Stephen Kenny

[elatedscum]

I wonder would Hassenhüttl be in our budget? Might be a long shot but I think he could be someone who could get more out of the squad than the sum of its parts

[texidub]

We need to think outside the box. Ryan Tubridy has the gravitas, the passion, and most of all the connections to make it a spectacular experience for the entire nation. He can do it on a wet December night in Dublin too, according to all the reports. And Netflix are probably only dying to snap him up to make a docuseries. A win-win for all parties and results be dammed. What a time to be alive.

[ontheotherhand]

What about Roddy Collins?

Not a bad shout. Turn it into a TV show for a few years until we have the players for a football team.

Sponsorship sorted via Louis Copeland. Louis would make a better jersey than Castore as well.

[TrapAPony]

What about Roddy Collins?

Well, if someone like Stephen Kenny could land the job of managing the Irish senior side then Roddy Collins may feel he has a great chance.

[EalingGreen]

I know he won the U21 Euros but I'd be unsure of Carsley at this level tbh.
Carsley was on the coaching staff at Brentford, including a brief spell as Caretaker Manager which they really wanted to make permanent, but he declined for (genuine) family reasons. And Brentford's record in appointing managers, whether externally or from within, is excellent.


I also do not see an up & coming coach going to bother with us anyway. They would be gone at the 1st offer of an English club job. John Eustace & Anthony Barry were here 5 minutes, Carsley would be the same IMO.
Except he's not your average "up & coming coach" etc. He'll be 50 next February, yet has never been the "Main Man" anywhere he's been - and certainly not for want of opportunity. It may just be that he likes working with players without the day-in, day-out scrutiny club managers endure - see eg Klopp losing the rag at being asked about Salah leaving for the 50th time this week.
In that respect, living in England and managing ROI for 10 or 12 games a year might just appeal. Otoh, he might just have designs on the England job after Southgate, now that the latter has repaired the previously poisonous relationship with the English media?
Obviously that gets huge scrutiny at times, but he's English as well as Irish after all, and he may consider that job to be the pinnacle of his coaching career?
I certainly get the impression from over here that the FA may be considering that, so who knows what has been whispered in Carsley's ear?

[Diggs246]

What about Roddy Collins?

Have you read the rodfather... its gold

[Razors left peg]

Have you read the rodfather... its gold

Ive heard its the one book that actually has less truth and facts than the bible!

[John83]

If the only suggestions are (a) elderly, unemployed Premiership managers (b) retired internationals, or (c) Roddie ****ing Collins, the search committee needs sacking far more urgently than Kenny. We don't have the money to fish in the Premiership pool any more. Barely ever did, really. Carsley or Hughton are obvious candidates if they're interested and available, but there must be talented young managers on an upward trajectory, or capable mid-career lads who can't or won't take the grind of a club job. If we can't identify such people, we're going to continue to underperform.

[ifk101]

In that respect, living in England and managing ROI for 10 or 12 games a year might just appeal. Otoh, he might just have designs on the England job after Southgate, now that the latter has repaired the previously poisonous relationship with the English media?
Obviously that gets huge scrutiny at times, but he's English as well as Irish after all, and he may consider that job to be the pinnacle of his coaching career?
I certainly get the impression from over here that the FA may be considering that, so who knows what has been whispered in Carsley's ear?

To support your thoughts, the current FAI CEO was previously employed by the English FA, continues to reside in the UK, and surely would favour a job closer to his home in future days. That person may not willing disrupt the English FA's succession plans as this may jeopardise his own personal ambitions.

[seanfhear]

Is there a Kenny Stephen about ? !

[ontheotherhand]

Do we have a search committee? The names I've seen mentioned wouldn't require one. You could just read this forum.

Here's an up and coming manager for you - Magne Hoseth. Worked wonders with KI in Europe this season. No chance we'd risk it though.

[Razors left peg]

I wonder would Hassenhüttl be in our budget? Might be a long shot but I think he could be someone who could get more out of the squad than the sum of its parts

Its thinking like this thats needed. Few heard of De Zerbi or Postecoglou before they moved to Brighton or Celtic. There is a world of good coaches and managers out there if there was enough intelligence to look.

Seeing the likes of Bruce being mentioned is soul destroying, but Im also convinced that in situations like this the betting markets are manipulated. Sky Sports have their own betting wing so release a story about a guy and watch that person get a load of money put on. Lots of newspaper journalists have links to bookies too, so its very easy to generate fake bookies favorites. Over the coming months we are going to see Roy Keane be a dead cert for a few days, Allardyce will have his time, Robbie will probably be favorite for a few days. Its all bu11sh1t from a betting perspective, and we shouldnt buy into it.

The FAI have completely fcuked this situation though. Kenny is 100% a lame duck manager now after yesterdays press conference. It wouldnt have been that expensive to pay him off, hes only due about 2 months salary at this point, but by not sacking or backing him yesterday his situation is impossible. What happens now if we win home to Greece and away to Holland? If Evan Ferguson is in the form he was against Newcastle that is a possibility, however slight. Do the FAI then say that its signs of progress and renew his contract? If not, then they were 100% wrong not to let him go now and let new man have some time. Whole thing is a mess from an organization that can never seem to get out of its own way and I have zero faith that we wont end up with some washout manager from the British Merry-go-round system.

[SkStu]

Not a bad shout. Turn it into a TV show for a few years until we have the players for a football team.

Sponsorship sorted via Louis Copeland. Louis would make a better jersey than Castore as well.

Box office.

[zero]

Do we have a search committee? The names I've seen mentioned wouldn't require one. You could just read this forum.

Here's an up and coming manager for you - Magne Hoseth. Worked wonders with KI in Europe this season. No chance we'd risk it though.

Isn't that a bit like SK getting dundalk to the EL group stages...

[ontheotherhand]

Isn't that a bit like SK getting dundalk to the EL group stages...


Yes, and that's why Kenny was an interesting appointment. Just because it didn't work out you can't discount achievements like that if you are going to cast a wide net and find and up and coming manager, which is what was suggested. I don't think the FAI have the knowledge or resources to do that even though it shouldn't really be that difficult.

The likes of De Zerbi and Postecouglu mentioned above might have been unknown to the average supporter but most clubs and associations should have known about them. Most, but probably not the FAI.

[zero]

Yes, and that's why Kenny was an interesting appointment. Just because it didn't work out you can't discount achievements like that if you are going to cast a wide net and find and up and coming manager, which is what was suggested. I don't think the FAI have the knowledge or resources to do that even though it shouldn't really be that difficult.

The likes of De Zerbi and Postecouglu mentioned above might have been unknown to the average supporter but most clubs and associations should have known about them. Most, but probably not the FAI.

i get what you mean but my sense is the FAI won't chance rolling the dice like that after the kenny experiment. you could even argue you may aswell stick with him if that's the road you're going down.

there are no easy answers. for me, carsley (or someone even more left field like BBM) is the best choice for long term development. for short term results maybe hughton. the likes of hassenhuttel, benitez etc are out of the price range it seems.

[John83]

i get what you mean but my sense is the FAI won't chance rolling the dice like that after the kenny experiment. you could even argue you may aswell stick with him if that's the road you're going down.
I think that's pretty much the argument Kenny makes for continuing to select Idah.

[ontheotherhand]

i get what you mean but my sense is the FAI won't chance rolling the dice like that after the kenny experiment. you could even argue you may aswell stick with him if that's the road you're going down.

there are no easy answers. for me, carsley (or someone even more left field like BBM) is the best choice for long term development. for short term results maybe hughton. the likes of hassenhuttel, benitez etc are out of the price range it seems.

I agree that they won't take the chance. But what the FAI do and what should be done are usually not the same thing.

They are flat broke as well. No sponsor now for 3 years is abysmal and we were already fooked. Maybe there's an AI who could take over forr a few years at an affordable salary?

[JR89]

Do we have a search committee? The names I've seen mentioned wouldn't require one. You could just read this forum.

Here's an up and coming manager for you - Magne Hoseth. Worked wonders with KI in Europe this season. No chance we'd risk it though.

Supposedly Marc Canham will be the one finding candidates for the FAI to interview.

[Jolly Red Giant]

Most places I've seen say Hughtons contract is until December 31st 2024.
From what I heard (from a source) it was always Hughton's intention to re-evaluate his position after AFCON.


I know he won the U21 Euros but I'd be unsure of Carsley at this level tbh. I also do not see an up & coming coach going to bother with us anyway. They would be gone at the 1st offer of an English club job. John Eustace & Anthony Barry were here 5 minutes, Carsley would be the same IMO.
I believe that Carsley has said himself that he would like to get into club management.


Steve Bruce is now the bookies favourite and I think that is far more realistic tbh. He is the right age for the job, has a good managerial CV, a respected playing career, Irish connection, knows what we are about, no compensation to be paid to get him & might grab a few granny rulers to boost our squad.
I would prefer Hughton - I think he is a much better coach.

[JR89]

From what I heard (from a source) it was always Hughton's intention to re-evaluate his position after AFCON.


I believe that Carsley has said himself that he would like to get into club management.


I would prefer Hughton - I think he is a much better coach.

Doubt the Ghanaian FA would stand in his way if he wanted out early. They didn't really want him in the first place, was the Ghanaian government who pay the wages. It's why he likely went in as technical advisor rather than manager at first. Unless he does good at AFCON I can see them not standing in his way if he wants out.

[Jolly Red Giant]

Doubt the Ghanaian FA would stand in his way if he wanted out early. They didn't really want him in the first place, was the Ghanaian government who pay the wages. It's why he likely went in as technical advisor rather than manager at first. Unless he does good at AFCON I can see them not standing in his way if he wants out.

Ghanaian football has been riddled with corruption for a long time - the Ghanaian FA were effectively disbanded in 2019. I think part of the plan was to bring in Hughton to stabilise the situation on the pitch. It is not a surprise that he would have been interested in the job given that he father is Ghanaian.

Saying that - I think he expected to be spending most of his time in Europe where almost all of the Ghanaian internationals are based - but I believe that he has been under pressure to spend more time in Ghana to 'evaluate' the players based in Ghana. I think he is likely to leave after AFCON - he's 64 now (albeit a fit 64 year old) and his family is in England.

[tetsujin1979]

Sort of related to the current managerial setup, interview with Anthony Barry
https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/anthony-barry-mason-mount-will-be-a-success-at-united-qvqjdd7f0

[Trequartista20]

Down to 55th in today's FIFA World rankings.

When Mick McCarthy left we 34th. When Martin O'Neill stepped down we were 33rd.

https://m.independent.ie/sport/soccer/international-soccer/ireland-drop-from-34th-to-55th-place-in-fifa-rankings-under-stephen-kenny/a734528252.html

[third policeman]

Down to 55th in today's FIFA World rankings.

When Mick McCarthy left we 34th. When Martin O'Neill stepped down we were 33rd.

https://m.independent.ie/sport/soccer/international-soccer/ireland-drop-from-34th-to-55th-place-in-fifa-rankings-under-stephen-kenny/a734528252.html

And he still thinks he’s making progress. Deluded.

[seanfhear]

And he still thinks he’s making progress. Deluded.
He is ~ Except in the wrong direction ! !

[weldoninhio]

Maybe he thinks the higher the number the better you are, like in FIFA.

Like in FIFA 23, Benzema, Lewandowski, Mbappe, Messi and De Bruyne were all 91.

Rice and Grealish were 84.

[texidub]

He's done his best, but I remember posting on here a year or two ago about how baffling the performances were and how difficult it was to evaluate what was going on. I'm not jumping on an anti-Kenny bandwagon, but looking back, I wonder whether Kenny had me, the media, lots of fans, himself, and possibly some of the team baffled by BS!

[Razors left peg]

Maybe he thinks the higher the number the better you are, like in FIFA.

Like in FIFA 23, Benzema, Lewandowski, Mbappe, Messi and De Bruyne were all 91.

Rice and Grealish were 84.

Speaking of FIFA, Evan Ferguson only gets a rating of 73 this year which is a bit scandalous

[Fixer82]

FIFA is a poor man’s Pro Evo.
EFootball 2020 is the greatest ever soccer game

[JR89]

In the rankings that really matter we dropped 4

places in the UEFA rankings. We're 28th and for the new WC qualifier format you need to be 24th to avoid being a third seed. Rankings for the Euro qualifiers are done off the Nations League table.

We're currently 11.6 points ahead of Slovenia in 29th and Romania who are 24th are 31.7 points ahead of us.

At the start of this campaign we were 24th and have dropped 22.27 points. Though strangely enough we nearly dropped the same number of points from Septembers window as we did for Junes window. Didn't think a lose to France and Holland would result in nearly the same number of points lost as a loss and win against Greece and Gibraltar

[JR89]

And If you go back to the beginning of his time in charge we were ranked 20th in Europe with 1486 points. A drop of 70 points in three years has seen us fall to 28th.

[ifk101]

Eustace sacked by Birmingham with Rooney rumoured to be his replacement. John O'Shea possible assistant to Rooney. Eustace available as a replacement for Kenny.

[JR89]

Eustace will walk into another Championship easily. Ireland job would probably be a step back for him at this point in his career. Wouldn't be surprised to see QPR make a move for Eustace given his links with them to replace Gareth Ainsworth.

[Jolly Red Giant]

Eustace sacked by Birmingham with Rooney rumoured to be his replacement. John O'Shea possible assistant to Rooney. Eustace available as a replacement for Kenny.
The yanks that own Birmingham are idiots, first by sacking Eustace - they are in the play-off spots. Even worse would be replacing him with Rooney - the guy is as big a spoofer as Gerrard and Lampard - the only reason why Derby made half an attempt to get out of their mess under Rooney was because Liam Rosenior was actually doing the job.

@JR89 - I agree that Eustace is likely to replace Ainsworth at QPR - which will now likely happen sooner rather than later given his availability

[Demesne Lad]

Eustace will walk into another Championship easily. Ireland job would probably be a step back for him at this point in his career. Wouldn't be surprised to see QPR make a move for Eustace given his links with them to replace Gareth Ainsworth.

Eustace is 7/4 to be the other Rangers' manager.
Next Rangers manager as new favourite emerges after EFL sacking (glasgowworld.com) (https://www.glasgowworld.com/sport/football/rangers/next-rangers-manager-new-favourite-emerges-for-ibrox-role-after-efl-championship-club-announce-departure-4364740)

[tetsujin1979]

my feelings on P*ndit Are*a are well known, but this is a new laughable low, even for them
https://punditarena.com/football/ronan/analysis-the-twisted-truths-behind-stephen-kennys-divisive-ireland-tenure/

[Diggs246]

Here are my two favs:

"If you want a good moan about the team I think that’s a perfectly fine point to make, but if you’re saying it to criticise the management team, I don’t even think it should be entertained"

"Throwing out Kenny’s record as an argument against him is therefore, in my view, a pretty worthless exercise. The raw numbers don’t carry the nuances, the set-backs, injuries, covid-cases, expected goals, refereeing decisions"

[Trequartista20]

The Kennyites have been proven decisively wrong. After all of their high-handed disparagement and sneering of those of us who weren't true believers, will they now accept their share of the responsibility for the unmitigated disaster that has now presented itself?

Well, I doubt it. But where to now? We've reached an all-time low in terms of the status of the national team. Mismanagement at association level is the real issue, with the Kenny situation Delaney's final insult to the Irish fanbase.

A higher level, proven manager seems to be the way forward. But realistic candidates that fit the bill are hard to come by.

[Colbert Report]

I feel bad for the guy. He seems like such a nice person. John Delaney is the guy to blame for this. I think if the job was offered, all of us would love to give it a go. Sadly, Stephen Kenny was just not the right person for the gig, and didn't appear to be better suited for the role than most of us on here. I hope that we will learn from this mistake and make better appointments going forward.

Steve Staunton was one of our best players ever, and is sadly remembered for his disastrous managerial run. He should never have been put in the position to take charge, and the same goes for Stephen Kenny. Let's look for managers with a higher level of experience in the future.

[dynamo kerry]

Wrote a great reply. Lost it. Here's the summary.

Stan was never a legit choice. It was madness and bad madness.

Kenny made some sense.i had though, watched his Scottish efforts first hand and it was rank.

He was half way to having a team but he never fully committed.. too many compromises.. but even tonight.. surrender the wings to the Greeks, took ages to make changes.. not subbing browne off at half time.. no one pressing behind ferguson,....bah

We need some mad fker now. Someone to really commit. Stare the other lads down and dare them to mess with us. Foster a true winning attitude.. dispense with the lads withered by age and attrition. Time to really clean house. Let's have some clinical decision making and if we lose so be it. In short, move on anyone over 30, start again, go for the jugular.. be hard to beat.. I don't care if its pretty.. I want some pride.

Second time losing to Greece at home in my life. I don't want a third.

[Dave77]

Kenny will be gone and no problem with that decision. He talked up what he and team could do but unfortunately fallen well short. Feel bad for the guy because it’s quite clear he and his coaching staff gave it everything but didn’t work out.

But Irish footballs problems are so deep it’s depressing. We are so underfunded and falling more and more behind it’s frightening. If anyone thinks some new manager will come in and solve the huge problems in irish football they are deluded.

Unless FAI get backing of money from government (think 900 million is the figure they mentioned) irish football will continue to decline. And let’s be honest all irish politicians will jump on board euro 2028 and say it’s great but ultimately will do nothing for elite game and grassroots game. All I see from euro 2028 is a GAA stadium, and small amount of money which will service debt.

Coached at decent LSL level and a player from Holland joined, he could not believe how bad facilities were for that level and we were explaining that it’s probably better then what a lot of semi pro and pro teams have in Ireland.

Kind of reminds of when people say we have the politicians we deserve. We have the football organisation we deserve. They only cared about senior men’s team for decades, most Irish football fans don’t care about Irish football at grassroots level and that’s what we have!!! A senior team with very little quality and as a result we just hope that a manager will get the absolute most from players rather than produce players and then make managers job easier.

Look at the rugby, they have around 12 private schools providing most of their pro players. Mad, when you train Young players 5/6 times a week in good facilities you produce good players. And it’s a lot easier to produce a rugby player then a footballer.

Not a defense of Kenny but **** me we are deep ****.

[JR89]

Kenny will be gone and no problem with that decision. He talked up what he and team could do but unfortunately fallen well short. Feel bad for the guy because it’s quite clear he and his coaching staff gave it everything but didn’t work out.

But Irish footballs problems are so deep it’s depressing. We are so underfunded and falling more and more behind it’s frightening. If anyone thinks some new manager will come in and solve the huge problems in irish football they are deluded.

Unless FAI get backing of money from government (think 900 million is the figure they mentioned) irish football will continue to decline. And let’s be honest all irish politicians will jump on board euro 2028 and say it’s great but ultimately will do nothing for elite game and grassroots game. All I see from euro 2028 is a GAA stadium, and small amount of money which will service debt.

Coached at decent LSL level and a player from Holland joined, he could not believe how bad facilities were for that level and we were explaining that it’s probably better then what a lot of semi pro and pro teams have in Ireland.

Kind of reminds of when people say we have the politicians we deserve. We have the football organisation we deserve. They only cared about senior men’s team for decades, most Irish football fans don’t care about Irish football at grassroots level and that’s what we have!!! A senior team with very little quality and as a result we just hope that a manager will get the absolute most from players rather than produce players and then make managers job easier.

Look at the rugby, they have around 12 private schools providing most of their pro players. Mad, when you train Young players 5/6 times a week in good facilities you produce good players. And it’s a lot easier to produce a rugby player then a footballer.

Not a defense of Kenny but **** me we are deep ****.

When Barry Maguire joined Limerick he couldn't get his head around the fact that 9/10 year olds in Holland trained four nights a week but 16/17 year olds here would do two nights a week.

FAI need to move away from this pipe dream they have of the LOI clubs having proper academies with full time coaches as the route for developing players and go about setting up a full time national academy. Where the best of the best can get full time professional training. Can still work on improving academies at LOI level for those that don't make the national academy but we need a national academy.

Look at the improvements Israel have made at underage level since they started working with UEFA and got funding. They've a full time academy now where the best players eat, sleep, study, and train together. Georgia also worked with UEFA and think they've four or five similar academies around the country like NI have who also worked with UEFA to develop theirs.

[ontheotherhand]

The Kennyites have been proven decisively wrong. After all of their high-handed disparagement and sneering of those of us who weren't true believers, will they now accept their share of the responsibility for the unmitigated disaster that has now presented itself?

Well, I doubt it. But where to now? We've reached an all-time low in terms of the status of the national team. Mismanagement at association level is the real issue, with the Kenny situation Delaney's final insult to the Irish fanbase.

A higher level, proven manager seems to be the way forward. But realistic candidates that fit the bill are hard to come by.

Who are the Kennyites?

[Insidetherock]

When Barry Maguire joined Limerick he couldn't get his head around the fact that 9/10 year olds in Holland trained four nights a week but 16/17 year olds here would do two nights a week.

FAI need to move away from this pipe dream they have of the LOI clubs having proper academies with full time coaches as the route for developing players and go about setting up a full time national academy. Where the best of the best can get full time professional training. Can still work on improving academies at LOI level for those that don't make the national academy but we need a national academy.

Look at the improvements Israel have made at underage level since they started working with UEFA and got funding. They've a full time academy now where the best players eat, sleep, study, and train together. Georgia also worked with UEFA and think they've four or five similar academies around the country like NI have who also worked with UEFA to develop theirs.

A national academy would be the way to go.. but we are still stuck in the situation where the best football players in the country are playing GAA alongside football up to u16 level minimum.

The LOI academies are helping, and they will bear fruit eventually..

But the "we don't have the players" line is wearing thin too..

Every player last night that played, was in a Premier League team or Championship team, along with Scales who's playing CL with Celtic

And ok, the PL players aren't playing with City or Arsenal.. but every team in the PL is a decent team

Most teams in the Championship, are decent teams.

All of those players are living, eating, sleeping football.. 7 days a week. They're all being trained by UEFA A license coaches. They're getting the best nutrition, the best S&C coaching.. the best of everything

And still looked lost for the past 18 months. Don't blame the "inadequacies" of the local football scene, for PL and C players playing poorly.

The 14 y in Holland playing 4/5 times a week.. is still not much better than Nathan Collins for example. But Collins looks lost playing for Ireland for the past 12 months

We rave about the man of the match performances of Ogbene. Honestly, nice as the guy is.. hard working, honest player.. but he can run fast and direct.. that's it. His first touch is terrible, you rarely see him dribble past a player, and his crossing is nothing to write home about

That's our problem at the moment.. we're getting not enough out of what we have.. while blaming what we won't have in the future

[Paddy Garcia]

Watching that game last might, the one person who grew in my esteem was Kevin Keegan.

A bit of self awareness and dignity.

[Trequartista20]

Who are the Kennyites?

The author of the Pundit Arena article linked above is a prime example. Utterly delusional stuff.

'Where are the Kennyites?' is probably a better question. Presumably walking slowly backwards into a hedge.

[Bungle]

Stephen is undoubtedly a nice man, but in a different era, he would have been gone long ago. He needs to show dignity and accept the job isn’t for him to sort out.

The “we don’t have the players” line is a cop out. Our players may not be Ronnie Whelan or Paul McGrath level, but there is enough quality to be a half decent competitive team. Noteworthy that the only time under Kenny we looked somewhat organised, he had a top level coach in Anthony Barry. He is a very poor manager technically and his back room team clearly don’t have much to contribute. To be fair to Kenny, I actually think he would listen to others around him.

A lot saying the future is bleak. I actually disagree. It looked bleak after 2012. Clearly we have an exceptional talent in Ferguson and a core of very exciting players coming through. An even better Belgian group in the late noughties and early 2010s took a few years to come through, but we need to ensure we have a proper manager with a good quality back room staff to help them come through tough times and ultimately become a decent team which they can become. Plenty of talent on the continent and Carsley is clearly a very impressive manager. All is not lost.

[liamoo11]

A national academy would be the way to go.. but we are still stuck in the situation where the best football players in the country are playing GAA alongside football up to u16 level minimum.

The LOI academies are helping, and they will bear fruit eventually..

But the "we don't have the players" line is wearing thin too..

Every player last night that played, was in a Premier League team or Championship team, along with Scales who's playing CL with Celtic

And ok, the PL players aren't playing with City or Arsenal.. but every team in the PL is a decent team

Most teams in the Championship, are decent teams.

All of those players are living, eating, sleeping football.. 7 days a week. They're all being trained by UEFA A license coaches. They're getting the best nutrition, the best S&C coaching.. the best of everything

And still looked lost for the past 18 months. Don't blame the "inadequacies" of the local football scene, for PL and C players playing poorly.

The 14 y in Holland playing 4/5 times a week.. is still not much better than Nathan Collins for example. But Collins looks lost playing for Ireland for the past 12 months

We rave about the man of the match performances of Ogbene. Honestly, nice as the guy is.. hard working, honest player.. but he can run fast and direct.. that's it. His first touch is terrible, you rarely see him dribble past a player, and his crossing is nothing to write home about

That's our problem at the moment.. we're getting not enough out of what we have.. while blaming what we won't have in the future

Yeah for all the grandious talk of changing irish football the only strategy was to have ogbene stay wide and use his athleticism to win free kicks that we aimed constantly with no variation towards Duffy. How was that different to previous irish sides. Only difference I can think is players like mcclean and kilbane who were similar to ogbene had far better delivery

[Jolly Red Giant]

There is a lot of nonsense about the players not being good enough - these are professional footballers playing at a high level in one of the most competitive leagues globally. Irish teams in the past with a similar or poorer 'quality' of player did not capitulate like Kenny's teams have done in the past 4 years. Irish teams for decades have always been greater than the sum of their parts (with the possible exception of Staunton's tenure) - now Kenny is succeeding in having them playing considerably less than the sum of their parts.

In 1974 the standard of English football wasn't anywhere close to its position in Europe now and few if any foreign players played in England - Ireland beat Russia 3-0 in 1974 and the team was significantly better than the sum of their parts because the guy managing the team, Johnny Giles, knew what he was doing - in the Irish team that day (and quite a few were not first choice at their clubs) were -

Paddy Roche (reserve goalie for Man Utd who were playing in the old second division - first choice goalie Mick Kearns, who played in the third division with Walsall was injured)
Jimmy Holmes (Coventry - bottom half of first division)
Joe Kinnear (Spurs - barely survived relegation from first division)
Terry Mancini (Arsenal - finished 16th in the first division - Mancini was 33 at the time and a bit part player - and was dumped by Arsenal at the end of the following season joining Aldershot)
Paddy Mulligan (Crystal Palace - third division)
Liam Brady (Arsenal - see above - and Brady was still an 18 year-old kid and played something like 15 games for Arsenal before the Russia game. Brady made his international debut in this game)
Johnny Giles (Leeds - finished 9th in the first division)
Steve Heighway (Liverpool - runners up)
Mick Martin (Man Utd - second division - and a bit part player)
Don Givens (QPR - mid-table first division)
Ray Treacy (Oldham - barely escaped relegation from second division)

Others in the Irish squad were -
Eoin Hand (Portsmouth - just above Oldham in second division)
John Dempsey (Chelsea - relegated from first division)
Tony Dunne (Bolton - mid-table second division)
Jimmy Conway (Fulham - mid-table second division)
Gerry Daly (played 16 games for Man U)
Miah Dennehy (Forest - just above Portsmouth)
Terry Conroy (Stoke - mostly used as a sub - first division)
Peter Thomas (Waterford)

If you have someone competent managing the team - particularly an international team - they will always get the team to punch above their weight. Last night was a disaster and remember Greece are not footballing giants - they are ranked four places above Ireland. Kenny has succeeded is seeing Ireland drop from 34th to 55th in his time in charge. We are now behind soccer powerhouses like Iran (21st) Australia (27th) Algeria (34th) Canada (44th) Panama (45th) Costa Rica (46th) Mali (49th) Finland (54th) and we are just ahead - literally - of Jamacia, Saudi Arabia and Burkino Faso.