Stephen Kenny

[youngirish]

I've obviously come from a LOI background and have been Kenny out for a long time (as have LOADS of others) but the weird, petulant, hysterical bile of your post is mind-blowing.

You're obviously hurting a great deal after last night and, maybe (hopefully), you were 'tired and emotional' writing that diatribe but to see a presumably grown man lashing out and blaming internet posters on an obscure website for the plight of the Irish football team would be hilarious if it wasn't so tragic.

I can't even comprehend the depth and quantity of wrong turns an adult would have to take in life to be so invested in their football team that a wave of hostility and fury follows a fairly predictable disappointment.

This is a barely average team with a markedly less than average manager. The true fans, not the borderline deranged making the unwise decision to live vicariously through Adam Idah's not quite 1-goal-in-9 career, should recognise that too and consider that, in addition to Kenny's limitations, this might be more of a contributary factor to our malaise than a handful of lads with an admitedly baffling loyalty to a manager who has largely been flailing since Day 1 and is listing ever more over time.

Another Kenny apologist blaming the team. A team no more inferior to the Mick McCarthy or Martin O'Neil ones that were at least in the running for qualification for tournaments. Your straw man argument that suggests Idah was his only choice so he cannot be blamed for him failing to perform clearly ignores the fact that he could have started with Obafemi instead. I'm guessing you knew beforehand we were going to be dominated by the Greeks in which case you should have stated this on here.

I like your attempt to paint my post as some reactionary, emotional post because I was devastated about the result. Its from page 1 of the 'How to Shut People Down Who You Don't Like What They Say but May Have a Point" handbook but nice try.

Anyway like your evaluation of Kenny you could not be further from the truth. I expected such a result so was not surprised in the slightest and if we are being honest here (try it) I'll admit that I actually wanted such a result but not for the reasons you will state. We need these types of result because if Kenny sneaks a 1:1 with Greece or a 1-0 against Gibraltar the fanboys (like you) latch onto that and use it as a reason to prop up this dead horse and keep it limping on an on repeat and rinse. We need this clown out now.

The real reason for my post is that I simply enjoy pointing out what has been obvious to me, as your intellectual superior, for a number of years now and this is that your naivety, fanaticism and utterly illogical devotion to Kenny (as can be seen when you are still trying to defend him above) was clearly going to lead us down a road to ruin. Now admit it, apologise and we can all move on.

[listowelceltic]

Young Irish are you ok

[dynamo kerry]

Youngirish, take a breath man. You've misread his post at the very least.

[zero]

I am really struggling to understand why SK retains such support. It baffles me. There were no positives from last night, no progress, no cohesion and from being at the game and watching the body language of the players at least half of them have given up on him.

This is the lowest ebb in memory and i find it insulting that people blame the players.

[D24Saint]

I am really struggling to understand why SK retains such support. It baffles me. There were no positives from last night, no progress, no cohesion and from being at the game and watching the body language of the players at least half of them have given up on him.

This is the lowest ebb in memory and i find it insulting that people blame the players.

Cant understand how anyone can back him anymore after that last night. The big question is where do we go from here. Everyone seems to know that he is on peanuts for being the international manger. I don't think a decent candidate would get out of bed for his salary.

[Diggs246]

I Heard off my Greek mate that Gus poyet in on 500k
If true
That's less then kenny

[joey B]

Poyet has been nowhere in management for years,but he was made look like Pep Guardiola last night,should tell you everything…..

[Diggs246]

True
But check out Croatia and the swedish Managers salaries

https://www.completesports.com/revealed-salaries-of-32-head-coaches-in-2022-fifa-world-cup/

[Eminence Grise]

YI, please take a minute. This is way over the top stuff. Nobody on this site has the right to state they're somebody's else intellectual superior. I know I can be be a bit condescending myself at times and the academic in me comes out more than i'd like it to, but that's crossing a line in basic common decency.

[Diggs246]

I'm not sure if this site is reliable

https://extra.ie/2023/06/17/sport/soccernews/stephen-kenny-fai-future

[sadloserkid]

Another Kenny apologist blaming the team. A team no more inferior to the Mick McCarthy or Martin O'Neil ones that were at least in the running for qualification for tournaments. Your straw man argument that suggests Idah was his only choice so he cannot be blamed for him failing to perform clearly ignores the fact that he could have started with Obafemi instead. I'm guessing you knew beforehand we were going to be dominated by the Greeks in which case you should have stated this on here.

I like your attempt to paint my post as some reactionary, emotional post because I was devastated about the result. Its from page 1 of the 'How to Shut People Down Who You Don't Like What They Say but May Have a Point" handbook but nice try.

Anyway like your evaluation of Kenny you could not be further from the truth. I expected such a result so was not surprised in the slightest and if we are being honest here (try it) I'll admit that I actually wanted such a result but not for the reasons you will state. We need these types of result because if Kenny sneaks a 1:1 with Greece or a 1-0 against Gibraltar the fanboys (like you) latch onto that and use it as a reason to prop up this dead horse and keep it limping on an on repeat and rinse. We need this clown out now.

The real reason for my post is that I simply enjoy pointing out what has been obvious to me, as your intellectual superior, for a number of years now and this is that your naivety, fanaticism and utterly illogical devotion to Kenny (as can be seen when you are still trying to defend him above) was clearly going to lead us down a road to ruin. Now admit it, apologise and we can all move on.

We're on the same side re: Kenny. I've never thought he was good enough and have wanted him removed since Luxembourg. Your inability to understand that, even after my last post, makes any suggestion of you being intellectually superior to a stale scone, let alone a sentient human being, beyond laughable.

I don't think I can make it any simpler than this for you (though, thankfully, dynamo kerry got the gist of what I posted).

I agree with you that Stephen Kenny is a poor manager at this level. I have held this view for a very long time. A more recent view I hold, based on your last few posts, is that's you're dangerously invested in this if the scale of your tantrum is anything to go by. You're ranting incoherantly and seemingly struggling to understand such difficult sentences in my last post as "I... have been Kenny Out for a long time".

Again, I don't know what else is lacking in your life that a bad international football result can unhinge you so much but, hopefully, Kenny will be gone soon and then you can start getting the help you need.

[TonyD]

One of the worst parts about all this is the cnuts who almost celebrate us losing just so they can say they were right on the internet

Can’t thank this enough.

[tetsujin1979]

youngirish, reel it in.

[SkStu]

Frank Lampard is available at the moment. We’ll need to act fast.

[Olander]

The real reason for my post is that I simply enjoy pointing out what has been obvious to me, as your intellectual superior, for a number of years now and this is that your naivety, fanaticism and utterly illogical devotion to Kenny (as can be seen when you are still trying to defend him above) was clearly going to lead us down a road to ruin. Now admit it, apologise and we can all move on.Is everything alright at home?

[JR89]

I'm not sure if this site is reliable

https://extra.ie/2023/06/17/sport/soccernews/stephen-kenny-fai-future

Might be mixing him up with someone else but I'm sure Philip Quinn is good buddies with Mick and has been negative from day one since Kenny took the job from Mick. So would take anything he says with a pinch of salt.

[Snapshot]

One of the worst parts about all this is the cnuts who almost celebrate us losing just so they can say they were right on the internet
Such a comment is always a reflection of the person making it.

[Snapshot]

Might be mixing him up with someone else but I'm sure Philip Quinn is good buddies with Mick and has been negative from day one since Kenny took the job from Mick. So would take anything he says with a pinch of salt.
Quite the opposite - he's been proven right.

[Calcio Jack]

YI, please take a minute. This is way over the top stuff. Nobody on this site has the right to state they're somebody's else intellectual superior. I know I can be be a bit condescending myself at times and the academic in me comes out more than i'd like it to, but that's crossing a line in basic common decency.

I second the the above

[Crosby87]

Houghton 6/1
Duff 7/1
Andrews 9/1
Lennon 10/1
Roy Keane 10/1
Michael O'Neill 15/1
Allardyce 17/1
Jim Crawford 23/1
Phil Neville 26/1
Jose Mourinho 26/1
Southgate 26/1
Given 26/1

[SkStu]

Houghton 6/1
Duff 7/1
Andrews 9/1
Lennon 10/1
Roy Keane 10/1
Michael O'Neill 15/1
Allardyce 17/1
Jim Crawford 23/1
Phil Neville 26/1
Jose Mourinho 26/1
Southgate 26/1
Given 26/1

Wow - I didn’t think I could get any more depressed!

[Eminence Grise]

Houghton 6/1
Never managed, never will.

Duff 7/1
Come back to me in five years. Like Chairman Mao, asked if the French student protests in ’68 had achieved their goal, it’s too soon to know.

Andrews 9/1
Unproven, likeable sort – but in the Houghton category?

Lennon 10/1
Well, a downward trajectory since first stint at Celtic so an international gig might interest. Not the worst, I suppose.

Roy Keane 10/1
And who said bookies don’t have a sense of humour?

Michael O'Neill 15/1
The only reason to appoint him would be to see the reaction among the OWC fundamentalists.

Allardyce 17/1
Comment is superfluous (https://www.theguardian.com/science/2023/jun/16/isle-of-wight-fossilised-remains-identified-as-new-dinosaur-species)

Jim Crawford 23/1
Nope, the U21s have gone backward since Kenny left.

Phil Neville 26/1
So bad his mate had to sack him…

Jose Mourinho 26/1
An unspeakably loathsome human being. Next role as likely to be a Dementor in Azkaban as a manager.

Southgate 26/1
If we can’t even poach an uncapped Englishman (hello, Tom Cannon) what chance have we with an Officer of the Most Excellent Order of the British Empire? Maybe Louis Copeland could do a deal on snazzy tricolour waistcoats?

Given 26/1
Hardly Don or Shay? Must be up, at this stage…

[pineapple stu]

Houghton 6/1
Never managed, never will.

Houghton should be Hughton I guess

[Eminence Grise]

Maybe. Razor tends to pop up all the time on these lists, and CH is working with Ghana. I like Hughton, but I think he's another old hand on the downward spiral and possibly a little bit conservtive.

[placid casual]

Get Brendan Rodgers before he goes back to glasgow.

[EalingGreen]

Duff 7/1
Come back to me in five years. Like Chairman Mao, asked if the French student protests in ’68 had achieved their goal, it’s too soon to know.
Actually it was Zhou Enlai:
https://professorbuzzkill.com/qnq-26-zhou-enlai/



Lennon 10/1
Well, a downward trajectory since first stint at Celtic so an international gig might interest. Not the worst, I suppose.
Would likely do a good repair job after SK, but not really up to taking the team to the next level or two?



Michael O'Neill 15/1
The only reason to appoint him would be to see the reaction among the OWC fundamentalists.
Aside from the fact you would have ZERO chance of attracting Michael, I would remind you that "the OWC fundamentalists" [sic] had no problem with Martin O'Neill managing your team, or Bryan Hamilton assisting the FAI previously, with both still very popular in NI.

Hell, we even gave you George Hamilton, without anyone giving a stuff! :)

[Eminence Grise]

I was optimistic about Kenny at the start: he had achieved a lot with limited LoI teams and seemed to have the man management skills to make players believe they were collectively better than the sum of their parts: he had enough good results against better teams to look like it was systematic and calculated.

I alway felt angry over Trappatoni’s dismissiveness of our players. When a coach of his stature says his players are rubbish, people believe him, and when his fanaticism for the system prevented them from playing the football they could, he made his condescension come true: if you tell players often enough that they’re inferior, they become inferior. Arguably, his style of play makes the qualification he achieved feel like an underachievement.

Reasons for optimism (1): Kenny doesn’t disparage his players individually or collectively, and he doesn’t instinctively dismiss flair players.

Martin O’Neill felt like a good change – some new thinking, more positive play, not a delivery on hope, but enough to keep you hoping. Behind the scenes issues, a lack of coaching, the tender compassion of Roy Keane, and a gradual decline towards the Trappatoni dross overshadowed the initial good work.

Reasons for optimism (2): Kenny assembled a coaching team that was less combative and old school, and more in tune with the current player.

Mick McCarthy, revered though he is in this house, never felt like the second coming: he’d been exposed as tactically outdated and inflexible in recent years (and subsequently) and though many were glad to see him in the role, they weren’t sorry to see him go. Some of the animosity towards Kenny has to be blamed on John Delaney: Captain Fantastic got shafted by an undeserving usurper has been a common narrative.

Reasons for optimism (3): a younger coach with Europa League group stage experience, Kenny was fresher and exposed to modern, continental styles of play.

None of Kenny’s predecessors seemed enthusiastic about capping young players and retained players who should have been phased out sooner. Young players in Premier clubs’ U23s were overlooked in favour of late bloomers down the divisions. If you’re not playing Championship-level football till your late twenties, you’re unlikely to be more than an international stopgap.

Reasons for optimism (4): Kenny had the skinny on the U21s and would oversee the transition to the senior team.

So what’s been good in all this time?


A manage refusing to believe that highly-paid professionals can’t pass a ball, hold their shape and play a attractive brand of football – and by and large sticking to this.
No more insulting players and Irish football by talking everyone down.
A lot of young players in the squad – some look to be very good prospects and if not a golden generation, maybe a gold-plated one.


On the flip side:


Blind loyalty: James McClean will win 100 caps for Ireland on Monday. That’s symptomatic of where we are. Ten of those caps would have been better invested in developing a viable alternative. Hourihane, 36 caps: a player of proven ability, but we've known for the last 25 it’s not international ability.
Formation: are we any closer to knowing what suits us best? 532, 352, an amorphous blob? And what formation prevents teams scoring regularly from 30 yards?
In-game decision-making: I’m not blaming Kenny solely for this. He has his coaches, and either they’re not right for the job, or he’s slow to react, but issues take too long to fix – subs are too late, tactical tweaks are too late.


To top it all off:


Results. After a while, and allowances for the mess Delaney left, you have to win: you have to beat teams worse than you, slug it out with ones near you, and give a good account against the best. Is anyone confident we can do one of those things? I’m not confident of a win on Monday. I think we’ll just outscore Gibraltar, but will it be a win?


So, for me, it’s case of time up. Much was promised, even more was hoped for, but the few small positives are outweighed by the accumulated despair and drift.

[brine3]

Best competitive away wins since Scotland in 1987. At the time that was our best away win ever in qualifying. So those are our three best away wins in our whole history.

You could argue we won in Paris over the 90 minutes in 2009.

[ifk101]

We have been good under Kenny but it coincided with Barry and Eustace having time to put their stamp on the team. Based on last night’s evidence, John O’Shea isn’t a Barry or a Eustace. Talk all week from Kenny about “a big performance” – preparation and team selection suggested as such, and then nothing. Better to make the change now and build again as this qualification campaign is effectively over.

Not liking that list of replacement names posted earlier – would prefer somebody younger with fresh ideas, thinking McKenna at Ipswich but he’s probably out of reach.

[youngirish]

We're on the same side re: Kenny. I've never thought he was good enough and have wanted him removed since Luxembourg. Your inability to understand that, even after my last post, makes any suggestion of you being intellectually superior to a stale scone, let alone a sentient human being, beyond laughable.

But we are not on the same side. Just because you state something does not make it true.

It has been obvious to me from very early into his reign that Kenny lacked the talent, ability and experience to lead the team anywhere but into the abyss. On the flip side you have given a number of fairly complementary assessments of him on here long past the Luxembourg game. I remember one in particular after the Belgium friendly. Don't be so disingenuous to admit that you have been on my side all along now that the ship has been confirmed to be dead in the water and is sinking below the waves.

[tetsujin1979]

youngirish, you should post that assessment from after the Belgium game

[ontheotherhand]

Pretty tired of this nonsensical idea of the LoI Kenny zealot. He's not still in the job because LoI supporters are going to Ireland games and supporting him. Half the posters who have supported him here are never seen on the LoI side of this forum but some of the critics are. Rovers people hate him for the most part and would have been dead set against the appointment. There is no unified LoI opinion on the man. There's very little unified opinion on anything in the LoI outside of the ****e refereeing.

Anybody here would have been delighted if Michael O'Neill took over us instead of N.Ireland and did a similar job for us.

[Scrufil]

A couple of observations. 1. This thundery weather in Ireland wreaks havoc with some people's moods, and I was fierce disappointed by last night's result, maybe more so than normal, so I can feel YI's pain.
2. Ireland players seem to have poorer physical prowess than other teams. Why is this? We have the builds for Rugby and GAA, why is football the poor cousin?
2b. I always thought Kenny's backroom team was a shambles. They must also shoulder the blame, and if Kenny goes they should go too.

[samhaydenjr]

Houghton 6/1
Duff 7/1
Andrews 9/1
Lennon 10/1
Roy Keane 10/1
Michael O'Neill 15/1
Allardyce 17/1
Jim Crawford 23/1
Phil Neville 26/1
Jose Mourinho 26/1
Southgate 26/1
Given 26/1

I hear that American coach, Lasso, is free now.

[Colbert Report]

We have a pub league manager. I'm almost hoping we lose on Monday so we can remove any doubt about sacking him.

[texidub]

Kenny hasn't done great, that's obvious, and is likely on the way out now, but I don't get lambasting managers/players in the international team - win or lose, they represent the country, warts and all. There's a degree of harshness that feels like the worst of the English club football mentality transposed onto the international arena. We can't go out and buy top players or a youth structure, and the international team is a reflection of a whole lot more than the manager.. who might be out of his depth somewhat, but definitely doesn't deserve some of the stuff said about him in the past few days, IMO.

[Bungle]

We are in a funny position right now. We evidently have very talented lads coming through and look like in 2-5 years, we could be very decent. However, our quality aged 25+ is very mediocre. This would impact managers being interested in the role, in a good way and a bad. The medium to long term looks positive so a manager open to two or three campaigns will feel confident of success.

International football is a funny one - outside of the elite countries, very few top managers at the peak of their powers is that interested in it. I mean I could see Ancelloti managing Italy at some point, or Klopp managing Germany, but no chance they would right now.

Kenny clearly isn’t up to it and never will be. The goals we concede show we are badly coached. The players should shoulder a lot of blame too. He makes out he is the light of positive football yet the performance against Greece wasn’t much better than the darkest days of O’Neills reign of horror football.

We seem to be in with a shout of a playoff. Let’s get someone in who might win that, with a view to getting us ready for a tilt at qualifying for a World Cup. At the very least someone who can maximise the talent coming through.

[osarusan]

I'm getting pretty tired of the stupid false binary arguments you see on social media. Arguments by people who either know their argument is bullsh!t, or are too thick to see that it's bullsh!t.

"Oh so you want to go back to the days of Trap hoofing it up the pitch?"

"Oh so you think there's a manager who's going to turn us into world-beaters?"


No, I dont want the first, or think the second.

I want somebody who can do a better job at what Kenny's trying to do.

I think the current options available to Kenny are pretty poor, but I also think he's doing a pretty poor job of getting the most out of those resources. No, we're not world beaters, but neither should we be failing to beat Luxembourg, Azerbaijan and Qatar.

From reading the discussion on this forum, which I would say is, on balance, one of the more patient with/loyal to Kenny, it seems like that patience has finally run out for most, if not almost all.

[Snapshot]

https://www.irishtimes.com/sport/soccer/2023/06/17/gus-poyet-unsparing-in-assessment-of-ireland-after-greece-win-tactical-battle/

Gus Poyet in today's Irish Times exposes Stephen Kenny's tactical naivety. It shouldn't be that easy.

[Diggs246]

Hes mates with John o shea
The conspiracy theorist in me. Is starting to wonder now. Is O shea looking for kennys job

[tetsujin1979]

Reel it in youngish. There won't be another warning.

[youngirish]

Reel it in youngish. There won't be another warning.

You asked for the quote and I gave it to you. So what's your problem? Maybe this gives you a feeling of power you don't get elsewhere. Suspend or disable the account if you want, I couldn't care less.

[tetsujin1979]

You asked for the quote and I gave it to you. So what's your problem? Maybe this gives you a feeling of power you don't get elsewhere. Suspend or disable the account if you want, I couldn't care less.
The last line from the post I had to delete was completely unacceptable. This isn't 4chan

[TonyD]

We have a pub league manager. I'm almost hoping we lose on Monday so we can remove any doubt about sacking him.

“pub league.” You can f##k right off with that attitude.

[dynamo kerry]

I think it's fair to say Kenny has had a fair chance. He has given us very little to be pleased about in results, lots of blooding goung fellas and lots of disappointment.

On balance it hasn't been good enough and despite what others may say about the quality of the players, it is clear that they have no resilience or consistency and management of a team requires these.

It's time to move on. The FAI have sacked people for less(brian kerr, eoin hand). He has had a fair chance.

[SkStu]

It’s so difficult to reconcile Doherty’s comments with what is playing out right in front of our eyes.

https://www.irishtimes.com/sport/soccer/2023/06/17/matt-doherty-backs-under-fire-stephen-kenny-following-republic-of-ireland-defeat-to-greece/

[ontheotherhand]

It’s so difficult to reconcile Doherty’s comments with what is playing out right in front of our eyes.

https://www.irishtimes.com/sport/soccer/2023/06/17/matt-doherty-backs-under-fire-stephen-kenny-following-republic-of-ireland-defeat-to-greece/

Doherty having a good relationship with the national team manager is probably more of a warning sign that anything else given his history....?

[SkStu]

Maybe (bit harsh on Doherty though, no?)... it does seem to be a fairly consistent theme though from the players in the past where they have regularly spoken about how exceptional the preparation and game planning has been. I'm not defending Kenny (I feel obliged to clarify that given some of the stupid stuff on here the last 48 hours), I just find it really strange... I mean, all this excellent prep and planning... is Kenny simply overestimating the ability of his players to pull off the type of game and tactics he wants to see?

[Diggs246]

Maybe (bit harsh on Doherty though, no?)... it does seem to be a fairly consistent theme though from the players in the past where they have regularly spoken about how exceptional the preparation and game planning has been. I'm not defending Kenny (I feel obliged to clarify that given some of the stupid stuff on here the last 48 hours), I just find it really strange... I mean, all this excellent prep and planning... is Kenny simply overestimating the ability of his players to pull off the type of game and tactics he wants to see?

These players being interviewed are being picked by Kenny and playing ask manning or long and they will go too far the other way with criticism
Players bring interviewed about their current managers in ridiculous imo they are completely compromised one way or the other

Stephen Kenny isn't a good international manager is he?
4 wins out of 23, with numerous defeats to very poor teams. We have never had one run for our money in any of his groups we are gone after two games everytime.

[pineapple stu]

Weren't there similar comments by players in the media around the end of the Stan reign?