Next Senior Men's Team Manager - Runners and Riders

[Razors left peg]

They're making puns on Christian terms. It's not decorious, but it's not the same as mockery. Christianity used to be able to demand decorum, but have lost that priviledge as our society rejected their claims to moral authority in light of, e.g., their shielding and enabling paedophiles and their mistreatment of mothers and children out of wedlock. This is an example of how loss of privilege is sometimes mistaken for discrimination. A counterexample, "Christians are overly sensitive to criticism because their beliefs are illogical and that makes thim insecure about their faith," would be mocking Christians.

Additionally, many Irish people have grown up in Christian households, and have a cultural claim on Christian language, customs, and iconography they grew up with. This is why, for example, many non-religious people celebrate Christmas in an entirely secular fashion, and do so without mocking the Christian holiday. A counterexample, quoting Jeremiah 10:2-4, 'Thus says the Lord: “Learn not the way of the nations, nor be dismayed at the signs of the heavens because the nations are dismayed at them, for the customs of the peoples are vanity. A tree from the forest is cut down and worked with an axe by the hands of a craftsman. They decorate it with silver and gold; they fasten it with hammer and nails so that it cannot move,' and pointing out the relationship to Christmas trees would be an example of mocking the Christian holiday.

I hope this was helpful in clarifying the situation.

To be fair I was making fun of Christians, but well written ;)

[Diggs246]

https://www.irishexaminer.com/sport/soccer/arid-41362600.html

[Razors left peg]

https://www.irishexaminer.com/sport/soccer/arid-41362600.html

Make it stop

[Eirambler]

So if we finally know in March who they met back in November, we should know the identity of the actual manager by about August.

[Eirambler]

So it's:

Untrustworthy chancer 6/4f
Guy who makes dodgy statements about race 9/4
Possible Steve Staunton reboot 10/3
Close to a possible Steve Staunton reboot 9/1
Ha! We wish! 10/1
Ruled out already 11/1

It's going swimmingly (or the bookies don't actually have a clue). Suddenly that guy nobody likes who briefly had the England job is looking like a viable option!

I'm sticking with Untrustworthy Chancer by a short head in the 5:30 at Abbotstown.

[Olé Olé]

The Keane stuff is funny because they set and started the Head Coach thing outset. Even if he isn't in contention now then why did they meet him at all?

If he is in contention, he could slot in above JOS tidily. But, then, there is no experienced or renowned coach between them. That doesn't work?

Feels like Anthony Barry is the only name that could work at his point but that may be unlikely.

They'll end up having to go for Poyet or Keane ...

[Snapshot]

The Keane stuff is funny because they set and started the Head Coach thing outset. Even if he isn't in contention now then why did they meet him at all?

If he is in contention, he could slot in above JOS tidily. But, then, there is no experienced or renowned coach between them. That doesn't work?

Feels like Anthony Barry is the only name that could work at his point but that may be unlikely.

They'll end up having to go for Poyet or Keane ...
I'd be comfortable with Anthony Barry if he's available. There was a marked improvement during his spell with Kenny. Sure, he lacks experience (as a manager) but his coaching development via Wigan, Chelsea, Belgium, Portugal and Bayern Munich can hardly be faulted. In fact it's damn impressive for anyone - and he's only 37.

Otherwise, was John O'Shea really that bad? Decent enough against Belgium but flat versus Switzerland. Two friendlies against reasonable opposition. Kenny was 20-plus games into his reign before the uniquitous "he needs more time" mantra pulled a hammy. How quickly we forget.

Otherwise, it looks like Poyet. Good, bad and ugly if the poo hits the fan.

[Razors left peg]

I'd be comfortable with Anthony Barry if he's available. There was a marked improvement during his spell with Kenny. Sure, he lacks experience (as a manager) but his coaching development via Wigan, Chelsea, Belgium, Portugal and Bayern Munich can hardly be faulted. In fact it's damn impressive for anyone - and he's only 37.

Otherwise, was John O'Shea really that bad? Decent enough against Belgium but flat versus Switzerland. Two friendlies against reasonable opposition. Kenny was 20-plus games into his reign before the uniquitous "he needs more time" mantra pulled a hammy. How quickly we forget.

Otherwise, it looks like Poyet. Good, bad and ugly if the poo hits the fan.

Yes O'Shea was really that bad. The inability to adjust the shape to fit how the game was going will stay with me a long time

[brine3]

https://www.irishexaminer.com/sport/soccer/arid-41362600.html

If d'paper says so then I'd say it's true.

[backstothewall]

In fact it's damn impressive for anyone - and he's only 37.

If it's old enough to be Taoiseach I suppose it's hard to argue he's too young to coach the football team!

[Snapshot]

Yes O'Shea was really that bad. The inability to adjust the shape to fit how the game was going will stay with me a long time
I'm sure you'll recover in the fullness of time. Judging John O'Shea so conclusively on one poor game seems basically unfair, especially given the tolerance afforded Kenny by so many, including you. But he's unlikely to get the gig so cancel that expensive appointment with your therapist.

[Eirambler]

Really, all this process needed at this point was for a few journalists to bring the pro Roy Keane nutjobs out of hiding. If they have their man as they say they do they should just get on with it and announce him at the start of next week. Maintaining this radio silence any further is doing nothing other than giving oxygen to the lunatic fringe of the support base which, as is usually the case with an international team, is sizeable.

[Razors left peg]

I'm sure you'll recover in the fullness of time. Judging John O'Shea so conclusively on one poor game seems basically unfair, especially given the tolerance afforded Kenny by so many, including you. But he's unlikely to get the gig so cancel that expensive appointment with your therapist.

2 games, he managed 2 games where he didnt adjust the shape. Some day if you learn your numbers you might be able to afford my expensive therapist too

[SkStu]

I know this is probably sad and all (and maybe i need an expensive therapist too) but I dreamt last night that the FAI announced a new managerial team of Gary Kelly, Jason McAteer and Phil Babb and were calling them the Three Amigos. They said they picked Kelly to be the manager because he was the most serious of the three. Paul McGrath was also in it - he was at the media table - and he kept calling him Gary Jelly.

Might be worth a cheeky fiver?

[backstothewall]

If John O'Shea wants to have a go at management I say good luck to him. He's got great experience as a player and has had a few coaching roles now. If he wants to have a go at it I would say he's ready for that.

Being a local I would suggest Waterford United would be perfect for him if a vacancy comes along, although they've started the season well so he might have to wait a while for that.

If he would be interested in a team across the water Bradford have lost 4 on the spin, or Inverness Caledonian Thistle are struggling. One of those might well be in the market for a new boss soon. They're both jobs a young manager as well known as John could impress in and move on to bigger and better things in a year or so.

He isn't close to being ready for the most senior coaching role in Irish football.

[Eirambler]

True, there is a line of thinking where you could argue that it is arrogant of O'Shea to be even putting his name up here. He was told clearly at the start that he was interim manager only, yet he seems to have taken it as an opportunity to try to audition for the full time job - and in the process shown exactly why he should be nowhere near the position.

[tetsujin1979]

I don't think he should be punished for showing some ambition

[backstothewall]

I don't think he should be punished for showing some ambition

But he isn't being punished. He's just not being trusted with the most senior football coaching role in the country. With what's a pretty thin CV he could have no legitimate cause to believe he would be in contention for the job.

[seanfhear]

True, there is a line of thinking where you could argue that it is arrogant of O'Shea to be even putting his name up here. He was told clearly at the start that he was interim manager only, yet he seems to have taken it as an opportunity to try to audition for the full time job - and in the process shown exactly why he should be nowhere near the position.Might be just putting himself in the shop-window ~ ~ If he wants to become a manger, he might as well.

[JR89]

Might be just putting himself in the shop-window ~ ~ If he wants to become a manger, he might as well.

Which he does. Tony Mowbray said that was O'Shea's reasoning for not wanting to stay on at Birmingham as a coach. Wonder though with Mowbray now out ill he might have gotten a shot as interim manager at Birmingham had he stayed.

[Kingdom]

I know this is probably sad and all (and maybe i need an expensive therapist too) but I dreamt last night that the FAI announced a new managerial team of Gary Kelly, Jason McAteer and Phil Babb and were calling them the Three Amigos. They said they picked Kelly to be the manager because he was the most serious of the three. Paul McGrath was also in it - he was at the media table - and he kept calling him Gary Jelly.

Might be worth a cheeky fiver?

We all needed to hear this.

[JR89]

From Dan McDonnells news letter this morning:

"There have been plenty of jokes about the significance of the Georgia-Greece playoff on Tuesday with Willy Sagnol and Gus Poyet on either side but there are sources claiming that senior FAI figures were following developments in the shootout in Tbilisi very closely in the minutes before kick-off in the Switzerland game. And the story goes that they didn’t necessarily get the result that they wanted."

[Crosby87]

That's the guy they were trying to get? Willy Sagnol?

I know this is tiresome to you all but it does say they have spoken to Roy 3 times.
Maybe they are trying to convince themselves to do it or not do it.

[Eirambler]

The least surprising news of the weekend.

https://www.the42.ie/roy-keane-ireland-manager-6340564-Mar2024/

At least now all the pro-Keane crowd can crawl back under the rock they came out of a couple of days ago.

[seanfhear]

Just think that ~ ~ Fine Gael managed to get a new leader in a few days ( and that looks like a shockingly bad job at the moment )

So obviously ~ ~ Fine Gael must pick the next Irish soccer manager ! ! ! ( ye know it makes sense ! )

[John83]

I know this is tiresome to you all but it does say they have spoken to Roy 3 times.
Maybe they are trying to convince themselves to do it or not do it.
Likely, there are different factions with competing ideas of who to hire.

[pineapple stu]

Greek media reporting Poyet has turned the job down, after being offered it this week (https://www.rte.ie/sport/soccer/2024/0330/1440877-report-poyet-offered-rejected-ireland-job-this-week/).

Which would of course be at odds with the idea that the deal was sealed last month and the FAI are just waiting on March contractual arrangements to be over before announcing.

[Jolly Red Giant]

Greek media reporting Poyet has turned the job down, after being offered it this week (https://www.rte.ie/sport/soccer/2024/0330/1440877-report-poyet-offered-rejected-ireland-job-this-week/).

Which would of course be at odds with the idea that the deal was sealed last month and the FAI are just waiting on March contractual arrangements to be over before announcing.
The entire process is now officially a shambles - advertise the job, see who applies and take it from there - you don't have to appoint someone from the list of applicants, but at least you will see the quality of coach who is interested.

My concern would be that in a panic they would bounce back to the misogynist or the racist.

[SkStu]

hard to know what to say at this point...the whole thing has gone about as poorly as it could go. Icing on the cake would be Allardyce/Lennon in the end.

[JR89]

Why would the FA offer him a five year contract. We'll be in the middle of qualification for the 2030 WC in five years time.

[Eirambler]

I've given Hill and Canham the benefit of the doubt on this one up to now. But they really are running out of rope here. If they do indeed have their man then they need to get on with announcing him early next week and put all this nonsense to bed. Whereas if they've been bluffing all along and they don't have someone decent lines up after this long a search then they should both resign.

[Olé Olé]

The entire process is now officially a shambles - advertise the job, see who applies and take it from there - you don't have to appoint someone from the list of applicants, but at least you will see the quality of coach who is interested.

My concern would be that in a panic they would bounce back to the misogynist or the racist.

Hardly could be "officially" a shambles. I would be inclined to think that it has been but when the ultimate appointment is made then you'll have your confirmation. Otherwise, it's "shambles" is an assumption based on media noise.

When Canham pulls back the curtain and we are left with O'Shea or something similar then everyone is going to know it has been an absolute sh*tshow... I'm praying that I am surprised with Anthony Barry or Lee Carsley...

[Murfinator]

I'm half expecting to read that John O'Shea has ruled himself out for it one of these days

[samhaydenjr]

:confused2::nails::angry3:

[samhaydenjr]

:mad2::curse::cry:

[samhaydenjr]

:excruciating::hopelessness::dejection:

[samhaydenjr]

Please ask Chris Hughton!

[Eirambler]

https://www.the42.ie/gus-poyet-turns-down-5-year-ireland-contract-reports-6341374-Mar2024/?utm_source=shortlink

Interesting that this is now being reported by David Sneyd, one of the few Irish football journalists I would rate to some extent.

I think Hill and Canham's positions are verging on untenable now.

[Eirambler]

For what it's worth, here's one possible timeline of what might have happened in the last five months or so. I'm absolutely not saying this is definitely what happened, just that it would tie in with some of what's been published by the more credible journalists that follow the Irish team.

Kenny was rightly sacked in November after we lost to everyone in our Euros group twice, apart from Gibraltar. At that point Carsley was most people's first choice for the job, including it seems the FAI.

Discussions took place with Carsley, but over time it transpired that the two sides weren't going to be able to work it out. At this stage Lennon was the back-up option, but that went out the window once his private life started getting brought up, including at least one tweet by a politician on the matter.

So, having gone back to the drawing board, they came up with Sagnol. Sagnol was provisionally on board, all that needed to happen was for Georgia to not qualify for the Euros and it was done. So they went for O'Shea as interim to deal with the March window and Canham was confident enough to issue some fairly bullish responses at that press conference about an early April appointment. Of course, then Georgia beat Greece on penalties to qualify and that blew the whole thing up on them (this would tie in with Dan McDonnell's tweet during the week).

So, in a panic, they offered a contract to the "break glass in case of emergency option" - Poyet. Only for him to turn them down too when they couldn't agree terms, as per David Sneyd's report this evening. Which leads us to where we are this weekend - up **** creek by the sounds of things.

Of course, almost none of the above could be true and the FAI might somehow have a name to announce next week. I wouldn't bet on it though.

[ontheotherhand]

Really was hoping Keane would get it. Not sure it would go well but it would **** off all the right people.

[backstothewall]

If this has all fallen apart I'd agree that it's time for Hill and Canham to hit the road. It's looking like they've made a complete balls of this.

Niall Quinn should be running the FAI anyway.

[Eirambler]

If the stuff from Sneyd about the Association wanting to pick at least some of the coaching staff is true, then it's probably easy enough to see why they're in this mess to be fair. That reflects badly on Canham that he can't source a candidate who he's happy with to just bring in their own people.

[elatedscum]

Really was hoping Keane would get it. Not sure it would go well but it would **** off all the right people.

Roy or Robbie?

[John83]

Robbie would be a gamble, but at this stage I might be willing to roll the dice. Roy would be a disaster whose sole saving grace would be the distraction he'd cause from the on-the-pitch issues.

[Olé Olé]

If the stuff from Sneyd about the Association wanting to pick at least some of the coaching staff is true, then it's probably easy enough to see why they're in this mess to be fair. That reflects badly on Canham that he can't source a candidate who he's happy with to just bring in their own people.

I don't get this either. If it's succession planning related or some attempt at a structure from senior to underage then why not put someone in as manager of the 21s? A part of me wonders how serious they even are about all that if Crawford is still in situ, to be honest....

[ontheotherhand]

Roy or Robbie?

Imagine a double ticket. Everyone fuming for various reasons.

Was at the two friendlies and the place is like a morgue. A Keane x2 headline act would up the ante a bit at least.

[Eirambler]

Must as there are elements of the Irish support that annoy me I'm not sure ****ing off about 95% of the core support base is really the way for the FAI to go right now...

[seanfhear]

Tis kinda bad that ~ ~ The Irish Manager's job can't even generate a few decent rumours ~ ~ Things are bad ! !

[ontheotherhand]

Must as there are elements of the Irish support that annoy me I'm not sure ****ing off about 95% of the core support base is really the way for the FAI to go right now...

Why would they break character now? Anyone in the support who isn't already ****ed off by the FAI is probably more a part of the problem than anything else.

You've a few posts above about pro-Keane people that would **** off a fair few supporters as well so I'm surprised to hear you aren't in favour of a bit of controversy!

[Jolly Red Giant]

I'll bang a drum at this stage - the way thinks are now the FAI need to go with the known product - the solid record and safe pair of hands - Chris Hughton.

Hughton may not light up the world with an Irish team, but they will be solid, disciplined and structured - the players will know what they are supposed to be doing - and with Ferguson upfront, Hughton could well open up the playing style to suit him. At worst Hughton will lay the foundation for his successor (like he did at Newcastle and Brighton).

Have a look at how he approached Brighton's 3-2 win over Man Utd - and having what was no more than a Championship team at his disposal - Ryan, Montoya, Duffy, Dunk, Bong, Knockart, Stephens, Propper, March, Gross and Murray - Man U team was De Gea, Young, Bailly, Lindelof, Shaw, Fred Pereira, Pogba, Mata, Lukaku, Martial.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v_TAQBqKtJk