Stephen Kenny

[John83]

Paul Green was a good Championship midfielder. He'd be likely starting for us these days. Back then, we could afford to sneer at a Championship midfielder.

[tetsujin1979]

Green suffered from press coverage because Trapattoni picked him and dropped Andy Reid.

[ifk101]

Green's touch was far too heavy for international football. He was in the team to win the ball and break-up opposition play. And this was his limit of his abilities - which was good enough for the Championship. Molumby, a player currently in the Championship, can do that and more, and has time on his side to keep improving.

[Diggs246]

The team are not as bad as brady and some people say
look at this set up against a team we should be looking to beat

4-3-3. theose play are preety good actually

I know we couldnt play that in Paris, where a 4-5-1 might be the order of the day

------- -------Gavin

Coleman--- Andrew O--- Egan --- Manning

---- J Culun--- N Collins--- M. Johnson

------ Ogbene --- Feguson ---- Obefemi

[SkStu]

I know he has class and could be a future Stones, but I dont want Collins learning how to be a midfielder in a green jersey. It carries a bit too much risk if you ask me. There's a few other problems with the line up you have there too in fairness... (Andy and Egan almost completely inexperienced in a back 2, Manning not a FB, Johnson can't play that role, especially behind Obafemi who I think is also better in a front 2 than out wide). With that said, subject to us sorting out some options at FB, I do agree that a back 4 is likely the next best iteration of the team style/formation.

I would see us going to a variation of 4-3-3 depending on the opposition... a 4-1-2-3 where we are playing a weaker team and a 4-2-1-3 where we are playing someone a bit stronger. Personnel/selection in the middle 3 would dictate the expected tempo. Against the top teams you'd just pull your wide forwards back into midfield more and go with something that looks more like a 4-5-1.

I'm on the fence about our current playing pool. Worst talent in history is, for me, taking us back to the mid to late 80's where you'd look at this crop and they'd pale into insignificance - almost entirely - against any squad from 86 - 02... the 02 - 12 cohort was when we started dropping as the golden generation(s) were leaving. It picked up a little from 12 - 16 and declined further since.

But.......... you look at this crop and while their club situations dont exactly provide much comfort for various reasons, they have youth and potential on their side, almost completely. There is a similar crop right behind them. The ceiling is high for this crowd but it remains to be seen if they get there. The future does seem brighter than the present and recent past but we'll have a better sense in a couple of years. It is weird though, I also feel like the present should be bit brighter than it is which is why you have now got to look at Kenny.

[pineapple stu]

I'm on the fence about our current playing pool. Worst talent in history is, for me, taking us back to the mid to late 80's where you'd look at this crop and they'd pale into insignificance - almost entirely - against any squad from 86 - 02... the 02 - 12 cohort was when we started dropping as the golden generation(s) were leaving. It picked up a little from 12 - 16 and declined further since.
Even that squad in the early 80s wasn't bad. OK, awful in 1986 qualifying. But 84 qualifying was respectable (drew with Spain, 2-0 up against Holland at half-time only to lose 3-2, beat Malta 8-0, still our record win). 1982 we beat Holland and France at home, drew away to Belgium and Holland; lost out on goal difference. Were the Belgians on the take that year? Certainly we were screwed in Bulgaria one of the years too - '78 I think. Players like O'Leary, Stapleton, Brady, Hughton, Whelan, etc, were top players.

I think we haven't had a squad this bad since the 70s - albeit that the age profile of our current squad absolutely stands in them in good stead for the future.

[SkStu]

I agree regarding the calibre of certain players. I just dont remember watching that team play (club or country)!! Definitely seems though there was a sense of significant underperformance in that 80 - 86 batch.

[Razors left peg]

Paul Green was a good Championship midfielder. He'd be likely starting for us these days. Back then, we could afford to sneer at a Championship midfielder.

Ah he wasnt good, lets not be revisionist about it. He was in the team regularly because he turned up to an early training camp for Trap and it drove us all mad that he was constantly picked afterwards. No one has ever said that we miss Paul Green in there after he was finally dropped, like we would have for Glenn Whelan for example.

[liamoo11]

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-12216475/amp/England-21-boss-Lee-Carsleys-astonishing-admission-early-days-manager.html . Corsley s approach. The lads on the English forum in big soccer who are very hard to.please very happy with Corsley reck8n he could get the England job after the ireland job but interestingly one poster says he doesn't sing the english national anthem which is interesting

[Trequartista20]

Ireland down to 52 in the latest FIFA Rankings, with Greece having moved up to 49, a reversal of where the two teams were placed prior to the defeat in Athens. I'd imagine we'll have slipped back some way further after the almost inevitable defeats to Holland and France.

I believe we were ranked 34th when McCarthy left, and 33rd at the time of O'Neill's departure.

Difficult to look upon the Kenny era as anything other than one of regression.

[Trequartista20]

On Paul Green, I seem to remember the media and certain supporters made a huge deal of the fact that he was named in the Euro 2012 squad whilst being without a club, as if this was evidence of how poor a player he was.

But that was hardly unique to to Green. Tournaments (the Qatar debacle notwithstanding) are played in the summer, and players are often out of contract at that time of year. It was the same for players like Gary Breen in the 2002 World Cup and Bonner, Cascarino and Whelan in US '94.

I think he got a decent move to Leeds that summer too. He always seemed to receive an undue amount of flak.

[NeverFeltBetter]

It was also that he was getting played when others that were more highly fancied by the fanbase were sitting on the bench, like James McClean, and maybe to a lesser extent Darren Gibson. His reputation maybe suffered a bit as well when he was brought on as a sub when the team was 4-0 down against Spain. It was something of a meme/snarky comment in the following season that I saw a few times regards counterproductive/pointless substitutions, whenever any random team was getting pasted: "4-0 down: better bring on Paul Green".

[Trequartista20]

Forgot about him being brought on against Spain at four down. That's going to put people's backs up right enough. And, controversially, in preference to Gibson too, if memory serves.

[Diggs246]

I know he has class and could be a future Stones, but I dont want Collins learning how to be a midfielder in a green jersey. It carries a bit too much risk if you ask me. There's a few other problems with the line up you have there too in fairness... (Andy and Egan almost completely inexperienced in a back 2, Manning not a FB, Johnson can't play that role, especially behind Obafemi who I think is also better in a front 2 than out wide). With that said, subject to us sorting out some options at FB, I do agree that a back 4 is likely the next best iteration of the team style/formation.





I would see us going to a variation of 4-3-3 depending on the opposition... a 4-1-2-3 where we are playing a weaker team and a 4-2-1-3 where we are playing someone a bit stronger. Personnel/selection in the middle 3 would dictate the expected tempo. Against the top teams you'd just pull your wide forwards back into midfield more and go with something that looks more like a 4-5-1.

I'm on the fence about our current playing pool. Worst talent in history is, for me, taking us back to the mid to late 80's where you'd look at this crop and they'd pale into insignificance - almost entirely - against any squad from 86 - 02... the 02 - 12 cohort was when we started dropping as the golden generation(s) were leaving. It picked up a little from 12 - 16 and declined further since.

But.......... you look at this crop and while their club situations dont exactly provide much comfort for various reasons, they have youth and potential on their side, almost completely. There is a similar crop right behind them. The ceiling is high for this crowd but it remains to be seen if they get there. The future does seem brighter than the present and recent past but we'll have a better sense in a couple of years. It is weird though, I also feel like the present should be bit brighter than it is which is why you have now got to look at Kenny.


Re Collins Im just not sure we have enough good players in the middle of the park, he is a very good player and will be playing in teh prem next season when he moves ( alba plays midfoield for Austria, when he was at munich he was a left back and nothimng else ) we have seen or owne lads swap sucesfully in th past Paul McGrath etc
RE: Andy O and Egan, they can of course play in a back 2. I wouldnt have any concerns at all there
RE Manning at LB, that is a risk, I get it, but I would prefer him to McClean and I would say doherty could be gone soon if he is leaving Europe as I under stand it
RE Joihnson if thats doenst wok we drop Ogebne back into the right side of the middle thrree and he pushes up ( no sub needed)

[elatedscum]

Re Collins Im just not sure we have enough good players in the middle of the park, he is a very good player and will be playing in teh prem next season when he moves ( alba plays midfoield for Austria, when he was at munich he was a left back and nothimng else ) we have seen or owne lads swap sucesfully in th past Paul McGrath etc
RE: Andy O and Egan, they can of course play in a back 2. I wouldnt have any concerns at all there
RE Manning at LB, that is a risk, I get it, but I would prefer him to McClean and I would say doherty could be gone soon if he is leaving Europe as I under stand it
RE Joihnson if thats doenst wok we drop Ogebne back into the right side of the middle thrree and he pushes up ( no sub needed)

Ogbene and Johnston aren't midfielders. Your team is a 4-4-2 with Ogbene on the right wing, Johnston on the left and Obafemi and Ferguson in the centre. That's fine - but that's definitely the formation, not playing Johnston or Ogbene as part of a midfield three

[JR89]

And David Alaba was a midfielder that Munich turned into a defender. Something they've done with multiple players. Because it's often easier for some lads to come in and play at FB when breaking into the team and then they've got a player that can play midfield and in defence.

Irish players have successfully swapped in the past and at the same time that happened I'm sure we still had some LOI players moving to teams in the top tier of English football. Times have massively changed since Paul McGrath played midfield for Ireland and went into the United first team after moving from St Pats.

[NeverFeltBetter]

Forgot about him being brought on against Spain at four down. That's going to put people's backs up right enough. And, controversially, in preference to Gibson too, if memory serves.

I actually need to correct myself after looking around for stuff related to this. Green was brought on at three down, and was badly at fault for the fourth goal, letting Fabregas past him and then slipping before he could try and stop his resulting shot.

[Razors left peg]

Fuppin hell, ya know theres not a lot going on when we are discussing the merits of Paul Green.

[SkStu]

He was the finest harrier ever to don the green.

[tetsujin1979]

Fuppin hell, ya know theres not a lot going on when we are discussing the merits of Paul Green.
it gets a bit quiet in the summer months in the international forum.

[SkStu]

Re Collins Im just not sure we have enough good players in the middle of the park, he is a very good player and will be playing in teh prem next season when he moves ( alba plays midfoield for Austria, when he was at munich he was a left back and nothimng else ) we have seen or owne lads swap sucesfully in th past Paul McGrath etc
RE: Andy O and Egan, they can of course play in a back 2. I wouldnt have any concerns at all there
RE Manning at LB, that is a risk, I get it, but I would prefer him to McClean and I would say doherty could be gone soon if he is leaving Europe as I under stand it
RE Joihnson if thats doenst wok we drop Ogebne back into the right side of the middle thrree and he pushes up ( no sub needed)

The CB issue I raised definitely not a showstopper, just a consideration. That midfield trio gets shredded though.

[tommy_c12000]

Carsley having a flawless Euro U21 championships so far, Portugal tomorrow in the quarter final. Will be interesting to see where he ends up after the tournament

[JR89]

Carsley having a flawless Euro U21 championships so far, Portugal tomorrow in the quarter final. Will be interesting to see where he ends up after the tournament

Wouldn't be surprised if all these Carsley for Ireland stories that have been feed to the press are his agent hoping to drum up interest for a job at club level in case he's moved on by the FA as U21s manager.

[AFunnyOldGame]

Does Carso sing GSTK!?

[CraftyToePoke]

Does Carso sing GSTK!?

Read back one page and its already been covered, no, it seems he doesn't.

[liamoo11]

Watched this England game with a bit of interest. Played a narrow 4141 Gordon as the front man, Jones and gibbs white narrow centrally behind Gordon with Ramsey and mudeke tucking in on the flanks to give aorons and garner the chance to push on wide and high from full back. Gomes who I remember been a number 10 played as the deep midfielder who took the ball with his back to goal and on the half turn. Back 4 played very high Trafford was prepared to sweep. England were prepared to give up space out wide but were very strong centrally. The goal came from the central dominance. English fullbacks were very poor . England committed alot of players to attacks in Central areas which created overloads centrally in dangerous areas rather than pointless overloads in wide areas. Through now to the semi s

[Diggs246]

If he wins the competition he will probably be out of our reach come September

[Diggs246]

The CB issue I raised definitely not a showstopper, just a consideration. That midfield trio gets shredded though.
But as I said that team is against weaker opposition. I just think it has to be different horses for courses
We played 3 CBs against Gibraltar at home. That team I suggested wouldnt imo be drawing 0-0 as half time.
I favour 4-5-1 against any decent team. Particular away from home

[CraftyToePoke]

But as I said that team is against weaker opposition. I just think it has to be different horses for courses
We played 3 CBs against Gibraltar at home. That team I suggested wouldnt imo be drawing 0-0 as half time.
I favour 4-5-1 against any decent team. Particular away from home

Ah twas a show of a thing, your team. Would get ate alive by any decent well set up & organised eleven professionals.

You are getting the hang of quoting posts though.

[Diggs246]

Ah twas a show of a thing, your team. Would get ate alive by any decent well set up & organised eleven professionals.

You are getting the hang of quoting posts though.

My darling clementine !
The donkey you backed can't beat
" any decent well set up & organised eleven professionals"
It's taken you three years to realize that ( if you have indeed realized that).

[Razors left peg]

For the 0-0 at half time we missed 3 wide open chances with McGrath, Ferguson and Obafemi. Was that Kenny's fault too or do we ever hold players accountable?

[weldoninhio]

For the 0-0 at half time we missed 3 wide open chances with McGrath, Ferguson and Obafemi. Was that Kenny's fault too or do we ever hold players accountable?

To paraphrase a much better Ireland manager than Kenny, 'He's the gaffer, the buck stops with him'.

[AFunnyOldGame]

Read back one page and its already been covered, no, it seems he doesn't.

Apologies missed that!

[liamoo11]

I watched the england game last night they absolutely animilised Israel. Palmer from city and Elliott from Liverpool came into midfield for Ramsey and madueke so they played even more narrow in midfield . They really dominated the midfield and committed players into the box in big numbers regularly. They missed a penalty early but didn't drop the heads .

[Razors left peg]

To paraphrase a much better Ireland manager than Kenny, 'He's the gaffer, the buck stops with him'.

Nonsense argument. If players are in positions to score and don't thats on them

[liamoo11]

https://twitter.com/englandyouth/status/1676674059642470401?t=jvwnSJf5bCA-d-YXkWWZzQ&s=19 summary video of England set up under carsley

[liamoo11]

One nil up at half time. Smith Rowe in today for Elliott. Even game england have forced mistakes, and turned over the ball centrally again with sheer numbers of players they committ centrally in midfield. They play so narrow unfortunately their 2 full backs just don't have the pace and quality to get up and down the line to use the space england create constantly by playing narrow

[liamoo11]

Won it deserved but very tight contest

[tommy_c12000]

Would be nice to offer Carsley the job now, it’s a nice juncture, may not be available when Kenny inevitably leaves at the end of the 2024 qualifying campaign. I doubt if it will happen

[SkStu]

The win probably gives Carsley his pick of jobs next, even if he was blessed with an exceptional crop of youngsters. I’d say nearly guaranteed a shot if Southgate was to leave plus he’ll have a host of decent clubs interested in him if he wants to step into club management. I don’t think the Ireland senior role would be high on his list now.

[liamoo11]

The win probably gives Carsley his pick of jobs next, even if he was blessed with an exceptional crop of youngsters. I’d say nearly guaranteed a shot if Southgate was to leave plus he’ll have a host of decent clubs interested in him if he wants to step into club management. I don’t think the Ireland senior role would be high on his list now.

I wonder. He didn't go wrapping himself in the union Jack or kissing the crest afterwards . Hopefully if he doesn't take our job he gets a good championship job and builds a good career

[JR89]

Would be nice to offer Carsley the job now, it’s a nice juncture, may not be available when Kenny inevitably leaves at the end of the 2024 qualifying campaign. I doubt if it will happen

More chance of him being the next England manager rather than Ireland manager.

[pineapple stu]

The Mail reporting he's in line for a new contract as 21s boss while we're also interested.

Read into that bit of football gossip what you will of course

[lofty9]

More chance of him being the next England manager rather than Ireland manager.


This. The FA will use the same succession plan as they did with Southgate. With the tools at his exposure he's not stupid enough to end his career by taking on the Ireland job.

[pixiehead]

This. The FA will use the same succession plan as they did with Southgate. With the tools at his exposure he's not stupid enough to end his career by taking on the Ireland job.I doubt they'd want Carsley to take over as caretaker followed by a permanent appointment after Southgate or his successor get caught up in a scandal.
:D
They've offered Carsley a contract extension. It wouldn't be a bad move to take the offer with a premier league get out clause,surely there'll be a job available before Christmas.

[zero]

I doubt they'd want Carsley to take over as caretaker followed by a permanent appointment after Southgate or his successor get caught up in a scandal.
:D
They've offered Carsley a contract extension. It wouldn't be a bad move to take the offer with a premier league get out clause,surely there'll be a job available before Christmas.

can't see a prem side going for him - the risk is just too high at that level. a mid table / struggling championship side is likely his best bet.

unless he prefers the idea of the Ireland job, which he may. both are completely different proposition to working with a squad with numerous elite players at the u21 level.

i dont think they conceded a goal all tournament though which is impressive. we should be keeping a lot more clean sheets than we do given the players at our disposal.

[SkStu]

Carsley set for talks with the FA about his future.

https://www.bbc.com/sport/football/66149678


Manager Carsley was appointed in July 2021 and is believed to be undecided about whether to carry on in the role.
…
Carsley is on a rolling one-year contract and is understood to have been approached by clubs during his tenure as under-21s manager.

[tommy_c12000]

Carsley has been very methodical so far in his career, progressing slowly with carefully selecting jobs, not getting out of his depth too soon, natural step up is senior international football which will have a better quality of life vs his other probable option championship club management. He has always prioritized his family and that extra time will be important to him, so I would not think it’s beyond the bounds of possibility. The main problem I see is the FAI being unable to make a prompt bold decision with their current committee / red tape set up. I guess there were some benefits of the “good old days..”

[liamoo11]

With it looking like Vera Paew is not going to get a new contract despite qualifying for the first World Cup and performing I felt well against 2 very strong nations stephen Kenny can consider himself fortunate the expectations of him are not as great as of Vera

[seanfhear]

With it looking like Vera Paew is not going to get a new contract despite qualifying for the first World Cup and performing I felt well against 2 very strong nations stephen Kenny can consider himself fortunate the expectations of him are not as great as of Vera

You'd wonder which way the FAI is veering alright ? !