Shane Long

[Charlie Darwin]

No, they're not. What's your point?

And while there might not be a Premier League team that's lost 20 games straight, there was one who went 32 without winning so it's not as if you have a point there either.

[Colbert Report]

Twenty losses in a row is a joke. The team obviously shouldn't be in the league.

[ArdeeBhoy]

If there was no LOI these players would just head over to England straightaway and get discovered much earlier.

Or get rejected....

Whatever its other failings (mainly financial instability) the domestic clubs provide a 'second chance' for many players or late(r) developers, eg. Long and Paddy McCourt.

The standard will never be the greatest, but it's not doing any harm either....

[Colbert Report]

I think it does terrible harm to the popularity of the sport in Ireland. I think there should be one club only, based in Dublin, that plays in the English tier. Think of how much better it would be if there was one team that got 50k a week out to see a Premiership match in Dublin instead of a few thousand scattered throughout the country.

[mastershake]

I think it does terrible harm to the popularity of the sport in Ireland. I think there should be one club only, based in Dublin, that plays in the English tier. Think of how much better it would be if there was one team that got 50k a week out to see a Premiership match in Dublin instead of a few thousand scattered throughout the country.

Stupid logic. Why would you want an Irish team in the Premier league when the majority of fans already support an English team. How exactly is having our own national league with the likes of shamrock roves competing well against the teams of Copenhagen's standard detrimental to the'' popularity of the sport in ireland''. We're generating players of championship standard or better now on a regular basis.Doyle, Long, Hunt,Hoolahan,Darl Murphy, Forde,Deegan, Delaney, O'Donavan even.Wake up man.

[tricky_colour]

I think it does terrible harm to the popularity of the sport in Ireland. I think there should be one club only, based in Dublin, that plays in the English tier. Think of how much better it would be if there was one team that got 50k a week out to see a Premiership match in Dublin instead of a few thousand scattered throughout the country.


That would be a bit like Cardiff City (who are in Wales). Ireland would be better off doing it like rugby, with Munster Leinster stc...

[ArdeeBhoy]

I think it does terrible harm to the popularity of the sport in Ireland. I think there should be one club only, based in Dublin, that plays in the English tier.

One small problem. Ireland's, er, not in England...

[gastric]

One small problem. Ireland's, er, not in England...

While you are obviously correct, we are still sending droves of teenagers to England every year as they are wanted by clubs there. Any plan that would keep these youngsters here until they are at an age to make up their mind about their futures would be certainly welcome by me.

[Charlie Darwin]

Twenty losses in a row is a joke. The team obviously shouldn't be in the league.
Yeah, they'll be relegated at the end of the year.


I think it does terrible harm to the popularity of the sport in Ireland. I think there should be one club only, based in Dublin, that plays in the English tier. Think of how much better it would be if there was one team that got 50k a week out to see a Premiership match in Dublin instead of a few thousand scattered throughout the country.
Football is not unpopular in Ireland. Scrapping the league and having only one club, on the other hand, would do terrible harm to the popularity of the sport in Ireland. Assuming the thousands of dedicated LOI fans in Cork, Sligo, Galway, Derry and Louth actually matter to you.

[Colbert Report]

No, they don't matter to me at all.

[BonnieShels]

Which is why you really shouldn't bother talking about the LOI in that fashion.

Absolute bullplop being talked here.
And in the week where OTB rehashed an interview with Eamo about the Dublin Dons.

Also say we did have an EPL team in Ireland. Why would it be populated exclusively by Irish players? What would stop the management purchasing foreigners to ensure success.
So we lose not only 20 or so senior clubs but the replacement club would end up just like any other EPL team.

It would be such a retrograde step and idiotic debate that any further talk about it on this forum should be punishable by a whack in the head by PoS's manbag.

[Acornvilla]

I cant believe I just read that conversation, jesus christ what an idiot

[BonnieShels]

The worst part is I responded like a suckah.

[paul_oshea]

Which is why you really shouldn't bother talking about the LOI in that fashion.

Absolute bullplop being talked here.
And in the week where OTB rehashed an interview with Eamo about the Dublin Dons.

Also say we did have an EPL team in Ireland. Why would it be populated exclusively by Irish players? What would stop the management purchasing foreigners to ensure success.
So we lose not only 20 or so senior clubs but the replacement club would end up just like any other EPL team.

It would be such a retrograde step and idiotic debate that any further talk about it on this forum should be punishable by a whack in the head by PoS's manbag.

I'm more than happy with that. I can fill it with Bricks. Its quite a strong ManBag.

[drummerboy]

What should be done is the FAI should fund an academy, top coaches, top facilities and each season a fresh batch of players are divided among the LOI clubs, similar to the the draft system in American Football.

[paul_oshea]

The only way that would be financially viable is if the FAI got significant chunks for any big money move/sell on clause. And i cant really see that happening.

Btw back on topic, I took Long was pretty annonymous bar the goal. What i do like from what i have seen recently though, is like rooney and a lot of good strikers he is making a yard of space for himself before getting a shot in. Great to see that sorta ability and awareness.

[SkStu]

What should be done is the FAI should fund an academy, top coaches, top facilities and each season a fresh batch of players are divided among the LOI clubs, similar to the the draft system in American Football.

im glad to see that someone has paid attention to my previous posts. It really is the only viable way to keep the majority of our best young players at home to learn their trade at a professional or semi professional level and also ensure that clubs get compensated appropriately when players are bought from Irish clubs. The english clubs get way, way, way too many "bargains" from the league each year. McClean and O'Donovan are an exception to the rule.

The best of the best would still probably go abroad earlier but if they were contracted to the academy then a portion of the compensation agreed could be split between all clubs in the League.

[BonnieShels]

I'm more than happy with that. I can fill it with Bricks. Its quite a strong ManBag.

Your ManBag now Paul, not your hod!

As regards your comment re Shane, is it bit this that differentiates the good from the great strikers' in that they can be anonymous for large portions of the game and then pull something out of no where?

[SwanVsDalton]

im glad to see that someone has paid attention to my previous posts. It really is the only viable way to keep the majority of our best young players at home to learn their trade at a professional or semi professional level and also ensure that clubs get compensated appropriately when players are bought from Irish clubs. The english clubs get way, way, way too many "bargains" from the league each year. McClean and O'Donovan are an exception to the rule.

The best of the best would still probably go abroad earlier but if they were contracted to the academy then a portion of the compensation agreed could be split between all clubs in the League.

What about the clubs already fairly successful at developing players and reaping the benefits? No hint of pretence here - I'm thinking of Derry predominantly although we're not the only ones who might feel aggrieved at any kind of central system. We haven't always got the best deal we could, but we're pretty good at developing quality players. OFF TOPIC at this point but I'd be curious to see your thoughts on how it would work - link to another post perhaps?

[SkStu]

SvD, ive posted on it many times a few years ago. I tried looking for them a while back but couldnt find them.

My thoughts on the problem you raise is that there is nothing to stop the clubs either a) competing with the academy if they have an adequate youth set up or b) signing the players that dont make the academy and developing these players themselves and of course retaining all transfer rights to these players - not every player would go through an FAI elite-academy.

There are obviously going to be challenges with any system and i havent thought through it all. In fact i havent thought about it much at all recently!!

[Colbert Report]

The system as it works now is just a joke, I don't think anyone here would argue with that. Our Champions League entrant routinely gets trounced by mediocre opposition in the early qualifying stages and the league is getting further and further away from being competitive in Europe every year. I watched Shamrock Rovers this year and they simply ran out of steam after about twenty or twenty five minutes, it was embarrassing to watch. The reason I say that it would be better to have one big club is that at least they'd have a shot at hanging on to the best domestic players, ie. Celtic or Rangers up in Scotland.

[Charlie Darwin]

Shamrock Rovers didn't run out of steam after 20 minutes. You were watching the wrong match because it didn't happen.

[irishfan86]

As someone who doesn't live in Ireland, I can't speak much about the quality of the league, but what I do know is that it has worked very well for the national team in terms of giving youngsters a chance who were written off or never were rated by English clubs. It's very difficult for me to comprehend missing out on the likes of Doyle, Long, Coleman and Ward, which could have happened if the LoI didn't exist. These players could very well have slipped through the cracks and then where would we be? All of these players have big parts to play in this campaign and the next.

What Colbert suggests (an Irish team in the English league) would put all of our eggs in one basket. Would the Dublin teams be able to sell tickets if there was a Dublin team in the English league? Probably not. Would the League of Ireland be able to exist without teams from Dublin? Probably not.

While the current league has its flaws, I don't think eradicating it is the sensible solution. Perhaps consolidating teams, especially in Dublin, and then using those bigger entities to gather capital for youth development would be the best route.

One option that might be worth exploring is less teams and no promotion/relegation, a la MLS. I'm not advocating a franchise system per se, but more stability in terms of expected revenue for teams could do more good for the league in the long term.

[DannyInvincible]

If there was no LOI these players would just head over to England straightaway and get discovered much earlier. Just think, if Kevin Doyle hadn't had to play for Cork City he would have just gone over and played for a League 2 team and would have been scouted much earlier. Time to get rid of the LOI, I was looking at the league table there yesterday and there's a team that has lost twenty matches in a row! What a joke, you'd never see that in the Premiership.

The 2007-08 table (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2007%E2%80%9308_Premier_League#Final_league_table) doesn't make great reading for Derby County fans.

Anyway, you can't just abolish the national league? Are you being serious?

Don't you think there's a possibility that staying in Ireland until a later age could have aided Doyle's development?


Our Champions League entrant routinely gets trounced by mediocre opposition in the early qualifying stages and the league is getting further and further away from being competitive in Europe every year. I watched Shamrock Rovers this year and they simply ran out of steam after about twenty or twenty five minutes, it was embarrassing to watch. The reason I say that it would be better to have one big club is that at least they'd have a shot at hanging on to the best domestic players, ie. Celtic or Rangers up in Scotland.

I'd argue with pretty much everything you said there.

The idea of having one Dublin club competing in the English league system is preposterous. Sure every dope knows that we should be aiming to get a club into La Liga!

[theworm2345]

The system as it works now is just a joke, I don't think anyone here would argue with that. Our Champions League entrant routinely gets trounced by mediocre opposition in the early qualifying stages and the league is getting further and further away from being competitive in Europe every year. I watched Shamrock Rovers this year and they simply ran out of steam after about twenty or twenty five minutes, it was embarrassing to watch. The reason I say that it would be better to have one big club is that at least they'd have a shot at hanging on to the best domestic players, ie. Celtic or Rangers up in Scotland.
Yeah, that 3-0 (on aggregate) "trouncing" by that "mediocre" side that only managed the Final 16 of last year's Champions League was embarrassing.

[Murfinator]

The system as it works now is just a joke, I don't think anyone here would argue with that. Our Champions League entrant routinely gets trounced by mediocre opposition in the early qualifying stages and the league is getting further and further away from being competitive in Europe every year. I watched Shamrock Rovers this year and they simply ran out of steam after about twenty or twenty five minutes, it was embarrassing to watch. The reason I say that it would be better to have one big club is that at least they'd have a shot at hanging on to the best domestic players, ie. Celtic or Rangers up in Scotland.

While I agree with your points on the LOI being utter trash I don't like your solution for a number of reasons. For one I very much doubt its within UEFA ruling having teams from one country competing in another countries league. The only examples I can think of where it happens is San Marino and a few welsh clubs and neither of those are proper countries to begin with.

[ArdeeBhoy]

To be fair, CR is talking rubbish with that 'one club, in the English league' idea.

I notice he put up this idea on here, rather than the LOI forum, or dedicated MB where'd he be shot down completely within minutes....

[BonnieShels]

While I agree with your points on the LOI being utter trash I don't like your solution for a number of reasons. For one I very much doubt its within UEFA ruling having teams from one country competing in another countries league. The only examples I can think of where it happens is San Marino and a few welsh clubs and neither of those are proper countries to begin with.


Well there's Liechtenstein clubs playing in the Swiss league as there's no Liechtensteiner league system and let's not forget Berwick Rangers of England who play in Scotland and Derry City of Ireland who play in Ireland.;)

[Stuttgart88]

To be fair, CR is talking rubbish with that 'one club, in the English league' idea.

I notice he put up this idea on here, rather than the LOI forum, or dedicated MB where'd he be shot down completely within minutes......by all the impartial members of that forum.

Look at the LOI table. Very exciting league. The clubs are doing OK and last w/e 5 LOI players that I know of scored in the EPL and C'ship. I was at tallaght when I was home recently and loved the experience. It is what it is. it's not the LOI's fault it's located in one opf the smallest countries in Europe and has other major sports and the biggest football league and system on its doorstep.

[Junior]

It would be such a retrograde step and idiotic debate that any further talk about it on this forum should be punishable by a whack in the head by PoS's manbag.


I'm more than happy with that. I can fill it with Bricks. Its quite a strong ManBag.

Whoooaaa. Hold on a minute. Is this common knowledge Paul? I've not been able to sleep at night dreaming of the moment I could release this bit of information to posters of foot.ie

Thunder stolen. gutted.

[shakermaker1982]

I've always thought Dublin vs Cork or Mayo vs Kerry in the football league would have been interesting. Football club for each county and see how you get on. Tribalism at it's finest.

[fionnsci]

I'd be ashamed to be in a ground full of supporters who had never considered supporting their local team before. No true LOI fan (the most dedicated football fans in the country) would abandon their club for some nonsense club. It's a complete non-runner. They'd get no respect from the English fans, no history, no fan culture. **** take of an idea.

[jbyrne]

the league is getting further and further away from being competitive in Europe every year.

not according to this...

"The League of Ireland's UEFA coefficient accumulates to a total value of 8.708 as of 2011, having fallen from 9.541 in 2010. Between 1998 and 2010, the league's place on the coefficent table rose 15 places, the biggest climb of any league in Europe. Its position of 29th in 2010 was also its highest since 1986."


The reason I say that it would be better to have one big club is that at least they'd have a shot at hanging on to the best domestic players, ie. Celtic or Rangers up in Scotland.

how's their european campaign going this year out of interest?

[EastTerracer]

I'd be ashamed to be in a ground full of supporters who had never considered supporting their local team before. No true LOI fan (the most dedicated football fans in the country) would abandon their club for some nonsense club. It's a complete non-runner. They'd get no respect from the English fans, no history, no fan culture. **** take of an idea.

I'd agree with all of this and these reasons are precisely why this idea has never taken off (the Dublin Dons move was first proposed back in 1997 but there were similar ideas floated even before that).

Irish-based Liverpool fans would still cheer for Liverpool, Irish-based Arsenal fans would still support Arsenal and the LoI fans would continue to support their teams so the only constituency that might support this fictional club would be the event junkies who go to any big game but sit on their hands and don't contribute to the atmosphere. A game between Dublin City and Swansea City / QPR / Wigan / Blackburn / Stoke would probably struggle to match a Shamrock Rovers home game for attendance numbers.

Also, the fiction that this would help develop Irish players needs to be challenged. Look at the Premier League teams - how many "local boys" do they really bring through the ranks? These teams are businesses and they will sign the best players they can. While there are academy rules in place the first team will be dominated by professionals from France, England, Spain, Czech Republic and Senegal like every other premier league team.

And finally, when a club like this is relegated (which it will be eventually) then the businessmen will soon disappear and there won't be any supporters' trusts stepping up to save a club with no history, tradition or local affiliation.

[fionnsci]

Furthermore, there are actually rules about entering the premier league, i.e. you have to be promoted to it. We could try and convince the bottom tier of the system, the Mid-Sussex Football league Division 11, to get on board but even they probably wouldn't get on board with this nonsense.

[tetsujin1979]

So we're all agreed then, the move to West Brom has been good for Long?

[BonnieShels]

So far so good.

[topia]

The system as it works now is just a joke, I don't think anyone here would argue with that. Our Champions League entrant routinely gets trounced by mediocre opposition in the early qualifying stages and the league is getting further and further away from being competitive in Europe every year. I watched Shamrock Rovers this year and they simply ran out of steam after about twenty or twenty five minutes, it was embarrassing to watch. The reason I say that it would be better to have one big club is that at least they'd have a shot at hanging on to the best domestic players, ie. Celtic or Rangers up in Scotland.


So you found watching Rovers embarrassing... playing against a last 16 Champions League team, in the same round as Rangers lost? What was the score the last time a LOI side played Malmo by the way?

[Colbert Report]

So you found watching Rovers embarrassing... playing against a last 16 Champions League team, in the same round as Rangers lost? What was the score the last time a LOI side played Malmo by the way?

FC Copenhagen are hardly a last 16 in the Champions League team. I know they were last season but they lost half their players and then lost today 3-1 in a Champions League qualifier to a team called Plzen, who I certainly have never heard of. Celtic and Rangers routinely make appearances in the group stages of the Champions League. Has any LOI team EVER gotten to the group stages of the Champions League?

[BonnieShels]

Cab we keep this thread about Shane Long please. This ridiculous row has home on too long.

CR, take it over to the LOI forum if you must.

[fionnsci]

Cab we keep this thread about Shane Long please. This ridiculous row has home on too long.

CR, take it over to the LOI forum if you must.

My word, don't encourage him.....

[BonnieShels]

He won't be able to find it.

[boovidge]

Furthermore, there are actually rules about entering the premier league, i.e. you have to be promoted to it. We could try and convince the bottom tier of the system, the Mid-Sussex Football league Division 11, to get on board but even they probably wouldn't get on board with this nonsense.

I would be ashamed if this Oirish franchise nonsense ever darkened the doors of Sussex football. :cool:

Interestingly, a new club Guernsey FC, has just been allowed into the Combined Counties league so it's not out of the realms of possibility.

[BonnieShels]

Not really that strange. The English FA's jurisdiction governs the Channel Islands.

[DannyInvincible]

So you found watching Rovers embarrassing... playing against a last 16 Champions League team, in the same round as Rangers lost? What was the score the last time a LOI side played Malmo by the way?

Rangers racked up another loss there this evening against Slovenian high-flyers, Maribor... Meanwhile, Shamrock Rovers battled to a very entertaining and hard-fought 1-1 draw with Partizan Belgrade. Could have won the game in the dying moments actually. Did you watch it, CR?

[Colbert Report]

No, it wasn't on television here in Canada, sorry. We're seven hours behind ye. Let's see who makes it through to the next round before we make any judgements on Shamrock Rovers vs. Rangers, shall we?

[DannyInvincible]

Funnily enough, I thought it had been yourself raising contrasts back in post #621 (http://foot.ie/threads/40993-Shane-Long?p=1519799#post1519799).

[tricky_colour]

I wonder how many goals he will put past Chelsea?

[Park_Lane]

Scored one already, great composure on the ball there. Well done shane

[tricky_colour]

here is the goal (crap quality)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wotaoMesE5Q

it will be deleted soon i expect.

Unfortunately I missed the goal, just saw a replay though in better quality.

A great start to his season at WB, joint top scorer.

Goal all of his own making robbed the defender, held off his challenge and great finish.

He almost had an assist but his pass was poor, a heavy touch.
Chelsea look poor.