherwise. Im sure the club will be in for sports capital grants if and when they are available.

If I win the Euromillions i promise that I will benefact Dundalk FC the money to develop a ground to be proud of. That or we all look for municipal facilities or partnerships with, for example, DkIT. We are the same club that was formed in 1908 and have been very close to folding on far too many occasions but have hung in there, I believe now we have a decent platform to move on and address the concerns of our fellow league supporters but it will be a slow process. In the mean time maybe we could set up a stall to sell a few plastic ponchos.....it is Ireland, a country that more often or not it p#sses rain, a different beast alltogether but try standing on a grassy bank at our 'County GAA ground' in the wet, being a spectator there is more like an extreme sport in itself.

Ok thats off my chest now phew:yawn:

[gufcfan]

Modern facilities in the RSC, but if you sit halfway up the stand, you're 35-40 yards from the sideline.

[Neish]

Yeah agree here RSC is a good sports ground but not a good place to watch a game of football

[De Town]

The RSC received a major upgrade a few years ago with a new 1,800 seated stand built opposite the existing Cork Road stand which holds 1,300 bringing seating capacity to 3,100. It is by far the best ground in the First Division and one of the best in the League.

Another fella that's for the birds round here.

[Partizan]

Another fella that's for the birds round here.

Speaking of birds, your main stand is full of bird sh1t.

[Charlie Darwin]

Nothing like a "your stadium is ****ter than ours" to while away the four-month off-season.

[citybone]

On a average the amount of away fans in dundalk is 50?, sometimes less than 10 but other times 200. Cater for the average and could increase average crowds up too 75. maybe . an extra 25 away fans x 16 games @ €15 is about €375 a year, over a 20 year period = €7,500. Im not sure what you could build for €5,000 but a permanent toilet or concrete terrace behind the goal maybe. Maybe not on the top of the list of priorities for Dundalk but it would be nice.

[Charlie Darwin]

On a average the amount of away fans in dundalk is 50?, sometimes less than 10 but other times 200. Cater for the average and could increase average crowds up too 75. maybe . an extra 25 away fans x 16 games @ €15 is about €375 a year, over a 20 year period = €7,500. Im not sure what you could build for €5,000 but a permanent toilet or concrete terrace behind the goal maybe. Maybe not on the top of the list of priorities for Dundalk but it would be nice.
You forgot to multiply by 16. If you're getting 25 extra away fans on average, that'll be 16 x 25 x €15 = €6000 per year.

[Nesta99]

Thanks for the paragraphs, didnt realise how long the post must have looked in one block!

Ive been to many non league grounds in and around London, and also lower league grounds. Some are ok, others wouldnt be out of place in LoI OR LoI grounds wouldnt be out of place here! Off topic a little but the common ground is the sense of the ground and team belonging! Tip in to Orient at the moment (great crowds currently) but they would rather chat to a wee Dundalk fan about LoI than premiership football!

Chelmsford City's ground and Newport Stadium have a 800m track, hence Newport County moved to Rodney Parade. Chelmsford(Skrill South) have looked at moving but Colchester and Roots Hall in Southend are seen as a benchmark and City just dont have the cash. Braintree Town is a much smaller club (Skrill Premier) but a much better ground for atmosphere - have a look on google images its small but works!

Kingstonians and AFC Dons at Kingsmeadow is probably the best small ground that LoI clubs like Dundalk could take something from, lovely spot and great matchday atmosphere.

[GUFCghost]

Do we really need away ends?

[Nesta99]

Do we really need away ends?

Nope not at all....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5CkC-YFcErk

[outspoken]

Speaking of birds, your main stand is full of bird sh1t.

Never seen 1 dirty seat in CCS this season the club have made huge strides in keeping the ground tidy and in good condition and there's no doubt it's the best ground In the FD. Even our clubhouse is in supeb condition.

[L.T.F.C.]

The RSC received a major upgrade a few years ago with a new 1,800 seated stand built opposite the existing Cork Road stand which holds 1,300 bringing seating capacity to 3,100. It is by far the best ground in the First Division and one of the best in the League.

Its in far better nick than Inchicore.
Right.

[Neish]

Nothing like a "your stadium is ****ter than ours" to while away the four-month off-season.

Sure everyone knows Finn Park is the best, its got the gold old fashioned rustic charm. Sorry I mean rusty charm

[legendz]

An astro pitch to meet FIFA international standard is to be put in place in Mounthawk stadium. Kerry soccer is raising the majority of the money required. They're looking for €50 from 2000 people to help with the project. They were disappointed not to receive any help from the national lottery. About 20 teams use the pitches in Mounthawk. With the astro pitch expected to be in place by the middle of next year, it's expected that Kerry will enter a team into the U19 league for '14-'15.

[gufc2000]

An astro pitch to meet FIFA international standard is to be put in place in Mounthawk stadium. Kerry soccer is raising the majority of the money required. They're looking for €50 from 2000 people to help with the project. They were disappointed not to receive any help from the national lottery. About 20 teams use the pitches in Mounthawk. With the astro pitch expected to be in place by the middle of next year, it's expected that Kerry will enter a team into the U19 league for '14-'15.
Is that expected to be a team representative of Kerry as in Kerry FC or Tralee Dynamos?

[legendz]

A team representative of Kerry, probably Kerry League like a few years ago.

[NeverFeltBetter]

Limerick OSC stuck up some details of its meeting with the LEDP on Facebook today (Is it OK to copy/paste those?). Basic gist is that the LEDP's budget is for getting the stadium going ASAP and has nothing in budget for anything else (like bar, shop etc) and envisions mobile catering as a substitute, and Thomond as option for major games. Purely from OSC minutes, LEDP sounded a little dismissive of complaints.

Edit: Also has details of meeting with club. Club's line is that MF will be approached on a business model and will be improved as required, but want to have a more permanent presence.

[bluewhitearmy]

Limerick OSC stuck up some details of its meeting with the LEDP on Facebook today (Is it OK to copy/paste those?). Basic gist is that the LEDP's budget is for getting the stadium going ASAP and has nothing in budget for anything else (like bar, shop etc) and envisions mobile catering as a substitute, and Thomond as option for major games. Purely from OSC minutes, LEDP sounded a little dismissive of complaints.

Edit: Also has details of meeting with club. Club's line is that MF will be approached on a business model and will be improved as required, but want to have a more permanent presence.


If they mean that say we were challenging for Europe and someone with good away support was coming then we would move to Thomond that is ridiculously stupid. LEDP don't seem to have a clue what they are doing tbh.

[NeverFeltBetter]

Yeah, I thought that was strange phrasing to use (and it is what OSC says "major games"). The point was made that Limerick FC could well take a loss renting Thomond in such an event. I'm not sure the LEDP care too much.

[SwanVsDalton]

Reports today that the Brandywell is set to overhauled next Summer thanks to £5 million of funding (http://www.derryjournal.com/news/business/stadium-revamp-with-5m-funding-1-5747752).

The Derry Journal (http://www.derryjournal.com/sport/football/derry-city-latest/5m-brandywell-stadium-refurb-to-get-green-light-1-5747772) say the Glentoran (Old) Stand will be replaced with a 3,000 seater stand, the pitch will go 4G, the Southend (New) Stand will be refurbished and, radically, the Greyhound track removed altogether and moved over to the Showgrounds next door (where it'll be part of a new sports facility with 3G pitches).

The how, when, what and why are scarce. And all this is going to be done for £5m apparently? Highly skeptical about that. Hope there's some rapid clarity on the plan.

[White Horse]

the pitch will go 4G.

3G, 4G, 5G...

People will still call it a plastic pitch and bitch about the ball not bouncing right. Bad players will complain about it when they fail to control the ball.

[Dodge]

Most astro pitches don't get any criticism at all.

Just Oriel, because it's awful.

[Ezeikial]

Most astro pitches don't get any criticism at all.
.

Even with your history of ludicrous claims, that one is remarkable





Just Oriel, because it's awful.

Ah now it makes some sense. (I guess it is called hyperbole) - its to try to make your dislike of that pitch sound reasonable and considered?

[White Horse]

Most astro pitches don't get any criticism at all.

Just Oriel, because it's awful.

Let me get this straight.

Oriel Park is a FIFA 2-Star Certified Star FieldTurf pitch. It has regularly passed tests to see if it meets the standards required to qualify as a FIFA 2-star pitch.

However, even though it meets the same objectively laid criteria, it is "awful" whereas other pitches (that meet the same criteria) are not.

Your post is one of the most stupid I've read on this site.

[Dodge]

Pats get beat by Cliftonville twice on Astro. Not a single complaint

However there has been loads of complaints from a variety of players and clubs, most of whom have a good record in Oriel. Pats included.

I've played on Oriel and it's an awful surface. You two are happy enough with it, so what's the issue with others thinking otherwise?

Loads of grass pitches here are poor too. It doesn't negate the fact that Dundalk's is awful

[Charlie Darwin]

Reports today that the Brandywell is set to overhauled next Summer thanks to £5 million of funding (http://www.derryjournal.com/news/business/stadium-revamp-with-5m-funding-1-5747752).

The Derry Journal (http://www.derryjournal.com/sport/football/derry-city-latest/5m-brandywell-stadium-refurb-to-get-green-light-1-5747772) say the Glentoran (Old) Stand will be replaced with a 3,000 seater stand, the pitch will go 4G, the Southend (New) Stand will be refurbished and, radically, the Greyhound track removed altogether and moved over to the Showgrounds next door (where it'll be part of a new sports facility with 3G pitches).

The how, when, what and why are scarce. And all this is going to be done for £5m apparently? Highly skeptical about that. Hope there's some rapid clarity on the plan.
Will the pitch be on a slope, as is the Derry tradition?


Let me get this straight.

Oriel Park is a FIFA 2-Star Certified Star FieldTurf pitch. It has regularly passed tests to see if it meets the standards required to qualify as a FIFA 2-star pitch.

However, even though it meets the same objectively laid criteria, it is "awful" whereas other pitches (that meet the same criteria) are not.

Your post is one of the most stupid I've read on this site.
There are lots of grass pitches in the league that meet the "criteria" and are still awful. Answer me this, why do the players in the league who actually play on it consistently vote Oriel the worst pitch to play on?

[NeverFeltBetter]

Limerick FC has a statement up about the Market's Field today: http://www.limerickfc.ie/limerick-fc-welcome-markets-field-progress

Key bit:


The initial phase of development is planned to allow The Markets Field to meet the Football Association of Ireland’s Licensing requirements. This will allow Airtricity League Premier Division competition to take place in the stadium and we now look forward to working with LEDP and continuing conversations to ensure that Limerick FC can call the stadium their home in the coming years.

As Limerick FC grow as a club and The Markets Field becomes an integral part of our city’s sporting fabric once again, the club look forward to investigating, in partnership with the LEDP, further phases of the stadium development in the future.

Limerick FC will continue to play our home matches in Thomond Park which will allow the LEDP the requisite time to fully complete the planned development to build The Markets Field into a stadium that epitomises the spirit of Limerick sport.

[SwanVsDalton]

Will the pitch be on a slope, as is the Derry tradition?

Hope so, it wouldn't be the same otherwise. The pitch should rotate at half-time so Derry are always facing down it. Giving how fanciful the finance of this project already is, I'd say that would only cost an extra, oh, couple of hundred quid.

[Ezeikial]

Pats get beat by Cliftonville twice on Astro. Not a single complaint


Is this meant to support your nonsensical earlier claim? So you are unaware of any Pats player or official or supporter being critical of the Cliftonville "astro" and you can translate it to this?


Originally Posted by Dodge http://foot.ie/images/buttons/viewpost-right.png (http://foot.ie/showthread.php?p=1727669#post1727669)
Most astro pitches don't get any criticism at all.



Artificial pitches - including 3G, 4G and Astro (your should really try to educate yourself about the differences)- consistently attract negative comment.

Some of them are really funny, like Lee McCulloch of Rangers (http://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/rangers-skipper-lee-mcculloch-pays-2877856) after he missed a penalty

“My contact with the penalty against Falkirk was terrible because I was scared of slipping, I didn’t like the artificial pitch.



You two are happy enough with it, so what's the issue with others thinking otherwise?


I didn't say I was happy with the pitch.......I said your comments were ludicrous

[White Horse]

There are lots of grass pitches in the league that meet the "criteria" and are still awful. Answer me this, why do the players in the league who actually play on it consistently vote Oriel the worst pitch to play on?

That is their opinion and they may be right. By the way, are grass pitches tested each year? I didn't think so.

However, this is not relevent to my post.

I was pointing out the nonsense of saying that Oriel Park is worse than other artificial surfaces given that all artificial surfaces undergo the same tests and Oriel Park passes each time.

They are either all fine or all crap.

[Charlie Darwin]

They are either all fine or all crap.
This is nonsense. A surface can meet the criteria and still be a nightmare to play on.

[Ezeikial]

There are lots of grass pitches in the league that meet the "criteria" and are still awful.

Grass pitches are not subject to this test. If they were, it is possible that many would fail the FIFA test criteria.