James McClean M Wrexham b.1989

[tetsujin1979]

Let's not forget the numerous acts of charity he's performed this year, as well as signing the statement opposing a hard border in the north.
I'm not saying that the other nominees haven't done anything charitable, but I genuinely haven't heard about them.

Also, wonderful player that he is, Murray's an utter ******.

[OwlsFan]

Is was sport personality of the year, not achievement of the year.

No, the BBC one is SPORTS PERSONALITY, which makes little difference to be honest as such wonderful personalities as Andy Murray, Nigel Mansell, Lewis Hamilton and Ryan Giggs have won it. Imagine being stuck in a lift with them for 6 hours!

[DeLorean]

I think it's telling how undeserving he was in a sporting sense that charity work and even a token captaincy is being thrown into the mix. Serious straw clutching with his anti-hard border signature too.

McClean is very generous with his wealth and his time, but he's in a really lucrative financial position compared to most/all of those other candidates. That's not taking anything away from him, but it's a lot easier to make grand gestures when you're earning Premier League wages. Anyway, it wasn't a humanitarian award and even if it was, McClean is hardly squeaky clean on that front either, often letting himself down with cowardly tackles and foul mouthed social media rants.

Joe Canning is one very obvious candidate who has recently engaged with high profile charity work - https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/gaa-star-joe-kicks-off-hope-for-syrian-refugee-kids-with-unicef-ireland-35261614.html

Katie Taylor certainly isn't lacking in that regard either - https://www.irishtimes.com/business/retail-and-services/profits-at-katie-taylor-firm-exceed-1-2m-1.2655140


She is also engaged in a lot of charity work and is associated with Barnardos, Zest4Kids, Bray Lakers, and Wicklow Hospice Foundation.

[DeLorean]

Also, wonderful player that he is, Murray's an utter ******.

What's your beef with Murray, Tets?

[The Fly]

Bono once tellingly said (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A_XfbHou88w) (whilst reciting in approval his father's supposed quoting of John Millington Synge at an earlier point in Bono's life) that Ireland was just a place that kept his feet from getting wet. In light of his tax-dodging, make of that what you will...

That's as cheap a shot as Gastric's post about McClean.


You'll enjoy this piece on how Bono and other philanthropic capitalists like Geldof who push charity to defend property (or "philanthropic poverty", in other words): https://www.jacobinmag.com/2014/11/philanthropic-poverty/

Bono, a mascot for neoliberal capitalism, urges the impoverished to trust the economic system that directly causes their poverty - which he incongruously claims to oppose - and encourages the notion that charity rather than social reform is a credible fix.

Someone has kept those marxist pamphlets from college.


Anyway, to bring this back on topic (somewhat :p), here's a bit of Sinn Féin-related vintage Bono cringe:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gzRWYRyzX7I

It's Bono engaging in a sanctimonious rant (using a weird assortment of accents) against an unfortunate individual in the crowd during a 1987 U2 gig in San Francisco. Bono appears to assume in error that the fan's "SF U2" sign (obviously in reference to the city in which the gig is taking place) refers to Sinn Féin, who he quite clearly loathed with a passion.

Massive facepalm moment indeed.


Luckily, he didn't spot the advertisement down the back for Bank of America individual retirement accounts or he'd still be there to this day ranting away about the IRA!

See first reply.

[Olé Olé]

I love Conor McGregor but I don't think receiving this award really registered with him. Whereas, I reckon James is utterly chuffed. I also think he's deserving. He had made it so far in such a competitive sport by dint of sheer determination, not natural ability. And he brought us such amazing moments over the past 18 months. Having been in the goal end that he slotted against Austria and Wales I can't say I'm but delighted for him.

[The Fly]

It's great that James can now write his own signature and is an expert on Brexit. I am sure Leo will value the petition and will certainly discuss it with Theresa.

Thanks for that input Gastric. It's good to get views on the state of the nation from those over in Torquay, Australia. :rolleyes:

Aren't you a teacher btw?



In a broader sense, I think it's another definite indication that the football team has well and truly re-captured the general public's attention/imagination over the past few years (in spite of the what happened in the play-off). The football team is respected again. That is a good sign. I've been critical of O'Neill, more so in latter times, but after the nightmare of Staunton and the anaemic lethargy of Trap, he has undeniably managed to bring the spark back.


Agreed, and as you say it's a good sign.

[jbyrne]

if I were honest id say the award to McClean is a little dubious but that's the risk that the organisers take when they leave it to a public vote to decide. Id say its a reflection of the place that the football team has in the hearts of the country as a whole when compared to other teams.

McGregor winning it last year removed any belief I had in the process anyway. what a complete joke that was

[The Fly]

McGregor winning it last year removed any belief I had in the process anyway. what a complete joke that was

How so?

[jbyrne]

How so?

the two Olympic silvers for one thing

[The Fly]

the two Olympic silvers for one thing

That's it?

If they were gold medals you may have a point but no other Irish sports person accomplished anything close to what McGregor did last year.

[jbyrne]

no other Irish sports person accomplished anything close to what McGregor did last year.

all hype

[Charlie Darwin]

If they were gold medals you may have a point but no other Irish sports person accomplished anything close to what McGregor did last year.
False. McClean, like McGregor, talked a good game but then got handily beaten.

[osarusan]

False. McClean, like McGregor, talked a good game but then got handily beaten.
That was this year, for McGregor.

Last year he became double UFC champion, holding titles in two different weight classes at the same time.

[The Fly]

all hype

Hmmm.....I'm sensing bias. :rolleyes:


False. McClean, like McGregor, talked a good game but then got handily beaten.

What osarusan said.

[Charlie Darwin]

That was this year, for McGregor.

Last year he became double UFC champion, holding titles in two different weight classes at the same time.
True, was reading last year as in the last year.

[bennocelt]

That was this year, for McGregor.

Last year he became double UFC champion, holding titles in two different weight classes at the same time.

UFC? come on, its not a real sport, and anyhow it doesn't look very competitive. I'd say most people can only name the one UFC fighter. :D

As for McClean: as much as I love James and all he stands for and his passion, think this was a bit of a joke. I would have given it to Canning, the story of the year I think.

[tetsujin1979]

Good point on YBIG on Canning, he wasn't even Galway's player of the year. He had the moment of the GAA year with that winning score, but the award is for performance over the whole year

[Gather round]

Morning all. I think it's a 'personality' contest as that's snappier than 'Sportsman/ Sportswoman'.

James McClean and Andy Murray seem quite similar- both ready to speak out on off-field issues.

Anyway here's the currently highest-profile Irish personality:

https://i.imgur.com/HQndFkA.jpg

[bennocelt]

And the semi's for Canning. That argument doesn't stand up as McClean hasn't done a massive amount in the year too, and with nothing to show for it.

[DeLorean]

Good point on YBIG on Canning, he wasn't even Galway's player of the year. He had the moment of the GAA year with that winning score, but the award is for performance over the whole year

I suggested the same thing in a separate group, I say suggested because I don't think it's fair to say that Canning definitely wasn't Galway's poty, as he was generally excellent and vitally important. They had other outstanding performers too though, the two Burke's, Whelan, etc.

He did win hurler of the year of course (which would imply he was Galway's best). Jamie Barron should have won that though in my opinion. Did Galway actually have a poty award that somebody else won or is that your own (or the YBIG guys) personal opinion?

Anyway, what did Conor Murray do to you? :)

[tetsujin1979]

Murray's done nothing to me personally, but I've heard he's carrying on the tradition of O'Gara in the world class player/world class ******* stakes

[The Fly]

UFC? come on, its not a real sport, and anyhow it doesn't look very competitive. I'd say most people can only name the one UFC fighter. :D


The sport is MMA - the UFC is the leading promotion within the sport. The featherweight and lightweight divisions have probably been the most competitive within the organisation in recent times, so McGregor's achievement was remarkable.

As for the 'not a real sport' point...:rofl:

[DannyInvincible]

UFC? come on, its not a real sport, and anyhow it doesn't look very competitive. I'd say most people can only name the one UFC fighter. :D

How do you define a "real sport"?

UFC may be a promotional company, but MMA is a widely-recognised full-contact combat sport with roots in ancient disciplines; it requires serious self-discipline, conditioning, agility and toughness, both physical and mental. It combines eight or nine martial arts disciplines in total, six of which are full Olympic sports. In what sense does it not look very competitive? I don't have a particularly extensive interest in it beyond a curiosity as to how McGregor gets on (although I still have a serious amount of respect for anyone who has the commitment and fortitude to compete), but why would something like that - or the level of public knowledge in respect of specific MMA fighters generally, in other words - have any bearing on its status as a sport or not?

[DeLorean]

Interesting that Benno suggests a lack of competitiveness in MMA and then picks a hurler for sportsperson of the year! :)

[DeLorean]

McClean having some Twitter fun this evening - https://twitter.com/JamesMcC_14/status/943204811125809152


So Paul Kimmage ( some journalist ) is upset the critter about me winning RTE sportsperson of year, as voted by the Irish public i may add.. Paul and whoever else is upset about it, as i go shine my award i apologise sincerely for not giving a toss

In response to this - https://www.independent.ie/sport/other-sports/its-astonishing-paul-kimmage-disagrees-with-james-mcclean-winning-rt-sportsperson-of-the-year-36419081.html

[bennocelt]

The sport is MMA - the UFC is the leading promotion within the sport. The featherweight and lightweight divisions have probably been the most competitive within the organisation in recent times, so McGregor's achievement was remarkable.

As for the 'not a real sport' point...:rofl:

What? the Brazilian that slipped on his fist, yeah, lol:D

[bennocelt]

How do you define a "real sport"?

UFC may be a promotional company, but MMA is a widely-recognised full-contact combat sport with roots in ancient disciplines; it requires serious self-discipline, conditioning, agility and toughness, both physical and mental. It combines eight or nine martial arts disciplines in total, six of which are full Olympic sports. In what sense does it not look very competitive? I don't have a particularly extensive interest in it beyond a curiosity as to how McGregor gets on (although I still have a serious amount of respect for anyone who has the commitment and fortitude to compete), but why would something like that - or the level of public knowledge in respect of specific MMA fighters generally, in other words - have any bearing on its status as a sport or not?

Yeah sure it does Danny, all I see is two lads in tight shorts rolling around on top of each other, and its all over in ten seconds. (insert jokes here.......)

[The Fly]

Yeah sure it does Danny, all I see is two lads in tight shorts rolling around on top of each other, and its all over in ten seconds. (insert jokes here.......)

Err yeah...ju-jitsu, boxing, kung fu, karate, wrestling, judo, capoeira. The list goes on.

Did what you describe happen in either of those two championship fights btw? Nope.

[DannyInvincible]

McClean having some Twitter fun this evening - https://twitter.com/JamesMcC_14/status/943204811125809152



In response to this - https://www.independent.ie/sport/other-sports/its-astonishing-paul-kimmage-disagrees-with-james-mcclean-winning-rt-sportsperson-of-the-year-36419081.html

Kimmage said: "Nobody agrees, other than James' parents, that James McClean is the Sportstar of the Year."

That's evidently untrue, considering the general public voted for James, although I didn't hear Kimmage's tone so he may well have been exaggerating for effect.

[DeLorean]

Kimmage said: "Nobody, other than James' parents, that James McClean is the Sportstar of the Year."

That's evidently untrue, considering the general public voted for James, although I didn't hear Kimmage's tone so he may well have been exaggerating for effect.

I think he means McClean got the votes because he's popular, rather than deserving. Kimmage is spot on in what he says I think, and is actually very complimentary towards McClean in a more general sense, he's just as mystified as many others that McClean actually won.

McClean's response is harmless, but predictably childish and actually counter productive if he really doesn't care what's being said about his achievement (as he claims). He has some great qualities but the guy is 28 going on 13.

[bennocelt]

Err yeah...ju-jitsu, boxing, kung fu, karate, wrestling, judo, capoeira. The list goes on.

Did what you describe happen in either of those two championship fights btw? Nope.

None of that does ever be on display, come on, stop telling porkies.

As for the latest tweet
.Calling Kimmage "some journalist" wasn't classy, I guess James is still hurting.
The general public voted for our current government, so I would mind that.

Anyway it could be worse, least we didnt give it to a doper like the British one. :)

[DannyInvincible]

I think he means McClean got the votes because he's popular, rather than deserving. Kimmage is spot on in what he says I think, and is actually very complimentary towards McClean in a more general sense, he's just as mystified as many others that McClean actually won.

McClean's response is harmless, but predictably childish and actually counter productive if he really doesn't care what's being said about his achievement (as he claims). He has some great qualities but the guy is 28 going on 13.

If Kimmage is of the opinion that the awarding process should not be subject to a public vote and that a select panel of sporting experts should decide the most deserving candidate because a public vote effectively renders the whole thing a popularity contest, that's fair enough and I can see his point. However, he could easily have left his analysis at that - at the level of procedural critique - without getting needlessly personal by bringing James' family into it in order to downplay the admiration the wider public have for James' endeavours. Instead, Kimmage added a hyperbolic jibe about James' parents being the only people who believed James was worthy of the award when this was demonstrably false, given the highest number of the general public who voted evidently felt James was deserving. That may have riled James a bit.

Still, on the whole and to be fair, Kimmage was complimentary (and I only read his words, so didn't actually hear his tone, which could well have been light and jocular for all I know, particularly as it will have been obvious to anyone aware of the award that more than just James' parents felt James was deserving), so, yeah, no need for James to react by being so defensive and mocking of Kimmage, who is a highly-regarded and well-respected journalist. The best way for James to have shown his lack of concern for Kimmage's opinion would have been to ignore the criticism or to thank Kimmage for his opinion but say he respectfully disagreed.


None of that does ever be on display, come on, stop telling porkies.

I'm not an MMA expert, nor am I an expert in any of the numerous core disciplines that make up MMA, but here's a random Bellator fight from YouTube:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=teSDNrYvJeI

It lasts four minutes, but I (someone with very basic knowledge and awareness in the field) can clearly spot the use of skills and tactics common to boxing, kickboxing, karate, judo and wrestling throughout the fight.

[DeLorean]

If Kimmage is of the opinion that the awarding process should not be subject to a public vote and that a select panel of sporting experts should decide the most deserving candidate because a public vote effectively renders the whole thing a popularity contest, that's fair enough and I can see his point. However, he could easily have left his analysis at that - at the level of procedural critique - without getting needlessly personal by bringing James' family into it in order to downplay the admiration the wider public have for James' endeavours. Instead, Kimmage added a hyperbolic jibe about James' parents being the only people who believed James was worthy of the award when this was demonstrably false, given the highest number of the general public who voted evidently felt James was deserving. That may have riled James a bit.

Still, on the whole and to be fair, Kimmage was complimentary (and I only read his words, so didn't actually hear his tone, which could well have been light and jocular for all I know, particularly as it will have been obvious to anyone aware of the award that more than just James' parents felt James was deserving), so, yeah, no need for James to react by being so defensive and mocking of Kimmage, who is a highly-regarded and well-respected journalist. The best way for James to have shown his lack of concern for Kimmage's opinion would have been to ignore the criticism or to thank Kimmage for his opinion but say he respectfully disagreed.

The bit about James' parents was obviously tongue-in-cheek, I don't think we need to hear Kimmage's tone to assume that much. I think it's a serious overreaction to call it "needlessly personal", it was more a dig at the madness of the whole awards process than at McClean himself. There's obviously a big divide though between people who were literally shaking their head in disbelief that McClean was even in the running for this award (me included) and those who think he's a worthy winner, or at least contender. Kimmage is clearly in the former bracket.

I can't see how you think the comment was aimed to "downplay the admiration the wider public have for James' endeavours", he did anything but.


Everybody likes him. I love his commitment to the team. I love the way he plays for Ireland.

It is great that you acknowledge his contribution but by no means is he the Sportstar of the Year.

[bennocelt]

I'm not an MMA expert, nor am I an expert in any of the numerous core disciplines that make up MMA, but here's a random Bellator fight from YouTube:



It lasts four minutes, but I (someone with very basic knowledge and awareness in the field) can clearly spot the use of skills and tactics common to boxing, kickboxing, karate, judo and wrestling throughout the fight.

Bit like this so

https://youtu.be/R52ieopsvyk

[tetsujin1979]

Just without the choreography, and the predetermined victor, and the pseudonyms.

[bennocelt]

Just without the choreography, and the predetermined victor, and the pseudonyms.


Ha you got to be kidding me. Lol, will ya stop:rolleyes:
Point to someone more of a clown in WWF than 'The Notorious' Conor McGregor in MMA? And some of those fights look well set up. Please.
Not to mention that many WWF stars have crossed over into MMA.....

[tetsujin1979]

McGregor stole his act from Ric Flair.
There's been two WWE guys who've moved to MMA. Lesnar already had a background in amateur wrestling, and CM Punk (AKA Phil Brooks) got hammered in his only fight to date.

[tricky_colour]

It was sportsperson of the year, not sports personality.


According to Wikipedia (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RT%C3%89_Sports_Person_of_the_Year)...



And RTÉ's own website (https://www.rte.ie/sport/other-sport/2017/1216/927882-mcclean-voted-rte-sport-sportsperson-of-the-year/)...

Sport person is better, they have sports personality in the UK but most of them don't have one, James does of course.
But there are a lot of sports folk do not have a lot in that respect.

[tricky_colour]

Just without the choreography, and the predetermined victor, and the pseudonyms.

They don't have pantomime in the USA so wrestling fills the void.

[DannyInvincible]

Ha you got to be kidding me. Lol, will ya stop:rolleyes:
Point to someone more of a clown in WWF than 'The Notorious' Conor McGregor in MMA? And some of those fights look well set up. Please.
Not to mention that many WWF stars have crossed over into MMA.....

WWE's Kurt Angle was a gold-medal winner in amateur wrestling at the 1996 Olympics in Atlanta.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q_TWGehY2sc

Just because he later joined the WWF/WWE (which he originally thought was "beneath" him (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kurt_Angle#Professional_wrestling_career)) and became a professional wrestler doesn't take away from his genuine amateur or Olympic wrestling abilities. Plenty of WWE stars have genuine athletic abilities - they just combine them with theatrical performance in the WWE to make pre-determined and co-operative performance art that mimics sport - so it's no surprise some of them may be attracted to MMA, an actual competitive sport.

Boxing is another sport where shameless self-promotion and trash-talk is rampant; it doesn't take away from the genuine athletic abilities of those who participate in the sport or from the fact that it is a sport. Muhammad Ali was a perfect example of a great boxer - the greatest, perhaps - who also put on a performance outside the ring. That didn't lessen in any way boxing's status as a sport; it was irrelevant to that.

Which MMA fights look set up and why do you say that? What are the clues to look out for?

[geysir]

None of that does ever be on display, come on, stop telling porkies.

As for the latest tweet
.Calling Kimmage "some journalist" wasn't classy, I guess James is still hurting.
The general public voted for our current government, so I would mind that.

Anyway it could be worse, least we didnt give it to a doper like the British one. :)
Team award - Cian O'Connor
Who could forget Waterford Crystal and the saga of the stolen drug test sample (perhaps not stolen but “illegally taken” ) (http://www.horseandhound.co.uk/showjumping/further-twists-in-olympic-doping-saga-59088)

[Olé Olé]

James McClean opens the scoring for WBA away to West Ham. It's been a good night so far for two of our players that could surely do with a goal.

[DeLorean]

Helpful deflection - https://twitter.com/SkySportsPL/status/948288360073674752

[tricky_colour]

Looked like a good Clean shot to me.

The Irish can't stop scoring atm.

It's like it's Christmas already.

[osarusan]

Sadly McClean's house was burgled while he was on the the away trip at West Ham.

[Charlie Darwin]

Sadly McClean's house was burgled while he was on the the away trip at West Ham.
I'll just fire up the old twitter so and see all the doubtless contrite messages of support he's getting from the public.

[samhaydenjr]

I'll just fire up the old twitter so and see all the doubtless contrite messages of support he's getting from the public.

I don't use these modern internet acronyms much, but seriously, LOL, ROFL, LMAO

[Olé Olé]

I think James has started all league games since Darren Moore took over doomed WBA. McClean took the opportunity to have a pop off Pardew also saying that it makes a difference that the players know what they're doing under Moore. Great to see him getting regular games and that Moore appreciated what he brings to the table.

[Olé Olé]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/amp/football/44380823

Cardiff back in for Cunningham (great) but McClean a bit dear for them (fine once he gets another PL side in for him). McClean was rumoured to have been subject to a rejected £4m bid from Stoke too.