eircom League in Europe - 2008

[skitz3]

Talk about foolish optimism

[Dodge]

Talk about foolish optimism

Its not optimism, its so when when pats are beat some fans of other clubs can say "That was abad result, they should've done better"

Anyone who thinks a LOI side is anywhere near a Bundesliga team needs their head examined. Upsets can happen, and I won't stop dreaming about it, but lazy bold predictions help nobody

[skitz3]

Its not optimism, its so when when pats are beat some fans of other clubs can say "That was abad result, they should've done better"

Anyone who thinks a LOI side is anywhere near a Bundesliga team needs their head examined. Upsets can happen, and I won't stop dreaming about it, but lazy bold predictions help nobody

Fair point Dodge, i pretty much with you.

[superfrank]

I was just watching Football Focus there and they were looking at the UEFA Cup draw. Mark Lawrenson made sure to get a special mention in for St. Pats. He was really talking them up and said they did brilliantly to get that far.

So their efforts are getting some notice abroad which is good to see.

[boovidge]

If Pats do go through to the group stages how would that effect their seedings for next years UEFA qualifiers and first round?

[higgins]

There's 2 points for a win now that we're into the 1st Round proper. So catching Lithuania is not impossible.

However, even a draw in one of the games would be more than Pats can hope for at this stage I think.

[CuanaD]

Talk about foolish optimism
Why???
5+ years ago were we foolish to hope any eL team could progress past their 1st round? - now we get that each year (& regularly get past their second round too)



Dodge - I wont be slagging off Pat's result whatever way it goes - they have been brilliant so far & I'm still hoarse from cheering them Thursday. (but you are right - there are begrudgers who would find some reason to slag off our domestic teams even if they were to win the CL!)

All i'm saying is that this is all part of an upward curve for the league & someday SOON we WILL have a team in the group stages :ball:

[CuanaD]

If Pats do go through to the group stages how would that effect their seedings for next years UEFA qualifiers and first round?
Its not worked on how far you get, but on the wins & draws you get - so progressing with 2 wins gets more points than progressing with 2 draws & away goals.
But, from this round the ranking points available are higher than in the preliminary rounds - so a draw for Pats against Hertha would be worth as much as the win against Elfsborg. Also, these (higher) points are added to the country coefficiant but ALSO added to the Team's individual ranking (not easy to explain but the details are all here: http://www.xs4all.nl/~kassiesa/bert/uefa/calc.html )
This means that ANY draw or win from here on for Pats will almost guarantee them being seeded for their first game next year.

[TonyD]

Congrats Pats - a well deserved success after a number of less-than-proud moments in Europe. I'm happy for you and my Dad's old club he followed in college :D

The only sad moment is that it wasn't on RTE, so that maybe a few more people could have been converted to the cause. RTE always choose the glorious losses :)

Was thinking exactly that after the game. Would have loved the public at large to see that performance. This was no smash and grab result. Pats comprehensively outplayed them for the majority of the game and the result was fully merited. I'd love to have seen Roddy Collins trying to downgrade that display. Now RTE will probably show the Hertha Berlin game and we'll probably get beaten(Don't get me wrong, I think we'll give a good account of ourselves, but I'm not expecting to go through) and they'll wheel Roddy out again to tell us all that Irish teams haven't progressed, he did it all with Bohs years ago, etc,etc, etc.

[kdjaC]

someday SOON we WILL have a team in the group stages :ball:

2nd of October 2008 at 21:35




kdjac

[TonyD]

Oh yeah. ;):D

[Big Ears]

I reckon Hertha will win by 2/3 goals on aggregate but hopefully Pats can get at least a draw in one of the ties. I'd love to be proved wrong and see them go through.

[Duffman]

I'd love to be proved wrong and see them go through.

I would too but the difference in the Bundesliga and our Premier division is huge. There are english championship sides that would struggle against a team like Hertha. Pats need to have the game of their lives out there and hope lady luck is on their side. I'm all for optimism and positive thinking but don't get carried away lads.

[bennocelt]

If we manage to get a score draw or lose by the odd goal in 3 over there I'd be happy and hopeful of going through. Did anyone take Paddy Power up on his 10-1 odds of any LOI team getting to group stages in the next 5 years?

Jeez thats not a bad bet

[thischarmingman]

Mark Lawrenson made sure to get a special mention in for St. Pats. He was really talking them up and said they did brilliantly to get that far.


Mark Lawrenson's a legend. He made sure to mention us all the time during our run. Top man.

[green army]

I was just watching Football Focus there and they were looking at the UEFA Cup draw. Mark Lawrenson made sure to get a special mention in for St. Pats. He was really talking them up and said they did brilliantly to get that far.

So their efforts are getting some notice abroad which is good to see.

he said something along the lines of - the best result there was from st patricks. they were out. then two goals in 86 and 90min. hertha berlin now.

[green army]

all i hope is that we somehow keep the tie alive for the 2nd leg.

[mypost]

Anyone who thinks a LOI side is anywhere near a Bundesliga team needs their head examined. Upsets can happen, and I won't stop dreaming about it, but lazy bold predictions help nobody

Nobody's saying a LOI team is near a Bundesliga team, but we remember when Cork, (and indeed Rovers) had tight games with Bayern Munich over the years in Europe, and Hertha are not Bayern Munich quality. They're still favourites, but I wouldn't rule out a shock.

[Dodge]

Nobody's saying a LOI team is near a Bundesliga team, but we remember when Cork, (and indeed Rovers) had tight games with Bayern Munich over the years in Europe, and Hertha are not Bayern Munich quality. They're still favourites, but I wouldn't rule out a shock.

I know your age, and you certainly don't remember Rovers playing bayern... ;)

As I've said, shocks can happen, but a poster here put the game at 50/50.

Thats just plain rubbish..

[DeNiro]

Great night in Richmond Park. One of the best atmospheres I've experienced. Fair play to Pats, they never gave up and dug deep. Pity the Hertha game is not in Inchicore. Hopefully the RDS will be full. Nice lift for the league at during such a tumultuous period.

[Denis The Red]

I'm sure teams were seeded in the draw so Pat's were always going to get a quality team. Unfortunately Hertha are a club that would never attract the big crowds you would want or are not the team you would hold much hope of beating to get into the group stages. Fallen between two stools really in my opinion.
Are you expecting a big crowd at the RDS?

[mypost]

The age posters are, frankly has nothing to do with it. What counts is the game itself, and how the LOI side played.

Bayern play Hertha tomorrow on the box, where you can expect them to fold again in Munich. :) Really, Pats have nothing to fear out there. If Drogheda can take Kiev to within a couple of minutes of progressing to the next round of the CL, then Pats can cope in Berlin. But if they go there having given up already that some here have, of course they have no chance.

[kdjaC]

I'm sure teams were seeded in the draw so Pat's were always going to get a quality team. Unfortunately Hertha are a club that would never attract the big crowds you would want or are not the team you would hold much hope of beating to get into the group stages. Fallen between two stools really in my opinion.
Are you expecting a big crowd at the RDS?

German tv giving us more money than selling out the RDS at 20 quid a head would.

Now i dont care for these barstoolers coming out once and watching us, they dont go to their own teams games wouldnt expect them to go to ours.

They reckon they will bring a 1000 over easily + our 2000 and plus our 1000 lapsed fans who came on thurs + other EL fans.

So club getting well paid, players getting to play in the Olympic stadium and we get to enjoy our day out. If we were still in the tie come 2nd leg i would be happy but unlikley.



kdjac

[higgins]

Berlin down 1-0 after 19mins today.

[mypost]

Pat's were always going to get a quality team. Unfortunately Hertha are not the team you would hold much hope of beating to get into the group stages.

Bayern 4-1 Berlin. :D

Quality sides don't concede 4 goals at the Allianz. That's 15 in their 4 visits.

[Rovers fan]

As I've said, shocks can happen, but a poster here put the game at 50/50.

Thats just plain rubbish..


Omg,i agree with dodge:eek: Can't see this happening again for a long time:D

[Inside Man]

This Tie alone will bag Pats in the region of 750,000.
And Pats are getting more money from the German T.V as they want to decide the day of the match so they can fit it in around other german bundeliga matchs. This means Pats earn even more than they would have. German TV is definatly most lucrative, and Pats were lucky with the draw in the financial way.

Talk on here of Pats having a chance is ludacris. This would be 'Havant and Waterville' style if they were to go through. Hertha are a top established Bundesliga outfit and there is not a hope they will bow out to Pats. They will be out to do a professional job on us and thats exactly what they will achieve.
Some of the talk I've seen on here is behond Laughable.

[finnpark]

Are ticket details for the 2nd leg announced yet and are Finn Harps fans allowed to go? :D

Im thinking of going.

It would be great if Pats could pack the RDS, I think it would lok great, a great image for the league :)

Hertha are pure quality from one of the best leagues in the world. Probably similar in quality to Man City, Celtic, Rangers, Everton etc in the UK

[Dodge]

HArps fans more than welcome, but if I hear one Donegal accent say I told you so when Hertha win, you're ****ing dead ;)

No ticket details yet

[finnpark]

HArps fans more than welcome, but if I hear one Donegal accent say I told you so when Hertha win, you're ****ing dead ;)

No ticket details yet

Cheers, well if its a really bad hammering I will leave at half time :D

Hopefully, the FAI can do something to help pack the RDS for Pats too, even a schools project or something to bring along a few big schools to support Pats.

[ifk101]

Pats should squezze as much money as possible out of this tie (which I'm sure they are doing) as Hertha Berlin is a big step-up from Elfsborg and I can't see them progressing to the group stages. Anyways best of luck to Pats.

[finnpark]

Well I think we all realise how difficult it will be. Derry, Shels and Cork have all tried before and lost by 2 goals or more on each occasion so we should not expect Pats to qualify :)

Hopefully, it will look good to the media with plenty of flair, colour and atmosphere. It might be an idea to give a free scarf or flag to all Pats fans on their way in, something cheap I suppose. Its a good PR opportunity for Pats and the league

[pineapple stu]

Hertha just signed Voronin from Liverpool. Just in case anyone wasn't aware of the size of the task! Not sure if he's eligible though.

[superfrank]

He didn't play for Liverpool in the CL so, AFAIK, he should be eligible.

[CuanaD]

Hertha just signed Voronin from Liverpool.
Never heard of him! Is he any good?

(look, i don't support any team outside of this island, so I haven't a clue about liverpool players)

[Dodge]

Hertha just signed Voronin from Liverpool. Just in case anyone wasn't aware of the size of the task! Not sure if he's eligible though.

Quigley is better than him. Seriously...

[LeixlipRed]

He's good in the way that he can run around in circles looking clueless. Obviously he should be decent against EL standard but, yeh, Quigley is better than him :eek:

[Dodge]

Hertha v Pats almmost certain to be played on Tuesday at 5pm (Irish time) to suit German TV

[pineapple stu]

Quigley is better than him. Seriously...
*Deeply sceptical hmmmmmmm...*

In pure stat terms, he has 54 caps for Ukraine and six goals (which is a fairly crappy return for a forward in fairness). Hertha also have a player with 50+ caps for Germany (Friedrich), Hungary (Dardai) and Croatia (Simunic), as well as players capped by the Czech Republic, Switzerland, Serbia, Bulgaria, Poland, and Tunisia. Also, Kaka and Lucio play for them. Pat's are rank outsiders obviously, and I reckon a home draw is about as good as they can hope for. But then, I've written off numerous clubs in this European campaign so far. Shame there's no-one really well-known playing for them; mightn't have the same appeal for the barstooler.

[Dodge]

Seriously, Quigley's better... I'm sure Fahey would get a game in the Bundesliga too.

Doesn't mean they're not massive, massive favourites

[L37Ultra]

Hertha v Pats almmost certain to be played on Tuesday at 5pm (Irish time) to suit German TV


Will it be on Irish TV does anyone know?

[finnpark]

Will it be on Irish TV does anyone know?

As far as I know Setanta have bought the rights to both legs, somebody might confirm this?:confused:

[paul_oshea]

its about winning a game paul. If you went to more than ROI internationals, you might understand. Cork and Derry's achievements were terrific for them, but do you honestly think anyone in Richmond last night gave either club a second thought last night? If we were losing 1-0 to any team and come back to win 2-1 there'd have been bedlam, never mind a victory to adnvance to our third round.



You are having a go, in your usual snide little way. Our players didn't get carried away last night. They acted like the professionals they did. The fans celebrated a great victory, just like all regular football fans do

I wasn't dodge, it was meant in my "non-usual-snideway" whatever that means :D I meant it in terms of fans as well as anyone else. I don't think I fully understand to be honest though. I have gone to el matches before and go to around 10 games a season in London. I am not putting down the atmosphere at all, it looked unreal and would have been great to experience it, just questioning why it was so electrice. Are you saying that every time pats go 1 - 0 down in richmond, or go down a goal at all and win, the atmosphere is that electric?

Aiming big is ingrained in me, thats all I was saying.

[pete]

Are you saying that every time pats go 1 - 0 down in richmond, or go down a goal at all and win, the atmosphere is that electric?

I don't think you get what Europe means to fans. European games are always more special even if you are playing very poor opposition worse than teams in your own league.

Pats had never progressed through two rounds of European competition (open to correction) which made this historic for them.

[Dodge]

I wasn't dodge, it was meant in my "non-usual-snideway" whatever that means :D
By comparing us to your local gaa team you're doing your usual "sure its only the league of Ireland


I don't think I fully understand to be honest though.
Should be your signature POS


Are you saying that every time pats go 1 - 0 down in richmond, or go down a goal at all and win, the atmosphere is that electric?

No. I'm saying that when you've known what Pats fans have endured over the years (in europe, in courts, in backrooms, on the pitch and pretty much everywhere), that when you're a goal down with 4 minutes to go, that when you're within touching distance of something you've never done before, that when you're playing great football, that when you have so much history built up with the club that nothing else could make you as happy as 2 late goals, that when you've had a few drinks, that when there are literally a million reasons why you deserve this win... then its obvious why it meant so much to fans.

As I said before, real football fans understand

[paul_oshea]

By comparing us to your local gaa team you're doing your usual "sure its only the league of Ireland


Should be your signature POS



No. I'm saying that when you've known what Pats fans have endured over the years (in europe, in courts, in backrooms, on the pitch and pretty much everywhere), that when you're a goal down with 4 minutes to go, that when you're within touching distance of something you've never done before, that when you're playing great football, that when you have so much history built up with the club that nothing else could make you as happy as 2 late goals, that when you've had a few drinks, that when there are literally a million reasons why you deserve this win... then its obvious why it meant so much to fans.

As I said before, real football fans understand

sorry sorta dragged this off-topic. I never compared, im just saying the mentality may have been similar.

The last paragraph explains what I was asking, its not just football, or limited to football even that people have these emotions dodge, so dont be so naive to think that only fans of EL/football(really EL fans given what you described above as it relates more so in the majority at least to EL fans) can have these emotions, not taking away at all either, just pointing out.

So the question I asked, got the response I wanted in the end, it came down to going further in Europe than you had previously done i.e. cos you never did it before, and thats simply what I was asking. I just got confused with what appeared to be relief based on what some of the things you said previously.

[Dodge]

I never compared, im just saying the mentality may have been similar.
LOL, read that back to yourself.


The last paragraph explains what I was asking, its not just football, or limited to football even that people have these emotions dodge, so dont be so naive to think that only fans of EL can have these emotions, not taking away at all either, just pointing out.
Thats the thing POS, only Irish people who aren't fans of Irish teams try and make out that the LOI thinks its unique. We know that every true football fan feels the same way about their team.



So the question I asked, got the response I wanted in the end, it came down to going further in Europe than you had previously done i.e. cos you never did it before
You didn't even read the post, did you?

[paul_oshea]

picking, nit etc......

I did dodge, but every other game, that you are 1 - 0 down, you still had all the same sh1t in the background(and forergound) etc, but this match brought ye further than ever before in Europe, something ye never did before.

Its not bound to only football dodge. dont even try to limit it to it. anyhow ive had the questions I asked answered so I am happy with that and wont bother re-routing this thread any further :)

I hope that pats can at least compete in the next two legs no matter what happens.

[Dodge]

You don't even understand the answer...

[pete]

Is the 1st leg on Irish TV? 2nd leg on Irish/German TV?