Everton and Liverpool discussion

[juan pablo]

As a die-hard Liverpool fan, i couldn't help but feel after watching the match last night that we still look far off the pace from competing with the big guns,

If you watched Arsenal on Tuesday night with there second string team out, they look really talented and have pace and skill and would probably beat most first teams in the Premier League. I am still not convinced from the likes of Voronin, Sissoko, Babel, and there are more, I was just left feeling sickened in the stomach as anyone else who supports the 'Pool' after last night. Even the bench didn't look strong enough. Charles Itjandze(spelt that wrong looks alright although i think his jersey was a bit big for him if you watch it back.:)

[stojkovic]

It doesnt matter how good Arsenal's second (or third) string is like. They can only put XI players on the pitch at any time. How long will those 'second string' players hang around playing in the reserves. Some of them are NOT babies. And some of them cost alot on money. Arsenal's academy has produced some fine players but people are getting a little carried away with the hype. They havent won anything yet and havent for the last three seasons. Only time will tell.

[drinkfeckarse]

What Wenger does is produce and mould great footballers with great technical skills. People forget that Arsenal actually pay big bucks at times for the raw talent in the first place. Denilson cost approx £4.5m and there are others too but I can't actually be bothered to look them up the monment while I'm supping my can of beer at work :) Their academy is full of young players that actually cost a fair bit of money.

Other clubs are now doing the same to be fair although I'm not sure if they are on the same scale yet.

[cheifo]

Was listening to 5live coverage of Everton/Man U match today and commentators were talking about Rooneys banter with Everton fans.Aparantly he was looking up at them clapping after United goals and final whistle.They said last week against Liverpool there was a side show all match with young Wayne constantly kissing the badge and stuff winding up the Pool fans.All fair enough I suppose but I am suprised hes ok with being disliked by both sets of fans in a football mad city that he must still have roots in.Anybody know the crack?Is he a hate figure in Liverpool?

[KildareFan]

Was listening to 5live coverage of Everton/Man U match today and commentators were talking about Rooneys banter with Everton fans.Aparantly he was looking up at them clapping after United goals and final whistle.They said last week against Liverpool there was a side show all match with young Wayne constantly kissing the badge and stuff winding up the Pool fans.All fair enough I suppose but I am suprised hes ok with being disliked by both sets of fans in a football mad city that he must still have roots in.Anybody know the crack?Is he a hate figure in Liverpool?

Rooney plays for a team that has 70,000 supporters singing "Feed the Scousers", I wonder does he ever stop and think about who he is playing for. He gets an awful lot of stick from everton fans so I suppose he is right to give it back to them but he really brought it all on himself. He is as thoroughly a dislikeable footballer as there is. The fact that he was almost completely marked out of the game by the fantastic Yobo makes him look all the more stupid.

One silly mistake cost Everton very dear. There can be no excuses for Pienaar's tackle, he could never win the ball doing that but it should be remembered that he was best attacking force on the day and has been excellent over the last two months. I still hope we sign him.

Our defence was superb and we really deserved a point. Lescott did really well, Jagielka was superb and is showing signs that he could develop into a really good centre half and was probably our man of the match. Howard was as commanding as always and Yobo was just as good as we've come to expect now. What a centre half he has turned into.

Apart from Ronaldo, I wasn't very impressed with Utd. Three times they've beaten us in 2007 but in each game, we've more than matched them for long periods but somehow contrived to hand them a win each time.

It was also worrying how a couple of injuries in midfield meant we had to reshuffle our team so much. This has to be addressed in Jan with at least 2 midfielders coming in.

Still, 2 home games to come, 6 points and yesterday will be a distant memory.

[anto1208]

Was listening to 5live coverage of Everton/Man U match today and commentators were talking about Rooneys banter with Everton fans.Aparantly he was looking up at them clapping after United goals and final whistle.They said last week against Liverpool there was a side show all match with young Wayne constantly kissing the badge and stuff winding up the Pool fans.All fair enough I suppose but I am suprised hes ok with being disliked by both sets of fans in a football mad city that he must still have roots in.Anybody know the crack?Is he a hate figure in Liverpool?

Pretty much, even the fans that didnt hold it against him leaving for utd to try and win things turned after seeing him running to goad the everton fans after utd scoring against them kissing the badge etc .players that leave a club should show respect for them ( cahil wouldnt even celebrate after scoring v millwall and beattie v southampton etc ) they should show even more respect if they owe everything they have to the club .Everton took rooney in and trained him up they gave up 10 years to developing him and he seems to have nothing but contempt for them. But the fans should also respect that its his job he has every right to play for who he likes and that he did give everton a massive boost with the money from his transfer.

[anto1208]

What do ye make of manny coming back on loan , if we are going to buy him then in the summer id be all on for it but i dont think we should take him if we are going to be used to give him first team football .

Gosling looks like he could be a good purchase

[KildareFan]

What do ye make of manny coming back on loan , if we are going to buy him then in the summer id be all on for it but i dont think we should take him if we are going to be used to give him first team football .

Gosling looks like he could be a good purchase

Fernandes was an excellent player for us last year and would do well in the current midfield with Arteta and Pienaar. Like you, I would be wary of taking him on loan again but I'm sure Moyes would be well aware of any problems.

We have to get somebody in to cover the midfield area, it would be a pity to see such great work earlier in the season go to waste now.

Have to get Pienaar signed up as well, his mistake at Old Trafford apart, he has been brilliant for us and will be badly missed when he is away with South Africa.

[anto1208]

This is a strange one moyes says he knows nothing about him coming back his agent says he is at everton having a medical , Ian ross says they are talking to Valencia about getting him on loan and Valencia chairman says they are looking to get rid after his arrest at the weekend. :confused:

He will do a good job for us but id prefere to be getting in someone that will become pernament.

[anto1208]

Going to be very hard tonight midfield is the biggest problem without Artetta Osman and Pienaar all creativity has been removed. In fact its going to be very hard to even find 4 fit midfielders.Cahill is carrying a knock Tommy grav proved on sat that he is rubbish and should go back to scotland Neville is a liability in there VDM hasnt played in years and is "injured". Think we will have to go with 2 up front and try to by pass midfield as much as possible.

should line up something like this

Howard
Hibbert Yobo Jags Lescott
Faddy Carsley Cahill Baines
AJ Yak

Fingers crossed we can get out of there with our chances still intact.

[KildareFan]

Going to be very hard tonight midfield is the biggest problem without Artetta Osman and Pienaar all creativity has been removed. In fact its going to be very hard to even find 4 fit midfielders.Cahill is carrying a knock Tommy grav proved on sat that he is rubbish and should go back to scotland Neville is a liability in there VDM hasnt played in years and is "injured". Think we will have to go with 2 up front and try to by pass midfield as much as possible.

should line up something like this

Howard
Hibbert Yobo Jags Lescott
Faddy Carsley Cahill Baines
AJ Yak

Fingers crossed we can get out of there with our chances still intact.


I think Phil Neville will definitely play. I'd agree with your team except with Neville in for either Faddy or Baines. Normally I hate seeing Neville in midfield but tonight is just about making sure we are still in the tie by the time the second leg comes around and he can do a "spoiling" job in there.

I'd love to have even one of arteta or pienaar available but Chelseaare missing a lot of players too. Our midfield will be weak and keeping possession is going to be a major problem but with people like cahill, aj and the yak we have plenty of possibilites to score.

We're so close to wembley now, I really hope that we produce a big performance tonight and set ourselves up for what would be an unbelieveable atmosphere at Goodison in the 2nd leg.

[anto1208]

Aaaahhhhhhhhh balls 2nd best untill the red card then everton where worth there goal should have nicked a 2nd from faddy but what a stupid goal where was howard normally so good at controlling the box and lescott what was that.

[KildareFan]

Aaaahhhhhhhhh balls 2nd best untill the red card then everton where worth there goal should have nicked a 2nd from faddy but what a stupid goal where was howard normally so good at controlling the box and lescott what was that.

Very very tough defeat to take but the tie is far from over. I would have settled for that scoreline before the game although obviously in the circumstances, it really was a chance missed. The main thing that we still have a chance no matter how small. I honestly think the noise in Goodison will be out of this world, us poor Everton fans haven't much to shout about in recent years and I reckon the roof will be lifted off the place that night. I'm just raging that I can't make it because of work commitments.

On much better news, the official Valencia website is reporting that Fernandes has signed on loan until the end of the season with an option to buy. He really is a superb addition to our squad. I couldn't have dreamt that we could have a midfield with him, arteta, pienaar and cahill in it a couple of years ago. The race for 4th place is very much on now!!

[anto1208]

I'm a lot happier with the loan deal with the option to buy bit, while we need him now i was a bit put out to be giving some other teams player first team football but this seems good he took the long way round but finally manny is back at goodison (fingers crossed).

Will he be ready for the visit of city on sat prob our biggest game in the race for 4th if we win that we have a good shot if we loose it will prob stay out of our reach for the season.

[OwlsFan]

Liverpool to get 10 million for Sissoko from Juve. Reds must be laughing all the way to the bank.

[drinkfeckarse]

...and £10 million for Carson too by the looks of things. Both good players in their own right but not good enough IMO to become great players so to get £20m is good business by the club.

Sissoko for all his good work breaking up play cannot pass a ball to save himself. Carson is never going to oust Reina although he is almost as consistent as him.

[paddywhack]

agree great bit of business for sissoko..just need to tie up the masharano deal :D

[Armando]

Liverpool to get 10 million for Sissoko from Juve. Reds must be laughing all the way to the bank.

€10 million, right? ...because if it's £ sterling that's ridiculous!!

...also Villa would be crazy to pay £10 million for Carson! Liverpool got him for £1 million and he never established himself there. He's a good keeper but shouldn't be more than £5 million.

[anto1208]

Massive win at the weekend now level on points with liverpool in fourth.Manny signs in & should start to feature from next week on, will add even more class to the midfield with all players available it has to be one of the strongest midfields in the league now.

[anto1208]

What do liverpool fans think of all the nonsense going on at the club at the moment the stadium fiasco where they cant fund it and are thinking of reducing the size now to make it more affordable and remortgage the club UTD style to pay for it putting the club in hundreds of millions of pounds worth of debt.

All the sillyness with Rafa and Klinsman, Being out of the tittle race ( allthough i felt ye where out of that in July :p).

I know im glad Everton didnt sell out now and this Tesco deal is looking sweeter by the day . Allthough the cost of that ground is going up as well.

[Roadend]

Having a shiny new stadium is one thing, filling it is another :p

[drinkfeckarse]

The stadium will look after itself one way or another. I'm not concerned in the meantime with it.

What does concern me is the fact that Hicks came out and admitted that they tried to get Klinsmann. It surely makes Rafa's position untenable? I understand relations are much better between everyone now but why they had to come out with that information is baffling if they are now happy with Benitez.

I said yesterday that Mourinho had apparently been approached about the job and seemed quite open to the possibility of taking over. Only for someone of that calibre would I want Rafa replaced.

To be honest, I'm getting sick of all the constant negative publicity surrounding the club. A few wins on the bounce will have everything looking rosy again!

[anto1208]

Looks like mcfadden is gone £5.5 mill i didnt want him to go but if that pays for half of manny in the summer its a good bit of bussiness. Hopefully Tommy G leaves aswell i dont know what kind of a deal we have made for him but if we are paying 50% of his wages that 20grand that could be better spent on someone that can play.

[anto1208]

Massive game now tomor not going into it very hopefull last few performances have been poor no coincedence that neville goes back into midfield and we fall apart in there.

Dont know whats the best course of action go with 5 in midfield and try to knick a goal or go with 2 up front and try not to loose any more goals.Think if we go with 2 up front we will score.

We need Manny in there any way some one that is able to hold up the ball id like to see starting

Howard
Hibbert Lescott Jags Baines
Artetta Carsley MAnny Osman
Cahill
AJ

But have a feeling it will end up with

Howard
Hibbert Lescott Jags Nuno
Artetta Carsley Neville Osman
Cahill
AJ

[drinkfeckarse]

Looks like mcfadden is gone £5.5 mill i didnt want him to go but if that pays for half of manny in the summer its a good bit of bussiness.

I thought that was great business by Everton. No way would I have payed anyway near that amount for him but I suppose McLeish knows him better than most.

He always struck me as a player that can turn a game with his undoubted skill but far too inconsistent with it.

[anto1208]

I've no doubt he will be a big hit at Birmingham because he will be the most skillfull player there. HE has bags of talent ive allways noticed that if he thinks about what he wants to do he ll make a mess of it but if he just plays he is top class.

It seemed the best for all really good deal for everton 5.5 milll Good move to a manager he has excelled under for scotland.
5.5 isnt that much went you consider Nugent was 6 mill !! and he cant even get in the pompy team.

[drinkfeckarse]

5.5 isnt that much went you consider Nugent was 6 mill !! and he cant even get in the pompy team.

No that's true but I always felt Nugent was hyped far too much. Don't get me wrong, I like McFadden and know he can turn a game in an instant on his day.

I just think he's one of those players who isn't an out an out striker and isn't an out an out winger either.

[anto1208]

Yea he is a drifter never scored enough to be a striker didnt have the pace for a winger and can be quite lazy at times.

Pienaar is 5 times the player faddy is and half the price .

[anto1208]

Dissapointing it was all ways going to be difficult Chelsea in fairness did a good job on everton kept them at bay bar a few spells, great goal to win it.

Just had nothing up front really missed the yak lazy as he is he knows where the goal is.

Howard : could have done better with the goal but was ok
NEville : the less said the better moyes's biggest mistake making him captain he has to stick with him every game
JAgs : good game he is no yobo but made some good tackles
Lesscot : outstanding as all ways
Nuno : Poor first touch and2nd no pace but a lot of very good tackles caught out for the goal
Artetta : double teamed out of it teams know if they stick 2 on him we are limited in attack
Osman : just not on his game
Manny : first game in months and it showed some early skill was let done by some poor passing and control maybe if he had got 30 mins on sunday he would have been better
Carsley : solid as ever got booked won me 130 euro
Cahill : did he play ??
AJ : not built for kick and chase game needs to be part of a 2 man attack

[reder]

Avram Grant on Everton.


In an interview with the Times, Grant isn't a massive admirer of the Blues:

"Grant even compared Everton to Hapoel Petah Tikva, the Israeli club where he started his career as a youth-team coach and won his first silverware. “I won my first trophy 33 years ago, the youth team cup in my first year with Hapoel Petah Tikva, and my first senior trophy was the Toto Cup with them in 1990,” he said. “It was the equivalent of the Carling Cup.

"This is the reason why I understand Everton. We were a very small club — we didn’t have a budget even for the tea. We had just come from the second division and we took it against the best team in Israel, so we were very happy. This is the reason I understand a team like Everton, who are not used to taking trophies. Even not major trophies are very important to you. I remember that we were happy and all the team went out to some bars together."


To top everything off, Grant is a Red at heart:


"My first visit to England was in 1977 at Wembley, Liverpool against Manchester United. I was in the stands as I didn’t have money for another ticket, but they almost killed me, the supporters. I was in the Man United end but supporting Liverpool. That was the problem, by the way. I didn’t know that the hat was different."

[anto1208]

The words clueless clown spring to mind. Fair enough no tknowing the history of everton but not knowing the history of the club he is managing!!

Ive often said it about chelsea that spending 1/2 a billion and winning a few throphys doesnt impress me at all.

[anto1208]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uVb2gbMtN3I

:D

[drinkfeckarse]

Artistic license ;) :D

[anto1208]

Moyes shut the window your letting the players out !!

Well the window is shut now
players out
De Silva ( wasnt up to it )
Viddarsson ( had high hopes for him shame he left )
Faddy ( Good cover player )
Stubbs ( good cover wanted him to finish his carrer with us on a high ill miss him )

Add Cahill / Osman / Pienaar to the injured list it depleats our midfield

Players In

Manny ( unreal talent delighted he is back )
Anthony gardner ( good defender but no Lescott )

[anto1208]

06:30PM Live UEFA Cup - SK Brann v Everton
Available in Ireland only. Available in Ireland only. Live action from the Brann Stadion, Bergen, Norway, as Merseyside giants Everton visit for this last 32, first leg clash. K.O. 19:00.


Midfield is going to be a problem tonight Faddy gone and Pienaar and artetta out injured , will either see Baines risked at left midfield see if his injury holds up or VDM make a come back. id love to see him get a go.

Good price for the betting and Lescott to score first worth a pop.

I see it lining up like this

..........Howard
Neville Yobo Jags Lescott
..........Carsley
VDM.... Cahill .....MAnny
.........AJ.... YAK

[KildareFan]

06:30PM Live UEFA Cup - SK Brann v Everton
Available in Ireland only. Available in Ireland only. Live action from the Brann Stadion, Bergen, Norway, as Merseyside giants Everton visit for this last 32, first leg clash. K.O. 19:00.


Midfield is going to be a problem tonight Faddy gone and Pienaar and artetta out injured , will either see Baines risked at left midfield see if his injury holds up or VDM make a come back. id love to see him get a go.

Good price for the betting and Lescott to score first worth a pop.

I see it lining up like this

..........Howard
Neville Yobo Jags Lescott
..........Carsley
VDM.... Cahill .....MAnny
.........AJ.... YAK



I think Manny is struggling with a groin injury and from reports, it looks like he will start on the bench. That would leave us very short in midfield. That might force Moyes' hand into playing 4-4-2 but I think playing away from home in europe, he will stick to 4-5-1. Assuming Manny doesn't make it, i think it could be something like



..................Howard
......Hibbert Yobo Jags Lescott
.....Osman Carsley Cahill Neville Baines
..................Yak

Not the most adventerous team but it's all about putting ourselves in a good position for the 2nd leg. The pitch is apparently in terrbible condition, it certainly won't be the most pleasing game on the eye. A score draw would be a good result but i fancy us to sneak a 1-0 or 2-1 win. I fancy Yak to get on the scoresheet tonight as well.

[anto1208]

Not a pretty win but a good score none the less 2 nil away from home and time noww to get players fit and ready for the 2nd leg.

Jags again had a great game a young Alan Stubbs , Neville again had a shocker i lost count of the poor crosses passes tackles etc he made bring back hibbert. YAk and Manny gave some very poor passes as well but for the most part everyone( bar neville) did there bit.

Had 60 euro on everton ( biggest bet ever ) so was extra nervous watching it.

[OwlsFan]

I saw the game. Good result (2nd goal off side - just) but to be honest I don't like watching Everton play. Functional but not attractive.

[KildareFan]

I saw the game. Good result (2nd goal off side - just) but to be honest I don't like watching Everton play. Functional but not attractive.

We were missing Arteta and Pienaar last night, two of our most creative players. Everton were playing some fantastic football before Christmas, January and February have been a bit of a slog but we have managed to keep on grinding out results.

A midfield containing arteta, pienaar and fernandes will not just be functional, it promises to be a joy to watch.

[superfrank]

Liverpool 1 Barnsley 2 at Anfield.

What now for Rafa?

[anto1208]

Great week in europe 8 goals !!! it really showed how much we missed Pienaar 4 assists and he hit the post involved in everything going to be a steal at 3 mill hopefully they get him signed up more important than Manny who has been dissapointing since he came back not looking like a £12 mill player.

Big week Man city tonight and pompy at the weekend 2 wins there would set us up nicely for the last 10 games 2 defeats and we could find ourselves out of the race again very quickly

[anto1208]

2 nil job done easily, never looked in doubt yak on the score sheet again must check the stats but i think thats 17 in 24 starts. Pienaar ran the game again MAnny looked out of sorts and came off ten mins after coming on with an "injury".

Beat pompy and we are in a great position

[OwlsFan]

Dedicating a goal to someone who has gone to prison for partially blinding a man. Strange world we live in:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/main.jhtml?xml=/sport/2008/03/03/ufncahill103.xml

[anto1208]

I dont know which is weirder why he did it or why anyone cares ? he dedicated a goal to his brother that just got locked up he didnt dedicate it to him for blinding someone.

The people looking for him to be banned now are idiots silly thing to do but theres nothing bad in it.

On the teams performance really pushing it now played 2 teams battling with us for a european spot and beat them quite comfortably roll on Thursday night now. then sunderland on sunday cant let it all slip away now.

[casso36]

No Doubt they will!!!!:D

[Sam_Heggy]

I dont know which is weirder why he did it or why anyone cares ? he dedicated a goal to his brother that just got locked up he didnt dedicate it to him for blinding someone.

The people looking for him to be banned now are idiots silly thing to do but theres nothing bad in it.

On the teams performance really pushing it now played 2 teams battling with us for a european spot and beat them quite comfortably roll on Thursday night now. then sunderland on sunday cant let it all slip away now.

Ban the jumped up aussie git ;)

[OwlsFan]

I dont know which is weirder why he did it or why anyone cares ? he dedicated a goal to his brother that just got locked up he didnt dedicate it to him for blinding someone.

The people looking for him to be banned now are idiots silly thing to do but theres nothing bad in it. .

I suppose it's not as bad say for example for a nephew of an SS guard to mimic handcuffs if his uncle had recently been locked up for his crimes.

Extremely bad taste and complete lack of empathy for the victim's family, even though they may or may not be in Australia but I agree a ban is out of order but I think he should be disciplined by the club. Where does one draw the line for such things?

[Sam_Heggy]

Did Robbie Fowler not get a ban/fine for his coke snorting mimic a few years ago?
Along the same lines if you ask me.

[anto1208]

Did Robbie Fowler not get a ban/fine for his coke snorting mimic a few years ago?
Along the same lines if you ask me.

He got fine/ban because he did that celebration to goad the oposition fans not to send a message to his brother. He ran if front of the Everton fans to snort the goal line ( or eat the grass like a cow as Houlier tried to pass it off as )

I think its a bit silly banning players over celebrations the abuse they take for 90 mins they should be able to give it back for the few seconds chance they get after scoring. with in reason of course.

While this is silly its a spur of the moment thing after scoring a goal there is nothing more in it.

[Roadend]

Scoring a goal is inciting the oppostiton fans in itself, bans and fines for scoring I say!