Clubs divided over future LOI format?

[Lim till i die]

"You were in trouble before so you are never allowed comment on anything ever again".

SHUTDOWN THE FORUM.

[Hitman]

No one in this league can afford to have glass houses.

Unless they sell them twice or get them council funded etc.

[Jofspring]

People, i think anyone would have to find it a tad strange that GUST are being shunned by the FAI when its clear as day they need them to make up numbers. For an onlooker it would definitely appear that there is something fishy going on here. How long can the FAI block them is the question?

And Limerick are the last club that should be sticking the knife in i would have thought, given all that went on between them and the FAI before the L37 episode. The club were shunned and ye are lucky to be where ye are right now, just my opinion. But thats a standard rule of thumb in this league; wait long enough and your own club will be in some sort of turmoil at some stage. No one in this league can afford to have glass houses or to throw stones.

I don't think any limerick fans are sticking the knife in. Asking questions and not agreeing with everything Galway fans have to say on the situation doesn't mean there is something against Galway fans.

Pretty sure every limerick fan would like to see a Galway united team in the league or at least be allowed apply for the league for the right reasons and not just because they should have some kind of a right over salthill and mervue to be there.

[A face]

"You were in trouble before so you are never allowed comment on anything ever again".

Hey, if that works for you then so be it :p


I don't think any limerick fans are sticking the knife in. Asking questions and not agreeing with everything Galway fans have to say on the situation doesn't mean there is something against Galway fans.

Pretty sure every limerick fan would like to see a Galway united team in the league or at least be allowed apply for the league for the right reasons and not just because they should have some kind of a right over salthill and mervue to be there.

Ahh fair enough so. I probably should have changed the order of the paragraphs in that post, the second paragraph was more of a general point, City was in a similar situation not so long ago so i can see where they are coming from is all ..... i really wanted to ask this question ....


People, i think anyone would have to find it a tad strange that GUST are being shunned by the FAI when its clear as day they need them to make up numbers. For an onlooker it would definitely appear that there is something fishy going on here. How long can the FAI block them is the question?

I should p[oint out i haven't been keeping myself up to date on this fully either.

[Tribesman2]

There were delays in payment of wages at various times at Galway United between 2010 - 2011 - this would have been wided featured in the media and on various fora.

The "holier than thou" attitude adopted by Tribesman2 is bizarre, considering that his club only managed to pay players for the first three weeks of the 2012 season.

The original point, that a lot of players from Galway currently forced to play outside the county, would return if there was a strong Galway club in the League of Ireland, still stands.

Once again, I have no affiliation to Salthill but you and you're GUST buddies have already made your mind up who I am, which is pretty funny.

Players weren't paid for weeks on end, I know some of the lads who played under the GUST regime. They said there were blazing arguments in the dressing room just before games with players refusing to play because they hadn't been paid in weeks. The Shaun Maher case made the headlines but there was alot of younger lads who had no other income other than the 100 or so quid that they were promised by GUST every week and they often went along time without being paid. Not exactly a ringing endorsement

[Patrick Dunne]

There were delays in payment of wages at various times between 2010-2011 - I have posted this already, quoted by yourself. Hardly a revelation to anyone involved in the game in Ireland.

[Olander]

Players weren't paid for weeks on end, I know some of the lads who played under the GUST regime. They said there were blazing arguments in the dressing room just before games with players refusing to play because they hadn't been paid in weeks. The Shaun Maher case made the headlines but there was alot of younger lads who had no other income other than the 100 or so quid that they were promised by GUST every week and they often went along time without being paid. Not exactly a ringing endorsement
Some of the trash you come out with is disgusting. Anybody with a braincell would see through your posts, all you're doing is throwing mud constantly at GUST, hoping some of it will stick. I don't really mind the lemons from Limerick coming out with their usual nonsensical rubbish, they will at least engage in a debate. All you do is make accusations, most of them baseless about GUST, which I find pathetic. Every single one of your posts is about GUST. You say you're not representing Salthill (personally, I don't give a hoot who you represent), clearly you're just a martyr looking out for the good of Galway football... :rolleyes:

To address a few of your "points", never once did any player refuse to play before a game that that I know of. Yes, the players are owed money, that's common knowledge really (yet you still feel the need to make the same exhausted point over and over). Presumably, you would have been happier if Galway United fans threw in the towel halfway through the season just like Monaghan. Instead, the heads of GUST persevered and got the club to the end of the season. I know that many of them had to invest thousands of their own money to make sure players got paid. Although despite this, some of the players were left not fully paid, yes.

A ringing endorsement, that's rich. The way you go on, you'd swear the heads of GUST walked into a club with a clean slate. After the year they went through, I'm quite sure that they would be well able to run a club. Not being involved in the running of their clubs didn't stop Cork City supporters did it? Unfortunately, Cork City and Derry City left some players and staff unpaid before they were re-admitted, that didn't put a stop to their supporters taking charge and bringing on both clubs no end. There is talk of Cobh being re-admitted to the First Division also, I honestly hope they can jump through the necessary hoops required, apparently they have a few outstanding wages to pay, similar to GUST it seems. Hopefully they can work something out.

What's next on your list of mud to sling? Lemme guess, we're also being held accountable for the directors debt too? Go on ya nut! Keep her lit :cool:

[Charlie Darwin]

Once again, I have no affiliation to Salthill but you and you're GUST buddies have already made your mind up who I am, which is pretty funny.

Players weren't paid for weeks on end, I know some of the lads who played under the GUST regime. They said there were blazing arguments in the dressing room just before games with players refusing to play because they hadn't been paid in weeks. The Shaun Maher case made the headlines but there was alot of younger lads who had no other income other than the 100 or so quid that they were promised by GUST every week and they often went along time without being paid. Not exactly a ringing endorsement
Players weren't paid by their employer. GUST stepped in and paid the players, something they were never obligated to do.

[A face]

Players weren't paid by their employer. GUST stepped in and paid the players, something they were never obligated to do.

Exactly, its hardly something GUST can be blamed for, the fact that some players got anything at all is commendable to say the least.

[gufcfan]

Exactly, its hardly something GUST can be blamed for, the fact that some players got anything at all is commendable to say the least.
This is neither here nor there but as an example of the sort of thing GUST had to contend with, even before the 2011 season, GUST were paying debts belonging to the club left, right and centre. Players and management were told by the directors not to have any dealings with GUST. But as soon as they complained about not being paid, they were sent straight to GUST. I don't know for how long exactly, but as far as I know, Sean Connor was being paid by GUST a very long time before the handover of day to day running of the club happened before the 2011 season started. The CEO and directors regularly went to ground. Upset and angry players and parents of players were on to GUST looking for their money. This really was no business of GUST, but they knew the club would never pay it themselves.

Yes players were left short during the 2011 season. GUST came into a situation where as well as keeping a LOI team going, they had to deal with huge obligations towards creditors, in addition to creditors which were hidden from GUST that came out of nowhere on an almost weekly basis for months at a time. On one occasion GUST rang up a business in the city to avail of a service they provided. They mistook GUST for GU Ltd. and told them they would gladly provide the service once the matter of the 5 figure debt they left behind was sorted.

GU Ltd. hadn't paid rent on Terryland for a long time. The Galway FA wouldn't deal with Leeson because whatever payment plan they arranged with him, he would immediately renege upon it. Because GUST wanted to keep the goodwill of the Galway FA, they began paying that debt owed to them by GU Ltd.

But f*** GUST, they're nothing but conscienceless scum that couldn't organise a **** up in a brewery. :rolleyes:

[sadloserkid]

And Limerick are the last club that should be sticking the knife in i would have thought, given all that went on between them and the FAI before the L37 episode. The club were shunned and ye are lucky to be where ye are right now, just my opinion. But thats a standard rule of thumb in this league; wait long enough and your own club will be in some sort of turmoil at some stage. No one in this league can afford to have glass houses or to throw stones.

Would you ever dial down the sanctimony a bit there like a good man? Limerick the club are hardly sticking the knife in. And while you're entitled to your deeply flawed opinion Limerick managed to keep the show on the road even through the L37 crisis. Also, if you'd bothered to read my post you might have seen the part where I said that GUST should be allowed in. Still, why let that get in the way of your pontificating.


I don't think any limerick fans are sticking the knife in. Asking questions and not agreeing with everything Galway fans have to say on the situation doesn't mean there is something against Galway fans.

Pretty sure every limerick fan would like to see a Galway united team in the league or at least be allowed apply for the league for the right reasons and not just because they should have some kind of a right over salthill and mervue to be there.

I actually said that GUST should be allowed in, facts don't matter a jot to him.


I don't really mind the lemons from Limerick coming out with their usual nonsensical rubbish, they will at least engage in a debate.

Nicest thing you've ever said about us, you're getting very mellow. :)

[El-Pietro]

Unfortunately, Cork City and Derry City left some players and staff unpaid before they were re-admitted, that didn't put a stop to their supporters taking charge and bringing on both clubs no end.
Just to clarify, as far as I know, Derry aren't fans owned. I'm sure someone from up there can clarify but its a group of business people I believe.

[outspoken]

If GUST still owe players money why are they not getting the same help from the PFAI to come to some sort of agreement as Cobh Ramblers who owe 24,000?

[gufcfan]

If GUST still owe players money why are they not getting the same help from the PFAI to come to some sort of agreement as Cobh Ramblers who owe 24,000?
I don't know if players are owed anything. If there are owed anything, the debt belongs to GU Ltd. GUST paid out hundreds of thousands fighting fires lit by Leeson in the last number of years. Any debt from 2011 was caused by GUST needing put the majority of everything coming in into servicing debts left (or hidden from) for them to sort out. GUST were never in the habit of seeing people go unpaid if they could help it so if there is any debt, it is being dealt with.

None of the above has anything to do with why GUST are not being allowed to apply. Politics, cronyism and protecting themselves.

[brendy_éire]

Just to clarify, as far as I know, Derry aren't fans owned. I'm sure someone from up there can clarify but its a group of business people I believe.

That's right. Owned and run by several local businessmen.

[JC_GUFC]

I highly doubt GUST would have their pick of players like they suggest they might. They talk of Stephen O Donnell, Iarlaith Davoren, Alan Keane et al coming back to play for a Galway club but it's never going to happen. They're going to be picking from Mervue/Salthill teams if they ever get a licence. That's the reality. Players will go where the money is and that will never be in a Galway club.

I think, even you, must be blinded by some of the GUST propaganda! I don't think there was ever any suggestion that players challenging and winning League titles would run back to their home town club to play for a pittance in the First Division.

What the goal should be is that the next generation of Galway players have a club they feel can give them this opportunity. We've seen in Mervue and Salthill in the last few years that Rory Gaffney and Daryl Horgan left.

Ultimately it all comes down to whether the FAI decide to implement the Ned O'Connor report or not. You don't seem to have commited yourself either way in support of it or not - I'd be interested to know your views on it. Do you think it offers the best solution for League of Ireland football in Galway?

[gufct]

Unfortunately JC Tribesman 2 is on a fishing mission like one of his fellow club members was at on gufc.net until he realised he had actually put in his own email account rather than a bogus one which he applied to the moderators to have changed. the other 2 members of this same club have also stopped posting but are constantly on checking out whay the lunatics from Gust are at.

All parties have to endorse the implementation of the report next monday as the only ones so far to do it are Gust so its time to **** or get off the pot !!!!!!!

[Dodge]

None of the above has anything to do with why GUST are not being allowed to apply. Politics, cronyism and protecting themselves.

And geography, don't forget geography. You yourself have said many, many times there isn't room for 3 LOI clubs in Galway.

[Sean South]

I blame the cryptosporidium.

[El-Pietro]

Can't find a picture of that banner but...
Obey your thirst!

[nigel-harps1954]

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/sport/2012/1115/1224326608172.html#.UKUeA_fiag0.facebook

Big investments at Home Farm. A possible route back into League of Ireland?

[adamd164]

Harm Farm? Are they the ones that became Dublin City? Or Sporting Fingal? I can never remember!

The Dublin clubs have always been full of franchises that have come and gone... it makes it difficult to follow these things. James' Gate, St Francis, Shelbourne United, etc. :o

[Jofspring]

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/sport/2012/1115/1224326608172.html#.UKUeA_fiag0.facebook

Big investments at Home Farm. A possible route back into League of Ireland?

Looks good in fairness and they have great foundations there for a proper club.

[adamd164]

Yeah, another Dublin club would be great for the League of Ireland! :rolleyes:

[Sean South]

Harm Farm? Are they the ones that became Dublin City? Or Sporting Fingal? I can never remember!

The Dublin clubs have always been full of franchises that have come and gone... it makes it difficult to follow these things. James' Gate, St Francis, Shelbourne United, etc. :o
Cork FC, Fordsons, Cork Hibs, Cork Celtic, Cork Alberts, Cork United, Albert Rovers, Evergreen United, Cork Bohs, Cork Athletic, Cork City I, Cork City II.

Can you feel it?

[Jofspring]

Yeah, another Dublin club would be great for the League of Ireland! :rolleyes:

Have to come from somewhere and if other clubs around the country don't want to come in or aren't in a position to come in then what can you do.

[adamd164]

Cork FC, Fordsons, Cork Hibs, Cork Celtic, Cork Alberts, Cork United, Albert Rovers, Evergreen United, Cork Bohs, Cork Athletic, Cork City I, Cork City II.

Can you feel it?
You don't do sarcasm, do you mate?

[Sean South]

I do quite a lot, especially here.

[adamd164]

My point was that the Dubs never stop harking on about the older 'Cark' clubs, never stopping to think about the Dublin clubs that have gone extinct. What more have Cork City got to do with Cork Hibs than St. Pats have to do with St. James' Gate? Except the fact that the Dubs assume all 'Cark' clubs are one homogenous mass because they exist outside the Pale.

[nigel-harps1954]

In fairness, Home Farm would be one of the more traditional clubs and not one of the franchises.

[Sean South]

My point was that the Dubs never stop harking on about the older 'Cark' clubs, never stopping to think about the Dublin clubs that have gone extinct. What more have Cork City got to do with Cork Hibs than St. Pats have to do with St. James' Gate? Except the fact that the Dubs assume all 'Cark' clubs are one homogenous mass because they exist outside the Pale.
To wind you up or maybe that no Cork club managed to last 30 years in the league of Ireland...

[adamd164]

In fairness, Home Farm would be one of the more traditional clubs and not one of the franchises.

Well Harps would probably enjoy the trip to Dublin wouldn't they? Bit of variety and all that. Tell you what, once they promise not to get promoted, you can have them!

[adamd164]

To wind you up or maybe that no Cork club managed to last 30 years in the league of Ireland...
Can anyone translate this into English please? :confused:

[Charlie Darwin]

In fairness, were Home Farm to (re)launch a LOI side they'd be the most successful junior club in Dublin to make the jump.

[BonnieShels]

Termonbarry FC, Termonbarry Hibs, Termonbarry Celtic, Termonbarry Alberts, Termonbarry United, De Barra Rovers, Termonbarry Boez, Termonbarry Athletic, Termonbarry Town I, Termonbarry Town II.

Can you feel it?

I can indeed!

[nigel-harps1954]

Well Harps would probably enjoy the trip to Dublin wouldn't they? Bit of variety and all that. Tell you what, once they promise not to get promoted, you can have them!

Never even thought about the fact we hadn't any trips to Dublin in the past season.

[brendy_éire]

Never even thought about the fact we hadn't any trips to Dublin in the past season.

See, the Graveyard has it's advantages. Maybe this seven team idea isn't so bad after all.

[Dodge]

My point was that the Dubs never stop harking on about the older 'Cark' clubs, never stopping to think about the Dublin clubs that have gone extinct. What more have Cork City got to do with Cork Hibs than St. Pats have to do with St. James' Gate? Except the fact that the Dubs assume all 'Cark' clubs are one homogenous mass because they exist outside the Pale.

Its quite the opposit in fact. You lot go rasher when we point out that all the Cork clubs are seperate. Sure in recent times you've had Cork City, then Cork FORAS

St James gate aren't extinct btw.

[sadloserkid]

Can anyone translate this into English please? :confused:

Sure, he said,

To wind you up or maybe that no Cork club managed to last 30 years in the league of Ireland...

[pateen]

Its quite the opposit in fact. You lot go rasher when we point out that all the Cork clubs are seperate. Sure in recent times you've had Cork City, then Cork FORAS

St James gate aren't extinct btw.

I didnt think St Francis were either?
To be fair Home farm have a great tradition and would be a welcome addition to the league IMO.
To answer your question above Adamd164, yeah Dublin City we're 'born' out of Home Farm

[Partizan]

I didnt think St Francis were either?
To be fair Home farm have a great tradition and would be a welcome addition to the league IMO.
To answer your question above Adamd164, yeah Dublin City we're 'born' out of Home Farm

The Home Farm experiment was tried but ultimately failed. I cant see them coming back into the LOI.

[Dodge]

I didnt think St Francis were either?
Still going. Nice set up for a junior club in Baldonnel


To be fair Home farm have a great tradition and would be a welcome addition to the league IMO.
They've a great tradition in schoolboy football but they had nothing to do with the LOI side for the last few years of its life...


To answer your question above Adamd164, yeah Dublin City we're 'born' out of Home Farm

...which led to the LOI side dying, and Dublin City taking its place

[peadar1987]

I don't think another Dublin side is going to add anything massive to the league, but it wouldn't hurt it either, and it's not like we've got a surplus of teams in the league at the moment.

Does anyone know of a single person who stopped regularly attending Dalymount or Tolka because Sporting Fingal, Dublin City, or Home Farm Kidderminster Harriers sprang up?

[Spudulika]

Home Farm gave alot of players a break into senior football and it would be great to see schoolboy clubs develop senior sides, but it just isn't practical. I wonder would the FAI ever amalgamate the different amateur (senior) leagues into 1 large body and work from this. It'd be like getting sheep to agree to move to Sligo, but it would be a great step to creating a ladder for clubs to climb.

[Dodge]

Genuinely, I know a guy who used to go to both Dalymount and Tolka (and before that Whitehall too) and started to go to Fingal games regularly.

But the point really ins't about pilching fans IMO. Its about the limited pool of sponsors/resources available in Dublin. Its a lot easier, for example, for Rovers to work with SDCC as they're the only club in their area. DCC have to work with Pats, Bohs and Shels (Even DLR CC sponsor UCD). Then you have those 5 clubs hitting the same/similar sponsors. OK so SEAT or Nissan mightn't be interested in small sposnorship but so many of match/player sponsors are local. Absolutely having a team beside Tolka would hinder Shels/Bohs.

The other argument against Dublin expansion is that St James Gate, St Francis, Dubliln City and Sporting Fingal have all shown that their isn't really the appetite for another club in Dublin. All entered, all have failed to attact more than a handful of fans (despite success for some of them). So do you want a club that has a ceiling of a couple of hundred fans in the league with no real way to generate the funds required to have their ground in order? Not for me...

[Dillonman]

Surely big towns such as Mullingar, Castlebar and Kilkenny could get teams back running. Mullingar used to have two teams in the old reserve leagues. Im still wondering as to why they never went for the A Divison that time. Also to a lesser extent, there is alot of players coming out of Tipperary, can a team not reserrect itself from somewhere in the county?!

[White Horse]

Its a lot easier, for example, for Rovers to work with SDCC as they're the only club in their area. DCC have to work with Pats, Bohs and Shels (Even DLR CC sponsor UCD).

As a matter of interest do local authority councils work with teams in other towns? I don't recall Louth CC doing anything for Dundalk FC or Drogheda United.

[peadar1987]

Genuinely, I know a guy who used to go to both Dalymount and Tolka (and before that Whitehall too) and started to go to Fingal games regularly.

But the point really ins't about pilching fans IMO. Its about the limited pool of sponsors/resources available in Dublin. Its a lot easier, for example, for Rovers to work with SDCC as they're the only club in their area. DCC have to work with Pats, Bohs and Shels (Even DLR CC sponsor UCD). Then you have those 5 clubs hitting the same/similar sponsors. OK so SEAT or Nissan mightn't be interested in small sposnorship but so many of match/player sponsors are local. Absolutely having a team beside Tolka would hinder Shels/Bohs.

The other argument against Dublin expansion is that St James Gate, St Francis, Dubliln City and Sporting Fingal have all shown that their isn't really the appetite for another club in Dublin. All entered, all have failed to attact more than a handful of fans (despite success for some of them). So do you want a club that has a ceiling of a couple of hundred fans in the league with no real way to generate the funds required to have their ground in order? Not for me...

Good point, I hadn't really considered competition for sponsorship.

I'd agree with Dillonman that there are a lot of places out there that could and should have LOI teams, Navan, Kerry, Cobh, Castlebar, Kildare, Portlaoise, Kilkenny, Mullingar, Tullamore, Carlow, Mallow, Nenagh and Ennis all have larger populations than Longford, for example, with no real LOI presence. Some teams from those places have folded for various reasons, but if an average attendance in the low hundreds is all that's needed to sustain an LOI club, I think all of those places should be able to field a team in theory.

Perhaps it would help if the FAI had a fund for encouraging new clubs to join the league, a zero- or low-interest loan available on a one-off basis to any club looking to upgrade its facilities and attract a fanbase in the first few seasons. We've seen countless times that a little investment in marketing and publicity almost always pays off in the end, so why not incentivise that?

[culloty82]

Good point, I hadn't really considered competition for sponsorship.

I'd agree with Dillonman that there are a lot of places out there that could and should have LOI teams, Navan, Kerry, Cobh, Castlebar, Kildare, Portlaoise, Kilkenny, Mullingar, Tullamore, Carlow, Mallow, Nenagh and Ennis all have larger populations than Longford, for example, with no real LOI presence. Some teams from those places have folded for various reasons, but if an average attendance in the low hundreds is all that's needed to sustain an LOI club, I think all of those places should be able to field a team in theory.

Perhaps it would help if the FAI had a fund for encouraging new clubs to join the league, a zero- or low-interest loan available on a one-off basis to any club looking to upgrade its facilities and attract a fanbase in the first few seasons. We've seen countless times that a little investment in marketing and publicity almost always pays off in the end, so why not incentivise that?

Generally, that's the primary role of provincial associations in both GAA and rugby, to assist clubs in improving facilities, drawing down grants to help development and raising standards within their regional remit. For the most part, junior football bailiwicks are too small to provide the level of help you suggest, so that would appear to be a prime role for the Munster, Leinster and Connacht FAs, with further input into such a scheme from Abbotstown if required.

[bennocelt]

Surely big towns such as Mullingar, Castlebar and Kilkenny could get teams back running. Mullingar used to have two teams in the old reserve leagues. Im still wondering as to why they never went for the A Divison that time. Also to a lesser extent, there is alot of players coming out of Tipperary, can a team not reserrect itself from somewhere in the county?!

Mullingar Town made a push for the first but were knocked back for Kildare and Dublin City - and look at how they turned out.
Having said that both Mullingar Town and Mullingar Athletic both gone backwards since then, playing in some god damn awful Midlands league with the likes of Clara and Ballyjamesduff. Gone the heady days when the Town had a team of exotic players from London, doing half decent in the Under 21 league, now we have nothing at all.:mad: