Stephen Kenny

[EalingGreen]

You'd wonder which way the FAI is veering alright ? !Unless they're thinking of replacing Kenny with Vera? ;)

[Colbert Report]

With it looking like Vera Paew is not going to get a new contract despite qualifying for the first World Cup and performing I felt well against 2 very strong nations stephen Kenny can consider himself fortunate the expectations of him are not as great as of Vera

We were beaten twice and are likely to lose to Nigeria. As I said in this thread before the tournament, the FAI should have had the guts to sack the manager when the details of her bullying scandal came out.

Stephen Kenny is not a bully, he's a really nice guy. He has a terrible group of players to pick from, and I feel badly for him. If he had a Roy Keane or a Damien Duff, things may have gone differently for him. What frustrates me is that he insists on playing the game "the right way" when we don't have the players to do that right now. What frustrates me even more is how he's been afforded such a long leash due to the fact that League of Ireland supporters seem so fanatical in their support of him. He can do no wrong in their eyes, yet he's doing so much damage.

[Eirambler]

If Pauw goes after qualifying for the World Cup then there can be no more rope for Kenny. Doesn't matter how nice a guy he's supposed to be, all he's doing is proving the theory that nice guys come last.

[third policeman]

We were beaten twice and are likely to lose to Nigeria. As I said in this thread before the tournament, the FAI should have had the guts to sack the manager when the details of her bullying scandal came out.

Stephen Kenny is not a bully, he's a really nice guy. He has a terrible group of players to pick from, and I feel badly for him. If he had a Roy Keane or a Damien Duff, things may have gone differently for him. What frustrates me is that he insists on playing the game "the right way" when we don't have the players to do that right now. What frustrates me even more is how he's been afforded such a long leash due to the fact that League of Ireland supporters seem so fanatical in their support of him. He can do no wrong in their eyes, yet he's doing so much damage.

‘Terrible group of players’ - Was reading about PL interest in Smallbone, and it’s possible he could actually field a team of PL players next season. This isn’t the greatest ever Irish squad, but is it as bad as some pundits and Kenny supported like to suggest?

[pineapple stu]

I think it's as bad as we've ever had but not as bad as results are showing

What's the team of Premier players?

Kelleher
Doherty... Collins... O'Shea...Egan...Coleman
Cullen...Smallbone (if he gets a transfer)... Hendrick
Ferguson...Ogbene...Obafemi

Most of them will be in relegation battles if they get gametime at all. It's a small step in the right direction but we've a lot of improving to do yet

[Eirambler]

We have the best squad we've had in five or six years, easily. A bit light in midfield, but most countries our size will usually have a weakness and it's up to the manager to find a way to work around that, just look at what Scotland are doing lately with very little quality in goal, at centre back or at centre forward.

Egan, Collins, O'Shea, Coleman, Doherty, Cullen, Ogbene and Ferguson will all be in or around their team's first 11s in the Premier League this coming season. Hodge might be in the mix as well going by pre-season. Obafemi and Alex Murphy may get some game time also, who knows Kelleher will end up. Manning, Omobamidele, Duffy, Bazunu, Lenihan, Taylor, Smallbone and Molumby will all be regulars with top 6 rated Championship teams. Festy will likely continue to develop in Serie A.

We've heard enough excuses at this point, that's a team and squad that should be in and around the top 24 in Europe at an absolute minimum. Stacks of players in or approaching their best years. If the results aren't coming then there's only one weak link and on the face of it it's the easiest problem of all to fix.

The "we don't have the players" excuse has well and truly run out of road at this point.

[liamoo11]

We were beaten twice and are likely to lose to Nigeria. As I said in this thread before the tournament, the FAI should have had the guts to sack the manager when the details of her bullying scandal came out.

Stephen Kenny is not a bully, he's a really nice guy. He has a terrible group of players to pick from, and I feel badly for him. If he had a Roy Keane or a Damien Duff, things may have gone differently for him. What frustrates me is that he insists on playing the game "the right way" when we don't have the players to do that right now. What frustrates me even more is how he's been afforded such a long leash due to the fact that League of Ireland supporters seem so fanatical in their support of him. He can do no wrong in their eyes, yet he's doing so much damage.

What I read in the athletic I would not consider her actions to have been problematic but I didn't read the actual report from the US soccer federation so perhaps the athletic article left out the bad stuff.

I think been a manager is about setting up a side to maximise their abilities and give them rhe best chance of success. Simply apeing other sides in how you play just because its popular is something anyone could do where is the skill and expertise in that?

[tetsujin1979]

Carsley effectively ruling himself out of the running to replace Kenny
1686014163930193920

[SkStu]

We were beaten twice and are likely to lose to Nigeria. As I said in this thread before the tournament, the FAI should have had the guts to sack the manager when the details of her bullying scandal came out.

Stephen Kenny is not a bully, he's a really nice guy. He has a terrible group of players to pick from, and I feel badly for him. If he had a Roy Keane or a Damien Duff, things may have gone differently for him. What frustrates me is that he insists on playing the game "the right way" when we don't have the players to do that right now. What frustrates me even more is how he's been afforded such a long leash due to the fact that League of Ireland supporters seem so fanatical in their support of him. He can do no wrong in their eyes, yet he's doing so much damage.

This - the influence of the LOI supporters - is substantially overstated as a reason he is still in the job in my opinion. The 30k or so LOI fanatics in the country carry no weight with the decision makers. Never have, never will. The reasons for keeping Kenny are more to do with 1) the fact that he was given a mandate that required at least 2 years and b) the association can't really afford a replacement and possibly 3) the list of feasible or obvious replacements is fairly limited.

[seanfhear]

Carsley effectively ruling himself out of the running to replace Kenny
1686014163930193920
Oe waiting for Kenny to fall ( maybe )

[ontheotherhand]

We were beaten twice and are likely to lose to Nigeria. As I said in this thread before the tournament, the FAI should have had the guts to sack the manager when the details of her bullying scandal came out.

Stephen Kenny is not a bully, he's a really nice guy. He has a terrible group of players to pick from, and I feel badly for him. If he had a Roy Keane or a Damien Duff, things may have gone differently for him. What frustrates me is that he insists on playing the game "the right way" when we don't have the players to do that right now. What frustrates me even more is how he's been afforded such a long leash due to the fact that League of Ireland supporters seem so fanatical in their support of him. He can do no wrong in their eyes, yet he's doing so much damage.


There's plenty of LoI supporters who have no time for Kenny at all. The myth of the fanatical LoI/Kenny supporter is beyond ridiculous. If you knew anything about the game here you'd know consensus is rare. Most of the posters on this forum who have shown support for Kenny over the last few years are never seen on the LoI side. I know it suits your pathetically ignorant anti LoI agenda but give it a rest unless you can come to us with some evidence to support your claim.

[Colbert Report]

I've been asked politely to stop comparing the LoI to a pub league, so I won't do that again. I have, however, been keeping close tabs on the LoI clubs in European competition this summer. Yikes.

[JR89]

Oe waiting for Kenny to fall ( maybe )

Don't think he'd continue to work with the FA if waiting on Kenny to go. Not like he would have to wait long either.

Also don't think the FA continue to employ an U21s manager who isn't fully committed. FA would likely want a manager that's gonna see out the U21s campaign and might well look to promote from within.

[CraftyToePoke]

I've been asked politely to stop comparing the LoI to a pub league, so I won't do that again. I have, however, been keeping close tabs on the LoI clubs in European competition this summer. Yikes.

There isn't a domestic league bias towards him at all. People I talk to are as divided on SK as any other demographic. All in your head.

[Razors left peg]

If the man who would be king has signed a new contract with England U21s does that give Kenny a bit more breathing room or are we still expecting him to get 6 points in September to keep his job?

[JR89]

If the man who would be king has signed a new contract with England U21s does that give Kenny a bit more breathing room or are we still expecting him to get 6 points in September to keep his job?

Don't think anyone is expecting him to get six points in September to keep his job, not even the FAI.

[Razors left peg]

Don't think anyone is expecting him to get six points in September to keep his job, not even the FAI.

Is that any less unrealistic than expecting him to qualify out of this group?

[ontheotherhand]

I've been asked politely to stop comparing the LoI to a pub league, so I won't do that again. I have, however, been keeping close tabs on the LoI clubs in European competition this summer. Yikes.

Can you back up your claim or not?

[nigel-harps1954]

Can you back up your claim or not?

He's only a wum, and not worth the time.

[ontheotherhand]

He's only a wum, and not worth the time.

True, I'll throw him back on the ignore list. You'd wonder what even motivates him. Years on here just taking weird swings at the LoI and its supporters. California is full of better things to do.

[OwlsFan]

I was never really a fan of Kenny after he criticised everything that went before him when he was given the Irish job. I did feel for him a bit when I looked at the recording of him squirming before the RTE cameras with Tony O'Donoghue as ever asking embarrassingly direct questions (which used to really get under O'Neill's skin - I see the latter in the Indo today is still bristling about that). Kenny is terrible in front of the cameras. Can he be any better in the dressing room ? Under Kenny arguably we've had one excellent result (Scotland 3-0), some good performances (e.g Portugal away, France at home (both lost though)) but mostly mediocrity (masking as "entertaining football") and one of the worst results in Irish football (losing at home to Luxembourg). I thought we did ok last night for one half (as we did in Paris) but when the going gets tough, he seems unable to respond until it's too late (barn door and all that). I was watching his interminable discussions with Keith Andrews (all initiated by the latter) which eventually resulted in McClean being replaced after the Dutch scored ! The 87th minute double substitutions baffled me (ones made this late are usually by a team leading to kill time not by a losing side requiring 2 goals). And McGrath brought on earlier (all after painfully long discussions with Andrews). He has been unlucky with injuries and other things but I've never taken to him as a manager (he won't lose any sleep over that). I fear if we keep him on he might get a result over the Greeks and we'll be once again "walking in a Kenny wonderland". It's an ideal time to introduce a new manager with very little to play for but if it costs, it won't happen. Mind you if it's Roy Keane, where are the words of that Kenny song again?

His legacy: managed a transition both in terms of players and style of play and perhaps has built foundations for a new coach to take the team forward.

[TrapAPony]

He has got 36 matches in charge and he has achieved next to nothing bar shove us further down the rankings with some woeful losses in between. He has got more time and more chances than anyone we ever had previously to be allowed continue with such an abysmal record despite it being obvious early on that he was out of his depth. He should certainly not be in charge for the games against Greece & Gibraltar. Now is the time to bring in someone new whoever that may be.

[DCWA]

Well it seems decision has been made on Kenny then, the gig is up for THE BOSS. According to tabloid reports in the UK the FA expect an official approach from the FAI for Lee Carsley as soon as today.

[backstothewall]

Multiple sources reporting the FAI have a break clause they can use until the end of October.

The papers can only have been given that info from 2 sources - either Kenny or the FAI. It seems unlikely it came from Kenny there's clearly some within the FAI who want to call it a day and have leaked it.

Carsley is an ideal candidate. Steven Reid would be similarly suitable. If the one the FAI want can't be in the dugout by October John O'Shea could step in.

He should and hopefully will be shown the door this week.

[NeverFeltBetter]

I would just be a tiny bit concerned about Carsley. He's won an underage tournament with an excellent crop of players, but his managerial career otherwise has been pretty limited. A senior international job, with all of the scrutiny that comes with it, would be a big step-up for him.

[backstothewall]

I would just be a tiny bit concerned about Carsley. He's won an underage tournament with an excellent crop of players, but his managerial career otherwise has been pretty limited. A senior international job, with all of the scrutiny that comes with it, would be a big step-up for him.

Reid is certainly that bit more charismatic.

The other side of that is that England have clearly got an excellent structure in place, and he's seen that from the inside with the St Georges Park setup etc. Bringing that knowledge with him could be excellent for the FAI at a time when there's hopefully an opportunity for genuine reform to take place under the Canham/Hill regime.

One thing I'd love to see is a return of B internationals with squads selected entirely from the domestic leagues. There are other countries with leagues equivalent to the League of Ireland who could benefit in a similar way.

[JR89]

Multiple sources reporting the FAI have a break clause they can use until the end of October.

The papers can only have been given that info from 2 sources - either Kenny or the FAI. It seems unlikely it came from Kenny there's clearly some within the FAI who want to call it a day and have leaked it.

Carsley is an ideal candidate. Steven Reid would be similarly suitable. If the one the FAI want can't be in the dugout by October John O'Shea could step in.

He should and hopefully will be shown the door this week.

Definitely came from the FAI side. Think Gavin Cummiskey was the first to mention it after June's window and specifically said it can be triggered if qualification is over before we play Greece in October.

Like you can assume things like they might have this and that but when you report that if the group is finished before Octobers window then the FAI can move him on, well someone slipped you that info to make public.

Think Kenny also said publicly himself before that their was no clauses. Might have been last summer when there was some talk that the FAI had a clause which allowed them to part ways after the NLs campaign.

[backstothewall]

Think Kenny also said publicly himself before that their was no clauses. Might have been last summer when there was some talk that the FAI had a clause which allowed them to part ways after the NLs campaign.

It's entirely possible that Kenny didn't realize the wording of the contract would allow them to move in October. He's not a lawyer and may have assumed the play-offs were considered part of the qualification process, but a lawyer on the FAI side had included a provision to allow for this situation.

I doubt whoever the source(s) within the FAI is/are would have leaked it without being sure they were on a sound footing. Or that a serious journalist would have reported it without either having multiple sources confirming the situation or seeing the document.

[Philly]

Steven Reid has managed one senior game as a manager. Likewise, Carsley has won with the best u21 team in the world. I'm not sure either of them are guaranteed to be an improvement on Kenny.

The lack of experienced candidates linked to the role speaks volumes for where Irish football is at the moment.

[Demesne Lad]

I think Ruud van Nistelrooy is available. Did very well at PSV, 5 years in England as a player, etc. But would the FAI need another billionaire to help out with the pay packet?

[JR89]

It's entirely possible that Kenny didn't realize the wording of the contract would allow them to move in October. He's not a lawyer and may have assumed the play-offs were considered part of the qualification process, but a lawyer on the FAI side had included a provision to allow for this situation.

Isn't Kenny's agent a solicitor?



I think Ruud van Nistelrooy is available. Did very well at PSV, 5 years in England as a player, etc. But would the FAI need another billionaire to help out with the pay packet?

He'll get himself a good club job this season. Won silverware and finished runner up his first as manager. Ireland would be a step down for his career.

[ltfc_2004]

I hate watching Stephen Kenny struggle, I have nothing but fond memories of him at Longford Town and how he changed the fortunes of a fairly crap pedestrian team into one that got promoted to the Premier Division from the bottom of the first division and made its first ever Cup final and European debut. My heart sinks when I see him on TV talking post match.

Who would want the job that's available and more importantly we can afford. If its Lee Carsley, I would love to see someone like Roy Hodgson approached to be the part time No 2. I know it feels like going back to Stan and Bobby but Carsley can actually manage a team but someone like Roy would be a great No 2 if he would take it.

[Strongbow10]

Stephen Kenny is unfortunately not at the level required to manage at international level. He is not at the level to manage at the top level. Pains me to say it, but its absolutely true.


I'll preface this (as it seems for some reason to be important what side of the fence we sit) by saying I am a LOI fan, love going to live games, regular at the Aviva for international games, yada yada....


The FAI have a body of work that needs to be completed in order to set Irish football on the right track for the next 20 years. They need to fight for every penny of funding they can to raise the standard of football in this country, they need to fight tooth and ****ing nail on this. THAT is their number 1 job. All this talk of implementing a passing style of football etc.. is absolute lip service, this requires a journey, implementing it with the senior team should be the destination, albeit the culmination of years of changing the culture at underage level.


Millions of euro need to be spent on infrastructure, stadia, training facilities, academies, the league in general, coaching etc... and only then will the work start in terms of us being on a level pegging with countries of similar size.


In terms of management of the men's senior international team, this is where some peoples interest in Irish football begins and ends. Sack Kenny and we are anti LOI, keep him on and he will drag us into the doldrums.


In my opinion, the deeper issues with our game need to be sorted, I'd have been happy to retain Kenny provided our seeding wasn't starting to slide, I do not expect him to qualify for major championships given our playing personnel (the worst in my lifetime), nor do I expect him to change the entire playing style/footballing philosophy of Irish football. Its unrealistic. But as soon as we start giving away 2-3 campaigns on the back of supposedly "developing the next generation" (baring in mind we reverted to Shane Duffy at CB and Jimmy McClean at LWB the other night) then we are in thin ground. Before we know it we will be 4th or 5th seeds for qualifying for these major tournaments.


The next managers remit should be to properly start to build a squad, whilst even if we don't qualify, we don't finish any lower than comfortably 3rd in our group. More importantly, is the development of a plan for Irish football for the next 20 years, that includes both public and private funding to drag our football philosophy and economy into the 21st century.

[tetsujin1979]

For all the progress that has been made under Kenny, introducing new players, trying a new style of play, etc, it's worth remembering that he ended his first game with a late headed equaliser from Shane Duffy, and he ended the qualifier against the Dutch with Duffy around the opposition penalty are, trying to nick something.

After three years in charge, you'd hope that he'd have come up with a plan for a late goal that wasn't "push the big man up front"

[mark12345]

For all the progress that has been made under Kenny, introducing new players, trying a new style of play, etc, it's worth remembering that he ended his first game with a late headed equaliser from Shane Duffy, and he ended the qualifier against the Dutch with Duffy around the opposition penalty are, trying to nick something.

After three years in charge, you'd hope that he'd have come up with a plan for a late goal that wasn't "push the big man up front"

Very good point. And that in essence shows that he really didn't improve the team at all.

[Stuttgart88]

Jeez, even the best teams lump it up to the big man late in the game if they're chasing a goal.

[Diggs246]

for all the Progress! when Stephen started we were 33rd in the world we are now 53rd
before Stephen we were competitive and proud, now unfortunately we are cannon fodder.
I know your not defending him over all, but progress is not the right word
He’s been a complete disaster.
I get it he’s a decent guy who has dedicated his life to Irish football and I get it that Martin O Neill is a Pr**k
But the pr**k got us to the 16 in the European Championships.
I would rather have a pr**k then a sweetheart. We are here to win

[ifk101]

He said Duffy went rogue at the end - i.e. he didn't push him up.


After three years in charge, you'd hope that he'd have come up with a plan for a late goal that wasn't "push the big man up front"

If it's deep into injury time and needing a goal, I think I'd put the big man up front.

[tetsujin1979]

I didn't mean that pushing Duffy up front was a bad idea, I meant that not having an alternative to it after three years in charge is bad.

[pineapple stu]

I think the bigger worry is how often it's happened. (Or how often we've been in a position where we've needed it to happen)

I've no particular problem with it in principal. But every other game gets a bit much.

[seanfhear]

For all the progress that has been made under Kenny, introducing new players, trying a new style of play, etc, it's worth remembering that he ended his first game with a late headed equaliser from Shane Duffy, and he ended the qualifier against the Dutch with Duffy around the opposition penalty are, trying to nick something.

After three years in charge, you'd hope that he'd have come up with a plan for a late goal that wasn't "push the big man up front"
In fairness ~ That was Johan Cruyff's policy in that situation according to Gary Lineker, when Lineker played for Cruyff at Barcelona ~ And if it's good enough for Johan Cruyff ! ! !

[ifk101]

I didn't mean that pushing Duffy up front was a bad idea, I meant that not having an alternative to it after three years in charge is bad.

What's the alternative?

For all Kenny's faults, our only way to score prior to his arrival was to push the big man up front.

[NeverFeltBetter]

I think the point isn't that it was a bad idea strictly in the context of those games, the point is that, taking a larger view, it's embarrassing that we have had to rely on an aging entre-back as a primary goal threat for such a lengthy period of time.
Edit: what Tets said

[elatedscum]

I think the point isn't that it was a bad idea strictly in the context of those games, the point is that, taking a larger view, it's embarrassing that we have had to rely on an aging entre-back as a primary goal threat for such a lengthy period of time.
Edit: what Tets said

he's pretty good at it in fairness.

also injuries to ferguson, obafemi, parrott, keane, robinson, johnston, o'dowda have to be factored into the equation.

they talked in previous camps about working extensively to get the most out of ferguson. parrott had, despite his club failings, build up good partnerships with both obafemi and idah. robinson scored key goals for ireland when fit. johnston looked really lively whenever he played. and o'dowda, for all his defensive failings provided pace and creativity from a LWB slot that we didn't get from Manning

when you lose than volume of viable options and attackers, you're tactical options take a huge hit

[third policeman]

One alternative would be not conceding as many goals, then pushing the big man up front might have been a recipe for getting a win or two.

[pineapple stu]

1701556582708822075

Benitez seems...ambitious I think

[joey B]

I thought Benitez was out of work,he’s managing in La Liga ffs,not a chance he’d come here…..

[backstothewall]

Isn't Kenny's agent a solicitor?

Quite possibly, but Kenny isn't.

Put it like this. If a journalist walked up to you now and started asking questions about the specifics of individual clauses in your terms and conditions of employment, how confident would you be about the precise accuracy of your answers?

[Jolly Red Giant]

Carsley is on a year-to-year rolling contract - so the FA couldn't really stop him leaving if he wanted to.

One person who shouldn't be ruled out is Chris Hughton - his contract with Ghana runs to the AFCON and that takes place in January. I suspect that he would put his name forward for the job.

[mark12345]

What's the alternative?

For all Kenny's faults, our only way to score prior to his arrival was to push the big man up front.

That's largely true. But Kenny was there to progress the thinking and playing style. Admirable on his part for sure but his noble effort at change has not worked.