John O'Shea

[joeSoap]

He will never amount to anything, just pushing for promotion or fighting relegation.I don't admire McCarthy; never have or never will, but I do respect the job he has done at club level, firstly at Millwall where he had put a decent side together, and lets face it, he got a poor Sunderland side promoted. He has a zero budget to work from, so that poor side is automatically going to come down. Thats no reflection on him; Mourinho, Ferguson and Wenger combined couldn't keep a squad like that in the premiership.

[gustavo]

i dont think mick should have brought him to the world cup despite the fact i said he should in this (http://foot.ie/showthread.php?t=2907&highlight=shea) thread. he hadnt played for us much if at all and would have been taking the place of someone who contributed in qualifiying , anyway this is very much by the by.

[gufct]

has definitely not progressed in my eyes as an international player and hasnt had a good performance in a green shirt in some while. His lack of concentration and complacency is there for everyone to see and i feel if he starts in any position against France were in trouble.

[Stuttgart88]

Who would you pick at LB though GUFCT?

It's a tough one. Given the pace that France are likely to have upfront I think Harte would be exposed. I think Kilbane should be tried at left back but not in this game. Finnan is an option with Carr playing right back.

If O'Shea was to play like he did in Paris I'd be happy.

[joeSoap]

I'd probably go with him at left back against the french, but only if Kilbane is on the left to track back and mind the house, as O'Shea likes to get forward a lot. with Duffer on the left, you're asking for trouble with Josh as a full back. Playing Finnan wide on the right, as I think he will gives Carr a lot of cover too. My team would be:

---------------------------Given---------------------------

Carr----------Dunne--------O'Brien----------O'Shea--------

Finnan-------Keane---------A.Reid----------Kilbane--------

-----------------------------------Duff-------------------

----------------------Robbie Keane------------------------

Subs: Kenny, S.Reid, Cunningham,Morrison, Holland.


But, he ain't going to drop Captain Kenny is he??

[NeilMcD]

Drop our Captain and one of our most consistant performers for a partnership that has never been tried at any sort of level and play duff up front even though it has been shown time and time again that it does not work. I am glad Brian Kerr is the manager and not some of the posters on this site.

[joeSoap]

Drop our Captain and one of our most consistant performers for a partnership that has never been tried at any sort of level and play duff up front even though it has been shown time and time again that it does not work. I am glad Brian Kerr is the manager and not some of the posters on this site.
Opinions are what this site is all about, and you're right. Our captain is one of our most consistent performers-consistently average, and looking weaker a link every game he plays. Richard Dunne is playing the best football of his career, Andy O'Brien is getting there, and we need two centre halves with a bit of pace against the french...Cunningham is slower than the 78A.

It also has been shown time and time again that Duff does not defend well enough to confidently support an attacking full back.The point I'm trying to make is that's how I would see us doing better against the french.

I am glad Brian Kerr is the manager too....and not you or I....but I'm even more glad that I can offer up two bit opinions here. :ball:

[geysir]

snip
I think Kilbane should be tried at left back but not in this game.
He needs a bit of work for that department.
He filled in at LFB with Everton against Villareal, with regret I report that he had a dreadfull game, no awareness of LFB responsibilities - substituted early enough.

[blueviking1980]

All I'll say is he needs to get his act together... he's horrifically unpredictable on the ball since a good while... both for 'Moan' United & unfortunatly our Green Eire... :eek:

[eirebhoy]

But, he ain't going to drop Captain Kenny is he??
I bloody well hope not. The Cunningham-O'Brien partnership is as good as I've ever (literally ever) seen play for Ireland. I can only judge them on the 15 or so games they've played together and I couldn't have asked for more.

[Colie]

Failure as a left back ... .moderate success when in centre midfield ....
Couldn't agree more

[Irish_Praha]

I thought he had a pretty solid game today at right back. He played a lovely ball into the box for RVN and didn't lose his concentration when he had to defend. I guess he will be starting at RB for the next few games if Gary Neville's injury is bad. Naturally he looks much more comfortable in this position than at LB. However Ireland already have lots of decent options there (Carr, Finnan, Kelly, S. Reid). Anyway, I guess I'd have to say he's been a success so far this season. It's only 5 games into the season so we will just have to wait and see if it continues. If Manure have all their players fit will he still get a regular start?

[tetsujin1979]

I thought he had a pretty solid game today at right back. He played a lovely ball into the box for RVN and didn't lose his concentration when he had to defend. I guess he will be starting at RB for the next few games if Gary Neville's injury is bad. Naturally he looks much more comfortable in this position than at LB. However Ireland already have lots of decent options there (Carr, Finnan, Kelly, S. Reid). Anyway, I guess I'd have to say he's been a success so far this season. It's only 5 games into the season so we will just have to wait and see if it continues. If Manure have all their players fit will he still get a regular start?

He's much more comfortable in the right back slot because he's right footed, there's no need to receive the ball on his weaker foot and transfer it to his right, as he often does at left full. With Neville out for about 3 months, he should get a good run in the side at right full.

[Stuttgart88]

He's much more comfortable in the right back slot because he's right footed, there's no need to receive the ball on his weaker foot and transfer it to his right, as he often does at left full. With Neville out for about 3 months, he should get a good run in the side at right full.
I agree about him being right-footed but did you see the cross he put in for RVN with his left? It was absolutely perfect!

[NeilMcD]

Opinions are what this site is all about, and you're right. Our captain is one of our most consistent performers-consistently average, and looking weaker a link every game he plays. Richard Dunne is playing the best football of his career, Andy O'Brien is getting there, and we need two centre halves with a bit of pace against the french...Cunningham is slower than the 78A.

It also has been shown time and time again that Duff does not defend well enough to confidently support an attacking full back.The point I'm trying to make is that's how I would see us doing better against the french.

I am glad Brian Kerr is the manager too....and not you or I....but I'm even more glad that I can offer up two bit opinions here. :ball:


Ok, Name more than one time that Kenny has ****ed up for Ireland and compare it with teh amount of times that he has made last ditch tackles or is leadership skills. As anyone who plays the game would know you need a leader at the back, i.e. Tony Adams, Mick Mc Carthy John Terry, and Kenny Cunningham. O Brien and Dunne have never played together before in a competitive game and centre backs are all about partnerships they take time to come together. There is no way that Brian Kerr or any decent manager would experiment with a new central defence partnership for a major World Cup qualifying game. We can all discuss the merits of who should Partner Cunningham but to drop him is insane.

In relation to Duff, since Mourinhio has gone to Chelsea, Duffs game has become more and more defensive. I dont think it could ever be levellled at him that he does not track Back. Watching the game against Spurs he was covering the full back time and time again. In fact I would argue that he has lost a bit of his spark as he has become so disciplined. He is better at tracking back than Andy Reid is at the moment also. Not that this is is a dig at Andy Reid and Duff is one of the most disciplined footballers in the world at teh moment. That is why he gets picked week in week out for Chelsea.

[joeSoap]

I agree with you that Cunningham has been a great servant to the green over the years. My point now is that I believe that there are several other defenders out there that will make up a better back four.

I also believe that Richard Dunne possesses plenty of leadership skills- a point not lost on Stuart Pearce, who himself never lacked leadership.

For me, Brian Kerr lacks killer instinct, so will be cautious..too much so at times (Paris and twice against Israel) so will probably will stick with his highly tried Lieutenant.

I accept your points and agree with them in hindsight about Duff.

[ken foree]

hmm what if o'shea starts to play blindingly well at rb for utd.. any chance in posters' eyes that he should displace carr/finnan* at rb? not just thinking of france but beyond... i thought he did well enough vs. luque agin newcy although a few typical misplaced passes when a far more sensible option was on - scholes on sunday gave him a rollicking after he tried a hollywood up the line to rooney i think and it went out. but defending he looked sound, the only time i remember him leaving luque was when he had to cover shearer in the middle coz ferdinand was dozing.

*semi-related point, finnan is almost the key to our whole side, we are much more solid with him at right-midfield because he's decent on the ball, a competent defender, but not a tigrish tackler; him and carr almost compensate each others' weaknesses perfectly.

[Stuttgart88]

hmm what if o'shea starts to play blindingly well at rb for utd.. any chance in posters' eyes that he should displace carr/finnan* at rb? not just thinking of france but beyond... i thought he did well enough vs. luque agin newcy although a few typical misplaced passes when a far more sensible option was on - scholes on sunday gave him a rollicking after he tried a hollywood up the line to rooney i think and it went out. but defending he looked sound, the only time i remember him leaving luque was when he had to cover shearer in the middle coz ferdinand was dozing.

*semi-related point, finnan is almost the key to our whole side, we are much more solid with him at right-midfield because he's decent on the ball, a competent defender, but not a tigrish tackler; him and carr almost compensate each others' weaknesses perfectly.
I think Kerr prefers Finnan RHM away from home & Reid / Duff playing wide at home, alternating sides. For a big game like this though I'm not sure what Kerr will do. Does he keep Carr on the bench as a defensive substitution option, or Reid on the bench as an attacking option?

Personally I'd prefer to see Duff & Reid occupy the wide berths against France. Neither is weak defensively & both are an attacking threat. I think we need to take the game to France and the best way to keep their defence busy is to play both. Finnan should occupy the right-back slot in my mind simply because he's better than Carr. I like Finnan a lot & thought he & Carr did exactly what you described really well in Paris. However, I thought they were both muck in Tel Aviv. Carr was careless & Finnan was ineffective.

I've been disappointed by Finnan only once in this campaign but I've been disappointed by Carr three times (Basle, Tel Aviv & Faroes). Carr gave Kilbane a hospital pass in Basle for the Swiss equaliser and got booked stupidly. In fact Carr's two stupid yellows (second was in Tel Aviv) contributed to our poor defensive performance in the return leg. I'd like to think Carr would never have made the errors O'Shea made.

I've said before that O'Shea is better suited to right back & he played really well there in the Poland away game. Again, though, he was appalling at home to Israel in this position. At the moment Steve Finnan is our best right back in my opinion & I wouldn't start playing O'Shea there by choice ahead of him.

I'd actually like to seer Carr RHM and Finnan RB sometime. Finnan is more reliable defensively and Carr is at his best going forward. Against France though I think Carr's pace could be an asset.

I think O'Shea will start left back so the only "unknown" in Kerr's selection is which two of Carr, Finnan & Reid will play.

[eirebhoy]

I'd actually like to seer Carr RHM and Finnan RB sometime.
Same here. The reason Kerr hasn't tried it I presume is because Finnan was playing in midfield for Liverpool when we had our matches. Carr started his career out as a winger.

[tetsujin1979]

Same here. The reason Kerr hasn't tried it I presume is because Finnan was playing in midfield for Liverpool when we had our matches. Carr started his career out as a winger.
I thought he started out in central midfield? Maybe that was in the youth teams.

[joeSoap]

Carr has been quite shocking this season.,..I think e'll be lucky to start at all.

[Anto McC]

It's the first time i've been on the Ireland section on this site since the last Isreal game and i was fairly wound up at the time,I won't bother reading through the thread but i will say that

John O'Shea is the most consistantly bad international footballer i have ever seen in all my life,ever

John O'Shea - A very,very big failure

[joeSoap]

John O'Shea is the most consistantly bad international footballer i have ever seen in all my life,ever

John O'Shea - A very,very big failure
You're saying so that O'Sheas has never played a good game for his country...interesting, if insane opinion that...

[thejollyrodger]

Carr has been quite shocking this season.,..I think e'll be lucky to start at all.

He has been like that for quite a few years now. But I did see him going forward a bit more and getting crosses in at newcastle. I think his game will improve this year since its World Cup year.

[eirebhoy]

He has been like that for quite a few years now. But I did see him going forward a bit more and getting crosses in at newcastle. I think his game will improve this year since its World Cup year.
He has always got forward. He's one of the most attack minded full backs in the prem. Its his lapses in concentration and defensive woes that hsa been the problem since coming back from injury.

[joeSoap]

Playing with Newcastle can't help him.

[joeSoap]

I thought that apart from one or two silly mistakes, he was ok....much better when pushed into midfield.

[tetsujin1979]

Probably start in the centre against Cyprus, with Harte starting at left full. Can't see them attacking too much so his defensive frailties will not be exposed, while his free kicks and passes will be more effective over the course of a game, rather than in the last 10 minutes

[swinfordfc]

Much better in central midfield you mad!!!!!!
at the end of the end we 1-0 down and habve two defensive midfielders in centre of park mad!!!!!!!! we could not thread a ball forward and had to kick long all the time dont be daft oshea play instead of roy in next game but will never be like roy in middle of field simple as that!!!!

[sadloserkid]

I thought that apart from one or two silly mistakes, he was ok....much better when pushed into midfield.

I thought John O'Shea was pretty awful in the first half to be honest. Even in the second he was reasonable at best. Not impressed.

[joeSoap]

still a better option than Harte...maybe play Finnan there??

[sadloserkid]

maybe play Finnan there??

That's what I'd do, I don't think he's as transparently one-footed as O'Shea is and is a better defender anyway.

[Green Tribe]

John O'Shea bugs me sometimes, God help him, but he is so slow, he has very little reactions at all. A couple of balls last night he could have collected/gone for but he just donkeyed along.... :rolleyes:

[DruggyDrog]

O'Shea is a muppet. Take him out of the comfort zone that is playing for Man U in the awfully weak premier****, and you see him for what he is, rubbish. Simon Webb would do a better bleedin job!!

[joeSoap]

O'Shea is a muppet. Take him out of the comfort zone that is playing for Man U in the awfully weak premier****, and you see him for what he is, rubbish. Simon Webb would do a better bleedin job!!
You're funny.... :D :D
Simon Webb can't even contain Finn Harps wide men ffs...

[sadloserkid]

Simon Webb can't even contain Finn Harps wide men ffs...

I think he's by far and away the best left-full in the country (Danny Murphy deserves a mention too to be fair) and given the dearth of options we have in the position we could probably do worse than try one of them in a friendly. Derek Geary is another player who should be tryed out, I know he's another right-footer but I think he's played on the left-side before.

[joema]

I think he's by far and away the best left-full in the country (Danny Murphy deserves a mention too to be fair) and given the dearth of options we have in the position we could probably do worse than try one of them in a friendly.

Danny Murphy is English

[Superhoops]

I think he's by far and away the best left-full in the country
Confused! Is this John O'Shea you are talking abourt? If it is you must be on something!

[sadloserkid]

Danny Murphy is English

London born I know but I was under the impression that he was from an Irish background over there? Maybe one of the Cork gang could clarify?

Or has Championship Manager lied to me again? :eek:

[sadloserkid]

Confused! Is this John O'Shea you are talking abourt? If it is you must be on something!

Simon Webb.

[JamesB]

It now looks like JOSH will be increasingly important for Man U this season.
Sympathys to Heinze who could be out for the season.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/teams/m/man_utd/4248368.stm

[tetsujin1979]

It now looks like JOSH will be increasingly important for Man U this season.
Sympathys to Heinze who could be out for the season.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/teams/m/man_utd/4248368.stm
Where will John be filling in? He's been at right full recently while the Neviller is out, do you see him going to left full now?

[NeilMcD]

O Shea will do right full until Neville comes back with Richardson filling in and left full. When Neville comes back I would say O Shea will go back to left back.

[thejollyrodger]

What does everyone think of dunphys comments the other night about Josh and his performance. Him and giles (i think) reckoned that josh will never be a top class player. They are kind of resigned to the way he plays.. poor passes, out of possesion etc.

i think josh has nearly settled into what he is going to be. A utility player for united.

he should get more football now that hienze is injured (bad buzz:( ) but in several positions

[joeSoap]

O Shea will do right full until Neville comes back with Richardson filling in and left full. When Neville comes back I would say O Shea will go back to left back.I'd say Wes Brown will come in at right full and Josh will go left.

[tetsujin1979]

I'd say Wes Brown will come in at right full and Josh will go left.
I think we can at least agree John O'Shea is going to get a run in the first team for the forseeable future, in one of the two full back slots.

[Qwerty]

I think it's fair to say that if O'Shea had come through at any other club than United he wouldn't have been heralded as the new Paul McGrath etc. It is that damn ManU mythology. JOSH will not be world class or even an Irish 'legend'. I think what Richard Dunne did at Everton at an early age and out of position surpassed what O'Shea did or is as close as hardly matters, and the scribes weren't penning premature hagiographies of Dunne.

If you remove the hullabaloo and Olympian expectations JOSH is of course a success, you cannot say he is a failure because he has not yet met the expectations of soused hacks. He is still playing for United after all and not playing with Livingston for instance.

[geysir]

Was there any part of O´Shea's performance today at RB for Man U v Liv. that anyone could find fault with? I thought he had a very good all round game, for his defensive and attacking play as well as his ball distribution.

[harry crumb]

He wasnt put under much pressure today in fairness, but he did ok.

He was poor going forward I thought.

Watch Danny Murphy(Cork City), GAry Neville(Manchester), and Asley Cole(Arsenal), they all contribute going forward for the team.

It takes a bit more courage to do that though.

[geysir]

He wasnt put under much pressure today in fairness, but he did ok.
He was poor going forward I thought.
Watch Danny Murphy(Cork City), GAry Neville(Manchester), and Asley Cole(Arsenal), they all contribute going forward for the team.
It takes a bit more courage to do that though.
I can't recall one mispass, all tackles won (all 3 of them) got forward in 1st half so much I thought he was at RM.