Euro 2012 Qualifying Group B - General Discussion

[Noelys Guitar]

With Clark, Coleman, hopefully McCarthy, Mayler coming through and the resurgent Long we could have a fairly dangerous side at 2012 if we do qualify.

[Kingdom]

My team vs Macedonia

-----------------Given----------------

O'Shea------Dunne----Sledger------Clark

McGeady----Whelan---Fahey------Duff

-------------Long Doyle---------

Westwood, Foley, McCarthy, Coleman, Gibson, Stokes/Keogh, Walters
(No need for a centre half given there's 4 of them at the back)

[SwanVsDalton]

My team vs Macedonia

-----------------Given----------------

O'Shea------Dunne----Sledger------Clark

McGeady----Whelan---Fahey------Duff

-------------Long Doyle---------

Westwood, Foley, McCarthy, Coleman, Gibson, Stokes/Keogh, Walters
(No need for a centre half given there's 4 of them at the back)

That's a decent looking line-up. I suspect though, if Keane's missing, Trap might take a punt on physicality up front, opening the door to Walters or Best. If one of them (probably Best) was to score a lock of Prem goals, that might seal it.

[shakermaker1982]

Keane won't be out that long will be?

[Noelys Guitar]

My team vs Macedonia

-----------------Given----------------

O'Shea------Dunne----Sledger------Clark

McGeady----Whelan---Fahey------Duff

-------------Long Doyle---------

Westwood, Foley, McCarthy, Coleman, Gibson, Stokes/Keogh, Walters
(No need for a centre half given there's 4 of them at the back)

Pretty close if not exactly the team and bench come Macedonia injuries permitting.

[Sullivinho]

My team vs Macedonia

-----------------Given----------------

O'Shea------Dunne----Sledger------Clark

McGeady----Whelan---Fahey------Duff

-------------Long Doyle---------

Westwood, Foley, McCarthy, Coleman, Gibson, Stokes/Keogh, Walters
(No need for a centre half given there's 4 of them at the back)

I'd go along with that. Throw Coleman at them in the later stages. McCarthy on in injury time ;)

[Sullivinho]

Keane won't be out that long will be?

6 weeks apparently.

[Kingdom]

These next 3 months and a bit are crucial. They probably are the most important 14 weeks in the international career of most of the squad.
The Macedonia game obviously is must-winnable. The following 3 friendlies take on a life of their own then though, as it will give the younger guys a chance to put their own stamp on the squad.
Is it too far fetched to think that come the trip to Skopje, that the likes of Clark, Coleman, McCarthy, Stokes, Long, Foley, Wilson, and with luck the recovered Meyler, Cunningham and maybe even O'Halloran will have shown that they deserve to be hanging around the household names of the squad? It's thinking of possibilities such as this that keeps me optimistic for the future.

It does underline just how important it is that the next few months are utilised correctly. Returning from Skopje with the full compliment from the two fixtures allows the team to really push on in the big two qualifiers that follow in the autumn. If the new blood are given time in the aforementioned friendlies, it gets a rebuilding job done 9 months earlier, hopefully allowing an open minded selection in advance of Euro 2012.

A squad that up to yr end 2010 looked like:
Given, Westwood, Murphy, O'Shea, McShane, Dunne, St Ledger, Kilbane, Foley, O'Dea, Lawrence, Whelan, Andrews, Green, Fahey, Duff, Hunt, McGeady, Keane, Doyle, Folan

could in 6 months look like:

Given, Westwood, Murphy, O'Shea, Foley, Dunne, St Ledger, Clark, Cunningham, McGeady, Coleman, McCarthy, Meyler, Wilson, Gibson, Whelan, Duff, Fahey, Keane, Doyle, Long, Walters.

The dross gone from the squad, the age profile getting younger, and hopefully a bright future.

[shakermaker1982]

6 weeks apparently.

Bloody hell. I didn't hear that. Gutted because of the Macedonia game + I'm gonna have to take him out of PL fantasy football team! I'd only just brought him in.

[AlaskaFox]

could in 6 months look like:

Given, Westwood, Murphy, O'Shea, Foley, Dunne, St Ledger, Clark, Cunningham, McGeady, Coleman, McCarthy, Meyler, Wilson, Gibson, Whelan, Duff, Fahey, Keane, Doyle, Long, Walters.

The dross gone from the squad, the age profile getting younger, and hopefully a bright future.

Where did Lawrence go?

[mypost]

These next 3 months and a bit are crucial. They probably are the most important 14 weeks in the international career of most of the squad.
The Macedonia game obviously is must-winnable. The following 3 friendlies take on a life of their own then though, as it will give the younger guys a chance to put their own stamp on the squad.

There is one friendly between now and August. The NI and Scotland games are not friendlies. They're tribal derbies with points and a trophy at stake.

[Hibs4Ever]

http://backpagefootball.com/europe/accusations-cloud-russias-2012-campaign/



Interesting.......

[Kingdom]

There is one friendly between now and August. The NI and Scotland games are not friendlies. They're tribal derbies with points and a trophy at stake.

To football thoroughbreds such as myself and yourself Mypost sure, these are tribal games, with pride and continental honours at stake. To Trapatoni and the management team surely they'll remove themselves from such emotion and try to use the occasions to test untried players in pressure situations.

[elroy]

http://backpagefootball.com/europe/accusations-cloud-russias-2012-campaign/



Interesting.......

Wonder if Russia offered to pay the debt on the Aviva would JD take it!?!?

[Kingdom]

There's another friendly date on the 7th june wonder will the FAI look for opposition ?

[Wolfie]

Saturday 26th March:

Armenia v Russia
Ireland v Macedonia
Andorra v Slovakia


I know you can't get fixated with other teams doing you a favour, but Armenia really could do us (and Slovakia) a real turn here. Even a draw would leave Russia on 10 points.

That said, we need to have our own house in order, first and foremost. A win is critical for us here if we harbour any lingering aspirations to get out of the group as group winners. A win would put us on 10 points.

Slovakia beating Andorra would put them on 10 points.

[Crosby87]

Agree Wolf would nice of Armenia to some how pull one out.

[French Toasht]

Am I the only one that thinks Armenia are actually contenders in this group. Lets be honest this is a poor group and I think it is quite feasible that any team bar Andorra can actually get a top two spot.

I am all for getting on with the job in hand, which is winning our games. At the end of the group if we have not amassed sufficient points off our own bat, then other results in the group are pretty irrelevant.

What are people's thoughts on Trap's meeting with McCarthy. I can't believe a word Trap says about that after his version of events regarding the Stephen Ireland meeting. I think the fact that Wigan actively set up a meeting for McCarthy with Levein and seem to be discouraging him from playing for Ireland will be the telling factor in the end. But hey, no worries though, Glen Whelan and Keith Andrews for the next 10 years ... thats a force for anyone to reckon with .....




Saturday 26th March:

Armenia v Russia
Ireland v Macedonia
Andorra v Slovakia


I know you can't get fixated with other teams doing you a favour, but Armenia really could do us (and Slovakia) a real turn here. Even a draw would leave Russia on 10 points.

That said, we need to have our own house in order, first and foremost. A win is critical for us here if we harbour any lingering aspirations to get out of the group as group winners. A win would put us on 10 points.

Slovakia beating Andorra would put them on 10 points.

[Kingdom]

Am I the only one that thinks Armenia are actually contenders in this group. Lets be honest this is a poor group and I think it is quite feasible that any team bar Andorra can actually get a top two spot.

At the moment they're contenders and hats off to them. They still have their toughest 4 matches to come. The next 2 games is where the group should seperate, as it's the back to back meetings - and they have Russia. Now if they are no worse off (i.e. 2 behind Russia) after the return in Moscow, then they will be definitely in with a shout as they'll have as near a banker following up, and then anything coul happen.
I would be extremely disappointed if we didn't dispatch Armenia in November with no fuss. saying that once they're beaten I'll be happy-fuss or not!


I am all for getting on with the job in hand, which is winning our games. At the end of the group if we have not amassed sufficient points off our own bat, then other results in the group are pretty irrelevant.
.....

Exactly. It's why not beating Slovakia when they were there for the taking makes it really annoying. Instantly it would have compensated for the beating at home, and given us room for maneouvre later on if necessary. Every game is a cup final from now on.

[Sullivinho]

Am I the only one that thinks Armenia are actually contenders in this group. Lets be honest this is a poor group and I think it is quite feasible that any team bar Andorra can actually get a top two spot.

They've had some impressive results in the group so far and are the highest scorers with a better GA record than us. Should we qualify, Fahey's winner over there will have had a lot to do with it. With their challenging surnames and penchant for results, they're practically the new Cyprus. All I ask of them is further damage to Russia, Slovakia and Macedonia and I'm glad our next encounter with them will be in Dublin.

[AlaskaFox]

Their squad is here anyway: (translated from the FFM site, the FAI have nothing yet)
http://greenscene.me/2011/03/spotlight-fyr-macedonia/

[paul_oshea]

"Macedonia’s defence is marshalled by Mainz’s captain Nikolce Noveski. Mainz are impressing this season in the Bundesliga, sitting in 5th position. The tall stylish defender is captain of Mainz"

Did you tell us that point to instigate fear or reaffirm how good he is?

Ipsiwhc - macedonian for Ipswich :P (as per the BBC website...)

Sorry good article im only amusing myself here at work!

[Stuttgart88]

I think Armenia are the likely kingmakers rather than contenders.

In answer to French Toasht, I don't really have any reason to doubt Trap's version of events wrt meeting McCarthy. Let's just hope the issue is put to rest soon.

[AlaskaFox]

"Macedonia’s defence is marshalled by Mainz’s captain Nikolce Noveski. Mainz are impressing this season in the Bundesliga, sitting in 5th position. The tall stylish defender is captain of Mainz"

Did you tell us that point to instigate fear or reaffirm how good he is?

Ipsiwhc - macedonian for Ipswich :P (as per the BBC website...)

Sorry good article im only amusing myself here at work!

:D A small typo, nothing too serious. As for the captaincy issue, being captain of a club is important. It's something Stephen Ireland will never aspire to.

[the bear]

What are people's thoughts on Trap's meeting with McCarthy. I can't believe a word Trap says about that after his version of events regarding the Stephen Ireland meeting. I think the fact that Wigan actively set up a meeting for McCarthy with Levein and seem to be discouraging him from playing for Ireland will be the telling factor in the end. But hey, no worries though, Glen Whelan and Keith Andrews for the next 10 years ... thats a force for anyone to reckon with .....

have wigan really set up a meeting between mccarthy and scotland? i thought there stance was that they didn't want him playing internationally at all. why would they prefer he played for them over us?

[Sullivinho]

have wigan really set up a meeting between mccarthy and scotland? i thought there stance was that they didn't want him playing internationally at all. why would they prefer he played for them over us?

I believe the only meeting between Levein and McCarthy occurred early last year. (http://sport.stv.tv/football/155691-wigan-midfielder-mccarthy-says-no-to-scotland) There's been some suggestion that Wigan organised it but 'facilitated' is probably more accurate. As they presumably did with Trap last week.

[Noelys Guitar]

I didn't realise Pandev walked out on Macedonia after the 2-2 home draw against Armenia. Typical he decides to show up against us. http://www.irishtimes.com/sports/soccer/2011/0316/1224292392813.html

[Noelys Guitar]

I believe the only meeting between Levein and McCarthy occurred early last year. (http://sport.stv.tv/football/155691-wigan-midfielder-mccarthy-says-no-to-scotland) There's been some suggestion that Wigan organised it but 'facilitated' is probably more accurate. As they presumably did with Trap last week.

I wonder what part if any Whelan played in all of this?

[Noelys Guitar]

Armenia could do us a huge favour today by drawing with or beating the Russians. They will probably need to score two goals to get anything from the game. A repeat of their home performance against Slovakia might be enough.

[geysir]

I'll also have the stream of the Sri Lankan run chase against England, as a back up sweetner.

[French Toasht]

Good result tonight. Performance still leaves a lot to be desired though. The away leg is going to be a much trickier affair and in 100 degrees heat aswell, we really need to up the performance from tonight. Organised and disciplined as you would usually expect with Trap but the fact remains that in his 3 years in charge we have only won one qualifer by more than one goal ... and that was against Andorra ... by two. There seemed to be no urgency about us in the second half and no desire to put Macedonia away and this could have cost us greatly in the end.

For all the endevour and hard work in the middle of the park, had it not been for two goalkeeping errors tonight we wouldn't have scored. Would love to see McCarthy be given a chance next time out. Whelan and Gibson as a duo are offering nothing going forward ... but hey its the system ... we cant change the system ... the system is never wrong ...

[French Toasht]

Also I would just like to reiterate the fact that I believe Armenia are contenders on this group.

Only thing is they have played Russia, Slovakia and Ireland all at home. Will be interesting to see will they be as competitive on the road.

[Willum101]

An excellent 3 points from us last night! Forget about how we got it. It won't matter when we are in Poland/Ukraine. To coin a phrase from our Northern amigos - We are not Brazil!

Yesterdays matches showed there are no easy pushovers in this group. We are up against 4 very capable, evenly matched teams on their day! I'm worried about Macedonia away. At times they passed around us in midfield and in the heat of June this will be a problem.

We do however have a crucial advantage, we play the two in-form teams, Armenia and Slovakia AT HOME. 6 points here and I genuinely believe we will qualify

[Stuttgart88]

We've definitely given ourselves a chance at this stage.

Who'd settle for a point in Macedonia right now? I'm not sure. If 1.5 or 2 were on offer I would!

I think we should dig out a sheer bloody-minded, professional ugly win, like all those Baltic trips during Jack's era.

[Freoch]

I agree willum , good win and at times we played well, but still no midfield, did you notice duff coming into the center a few times to take resposibility and the fact is i wouldnt have whelan in the squad let alone first team , when you see him up close he looks confused as to how he got there , like dougle off father ted looking around thinking "How did i get here in the middle of all these professional footballers?". Gibson was awful aswell, saw him at old trafford last year and he was embarassing , never touched the ball against a second string wolves team (remember the one where mccarthy got fined), scholes was doin all the work so he got subbed. I might have Gibson on the bench based solely on the fact fergie hasnt dumped him yet (he must see something?). So where does that leave us.
Andrews - better than the other two defensively but still cant pass
Lawrence - never happen , trap doesnt like him and sees him solely as a winger/whinger
Reid, stevie - I bloody wish
Reid andy - love him but trap doesnt
Mccarthy james - trap wont please us to play him
Fahey keith - pretty much same as mccarthy
Irelan - sorry lets leave that one
carsley lee- f it , if you want a defensive midfielder trap u could at least consider the best one we've got , on crutches hed be better than whelan
Now i could list another maybe 8 players playing first team football in the championship in midfield , but thats not the same standard as sitting on the bench not being named in the subs for stoke (no disrespect to stoke intended im sure their bench is of a very nice standard)
Ha ha just had a great idea he could ask pennant and nolan ..........oh god we're doomed

good win though

[Stuttgart88]

Hmm, not sure about some of that - but Steven Reid would be great to have back. That'd improve CM no end.

[Willum101]

What's the story with stevie reid? Didn't he score the other day for West Brom? Surely he should be included in the squad in June!

Although even if he was included, Trap will not play him without a few friendlies under his belt. I expect it will be Whelan / Gibson again.

I honestly don't mind this pairing if we have o'shea and st ledger back to tighten things up. They may not get alot of praise but look the results are good so far and whats to say throwing mc carthy in would help.

[Stuttgart88]

Steven Reid has retired from international football but has said "maybe in an emergency" or something like that.

[shakermaker1982]

Macedonia away is definitely an emergency. S Reid and McCarthy in midfield would be a lovely combination.

[Bungle]

As good as Russia can be, I wouldn't be suprised if they drop points at home to either Armenia or Macedonia. They haven't reached the consistency of Germany, Spain, Holland or Italy at clinically going through qualification.

If we win against Macedonia, then I think we'll make the playoffs at least. I fancy us to grind out a result in Russia, as I think Trap's tactics will frustrate the hell out of them.

[Noelys Guitar]

We are coming up on the inside rail and that is the team that often tops the group. Russia have not scored a goal in their last three matches. And Slovakia looked poor in yesterdays game against Andorra (watched about 50mins). The last time we played Macedonia away we actually cruised for most of the game. Idiocy at the end cost us. Its not all that hostile a palce and they are now out. They probably will have a new manager. Pandev might not show up. Possibly the best time to be playing them.

[Freoch]

Was havin abit of a rant there earlier out of frustration at us constantly giving the ball away.
Realistically , the solution would be Mccarthy and maybe Andrews as the more defensive midfielder , that way you've one player that can pass in the center and my pick of the other players trap seems to like.

[Crosby87]

Freoch you are dangerously inflating your one comment per year limit!

[elroy]

We are coming up on the inside rail and that is the team that often tops the group. Russia have not scored a goal in their last three matches. And Slovakia looked poor in yesterdays game against Andorra (watched about 50mins). The last time we played Macedonia away we actually cruised for most of the game. Idiocy at the end cost us. Its not all that hostile a palce and they are now out. They probably will have a new manager. Pandev might not show up. Possibly the best time to be playing them.

I think we should be going there looking for the win. I thought we were very good in the first half last night,very composed and comfortable. In fairness to Macedonia they scored a good goal just before time which switched momentum and gave them hope. We were quite lethargic in the second half until the last ten mins or so when we actually kept the ball.

We seem to play better away from home these days and seeing as we got the win in Armenia I think we should be looking for the win away to Macedonia too. The heat in Macedonia at that time of year could be a factor but hopefully it will be an evening kick off. Dunne out is a loss so we would need JOSH and Sledger fit. Hopefully we will use the game on Tuesday and the nations cup games in May to sort out a more effective centre mid. McCarthy and Fahey would look to be an attractive alternative.

[Willum101]

A draw in Macedonia and Russia, coupled with 3 wins against Armenia, Slovakia and Andorra might even be good enough for top!! Slovakia would be out of the equation losing to us so it all depends on how Russia get on. Armenia seemed to raise their game against them, something i doubt they will do in Dublin.

[Freoch]

ha ha you f~~k~r crosby

[geysir]

Ah now, Crosby is such an attractive catch that holidaying fat english ladies in their last flush of heat, think he will offer them a céad míle fáilte,

[Stuttgart88]

I like Willum101. A card-carrying member of the Positive Club.

Hopefully he & Freoch can add to their meagre post totals.

[Wolfie]

http://http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/UEFA_Euro_2012_qualifying_Group_B (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/UEFA_Euro_2012_qualifying_Group_B)

[Noelys Guitar]

You wouldn't put too much money on Russia beating Armenia the same day we play Macedonia. Armenia should have beaten Macedonia away. They look to me like a team that is losing its fear of so called bigger nations.