John O'Shea

[Slash/ED]

Kerr is a very conservative manager he wont move Finnan to left back in a world cup qualifyers without doing it in a few friendlys before hand. Maybury and Dunne would not be better left backs than O'Shea.

[Plastic Paddy]

red-tinted specs? I'm not a Man U fan :confused:

I didn't say you were a follower of those particular Red hordes, but your comment is symptomatic of a fascintation with certain Lancashire-origin teams in red that seems to captivate the entire east coast of Ireland. O'Shea may play semi-regularly for ManUre's first XI, but that in itself does not an Ireland player make. On current form, he just ain't good enough. End of.

:ball: PP

[Slash/ED]

Like I said ideally I'd agree with you but atm he's the best of a bad bunch as far as left backs are concerned unless we put Finnan there and Kerr simply wont do that for a world cup qualifyer unless forced with injury.

[jimbob117]

Jimbob, did you watch the match last week and if you did you failed to comment on his beautiful backheader that left Carrol scrambling and nearly getting his Ba**s choped off in the process. The penalty was six of one half dozen of the other so i guess he was unlucky here too.Eventually this guys luck will run out and he or you wont have any more excuses.O'Shea is fine going forward but he is a very average defender who is prone to a lot of mistakes and is not the answer to our left back problem simple as that.

I did, but Carroll aint exactly the best man to have behind you to give ya confidence. I disagree with what you say, i think O'shea is a decent defender with poor distribution going forward. Think he has the ability to be a decent centre half, maybe even centre midfielder, but at the moment he lacks confidence. Hopefully he can settle down and get regular first team football, be it at utd or another decent prem club, and be given a regular position

Im sure you'll remember his lob when utd beat arsenal or when he nutmegged Figo.. shows what potential the guy has!

[Plastic Paddy]

Like I said ideally I'd agree with you but atm he's the best of a bad bunch as far as left backs are concerned unless we put Finnan there and Kerr simply wont do that for a world cup qualifyer unless forced with injury.

Fair play. That's a good analysis of the situation atm.

:) PP

[FarBeag]

Quote Jimbob117...I did, but Carroll aint exactly the best man to have behind you to give ya confidence. I disagree with what you say, i think O'shea is a decent defender with poor distribution going forward. Think he has the ability to be a decent centre half, maybe even centre midfielder, but at the moment he lacks confidence. Hopefully he can settle down and get regular first team football, be it at utd or another decent prem club, and be given a regular position

Im sure you'll remember his lob when utd beat arsenal or when he nutmegged Figo.. shows what potential the guy has!


It does not matter what the standard of goal keeping,there is no excuse for that type of headed back pass at this standard.Are we talking about the same John O' Shea here?He is not good enough in the back line at all,left,right centre even midfield.Even if he was he will never get the chance to develop into a centre while he is at United anyway.I think his distribution going forward is much better than his defending but that is another story.Like the lads said he is the best of a bad bunch but with O'Brien playing/or not playing the way he is,it does not give me much confidence in the Irish backline apart from Given,Finnan and good old Mr Reliable Kenny Cunningham.I know that Clive Clarke does not feature for Ireland much but he is a natural left back,plays regular and captains Stoke City(ok,its only stoke) but surely he is better than the others.
As for the chip he scored against Arsenal, it took him half a lifetime to realise it went in. As for his nugmeg on Figo,His only fame to claim i guess.

[Slash/ED]

As for the chip he scored against Arsenal, it took him half a lifetime to realise it went in.

What? :confused:

[jimbob117]

As for the chip he scored against Arsenal, it took him half a lifetime to realise it went in. As for his nugmeg on Figo,His only fame to claim i guess.

Isnt that 2 things????
Well have you not watched any of his performances in midfield?? He's done fairly well. You have to remember he's only young and is learning and ferguson obvviously rates him, amongst others.
I mean Cunningham was a later starter and, with experience, you refer to him as reliable. As for O'Brien, while his form for newcastle has been poor, the guy has done little wrong for Ireland. Was one of the best players against France away amongst other games.

[FarBeag]

What?

His reaction to the fact it went in was as slow as his reaction to a player running up the left wing past him. :)

[jimbob117]

What?

His reaction to the fact it went in was as slow as his reaction to a player running up the left wing past him. :)

What are ya talking about, it was a good finish, at least u should be able to acknowledge that.

[Slash/ED]

What?

His reaction to the fact it went in was as slow as his reaction to a player running up the left wing past him. :)

You can't seem to give him any credit whatsoever, have you something against him? :confused:

[FarBeag]

Quote Jimbob117..Well have you not watched any of his performances in midfield?? He's done fairly well. You have to remember he's only young and is learning and ferguson obvviously rates him, amongst others.
I mean Cunningham was a later starter and, with experience, you refer to him as reliable. As for O'Brien, while his form for newcastle has been poor, the guy has done little wrong for Ireland. Was one of the best players against France away amongst other games

Ya..I have watched him play in every position for utd and i still think he is crap.I agree with you on O'Brien though, **** for newcastle but excellent for Ireland but he is prone to bad mistakes so lets hope he carries on playing well for us.As far as Cunningham is concerned, he was not a late developer he has always been consistant while playing for the Dons but could not make the Irish team at the time due to the standard of backs we had that time.There is no comparing the two and in my opinion there never will.

[FarBeag]

Quote slash/Ed..You can't seem to give him any credit whatsoever, have you something against him?

No..Nothing what so ever apart from him being a very average football player.I don't know him personally but he appears like a sound lad.

[jimbob117]

Ya..I have watched him play in every position for utd and i still think he is crap.I agree with you on O'Brien though, **** for newcastle but excellent for Ireland but he is prone to bad mistakes so lets hope he carries on playing well for us.As far as Cunningham is concerned, he was not a late developer he has always been consistant while playing for the Dons but could not make the Irish team at the time due to the standard of backs we had that time.There is no comparing the two and in my opinion there never will.
Well we'll have to disagree. When i first was watching Cunningham, he was being kept out of the team by Keith Curle,Brian Talbot,Chris Perry and another lad whos name i cant think of off hand.(hardly world class players) cunningham wasnt a regular, and even played at right back as a fill in.
As for o'shea being crap, i think you are being way too harsh, but alas, if thats ur opinion so be it

[carnstien]

Having a go at O'Shea for scoring that OG really is a joke and shows how ridiculously biased against Manchester United some of the people are on here. The goal was entirely Carrols fault and the truth be told O'Shea was on of Uniteds better players at the weekend.

I have long thought that O'Shea's best postition is central midfield. I think that if he realises this himself he should move to get regular 1st team football in that position.

[FarBeag]

Quote..Carnstien...Having a go at O'Shea for scoring that OG really is a joke and shows how ridiculously biased against Manchester United some of the people are on here. The goal was entirely Carrols fault and the truth be told O'Shea was on of Uniteds better players at the weekend...

I have nothing against Man U what so ever and i do admire them even when they blame everything/one but themselves when they don't win games.I am pointing out some of my observations in John O' Shea's play and its my opinion that he is not a good defender. How can i be biased against Utd because of this.If I say a player in any team is not playing well,it does not mean i dislike the whole team.

[carnstien]

In England its now Chelsea Arsenal and United because they have the financial clout, The game is sick and the fans are the only ones that suffer.
There is no way you can put Arsenal in the same bracket as Chelsea and United financially. Arsenal are in the position they are in because of Wengers exceptional management. Arsenal have even less money to spend than the likes of Spurs, Newcastle and Middlesborough.

So becuase of this it could be argued that many more than those 3 teams have the potential to win the league if the were properly managed.

Its my opinion that if you put Wenger and Mourinho in charge of Newcastle and Spurs, within 5 years they would be the dominant teams in England.

[jimbob117]

Carroll's a muppet who supports Ingleland,even though he allegedly plays for another 'international' side,whilst JO'S is another,albeit high-profile,mediocre EPL centre-back/defender....unfortunately amongst the best that Ireland have got. :o

u really live up to ur name.. (gonzo was a muppet wasnt he)

Calling him a mediocre centre back, when id say you have only seen him play there 2 or 3 times is just plain ignorance. and why are you putting 'international' in ' '??hes plays for northern ireland and they are an international side, end of story. u may not like it but u gotta respect it

[NeilMcD]

Manchester United defender John O'Shea has revealed he is on the verge of signing a new four-year contract with the Old Trafford outfit.
The 24-year-old Republic of Ireland international has recently been linked with a move to Celtic.

"I am very close to signing a new four-year deal and, fingers crossed, that will be done and dusted before the start of the season," O'Shea said.

"I'm looking forward to spending more time here and enjoying more success."

O'Shea, whose present contract expires next summer, added: "When I first broke into the squad I played about 50 games a season for a couple of years.

"Last season, I took part in 37, so anywhere in between would be nice."

O'Shea made his 155th senior appearance for United against Debrecen on Tuesday.


Good News in my view, Looks like Ferguson has faith in him.

[Stuttgart88]

I've mixed views. I don't see O'Shea being in the first XI if everyone's fit. Obviously it's great if a club like MUFC has faith in a 24 yr old Irish guy but I wonder will it hinder rather than help his development.

How long was left on his contract? It could just be MUFC protecting the value of their assets.

[Peadar]

Contracts in football mean nothing these days.
Nice bit if business for the lad because he's got himself a contract that will see him paid well to warm the bench.

[tetsujin1979]

I really do worry he's going to turn into the next Phil Neville, esp now the last Phil Neville has left the club :(

[thejollyrodger]

so is he the new Phil Neville then ? i dont know where he is giong to fit in with hienze there. I dont see it as a great contract for Josh,

[Peadar]

I really do worry he's going to turn into the next Phil Neville

Some players seem to lack ambition and happy just to be at a "big" club.
Man Yoo has a history of such players, Solsjaker, Butt, P. Neville etc.
John O'Shea seems to fit the bill in that respect.

[NeilMcD]

How is winning trophies consistantly and playing at a top club lacking in ambtition. Nowadays with squad players the idea of a first 11 when everybody is fit is gone. What is Chelsea's First 11 or Arsenals. There is normally always about 3 players in a squad injured. In addition to that you have form, tactics etc, so the days of a pick yoru best 11 players is totally gone. Should Crespo be worried because Drogba played on Sunday and scored twice. He will get his chance if you are at a top club there is always competition for places. It is only further down the league and at smaller clubs were someone is certain of their place. and in my view if O Shea did that , it woudl lack ambition.

[NeilMcD]

Contracts in football mean nothing these days.
Nice bit if business for the lad because he's got himself a contract that will see him paid well to warm the bench.


37 appearance, does not sound like warming the bench at all, but sure we wont let facts get in the way.

[Peadar]

37 appearance, does not sound like warming the bench at all, but sure we wont let facts get in the way.

You're talking about the past, I'm talking about the future.
Have a seat next to him on the bench and chill out a bit! :rolleyes:

[NeilMcD]

I am grand and chilled today as I have a nice bottle of water with me with lots of ice here in work. Well the future is only opinino but O shea seems to think he will get between 37 and 50 appearance during his contract and Ferguson does too. But the past can be a good guide to the future and last season O Shea had 37 appearacne when Heinze was there so there is no reason to think he will have less appearances this season as Kleberson, Djemba Djemba and Phil Neville have all left and O Shea was competing for places in midfield with them. O Shea will not get 37 appearances at left back for Man Utd but I think he will get 37 appearances in various positions.

[Qwerty]

Contracts in football mean nothing these days.
Nice bit if business for the lad because he's got himself a contract that will see him paid well to warm the bench.

O'Shea is a good player and ManU would not allow him to walk away on a Bosman at the end of the season, and he is a valuable player in his own right. Makes sense for United all round.

[crc]

You're talking about the past, I'm talking about the future.
Have a seat next to him on the bench and chill out a bit! :rolleyes:
Actually, I've seen the future, :eek: O'Shea played 35 games for Man Yoo in 2005/6 (including 8 as a sub), but only 22 the following season (partly due to his poor performance in the World Cup in Germany)!! ;)

[Stuttgart88]

but I think he will get 37 appearances in various positions.For me, that's the problem. I'd love to see the guy specialise.

I said this recently on another thread, but it's appropriate here too: I disagree with the assertion that he's a poor passer. I just think that he's a poor passer from left-back, as he's a right footer. I think he could do a Lawrenson type role in midfield for us.

[Peadar]

I think he could do a Lawrenson type role in midfield for us.

Not likely to get that chance at club level though.
Look at all the second rate midfield players they bought over the past few season and then they stick Alan Smith in there.
Surely if they rated O'Shea he'd have been coached into that role?

On another note, I fear for Miller at Glazer Bros. :(

[thejollyrodger]

fergie is only going to be at united for another season or two ,, what going to happen to josh and mr invisble then ? i cant see the new manager being so positive about such weak performances

[Slash/ED]

I thought this thread was about him becoming a pundit :D

Can't be worse than Shearer anyway.

Hard to know what to make of O'Shea, but this is a very big year for him

[joeSoap]

Heard two lads having a very deep and meaningful at half time at the game last night about the career to date of John O'Shea. One thought that it was a roaring success, premiership and fa cup medals, near regular in the United side and a cert for Irish games.

The other wasn't convinced and doesn't rate him a success at all, thinking he's only in the Unted side to boost his value before he gets sold on, and is only in the Irish team because he's playing regularly for a massive club side.

I'm kind of caught in the middle of this...seeing both sides. What does everyone else think?? Maybe a poll, success or failure, or undecided?? :ball:

[zinedineontour]

Failure as a left back ... .moderate success when in centre midfield ....

now liam miller on the other hand total failure ...

[Stuttgart88]

Career to date? Undecided, but certainly closer to success than failure.

Last night in central midfield: success.

[Drumcondra Red]

Total failure, he's shyte!!! I really can't understand what he's doing in the Irish team, never mind the premier league!!!

[joeSoap]

To me, he's got great skill and vision and can play the game, but for a 6ft 2" strong lad, he gets muscled out of it very easily at times which is why he'll never make it as a centre-half. I think he's a decent full back though.

He suffers for his flexibility because he's never picked in the same bloody position three weeks in a row,

[JimmyP]

Failure.
Makes all the initial hope and promise invested in him now seem naive (same for Miller).
I firmly believe he's getting in the squad due to "lovely lad syndrome" (a problem McCarthy has been known to suffer from).

Why are the likes of Miller, O'Shea, and Quinn getting into the squad every single time when they have done nothing to warrant it, when others (Dunne, McGeady, S. Reid) are left "dumbfounded" by going months at a time without a call up, wondering if they pi$$ed Kerr off somehow -??
"Ah, he's a lovely lad. Gets on with everyone, tries hard, always eager to be a part of it." It's not enough. We have the players, and we're not getting the most out of them.

We need someone who is going to be clinical and detached, a la Mourinho. Hard but fair.
Don't get me wrong, I'm not calling for Kerr's head. I don't think there's any point in replacing him unless we have someone better who's ready, willing, and able to step in. I have been a fan of Kerr since he was given the job, but I've found that every game since (and including) the match in Paris has just been frustrating.

Game after game, I'm not enjoying these matches, I'm just getting frustrated watching it. Sure, over time, that feeling gets clouded by the memory of a result (wins over the likes of Faroes and China, draws away to Swiss and Israel when we actually played far, far below par), but it's just...I don't know. I've never for a second doubted that we're going to the World Cup, and I'm glad that the overall reaction on here has been surprisingly accomodating for last night (that's somewhat reassuring), but I'm losing that optimisim fast.

[Bowsy]

Posted about O'Shea on another thread but just saw this. Agree totally on the Miller score with regards to favouritism but i'm beginning to wonder if i watched a different game last night with O'Shea. I thought he was one of our best players in both positions he occupied.

[joeSoap]

Why are the likes of Miller, O'Shea, and Quinn getting into the squad every single time when they have done nothing to warrant it, when others (Dunne, McGeady, S. Reid) are left "dumbfounded" by going months at a time without a call up, wondering if they pi$$ed Kerr off somehow -??
In O'Sheas case I'd say his versatility actually helps him to make squads, given the variety of positions he can cover. Thats the same versatility that also hinders him though as he has no definitive 'position'.

[tiktok]

Failure as a left back, was worse in midfield last night, hadn't a clue what was going on.
Will get his game because Kerr won't consider any other options.

[thejollyrodger]

Im not sure about the Mourniho comment there. I think a lot of our players are confidence players and need lots of time and engergy, like clinton has been getting from kerr. I dont know if Mourniho does this kind of thing (if he does all fair & good) but kerr has taken the right approach with all the players.

As for Josh, I think he defintely has a lot of abilty, its just that mentally he doesnt seem very strong to date. I think he will come right in the end though, he will break through to the first team in Man U and he will be a solid player for us in midfield for ireland.

Miller on the other hand looks like he is going backwards

[brine3]

Only a failure if you're expecting him to live up to all the hype written about him in 2002/03.

If you take him for what he's worth, he's a good player well worth his place in the Ireland squad.

[ciaran76]

He is not a failure he just isn't as good as some media quaters think he is ! Some players just don't cope well with International football and he seems to be one of them :(

[wallis]

Its too early to say. He is still young and has a lot to learn , but you dont play central midfield for United if you are a bad player. I think he is far better in midfield than defence and a season alongside keane and co playing regular football and starting a few champions league outings could be the making of him.

Dont forget that Phil Neville was the one that Fergie let go and JOS is now playing that position so he cant be that bad !

I thought he had a good game last night and was very comfortable on the ball (which is his failing ironically at left back because of his reluctance to 'hoof it').

[tricky_colour]

Didn't see last night match but my opinion is - he's not getting any worse :D

[zinedineontour]

Didn't see last night match but my opinion is - he's not getting any worse :D

dont think that would be possible ...

[TerryPhelan]

Don't get me wrong, I'm not calling for Kerr's head. I don't think there's any point in replacing him unless we have someone better who's ready, willing, and able to step in. I have been a fan of Kerr since he was given the job, but I've found that every game since (and including) the match in Paris has just been frustrating.

Game after game, I'm not enjoying these matches, I'm just getting frustrated watching it. Sure, over time, that feeling gets clouded by the memory of a result (wins over the likes of Faroes and China, draws away to Swiss and Israel when we actually played far, far below par), but it's just...I don't know. I've never for a second doubted that we're going to the World Cup, and I'm glad that the overall reaction on here has been surprisingly accomodating for last night (that's somewhat reassuring), but I'm losing that optimisim fast.

Couldn't agree more with what you say in the last paragraph. I tend to take a pessimistic approach to Irish games as some manner of a buffer against the abject disappointment when you've expected a win - it doesn't really work though. Israel away and more particularly at home were gut-wrenchingly painful. Like you say, the manner of performance and Kerr's seeming nonchalance about what are substandard performances has me very worried - to an exponential degree now that a stronger French side are coming in 3 weeks. I know it doesn't help for an international manager to criticise his players to the press, but Kerr appears nothing but cheerful and unworried about our repeated failures to finish off weaker opposition and now, in the Italy game, to mix it with bigger teams. Case in point is his refusal to dismiss out of hand the suggestion that he might use the 4-3-3/4-5-1 system of last night against the French. Did he not see our central defence getting cut open at will every time the Italians came at us in the first half? Did he not see the amount of space allowed to Italian danger players in midfield, the Irish markers either unsighted or backing off? I tread to think what Zidane, Vieira and Henry will do if we allow them anything like the mockery that was our porous performance in the key areas last night. I remain to be convinced about our seeming ability to produce a world-beater performance.