LOI in Europe 2011

[sligoman]

Semi-Final 1st leg results tonight:

FC Porto 5-1 Villarreal CF
Benfica 2-1 Braga

If Benfica go through to final, Rovers are guaranteed to be in the Europa League 3rd qualifying round afaik. Better chance of getting a big draw (Marseille, Birmingham, 6th in Serie A, 7th in La Liga, among others) in that but downside is the home leg wont be in Sligo afaik, whereas if we're in 2nd round it would be.

EL dates I have are:
20th June 1st/2nd round draw.
30th June 1st round, 1st leg.
7th July 1st round, 2nd leg.
14th July 2nd round, 1st leg
15th July 3rd round draw.
21st July 2nd round, 2nd leg
28th July 3rd round, 1st leg.
4th August 3rd round, 2nd leg

[PartySaint]

I am totally lost by this, Why do Sligo go into the 3rd qualifying round if Benfica get to the Final??

[Red4Eva]

If the title holder qualifies for any stage of the Champions League

The title holder's place in the group stage is vacated. The title holder loses all entitlement to this place, even if they are knocked out out of the Champions League and re-enter the Europa League. Their place in the group stage is not automatically given to another team. This means that one more team is required to progress from the playoff round to the group stage. To do this:

The domestic cup winners of associations 16 and 17 (Scotland and Bulgaria) are moved from the third qualifying round to the play-off round.
The domestic cup winners of associations 28 and 29 (Belarus and the Republic of Ireland) are moved from the second qualifying round to the third qualifying round.

[mypost]

If Benfica go through to final, Better chance of getting a big draw (Marseille, Birmingham, 6th in Serie A, 7th in La Liga, among others) in that but downside is the home leg wont be in Sligo afaik, whereas if we're in 2nd round it would be.

What do you want? The progress or the glamour tie?

We need to win 2 CL rounds to get to the UEFA Cup groups minimum. Hence I want 2 winnable rounds, rather than the one only we got last year.

[TheBoss]

It looks highly likely that Shamrock Rovers will be the highest unseeded team, unless Maribor lose their 10 point lead with 7 games to play. :rolleyes:

A very high chance of a difficult game.

Possible:
Celtic/Rangers [SCO]
BATE Borisov
[B]Dinamo Zagreb [CRO]
Rosenborg [NOR]
APOEL Nicosia [CYP]
Hapoel Tel Aviv/Maccabi Haifa [ISR]
Viktoria Plzeň/Sparta Praha [CZE]
Sturm Graz/Austria Wien/Rapid Wien [AUT]
HJK Helsinki [FIN]
Litex Lovech
[B]Ekranas Panevezys [LIT]
Wisła Kraków/Jagiellonia Białystok [POL]
Senica/Slovan Bratislava/MSK Žilina [SVK]
Zestafoni [GEO]
Partizan Belgrade/Crvena Zvezda [SER]
Malmö [SWE]
Maribor [SLO]

[nigel-harps1954]

Technically you can see both sides of the story though mypost, in the current financial struggle you'd almost prefer a big glamour tie to fill the ground and make plenty of money off it. Teams in a tight financial situation wont want to travel to some tiny eastern European country and spend a bomb getting there.

Alright for Shamrock Rovers who can afford that sort of luxury and in the process have a good chance of raising their Euro co-efficient. But in the case of Sligo and indeed most clubs, I'm sure they'd prefer a shot at the glamour tie.

[nigel-harps1954]

It looks highly likely that Shamrock Rovers will be the highest unseeded team, unless Maribor lose their 10 point lead with 7 games to play. :rolleyes:

A very high chance of a difficult game.

Possible:
Celtic/Rangers [SCO]
BATE Borisov
[B]Dinamo Zagreb [CRO]
Rosenborg [NOR]
APOEL Nicosia [CYP]
Hapoel Tel Aviv/Maccabi Haifa [ISR]
Viktoria Plzeň/Sparta Praha [CZE]
Sturm Graz/Austria Wien/Rapid Wien [AUT]
HJK Helsinki [FIN]
Litex Lovech
[B]Ekranas Panevezys [LIT]
Wisła Kraków/Jagiellonia Białystok [POL]
Senica/Slovan Bratislava/MSK Žilina [SVK]
Zestafoni [GEO]
Partizan Belgrade/Crvena Zvezda [SER]
Malmö [SWE]
Maribor [SLO]


In all honesty though, Shamrock rovers would have to fancy their chances against at least half of that list.

[mypost]

Technically you can see both sides of the story though mypost, in the current financial struggle you'd almost prefer a big glamour tie to fill the ground and make plenty of money off it. Teams in a tight financial situation wont want to travel to some tiny eastern European country and spend a bomb getting there.

Alright for Shamrock Rovers who can afford that sort of luxury and in the process have a good chance of raising their Euro co-efficient. But in the case of Sligo and indeed most clubs, I'm sure they'd prefer a shot at the glamour tie.

I see their view, but I prefer a greater chance of progress, (and hence more paydays down the line) from beatable opposition, than getting the likes of Juventus, where you know you have zero chance of progress before you step out the tunnel.

[Acornvilla]

This is epicly early to start this topic but i love the euro speculation, the prelim rounds in europe are by far my fav time of the season :D

[Charlie Darwin]

Technically you can see both sides of the story though mypost, in the current financial struggle you'd almost prefer a big glamour tie to fill the ground and make plenty of money off it. Teams in a tight financial situation wont want to travel to some tiny eastern European country and spend a bomb getting there.

Alright for Shamrock Rovers who can afford that sort of luxury and in the process have a good chance of raising their Euro co-efficient. But in the case of Sligo and indeed most clubs, I'm sure they'd prefer a shot at the glamour tie.
I don't think Sligo really need the money, do they? After Shamrock Rovers, they're probably the best-supported team in the league and not in any debt. And like mypost said, the more games you win, the more you boost your co-efficient and increase the likelihood of a glamour tie.

[SkStu]

In all honesty though, Shamrock rovers would have to fancy their chances against at least half of that list.

I really dont think so Nigel... ignoring the fact that the Irish champions last year couldnt beat the Welsh champions... ;)

I think that if Rovers were to be in that seeded group, they would much much prefer their chances. Here are my predictions based on that list. The blanks represent some sort of chance of progression.


Possible:
Celtic/Rangers [SCO] Loss
BATE Borisov [BLS] Loss
Dinamo Zagreb [CRO] Loss
Rosenborg [NOR] Loss
APOEL Nicosia [CYP]
Hapoel Tel Aviv/Maccabi Haifa [ISR] Loss
Viktoria Plzeň/Sparta Praha [CZE] Possibly beat Plzen
Sturm Graz/Austria Wien/Rapid Wien [AUT] Loss
HJK Helsinki [FIN]
Litex Lovech [BUL] Loss
Ekranas Panevezys [LIT]
Wisła Kraków/Jagiellonia Białystok [POL] Loss to Krakow
Senica/Slovan Bratislava/MSK Žilina [SVK] Loss to Slovan/Zilna
Zestafoni [GEO]
Partizan Belgrade/Crvena Zvezda [SER] Loss
Malmö [SWE] Loss
Maribor [SLO] Loss

From a Bohs perspective, given my earlier comment, I'll take a glamour tie in the Europa if its going.

[nigel-harps1954]

I don't think Sligo really need the money, do they? After Shamrock Rovers, they're probably the best-supported team in the league and not in any debt. And like mypost said, the more games you win, the more you boost your co-efficient and increase the likelihood of a glamour tie.

After costs of flights, overnight stay, etc you're looking at a lot of expenditure for one away trip in Europe. I could be totally wrong, I know being a Harps fan and all, I haven't a great history of witnessing Harps in European competition, but it's just what I'd think. I don't think Sligo are the 2nd best supported club in Ireland by a long way either. Open to criticism from Sligo fans there, but thats just how I see it.


I really dont think so Nigel... ignoring the fact that the Irish champions last year couldnt beat the Welsh champions... ;)

I think that if Rovers were to be in that seeded group, they would much much prefer their chances. Here are my predictions based on that list. The blanks represent some sort of chance of progression.



From a Bohs perspective, given my earlier comment, I'll take a glamour tie in the Europa if its going.

Honestly, at that time last year, nobody expected a TNS win, never mind by how large a margin it was. I don't say it often about an Irish team, but if ever there was a chance of progression in European football like this country has never seen, this is the year.

[mypost]

After costs of flights, overnight stay, etc you're looking at a lot of expenditure for one away trip in Europe.

It's one away trip. If you win it, you have more trips. More exposure at home and abroad, improve the league's co-efficient, and the players get invaluable experience. There is also win bonus cash on offer, appearance/prize money to play for, and tv rights deals at home and (depending on the opposition) abroad. If you get a "big name" draw, you'll have your day in the sun. But that's all it'll be. One day.

The CL/EL was restructured to provide more opportunities for clubs from lower-ranked countries to progress further. We are capable of winning 2 rounds in Europe with a good draw, and if we do it, our season goes on until mid-December.

[Dodge]

The CL/EL was restructured to provide more opportunities for clubs from lower-ranked countries to progress further. We are capable of winning 2 rounds in Europe with a good draw, and if we do it, our season goes on until mid-December.

It was structured to help mid ranked teams. We're not mid ranked.

[Hibs4Ever]

Viktoria Plzeň/Sparta Praha [CZE] Possibly beat Plzen


Wouldn't beat either IMO. Sparta had a great run in Europe last year, including knocking out Palermo, and Plzen are a much better team, top of the league and have already beaten Sparta home and away this season

[Ezeikial]

I don't think Sligo really need the money, do they?

Every LoI club badly needs the money......including Sligo Rovers and Shamrock Rovers

[Nah Nah Nah Nah]

After costs of flights, overnight stay, etc you're looking at a lot of expenditure for one away trip in Europe. I could be totally wrong, I know being a Harps fan and all, I haven't a great history of witnessing Harps in European competition, but it's just what I'd think. I don't think Sligo are the 2nd best supported club in Ireland by a long way either. Open to criticism from Sligo fans there, but thats just how I see it.



Honestly, at that time last year, nobody expected a TNS win, never mind by how large a margin it was. I don't say it often about an Irish team, but if ever there was a chance of progression in European football like this country has never seen, this is the year.

I wouldn't have said so either. Probably fourth after Derry & Cork.

[El-Pietro]

bigger crowds than us these days though, maybe that changes if we're promoted

[SkStu]

Wouldn't beat either IMO. Sparta had a great run in Europe last year, including knocking out Palermo, and Plzen are a much better team, top of the league and have already beaten Sparta home and away this season

hey - i was going on nothing other than the ever popular "I have never heard of them therefore they are beatable" theory.

Which is one small step up from the "I have never heard of them therefore they are crap and we'll definitely win" theory.

[TheBoss]

As I pointed out, a very high chance of hard game, they only really have a chance of qualifying against 3/4 teams.

[Charlie Darwin]

Every LoI club badly needs the money......including Sligo Rovers and Shamrock Rovers
I'm sure they'd like the money but I'd define need as having to service a debt a la Bohs or cover a budget deficit a la Springal.

[abcd]

Whats the story with Pats and Bohs will both be starting out in the 1st qualifying round or will one be in the 2nd. Some tough looking potential games for Shamrock Rovers there but its a long way off yet.

[PartySaint]

Whats the story with Pats and Bohs will both be starting out in the 1st qualifying round or will one be in the 2nd. Some tough looking potential games for Shamrock Rovers there but its a long way off yet.

Bohs will start in the second round and we will start in the first, We will be seeded in the first and if we get through we will also be seeded in the second, It pays off being Ireland's European Club

[sparky12345678]

It looks highly likely that Shamrock Rovers will be the highest unseeded team, unless Maribor lose their 10 point lead with 7 games to play. :rolleyes:

A very high chance of a difficult game.

Possible:
Celtic/Rangers [SCO]
BATE Borisov
[B]Dinamo Zagreb [CRO]
Rosenborg [NOR]
APOEL Nicosia [CYP]
Hapoel Tel Aviv/Maccabi Haifa [ISR]
Viktoria Plzeň/Sparta Praha [CZE]
Sturm Graz/Austria Wien/Rapid Wien [AUT]
HJK Helsinki [FIN]
Litex Lovech
[B]Ekranas Panevezys [LIT]
Wisła Kraków/Jagiellonia Białystok [POL]
Senica/Slovan Bratislava/MSK Žilina [SVK]
Zestafoni [GEO]
Partizan Belgrade/Crvena Zvezda [SER]
Malmö [SWE]
Maribor [SLO]

If Man U beat Schalke (sic) then Celtic move up to next round which means sham rovers are seeded. Also according to bert ekranus are below sham rovers.
http://www.xs4all.nl/~kassiesa/bert/uefa/data/method4/tcoef2011.html
I always find the wiki site a great reference this time of year

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2011%E2%80%9312_UEFA_Champions_League#Second_quali fying_round

granted it will be very close as to whether or not they are seeded but lets not be totally pessimistic.

[nigel-harps1954]

It's one away trip. If you win it, you have more trips. More exposure at home and abroad, improve the league's co-efficient, and the players get invaluable experience. There is also win bonus cash on offer, appearance/prize money to play for, and tv rights deals at home and (depending on the opposition) abroad. If you get a "big name" draw, you'll have your day in the sun. But that's all it'll be. One day.

The CL/EL was restructured to provide more opportunities for clubs from lower-ranked countries to progress further. We are capable of winning 2 rounds in Europe with a good draw, and if we do it, our season goes on until mid-December.

Big IF though.

[TheBoss]

If Man U beat Schalke (sic) then Celtic move up to next round which means sham rovers are seeded. Also according to bert ekranus are below sham rovers.
http://www.xs4all.nl/~kassiesa/bert/uefa/data/method4/tcoef2011.html (http://www.xs4all.nl/%7Ekassiesa/bert/uefa/data/method4/tcoef2011.html)
I always find the wiki site a great reference this time of year

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2011%E2%80%9312_UEFA_Champions_League#Second_quali fying_round

granted it will be very close as to whether or not they are seeded but lets not be totally pessimistic.

Ekranus are ahead, you looking at the wrong table: http://www.xs4all.nl/~kassiesa/bert/uefa/data/method4/trank2011.html

Ah right !, So, looking at other possible champions in contention we have:

If we exclude Maribor, which is certain, one of these teams will get last seeding.

Shamrock Rovers [IRL] (2.741)

Dacia Chisnau [MOL] (2.549) - Currently 4 points clear with 2 to play.
Borac Banja Luka [BOS] (2.324) - Currently 7 points clear with 7 to play.
Fehérvár [HUN] (2.200) - Currently 10 points clear with 5 to play.
Neftçi Baku [AZB] (1.233) - Champions
Škendija 79 [MAC] (1.041) - Currently 5 points clear with 5 to play

Looks very good for Rovers.

[pineapple stu]

Dacia are Moldovan champions elect? What happened to Zimbru and (particularly) Sherriff this season?

[A N Mouse]

Ekranus are ahead, you looking at the wrong table: http://www.xs4all.nl/~kassiesa/bert/uefa/data/method4/trank2011.html

Ah right !, So, looking at other possible champions in contention we have:

If we exclude Maribor, which is certain, one of these teams will get last seeding.

Shamrock Rovers [IRL] (2.741)

Dacia Chisnau [MOL] (2.549) - Currently 4 points clear with 2 to play.
Borac Banja Luka [BOS] (2.324) - Currently 7 points clear with 7 to play.
Fehérvár [HUN] (2.200) - Currently 10 points clear with 5 to play.
Neftçi Baku [AZB] (1.233) - Champions
Škendija 79 [MAC] (1.041) - Currently 5 points clear with 5 to play

Looks very good for Rovers.

Looking at it seems Bosnia is the one to watch.

Zeljeznicar, in second there, seem to be the only team - that'd be seeded above rovers - with any realistic chance of overcoming the gaps noted.

Sarajevo derby next weekend. And 1st v 2nd down for midweek before final set of fixtures, could be all to play for.

[TheBoss]

Borac lost 1-0 and Zeljeznicar are 1 up after 20 minutes, it certainly makes it a bit nervy for Rovers fans :D

[HulaHoop]

Borac lost 1-0 and Zeljeznicar are 1 up after 20 minutes, it certainly makes it a bit nervy for Rovers fans :D


Finished 1 all in the end so Borac hold a six point lead with six games left. Hopefully they can hold out to wrap up the title!

[thischarmingman]

For the benefit of someone who find it hard to get his head around this stuff, can anyone neatly summerise who I should be supporting in the upcoming Europa/CL matches, wand what the effect will be?

kthxbye

[TheBoss]

Finished 1 all in the end so Borac hold a six point lead with six games left. Hopefully they can hold out to wrap up the title!

There is a possibility that the Bosnian Teams may not be allowed to enter, cause Bosnian FA is suspended: http://www.uefa.com/uefa/aboutuefa/news/newsid=1614180.html

[mypost]

Finished 1 all in the end so Borac hold a six point lead with six games left. Hopefully they can hold out to wrap up the title!

Doesn't matter. Bosnia are suspended from UEFA competitions atm.

There is also the summer football factor to consider. Against all bar the elite, it's been a great leveller when LOI teams play in Europe.

[pineapple stu]

Doesn't matter. Bosnia are suspended from UEFA competitions atm.
Course it matters. They're temporarily suspended, not permanently expelled. Given the national team have two qualifiers in June - which are a massive incentive to do whatever UEFA want - I'd say it's more likely than not that B&H clubs will compete.

[TheBoss]

Both teams won on Wednesday, Borac 6 points ahead with 15 to play for.

[mypost]

Course it matters. They're temporarily suspended, not permanently expelled. Given the national team have two qualifiers in June - which are a massive incentive to do whatever UEFA want - I'd say it's more likely than not that B&H clubs will compete.

I'm not bothered whether we get Bosnians or not tbh. If we get them, we get them. All I'm looking for us (and by extension Pats and Sligo) are ties that are not beyond us before a ball is kicked.

[Rasputin]

I don't think Sligo really need the money, do they? After Shamrock Rovers, they're probably the best-supported team in the league
Cork are definetly ahead of us, when they eventually do get promoted they will be the only realistic opposition to a Shams Hegemony seeing as they are the only other club capable of pulling in 4000+ on a regular basis when in the premier.
After that, ourselves Dundalk and Derry are all much of a muchness.

and not in any debt.
Correct but money is not to be sniffed at in this league.
A nice bumper cash day would go a long way in further developments.

[PartySaint]

I'm not bothered whether we get Bosnians or not tbh. If we get them, we get them. All I'm looking for us (and by extension Pats and Sligo) are ties that are not beyond us before a ball is kicked.

We should be ok in the first round*, then after that anything can happen in with the draw



*Me saying this obviously will lead to us being knocked out in the first round

[cornflakes]

UCD might be playing in Europe next year through the fair play table (http://www.extratime.ie/newsdesk/articles/5566/fai-grant-5-uefa-licences/). Not sure how that works

[Dodge]

We should be ok in the first round*, then after that anything can happen in with the draw



*Me saying this obviously will lead to us being knocked out in the first round

100% YOUR fault

As long as its not a Welsh team...

[HulaHoop]

I'm not bothered whether we get Bosnians or not tbh. If we get them, we get them. All I'm looking for us (and by extension Pats and Sligo) are ties that are not beyond us before a ball is kicked.


If you read the thread properly you would understand the fascination with Bosnia is about the possibility of us being seeded or not, not whether we draw them in the champions league. If Borac hold on to win the Bosnian league it means we will be seeded in the draw which will see your dream of a tie thats not beyond us before a ball is kicked come true. If Borac don't win the league and the UEFA ban on Bosnia is lifted we will not be seeded and thus could end up with a very difficult tie.

[redobit]

Cork are definetly ahead of us, when they eventually do get promoted they will be the only realistic opposition...


.

Off topic, but if/when Cork get up there could be a real possibility of 4 teams from the 4 provinces being mainstays in the top 4 of the league. A real LO Ireland and not LO The Pale as can happen.

[hoops1]

[QUOTE=Rasputin;1482721]Cork are definetly ahead of us, when they eventually do get promoted they will be the only realistic opposition to a Shams Hegemony seeing as they are the only other club capable of pulling in 4000+ on a regular basis when in the premier.
After that, ourselves Dundalk and Derry are all much of a muchness.
QUOTE]

The penny finally drops. Now that wasnt that hard.

[sligoman]

Semi-Final 2nd leg, Braga (1) Vs. Benfica (2) tonight on 3e. Kick off 8.05pm. Important game for us.

[poster]

The penny finally drops. Now that wasnt that hard.

I don't think any Sligo Rovers fan thinks we're as well supported as either Cork or Shams.

[mypost]

If you read the thread properly you would understand the fascination with Bosnia is about the possibility of us being seeded or not, not whether we draw them in the champions league. If Borac hold on to win the Bosnian league it means we will be seeded in the draw which will see your dream of a tie thats not beyond us before a ball is kicked come true. If Borac don't win the league and the UEFA ban on Bosnia is lifted we will not be seeded and thus could end up with a very difficult tie.

Seeding doesn't matter either. LOI seeds have won games before and lost them. When they haven't been seeds, the same has happened. In the qualifying rounds, there are many good teams, but not unbeatable teams. We can compete with most of them.

[nigel-harps1954]

I don't think any Sligo Rovers fan thinks we're as well supported as either Cork or Shams.

Not really trying to start anything or have a dig at anyone, but when Harps are going good we're as well supported as anyone out there. If we we're sitting pretty in the Premier ala Derry/Sligo/Dundalk I'd be confident we'd be pulling in over 3000 each game.
You just have to look at us now, 2nd bottom team in the whole LOI and still averaging about 550 a game. We'll all complain, but when we're seeing the muck thats on the pitch at the minute, being hammered here and there and only scoring like 6 goals all season so far, you know you have a good loyal support right there. Give it till the end of the season when Felix and Pizza sort us out, and we'll have over 2000 in there every game. ;)

[Dodge]

Not really trying to start anything or have a dig at anyone, but when Harps are going good we're as well supported as anyone out there. If we we're sitting pretty in the Premier ala Derry/Sligo/Dundalk I'd be confident we'd be pulling in over 3000 each game.


and if Pats were in the Champions League, we'd be getting 20k at each game


See we can all make up stuff that will never be proved ;)

[PartySaint]

Seeding doesn't matter either.

It sorta does

[marinobohs]

Off topic, but if/when Cork get up there could be a real possibility of 4 teams from the 4 provinces being mainstays in the top 4 of the league. A real LO Ireland and not LO The Pale as can happen.

Ah yes, the 4 "provincional" superpowers theory, presumably Shams, Sligo, Cork and Derry ? That between them in the last decade have won 2 League titles ? And three of them have gone bust. yep, a real League of Ireland to look forward to.