Bohs in financial trouble - FAI Licencing called into question again?

[Jicked]

A manager's job is to generate on-pitch success. That's how they get measured/rewarded. As part of that, they'll obviously want the best players at their disposal.

It's not a football manager's job to be aquainted with the financial minutae of his club, unles of course the Board make a point of ensuring that he is. It's the Board that provide a budget for signings, salaries etc, so the buck starts and stop with them on spenidng decisions.

So Manager's aren't to blame if a club overspends. The worst they can be accused of is being too persuasive for their Board. Board's are to blame.

I'm always amazed at this line of thinking. Personally, I feel a manager should act as a link between board and the first team, and not be so short sighted as to just demand every single penny possible for players. It's ridiculous to think that a manager just says "I want that one" and leaves the rest to the board. Fenlon (or whoever at whatever club) should work with the board and see if that's a good deal for the club in terms of the length and cost of the deal. Fenlon would undoubtedly have had better on field success over a longer period of time if he sat down and instead of picking the first 5/6 players available on a free transfer, spent longer working on the minutae of the details, and the club's ability to pay them over a longer period of time.

At Shamrock Rovers, MON at both AGMs has made it clear that he can't get his head around the finances involved in the league. He's said how he's turned down player's ridiculous offers, including losing out on players to Bohemians and others in this off-season. His outlook has been towards getting young players on reasonable contracts, and at Rovers we now have a good, affordable, young squad.

At this season's AGM MON gave examples of the type of demands he's rejected from players. His reasoning was that if players would rather sign for Bohs (who everyone knew were in financialy precarious long-term position) for the sake of a few extra euro cash in hand, then they wouldn't be the type of player likely to have the hunger and drive needed to succeed over the long-term. Looking at how Rovers battled and worked in Israel, Italy and to overcome a bad league start, compared with how Bohs seemed to have thrown in the towel, I think MON might be the start of a new breed of more prudent managers. Hopefully so anyway.

[Lim till i die]

All hail St. MON, All HAIL ST. MON :rolleyes:

[Jicked]

So it's not a better approach to take? Y'know, someone actually being financial responsible and looking at something long-term for once with this league. It's not just MON, I obviously just know him better. Mahon seems to be another willing to deal with reality, and of course Russell at UCD I'd presume.

[Lim till i die]

Is young hungry Dan Murray playing for free??

What about young, hungry Keith Gillespie that was on trial the other day??

To suggest that MON is somehow the "start of a new breed of more prudent manager" because he spends less than Nutsy Fenlon is sanctimonious nonsense. The vast majority of managers in thie league operate to very tight budgets and in a lot of cases have been doing so for years.

Lets not over egg the pudding. ;)

[pineapple stu]

If Fenlon's given a budget and says "No - that'll bankrupt the club, I insist you cut the budget by E10k a month", the board will say "Right, you're sacked; we'll get in some other numpty"

[peadar1987]

I doubt Pat Fenlon was aware of the financial situation at the club, at least, not how bad it was. He's not a professional accountant, he probably hasn't been through the accounts with a fine-tooth comb, I reckon the board told him how much money was available for transfers and wages, and he made the not completely unreasonable assumption that spending that money wouldn't drive the club into the ground.

[pineapple stu]

I doubt Pat Fenlon was aware of the financial situation at the club, at least, not how bad it was. He's not a professional accountant, he probably hasn't been through the accounts with a fine-tooth comb,
I wouldn't say he was that unaware though. It doesn't really take an accounting genius to realise that losses of E1m+ are bad.

[dcfcsteve]

It is however, Steve, surely no co-incidence that Fenlon's success would appear to leave a trail of devastation in it's wake. Perhaps you are right, perhaps any club that is fool enough to employ him gets what it deserves for generating a culture of infalted fees and wages, but I don't think the manager can be totally exonerated if his purchases and recommendations to often inexperienced boards results in financial difficulty for the club, as evidenced by the way in which he chewed up and spat out the muppets who were running our club.

If Board's are stupid enough to agree to signings they can't afford, how is Fenlon the one to blame for asking for the players ? It's not hus joib to check his ambitions and 'guess' what the cliub can afford, is it ?

It's probably a vicious circle with Fenlon. He will only be attracted to club's with a serious chance of silverware, and the oinly clubs likely to meet his own salary demands likewise expect success in return as well. He will therefore walk into an environment of expectation anywhere he goes. If that expectation leads to Boards being foolish enough to give him money they can't afford, then that's theire issue - not his.

It would be akin to blaming young kids for being spoiled, rather than the parents who just keep lavishing them unchecked.

[dcfcsteve]

I'm always amazed at this line of thinking. Personally, I feel a manager should act as a link between board and the first team, and not be so short sighted as to just demand every single penny possible for players. It's ridiculous to think that a manager just says "I want that one" and leaves the rest to the board. Fenlon (or whoever at whatever club) should work with the board and see if that's a good deal for the club in terms of the length and cost of the deal. Fenlon would undoubtedly have had better on field success over a longer period of time if he sat down and instead of picking the first 5/6 players available on a free transfer, spent longer working on the minutae of the details, and the club's ability to pay them over a longer period of time.

At Shamrock Rovers, MON at both AGMs has made it clear that he can't get his head around the finances involved in the league. He's said how he's turned down player's ridiculous offers, including losing out on players to Bohemians and others in this off-season. His outlook has been towards getting young players on reasonable contracts, and at Rovers we now have a good, affordable, young squad.

At this season's AGM MON gave examples of the type of demands he's rejected from players. His reasoning was that if players would rather sign for Bohs (who everyone knew were in financialy precarious long-term position) for the sake of a few extra euro cash in hand, then they wouldn't be the type of player likely to have the hunger and drive needed to succeed over the long-term. Looking at how Rovers battled and worked in Israel, Italy and to overcome a bad league start, compared with how Bohs seemed to have thrown in the towel, I think MON might be the start of a new breed of more prudent managers. Hopefully so anyway.

So effectively you're asking for managers to be treated almost like a Board member ?! Guaranteed to terrify the ballax off of every other Board member the day that that ever happened ! :D

What you've written above just reinforces the point that it is Board's that are in control. Managers are there for their football knowledge, not their financial acumen. As you've stated above, the manager of the team at the top of the league hasn't a scooby about finances. What seems to have happened at Rovers is that the Board has left him in no doubt as to what finances are and aren't available to him. That doesn't seem to have happened with regards Fenlon. Either that or they told him he could spend way more than they could afford, or he chanced his arm by asking for more than he was told was available and they yielded. Regardless of which of those scenarios is factually correct, they all have one thing in common. It's that the Board is the only body that makes the money decisions, has the full financial picture at its disposal, and therefore is ultimately responsible.

[mrtndvn]

Fenlon can't be blamed for the budget handed to him at bohs, the only question that can be put to him, is did bohs get value for money for the budget that was handed to him?

[dcfcsteve]

If Fenlon's given a budget and says "No - that'll bankrupt the club, I insist you cut the budget by E10k a month", the board will say "Right, you're sacked; we'll get in some other numpty"

Or more likely - given that he's judged on on-pitch performances (not the club's financial performance), and given the clear correlation between money and success in football, he'd just smile, take the money and go shopping.

If people want football managers to develop some sort of financial awareness/concern/acumen, then make it one of the criteria on which they're judged/rewarded. Hey presto - instant fiscal probity from footballing people.

[dcfcsteve]

You'd probably be right. But the question we're addressing is who's responsible. And when it comes to financial decisions the buck must always stop with the Board.

[Mr A]

While I agree with what you're saying Steve, it should also be remembered that a manager can generally get a club into serious bother quicker than anyone else. If a club backs a manager who then seriously under performs (i.e. finishes well below where the budget would/should place him) then any club will struggle. There will always be an element of gambling to football- and slashing the budget can in some cases make things worse by seeing revenues drop more than the outgoings do.

That does not justify the madness that occurred at many clubs including Harps. Football may always be a gamble, but LOI clubs tend to put the mortgage on the first horsey that catches their eye. The only clubs that don't really have to gamble are those with income significantly higher than the clubs around them- but even there an exceptionally bad period on the pitch will hurt them.

[Mr A]

The PFAI express concern (http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/sport/2010/0819/1224277147806.html) at the goings on at Dalymount. Mr McGuinness does not seem to realise that (relative) on field success != income.

There's slightly more in the Indo. (http://www.independent.ie/sport/soccer/league-of-ireland/bohs-face-fight-for-livelihoods-2302919.html)

[gufct]

The Sun and Star today have just one page on the LOI and in both cases its all about Bohs.Im sick of reading about them to be honest there are a lot of good news story and after Monaghan's great win they should have got some decent coverage as also should Sligo.

There are a majority of clubs in the country experiencing severe financial troubles but Bohs are the only show in town.

[Dodge]

There are a majority of clubs in the country experiencing severe financial troubles but Bohs are the only show in town.

The majority of the clubs in the country aren't the champions, and I'd bet that their combined debts don't amount to Bohs.

Its hardly a shock that the bigger clubs get more press, is it?

[dcfcsteve]

While I agree with what you're saying Steve, it should also be remembered that a manager can generally get a club into serious bother quicker than anyone else. If a club backs a manager who then seriously under performs (i.e. finishes well below where the budget would/should place him) then any club will struggle. There will always be an element of gambling to football- and slashing the budget can in some cases make things worse by seeing revenues drop more than the outgoings do.

There's two elements to what you've said there. The first is about a manager not delivering the results expected, which they're paid to do. So it would be perfectly right to blame them for that.

But your second bit then directly links expected on-picth performances to budgets, which again is something a Board itself is the one who decides to do (or not do so, as would be more appropriate). So the manager can't be blamed for that.

It would be like a gambler blaming a horse for him losing money he couldn't afford to lose. The real responsibility rests with the idot who was spunking money he didn't have on horses. It's easy to see whay clubs bank on a certain level of performance etc, but given the wide variety of variables in the game of football - particularly in a financially poor league like ours - then any Board who banks on success that is never guaranteed shouldn't look beyond themselves for the blame.

[Mr A]

Sorry- should have made it clear that the bit about football being a gamble wasn't really about managers any more, just making the point that a club could make fairly reasonable projections and still find themselves in trouble if they fall apart on the field or if other revenues collapse for some reason.

I guess the ideal would be for everyone to budget for their season being a total washout, but while other clubs are not doing so the one that does may be damaging themselves more than if they had not. Until licensing/the SCP becomes more effective and guarantees a fairly even level of budgeting across clubs we will not reached the promised land- and even when we do there will still be the odd exceptional case.

Not that any of that for a second justifies the madness in the league in recent years, or moves a significant amount of the blame on to managers. Boards will always have ultimate responsibility for the well-being of their clubs.

[sullanefc]

The Sun and Star today have just one page on the LOI and in both cases its all about Bohs.Im sick of reading about them to be honest there are a lot of good news story and after Monaghan's great win they should have got some decent coverage as also should Sligo.

Well said. Last night, 2 sides not favoured to reach the final did. That is a story in itself. Also, Monaghan reached their first ever final. There should be a full page spread on that alone. Give the county a lift. Build it up. But no, the media always focus on negative stories in the LOI.



I guess the ideal would be for everyone to budget for their season being a total washout,
All clubs should budget for this scenario. Prize money is a bonus, and should either go towards, off-field stuff, or else go in to the following years budget.

[John83]

All clubs should budget for this scenario. Prize money is a bonus, and should either go towards, off-field stuff, or else go in to the following years budget.
Except that gate income and even fundraising will be negatively hit by an unexpectedly terrible season.

[sullanefc]

Except that gate income and even fundraising will be negatively hit by an unexpectedly terrible season.
I firmly believe that clubs should budget on a modest percentage of the previous years turnover. If you have a good season, followed by a bad season, then budgets should be slashed for the following season. To compensate for the shortfall.

This business of "we think we can win the league, so that's what we will budget for" is madness.

[John83]

What Mr A is talking about is this: say you finished 4th in the league last year, so this year you set your expenditure to finish 7th. Low and behold, your slashed wage bill and weakened team finishes 9th (maybe the manager is to blame, maybe you just had a bit of bad luck), your crowds have halved and your carefully conservative budget is in ruins. Something like this effect turned Harps' troubles into a crisis a couple of years ago.

This is what happens when all of the clubs are competing in such a cut-throat manner. This is why licensing being of marginal effectiveness is such a problem for the league.

[sullanefc]

Yeah, get what you are saying John83, I think in this scenario that clubs should be working harder to get punters in the gate. Depending on results to draw crowds is not enough. Then again, you could argue that we are a nation of glory hunters.

[Lim till i die]

Well said. Last night, 2 sides not favoured to reach the final did. That is a story in itself. Also, Monaghan reached their first ever final. There should be a full page spread on that alone. Give the county a lift. Build it up. But no, the media always focus on negative stories in the LOI.

This is the equivalent of saying Doncasters good start to The Championship season should get more coverage in Britain than Liverpools financial problems.

It's not the job of the national media to give anyone a lift.

[PartySaint]

This is the equivalent of saying Doncasters good start to The Championship season should get more coverage in Britain than Liverpools financial problems.

It's not the job of the national media to give anyone a lift.

Not really, Its the equivalent of Doncaster getting to the league cup final

[Lim till i die]

Not really, Its the equivalent of Doncaster getting to the league cup final

And Liverpool would still get 6500 times the media coverage in England.

This is all assuming of course that the Nintendo Trophy here has the same amount of public interest in it as the League Cup has in England.

Which it doesn't.

[de bowez]

Not really, Its the equivalent of Doncaster getting to the league cup final

Wexford and Waterford have both made the league cup final in recent years, its rated slightly above the LSC by most clubs.

[sullanefc]

This is the equivalent of saying Doncasters good start to The Championship season should get more coverage in Britain than Liverpools financial problems.

It's not the job of the national media to give anyone a lift.
If the sport was GAA then it would be a completely different story. They'd concentrate on the on-field stuff before the off-field stuff.

[Lim till i die]

If the sport was GAA then it would be a completely different story. They'd concentrate on the on-field stuff before the off-field stuff.

Sigh.

The Media concentrate on what the public are interested in.

The reason you will hear more about say the Dublin footballers good run than you will about say some ref being put into the boot of a car in South Armagh isn't because of some pro GAA, anti League of Ireland conspiracy, it's because the Dubs are the bigger story.

[Dunny]

BOHEMIANS' players are playing for their livelihoods between now and the end of the season and are now under 'massive pressure' to win the league, according to PFAI chief Stephen McGuinness.

The players' union general secretary yesterday stated his belief that professional football at the Phibsboro-based club now hinges on whether or not they win the league, and maybe even the FAI Cup, this season.

"I think a lot is hinging on winning the league, that's my own opinion. I think everything is based on winning the league and possibly winning the cup as well, so there's a lot of pressure," said McGuinness.

"I think it's showing in their performances now, they now know that if they don't win the league this year that they probably will have to go part-time, and the contracts that they currently have -- the club's going to come and look to renegotiate. That's a massive pressure -- not only have you got the pressure of trying to win football games and the crowd being on your case, you've got your livelihood on the line too."

McGuinness also revealed he has received assurances from the FAI that financially stricken Bohs had budgeted for 2010 based on the possibility of finishing in mid-table in the league and failing to progress in the Champions League.

The club are currently sitting just five points off the top of the Premier Division table and yet are still hitting huge financial barriers -- although the imminent sale of youngster Matt Doherty to Wolves has added a timely boost to the club's coffers.

But former Shamrock Rovers player McGuinness admitted he is surprised that problems have arisen now.

"I spoke to the FAI in relation to Bohemians and we were told categorically that Bohs' budget was based on them finishing below mid-table and being knocked out of Europe so I can't see now why, all of a sudden, they have an issue with regard to paying wages when their budget was approved on the basis of doing worse than how they're currently doing," he said.

"We all know that they've been mortgaging on the ground for a long, long time and maybe the debts they had are now coming back to haunt them."

- Neil Ahern

Irish Independent

apologies if already posted.

[marinobohs]

apologies if already posted.

Mc Guinness obviously missed the news flash about 400,000 plus unemployed, diminishing returns from just about any finance stream and the worst recession to hit ireland in at least 20 years.
Everytime you think that clown has hit rock bottom............ surely the worst reprezentative the players could have ?

PS this is not to mitigate in any way Bohs self inflicted financial difficulties.

[Ezeikial]

PS this is not to mitigate in any way Bohs self inflicted financial difficulties.

A Damascan conversion if ever there was one!

Accpeting reality is welcome even if very belated

If Bohs somehow win the league and escape short term finanical meltdown or SCP sanctions will you turn back again to your earlier lines of mitigation?

[micls]

Mc Guinness obviously missed the news flash about 400,000 plus unemployed, diminishing returns from just about any finance stream and the worst recession to hit ireland in at least 20 years.
Everytime you think that clown has hit rock bottom............ surely the worst reprezentative the players could have ?

PS this is not to mitigate in any way Bohs self inflicted financial difficulties.

You say that as if there was no recession before the budgets went in in February. Come off it!.

If the bohs board weren't even able to see that this would be a tough year in Ireland then theyre more clueless than I alright thought they were, and that would be difficult.

[Mr A]

The following is robbed from the Bohs forum and appeared in the Mail On Sunday. It doesn't seem to be online anywhere else, so I'll post it in full:


Bohs in bother but League must take share of blame
Gypsies enter most critical stage in their history so far
By Mark Gallagher

NEXT MONTH, as part of the Phibsboro Arts Festival, there is a special evening organised for the Phoenix Bar at Dalymount Park entitled Bohemians at the Heart of Phibsboro.

It will chronicle the history of the club from its founding meeting in 1890 to the present day.

The next few weeks, though, are likely to be the most critical in the long and proud history of Bohemians football club. A shortfall in commercial income and cashflow problems mean the club needs €400,000 simply to survive until the end of the season.

Doubts expressed, most loudly by PFAI chief Stephen McGuinness, over their ability to pay players' wages in the past week have been allayed somewhat by the impending sale of teenage defender Matt Doherty to Wolverhampton Wanderers and receipt of the next instalment of Gary Deegan's €150,000 transfer fee from Coventry City.

In that rarest of League of Ireland seasons, where there has been no issue with unpaid wages (Galway United players agreed to a deferral last month), the FAI have to deal with one of the biggest crises since they took control of the league with the most successful club of recent times falling on hard times.

There were warning signs, though, and all too frequently reported on these pages. Only two years ago, Bohemians posted losses of €1.3million.

Nevertheless, they went ahead and secured a €4million loan from Zurich Bank, repayments of which now affect their cashflow. One highprofile member (writer and activist Michael Nugent) was so perturbed by the club's spending practices in 2008 that he called for an Emergency General Meeting. But little changed.

Bohs were dogged with rumours that they were skirting around the 65 per cent Salary Cost Protocol last season, something borne out by the fact the FAI imposed a transfer embargo on the club.

Despite walking a financial tightrope, though, the two-time champions bolstered their squad with seven new players this past January. No wonder it will be a constant struggle for the club between now and November. Bohemians are paying for past sins; recent ones at that.

'We robbed Peter to pay Paul and we did that for a while,' one club source acknowledged this week.

'And that is where we are at now and we just have to see where we can go from here.'

The Gypsies elected a new board last year and immediately set about implementing cost-cutting measures.

Wages were slashed by as much as 40 per cent in some cases. By that stage, though, things had been allowed to spiral out of control.

Bohemians met on Thursday night to evaluate the club's current position, discussing a number of fundraising ventures and the different methods which will allow it to get back on a stable footing.

Members have been asked to pay for home games, although given less than 1,200 turned up to watch the 2-0 defeat of Bray Wanderers on Tuesday night, it remains to be seen how much can be raised. The club is also running a 'Bring a Friend Initiative'. But again, judging on recent gates, it doesn't appear to have been too great a success.

It doesn't help that the events on the pitch have led to the most pronounced slump of Pat Fenlon's reign at precisely the wrong time. Since their shock Champions League exit at the hands of TNS in Wales, the faith of followers was further shaken by a 3-0 defeat to Shamrock Rovers in Tallaght before the lost 2-0 at home Park to nine-man Galway United. There was some respite with Friday's victory over freefalling Dundalk but it remains to be seen whether it's enough to stop the rot.

For seasoned observers of the league as a whole, it's depressingly familiar. Twenty-three years ago, Shamrock Rovers spent their final season in their fabled Milltown home with average gate floating around the 600 mark.

Fenlon has delivered five trophies in two-and-a-half seasons at Dalymount Park, but it hasn't led to any sort of stampede through the turnstiles. And recent spiritless performances have turned off a few regulars too.

However, as Bohemians members discovered nine days ago in an information meeting, there's a major reason for the lack of spirit among the players. Despair on the field has been dwarfed by that off it. The board anticipated there would be trouble as far back as June.

Certain revenue streams were not producing and the club still had to deal with a long-standing Revenue debt (which they hope to clear by the end of this year) as well as repayments on the €4million Zurich bank loan. They decided, not unreasonably, to wait until the outcome of the Champions League qualifier with TNS to break any bad news.

When that game ended in disaster, however, costing the club in the region of €500,000, the inevitable transpired only days after the humbling defeat to their most bitter rivals in Tallaght Stadium. Despite what it may look like, however, both the club and the FAI are adamant that only one round of European football was factored into their calculations.

'Bohemians were only allowed to budget for one round in Europe and last place in the Premier Division,' insists FAI compliance officer Padraig Smith whose efforts have been rewarded with an invitation to join UEFA's Financial Fair Play Committee.

There was no issue with regard to a budget, speculating on how far they might get in Europe. Their current problems do not come from that.'

The new board elected at Dalymount Park last year have been firefighting (mostly inherited) financial issues for much of the intervening time. However, facilitiating the manager in bolstering his squad with seven new players in January, when they knew that the club were walking a financial tightrope after the FAI embargo had been lifted was, perhaps, not the wisest move.

Still, given the apparent rigours of the licensing process, questions must also be asked as to how, only two thirds of the way through the season, they should find themselves in such a financial bind.

The current trouble seems to stem from that September night almost four years ago when Bohemians members rubber-stamped an agreementin-principle worth €65million with property developer Liam Carroll which would see them leave Dalymount Park and move to a new, purpose-built stadium.

Doubts surrounding that deal, however, were not long in surfacing and said that And it's midtable title up, and the the although the club stubbornly refused to acknowledge any difficulty and continued to spend well beyond the non-refundable advances received (only circa €2m of an agreed total of €4.5m was paid over).

'The new board has done very well in trying to reduce the costs,' Smith says. 'And they have a very solid three-to-five year plan in place to get the club back on a sound financial footing and deal with the problems they have inherited. And we believe they can do that, if they are allowed to.'

Despite repeated warnings, the scale of the mess engendered by several seasons of over-spending is only now becoming apparent.

CARROLL'S well-documented financial difficulties mean that deal has crumbled, but the club still need to find some way out of the sinking hole. The hope now is that property developer Pascal Conroy, with whom the club were engaged in a legal battle in 2008 over the sale of a small corner by of the ground, may be enticed to buy the rest of the site if plans to redevelop Phibsboro Shopping Centre go ahead.

'A deal with Albion and Pascal Conroy is one of the options on the table,' said a Bohs source. 'And all of these options will be discussed with our members at an EGM early next month.'

The picture remains bleak, though. Although the new board did implement measures to slash the wage bill last year, with some staff taking a 40 per cent wage cut, salaries are still high by league standards and the club concedes there are not many who will be able to match them.

'One of the ways we are looking at raising funds, though, is through the sale of players (Paddy Madden, Killian Brennan and Aaron Greene are among the few saleable assets),' admitted a Bohs official.

That the club's profligacy with cash seems to have gone relatively unchecked for so long is almost beyond belief yet it was hardly a secret.

An official at one club, facing serious sanction in the last few seasons, recounted a tale of a crisis meeting he'd had with the licensing board. Making a plea on behalf of his own club, he cited the apparently greater difficulties at Bohemians. The dogs in the street, he reasoned, know how bad Bohs' situation is.

Asked to provide evidence, he declined. 'That's not my job,' he said.

Indeed.

Not too much new there but I wasn't aware of the issue with the taxman.. that appears to be the most obvious threat on the licensing front if we accept that the 65% limit is not an issue.

[Macy]

'Bohemians were only allowed to budget for one round in Europe and last place in the Premier Division,' insists FAI compliance officer Padraig Smith whose efforts have been rewarded with an invitation to join UEFA's Financial Fair Play Committee.

There was no issue with regard to a budget, speculating on how far they might get in Europe. Their current problems do not come from that.'
So where do the budget problems come from, that wasn't in the mix before the start of the season? They might not have been allowed to budget for more than one round in Europe and last place, but there's a big hole there now. Why didn't the licencing process pick up on it? What's the point of pre-approval of budgets, if this can still feckin happen?

[kdjaC]

Mc Guinness obviously missed the news flash about 400,000 plus unemployed, diminishing returns from just about any finance stream and the worst recession to hit ireland in at least 20 years.
Everytime you think that clown has hit rock bottom............ surely the worst reprezentative the players could have ?

PS this is not to mitigate in any way Bohs self inflicted financial difficulties.

Ah now here Pats,Sligo,Rovers,Bohs,Fingal(one) have had great fun away in europe with him, the lad can drink.

[DeNiro]

I blame the outrageous anti-Rovers bias on this forum for entirely derailing the thread from its topic.

http://www.motifake.com/image/demotivational-poster/0903/derailed-train-derailed-thread-demotivational-poster-1237346157.jpg

Anti-Rovers bias on this forum? What? Sure we all love Rovers on this forum! How could you not?

[mandrake]

i wonder will bohs be 'switching off floodlights' in an attempt to get two gates as dalymounttrower accused us of about a month ago ...
tut tut tut, what goes around comes around......:p

[sean r]

how did the fai approve of there budget? are there 2 contracts is the goalkeeper also the barman?

[Dodge]

http://www.independent.ie/sport/soccer/league-of-ireland/byrne-out-to-lose-new-shels-label-2313674.html

Byrne, the thick, still doesn't get it

[Jaime]

What does he not get?

[Dodge]

"But I hope it doesn't go the way Shelbourne did. It's a pity they are in the first division because they are a premier division club, but if things are not done properly off the field, these are the things that happen."

"That's the price of success if you want to bring the league on and bring the best players here. It comes at a price," he said.

"We have taken a step back and that is not good for the league. It is a good league as a whole, but when you see some of the things happening off the pitch it gets a bad name."

---

That most of these "off field" issues he speaks off were payments to players

[osarusan]

What does he not get?
Paid.

[legendz]

The frustrating thing about Boh's is, had they beaten TNS and been defeated by Anderlecht, they would've given CSKA Sofia a good game in the Europa League Play-offs. Would've been some amount of games as well to raise the profile of the LoO.

[Dodge]

The frustrating thing about Boh's is, had they beaten TNS and been defeated by Anderlecht, they would've given CSKA Sofia a good game in the Europa League Play-offs. Would've been some amount of games as well to raise the profile of the LoO.

No basis for saying they'd have given CSKA a good game seeing as they were beaten 2-0 at home by Galway (with 9 men)

Also the'd have played 6 games in Europe. Same amount as Pats last year and the year before. same as a few others in recent time too

[Jaime]

Same amount as Pats last year and the year before. same as a few others in recent time too

Yeah, and those games were good news for the profile of the league too. It was definitely a springboard for Fahey, for one thing. The evidence of the benefits of a good Euro run are there for all to see.

[Jaime]

That most of these "off field" issues he speaks off were payments to players

So he's making some attempt acknowledge the bigger picture, while all the time [rightly] pointing out that his own primary concern has to be his wages...

[Dodge]

Yeah, and those games were good news for the profile of the league too. It was definitely a springboard for Fahey, for one thing. The evidence of the benefits of a good Euro run are there for all to see.

So how has the league improved with all this great promotional work done by pats over the past two years? (and Fahey only played in half those games btw)

[Jaime]

The Fahey thing proves my point, one decent performance in Europe will accelerate any prospective move to a decent English club. I was thinking specifically of his performance in the Hertha home(?) game, which was probably worth a million times more to him than the Sunday evening league game when he came off the bench against Cork and single handedly rescued a point.

Lookit, a European run increases public awareness of the league and media coverage of the league, and generates positive publicity. I am not saying it gets an extra 1,000 people in the gate for the next league game, because we all know that isn't the case. But the benefits are there. They might not be worth a whole lot financially, but they are there.

[legendz]

What the league needs it's top 2 or 3 clubs making the play-offs at least every season. One-off season get a bit of coverage, if it happens season after season it'll raise the profile of the league and the coefficient.