2006 Attendances

[pineapple stu]

The Times obviously have a source that stated that crowds haven't changed significantly.
That was my question, not CTID's. And the question was whether a source was quoted, not whether there was one. And I was asking not to start getting aggressive, but out of curiousity. The only stats I've seen on the issue anywhere are these; we only started in 2003 - first season of summer soccer - and since those figures (which were overstated due in part to an overreliance on the Star), attendances are down about 40%. So either there's an alternative source, which I'd be interested in seeing, or the article was making things up.

[dcfcsteve]

That was my question, not CTID's. And the question was whether a source was quoted, not whether there was one. And I was asking not to start getting aggressive, but out of curiousity. The only stats I've seen on the issue anywhere are these; we only started in 2003 - first season of summer soccer - and since those figures (which were overstated due in part to an overreliance on the Star), attendances are down about 40%. So either there's an alternative source, which I'd be interested in seeing, or the article was making things up.

I see no reaosn for the London Times to want to make things up about Irish football attendances. To the contrary - I suspect from their editorials that they are actually against Summer football in Britain.

No source was listed, but I suspect it was the FAI. It would not be beyond the realms of belief that the FAI, however, either have no idea re attendances, or would be keen to push a positive message on Summer football.

[pineapple stu]

No source was listed, but I suspect it was the FAI. It would not be beyond the realms of belief that the FAI, however, either have no idea re attendances, or would be keen to push a positive message on Summer football.
Yep, that sounds fairly likely. Bear in mind that they couldn't give Genesis attendance figures for their report, but were happy to "review" the ones here and say "Yep, they're grand why not", then it all fits...

[pineapple stu]

400-500 at Longford-Bohs according to the Longford forum. That's estimates then for every game played in the Premier Division this season - first time ever we've gotten that far. :)

[pete]

Had a column on the Eircom league switch to Summer football, and reported that it has lead to neither a fall or an increase in attendances to any significant degree.....

I agree, attendanaces go up & down due to success & lack of success. There are now more games due to European success & Setanta Cup so its unrealistic to think that can mainly averages across all competitions. The margin for error is acceptable & no one has been able to approve that attendances would have fallen if winter football had continued.

[Student Mullet]

Well done to pineapple for all the work and to everyone who posted the attendances but I can't be the only one who finds it pathetic that this is the best record being kept of club's attendances.

Recording attendances was supposed to be a part of the Licensing but whenever I see a figure quoted somewhere official it is always off this site. The same question I raised a year ago here (http://www.stigonline.com/misc/si_genesis.htm) is still valid. Are the clubs not reporting attendance figures (in breach of the license) or is the FAI not bothering to keep a record of them?

[pete]

For good or bad official attendances should be published. Without this there is no means for telling if they improving or not.

[pineapple stu]

And on that subject, what figures will the IAG use?

[DmanDmythDledge]

Another update. 2005 and 2004 in brackets. FD and PD indicate average crowd got in a different division to current year. 1 and 2 refer to first round and second round of matches.

PREMIER DIVISION
Bohs - 1463 (1976; 2340)
Bray - 1027 (1550; 818 FD)
Cork - 2941 (3644; 4033)
Derry - 3200 (2698; 1672)
Drogheda - 1751 (1682; 1554)
Dublin City - 488 (175 FD; 592)
Longford - 702 (1004; 1131) (missing Bohs 2)
Pat's - 1342 (1599; 1882)
Shels - 1690 (1949; 2158)
Sligo - 1806 (1794 FD; 781 FD)
UCD - 546 (653; 306 FD)
Waterford - 915 (1513; 1753)

FIRST DIVISION
Athlone - 421 (316; 291)
Cobh - 368 (403; 240) (missing Finn Harps (both) and Limerick 1)
Dundalk - 1078 (474; 591)
Harps - 428 (1347 PD; 1106)
Galway - 1148 (566; 571)
Kildare - 265 (186; 298) (missing Harps 2)
Kilkenny - 122 (185; 110) (missing Cobh (both) and Kildare (both))
Limerick - 364 (669; 188)
Monaghan - 204 (183; 182) (missing Harps 2, Kildare 2 and Limerick 2)
Rovers - 1089 (1539 PD; 1349 PD)

Premier Division average - 1539 (1759)
First Division average - 570 (520)

Overall average - 1071 (1195)


Couple of changes in the top draw rankings. The list is still sorted according to clubs' final ranking in the average crowd stakes.


Team Top
PREMIER DIVISION
Derry City 6,800 v Cork
Cork City 5,500 v Shels
Sligo Rovers 2,900 v Shels
Drogheda United 2,800 v Shels
Shelbourne 4,000 v Bohs
Bohemians 3,104 v Shels
St Pat's Ath 2,145 v Shels
Bray Wanderers 2,800 v Shels
Waterford Utd 1,250 v Derry
Longford Town 1,421 v Sligo
UCD 1,250 v Shels
Dublin City 1,900 v Bohs


FIRST DIVISION
Galway United 3,092 v Rovers
Shamrock Rovers 2,000 v Dundalk
Dundalk 3,500 v Rovers
Finn Harps 700 v Rovers
Athlone Town 2,000 v Monaghan
Cobh Ramblers 800 v Rovers
Limerick FC 1,100 v Rovers
Kildare County 1,100 v Rovers
Monaghan United 800 v Rovers
Kilkenny City 278 v Dundalk
Pineapple this (http://www.derrycityfc.net/displaystory.php?storyid=661) article on the Derry City website gives figures that don't match the records compiled here. I presume they are official attendences.

[pineapple stu]

Interesting. 2272 for Cork? And Derry v Cork out by 700? Just goes to show the problems with guesstimating. I'd also be wary about unaudited "official" estimates when clubs know they're gong to be judged on attendances for next season! Although that would make our figures too high again. Still, just goes to show that my policy of prudence, although it annoys some, is probably right!

For what it's worth, I make it 280994 for the Premier compared to 257745 - an extra 10%-ish for me. And I have 96307 for all bar 11 First Division games compared to 93276 - an extra 5%-ish for me.

There was a similar announcement for last year as well; I'll see if I can find it.

[exiled_gufc_fan]

Interesting. 2272 for Cork? And Derry v Cork out by 700? Just goes to show the problems with guesstimating. I'd also be wary about unaudited "official" estimates when clubs know they're gong to be judged on attendances for next season! Although that would make our figures too high again. Still, just goes to show that my policy of prudence, although it annoys some, is probably right!

For what it's worth, I make it 280994 for the Premier compared to 257745 - an extra 10%-ish for me. And I have 96307 for all bar 11 First Division games compared to 93276 - an extra 5%-ish for me.

There was a similar announcement for last year as well; I'll see if I can find it.

Interesting to compare the estimated aggregate attendances with the officially announced (at the League AGM) aggregate figures.

"Figures announced at Fridays League AGM show Galway United just edged out champions Shamrock Rovers (1,100 to 1,081) for the highest average attendance in the eircom League First Division. In the Premier Derry City ousted Cork City as the club with the highest average attendance in the Premier Division with 3,127.
Galway United also finished top with the largest attendance at a First Division game with the meeting of United and Shamrock Rovers at Terryland Park on Friday October 6th. With both clubs chasing title glory the official attendance was recorded at 3,210.
Overall attendances in the eircom League totaled 351,021 with the Premier Division accounting for 257,745 of that figure and the First Division the remaining 93,276."

http://www.galwayunitedfc.ie/off-the-pitch-features/united-supporters-finish-top!.html

[dcfcsteve]

Interesting. 2272 for Cork? And Derry v Cork out by 700? Just goes to show the problems with guesstimating. I'd also be wary about unaudited "official" estimates when clubs know they're gong to be judged on attendances for next season! Although that would make our figures too high again. Still, just goes to show that my policy of prudence, although it annoys some, is probably right!

The Derry v Cork figure I posted here of 6,800 was PM'd to be directly by a Director of the club (along with a higher figure which isn't official). I therefore can only assume 6,080 Is a typo - particularly as the ground was jammed to the rafters that night and certainly nearer the 7,000 mark. An attendance of 6,080 would've made the ground over 20% empty - and there is absolutely no way on earth that was the case.

Whilst it may or may not suit southern clubs to over-state their attendances for the IAG, it doesn't suit Derry given that we get taxed on attendances.

Very interesting to see that Cork attendances were apparently so low, but good to see the City average figure was about right.

[Cluba06]

your calculations on attendances are way off, get your facts right

[GalwayFrancis]

your calculations on attendances are way off, get your facts right

you talking bout this thread? you do realise its pretty much all guesstimations! its the best we have, until the fai/clubs start telling the public bout the attendances

[dcfcsteve]

your calculations on attendances are way off, get your facts right

You just back from your afternoon in Merrion Square Cluba.....?

:D ;)

[pete]

I think we definitely had issues with over estimation in previous years (thats why looks like huge drop in last 2 years).

However the league press release mentioned Derry City as having highest average with just over 3000 & Cork City 300 odd below.


Cork - 2941 (3644; 4033)
Derry - 3200 (2698; 1672)

When you look at the estimated numbers above 10% isn't a huge amount to be out by when many numbers are just guessed. I think also reasonable to think the figures from a few years ago over estimated by more than 10%...?

[dcfcsteve]

I think we definitely had issues with over estimation in previous years (thats why looks like huge drop in last 2 years).

However the league press release mentioned Derry City as having highest average with just over 3000 & Cork City 300 odd below.



When you look at the estimated numbers above 10% isn't a huge amount to be out by when many numbers are just guessed. I think also reasonable to think the figures from a few years ago over estimated by more than 10%...?

Hence why there dsn't appear to have been a significant increase or decrease oin attendances verall - despite what the Summer football nay-sayers would have you believe.

[Schumi]

However the league press release mentioned Derry City as having highest average with just over 3000 & Cork City 300 odd below.
Didn't it say Cork had an average of 2,200?

[pineapple stu]

However the league press release mentioned Derry City as having highest average with just over 3000 & Cork City 300 odd below.

I think also reasonable to think the figures from a few years ago over estimated by more than 10%...?
2200 for Cork.

The first year seems to have been way too high, but I don't put that in the comparison figures for that reason. The last three years should be about as accurate as each other really - nothing's changed that much. It would still appear that crowds are down roughly 10% this year.

[pete]

Didn't it say Cork had an average of 2,200?

2,700 plus a few...

[pineapple stu]

Derry City ousted Cork City as the club with the highest average attendance in the Premier Division – 3,127 for the Foylesiders compared to 2,272 for the former champions.
Link. (http://www.derrycityfc.net/displaystory.php?storyid=661)

[pete]

Totally kills my point but there is no chance we averaged only 2,200. Lowest game probably 1500 at worst. We had couple of 5000 odd league games which would mean the remaining 15 would average at 1800.

:confused:

[pineapple stu]

My thinking too. I had 1500 - 1200 absolute minimum - for our game in Cork which clashed with the World Cup Q/F. Considering most teams seem to have suffered almost 50% dips in crowds during the World Cup, that'd have your average way up even bfeor eyou factor in the bigger games.

To be honest, I'd almost trust the figures here before I trust those ones.

[pete]

To be honest, I'd almost trust the figures here before I trust those ones.

CCFC may have their own reasosn for releasing those numbers as you don't exactly have to prove them.

Shels & Derry games near end of season had 4500-5500 each. Our crowds fluctuated a lot but 1500 would be minimum rising over 4000 for any visit of bigger teams. We had Shels & Derry at home twice.

[pineapple stu]

Annoucing lower numbers anything to do with your winding-up petition earlier? Keeping money off the books to pay your expensive squad? ;)

[Jerry The Saint]

Annoucing lower numbers anything to do with your winding-up petition earlier? Keeping money off the books to pay your expensive squad? ;)

There must be some reason. Many fans have pointed out that attendances for some big games are significantly higher than the supposed safe maximum capacity of Turner's X. Maybe they knock a couple of thousand off every game to keep the health+safety folks happy. :)

[A face]

Lads, i have unstuck this now so if you want to add anything now, get it in before if falls off the end. It is linked in the resources thread anyway if you are looking for it.

[pete]

Maybe they knock a couple of thousand off every game to keep the health+safety folks happy. :)

Capacity last year was 5500 or so seats. I don't think any suggested any figures above that...

[OneRedArmy]

We had Shels & Derry at home twice.You only had Derry at home once.

[pete]

You only had Derry at home once.

Good, just proved ye paying attention ;)