LOI In Europe 2020

[Yossarian]

So Dundalk’s first Europa League game was moved to Tallaght because the IRFU wanted the stadium empty on the Thursday for kicking practice. Good to see the FAI have some control in the stadium that they are supposedly co owners in. Dundalk now apparently trying to move all the games to Windsor Park.

https://independent.ie/sport/soccer/league-of-ireland/dundalk-in-talks-to-play-europa-league-group-matches-in-windsor-park-39607083.html

[John83]

Kicking practice overrules an actual competitive match? I imagine the FAI have diminished clout since they shat the bed at the end of the Delaney junta, but that sounds like some fairly messed up priorities.

[The Lilywhites]

What a joke. Can't see UEFA allowing us to play in the North though, so probably all 3 games in Tallaght.

[Charlie Darwin]

UEFA would only allow it if there was no suitable venue in the 26 counties, which is clearly possible in Tallaght, so the only possibilities are the IRFU's terms or all games in Tallaght. You'd hope the FAI would be able to talk the IRFU around and have all the games in the Aviva but, if not, I'm not going to complain about SDCC getting some extra money to invest in the stadium!

[Calcio Jack]

So Dundalk’s first Europa League game was moved to Tallaght because the IRFU wanted the stadium empty on the Thursday for kicking practice. Good to see the FAI have some control in the stadium that they are supposedly co owners in. Dundalk now apparently trying to move all the games to Windsor Park.

https://independent.ie/sport/soccer/league-of-ireland/dundalk-in-talks-to-play-europa-league-group-matches-in-windsor-park-39607083.html

The reality is that the IRFU had that Thursday slot booked way in advance of Dundalk qualifying and knowing they’d have a home match that evening- stamping your feet (if true) like a petulant child and threatening to move to Windsor is not just a silly over reaction but also shows a either a complete ignorance of local politics as that I assume would anger your fans or simply Bungalow Bill ( or whatever his name is) and P6 simply don’t give a crap about the feelings of the fan base..... anyway much ado about nothing methinks

[sbgawa]

The north stand has to be paid for if we can get 10000 in for next year's euro run for rovers. :)

[Ezeikial]

The north stand has to be paid for if we can get 10000 in for next year's euro run for rovers. :)

I thought you kept up with developments at SDCC about ground rental

SDCC confirmed the 2,000 seater development of a North Stand last June - there was no caveats about it being dependent on rental income in interim.

https://www.rte.ie/sport/soccer/2020/0612/1147057-tallaght-stadium-to-get-new-stand-in-7-7m-upgrade/

Is there any indication yet of Rovers paying increased rent when the upgrade is complete?

[sbgawa]

Apparantly council are reducing the rent by whatever they get off DFC on the basis it's LOI income. Fair play to them I say

[Yossarian]

Apparantly council are reducing the rent by whatever they get off DFC on the basis it's LOI income. Fair play to them I say

The sad thing is some people on this forum will actually believe this.

[sbgawa]

It's half true tbh Sdcc have a bottom line to hit when it comes t ok the stadium in terms of local economic benefit so things like dfc chipping in or the fai with u21 games contributes. Rovers have an excellent relationship with the council so it all helps. If I had to guess why peak 6 want to play in Windsor I'd say one of the reasons although not the major one is they appreciate help in g out SDCC is helping rovers

[sidewayspasser]

If Dundalk can't play in the Aviva and don't want to play in Tallaght, could they be asked to play in Thomond instead? I assume UEFA would prefer that over Windsor as Thomond is in the 26 counties and should easily meet UEFA's Cat 4 standards.

[Ezeikial]

If Dundalk can't play in the Aviva and don't want to play in Tallaght, could they be asked to play in Thomond instead? I assume UEFA would prefer that over Windsor as Thomond is in the 26 counties and should easily meet UEFA's Cat 4 standards.

Why would Dundalk not want to play in Tallaght - the opening match against Molde was previously announced for Tallaght Stadium. Presumably if an impasse around the Aviva remains, all three home matches will take place there

It is good craic that some deluded Hoops think they and not SDCC will benefit from the rent

[sidewayspasser]

Why would Dundalk not want to play in Tallaght
Why else would they consider moving the games to Windsor - if there is any truth to that?

[sbgawa]

Why would Dundalk not want to play in Tallaght - the opening match against Molde was previously announced for Tallaght Stadium. Presumably if an impasse around the Aviva remains, all three home matches will take pla

It is good craic that some deluded Hoops think they and not SDCC will benefit from the rent

Peak 6 pay SDCC rent on the stadium helping the overall economics , it's not hard to understand really when counccilers are looking at on going support for the stadium. Given peak 6 s lack of interest in doing anything for DFC fans in oriel it is apredictable few bob a year provided DFC keep qualifying

[sbgawa]

If peak 6 are prepared to contribute to SDCC rather than spend money in oriel it helps with the economics.
If you can't see how that helps rovers you need to open your eyes

[The Lilywhites]

How many LOI grounds would actually pass for European group stage football?

If Waterford or Sligo ever made it, would they have to move their home games?

[Nesta99]

If peak 6 are prepared to contribute to SDCC rather than spend money in oriel it helps with the economics.
If you can't see how that helps rovers you need to open your eyes

SDCC have already allocated their budget for the final stand, but I suppose the additional income will help justify the outlay. Whats the rent per game? Ive heard 10k for DFC but sounds far too little. Maybe it was % of gate on top of a flat fee previously which would makes sense but not relevant this time. It helps SRFC indirectly by adding to the capacity and potential crowd for Rovers but Rover have to make use of the capacity to make any gain. So there is definitely benefit to the ground making money for SDCC and indirectly for Rovers. I dont see why Dundalk would have issue tbh unless the terms of rental get pushed out. Its frustrating that that money isnt going to Oriel Park but tbh what the rent would be would make a small impact on Oriel unless it goes on for so many games that eventually it adds up. In the mean time its a necessary option. I dont know where the Windsor Park stuff came from but I doubt the club had anything to do with those rumours. We have played enough in Tallaght and The Aviva for them to be a bit of a home from home where players are familiar with the surroundings crowd or not. Things are bad enough without crowds but at least the enclosed nature of Landsdowne and now Tallaght is a small help. Thomond is too open especially if weather is blustery. IRFU having their booking in for kicking practice but that is usually for no more than a few hours. The Dundalk game could be a night time kick-off, there just would be no training on the day beforehand. It could be managed if the FAI had a pair.

[Charlie Darwin]

How many LOI grounds would actually pass for European group stage football?

If Waterford or Sligo ever made it, would they have to move their home games?
Just Tallaght and the Aviva as far as I know. The RDS possibly too.

[Charlie Darwin]

SDCC have already allocated their budget for the final stand, but I suppose the additional income will help justify the outlay. Whats the rent per game? Ive heard 10k for DFC but sounds far too little.
Dan McDonnell said 25k for the Aviva. I can only assume Tallaght would cost more because I can't see Dundalk going out of their way to give the FAI money if there's a cheaper option.

[Nesta99]

Be interesting if the National Stadium is cheaper than Tallaght (assuming there isnt a typo above CD?) but its possible if the FAI are trying to minimise costs for clubs at the moment. Tbh I dont think the club would be bothered either way about money going to the FAI. Stories of childlike tantrums are greatly exaggerated - especially if The Aviva is cheaper. It could well be that playing in Tallaght needs some prep to host the games that is already sorted at The Aviva.

[Mr A]

Mad to think the Aviva would be cheaper than Tallaght, I was bewildered as to why you'd bother with the Aviva when fans can't go anyway. The whole thing seems a bit mad, it seems incredible that both kicking practise for the rugger and a match could not be worked around each other.

[Nesta99]

The only thing I can think of is that there is no need to either adapt a few things in Tallaght to meet UEFA requirements, seek some dispensations as opposed to everything already in place at the Aviva. Iirc there are a few requirements for Tallaght to be done to make it Cat 4. Small things eg high level camera positions behind both goals. Maybe its seen as some sort of boost for players to be playing in the national stadium with the lack of crowds. Who knows!!??

[EatYerGreens]

Be interesting if the National Stadium is cheaper than Tallaght (assuming there isnt a typo above CD?) but its possible if the FAI are trying to minimise costs for clubs at the moment. Tbh I dont think the club would be bothered either way about money going to the FAI. Stories of childlike tantrums are greatly exaggerated - especially if The Aviva is cheaper. It could well be that playing in Tallaght needs some prep to host the games that is already sorted at The Aviva.

The FAI are financially fcuked. There's no way they'd be doing an LOI club a favour on the rent for games there, unless they were afraid of losing them to somewhere else (and thereby getting no money).

[Nesta99]

The FAI are financially fcuked. There's no way they'd be doing an LOI club a favour on the rent for games there, unless they were afraid of losing them to somewhere else (and thereby getting no money).

Really???

[EatYerGreens]

Really???

It's regrettable that it had to be spelled out for you there :p

[Martinho II]

How many LOI grounds would actually pass for European group stage football?

If Waterford or Sligo ever made it, would they have to move their home games?

Our ground. Dont forget that we hosted the UEFA under 17 group stages in Bishopsgate last year. We have reopened the area behind the goal with new seats. Based on that I would be confident we would pass UEFA inspection.My only issue is that there isnt enough cover especially at the side near where Section O is.

But only if a NW/Northern side/midlands side made Europe .Think our capacity is back to over 5000 as we had 300 fans at last home game due to the new extra seats being put in!

[pineapple stu]

Longford is a long way off hosting EL group games.

Lots of grounds hosted the U17 Euros. Bray did. A few extra seats won't help them host an EL group match

[Nesta99]

Our ground. Dont forget that we hosted the UEFA under 17 group stages in Bishopsgate last year. We have reopened the area behind the goal with new seats. Based on that I would be confident we would pass UEFA inspection.My only issue is that there isnt enough cover especially at the side near where Section O is.

But only if a NW/Northern side/midlands side made Europe .Think our capacity is back to over 5000 as we had 300 fans at last home game due to the new extra seats being put in!

5000 media positions, car parking for 100k etc. Seriously though to be a Cat 4 stadium there are some ridiculous criteria for smaller leagues. Covered seating for fans probably is lower ranked than having corporate facilities. Control and medical rooms would probably cost an entire season of sold out gate receipts. Tallaght currently still needs dispensation from UEFA to be used.

[nigel-harps1954]

Tallaght and Aviva Stadium are the only Cat 4 stadia in the country as far as I'm aware. I don't think Thomond Park qualifies either.

[bohsmug]

Tallaght isn't category 4 but it's good enough that it can put a reasonable case forward for an exemption.

I read somewhere (can't remember where) that with the improvements to main stand and the new stand going up that it will bring it up to category 4. I'm not sure if that's 100% true because there is a lot needed for that but Im sure it will bring it close enough to get exemptions in the future.

[Neish]

Our ground. Dont forget that we hosted the UEFA under 17 group stages in Bishopsgate last year. We have reopened the area behind the goal with new seats. Based on that I would be confident we would pass UEFA inspection.My only issue is that there isnt enough cover especially at the side near where Section O is.

But only if a NW/Northern side/midlands side made Europe .Think our capacity is back to over 5000 as we had 300 fans at last home game due to the new extra seats being put in!

Longford host European competition, lol hat do they put in the water down ?

Its a decent ground for LOI but its miles off the standard for European competition


New seats in Longford is great but unless they are going to be covered you will end with many of them rusting and disintegrating again in 4-5 years
Need to invest more in the facilities ie hot food provided, decent toilets on section O side
Car park need extending and improving, especially since its so far out of town
Is there more then one entry/exit point to the ground? Ben 5 or 6 times and only ever seen one in operation



You may think it a bit rich a Harps fan saying this, but I know exactly what Finn Park is.

[WeAreRovers]

Tallaght Stadium - https://www.irishexaminer.com/sport/soccer/arid-31004924.html

The existing West Stand will be developed to include a medical area, mixed media zone, and new dining facilities.

This means the stadium will meet UEFA Category 4 requirements to host any European competition, including Champions League matches.

[DCSIL]

You may think it a bit rich a Harps fan saying this, but I know exactly what Finn Park is.

The more Venues can hold Top class games the better however...

No surprise you lot steaming in should anyone suggesting anyone take European games away from Tallaght.

I’m sure SB has already promised you first pick of who he’s getting rid of in the Winter.

[nigel-harps1954]

The more Venues can hold Top class games the better however...

No surprise you lot steaming in should anyone suggesting anyone take European games away from Tallaght.

I’m sure SB has already promised you first pick of who he’s getting rid of in the Winter.

May I be the first to say..

What?

[Mr_Parker]

League of Ireland side Dundalk plan to seek permission from Uefa to play their home Europa League group matches at Windsor Park in Belfast.


Dundalk wanted to hold the games at the Aviva Stadium in Dublin but it was only available for two games with the other match set for Tallaght Stadium.

Club chairman Bill Hulsizer said on Monday this would be too expensive and Windsor Park is a suitable alternative.

An IFA spokesman said the association "declined to comment at this stage".

Dundalk have home fixtures against Molde (22 October), Rapid Vienna (26 November) and Premier League giants Arsenal (11 December).

Hulsizer revealed that splitting the games between the Aviva Stadium and Tallaght Stadium would cost the club an extra 50,000 euro.

Uefa hurdle

So the plan now is to stage the games in Northern Ireland, although Uefa prefer clubs to host ties "within the territory of its jurisdiction".

Hulsizer has a company based in Belfast and claims an employee has made contact with the Irish FA.

"We have a presence in Belfast now and the manager of our data business said he knew the boss of the IFA so he has called him on our behalf," he told RTE.

"Firstly, Windsor Park needs to confirm it's available so that we're not conflicting with something that they have scheduled.

"Then UEFA has to say we can play in another jurisdiction but it's a venue that is closer to Dundalk than the Aviva or Tallaght. We're also bringing an English team from the UK into the UK so there's logic to that I think.

"I want to get it done as fast as possible because it's unfair to my staff otherwise because there is loads of work to be done to host one of these games. It's not just a case of opening the gates and letting the teams in."

He might be in for a shock at the cost of using Windsor Park.

[EatYerGreens]

He might be in for a shock at the cost of using Windsor Park.

My sat nav thingy says its 85km from Oriel to both Windsor Park and the Aviva.

His point about bringing an English team from the UK into the UK for the fixture is just random and utterly irrelevant.

[pineapple stu]

Would Linfield be bothered helping out?

Would the HSA put any extra restrictions for leaving the country?

The bould Bill does seem a bit off his rocker at times tbh. It's an empty ground; it doesn't matter how well it looks. Because it's empty, and therefore looks ****e.

[EatYerGreens]

Would Linfield be bothered helping out?

Would the HSA put any extra restrictions for leaving the country?

The bould Bill does seem a bit off his rocker at times tbh. It's an empty ground; it doesn't matter how well it looks. Because it's empty, and therefore looks ****e.

I don't think Linfield control the usage of the stadium any more ? Did they not have to do a new deal with the IFA as part of the refurbishment where they're effectively treated as tenants with strong right there now? I could be wrong.

[pineapple stu]

Oh that could be true.

Though would the IFA be more or less likely to help?

It does seem like Dundalk just announced they were playing in Lansdowne without checking its availability, and are having to backtrack now.

[Martinho II]

Longford host European competition, lol hat do they put in the water down ?

Its a decent ground for LOI but its miles off the standard for European competition


New seats in Longford is great but unless they are going to be covered you will end with many of them rusting and disintegrating again in 4-5 years
Need to invest more in the facilities ie hot food provided, decent toilets on section O side
Car park need extending and improving, especially since its so far out of town
Is there more then one entry/exit point to the ground? Ben 5 or 6 times and only ever seen one in operation



You may think it a bit rich a Harps fan saying this, but I know exactly what Finn Park is.

Fair enough I may have got carried away with myself here. Theres obviously more to it than meets the eye!

[Nesta99]

The ridiculous biased and unfair old agreement between Linfield and the IFA were changed with the redevelopment, it was an issue during NIFL participation agreements, and to get the necessary government funding iirc there had to be a change in the ownership model.

On the use of Windsor and any issue with Linfield, Dundalk and Linfield still have a very strong working relationship as they continue to work on reestablishing some version of the Dunfield project though it has been on a back burner - Pat Fenlon could be a bit of an ass about it as he was never such a big fan of Dundalk.

I'm not sure what Bill is trying to achieve by slinging stuff at the IRFU. I actually thought there was a management company over the stadium, should be a bit more independent of the associations involved with reps on a board of management rather than made up or IRFU/FAI. FG was the first to mention the Aviva, which probably jumped the gun but I'll give him a pass on making assumptions considering the unusal setup of the stadiums ownership.

I'm surprised that people werent more aware that Tallaght was getting dispensations for use as it doesnt yet fulfill all the Cat 4 criteria. Close to it but temporary work/facilities had to be provided for the group stages previously. The final stand was to include the missing pieces but it was said at the time that the cost of this was almost as much as the cost of renting it though there was cost knocked off for remedial work that could be used again.

Some of Bills points dont really stack up but I kind of like that the days of bowing and towing to sporting bodies seem to be coming to an end. That there isnt the fear of retribution if a club doesnt stick to the script. That said it is of no use to alienate people either like what has Sport Ireland to do with this specific issue with the IRFU. Again, Ive no doubts that an agreement could have happened to accomodate both the kicking practice sessions and the late ko of the game. Kicking practice wouldnt go past late afternoon. It hardly needs people there all day to prep for the EL game, the toughest issue is marking the pitch for both codes on the same day. The place is beg enough to keep groups present in opposite stands if need be like for security briefings. It could well be down to the IRFU being childish and giving a slap on the wrist over Peak6 proposals during the summer. We do like to take our pound of flesh in this country - my own glib reaction to the Fenn sacking over a decade since he annoyed me being a small but typical example.

[Demesne Lad]

Financial and IRFU/FAI/Dundalk FC issues aside, surely any professional club would prefer to play on a pitch used exclusively for soccer. I was at pitch level in Windsor Park on Sunday night and the pitch is in very good nick. The Northern Ireland Executive are more likely to allow some fans to attend, and 1,000 fans in Windsor Park would create far more of an atmosphere than the same number lost in the Aviva.

[pineapple stu]

Would the Government get involved if there was talk of 1000 Dundalk fans travelling to Belfast while covid numbers are on the rise?

I don't see why Lansdowne Road as a venue is devalued just because some eggs are chased there.

[DCWA]

The Northern Ireland Executive are more likely to allow some fans to attend, and 1,000 fans in Windsor Park would create far more of an atmosphere than the same number lost in the Aviva.

Not a chance in hell that will be permitted. There are almost constant checkpoints on the Derry / Donegal border at the minute to discourage cross border travels even into and out of areas of Donegal that are essentially Derry suburbs.

There is also likely to be tighter restrictions applied across the north very soon. Encouraging 1,000 people to travel up from Dundalk will be a big no no.

If Dundalk use Windsor, it will have to be empty.

[Mr_Parker]

I don't think Linfield control the usage of the stadium any more ? Did they not have to do a new deal with the IFA as part of the refurbishment where they're effectively treated as tenants with strong right there now? I could be wrong.

You're right they don't. The IFA set up a stadium management company to run the venue.

[Mr_Parker]

Not a chance in hell that will be permitted. There are almost constant checkpoints on the Derry / Donegal border at the minute to discourage cross border travels even into and out of areas of Donegal that are essentially Derry suburbs.

There is also likely to be tighter restrictions applied across the north very soon. Encouraging 1,000 people to travel up from Dundalk will be a big no no.

If Dundalk use Windsor, it will have to be empty.

Even if they were to allow some fans, the max would be 600.

[Nesta99]

Would the Government get involved if there was talk of 1000 Dundalk fans travelling to Belfast while covid numbers are on the rise?

I don't see why Lansdowne Road as a venue is devalued just because some eggs are chased there.

Never thought about the fans aspect with Windsor. There would bound to be some issue with Dept of Health if 1000 odd were able to travel up just 'cause of the more lax covid restrictions. Dunno how they could actually stop people travelling legally, but might ask the club to do the sensible thing and keep it bcd, if using Windsor is viable at all. If we can keep from paying the bill until the last group game and of course the round of last 32 and beyond, if brexit talks are going nowhere € to £ rate could be near parity if Bill wants to save even more money...

The pitch in the Aviva stand up pretty well for rugby games, especially if not raining but if the Dundalk game was a day after a rugby game it wouldnt be ideal.

Its weird how no matter how things change the FAI always just seem to court negative situations. Disruption (over CMs on a flight where there isnt realistically distancing), losing a couple of key attackers and then going out on penos and then is a flipping false negative covid tests. While this issue on the Aviva may be an oversight by Dundalk, it looks that the FAI have damn all clout where their club representatives in Europe are trumped by a couple of hours of kicking practice in the rugby for a game a couple of days later. If the issue was an obligation to let either Ireland or Italy have their stadium training session then yeah there is a fully legitimate issue with prepping the pitch and stadium in time for a game that night, but kicking practive even with slots for both country's kickers?

*I see its just being announced that further false positives have happened that disrupted again for Ireland v Wales - what lab was doing the tests, taking the swabs, or the batch of test were dodgy. Unusual to get false positives in a cluster unless somthing was up. FAI looking a bit daft even if not of their own doing directly though SK seems annoyed by the presence of non-football staff being present.

[MKMK]

The stadium is run by a seperate company and maybe the question Bill should answer is why Peak6 have done nothing to plan or improve Oriel Park. Throwing his toys out ofthe pram aka Trump is stupid. The IRFU would have had that booked from the moment the six nations games were refixed and i doubt anyone in the stadium company or the IRFU would not be happy to facilitate Dundalk.It has happened before and indeed I was glad to be there. Surprisingly Bill appears to have missed the point that the national rugby team is a slightly bigger deal than Dundalk.

[Neish]

The more Venues can hold Top class games the better however...

No surprise you lot steaming in should anyone suggesting anyone take European games away from Tallaght.

I’m sure SB has already promised you first pick of who he’s getting rid of in the Winter.

WTF are you scuttering on about?

I'd love to see more top class stadium around the country which could host European games, just not having someone suggesting Longford is anywhere near the standard to do so.

Who is SB and who will he be getting rid of in the winter?

[Nesta99]

The stadium is run by a seperate company and maybe the question Bill should answer is why Peak6 have done nothing to plan or improve Oriel Park. Throwing his toys out ofthe pram aka Trump is stupid. The IRFU would have had that booked from the moment the six nations games were refixed and i doubt anyone in the stadium company or the IRFU would not be happy to facilitate Dundalk.It has happened before and indeed I was glad to be there. Surprisingly Bill appears to have missed the point that the national rugby team is a slightly bigger deal than Dundalk.

Maybe there is a plan there!! Oriel Park has been improved just not as us supporters would like to see. Im not so sure that a few hours of kicking training was insurmountable so as not to be able to host the Dundalk game. Bill is just a tad brash but hey he gives some life to LoI in these quiet times. Is he wrong about the stadium losing money? No idea what Peak6 would do differently but doesnt mean they are wrong in wondering why an asset is under used.