Everton and Liverpool discussion

[razor]

LMFAO :p

Reina has been class this season, just 'cos he made a few mistakes doesn't warrant being dropped. Warnock ballsed up for the first goal, no defender should head the ball like that across his own goal. He's inexperienced, he made a mistake, so what? Reina was at fault for the second, but again you can't ignore how solid he has been up to now.
Apart from 1 save in the Super Cup final and a save with his legs from Heskey I can't remember anything decent he has done.
For the first goal Reina could have called for the ball, Warnock didn't know what was behind him Reina did. plus he came for the initial corner and made a mess of that which led to the cross for the goal. He is far too quick off his line which cost us a goal in the Super Cup final and nearly gifted Van Horsehead a goal against Utd last week.
His judgement is suspect and has shown me nothing to say he is worth the money Liverpool paid for him.
He may turn out to be great and I hope he does but with 2 huge games coming up he could be the weakest link.

[redgav]

first i didnt say they were irish i said one was and probibly a few more .
secondly we played badly with grav in the team in december and january then he left ( also for 4 years before he had his 4 months of good games )

loosing players and not replacing them can you explain that
out pistone left back
in valente left back
out stubbs centre back
in ferrari centre back
out watson right midfeild
in davies right midfield
out grav central midfield
in artetta neville central midfield

dont try to talk to an evertonian about everton when you dont have a clue what your on about .

also a forum full of kids of course it is its the internat mainly used by kids this forum is full of kids . is that were the story came from ?? a forum and you belive it

still have nt seen any shred of proof about this story , and i knew about the gazza incedent the rooney bust up , the neville deal , the robbie keane meetings before any one else did . so if it was true id know

Now that you've finished chastising me , does the fact that you yet again completly ignored my comments on your relegation form as being a silent nod ;) ????

You may have played the odd game badly with fester in the team but you played a helluva lot worse without him....have you looked at yer last 30 games ??

Re loosing players ...the word "adequatly" was omitted...

So I don't have a clue what I'm talking about cos I have a different opinion to you but I should kneel in awe at your self proclaimed "I'm mr EFC and I know" title .ffs grow up a bit ..Its a bit of banter , It's not as If I insulted your manhood or something .I take it you also knew about the club in their rush to get more fans yesterday were giving away/selling tickets for £15 depite selling the same ones for £25 to st holders ?!?!?!

And just to revise ,cos it seems you must've missed the paragraph in your rush to tell me how wrong I was ..."met a load of em in the cabbage for the derby and they had the best scouse accents ever ,same at the HJC footie games , best (fake !!! ) scouse accents ever"
bit different from " and you believe it " ehh


Glad you mentioned Robbie Keane ....bluekipper is so insightfull that some of the regulars were actually blaming LFC not selling cisse for Keane not going to youse :D

On a plus side , The Momo Sissoko sure is some player ...pity about that one :p

[anto1208]

Now that you've finished chastising me , does the fact that you yet again completly ignored my comments on your relegation form as being a silent nod ;) ????

You may have played the odd game badly with fester in the team but you played a helluva lot worse without him....have you looked at yer last 30 games ??

Re loosing players ...the word "adequatly" was omitted...

So I don't have a clue what I'm talking about cos I have a different opinion to you but I should kneel in awe at your self proclaimed "I'm mr EFC and I know" title .ffs grow up a bit ..Its a bit of banter , It's not as If I insulted your manhood or something .I take it you also knew about the club in their rush to get more fans yesterday were giving away/selling tickets for £15 depite selling the same ones for £25 to st holders ?!?!?!

And just to revise ,cos it seems you must've missed the paragraph in your rush to tell me how wrong I was ..."met a load of em in the cabbage for the derby and they had the best scouse accents ever ,same at the HJC footie games , best (fake !!! ) scouse accents ever"
bit different from " and you believe it " ehh


Glad you mentioned Robbie Keane ....bluekipper is so insightfull that some of the regulars were actually blaming LFC not selling cisse for Keane not going to youse :D

On a plus side , The Momo Sissoko sure is some player ...pity about that one :p

i didnt miss that pargraph about you meeting them in fact my first answer was in refrence to that i said i that they arent all irish at least one is if not more .

god your getting worse the that mypost fella what is wrong with ye reds .banter is having a laugh using facts not just picking stuff out of the air that you just made up .

on grav, again ill say he had 1/2 a ok season . he played rubbish for 4 years .remember we finished 17th with him in the team

it not an opinion you are giving you are claiming things like moyes sold players with out replacing them i just pointed out all the players he sold and all the players he replaced them with . its not opinion its fact .

and again with this giving away tickets nonsence , they are still 25 quid today what did they put the price back up !!

http://www.evertonfc.com/splash/dinamo-home/main.php (proof)

you seem to spend a lot of time on everton websites , is there something wrong with your own or are you just one of these sad people that go into everton forums make up rubbish to try to wind people up ........ so very very sad ........ and you tell me to grow up

[redgav]

i didnt miss that pargraph about you meeting them in fact my first answer was in refrence to that i said i that they arent all irish at least one is if not more .

god your getting worse the that mypost fella what is wrong with ye reds .banter is having a laugh using facts not just picking stuff out of the air that you just made up .

on grav, again ill say he had 1/2 a ok season . he played rubbish for 4 years .remember we finished 17th with him in the team

it not an opinion you are giving you are claiming things like moyes sold players with out replacing them i just pointed out all the players he sold and all the players he replaced them with . its not opinion its fact .

and again with this giving away tickets nonsence , they are still 25 quid today what did they put the price back up !!

http://www.evertonfc.com/splash/dinamo-home/main.php (proof)

you seem to spend a lot of time on everton websites , is there something wrong with your own or are you just one of these sad people that go into everton forums make up rubbish to try to wind people up ........ so very very sad ........ and you tell me to grow up


God ,you Bs fans ...get so uppety every time someone criticises yer little world :D

where in any of the posts did I say that the club were offering them at discount online ???hmmmmmm
read again what I said .Just so its clear ,cos there seems to be a lot that you are scanning over ;)
They were selling the tickets IN the City centre with 2 birds dressed in EFC gear and were offering them to people for £15 . If you don't believe me , why not ring one Ian Ross or someone , you know , the ones that give you all your scoops ..maybe they'll let you know all about it
Or why not go on to blukipper , afterall ,they are the ones that started this negative efc thread that was copied to loads of LFC sites .And man are they hammering the club for it .Imagine it , wee luvvie is so obsessed with getting some extra sheckles in that he'd actually screw over his more loyal fanbase just to get a few extr discounted seat in there ...some of your felow supporters are spitting blood over it

Moyes sold 3 players that were established ,and were playing above themselves cos they were looking for new contracts elswhere , he has not "adequetly"(another word you missed :D ) replaced them.He may have actually bought replacements but they are not even close to what you got rid of

As for spending time on efc sites , You've just copied a post where I put in bold type that I meet them and played football against them, what does that suggest ???? ....is that really the best retort you can come up with ??? to call me sad for being mates with some efc fans.Besides , as you know well, anything like that will end up on a lfc site within minutes just like the same happens in reverse

[jockser]

you lads dont half talk some schite!!!! Youre getting WORSE than mypost and his michael owen love dolls. can we not get back to the discussion of saying "Youre muck!" and replying with " No YOURE muck!!"

[anto1208]

God ,you Bs fans ...get so uppety every time someone criticises yer little world :D

where in any of the posts did I say that the club were offering them at discount online ???hmmmmmm
read again what I said .Just so its clear ,cos there seems to be a lot that you are scanning over ;)
They were selling the tickets IN the City centre with 2 birds dressed in EFC gear and were offering them to people for £15 . If you don't believe me , why not ring one Ian Ross or someone , you know , the ones that give you all your scoops ..maybe they'll let you know all about it
Or why not go on to blukipper , afterall ,they are the ones that started this negative efc thread that was copied to loads of LFC sites .And man are they hammering the club for it .Imagine it , wee luvvie is so obsessed with getting some extra sheckles in that he'd actually screw over his more loyal fanbase just to get a few extr discounted seat in there ...some of your felow supporters are spitting blood over it

Moyes sold 3 players that were established ,and were playing above themselves cos they were looking for new contracts elswhere , he has not "adequetly"(another word you missed :D ) replaced them.He may have actually bought replacements but they are not even close to what you got rid of

As for spending time on efc sites , You've just copied a post where I put in bold type that I meet them and played football against them, what does that suggest ???? ....is that really the best retort you can come up with ??? to call me sad for being mates with some efc fans.Besides , as you know well, anything like that will end up on a lfc site within minutes just like the same happens in reverse

i dont mind people having a go at everton other posters on here do it .im not getting pi ssed off with you slagging everton im getting pi ssed of with you making up lies in a pure attempt to wind me up !!

the box office charge 25, every ticket agent charges 25, the club says they cost 25 . but you know of 2 birds selling ticket for 15 give me a break .

adequetly replacing players : selling 1 player buying 2 for that position is adequet . are you suggesting that selling a 34 year old and replacing him with 2 quality defenders in there 20's isnt good enough .

i thought you read efc forums because you said "reading that forum" .about blue kipper . how did i get the idea that you read the forum.........surely my fault !!
and you also referenced toffeeweb who you said you met for the derby , so not in the last few weeks as in after the event in question happened !!! (also dont belive something a guy down the pub tells you )

any way im not going to reply anymore as its clear you dont know what your on about and its just a poor wind up .

[Dillo]

:cool: Great to see the best thread ever put on foot.ie still flying high!

The blues are struggling at the minute but i'm sure the revival will commence at Man City next sunday. After all the only way is up now!

[redgav]

i dont mind people having a go at everton other posters on here do it .im not getting pi ssed off with you slagging everton im getting pi ssed of with you making up lies in a pure attempt to wind me up !!

the box office charge 25, every ticket agent charges 25, the club says they cost 25 . but you know of 2 birds selling ticket for 15 give me a break .

adequetly replacing players : selling 1 player buying 2 for that position is adequet . are you suggesting that selling a 34 year old and replacing him with 2 quality defenders in there 20's isnt good enough .

i thought you read efc forums because you said "reading that forum" .about blue kipper . how did i get the idea that you read the forum.........surely my fault !!
and you also referenced toffeeweb who you said you met for the derby , so not in the last few weeks as in after the event in question happened !!! (also dont belive something a guy down the pub tells you )

any way im not going to reply anymore as its clear you dont know what your on about and its just a poor wind up .

You're priceless

As i said , go check yer proclaimed best site bluekipper and then come back and direct all kisses to me backsie region ...

http://bluekipper.net/everton_forum/viewtopic.php?t=44477

http://bluekipper.net/everton_forum/viewtopic.php?t=44581


I await you're response with baited breathe...its not often a RS is more "in the know" than a BS :D

[jockser]

:cool: Great to see the best thread ever put on foot.ie still flying high!

The blues are struggling at the minute but i'm sure the revival will commence at Man City next sunday. After all the only way is up now!
you're only coddin yourself :p

there is only one way for everton this year and its not up im afraid :eek:

[4tothefloor]

Youre getting WORSE than mypost and his michael owen love dolls
lol :p

And jaysus if it isn't Dillo, who's suddenly climbed out of the bunker he's been hiding in since we won the CL..... :D

[mypost]

in that 5 FIVE games , they've picked up 3 draws, from games we lost last season!!!

League draws = Useless. Points gained from drawn games, will be lost somewhere else down the line.


Owen would be the preferred choice, but I'm glad benitez wasn't dictated to by someone who was so desperate for a club (that he'd go to barcodes) just so he wouldn't lose his Engurland place

So, is he the only player around concerned that his lack of first-team football, may be damaging to his international place?? :rolleyes: If you were an international player, and you faced the task of sitting on the bench kicking fresh air for 4 months which may harm your international prospects, or move elsewhere, what would you do?? :confused:

Isn't that in a roundabout way, what Fernando Morientes did?

[anto1208]

You're priceless

As i said , go check yer proclaimed best site bluekipper and then come back and direct all kisses to me backsie region ...

http://bluekipper.net/everton_forum/viewtopic.php?t=44477

http://bluekipper.net/everton_forum/viewtopic.php?t=44581


I await you're response with baited breathe...its not often a RS is more "in the know" than a BS :D

i spot the irony in replying ,to tell you im not replying to you anymore, ive no idea what those pages are ment to be linked to but all i get is a log in page !! so that proves nothing also its a FORUM nothing posted on a FORUM can be taken as fact because as we all know they are full of kids and worse the redsh1te making up nonsence .

now thats it thank you and good night

[redgav]

i spot the irony in replying ,to tell you im not replying to you anymore, ive no idea what those pages are ment to be linked to but all i get is a log in page !! so that proves nothing also its a FORUM nothing posted on a FORUM can be taken as fact because as we all know they are full of kids and worse the redsh1te making up nonsence .

now thats it thank you and good night

ahhh , so you dissmiss a story I tell you appeared in one forum , based on you claiming its rubbish forum,then promote a second one as being "the best one there" and now you tell me you don't even have a log in for that very same forum.....this gets better and better ...just how is it you know that its the best one around if you don't even use it
If you had a log in you would get the proof of the 15 quid tickets that you dismissed as me making up stories , but hey if you prefer to keep your fingers in your ears singing lallalalala instead of finding out just how smalltime your club is then thats your choice ....

its simple really , log in , go back to page 4/5 and look for the thread "everton sell tickets for 15" and tell me am I making up stories ;)

Oh and heres a post on a forum ...Liverpool are the current Champions of Europe , fact or fiction

[redgav]

League draws = Useless. Points gained from drawn games, will be lost somewhere else down the line.



So, is he the only player around concerned that his lack of first-team football, may be damaging to his international place?? :rolleyes: If you were an international player, and you faced the task of sitting on the bench kicking fresh air for 4 months which may harm your international prospects, or move elsewhere, what would you do?? :confused:

Isn't that in a roundabout way, what Fernando Morientes did?

draws are useless ??? that makes sense :confused:
No points = Baaaaaaad
1 point = gooood
3 points = excelleeeeent

On the basisof points tallies , 3 points from 3 games is better than no points from the same 3 games

and before you say it yes I see the irony of it but with all 3 games ,a bit of composure and better finishing and they could have been wins :D


Re - Owen .... have you read the bascombe article about what went on ???

[anto1208]

ahhh , so you dissmiss a story I tell you appeared in one forum , based on you claiming its rubbish forum,then promote a second one as being "the best one there" and now you tell me you don't even have a log in for that very same forum.....this gets better and better ...just how is it you know that its the best one around if you don't even use it
If you had a log in you would get the proof of the 15 quid tickets that you dismissed as me making up stories , but hey if you prefer to keep your fingers in your ears singing lallalalala instead of finding out just how smalltime your club is then thats your choice ....

its simple really , log in , go back to page 4/5 and look for the thread "everton sell tickets for 15" and tell me am I making up stories ;)

Oh and heres a post on a forum ...Liverpool are the current Champions of Europe , fact or fiction

i was talking about the toffeeweb and blue kipper websites not the forums . forums are open to any old idiot to post any old rubbish on it .if your looking for facts on forums your going to get misled .

perhaps now i see the problem with your stories as you seem to take something someone wrote in a forum as fact .

again i find it hard to belive that from the box office a ticket costs 25 but if you walk 3 miles to the city centre you save a tenner !! . are you sure it wasnt 2 birds selling student /oap/kids tickets as they are about £12 and some one just misheard or misunderstood what was happening

[redgav]

i was talking about the toffeeweb and blue kipper websites not the forums . forums are open to any old idiot to post any old rubbish on it .if your looking for facts on forums your going to get misled .

perhaps now i see the problem with your stories as you seem to take something someone wrote in a forum as fact .

again i find it hard to belive that from the box office a ticket costs 25 but if you walk 3 miles to the city centre you save a tenner !! . are you sure it wasnt 2 birds selling student /oap/kids tickets as they are about £12 and some one just misheard or misunderstood what was happening


You seem to be doing an awefull lot of evading going onto the site and reading this for yourself ...but hey , if you prefer to sit there muttering that I'm making things up thats your choice .......I'm amazed that you havn't bothered to get onto whoever tells you your scoops
And as I said ,Stopry was reported on bk , It was Told to me via text , and this has been confirmed by friends and family In Liverpool , but you'd rather not know the truth

Must say tho , theres a lot of very unhappy home fans ,not just Moyes that has em up in arms but seems yer man wyness with his cheapo tickets has them spitting blood

[redgav]

:D even better ...just got a text to let me know that EFC were in the Liverpool Uni today selling a ticket and a bottle of Chang for £10 :D :D

[anto1208]

You seem to be doing an awefull lot of evading going onto the site and reading this for yourself ...but hey , if you prefer to sit there muttering that I'm making things up thats your choice .......I'm amazed that you havn't bothered to get onto whoever tells you your scoops
And as I said ,Stopry was reported on bk , It was Told to me via text , and this has been confirmed by friends and family In Liverpool , but you'd rather not know the truth

Must say tho , theres a lot of very unhappy home fans ,not just Moyes that has em up in arms but seems yer man wyness with his cheapo tickets has them spitting blood

im not evading anything , there is no story !!

[mypost]

Well, now the shi-t has really hit the fan:

Liverpool 1-4 Chelsea

I hope the "Dictatorship of Benitez Mouthpieces" will start listening after that. The above scoreline proves that my recent posts are not "rubbish", but are further evidence that this joke of a boss cannot cut the mustard in the Premiership. :mad:

At the beginning of October, where are we?

Played 6, drawn 4, scored 4, conceded 7.
Thrilled with getting one point at Birmingham, Spurs, and Boro :rolleyes:
A boss tactically out of-his-depth in the league, playing boring longball football, with crazy conservative formations.
5 strikers have scored the grand total of 1 league goal between them
2 points away from the bottom three,
In 13th place,
With the club's worst start in the league since 1992/93, to boot.

That is simply not good enough.

What use is Djimi Traore? Why is he playing?
Sissoko? The greatest waste of money since Harry Kewell.
Cisse? £14 million of striking talent kicking fresh air on the bench. When he does play, he is played out of position.
Crouch? Showing why his last club were relegated.
Pongolle? Waste of space.

The "great" :rolleyes: points won away from home, have been rendered completely useless following a crushing home defeat to Chelsea. Reaching 4th place is not a goal at this club, yet even that looks kilometres away at the moment. It's very difficult to see where goals, or indeed league wins are going to come from at the moment. Benitez may have won the "Best coach in Europe" award, but that was based on a select few games. However, he's about as effective in the league, as a snowboard in the Sahara in mid-summer. The outlook for us domestically, is bleak. :mad:

[redgav]

Well, now the shi-t has really hit the fan:

Liverpool 1-4 Chelsea

I hope the "Dictatorship of Benitez Mouthpieces" will start listening after that. The above scoreline proves that my recent posts are not "rubbish", but are further evidence that this joke of a boss cannot cut the mustard in the Premiership. :mad:

At the beginning of October, where are we?

Played 6, drawn 4, scored 4, conceded 7.
Thrilled with getting one point at Birmingham, Spurs, and Boro :rolleyes:
A boss tactically out of-his-depth in the league, playing boring longball football, with crazy conservative formations.
5 strikers have scored the grand total of 1 league goal between them
2 points away from the bottom three,
In 13th place,
With the club's worst start in the league since 1992/93, to boot.

That is simply not good enough.

What use is Djimi Traore? Why is he playing?
Sissoko? The greatest waste of money since Harry Kewell.
Cisse? £14 million of striking talent kicking fresh air on the bench. When he does play, he is played out of position.
Crouch? Showing why his last club were relegated.
Pongolle? Waste of space.

The "great" :rolleyes: points won away from home, have been rendered completely useless following a crushing home defeat to Chelsea. Reaching 4th place is not a goal at this club, yet even that looks kilometres away at the moment. It's very difficult to see where goals, or indeed league wins are going to come from at the moment. Benitez may have won the "Best coach in Europe" award, but that was based on a select few games. However, he's about as effective in the league, as a snowboard in the Sahara in mid-summer. The outlook for us domestically, is bleak. :mad:


Yer like a kid screamin cos his mum won't get him the shiney wrapped sweets at the counter!!!!
Complete OTT reactionary drivel .........1 game where a scoreline flattered , andc suddenly momo's useless ,Crouch is useless cos hes sooooooo big , and of course so is benitez ....cos apart from the Champions league ,whats he ever done for us ...some times I really and truly wonder just why people like you latch onto a club like Liverpool , why not put yourself out of your misery , buy blew shirt ,and support the chavs

Longball football ??? What bloomin game were you watchin ??? there was only one team playin long ball and they play in blue

[jockser]

However, he's about as effective in the league, as a snowboard in the Sahara in mid-summer. The outlook for us domestically, is bleak. :mad:

eh id say a snowboard in the sahara would be quite handy surfing those dunes :) .We lost for the first time yesterday long after everyone else except chelsea.Your posts do nothing but either embarrass your footballing knowledge or reflect your 7 year old age. Bad mistakes by players and manager lost us the game yesterday but all is not so gloomy as you would think.
Can you come back and post after we have played our next 8 games which are
Blackburn – home
Fulham – away
West Ham – home
Villa – away
Portsmouth - Home
Man City – away
Wigan – home
Boro – home
then and only then will the season and the table (and yourself!!!)start to sort itself out.
oh and by the way, just as a matter of interest, before the season started what exactly was your expectation of your beloved liverpool for the season?

[mypost]

I hope the "Dictatorship of Benitez Mouthpieces" will start listening after that.

It appears that despite the message been loud and clear, it's still not been absorbed by some people.


Your posts do nothing but either embarrass your footballing knowledge or reflect your 7 year old age.

Where are you going with your 7 year old drivel? :confused: :mad:

Actually, FYI, I have been supporting the club for 20 years. I have seen us win domestic leagues and cups, and that is how all Liverpool coaches are judged. Benitez is either unable and/or unwilling to compete domestically. He wastes his money buying useless Spaniards, he selects the wrong players, he plays the wrong tactics. This is the boss, whose side got knocked out of the FA Cup by flippin' Burnley at the first hurdle!! It's his team now, and he accepts the responsibility, and the criticism for bad results.


Bad mistakes by players and manager lost us the game yesterday but all is not so gloomy as you would think.

Losing 1 game is acceptable. Losing 1-4 at home, on the back of 3 straight draws, and finding ourselves in 13th place is not. Whatever way you want to dress up the facts to your own agenda, you cannot tell me that lying in 13th place is good for Liverpool.


Can you come back and post after we have played our next 8 games which are
Blackburn – home
Fulham – away
West Ham – home
Villa – away
Portsmouth - Home
Man City – away
Wigan – home
Boro – home

And you think we'll win most/all of those games? Playing 4-5-1 is not going to launch a scoring spree. This team has scored 4 goals in 6 games. Where are the goals in the above games going to come from? Not from Crouch, that's for sure. So, who else is going to provide the firepower?


by the way, just as a matter of interest, before the season started what exactly was your expectation of your beloved liverpool for the season?

Expectation? To compete for the title, failing that to finish in the top 3. Given our resources, they are not unreasonable expectations. Like most fans, I will not accept the current situation, European Champions or not. The league determines where the club is going. As the stats clearly show, we are heading in the wrong direction. Until Benitez halts the slide, I will continue to criticise the team, until things improve.

[jockser]

Expectation? To compete for the title, failing that to finish in the top 3. Given our resources, they are not unreasonable expectations. Like most fans, I will not accept the current situation, European Champions or not. The league determines where the club is going. As the stats clearly show, we are heading in the wrong direction. Until Benitez halts the slide, I will continue to criticise the team, until things improve.
So is there any chance of you stopping your whinging til december and we get a proper idea of where we are in the league after the above mentioned games?:rolleyes:

[mypost]

So is there any chance of you stopping your whinging til december and we get a proper idea of where we are in the league after the above mentioned games?:rolleyes:

In a word, no. The Premiership starts in August, not December.

I'll stop "whinging", when the coach plays the right tactics, picks the right players, we win games, and are competitive, which is not the case at the moment.

[dfx-]

I'll stop "whinging", when the coach plays the right tactics, picks the right players, we win games, and are competitive, which is not the case at the moment.

I'll translate that.

You'll stop incessantly complaining when Benitez plays the way you want them to play or think they should play, rather than what is best for Liverpool in the long run. :rolleyes: :mad:

[dfx-]

Expectation? To compete for the title, failing that to finish in the top 3. Given our resources, they are not unreasonable expectations. The league determines where the club is going.

Your expectation of this team was to challenge for the title and 6 weeks in, you are now slating that very team with that same set up as rubbish?! :rolleyes: Given the resources we had at the start of the season we were title challengers and now given those same resources we are useless and the manager doesn't know what he's doing? The contradiction....:D If you understood football rather than 'say what you see', then you would understand:

(i) We were not title challengers to begin with. Benitez cannot be expected to live up to aspirations rather than expectations.

(ii) We are more stable than last year. No away defeats vs. how many last season...? We were unbeaten ahead of everyone else 'above' us until the weekend. It is not easy to spot why some people are optimistic despite the defeat. It comes down to your true understanding of the game


As the stats clearly show, we are heading in the wrong direction.

Any child can read stats and come to a conclusion. :rolleyes: Again it is down to understanding the progress of the team in other than results.

From a dissection of your posts so far, that understanding is something you are sadly lacking

[mypost]

You'll stop incessantly complaining when Benitez plays the way you want them to play or think they should play, rather than what is best for Liverpool in the long run. :rolleyes: :mad:

If RB played the way that is best for Liverpool in the long run, we wouldn't be sitting in 13th position.


Given the resources we had at the start of the season we were title challengers and now given those same resources we are useless and the manager doesn't know what he's doing?

We finished 5th last season with Houllier's leftovers. Now, we are supposed to be a better side, having bought new players in the close-season. Logically, this should mean an improvement in results, points, and position. After 38 games last year, we finished 37 points behind the champions, with an injury crisis. With no injury crisis so far this season, we are already 17 points behind the leaders, and lie in the bottom half of the league. It is not acceptable, and it shows that the European successes are a smokescreen, which only paper up a wide range of fundamental problems within the team.


We are more stable than last year.

And you base this on...


No away defeats vs. how many last season...?

3 away draws, including two 0-0 draws. :rolleyes: More smokescreens. We cannot score goals, we play terrible football, the tactics are not working, and at present, we show no sign of any improvement. In you want to be competitive in any league, draws are useless. They're fine if you like to swim in mediocrity.


Any child can read stats and come to a conclusion.

And any child knows that the league table doesn't lie. We are in 13th place, and lucky not to be further down. Results must improve rapido.

[jockser]

In a word, no. The Premiership starts in August, not December.

I'll stop "whinging", when the coach plays the right tactics, picks the right players, we win games, and are competitive, which is not the case at the moment.
So basically you havent stopped whinging since 1990 !!!:D :D :D

[mypost]

So basically you havent stopped whinging since 1990 !!!:D :D :D

Since November 2002, when we were unbeaten, and 7 points clear at the top. Then H went to Boro', played for a draw and lost. It began a run of 11 league games without a win, (the worst in the club's history), and turned a 7-point lead into a 5th place finish. Despite millions being spent, and a change of manager, there has been no noticeable improvement domestically since then. :(

[dfx-]

If RB played the way that is best for Liverpool in the long run, we wouldn't be sitting in 13th position.


You just don't get it. :rolleyes: :mad:

It's not about being 13th now! It's about seeing the development of the team that in a year or two we will actually be challenging...

Sure I suppose you were loving it when we were top of the group with the neanderthal Houllier - who cares about the future of the club - just as long as we're top for a couple of seasons.:rolleyes: Sure we were top then and we finished second - none of this 13th business...

Look where that got us.:rolleyes:

I don't care if they lose their next match away or not and drop to 15th. It is not about that to everyone except the fickle and the stupid.


Logically, this should mean an improvement in results, points,

Now you've been saying there's been no improvement in results, yet we are getting points where we did not last season..............................? Prior to last Sunday, we had exactly the same points as we had after 5 matches last season. However we are more solid at the back. We can zonal mark. We have not lost humiliating games at Bolton and Utd.

Goals can come. If you ever looked at Benitez at Valencia you'll see what he's trying to do there. For Carew read Crouch. Luis Garcia - a temporary Aimar. Gerrard = Baraja. Now all he needs is his Vicente and Rufete type wingers....and *that* requires time.

The sooner the rest of the players get used to adopt this tactic and method of play, the quicker the improvement will be upon proper wingers being installed.


Since November 2002, when we were unbeaten, and 7 points clear at the top.

Undoubtedly you were happy under Houllier then, by definition of what you call success (i.e. to be top never mind anything else). The nature of Houllier meant that was going to collapse and so it did. And yet, I'm sure you'd tear into Houllier at the first chance. :rolleyes:















But understanding why people are not calling for Benitez' head despite being 13th any other statistic you can throw at us, requires you to look further than the league table or any statistics can provide you and see if there's any knowledge of football there at all.

[mypost]

I don't care if they lose their next match away or not and drop to 15th. If you ever looked at Benitez at Valencia you'll see what he's trying to do there. For Carew read Crouch. Luis Garcia - a temporary Aimar. Gerrard = Baraja. Now all he needs is his Vicente and Rufete type wingers....and *that* requires time

We scraped into the CL this season by the back door. If we don't finish in the CL qualifying positions this season, we won't have as much money to spend on bringing in all the players we need next season. And we all know how long it takes Spanish players to adapt to the demands of English football. :rolleyes:


Now you've been saying there's been no improvement in results, yet we are getting points where we did not last season?

No rather, we got A point at Boro', Brum, and Spurs. We won't be the only team to take points off those teams away this season. All 3 sides have lost to other teams at home this season. That puts our "improvement" in perspective.


However we are more solid at the back. We have not lost humiliating games at Bolton and Utd. Goals can come.

Is losing 1-2 at one of our main rivals, "humiliation"?:confused:

The reason why we are solid at the back is down to the formation used, which in turn, restricts our attacking instincts. It's all very well keeping them out, as long as you're knocking them in at the other end. We aren't scoring goals, we're not winning games, and that is a major problem. That's not just me talking; other fans, and most observers in the media think along the same lines. Until the goalscoring problem is sorted, we will continue to struggle. If it continues for a long period, we will have lost too much ground to our rivals. If we fail to make the CLQ's this season, it will be a disaster both financially, and for the team's development. So we must start winning, soon.

[jockser]

why has the great title of this thread been changed!?!?! :( :confused:

[Dillo]

why has the great title of this thread been changed!?!?! :( :confused:


Yeah Jockser, and it was done behind my back and i'm not happy about it.

[mypost]

Nothing wrong with the title, it's probably better.

But why is the poll still on it?? :confused: The poll was voted on, is closed, and is about the 2004/05 season. Can it be removed without interfering with the thread?

[jockser]

Nothing wrong with the title, it's probably better.

But why is the poll still on it?? :confused: The poll was voted on, is closed, and is about the 2004/05 season. Can it be removed without interfering with the thread?
no i prefered to old title so in my opinion it should be changed back

[jockser]

not a great performance against 10 defenders and moro could have had a hatrick.but 3 points is the the most important thing!!!

bye bye everton.....

[4tothefloor]

not a great performance against 10 defenders and moro could have had a hatrick.but 3 points is the the most important thing!!!

bye bye everton.....
Cisse should have had at least a hat-trick and Moro could have matched it. Dreadful finishing. It's ridiculous because we are winning games 1-0 that we should be p!ssing through. We are drawing games that we should be winning and as for the Chelsea game, our lack of finishing and cutting edge cost us when we were the better side in the first half. Still think things will fall into place though

[jockser]

i miss your Pessimism :D

[dfx-]

Stubborn pessimists please note: Another game with an improvement on the corresponding fixture last season.......

[4tothefloor]

I'm a bit alarmed though that Benitez is after another beanpole striker, your man from Getafe, Riki I think his name is. We need mobility, Cisse made a huge difference yesterday. Morientes just doesn't look up to it. Crouch is very limited.

All in all though I'm not impressed with the football we've played this season, it needs to improve, and fast.

[JoeSemi]

Not long back from the States, so i'm just bedding myself into foot again! Great to see the thread is still open for healthy discussion, but the title change will have be altered back so those Evertonians can reminisce over their one season among the elite.:)

This season is a far cry from the euphoria on Merseyside last May when both clubs achieved what they set out to do in the second half of the season. A lot of failed transfer targets later and a few questionable signings on both sides, have left Liverpool and Everton victims of their own overnight successes. Prices were immediately hiked up for players when Liverpool came calling and Rafa was left without the centre half he badly required. Everton, meanwhile, thought they were now a big club with notions beyond their station of who they could sign, thus leaving them resigned to paying over the odds for the likes of Simon Davies and Phil Neville. You reap what you sow, and Everton ultimately didn't get the Champs Lge football they prematurely thought was in their grasp last May.

Expectations have risen but both teams have fallen in these early months. Criticism can be thrown at a few doors in both cases, but the crux of the matter is that both clubs over-achieved last season thanks to two top class managers who had two well-drilled sides. The next step hasn't come and people are pressing a few panic buttons that are unwarranted. Everton have more cause for concern than liverpool, thankfully, but when they get a few players fit they should climb out of trouble. Thats all Everton can realistically hope for from this season, but Liverpool fans rightfully want more. The more we are talking about is finishing closer to chelski than last season, and with a bit of patience and belief in what Rafa is doing this will happen. There is a midfield three of Gerrard, Alonso and Sissoko that will match any in the world and a front three, that when they gain a bit of confidence and quality supply from wide players, will certainly score goals.

Goals can come. If you ever looked at Benitez at Valencia you'll see what he's trying to do there. For Carew read Crouch. Luis Garcia - a temporary Aimar. Gerrard = Baraja. Now all he needs is his Vicente and Rufete type wingers....and *that* requires time.

Dfx made the above point which ties in with my previous one and there is little doubt this is what Rafa is trying to achieve. For Rufete, wait for Simao in january. For Vicente, we'll hold tight once more to see can the old Harry Kewell rise to the task. The other problem is the centre back position, with things looking ominous for Sami after yesterday. I hope it was just the fact he'd played 4 games in 14 days and was tired that he was left out and that we see him back for wednesday, where 3 more points should be comfortably picked up in Brussels.

On an added note, I was delighted to see Cisse react with the celebration he did after the horrible taunts he was subjected to by a few scumbags in the Blackburn end. To think the lad went through what he did and there are still mindless thugs who want to bring the horror moment up again.

[mypost]

I'm quite happy with Liverpool so far this season. This time last year I remember the major difficulties we were having, Twelve months on and it's working like a dream.

Or is it??

Later on:


I'm a bit alarmed though. I'm not impressed with the football we've played this season, it needs to improve, and fast

Has the tide turned??

[4tothefloor]

Or is it??

Later on:



Has the tide turned??

If you're going to quote me mypost, at least do it properly and quote the full quote :rolleyes: . The first quote above, I was talking about our defensive problems ie. Zonal Marking 12 months ago. Apart from the Chelsea game, we are not conceding goals, so defensively it is working like a dream. But of course you do a selective quote and leave the defensive bit out just to suit your sad Michael Owen love affair arguement. It's so sad you can't even see the difference between talking about the defensive unit/defending set-pieces and the teams overall style of play. So go back in to your box like a good man......

As JoSemi said, we are lacking wingers and wingers are really the key to Rafa's tactics in the long run. All you have to do is look at the effect Duff/Robben/Wright-Phillips/Cole have at Chelsea when playing off a target man and you get the picture. For Lampard, read Gerrard. It looks like Benitez is going to go back for Simao in January should Benfica bow out of the CL. Jaoquin keeps banging on about how much he wants to join Liverpool, he's at it again this week before the Chelsea game. I doubt if we can afford Jaoquin, but if we did sign him it would be a whole different ball game. Maybe we could send Morientes off to Betis. Fingers crossed!

[mypost]

If you're going to quote me mypost, at least do it properly and quote the full quote

I'll quote the relevant quote, not how you want it.


to suit your sad Michael Owen love affair arguement.

You're acting the blx now. :mad: Wtf has he got to do with it?? :confused:

The defence is working like a dream, isn't it? 7 goals conceded in 7 games, a minus gd with 5 strikers available, a place in the bottom half of the league, and our worst start since 1992 to boot.

That isn't working like a dream. It's merely mediocrity. Anyone who says otherwise is lieing.

[4tothefloor]

I'll quote the relevant quote, not how you want it.

Good man mypost, whatever you say ;) :rolleyes:

I think ignoring you is the best bet from now on because you're just a waste of time arguing with

[mypost]

I think ignoring you is the best bet from now on because you're just a waste of time arguing with

In that case, then this and other Liverpool-related threads should be closed, then there will be no arguing/debating with anyone. ;)

[JoeSemi]

Down with the sniping lads or we'll be looking for Frank Warren to find a suitable venue for foot.ie members to see you two slog it out! And this is what one or both will look like(minus the smile) in the post match press conference...:cool:

This thread hasn't run its course and if some of the bluenoses started to throw their views into the mix it'd be all the more healthier. They're conspicuous by their absence not surprisingly:p

[JoeSemi]

Anyone read the piece on the liverpool website about our front players? If I could add the attachment I would, but its definitely worth reading.

[jockser]

so we have signed gonzales........where will he play? i presume left or right wing......fingers crossed he is what we have all been waiting for!!!


VIVA LA RAFALUCION!!!!!

[Dillo]

This thread hasn't run its course and if some of the bluenoses started to throw their views into the mix it'd be all the more healthier. They're conspicuous by their absence not surprisingly:p[/QUOTE]


The chief orchestrator of this thread is a blue nose and proud of it. He originally entitled the thread "Merseyside now Moyeseyside?" but some parasite had the cheek to go and alter it to "Everton and Liverpool discussion". Last season's poll granted everybody an opportunity to cast a vote on who would finish the highest in the league. The toffees handsomely came out on top in both instances :rolleyes: :p . Enough said...