LOI in Europe 2011

[sheao]

Rovers if they get a good draw on Friday have a good chance of getting into the Europa league group stages.
If Turners header went in then we could have seen a totally different game, but Rovers had the chances over both legs to score but did'nt take them.
No shame in going out to a side like Copenhagen, who you would think given the right draw have every chance of getting to the Champions league group stages.

[harleyleeds]

Sligo should learn from Shamrock Rovers. Sligo failed to take their chances last week, if they fail to take their chances on Thursday they could be paying the price for it.


dont forget Rovers are not a goal down going in like shams were, and poltova failed to take there chances too. Perhaps you mean they should learn from shams mistakes.lets be positive although they are way underdogs they are in a much better position than shams were. cmon the B'O'R

[oriel]

Thought Rovers very unlucky first half, certainly didnt deserve to go in at HT 0-1 down. Stevens was class, gave them brilliant options on the left, maybe O'neill should have gone 4-4-2 when rovers were getting on top mid way through the first half. Sloppy first goal to give away, just ended the whole contest. Pity really

[dfx-]

3-0 agg is probably a fair reflection if a little harsh. No room for what ifs, with a bit of luck Rovers have more of that competition to come. Rovers had their chances and didn't take them. Glad they didn't add to the total in the end which they could've done.

Ndoye is some player, a tank like Amauri last year for Juve but with skill and arrogance too. The Champions League this season is a silly competition anyways, the Europa League is where the cool kids are :cool2:

[MeathDrog]

Are Shamrock Rovers seeded for Fridays draw?

[L.T.F.C.]

Are Shamrock Rovers seeded for Fridays draw?

They are not.

[Acornvilla]

Is anyone seeded in the fourth round draw? I thought anyone can play anyone in the playoffs but maybe I dreamt it

[mypost]

Is anyone seeded in the fourth round draw? I thought anyone can play anyone in the playoffs but maybe I dreamt it

It's a UEFA draw, it is seeded. And we can't play anyone from the LOI.

[Acornvilla]

Damn reality corrupting my dreamt up theories

[Spudulika]

Was disappointed with MON's attitude last night which sums up his managerial style overall. He does the basics right but he is not the man to bring Rovers to the next level. It will be interesting to see what will happen if Rovers fall at the first hurdle in the EL and if he'll still be around come Autumn. As Mick McCarthy said, those were his players, his tactics and they never looked like coming off. Sure the Turner chance (s) in the first half gave a lift, but the coaching left alot to be desired. (I'm saying this as someone who personally has time for MON and also for his strength in getting a team to be competitive).

[Dodge]

Sligo should learn from Shamrock Rovers. Sligo failed to take their chances last week, if they fail to take their chances on Thursday they could be paying the price for it.

Insightful stuff

Would've been interesting if Turner's header had've gone on, but Rovers can be added to the great list of LOI "what ifs" in Europe. Looking at the seeds, thre aren't too many winnable ties. Fair few cash cows though.

If you want to know the value of being seeded, Rovers are prime example. Having scored only one goal so far, they're in the EL play offs. That goal against an Estonian side (and every Estonian side lost first time out this year).

Sligo have a genuine chance on Thursday. Pats don't really

[pineapple stu]

Disappointing second half really after a very good first half. Looked like Rovers were more focussed on the Bohs game on Friday for most of the second period, particularly when taking off Finn and Twigg. Copenhagen fairly cruised through the last 45. Didn't see the first leg - so can only comment on the 2-0 game rather than the 3-0 tie - but can't agree with those who reckon the result didn't reflect the game.

[paul_oshea]

The 42 week contracts that LOI players are contracted to, when do they end? IS it the last day of the season?

An incentive which wouldn't financially bankrupt a club, but could potentially guarantee "better" player recruitment/keep those at home longer would be a bonus type system if they were to ever reach the group stages of any competition. For every win again they get a certain amount more....Its not something that really matters now but in a couple of years and with a bit of luck its something I'm sure will need to be thought about.

[poster]

The 42 week contracts that LOI players are contracted to, when do they end? IS it the last day of the season?

Think with most clubs, the contracts are up the day after the last game of the season unless there's an FAI Cup Final. Last year, we had to extend our players contracts to Nov 15th to cater for the final.

Assume if a club was to qualify for group stages of a Euro comp then players would have to be paid throughout Winter. Good craic that'd be!

[paul_oshea]

http://www.independent.ie/sport/soccer/pats-players-may-boycott-europa-tie-as-compensation-row-erupts-2837759.html

[passinginterest]

The 42 week contracts that LOI players are contracted to, when do they end? IS it the last day of the season?

An incentive which wouldn't financially bankrupt a club, but could potentially guarantee "better" player recruitment/keep those at home longer would be a bonus type system if they were to ever reach the group stages of any competition. For every win again they get a certain amount more....Its not something that really matters now but in a couple of years and with a bit of luck its something I'm sure will need to be thought about.

I know the Rovers players already have performance related bonuses in their contracts, including for the European games. There would be an obvious issue for Rovers with the need to immediately extend the 42 week contacts and the opinion seems to be that they would have to go full time, or at least offer 52 week contracts in future should they make the group stages. The financial rewards of making the group stages once would probably make it feasible to run full time for 2-3 years without even making the groups again, assuming it's done in a sensible manner (which I know is a huge assumption give LOI history).

It's hard to believe Pat's didn't have some sort of agreement with the players about Euro bonuses before the start of the season. I'd imagine a lot of the issue is due to the fact that all of the games have been so far away meaning far more time off from work than would have been normally anticipated.

[marinobohs]

Was disappointed with MON's attitude last night which sums up his managerial style overall. He does the basics right but he is not the man to bring Rovers to the next level. It will be interesting to see what will happen if Rovers fall at the first hurdle in the EL and if he'll still be around come Autumn. As Mick McCarthy said, those were his players, his tactics and they never looked like coming off. Sure the Turner chance (s) in the first half gave a lift, but the coaching left alot to be desired. (I'm saying this as someone who personally has time for MON and also for his strength in getting a team to be competitive).

Think thats a little harsh to be fair. Thought shams did well in the first half and could (maybe should ?) have scored first, resulting in a very different game. Once Copenhagen scored the game as a contest was over and they ran out very comfortable winners. Personally thought that the tie swung on first goal last night and that shams played well against very decent opposition until the tie was well beyond them

[paul_oshea]

I know the Rovers players already have performance related bonuses in their contracts, including for the European games. There would be an obvious issue for Rovers with the need to immediately extend the 42 week contacts and the opinion seems to be that they would have to go full time, or at least offer 52 week contracts in future should they make the group stages. The financial rewards of making the group stages once would probably make it feasible to run full time for 2-3 years without even making the groups again, assuming it's done in a sensible manner (which I know is a huge assumption give LOI history).

It's hard to believe Pat's didn't have some sort of agreement with the players about Euro bonuses before the start of the season. I'd imagine a lot of the issue is due to the fact that all of the games have been so far away meaning far more time off from work than would have been normally anticipated.

But the thing is, those 42 week contracts would cover the LOI season. They wouldn't need to be changed/extended, I'd need to see the proper financials and the breakdown of games, but changing to full time could just see rovers go the way of previous clubs who tried to work this way. If its completely bonus related after the 42 week contracts, then the club is completely covered for the eventuality of not getting into the Group stages or missing out on Europe. The players are covered and incentivised to do better. Thats the point I'm trying make.

A completely other far-fetched scenario would be if they were to ever make knock out stages of Europa(either throw finishing 3rd in CL or just getting 2nd in Europa league)....but thats for another year(day).

[Jicked]

Was disappointed with MON's attitude last night which sums up his managerial style overall. He does the basics right but he is not the man to bring Rovers to the next level. It will be interesting to see what will happen if Rovers fall at the first hurdle in the EL and if he'll still be around come Autumn. As Mick McCarthy said, those were his players, his tactics and they never looked like coming off. Sure the Turner chance (s) in the first half gave a lift, but the coaching left alot to be desired. (I'm saying this as someone who personally has time for MON and also for his strength in getting a team to be competitive).

You'd have to seriously have it in for MON if you tried to blame him for anything last night. We gave it as good a shot as we could, with a lot of thanks to his tactics/formation and for as long as the tie was alive (half time yesterday) we made things difficult for FCK. Turner's header goes in and you never know, thats about all you can ask for when you're up against one of Europe's top teams. Next year you just have to hope you get lucky and that ball bounces in for a change, or even better we don't get the hardest possible team in the draw for a third year running.

[Dodge]

You got Tallinn and the Israelis, don't get greedy :)

[Spudulika]

Think thats a little harsh to be fair. Thought shams did well in the first half and could (maybe should ?) have scored first, resulting in a very different game. Once Copenhagen scored the game as a contest was over and they ran out very comfortable winners. Personally thought that the tie swung on first goal last night and that shams played well against very decent opposition until the tie was well beyond them

Don't get me wrong, they did well, but MON has always struck me as more concerned with not losing than going for it. They did well and the Danes didn't have too many chances to over run them, and true, if Turner's header had gone in it would have been a much more interesting game. I guess it just disappoints me that with all the talent at his disposal MON just doesn't get the best out of them.

[marinobohs]

Don't get me wrong, they did well, but MON has always struck me as more concerned with not losing than going for it. They did well and the Danes didn't have too many chances to over run them, and true, if Turner's header had gone in it would have been a much more interesting game. I guess it just disappoints me that with all the talent at his disposal MON just doesn't get the best out of them.

........ wait until they see Nutsey's european tactics :rolleyes:

[Spudulika]

You'd have to seriously have it in for MON if you tried to blame him for anything last night. We gave it as good a shot as we could, with a lot of thanks to his tactics/formation and for as long as the tie was alive (half time yesterday) we made things difficult for FCK. Turner's header goes in and you never know, thats about all you can ask for when you're up against one of Europe's top teams. Next year you just have to hope you get lucky and that ball bounces in for a change, or even better we don't get the hardest possible team in the draw for a third year running.

Not in the least, as I've already stated I find the man pleasant on a personal level and respect him as a coach, though I don't see him as being able to make that mental step forward/up with the players he has on the books. Luck, well, I'm not so sure if what happened last night can be ascribed to luck. If Rovers had 15 chances on goal then you could say the team increased their luck. Rovers didn't.

[Jicked]

Jicked, as I said, I don't have it in for the man. On a personal level I always find him pleasant, he's a good manager to get a team to a certain place, but if you look at some of the players he has at his disposal it's an anomaly that he just doesn't get the best from them. I don't believe in luck, if Rovers had 23 chances on goal then they're creating a higher percentage of scoring - making themselves luckier if you believe in it. They were able to match the Danes but again I go back to the negative mindset MON too often seems to instil in his teams.
I thought we were purposeful throughout, tried to get numbers forward when we could and if we had a better final ball could have scored over the two legs. Our attacking players might seem like a LoI all star team, but they're ex Brechin City, Oldham Athletic, UCD and Galway Utd. Up against a team like FCK we got just about as much as we could from them. go any more "gung ho" and we wouldn't have been able to get the ball back, instead for 30 minutes we had McCormack running the show. If we can keep knocking on the door over the next couple of years we'll take one of those half-chances and go through.

[Spudulika]

I thought we were purposeful throughout, tried to get numbers forward when we could and if we had a better final ball could have scored over the two legs. Our attacking players might seem like a LoI all star team, but they're ex Brechin City, Oldham Athletic, UCD and Galway Utd. Up against a team like FCK we got just about as much as we could from them. go any more "gung ho" and we wouldn't have been able to get the ball back, instead for 30 minutes we had McCormack running the show. If we can keep knocking on the door over the next couple of years we'll take one of those half-chances and go through.

I agree completely with you on the possibility of breaking through in the next 2 years, though I don't see MON as the man to do it. Earlier this year I sat watching Rovers in Tallaght trying to figure out when they would just cut loose a little. I know it's always a risk to push on, though there is a fear in the play that is not going to improve. Then again, I'd love to be proved 100% wrong in a couple of weeks with Rovers making the EL group stage, along with Sligo and Pats (after they put 5 past the Ukranians).

[Ezeikial]

Assume if a club was to qualify for group stages of a Euro comp then players would have to be paid throughout Winter. Good craic that'd be!

Thats where the fun really starts!

Where most players are out of contract at the end of October they are in a very strong negotiating position.

Clubs can extend exisiting contracts by agreement with a player before the end of the season, but to replace a player who will not agree a new contract they must wait 'till the transfer window in January (unless he was out of contract at end of July)

[pineapple stu]

Whut?

[paul_oshea]

Whut?

Sorry wrong forum....but it did get me thinking :D

[Sean South]

Any more on the fighting between Shamrock and FCK fans? I heard FCK got a Shamrock banner as a souvenir and a few of their fans arrested?

[marinobohs]

Any more on the fighting between Shamrock and FCK fans? I heard FCK got a Shamrock banner as a souvenir and a few of their fans arrested?


...... oh crap, I must have clicked on the "two sets of morons fighting in Tallaght" thread by mistake :rolleyes:

[Sean South]

Same lads drinking in Dalyer so?

[marinobohs]

Same lads drinking in Dalyer so?

Genuinely have no idea about it apart from a mention on bohs website of an "attack on Copenhagen fans outside the Maldron". No idea if it is true or not (not especially bothered either way)

[dfx-]

Any more on the fighting between Shamrock and FCK fans? I heard FCK got a Shamrock banner as a souvenir and a few of their fans arrested?

There'd have to have been FCK fans in attendance for that to happen.

[Duggie]

its just a pity turners header didnt go in would have been a great goal and changed the tie. Copenhagen are nothing special just a pity they scored a sh1ty goal to basically kill off the tie. Shams did well before they scored and made them look ordinary which i think they are. just shows the importance of an away goal in europe. All our sides in europe just have to take any goal chances we get but we rarely seem to do which is frustrating. On a side note on Twigg, his first touch is very poor and he just dosent look up to it at a higher level. thats just my opinion, hope he proves me wrong in the near future in europe.

[paul_oshea]

There'd have to have been FCK fans in attendance for that to happen.

There were 36.

[redobit]

I thought we were purposeful throughout, tried to get numbers forward when we could and if we had a better final ball could have scored over the two legs. Our attacking players might seem like a LoI all star team, but they're ex Brechin City, Oldham Athletic, UCD and Galway Utd. Up against a team like FCK we got just about as much as we could from them. go any more "gung ho" and we wouldn't have been able to get the ball back, instead for 30 minutes we had McCormack running the show. If we can keep knocking on the door over the next couple of years we'll take one of those half-chances and go through.

Correct if wrong but did MON not leave one up front for the last half hour even when ye still needed to score three.

[BonnieShels]

There were 36.

And not an umbrella between them.

[Jicked]

Correct if wrong but did MON not leave one up front for the last half hour even when ye still needed to score three.

Yes, the game was over at that stage. We also didn't send Thompson up for corners in the last minute for the same reason and started substituting our key players.

[swinfordfc]

Glasgow Rangers are out as well .... and i believe if Shamrock Rovers were playing Malmo ... Rovers would have won that tie and be in the next round. Good luck to Sligo and St Pats tomorrow

[dong]

From what I saw in that game there wasn't a huge gulf in class between Shams and Copenhagen. They were that bit stronger physically maybe and could stroke it around well at times. More clinical over the two legs as well.
Still all to play for in the Europa league for them. They certainly didn't let themselves down.
Nice display the ultras put on as well.

[Dave_SRFC]

Any more on the fighting between Shamrock and FCK fans? I heard FCK got a Shamrock banner as a souvenir and a few of their fans arrested?
non event why did you bring it up?

[paul_oshea]

If it happened it is NOT a non event. Typical nothing to see here attitude just makes things worse. As Ace once said "Denial is a terrible thing".

Good luck to both teams tonight, unfortunately the way things appear from the outside at Pats I can only see them getting beaten tonight, perhaps well.

2 teams in the 4th qualifying round of the Europa League would be a very good achievement.

[punkrocket]

.... They were that bit stronger physically maybe...

I've often thought that seeing Irish lads up against foreign players but really, it should be one of the simpler things to rectify, an extra half an hour a day pumping iron should sort it.

[pineapple stu]

If it happened it is NOT a non event.
If it happened, can we find some report of it? Otherwise we'll descend into the usual pantomime of "Yes it happened - you've your head in the sand" "No it didn't happen - I saw nothing beside me anyway" that we could do without.

[paul_oshea]

Stu you don't hear about every fight on a saturady night outside a nightclub.

It doesn't mean it didnt happen.

[paul_oshea]

I've often thought that seeing Irish lads up against foreign players but really, it should be one of the simpler things to rectify, an extra half an hour a day pumping iron should sort it.

This is something I also mentioned during the first leg that richardson mentioned a few times the last night, the conditioning and physical build of the players was far superior for all to see.

In other sports in Ireland be it rugby/GAA this is what they focus on over the winter/when not playing. Its very little cardio and all weight training. I cant understand how this can't be rectified by a proper weights programme, especially at somewhere like rovers where they are paying a sports scientist.

[pineapple stu]

Stu you don't hear about every fight on a saturady night outside a nightclub.

It doesn't mean it didnt happen.
But it does mean that threads can get particularly tedious if unsubstantiated allegations are being thrown about the place. That's why we have a rule against it.

[punkrocket]

Good luck to Sligo and er..the silly ****s tonight

[punkrocket]

Oops..didn't realise I was being rude there, rhymed with Pats

[paul_oshea]

Haha Br@ts very good PR. The pats players should give 110% tonight after this big hullabaloo. I'm sure everything would be forgiven-from the club and fans- if they won 3-0.