Liverpool

[KK77]

I didn't see the West Ham match properly but I thought he was nothing more the average in the other two, despite the excellent results or slaughterings if you will:rolleyes:

I just said he played in them that's all. You always seem to have a smart reply when i post. You'd nearly think you were a Man U fan:rolleyes:

[DeLorean]

I just said he played in them that's all. You always seem to have a smart reply when i post. You'd nearly think you were a Man U fan:rolleyes:

I'm only keeping you on your toes Rafa. Don't know it's probably the username that sets me off, or your inability(refusal??) to see things clearly concerning Liverpool. I take it back though, I somehow thought you were implying that he contributed heavily to that fine performance, in the Theatre of Dreams against the 3 in-a-row record equalling Champions!!

[KK77]

I'm only keeping you on your toes Rafa. Don't know it's probably the username that sets me off, or your inability(refusal??) to see things clearly concerning Liverpool. I take it back though, I somehow thought you were implying that he contributed heavily to that fine performance, in the Theatre of Dreams against the 3 in-a-row record equalling Champions!!

Only a club with five european cups could produce such a performance!!!!!!!

[DeLorean]

Only a club with five european cups could produce such a performance!!!!!!!

Yes it's not like Fulham did something similar a week later, and they didn't even have Lucas

[old git]

Roma are letting him go because they're not in the champions league this year and Aquilani hasn't played much for Roma because he is injury prone- Harry Kewell II anyone?

just signed a five year deal wth liverpool .... out injured since march and not expected to be fit to play for liverpool for 6-8 weeks
lot of money for a player not available for selection for nearly 2 months :ball:

[brianw82]

Added to this, its no coincidence that when Liverpool play a more fluid attacking game rather than a tactical defensive, counter attacking game, based on squeezing the life out of teams then he is at his best ie: Newcastle away and Man u away last season( incidently Alonso did not start either game). His natural position is as an attacking midfielder and with Alonsos departure and the possible change of tactics by Benitez, he will have more freedom and get to show his natural game.

He played an eye-of-the-needle ball for Gerrard's second goal against Newcastle. Only good thing I've ever seen him do, though. And Newcastle were a shambles that day (and every other day!)

[old git]

just signed a five year deal wth liverpool .... out injured since march and not expected to be fit to play for liverpool for 6-8 weeks
lot of money for a player not available for selection for nearly 2 months :ball:

more injury worries as carragher limps of after 15 mins of match today against atletico madrid ... lost 2-1 but at least lucas scored :D: also skertel and agger both doubtfull for start of season now also strong rumours of benitez wanting to sign michael turner from hull city as cover for centre half :ball:

[Noli]

I thought he was only talking to Phil about the weather?? :D in all seriousness if he does want turner he better not pay silly money

[reder]

more injury worries as carragher limps of after 15 mins of match today against atletico madrid ... lost 2-1 but at least lucas scored :D: also skertel and agger both doubtfull for start of season now also strong rumours of benitez wanting to sign michael turner from hull city as cover for centre half :ball:

Id say Carragher and Torres will be fit. It will be interesting to see how much Turner goes for.

[KK77]

Yes it's not like Fulham did something similar a week later, and they didn't even have Lucas

The week after being the key here yet weeks previous lay down and died at Old Trafford.

[Roadend]

lot of money for a player not available for selection for nearly 2 months :ball:

That's true, they should have halved the fee because he's unavailable for the first month, or possibly two, of his 5 year deal.

[DeLorean]

The week after being the key here yet weeks previous lay down and died at Old Trafford.

So Fulham took inspiration from Liverpool's win is it? until that they thought is was impossible to beat United? I don't think they went to OT with the intention of rolling over, they were just outplayed by a considerably better side playing at home, nothing too unusual about that.

[KK77]

So Fulham took inspiration from Liverpool's win is it? until that they thought is was impossible to beat United? I don't think they went to OT with the intention of rolling over, they were just outplayed by a considerably better side playing at home, nothing too unusual about that.

Yawns:D:D:D:

[DeLorean]

Yawns:D:D:

Another quality post. I feel the same way when watching your beloved Liverpool:p

Anyway...I hear Torres is a doubt for Sunday?

[stojkovic]

Yawns:D:D:D:

Its YNWA.

[Razors left peg]

Its YNWA.

is that You'll Never Win Again???

sorry couldnt resist :)

[Noli]

i really do wonder what fans of other clubs obsession with all things concerning liverpool, is it the class,is it the way they behave themselves in post match comments,is it the way benitez doesnt have to double up with other managers to talk about other clubs?
is it the fact that we have our own songs,our own tradition and it hasnt been marketed with tacky names like the peoples club or theater of dreams, theres no point biting to these people.

The league kicks off next week and rafa and the lads are coming up that hill!no 19 here we come

[Razors left peg]

i really do wonder what fans of other clubs obsession with all things concerning liverpool, is it the class,is it the way they behave themselves in post match comments,is it the way benitez doesnt have to double up with other managers to talk about other clubs?
is it the fact that we have our own songs,our own tradition and it hasnt been marketed with tacky names like the peoples club or theater of dreams, theres no point biting to these people.

The league kicks off next week and rafa and the lads are coming up that hill!no 19 here we come

or maybe its because alot of Liverpool fans talk shyte like that!!

[reder]

it hasnt been marketed with tacky names like the peoples club or theater of dreams.

That is by fault rather than design and Ian Ayre and his comrades are busy 'fixing' this. The club is slowly catching up on the marketing front and the new membership scheme, whatever it is called, will turn out to be just as tacky as either of the above.

[KK77]

[QUOTE=DeLorean;1209148]Another quality post. I feel the same way when watching your beloved Liverpool:p

]

Don't watch them then;)

[DeLorean]

i really do wonder what fans of other clubs obsession with all things concerning liverpool

Yes, because Liverpool fans never concern themselves with what's going on at OT. They never give out about Ronaldo diving, Fergies outbursts, dodgy penalty decisions, Barcelona beating them in Champions League Final. Big clubs take notice of other big clubs, it's just the way it is.


is it the class

Probably not I'm thinking seeing as they've won one major trophy in about 20 yrs. Don't even think the FA Cup is considered major anymore.


is it the way they behave themselves in post match comments

Definitely not seeing as Rafa is one of the biggest moaners going. So is Fergie by the way but at least I won't try to defend him.


is it the way benitez doesnt have to double up with other managers to talk about other clubs?

Not Fergies fault if big Sam agreed with him:D


is it the fact that we have our own songs,our own tradition and it hasnt been marketed with tacky names like the peoples club or theater of dreams, theres no point biting to these people

Own songs- Yes what was the name of the scouser that wrote The Fields of Anfield Road again, he was very talented!!
Own tradition- why who does Man United's tradition belong to?

I pretty much agree with you on the tacky marketing side of things.


Don't watch them then;)

And miss out on all those pathetic draws against Stoke, Hull, West Ham, etc....never!!:D

[KK77]

And miss out on all those pathetic draws against Stoke, Hull, West Ham, etc....never!!:D[/QUOTE]


Suppose you could be watching them beat your team 4-1!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Noli]

or maybe its because alot of Liverpool fans talk shyte like that!!

Every team has fans that dont know there arse from their elbow,some fans actually are real football fans and can appreciate good play and tactics weather it be their own team or another on the other hand you have blinkered fools who think they have the best stadium/fans/striker/manager whatever

[DeLorean]

Suppose you could be watching them beat your team 4-1!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Risk I'm willing to take, law of averages would suggest it won't happen too often.

[gustavo]

Is anyone else bored with this Liverpool Manchester United bickering?

[DeLorean]

Every team has fans that dont know there arse from their elbow,some fans actually are real football fans and can appreciate good play and tactics weather it be their own team or another on the other hand you have blinkered fools who think they have the best stadium/fans/striker/manager whatever

As much as this is a very reasonable post it's hard to believe it came from the same person as your previous post.

[DeLorean]

Is anyone else bored with this Liverpool Manchester United bickering?

I must admit I don't enjoy slagging matches, seems it always turns into this though. Would much prefer to actually discuss the topic properly but it never seems to happen. I think whenever a United/Pool fan says something not complimentary about the other side, even if it's an honest and fair point, the other crowd go on the defensive instead of suggesting points to the contrary.

[Noli]

My point about class was that some teams such as City and Chelsea along with villa to a lesser extent think that because you have money to spend it makes you a big team,it does not. Winning like United have done consistently over the past 16 years has.

Rafa can have a moan alright but fergie is smarter when he has a moan,thats why hes only been reprimanded once in 17 seasons.

I agree with the FA cup not being a major competition anymore and its sad because it used to have a magic to it,but only the big 4 have one it since the bitters won it in 95. I think the way there is no real reward for winning it has diminished the value of the competition,but how do you make it exciting?offer a champions league spot and it would diminish the "champions league" even more.

Since 95 liverpool have won a few fa cups,league cups,uefa cup,super cup there hardly what liverpool fans want,its the league we all want, but football goes in cycles, remember the 26 years united had to wait before they won there first league???the champions league and league are the only two competitions really worth winning.

My point about tradition is that some fans are more interested in running down other teams rather than celebrating there own triupmhs,its rather sad(just like the way i received a rake load of texts from lads celebrating kerrys win last bh mon but thats a different kettle of fish)

and pathetic draws against stoke hull and west ham can be compared with inept performances away to Fulham,home and away to liverpool or drawing at home to newcastle early last season im sure that was a classic match :D

[Noli]

I must admit I don't enjoy slagging matches, seems it always turns into this though. Would much prefer to actually discuss the topic properly but it never seems to happen. I think whenever a United/Pool fan says something not complimentary about the other side, even if it's an honest and fair point, the other crowd go on the defensive instead of suggesting points to the contrary.


Thats a very fair shout there,i think sometimes pride stops common sense winning

[De Town]

Suppose you could be watching them beat your team 4-1!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Since when was a league title won on the basis of 1 result?

[Noli]

Been reading a thread on another forum, talking about how we might play at home this season, and someone commented on Gus Hiddink talking about how important it was to "cover Arbeloa as the 3rd man".

"When Reina has possesion of the ball - Rafa is adamant (and rightly so) that its harder for 2 forwards to mark 3 defenders as opposed to 4 (with 4 defenders 2 forwards can split them, but generally teams play with 1 up so if you have 4 defenders the 1 stikers splits the 2 centre halfs). What Rafa has them doing is as soon as Reina gets possession the LB and Carragher spread out to the touchline leaving 1 centre half (Agger/Skrtel) in the middle and Arbeloa acts as a right midfielder and Dirk tucks right in.

They do it every time . . . now and again they do it down the left but not often.

Its amazing to see Kuyt/Reira when they tuck in - they literally run in a straight line in-field."

It's amazing to think that the above is probably 1% of the match tactics that Rafa will have drilled into the team!

Such little details he has into the team, to which im also doing my coaching badges at the moment, i wonder is there any other gems out there that people are using,

[KK77]

Since when was a league title won on the basis of 1 result?

I was having a laugh. Heaven forbid!

[De Town]

I was having a laugh. Heaven forbid!
Surely the whole 4-1 thing is a bit old at this stage though?!:o

[KK77]

Surely the whole 4-1 thing is a bit old at this stage though?!:o

Surely you can see i was having a laugh?!!!!!!!

[Noli]

As much as this is a very reasonable post it's hard to believe it came from the same person as your previous post.


Yup it is,im as much a football man as im a liverpool fan! im player manager of Killavilla United B team,im obsessed with details of the game,tactics play etc

i can appreciate play like i said sometimes can get wrapped up in the bickering so apologies if i offended anyone!:o

[De Town]

Surely you can see i was having a laugh?!!!!!!!

How many times can you get a laugh out of the same joke for the last 4 or 5 months?!

[KK77]

How many times can you get a laugh out of the same joke for the last 4 or 5 months?!

Bangs head on table several times:(

[DeLorean]

Rafa and Noli- we'll try to discuss Pool's chances properly so we no crap. Obviously ye both hope they'll win the PL but how do ye think they'll fare honestly? Will they get as many points as last year? How badly will they miss Alonso? Will United be much more beatable (points wise) now that Ronaldo and Tevez are gone? Will Chelsea get better or worse?

[Noli]

I think Man City will have a big influence on the destination of the premiership, they wont win it. The top 3 in no particular order will be Chelsea,Man Utd,Liverpool it will all depend on how many points the likes of Arsenal, City, Villa and Everton manage to knick off the the others.

I dont think Alonso will be as big as loss as the red tops make it out to be, he was good last year but terrible the previous two years i know injuries had made it tough. With Aquailani coming in he will play further up the pitch along with Johnson i would say its an improvement of Arbeloa/Alonso turning those glorious draws into wins ;)

Chelsea will be there or there abouts but it all depends on how Carlo settles into the premiership, itll be tough so alot will depend on the backroom team and JT. Chelsea need a player or two as for me there far too rigid and and can only play the one system making it easier for teams to play against.
Malouda improved as the season went on and Joe Cole coming back from injury will be a big boost for them,he grabs a few goals(usually matchwinners)
I reckon theyll finish 3rd though when on form they can be leathal.

Man United are still favourites-mean defence lethal going forward but that was last year, its going to be tough to replace the man who scored 42 goals two seasons ago and also a rake load of goals last year. looking at Uniteds midfield its not quite as potent as in the keane/schole/beckham/giggs era it looks a bit narrow, therell be a lot of pressure on the newboy valencia as he only scored 2 goals in the premiership for Wigan, MO will always score goals but alot will depend on how fit he can manage to stay.
Fergie has said he isnt going to spend money this summer,but dont rule out a suprise buy or a transfer window buy,hes smart he knows citeh and real have inflated the prices of players to a crazy level. i reckon they will still have enough know how to win it,but i dont think 90 points will be needed to win it. Will the loss of Tevez settle the dressing room?now that hes gone theres no speculation of dressing room discontent between him and fergie it also means rooney can be the main man instead of being shunted out to the left where he is wasted imo, i reckon theyll be champions but just....

[Razors left peg]

Noli you say that you dont think that Alonso will be as big a loss as the papers make him out to be because even though he was good last season he wasnt the 2 seasons before that..... does that not coincide with Liverpool improving last season on the previous 2 seasons? As I see it Alonsos form last season was a major influence on why Liverpool were so close in the end

[Noli]

Noli you say that you dont think that Alonso will be as big a loss as the papers make him out to be because even though he was good last season he wasnt the 2 seasons before that..... does that not coincide with Liverpool improving last season on the previous 2 seasons? As I see it Alonsos form last season was a major influence on why Liverpool were so close in the end

Yeah Xabi was good last year,but i dont think he was the sole reason for the improvement in the team, I think stats can be twisted and turned for the benefit of each side of the arguement, i think Xabi didnt score enough goals or get enough assists.15 goals in 138 isnt a great return for a midfielder

I think the team was more balanced last year with Riera adding width on the left,i know his form dipped mid season but he found his form again,players like yossi and dirk getting some vital goals also made the team stronger.

[DeLorean]

15 goals in 138 isnt a great return for a midfielder

It's pretty normal for a holding midfielder though, which Benitez essentially turned him into. I agree with your point about stats being turned this way and that to suit arguments, like Lucas playing in Liverpool's best performances last season for example, but I think Alonso was a key player and will be missed. Ye don't have many players that can retain the ball, even Gerrard gives it away constantly, generally when trying to create something when it's not really on. I have a feeling that Liverpool are going to have a slow start to the season and improve but it depends on United and Chelsea's starts as to how difficult it will be for Liverpool to get back into it.

[reder]

Liverpool are the favourites to win the league in many pundits eyes and I concur with caution. Up until the departure of Xabi, I most definitely would have agreed given the manner in which the team finished the league but 2 issues concern me.

The departure of Alonso is a massive blow. He was excellent last season and for me, a massive part of the improvement in league form. If Liverpool cant plug the gap resulting from his departure quickly, it will lead to a poor start to the season and unease/disenchantment will cloud Anfield pretty quickly. If this happens, its bye-bye title time.

One other thing that people tend not to mention is how different Liverpool performed when they were on top in the league compared with when they were chasing. Pre-Xmas and during the new year period, Liverpool had to chance to pull away from the chasing pack but failed to do so. However, during their brilliant run of form in the 2nd half of the season, they were playing catch-up and thus had far less pressure on them. If they get ahead this season, can they pull away if the chance presents itself?

[KK77]

It's pretty normal for a holding midfielder though, which Benitez essentially turned him into. I agree with your point about stats being turned this way and that to suit arguments, like Lucas playing in Liverpool's best performances last season for example, but I think Alonso was a key player and will be missed. Ye don't have many players that can retain the ball, even Gerrard gives it away constantly, generally when trying to create something when it's not really on. I have a feeling that Liverpool are going to have a slow start to the season and improve but it depends on United and Chelsea's starts as to how difficult it will be for Liverpool to get back into it.


Fair point about Lucas. Cost £6 million and classed as a flop. But as you say things can be turned around to suit whatever way you want. For example Berbaflop £30 million, Nani £18million. That's close on £50 million yet no
return or dare i say criticism.

By the way Alonso was no more a holding player than Jan Molby was. His main role was to create chances and get the ball moving quickly to the wingers and forwards which to his credit he did last season extremely well. But lets not get carried away with ourselves he also played in all the draws we had that cost us the title. Was at 26 games last season and one for example stands out Stoke at home when when for all his passes sideways and forwards it was an attacking midfielder we needed that day breaking into the box. Suppose your right though it's easy to turn it to make it look the way you want. For example Alonso has all of a sudden become the hearbeat of the Liverpool side of last season and Owen is a goalscoring genius.

[osarusan]

For example Alonso has all of a sudden become the hearbeat of the Liverpool side of last season and Owen is a goalscoring genius.
Both of those things have been said far and wide for quite a while now. Nothing sudden about them.

[KK77]

Both of those things have been said far and wide for quite a while now. Nothing sudden about them.

I'd say a month is sudden enough. Now if they had been said over the last couple of seasons well then that would be different:p

[DeLorean]

I always considered Alonso a key player for Liverpool, even in the couple of seasons when he was supposed to be playing badly. Is he more replacable than Gerrard or Torres...yes, will he still be difficult to replace...yes.

I've nothing against Lucas by the way, it suits me fine that he's been poor in my opinion so far. Of course he could come good. Look at Fletcher at United, I wanted him shot for a good 3+ seasons at United but he has developed into a very useful squad player.

I wouldn't bee too eager to jump to Berbatov's defence either as his attitude doesn't dererve defending, but he has undoubted quality and I'd be slow to write him off completely. As for Nani I thought he had a relatively good first season with United, contributing fairly heavily from the bench and being involved in a lot of goals. His form seemed to dip in a big way last season and was rarely used. This will be a big season for him.

Michael Owen has always been a goal scorer supreme. It's very difficult to know what level he's at right now but I delighted with the gamble, if you could even call it that. He always came across as a good honest lad as well so I hope it works out for him.

[Noli]

. However, during their brilliant run of form in the 2nd half of the season, they were playing catch-up and thus had far less pressure on them. If they get ahead this season, can they pull away if the chance presents itself?

A team rarely goes from 3rd to being champions the next year, in 91 leeds pipped utd to the title and they learnt there lesson the following year they won it, its all about learning to deal with the pressure and not "crack up" If they dont win it next year,id expect a clear out and maybe even rafa leaving. I still think there a player or two short,a player that can create a goal out of nothing and a second decent quality striker

[Noli]

Was just checking some goal stats out there Essien has 11 goals in 102 games for Chelsea and in comparison Carrick has 9 goals in 102 games, thats not really a great return for midfielders is it? Scholes has 98 in 402 games which is much better

[Roo69]

Fair point about Lucas. Cost £6 million and classed as a flop. But as you say things can be turned around to suit whatever way you want. For example Berbaflop £30 million, Nani £18million. That's close on £50 million yet no return or dare i say criticism.

As a United fan and most United fans i know would say that they think Berbatov is a lazy b@stard and Nani is just not good enough. The only thing is that both players are members of a squad that won the League, League Cup and World Club Championships (or what ever its called).

As ive said pretty much every United fan i know has grately slated Brabatov and Nani but both players played their part in winning things last season so we have no reason to complain really.

Lucas clearly isn't as good as Alonso but at 6 million he is not bad value considering the money being spent on players these days. Give him another few seasons to prove himself i reckon.