Martin O'Neill and Roy Keane

[OwlsFan]

I don't care so much about qualification. I'd like Ireland matches to no longer be an assault on my eyeballs.

I never get this sort of comment for international football. I can understand it for a club side where you have 20 odd games at home each season to watch and if the style of football is not easy on the eye, it might be tough to endure. But for international football where you only have may be five competitive games of football each year (circa 7.5 hours), I really don't care whether it "assaults my eyeballs" or not if it is successful because I follow Ireland in the hope of being successful (i.e. qualify for tournaments) and not to be entertained for 8 hours. I would choose any day of the week a scrappy win that puts us on the road to qualification over a free flowing defeat.

I have lived through the era of the glorious defeats when we qualified for nothing. In my opinion it is all about trying to qualify by whatever method is deemed best. Nothing would sicken me more than seeing us playing great football and losing - it would be as sickening as playing shi+e football and also losing except possibly more disappointing.

As for O'Neill and Stoke, the former's name is mentioned for every vacancy these days. He was 18/1 for the Sheff Wed job recently. I'd attach little credence to the rumours,

[Kingdom]

I never get this sort of comment for international football. I can understand it for a club side where you have 20 odd games at home each season to watch and if the style of football is not easy on the eye, it might be tough to endure. But for international football where you only have may be five competitive games of football each year (circa 7.5 hours), I really don't care whether it "assaults my eyeballs" or not if it is successful because I follow Ireland in the hope of being successful (i.e. qualify for tournaments) and not to be entertained for 8 hours. I would choose any day of the week a scrappy win that puts us on the road to qualification over a free flowing defeat.

I have lived through the era of the glorious defeats when we qualified for nothing. In my opinion it is all about trying to qualify by whatever method is deemed best. Nothing would sicken me more than seeing us playing great football and losing - it would be as sickening as playing shi+e football and also losing except possibly more disappointing.

As for O'Neill and Stoke, the former's name is mentioned for every vacancy these days. He was 18/1 for the Sheff Wed job recently. I'd attach little credence to the rumours,

I appreciate what you're saying, but you have to understand from the perspective of people trying to coach football to kids here, and then showing those same kids the football on show at Ireland matches.

There's more to international football than the Senior men's team, and considering the whole football development plan is built around an ideal of how to play football, it seems a bit ridiculous that what the senior manager passes off as football deviates completely from what is being taught at underage level.

I don't think it's particularly fair either to compare the days of the 70s and 80s prepared teams - which from lore were horrific, and prone to serious squad withdrawals - to the current organisation surrounding internationals.

[BonnieShels]

I wonder is Michael O'Neill holding out to see if we come in for him , my understanding is he has offers from NI and also Scotland, but hasn't signed. The Scottish offer I believe if the media are right is lucrative

Poaching their players and then their manager?


That just wouldn't do.

[brine3]

I have lived through the era of the glorious defeats when we qualified for nothing.

That was a different era. Firstly, the tournaments were much smaller so there were less places up for grabs. For 1982 we were in a qualification group with France, Belgium and Holland. Secondly, even if we played well enough and somehow had a chance of qualifying against these teams, refs in those days were for sale. 1982 being the case in point again.

Don't forget, as well, that we made it to the last 8 of the Euros in 1964.

The dominating narrative in Irish football for the past 30 years is is that we couldn't do anything until Jack came along and got us to play results oriented football. But it doesn't wash with reality.

It's now 2018. Euro 88 was 30 years ago. You didn't get anywhere in 1988 playing tactics from 1958. So I don't know why O'Neill has us set up like we are lining out at the Neckar Stadium.

[Olé Olé]

https://www.google.ie/amp/s/amp.independent.ie/sport/soccer/ireland-boss-martin-oneill-set-to-meet-stoke-officials-with-roy-keane-likely-to-be-part-of-any-deal-36477120.html

Looking more ominous. There's a headline on the front page of the Indo that he's set to take the Stoke job. Just walked past it so I didn't read further and not sure if that headline is deduced from the above article.

Interesting to note Keane would be part of the deal. Rules him out of the Ireland job.

[osarusan]

If the rumours are true, I'm genuinely surprised that an EPL team would be looking to hire him.

He certainly has experience, but over the past few years, I don't think he has much to show he would do a good job at that level.

I would not be bothered if he did leave, as I don't think he is a manager that changes style, and the style he plays with us is not one that gets us good enough results at home.

[jbyrne]

I would not be bothered if he did leave, as I don't think he is a manager that changes style, and the style he plays with us is not one that gets us good enough results at home.

but certainly a style that gets us big results away from home, a euro 16 qualification and the wc play offs from being 4th seeds in the group.
the wins against italy, germany, wales away, Austria away in his two campaigns so far cant just be dismissed

[osarusan]

but certainly a style that gets us big results away from home, a euro 16 qualification and the wc play offs from being 4th seeds in the group.
the wins against italy, germany, wales away, Austria away in his two campaigns so far cant just be dismissed

I didn't dismiss them, I specified that the problem is at home. We are actually set up very well away to the top teams.

We are very good at playing deep and frustrating attacking opposition. But pretty much every other style of play is a problem.

[NeverFeltBetter]

For the best I feel. His final game leaves a terrible black mark, but O'Neill's tenure was a success. That being said, we have a habit of holding onto managers one campaign too many, and I have a feeling Euro 2020 qualifying would have been that for these two.

As for Stoke, get the impression they want a steady pair of hands to avoid relegation. O'Neill and Keane will provide that.

[seanfhear]

Has O’Neill been as good a manager when he has not had John Robertson as his main Coach / Tactician .

A assistant of that quality is not easy to find .

[seanfhear]

You’d think Michael O’ Neill would be a better choice for Stoke ....Younger and Hungrier . He has done an outstanding job for Northern Ireland .

[Gather round]

Michael's entire managerial record is in either part-time club football or as a part-time international manager. I predict he'll never manage in the EPL or even ECL

[seanfhear]

Michael's entire managerial record is in either part-time club football or as a part-time international manager. I predict he'll never manage in the EPL or even ECLObviously you want to keep him but running down his achievements as Northern Ireland manager is a bit dodgy .

He basically achieved a miracle with Northern Ireland . He would certainly be well worth a go with a decent Championship side and perhaps with a lot of clubs in the bottom half of the premiership .

Some of the managers on the merry go round have had a lot less recent success than Michael O’ Neill .

Arguably Martin O Neill should have done better than Michael with what some would consider a somewhat ( in my opinion not much better ) better Republic Squad .

[Stuttgart88]

For the best I feel. His final game leaves a terrible black mark, but O'Neill's tenure was a success. That being said, we have a habit of holding onto managers one campaign too many, and I have a feeling Euro 2020 qualifying would have been that for these two.

As for Stoke, get the impression they want a steady pair of hands to avoid relegation. O'Neill and Keane will provide that.

I just saw something very similar on Twitter! You I presume? Or a copycat?

[NeverFeltBetter]

Ha, I'm afraid not, haven't been on Twitter in some time. A case of "Great minds..."

[Olé Olé]

It's being reported that Coates and Scholes are actually in Barcelona meeting Quique Sanchez Flores. Apparently they have offered him the job and 4m compensation to Espanyol.

Surely O'Neill's position is untenable if he's flirted with Stoke, ignoring the verbal agreement.

[Diggs246]

It's being reported that Coates and Scholes are actually in Barcelona meeting Quique Sanchez Flores. Apparently they have offered him the job and 4m compensation to Espanyol.

Surely O'Neill's position is untenable if he's flirted with Stoke, ignoring the verbal agreement.

I personally wanted Martin O'Neill to stay, but if I was a decision maker in the FAI, I would move to appoint a new manager. We cant have a guy who doesn't want to be there.

[osarusan]

Surely O'Neill's position is untenable if he's flirted with Stoke, ignoring the verbal agreement.
I don't really see why. It would all depend on who we could get to replace him I suppose.

If we're not able to attract a good manager to replace him, then I'd imagine a blind eye would be turned to his flirting with Stoke.

[OwlsFan]

Don't forget, as well, that we made it to the last 8 of the Euros in 1964.

The dominating narrative in Irish football for the past 30 years is is that we couldn't do anything until Jack came along and got us to play results oriented football. But it doesn't wash with reality.

It is a fact that we didn't qualify for anything until Jack came along. I don't think anyone said that "we didn't do anything" as I was in attendance at some great victories, not least 3-0 over the Soviet Union, 4-0 over Turkey and 3-2 over France but they all counted for nothing in the end. That is the reality no matter how much revisionist history some people might like to proffer. We had some great players but we never gained the holy grail of qualification.

As regards 1964, we beat Iceland in a qualifying round and Austria in the first qualifying round and lost to Spain (who has only squeaked past Northern Ireland in an earlier round) by a cricket score in the 2nd qualifying round. We didn't make the Finals. It also wasn't easy to qualify for Euro 88. Only one team qualified out of a group of 5 and we were the third or fourth seed. We also earned our right to play in Italia 90 with a 1-0 home win over Spain.

Martin O'Neill has presided over some of the greatest results in Irish football history (Germany away and home, Austria away, Wales away, Italy at the Euros) and secured one qualification. It's a great legacy results wise. We will have to agree to differ over the style of play which to me is immaterial even if Kingdom thinks it might affect people trying to coach kids. The international team is not about setting an example. It's about results, qualification and generating revenue for the FAI who in theory then put that money back in to the grassroots (coaches, kids etc).

Anyway, I still doubt if he will be leaving. Quique Sanchez Flores (all three of him) is the current odds on favourite.

[Kingdom]

It is a fact that we didn't qualify for anything until Jack came along. I don't think anyone said that "we didn't do anything" as I was in attendance at some great victories, not least 3-0 over the Soviet Union, 4-0 over Turkey and 3-2 over France but they all counted for nothing in the end. ........immediately discounts.......


Martin O'Neill has presided over some of the greatest results in Irish football history Austria away, Wales away It's a great legacy results wise.

.....this.

And as I said on another social media platform to give the man his absolute credit, he's probably achieved the best collection of results of any previous Irish manager. Unfortunately, the performances have been seriously bipolar.

[Olé Olé]

You're right there Kingdom. He was home victim to his away successes.

[geysir]

Amid the good results, it's impossible to ignore the rank rotten football played in the other games, mostly this campaign, And if it's "all about results", what fueled the non achievement of those other results were the poor game-plans, crude tactics and some truly bizarre decision making, along with some serious questions arising about the quality of the pre-game practice & preparation.

I'd have no confidence that it would be any different in the Euro 2020 qualifiers. By standards, the manager and deputy are earning a fortune for what is a part time job and get bonuses for not failing at it. It's a dream job for a manager and I don't foresee a lack of good candidates should MON's ice cold grip on it be loosened.

[shakermaker1982]

Surprised at the lack of support for MO’N on twitter and on here. The Danish hammering has really wiped out the credits he had surely built up over the past two campaigns. Look at some of the results we got.....a shame really. I think once that happens the clock is ticking - even if Stoke appoint somebody else the game is nearly up.

I get Owlsfan’s point about the style not being important because it’s only 7 games a year. But on the flip side I’d say for vast majority of Irish home supporters this is the only ‘live’ football they get to see in a year!!! Watching Klopp’s rampaging Liverpool side on the box or Rodgers Celtic side beating pub teams is what is important. “Why can’t Ireland play like that” they cry on the 42, twitter and elsewhere.

Back in the real world I’d give it to Kenny and build for 2022.

[pineapple stu]

I think if the Danish result wasn't long overdue based on our previous performances, he'd have more support.

[irishfan86]

Based on our (limited) quality, getting to the playoffs should be the barometer of success or not IMO. By that metric, I feel Martin should keep his job. He certainly has not been perfect but he has to be in the conversation for one of our best managers of all time. There was a long dark period after McCarthy left and I'm not eager to roll the dice again.

[TrapAPony]

Back in the real world I’d give it to Kenny and build for 2022.

Doubt he'd have the respect from all players tbh. It's very hard to know who should get the job.

[tetsujin1979]

Stoke have offered Flores a five year deal according to Sky Sports

[DeLorean]

Sky aren't really committing to that, a such - http://www.skysports.com/transfer-centre


Sky Sports News has been told by a senior source at Stoke City that the club is keeping its search for a new manager secret, and that no information has been given out to any journalist.

They are adamant that any name being reported in connection with the job is speculation from outside the club.

Spanish sources are briefing that the former Watford manager Quique Sanchez Flores has been offered a five year deal, if he accepts the chance to leave Espanyol.

But sources in Ireland are saying that Martin O’Neill has been made an offer which involves a deal beyond the end of this season, and Roy Keane will follow him to Stoke as assistant manager. We understand both Sanchez-Flores and O’Neill are under consideration.

SSN have spoken to one of the three men involved in the selection process at Stoke this evening and none of that information has leaked from the club. Stoke say there will be no comment from them until they announce their new manager.

[Fizzer]

O'Neill's in a tricky spot, even if he doesn't get the Stoke job I don't see how he can continue with us. If he was saying that the Denmark game was a nightmare but he's fully committed to trying to put things right then maybe give him a chance, but he's gotta go now. What happens if we're in the middle of a campaign and he has his head turned again. I think he did ok in the absence of Coleman and McCarthy in the last campaign and I would suggest that he's the only manager in the last 30 years or more, not to have had an all-time great Irish player at his disposal (Robbie being old and benched). At the same time, I'd rather a change now.

[EAFC_rdfl]

Are the FAI/Denis O'Brien still handing over cash to MON and Keane while all this is going on?

[OwlsFan]

O'Neill's in a tricky spot, even if he doesn't get the Stoke job I don't see how he can continue with us. If he was saying that the Denmark game was a nightmare but he's fully committed to trying to put things right then maybe give him a chance, but he's gotta go now. What happens if we're in the middle of a campaign and he has his head turned again. I think he did ok in the absence of Coleman and McCarthy in the last campaign and I would suggest that he's the only manager in the last 30 years or more, not to have had an all-time great Irish player at his disposal (Robbie being old and benched). At the same time, I'd rather a change now.

I am inclined to agree. It is very hard in any walk of life to continue in a job when it is common knowledge that you have applied for a job in another organisation and have been rejected.

[DeLorean]

O'Neill waiting on Flores' sloppy seconds...


BREAKING NEWS

Stoke are waiting to hear whether Quique Sanchez Flores will accept their offer to take over as manager. The former Watford boss is expected to inform Stoke of his decision, together with his current employers at Espanyol, later today.

The issue of compensation is not thought to be a problem between the two clubs.

We understand that if Sanchez Flores turns Stoke down, the club will instead firm up an offer to Martin O’Neill.

http://www.skysports.com/transfer-centre

[Diggs246]

I love Martin O'Neill, but this isn't good enough. he us now going to the dinner tonight, the FAI should be camped outside Michaels O'Neill Gaff in Belfast, the lack of signing the contract works both ways mon frère

[Diggs246]

F**k I didn't realize Michael O'Neill actually lived in Scotland

[colonelwest]

MON & his team heading to the SWA awards tonight after all after earlier in the week cancelling so looks like that's that then

[DeLorean]

What are the SWA awards?

[nigel-harps1954]

What are the SWA awards?

SWAI. Soccer Writers Association Ireland.

[OwlsFan]

Some very harsh comments about O'Neill on the RTE Website. https://www.rte.ie/sport/soccer/2018/0112/932763-quique-sanchez-flores-to-accept-stoke-job-reports/ Here is one for instance by Finto 23 who has got 27 likes for his comments:

"Rejected by Stoke shows precisely the calibre of manager we have. Stoke have rejected prehistoric, no-nonsense route one football in favour of a modern thinking, tactician who understands how developer a squad."

I might be wrong but didn't Stoke have Tony Pullis for a few years who kept them safe and sound in the EPL with his prehistoric, no-nonsense route one football. The Board got tired of that, despite an historic first FA CUP Final and European Football, and decided to appoint Mark Hughes to play a more expansive game which worked for a while until they now find themselves in the relegation zone !!

I'll be interested to see how this modern thinking tactician gets on at Stoke over the next 3 years. Meanwhile MON's achievements for Ireland are consigned to the dustbin and he is now just a "Stoke reject". Forget the halcyon days in France, the games against Germany and the wonderful wins in Austria and Wales. It never ceases to amaze me how quickly fans can turn on their manager.

[jbyrne]

Some very harsh comments about O'Neill on the RTE Website. https://www.rte.ie/sport/soccer/2018/0112/932763-quique-sanchez-flores-to-accept-stoke-job-reports/ Here is one for instance by Finto 23 who has got 27 likes for his comments:

"Rejected by Stoke shows precisely the calibre of manager we have. Stoke have rejected prehistoric, no-nonsense route one football in favour of a modern thinking, tactician who understands how developer a squad."


id say finto 23 was one of the first "fans" to moan on the same RTE website when the Denmark ticket public sale sold out after 2 mins thereby denying him the opportunity to get that all important "look at me at the match" selfie for his facebook page

[tetsujin1979]

The comments on RTE's articles make thejournal look like a hive of compassion

[seanfhear]

https://www.independent.ie/sport/soccer/international-soccer/martin-oneill-refuses-to-talk-to-media-at-awards-banquet-in-dublin-36483334.html

Martin not talking to the media .

[brine3]

Wales/Austria might have been favourable in the overall scheme of things, but they were ranked ahead of us very much on merit. They had both achieved things were could only dream about in the previous couple of years and were deserving of their high standing. Yet we still managed to out-perform both (or at least out-result them!).

I think you might be confused with the Austrian wunderteam of the 1930s.

[DeLorean]

I think you might be confused with the Austrian wunderteam of the 1930s.

Nope, the one that qualified for the Euros winning nine games in a row, beating Russia, Montenegro and Sweden (4-1) away from home. Does that sound like a typical (or even successful) Irish qualification campaign?

[Diggs246]

Mon back favourite for the stoke job

[Olé Olé]

Yup. Flores trained this morning. Did a press conference after and said he's going nowhere. Dan McDonnell saying on Twitter that O'Neill was in and out on the phone last night.

I considered would he be too proud to be second choice. But remembered he wasnt too proud to renege on a publicly announced verbal agreement so probably not.

[The Fly]

Yep, Flores has turned it down.....to the absolute disbelief of the brains on Sky's Soccer Saturday.

[Olé Olé]

Yep, Flores has turned it down.....to the absolute disbelief of the brains on Sky's Soccer Saturday.
Yeah. No real comprehension of the practicalities of it. The man is obviously enjoying life in beautiful Barcelona on a comfortable salary. He may even get a better paid job in Spain soon. Moving a family to a hole like Stoke.. why?

[The Fly]

Yeah. No real comprehension of the practicalities of it. The man is obviously enjoying life in beautiful Barcelona on a comfortable salary. He may even get a better paid job in Spain soon. Moving a family to a hole like Stoke.. why?

'Coz this is the Premier League...everyone in the world watches this innit?'

[ger121]

Yep, Flores has turned it down.....to the absolute disbelief of the brains on Sky's Soccer Saturday.

Guess he can’t do it on a cold wet Tuesday night in Stoke.

[seanfhear]

Yeah. No real comprehension of the practicalities of it. The man is obviously enjoying life in beautiful Barcelona on a comfortable salary. He may even get a better paid job in Spain soon. Moving a family to a hole like Stoke.. why?Darn it . That Espanyol job sounds appetising alright .