LOI In Europe 2020

[Yossarian]

Arsenals second team hammered Basel a few years ago, they seemed like they were itching for a chance to shine.......:D

Look I don’t really expect anything other than a convincing win for Arsenal but at least allow me the chance to dream, no matter how deluded it is!!

[bennocelt]

Look I don’t really expect anything other than a convincing win for Arsenal but at least allow me the chance to dream, no matter how deluded it is!!

Ha yeah sorry Yossarian:)

[CorribsideSteve]

David Luiz injured for Arsenal. There goes Dundalk's best chance of an Arsenal slip-up on Thursday :P

[Straightstory]

I think if they can keep them down to a four goal margin, that's a decent enough result. ('Them' being Arsenal - not Dundalk).

[joey B]

https://www.thesportreview.com/2020/10/arsenal-v-dundalk-united-prediction-michael-owen/

Dundalk getting the name change in!

[placid casual]

Arsenal have spent the last 10 yrs being the ultimate flat track bullies, but predictably fall assunder when their weak mindset is exposed.
This game could be a cricket score, unless dundalk show bravery to attack whenever possible.
If I was the dundalk coach I personally wouldn't play shields as he will get filleted against arsenal, but I'm sure the dundalk fans will disagree.

[CorribsideSteve]

Arsenal have spent the last 10 yrs being the ultimate flat track bullies, but predictably fall assunder when their weak mindset is exposed.
This game could be a cricket score, unless dundalk show bravery to attack whenever possible.
If I was the dundalk coach I personally wouldn't play shields as he will get filleted against arsenal, but I'm sure the dundalk fans will disagree.
Agreed. However, Shields is likely their best DM/CM, though some would say Slogett. Alot of recruitment needed next year if they are to be near a group stage again. All that being said, it should be easy street for Arsenal tonight. You never know though, as you've alluded to, Arsenal are famously crap at putting small teams away. The 3-3 vs Osterunds (sp?) a few years back being a good example.

[Scrufil]

Will Gunnersyrus get a game? I want a pic of Chris Shields with him. ;-)

[EatYerGreens]

Will Gunnersyrus get a game? I want a pic of Chris Shields with him. ;-)

Gunnersyrus Christie ?

[Ezeikial]

This game could be a cricket score,
unless dundalk show bravery to attack whenever possible.
If I was the dundalk coach I personally wouldn't play shields as he will get filleted against arsenal, but I'm sure the dundalk fans will disagree.

This game is likely to be high scoring no matter what.

I expect Filipino may opt for both Shields and Sloggett. It seems to be his preference

[Nesta99]

At minimum I hope the lads learn from playing at this level, I hope also that a hammering wont damage confidence in general terms for Sunday. A big maybe is that they will play with such free abandon that they give a good account of themselves. Having said that even Barcelona have shipped cricket scores of recent....

[pineapple stu]

Arsenal as expected playing about as weak a team as possible -

Runarsson
Cedric
Mustafi
Kolasinac
Maitland-Niles
Willock
Elneny
Xhaka
Pepe
Nketiah
Nelson

Subs - Leon, Hein, Bellerin, Gabriel, Tierney, Ceballos, Partey, William, Saka, Aubameyang, Lacazette, Balogun

[sparky12345678]

Austrian teams doing well this week... showing some ambition.
Obv United put 5 past a decent german side so hopefully Arsenal wont take inspiration from that :S

[pineapple stu]

Respectable start for Dundalk midway through the first half.

Rogers with a bit of a brain fart passing a goal kick inside his six-yard box with two Arsenal players lurking, but other than that, Arsenal haven't created much yet.

[Philosophizer]

Arsenal really starting to look dangerous though

[Philosophizer]

Mountney with a couple of bad unforced errors there. Hoofed a cross over the endline unoppossed and miscontrolled a ball out of play. McEleney and Murray looking comfortable on the ball. Shields less so.

[pineapple stu]

Arsenal really starting to look dangerous though
They are and they aren't - it's very Arsenaly in that they've lots of play around the box, but they haven't really created any proper openings yet.

Dundalk probably delighted to get to 30 minutes fairly intact tbh.

[pineapple stu]

Gary Rogers, eh?

Shocked, so I am.

[osarusan]

Pity they couldn't hold on until HT, even that would have been a boost.

And another now, giving the ball away and getting punished again.

[Philosophizer]

True. Brian Kerr with an honest analysis of the first half. It was probably a bit silly that Gartland took the quick free instead of slowing the game down.
Still tho 42% possession is a lot higher than I'd have predicted. Fair play!

[nigel-harps1954]

Same old story..Gary Rogers.

It's a pity for Dundalk that Aaron McCarey didn't really step up to the mark. They really need a goalkeeper, have been saying the same for years too.

[osarusan]

Jaysus, 3-0 now, just 32 seconds into the second half.

[pineapple stu]

I know this is a bit ironic as a UCD fan, but the playing out from the back the way they're doing it (ie goalkicks inside the six-yard box) is a bit extreme. I can see that costing a goal before the end.

[sbgawa]

Jaysus id take 5 at this stage.

[joey B]

You have to feel for McEleney, can't stay fit, real shame one of the best in the league.

[Nesta99]

Same old story..Gary Rogers.

It's a pity for Dundalk that Aaron McCarey didn't really step up to the mark. They really need a goalkeeper, have been saying the same for years too.

He's as reliable as De Gea....he is prone to the odd clanger but has been solid a lot more than a liability. Frustrating to concede so close to HT and that they happened as a result of an error or sloppiness. Could have had a bit of luck with a ball pinging about the box. 3rd goal was just individual class that little can be done about so doesnt hurt just as much. Ye have to make every chance count too eg Murry and Gartland mistiming things and spurning chances.

Definitely one eye is on the Pats game with some subs. McEleney is just made of glass these days and we will wait and see with Murray too. He was playing well so most likely an injury.

Not feeling humiliated (yet), the more ye play at this level the better the ability to cope and not be overawed. If we had a really classy striker for this level, and a keeper (due to Rogers age rather than ability) we'd obviously move up a level and look to hit group syages and then pick up points. Easier said than done, but we do need a hatfull of chances to score one, over the last 8 years the better sides we've played get one chance and its usually taken Rosenborg a typical example and where Kilduff missed a sitter that would have put us through. Spreading the net wider for players that are that bit more clinical is the only way to improve squads as there isnt any standout players in the usual circles as Rovers would know. Adorjan had the potential to both be a finisher and creator and had more pace than the attacking lads we have.

[bennocelt]

He's as reliable as De Gea....he is prone to the odd clanger but has been solid a lot more than a liability. .

Never seems like that though when he is up against decent European opposition, lets be honest

[ciaraa]

He's as reliable as De Gea....he is prone to the odd clanger but has been solid a lot more than a liability.

the delusion is strong in this one

[ger121]

Respectable scoreline in the end, with one eye on Sunday.

[Nesta99]

the delusion is strong in this one

Tongue firmly in cheek with the De Gea comment lol. The standout goalkeeping error in Europe was Sava's misskick v Zenit when we were winning and controlling the game. Rogers didnt make the punch tonight but I dont really recall any major past clangers, maybe a combination of errors but not in singling out Rogers. If there are examples Im happy to hold the hands up, but I think its a perception rather than anything.

[joey B]

You feared the worst when they went 3 up 30 seconds into the second half but they kept it respectable in fairness,the player who scored the third cost 79 million euro! its a different planet they're on. The biggest shame for me is the Dundalk fans didnt get their away day,games like this won't come around often unfortunately.....

[osarusan]

As good as could have been expected I suppose. It's always going to be a defensive effort for 90 minutes, and Arsenal are eventually going to get through. 3-0 overall is decent. Ok, Arsenal were a weakened team, but that doesn't matter really, and Arsenal took their foot off the gas, but that doesn't matter either.

3-0 is as good as you could hope for, and after 45.32 minutes, it could have been a lot worse. Only cloud is that they had a part in a couple of soft goals, when you want the other team to have to earn their goals.

Just heard that Dundalk didn't commit a single foul for the entire 90 minutes, which is incredible really.

A pity that Dundalk fans were not there to see it, and clap the team off after a creditable performance.

[pineapple stu]

Tongue firmly in cheek with the De Gea comment lol. The standout goalkeeping error in Europe was Sava's misskick v Zenit when we were winning and controlling the game. Rogers didnt make the punch tonight but I dont really recall any major past clangers, maybe a combination of errors but not in singling out Rogers. If there are examples Im happy to hold the hands up, but I think its a perception rather than anything.

Really didn't cover himself in glory for the first or last goal against Celje in fairness.

OK, he wasn't alone in that, but that doesn't take away from the fact his part in both was poor.

There's other examples I'm sure.

[kksaints]

Tongue firmly in cheek with the De Gea comment lol. The standout goalkeeping error in Europe was Sava's misskick v Zenit when we were winning and controlling the game. Rogers didnt make the punch tonight but I dont really recall any major past clangers, maybe a combination of errors but not in singling out Rogers. If there are examples Im happy to hold the hands up, but I think its a perception rather than anything.

I can remember Rogers not coming out for a backpass that let a Steaua player in to score in the RDS in our playoff match in 2009. Cost us the chance of winning on the night as we were 1-0 up at the time.

[pineapple stu]

Just heard that Dundalk didn't commit a single foul for the entire 90 minutes, which is incredible really.
That is remarkable actually. Livescore says Arsenal committed 20.

But yeah, I don't think anyone can quibble with a 3-0 scoreline, even if the game did have the feel of an England v Andorra game for much of it. And a huge pity that Dundalk fans couldn't be there of course.

[sbgawa]

Its a pity dundalk didnt make the groups last year instead of this year.

[Nesta99]

Its a strange one in being ok with a 3 nil loss. Pity that the 1st two were errors. It does feel a bit typical to have gotten a plumb draw and not be able to go, especially having lived in London and would have pals that are Arsenal fans that Ive often been to rsenal games with. Back in Uni days in London, about 1998, the lads would have a good laugh at my determined support for a club they knew nothing about. Ive been getting a rake of messages now from them and they were pretty impressed considering the difference in size of clubs and finances. Its flipping easier to get English lads in Irish football than it is with the Irish!!

I thought that zero foul stat was an error on the BBC website, its remarkable really but not sure whether its is excellent discipline or lacking some edge. Usually when a team is chasing the ball fouls are committed, not the one dominating possession.

Keeping things respectable could be very important in relation to keeping Peak6 interested. It also might shut a few people up that would scoff and say a LoI would ship 10 against a top EPL side!

[2 Year Contract]

I thought that zero foul stat was an error on the BBC website, its remarkable really but not sure whether its is excellent discipline or lacking some edge. Usually when a team is chasing the ball fouls are committed, not the one dominating possession.

Thought the fouls stat was an error myself initially, I’ve never in my life seen that happen in a game. To be fair there was several times when Nelson in particular was strolling through the midfield/defence and taking the **** a bit which could’ve done with a tactical foul. On the flip side no silly free kicks on the edge of the area were given away which could’ve resulted in goals

[Nesta99]

Really didn't cover himself in glory for the first or last goal against Celje in fairness.

OK, he wasn't alone in that, but that doesn't take away from the fact his part in both was poor.

There's other examples I'm sure.

I doubt there is a keeper on the planet that hasnt had a few clangers if you look for them. I would remember Rogers more for saving (pardon the pun) us, particularly domestically in key games. He did have one spell where he did lose form but Kenny was the type of manager who stuck with players so they could build confidence and play in to form. So my perception is more positive than feeling he was a weak link, like a Chencinski or Horgan even. His age is main reason for people feeling a keeper is needed and that the jury is out on McCarey - maybe he just needs a run as N0.1. If I'd a choice between Rogers and Mannus I'll admit that Mannus would be the pick respective ages aside. Rogers has had to add the 'chipped' out short pass to his game, he does put them out for a throw more than younger keeper who has always been coached to pass and not hoof.

[Nesta99]

Thought the fouls stat was an error myself initially, I’ve never in my life seen that happen in a game. To be fair there was several times when Nelson in particular was strolling through the midfield/defence and taking the **** a bit which could’ve done with a tactical foul. On the flip side no silly free kicks on the edge of the area were given away which could’ve resulted in goals

That really is the main part of the positives from the Dundalk performance. We defended well as a single unit for long periods of pressure, runners were well tracked, no lunging in to tackles with players standing up and forcing the play in to wider positions. We werent severely carved open at will. Work ethic was excellent. If we had gotten to HT nil all and Arsenal brought on some of the big guns as we tired it probably would have been more than 3 in the end, though they did have a £79million Brazilian international reserve player on of course lol. Arsenal didnt need to risk players prior to their weekend game. With Molde winning against Vienna and considering how we did put in a good 45mins against Molde well maybe there is a point of two possible yet.

[DCWA]

Funny that for all the talk recently of Shields being past it needing replaced etc the BT Sport commentators singled him only really out for praise tonight. Rightly so as well he was excellent and the linchpin for Dundalk.

Can have no complaints with the performance, we should note that for 85 minutes of that game it was Arsenal 0-0 Dundalk just two silly mistakes and a cracking goal all in the space of a few minutes either side of half time.

Hopefully there’s the chance of picking up a point or more in there against Rapid Vienna.

[CorribsideSteve]

Admirable effort from Dundalk. Really should have held on til half time at 0-0 only for Rogers to channel his inner David James. Dundalk played very well for 35-40 minutes but in the blink of an eye it's game over at this level. Passed nicely, played out from the back every time, and pleasingly, even at 3-0 didn't resort to wasteful lumped balls forward at every moment, yet there was little going forward. I feared for them then, but a combination of Arsenal easing off, and Dundalk brave blocking kept it to a very respectable scoreline. Hoban's attempt at a free kick in the 2nd half was absolutely embarrassing though. Dundalk need to begin somehow to start signing players from the continent with experience at this level. Easy to say, I know, but that's what's needed to help them get to a higher level I think. Something outside of League 1 free transfers. Maybe their good showing tonight will ignite something in the owners regarding off-season recruitment. Reamrkable that they didn't concede a foul the whole game. Not sure what to make of it! A very 2020 thing indeed.

[sundance kid]

Such a pity it didn't go better. Dundalk were still well in with a chance for about 30 minutes, but then the warm up ended, the game started, and they didn't see the ball again.

[pineapple stu]

I doubt there is a keeper on the planet that hasnt had a few clangers if you look for them.
His age is main reason for people feeling a keeper is needed
Rogers seems to have more than most though. The Celje ones were real high-profile clangers in an important game. The goal in Alkmaar too was another one - came way off his line just to punch his opponent in the head and let the ball bounce into an empty net. I'm sure there's others.

He's been getting stick on foot for a few years now, so I don't think it's age-related. It's clanger-related. You can play a great game for 95% of the time, but if you then commit a howler, it's what you're remembered for because it can impact the game so much.



I thought that zero foul stat was an error on the BBC website, its remarkable really but not sure whether its is excellent discipline or lacking some edge. Usually when a team is chasing the ball fouls are committed, not the one dominating possession.
Funny, I was thinking of that Southampton 0-9 Leicester result when I heard the stat. Part of the reason Southampton got so badly thumped is because (red card aside) they barely put in a challenge at all that night - just three fouls in total.

Last night was a different game of course; Dundalk were happy to put ten men on the edge of the box and try stifle Arsenal. It worked in the sense that the score was kept respectable but at the expense of any sort of attacking threat (which isn't a criticism because, well, it was Arsenal v Dundalk)

Killing the game off in five minutes mayn't have been any harm either; if it was 1-0 with an hour gone, Arsenal would probably have pulled some big guns from the bench. So not stoking the bear - probably not a bad idea.

[Nesta99]

You may be on the button regarding Rogers, you'd probably get a mixed reaction from different supporters. We may even have been knocking in the goals in past league seasons that meant any howler didnt register so much. In Europe there isnt the room for error. I'm not changing tack myself but there has been criticism, some of it harsh as the good outweighs the bad eg he could have nothing to do and then pull off the spectacular save in injury time. The notable loss of form was after the Alkmaar incident, he wasnt right for a while after but got back to claiming crosses clattering anyone in his way. We've a good tradition of having great keepers at Oriel, he'd be in a top 5 i'd say but maybe fan expectations have dropped with there not being really top keepers around the league - Rovers struggled in that department until Mannus became available and had a big impact. Names like Brian Murphy, Michael Schlingermann(?) have been thrown up occasionally but are they any better than Rogers really at this stage!? Talbot also has been mentioned as a potential target, good keeper and age profile, but bleeds Bohs. McCarey getting his chance is possible. One thing for sure is that it has to be sorted sooner than later.

[2 Year Contract]

Rogers errors on the European stage have been poor, as mentioned a goal conceded for Pats vs Steaua Bucharest: https://youtu.be/CeLBoYyolWs

I also remember a few other howlers like this against Karpaty Lviv: https://youtu.be/DoBl289_jZ0

BUT in Rogers favour, the fact that he’s played circa 50 games (most in LOI history) in European competition will obviously raise the number of opportunities to make howlers. Yes he’s probably made more than any LOI keeper in Europe, but he’s also had more good games in Europe than any other LOI keeper

[mcgonigle]

Rogers seems to have more than most though. The Celje ones were real high-profile clangers in an important game. The goal in Alkmaar too was another one - came way off his line just to punch his opponent in the head and let the ball bounce into an empty net. I'm sure there's others.

He's been getting stick on foot for a few years now, so I don't think it's age-related. It's clanger-related. You can play a great game for 95% of the time, but if you then commit a howler, it's what you're remembered for because it can impact the game so much.


It must be very time consuming keeping tabs on every professional goalkeeper?

Was it a howler? Yes

Rogers is a LOI standard goalkeeper (one of the best that has played LOI). LOI standard players make mistakes, hence why they are playing LOI. There is not a goalkeeper in LOI, past or present who would not make some mistakes if they played 50 games in Europe.

I've watched Rogers more times than I can count and he has been outstanding in the most part. So forgive me if I think your opinion based on seeing him in a handful of games a season is nonsense. Also I'm probably swayed by the fact that not so long ago you were heralding some UCD keeper (so good I can't remember his name) as the next best thing, how is he getting on?

[John83]

It must be very time consuming keeping tabs on every professional goalkeeper?
Gosh, if only there was some way to sample a distribution without examining every individual datum.

[mcgonigle]

Gosh, if only there was some way to sample a distribution without examining every individual datum.

Crunch your numbers there prof and let me know where Rogers ranks on the world wide list. No less than 50,000 words.

[pineapple stu]

Yep, cos that's relevant here.

Look, the bottom line (and I'm far from the only one saying this) is Rogers is Dundalk's weak link, particularly in Europe. One of the problems Dundalk have at the moment is an ageing team with poor recruitment, and that's exemplified by the fact that, despite a number of high profile and costly blunders, he's not been replaced. Effectively Dundalk are hoping to progress by standing still.