View Full Version : Cork City denied a licence; club to be wound up; FORAS to enter First Division
redgav
22/02/2010, 4:02 PM
I still can't get my head around FORAS buying a 20% share of a 1.2 million debt as opposed to starting a new club with a clean slate???
Its not 1.2 ,its under 600K...geting rid of the coughlans knocks 200k off it alone ...
I hope that a number of LOI clubs are also on to the FAI in the next two hours telling them to hold firm and not give into blackmail. Bray should be in the Premier Division Cork shouldn't.
Thinly veiled - "I WANT EUROPEAN FOOTBALL!!!"
And I@m not saying you shouldn't get it either
tippex
22/02/2010, 4:04 PM
It is very sad to see FORAS as part of a consortium that is bullying its way to a PD license, have they learned nothing from this whole sorry mess? The FAI should hold off awarding the license till after 2 tomorrow. Its bray I feel for.
No the FAI need to grow a pair and make the decision that everyone knows and pretty much agrees should be made....
Longfordian
22/02/2010, 4:04 PM
Just heard there that the Ladbrokes guy "owned" Long and sold him to Burnley (ala Tevez), thats why he is saying he should have been paid first. The Judge is seriously ****ed as she wanted it sorted today.2pm tomorrow is the new final deadline but we've heard that before....
How was he registered as a Cork City player then?, if this interest wasn't declared to the FAI and FIFA then there could be another mess to sort out. Or ignore.
If Cork City FC has changed ownership then the licence committee need to now dish out the punishment for the broken deadlines, 65% salary cap, non payment of players, non payment of creditors and the lies told.
That was all done in the name of Cork City FC, I don't care who the owner was at the time...
The FAI/ILC have never let a change of owner wipe the slate clean previously.
Why should they do it now?
Agreed, not to mention the behaviour of the consortium in attempting to bully them into awarding a Premier Licence. Is Cork City bigger than the integrity of the league?. We'll find out soon enough.
chatterbox
22/02/2010, 4:06 PM
I hope that a number of LOI clubs are also on to the FAI in the next two hours telling them to hold firm and not give into blackmail. Bray should be in the Premier Division Cork shouldn't.
If Cork City FC has changed ownership then the licence committee need to now dish out the punishment for the broken deadlines, 65% salary cap, non payment of players, non payment of creditors and the lies told.
That was all done in the name of Cork City FC, I don't care who the owner was at the time...
Thats how simple this situation actually is. The FAI won't be able to look any of the other clubs in the face if they ignore all this and award them a license, even first division is more than they deserve.
tippex
22/02/2010, 4:07 PM
How was he registered as a Cork City player then?, if this interest wasn't declared to the FAI and FIFA then there could be another mess to sort out. Or ignore.
Agreed, not to mention the behaviour of the consortium in attempting to bully them into awarding a Premier Licence. Is Cork City bigger than the integrity of the league?. We'll find out soon enough.
Well if we believe a well used footballing phrase.
"No one player is bigger than the club" by the same token "No one club is bigger than the League" but lets see if that holds true....
Leeside Swagger
22/02/2010, 4:09 PM
How was he regsitered as a Cork City player then?, if this interest wasn't declared to the FAI and FIFA then there could be another mess to sort out. Or ignore.
It was probably never meant to come out like this and I doubt anything was declared to anyone. I dont have the exact details but thats the word from court.
tippex
22/02/2010, 4:11 PM
According to here (http://www.breakingnews.ie/sport/judge-puts-stay-on-city-winding-up-order-447289.html)the Revenue are owed close to 164K I thought it was 107k....
pineapple stu
22/02/2010, 4:12 PM
So we now have (based on one radio report) a possibility where Cork have been messing around with contracts.
If only we had a precedent for action to be taken when clubs get caught with phony contracts...
tippex - at a guess, the E107k is what Revenue were suing for initially; the E164k is what it's up to now. So it seems it's now a case of pay everything or feck off. And I doubt they'd be slow to take action this season either.
Mr_Parker
22/02/2010, 4:12 PM
Its not 1.2 ,its under 600K...geting rid of the coughlans knocks 200k off it alone ...
Just going buy what was posted earlier...
Michael O'Connell has apparently said in the paper that the debts stand at €1.2m and they're prepared to take them on but Tom wants a pay off. I think he won't give a toss if the club gets wound up if he's not going to be getting anything out of the takeover.
chatterbox
22/02/2010, 4:13 PM
According to here (http://www.breakingnews.ie/sport/judge-puts-stay-on-city-winding-up-order-447289.html)the Revenue are owed close to 164K I thought it was 107k....
Seems to be a discrepancy alright. No one has explained why yet...
weecountyman
22/02/2010, 4:13 PM
1. The money looks like it was paid by Stephen O'Keeffe which was a loan and what ****ed off the revenue so much,not gotten the full story from the court yet though
2.NEVER EVER trust Billy Barry
3.Don't care ..im off out to get hammered to celebrate a TNB freezone and the end to a 2 year nightmare
Thanks Redgav, and for the warning on Billy Barry, just listened to the 96fm sports news.
As regards to O'Keefe "owning" a player, this sounds worse than it is. It is common (began in South America) for businessmen to contribute to their local club in the form of a loan to pay the wages of a player. When said player moves on they recoup their investment and possibly make a profit. There should be a very direct paper trail to the club and it's all legal and above board. After all the player is simply an moveable asset.
tippex
22/02/2010, 4:15 PM
yeah but 50 odd grand seems like a huge jump considering they have had no games since november...
Longfordian
22/02/2010, 4:15 PM
Are you having a laugh do you think it wouldn't have come out before now if there was a direct paper trail to the club?. Not a hope TNB had any agreement. Third party ownership is banned in England and at the least has to be declared here I'd imagine.
Sam_Heggy
22/02/2010, 4:16 PM
Anyone know what time Roddy C is to be on Newstalk? There is only so much George Hook that one can listen to, he's bad enough doing the Rugby.
pineapple stu
22/02/2010, 4:20 PM
yeah but 50 odd grand seems like a huge jump considering they have had no games since november...
Maybe they were only suing for arrears on an agreement, but now it's for the whole lot?
Leeside Swagger
22/02/2010, 4:20 PM
Are you hvaing a laugh do you think it wouldn't have come out before now if there was a direct paper trail to the club?. Not a hope TNB had any agreement. Third party ownership is banned in England and at the least has to be declared here I'd imagine.
+1
This surely would have come out already, I've never heard of any case of a private individual owning a player in this country. It's a wink wink nudge nudge TNB's special, saved for the last minute of the last day.
tippex
22/02/2010, 4:21 PM
Anyone know what time Roddy C is to be on Newstalk? There is only so much George Hook that one can listen to, he's bad enough doing the Rugby.
I'd imagine it would be offtheball after 7.
Presume he'll be off the ball after 7
tippex
22/02/2010, 4:22 PM
would be interesting to see if there was anything in the licensing about player ownership.
weecountyman
22/02/2010, 4:23 PM
Are you hvaing a laugh do you think it wouldn't have come out before now if there was a direct paper trail to the club?. Not a hope TNB had any agreement. Third party ownership is banned in England and at the least has to be declared here I'd imagine.
Longfordian, sorry, I didn't explain it properly. The money is loaned to the club, there is a given undertaking to repay same loan, the loan is understood to be against x or y (player sale(s), gate money, European participation, sale of ground etc). It may well be it was the form of a handshake, but due to money laundering laws and restrictions most business people would want it on paper.
Heggy, keep the faith, but it's most likely Off the Ball he'll be on (he's contracted to Thursdays normally but he's been on regularly).
A question someone might be able to answer, why on the podcast/download from Off the Ball on NT never carries Roddys bit, only some non-sensical rambling about Spain, Italy or England?
redgav
22/02/2010, 4:24 PM
Anyone know what time Roddy C is to be on Newstalk? There is only so much George Hook that one can listen to, he's bad enough doing the Rugby.
I'd rather pluck the hairs from between tyhe cheeks of my arse than listen to that mong ...he'll have nothing to add on this bar what affects him personally
Longfordian
22/02/2010, 4:25 PM
Longfordian, sorry, I didn't explain it properly. The money is loaned to the club, there is a given undertaking to repay same loan, the loan is understood to be against x or y (player sale(s), gate money, European participation, sale of ground etc). It may well be it was the form of a handshake, but due to money laundering laws and restrictions most business people would want it on paper.
Heggy, keep the faith, but it's most likely Off the Ball he'll be on (he's contracted to Thursdays normally but he's been on regularly).
A question someone might be able to answer, why on the podcast/download from Off the Ball on NT never carries Roddys bit, only some non-sensical rambling about Spain, Italy or England?
That's completely different from owning the player in fairness. That may well be the case here but that's just a secured loan.
tippex
22/02/2010, 4:27 PM
I know that clubs have 3 days to appeal if they don't get the license they applied for but conversely could other clubs appeal the granting of a license that they did not feel was deserved?
Leeside Swagger
22/02/2010, 4:28 PM
A question someone might be able to answer, why on the podcast/download from Off the Ball on NT never carries Roddys bit, only some non-sensical rambling about Spain, Italy or England?
Theres a listenback thing on the website you'll be able to get it on if you miss it.
bluemovie
22/02/2010, 4:33 PM
If Cork City FC has changed ownership then the licence committee need to now dish out the punishment for the broken deadlines, 65% salary cap, non payment of players, non payment of creditors and the lies told.
That was all done in the name of Cork City FC, I don't care who the owner was at the time...
The FAI/ILC have never let a change of owner wipe the slate clean previously.
Why should they do it now?
That's it in a nutshell. It doesn't matter that TNB was doing things against the fans' wishes. He cheated, therefore Cork City cheated, and so they finished in a false position. If Bray had signed Ronaldo and Torres (and not paid them), they probably would have stayed up.
And if I can stretch to another analogy, after Hitler popped his clogs, they didn't let the new nice Germans keep Poland and the Sudetenland.
Thread over. Someone compared Cork to Hitler's Germany...
Longfordian
22/02/2010, 4:40 PM
Godwin's Law they call it isn't it?.
So when will be the FAI annoucing they have given Cork a Premier licence and will be allowing them to take part in the Premier Division season now? Surely they have to make an announcement this evening, i though it was due by 5pm?
Thread over. Someone compared Cork to Hitler's Germany...
Comparing Corkonians to people with ridiculous accents that think they're somehow inherently better than everyone else on the planet?
Not as mad as it first sounds actually.....
bluemovie
22/02/2010, 4:41 PM
Didn't think anyone would mind me comparing Tom to Adolf.....well maybe the Hitler family.
pineapple stu
22/02/2010, 4:43 PM
So when will be the FAI annoucing they have given Cork a Premier licence and will be allowing them to take part in the Premier Division season now? Surely they have to make an announcement this evening, i though it was due by 5pm?
Meeting now at 7:30, according to someone an hour (and 5 pages) ago.
Meeting now at 7:30, according to someone an hour (and 5 pages) ago.
thanks for the update
should make for a fun / tense friendly tonight.
should make for a fun / tense friendly tonight.
It would be very nice to hear good news just at kick off but i highly doubt it.... so i'm reckoning it will be fiesty :P
Rocketman
22/02/2010, 5:04 PM
That's it in a nutshell. It doesn't matter that TNB was doing things against the fans' wishes. He cheated, therefore Cork City cheated, and so they finished in a false position. If Bray had signed Ronaldo and Torres (and not paid them), they probably would have stayed up.
And if I can stretch to another analogy, after Hitler popped his clogs, they didn't let the new nice Germans keep Poland and the Sudetenland.
We (Derry City) where punished for the actions of our previous board and rightly so, Cork should be treated the same as it is in the name on Cork City...new board or not Cork City have broken many rules. The book should be thrown at them the way it was at us.
**FrOsTy**
22/02/2010, 5:04 PM
Talking to a few City fans, they're very confident of a premier licence after todays break through.
Shambolic!
redgav
22/02/2010, 5:05 PM
Meeting now at 7:30, according to someone an hour (and 5 pages) ago.
that was me ,its at 7pm ,presumably to allow Brays lawyers a chance to get a bite to eat before making their way from the courthouse to Abbotstown ;-)
weecountyman
22/02/2010, 5:14 PM
http://www.irishexaminer.com/breakingnews/sport/another-reprieve-for-city-447305.html
Pretty clear here, but how on earth could it happen that someone was watching the news, saw that the money from the transfer was not going to him and then jumped into the equation? Surely Tom and co would have said something to him! This is unbelievable.
El-Pietro
22/02/2010, 5:22 PM
http://www.irishexaminer.com/breakingnews/sport/another-reprieve-for-city-447305.html
Pretty clear here, but how on earth could it happen that someone was watching the news, saw that the money from the transfer was not going to him and then jumped into the equation? Surely Tom and co would have said something to him! This is unbelievable.
This is Tom Coughlan we're talking about. You don't seem to realise what he is like. This is par for the course for him.
harry crumb
22/02/2010, 5:27 PM
Great day for Cork City fans.
We can get back to talking about the actual football on the pitch. Hopefully in the Premier Division.
weecountyman
22/02/2010, 5:29 PM
This is Tom Coughlan we're talking about. You don't seem to realise what he is like. This is par for the course for him.
I know he can tell lies with the best of them, Roddy, and can get away with the most outlandish statements unchecked. But I just thought, well, jeez, I just thought there was some shred of normality there!
Great day for Cork City fans.
We can get back to talking about the actual football on the pitch. Hopefully in the Premier Division.
Ah in all fairness while it might be a great day to have gotten rid of Coughlan,it will be an absolute joke if/when you get a premier licence.A sad day for football if it happens.How the f*ck can the ILC justify all the rule breaking and missed deadlines
El-Pietro
22/02/2010, 5:35 PM
I know he can tell lies with the best of them, Roddy, and can get away with the most outlandish statements unchecked. But I just thought, well, jeez, I just thought there was some shred of normality there!
We used to think that as well, needless to say, everytime he surprises us and goes further than we thought possible. He has no regard for anyone but himself, and once he makes a profit he couldnt care what anyone else thinks, or whether it is legal or morally right.
I think he needs to be committed to be honest.
weecountyman
22/02/2010, 5:37 PM
We used to think that as well, needless to say, everytime he surprises us and goes further than we thought possible. He has no regard for anyone but himself, and once he makes a profit he couldnt care what anyone else thinks, or whether it is legal or morally right.
I think he needs to be committed to be honest.
Are we talking about Tom or Roddy? :-)
I'm glad that at least there's a stronger chance of FORAS taking over, and the long term aim has to be a completely supporter controlled club.
SMorgan
22/02/2010, 5:55 PM
The contension that the club is worth a few hundredgrand if in the Premier and worthless if in the First is a load of BS. The club would be stronger if building from the first. Hopefully the FAI will see through this crap.
El-Pietro
22/02/2010, 6:00 PM
The contension that the club is worth a few hundredgrand if in the Premier and worthless if in the First is a load of BS. The club would be stronger if building from the first. Hopefully the FAI will see through this crap.
We dont care what division were in, obviously wed prefer the Premier, but we just want to hold on to our name and history. We don't want Tom Coughlan to have been involved for just 15/18 months and destroy everything we have. We may not be left with much, but we aren't about to give it up if we have any opportunity to hold on to it
Great day for Cork City fans.
We can get back to talking about the actual football on the pitch. Hopefully in the Premier Division.
Very easy for a football supporter to take the moral high ground regarding a situation that doesn't involve their club I know but if Cork get a licence for the Premier it will only confirm the vast majority of barstoolers', and a sizeable amount of LoI fan's suspicions that these two leagues of ours are painful jokes played out at idiots' expenses, namely myself, yourself and everyone else that has wasted their time trying to keep their heads up amidst the myriad of rubbish that gets served to us each and every year
redgav
22/02/2010, 6:13 PM
The contension that the club is worth a few hundredgrand if in the Premier and worthless if in the First is a load of BS. The club would be stronger if building from the first. Hopefully the FAI will see through this crap.
No it wouldn't .It'd be stronger for doing its utmost to try pay back and keep on board those businesses,sponsors,staff and others who were shat on by Arkaga and shat on by TNB...We need businesses and sponsors ,us folding and taking the easy way out would lose us a lot of financial support.We're not gonna be able to do that while in the first division and getting shag all revenue
Celdrog
22/02/2010, 6:13 PM
The implementation of the club licensing process in Ireland is vigorously checked through a process of annual audit conducted by internationally renowned auditing firm SGS Europe, which ensures that the FAI Club Licensing Department maintains the required standards set down by UEFA for licensors.Gonna be fun to see how the FAI explain their decision to UEFA, Delaney's not exactly flavour of the month wth Platini
No it wouldn't .It'd be stronger for doing its utmost to try pay back and keep on board those businesses,sponspor,staff and others who were shat on by Arkaga and shat on by TNB...We need businesses and sponsors ,us foilding and traking the easy way out would lose us a lot of financial support.We're not gonna be able to do that while in the first division and getting shag all revenue
That's why they allowed Tom Coughlan to take over in the first place, because of what Arkaga did. With taking on between �600k and �1.2M in debt what guarantee is there that we will not be here again next year having shat on creditors and sponsors three years in a row.
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