Shane Ferguson

[DannyInvincible]

To be fair, DI, you and the other Two Wise men, need to write a definitive article between you for the BT and the rest of their constituency.

The truth is of course, this is too unpalatable for certain parties to accept, hence their stance. And this is 'only football.
:rolleyes:

I have noticed that people mention the CAS Kearns judgment fairly regularly in the comments sections beneath these awful pieces but it appears to make little difference.

[ArdeeBhoy]

I don't think people know what "sectarian" means any more when the FAI accommodating an individual's expression of his Irish identity is construed in such a term, or else there's some agenda at play. Hmm...

I'd imagine we've had Protestants play for us in recent times. Sure Alan Kernaghan was from a Protestant background, albeit secular, religion having "meant diddly" to him (http://sport.scotsman.com/rangersfc/Kernaghan-still-pushing-back-the.3337606.jp). Maybe we even have Protestants in our current squads, God forbid! Who knows or cares? One thing for certain though is that we don't know for sure probably due to the fact there's never been an issue made of it because no-one, including the FAI, could care less what religion any of our players are. Religious segregation doesn't actually permeate every facet of life south of the border which is maybe why some of these OWC dullards find the notion that some people don't spend their days worrying about what one's religion might be so difficulty to comprehend.

We even have some.....Protestant fans. Including some who've lived in the North. But Sssh.
;)

[co. down green]

We even have some.....Protestant fans. Including some who've lived in the North. But Sssh.
;)

An Ireland supporter who regularly travels down with us is employed by the IFA. :)

[Predator]

I don't think people know what "sectarian" means any more when the FAI accommodating an individual's expression of his Irish identity is construed in such a term, or else there's some agenda at play. Hmm...The claim is so astoundingly ludicrous that I almost feel dirty discussing it, but I feel it's the kind of thing that needs to be addressed and rubbished. I'm reminded of a certain Facebook campaign set up by Belfast Telegraph journalist, Owen Polley.

Some IFA fans are asserting that, because Givens stated that Mick Martin had spoken to Ferguson, it must have been the FAI who initiated contact (not that who contacted who actually matters), and as such, it proves beyond doubt that the FAI only approach those players who are allegedly Catholic, thus making their policy a 'sectarian' one.

Of course, the logic is perforated.


We even have some.....Protestant fans. Including some who've lived in the North. But Sssh.
;)What are you talking about? The 'Irish Republic of Ireland' is a Catholic country for Irish Catholic Irishmen! :)

[DannyInvincible]

An Ireland supporter who regularly travels down with us is employed by the IFA. :)

That's quite funny alright. I'd always been wondering who the guy wearing this (http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-eOZbbvfVCpk/TbDbKZmtiFI/AAAAAAAAFRA/2-1wVi5L9cY/s1600/disguise.jpg) at games was. :p


Some IFA fans are asserting that, because Givens stated that Mick Martin had spoken to Ferguson, it must have been the FAI who initiated contact (not that who contacted who actually matters), and as such, it proves beyond doubt that the FAI only approach those players who are allegedly Catholic, thus making their policy a 'sectarian' one.

Even so, when rumblings are made on the various forums and in the media that the player might actually have grown up supporting Ireland, the logical response would surely be to enquire with the player himself whether he'd be interested. If not, no harm done. I can't see what's wrong or "sectarian" about that at all. As to why the players who have made the switch are generally from a nationalist or Catholic background, it doesn't take a brain surgeon to work it out. Shane Duffy gave his personal reasons as to why it was always his dream to play for Ireland and was hysterically lambasted as sectarian for mentioning the fact that he grew up in a Catholic background meaning it seemed like a perfectly natural decision for him to declare.

[ArdeeBhoy]

An Ireland supporter who regularly travels down with us is employed by the IFA. :)
Actually cdg, presuming it's not Steve Beaglehole, am disappointed you may have blown their cover and our attempts to infiltrate the FAI from within....
;)


The 'Irish Republic of Ireland' is a Catholic country for Irish Catholic Irishmen!
Following in the spirit of the 'United Irishmen', very happy to contradict this was ever the case. Not everyone is paranoid.
Though apologies if, :rolleyes:, 'too much history ' for some!

[co. down green]

That's quite funny alright.

You don't know the half of it! I played 5-a-side recently (i can still kick a ball, just!) with another lad employed by the IFA who turned up for the game in the long sleeve Ireland away jersey and would not be seen dead in his employers attire outside work.

And the next time some of these loons come on talking about out resources, money etc.. being spent by the IFA on developing players, its worth remembering that the IFA have no money, it's taxpayers like me who fund the IFA.

Only recently the Sinn Fein Stormont minister forked out over three million quid of our money to save 30 IFA jobs that were under threat over cutbacks.

So if a player decides at 16 or 21 to declare for Ireland, it's not the IFA's money that has contributed to his progress, It's his parents hard earned cash and other hand outs from UEFA.

[ArdeeBhoy]

Only recently the Sinn Fein Stormont minister forked out over three million quid of our money to save 30 IFA jobs that were under threat over cutbacks.

The next vanity project and 'Thank You' banner for Ealing Green??
:)

[seanfhear]

If some one does not put a stop to Don Givens he will start World War 3. He is the most dangerous man on the planet and has to be controlled. If action is not taken immediately the very existance of mankind is threatened. In fact he is so dangerous that he must be some sort of agent-provocateur sent by aliens to get mankind to self inflicted Armageddon.

I have taken a big risk issuing this warning and have put my very existence in the greatest of jeopardy from the "GIVENS"

[Predator]

An Ireland supporter who regularly travels down with us is employed by the IFA. :)Poaching! Brainwashing! Sectarian!

[Eminence Grise]

I see that some are once again suggesting that this is 'confirmation' that the FAI is sectarian in making approaches to players. After all, it's an association of sectarian kidnappers.

In that case, the FAI should go the whole hog and rebrand as FARC (Football Assocation of Roaming Catholics).

[TrapAPony]

On the bench today v Liverpool

[Not Brazil]

=
Only recently the Sinn Fein Stormont minister forked out over three million quid of our money to save 30 IFA jobs that were under threat over cutbacks.


That's interesting!

Who was the Minister dishing out the dosh?

Have you a link to the story?

[Scooby Doo]

In that case, the FAI should go the whole hog and rebrand as FARC (Football Assocation of Roaming Catholics).

Ah, well played E.G., well played!

[DannyInvincible]

Ferguson on for the last 2 minutes of stoppage time against Liverpool. Newcastle already 3-0 down but I doubt he'll have time to do much.

[DannyInvincible]

Full-time. Only touch he got was a shake of Andy Carroll's hand after the final whistle.

[Sullivinho]

I've heard him described as a left back but physically and ability-wise he looks every bit the left winger.

[Predator]

I've heard him described as a left back but physically and ability-wise he looks every bit the left winger.I've seen him a good few times through the years and every time he was a left winger or forward. Only recently it seems that he has been playing left back.

[ArdeeBhoy]

He couldn't be any more of a liability than Kilbane in that position. Who incidentally turned in an accomplished performance in central midfield for Huddersfield @ MK Franchise recently.

[SwanVsDalton]

He couldn't be any more of a liability than Kilbane in that position. Who incidentally turned in an accomplished performance in central midfield for Huddersfield @ MK Franchise recently.

That the same Kilbane who has been nothing but tidy for Ireland at LB in the last few internationals?

Think the phrase 'couldn't be more of a liability than Kilbane in that position' has been used to describe 59 players on this forum.

[DannyInvincible]

Came across another article (http://www.chroniclelive.co.uk/newcastle-united/nufc-news/2011/04/02/nufc-ace-shane-ferguson-in-cap-tug-of-war-72703-28446500/) on Ferguson written by a chap called Lee Ryder from the Newcastle-based 'Evening Chronicle'. Clearly, he's lifted his tack straight from the Belfast Telegraph story (http://foot.ie/threads/148961-Shane-Ferguson?p=1481288&viewfull=1#post1481288) and the resulting story reads like a classic and pretty amusing case of Chinese whispers. Whilst ignorantly describing the relevant FIFA rule as a "loophole", he humours with:


FIFA decreed two years ago that a player who holds an Irish passport can also play for the Republic, if they have not already played a competitive game in either the European Championships or the World Cup – and Ferguson fits into that exact category.

That exact category, eh?

[tetsujin1979]

Came across another article (http://www.chroniclelive.co.uk/newcastle-united/nufc-news/2011/04/02/nufc-ace-shane-ferguson-in-cap-tug-of-war-72703-28446500/) on Ferguson written by a chap called Lee Ryder from the Newcastle-based 'Evening Chronicle'. Clearly, he's lifted his tack straight from the Belfast Telegraph story (http://foot.ie/threads/148961-Shane-Ferguson?p=1481288&viewfull=1#post1481288) and the resulting story reads like a classic and pretty amusing case of Chinese whispers. Whilst ignorantly describing the relevant FIFA rule as a "loophole", he humours with:

FIFA decreed two years ago that a player who holds an Irish passport can also play for the Republic, if they have not already played a competitive game in either the European Championships or the World Cup – and Ferguson fits into that exact category.


That exact category, eh?

it does beg the question, how exactly could he play a competitive game that wasn't in the European Championships or the World Cup?

[DannyInvincible]

Maybe he still thinks Blatter is going to invite us to partake in the Copa America after 'Henrygate'.

[BonnieShels]

The absolute garbage that's peddled us astounding. Are you gonna respond Danny?

[French Toasht]

Whilst I think the FAI are well within their rights to pursue northern born players with nationalist ideals, I don't think Don Givens contentious comments do anything to improve what is already an acrimonious relationship between the two associations and the net result will be hostility and violence breaking out at matches either between club sides of both associations or at international matches between the two. Also his comments will result in the likes of Ferguson, Kearns, Wilson etc been targetted for abuse.

Givens is an incendiary and I can't think of any role he has played within the FAI that has not been more detrimental than beneficial to the advancement of Irish football.

[SwanVsDalton]

How'd do you respond to that? The article would be more factually correct if it was printed in wingdings font.

[SwanVsDalton]

Whilst I think the FAI are well within their rights to pursue northern born players with nationalist ideals, I don't think Don Givens contentious comments do anything to improve what is already an acrimonious relationship between the two associations and the net result will be hostility and violence breaking out at matches either between club sides of both associations or at international matches between the two. Also his comments will result in the likes of Ferguson, Kearns, Wilson etc been targetted for abuse.

Givens is an incendiary and I can't think of any role he has played within the FAI that has not been more detrimental than beneficial to the advancement of Irish football.

You're not given certain sections of Irish football support enough credit here - they don't need Givens to encourage any kind of animosity.

[French Toasht]

You're not given certain sections of Irish football support enough credit here - they don't need Givens to encourage any kind of animosity.


True. But talk about fuelling the fire. The IFA have apparently put out a motion to all members of the NI Supporters club as to whether or not they choose to boycott the Aviva match. Whilst that is undoubtedly a foolish move on their part, its statements like these that will give the IFA the authority to take the moral high ground on the issue. Also watch, over the next few years how many young 16 and 17 year old nationalists will be capped in a competitive match against the San Marinos and Andorras of this world, in order to prevent any of those baddies at the FAI getting their dirty hands on them.

Like I say, the man is an incendiary. As an underage manager, he was no stranger to shouting his mouth off and was clueless in terms of his man management style with our more "volatile" young players. Clearly he determined to continue to be just as brash and bullish in his new role.

[ifk101]

Came across another article (http://www.chroniclelive.co.uk/newcastle-united/nufc-news/2011/04/02/nufc-ace-shane-ferguson-in-cap-tug-of-war-72703-28446500/) on Ferguson written by a chap called Lee Ryder from the Newcastle-based 'Evening Chronicle'. Clearly, he's lifted his tack straight from the Belfast Telegraph story (http://foot.ie/threads/148961-Shane-Ferguson?p=1481288&viewfull=1#post1481288) and the resulting story reads like a classic and pretty amusing case of Chinese whispers. Whilst ignorantly describing the relevant FIFA rule as a "loophole", he humours with:

I wouldn't place too much weight on that Chronicle article.

For example the article states "Derry lad Ferguson has already been capped by Northern Ireland in an international friendly against Italy in a 4-1 defeat in Sardinia two years ago."

Indeed Ferguson did appear in that game but the result was 3-0 to Italy and the game was played in Pisa. (Off topic but there was a television on the Ni bench for that game so that Shane Duffy could follow preceedings in his country's game against Bulgaria.)

[SwanVsDalton]

True. But talk about fuelling the fire. The IFA have apparently put out a motion to all members of the NI Supporters club as to whether or not they choose to boycott the Aviva match. Whilst that is undoubtedly a foolish move on their part, its statements like these that will give the IFA the authority to take the moral high ground on the issue. Also watch, over the next few years how many young 16 and 17 year old nationalists will be capped in a competitive match against the San Marinos and Andorras of this world, in order to prevent any of those baddies at the FAI getting their dirty hands on them.

Like I say, the man is an incendiary. As an underage manager, he was no stranger to shouting his mouth off and was clueless in terms of his man management style with our more "volatile" young players. Clearly he determined to continue to be just as brash and bullish in his new role.

I agree that Don Givens would be better off keeping schtum on pretty much any issue. But there's not much he can do about how the IFA treat this situation or how their fans react. The IFA 'moral high ground' is at the bottom of the hole they've dug themselves, so I'm not too concerned and anything he says is only an extra log on an already raging fire of vitriol. However this sounds an awful lot like I'm defending Don Givens, urgh, so moving on...

Ig the IFA do embark on a cap-a-thon, more bully them - players should be aware of the implications of receiving a call-up and can make their own decision accordingly. Also such an action will likely devalue and discredit the NI team.

[ArdeeBhoy]

That the same Kilbane who has been nothing but tidy for Ireland at LB in the last few internationals?

Hmm, the same player (in that position) who's been responsible for around half the goals conceded by Ireland in the last 2 years.
Like said previously, Ferguson or even Ian Harte could do better.

[SwanVsDalton]

Hmm, the same player (in that position) who's been responsible for around half the goals conceded by Ireland in the last 2 years.
Like said previously, Ferguson or even Ian Harte could do better.

Around half? Fine - go ahead and breakdown how Kilbane's been solely responsible for 10 goals in the last two years. I even did some of the work for you and narrowed it down to just goals conceded in games he's played in.

On the topic at hand, I'm sure Harte or Ferguson will be options but my view is throwing around words like liability is just lazy.

[Charlie Darwin]

Kilbane has been responsible for every goal Ireland have ever conceded. Wait, no, that sounds dangerously like wild hyperbole.

[SwanVsDalton]

Kilbane has been responsible for every goal Ireland have ever conceded. Wait, no, that sounds dangerously like wild hyperbole.

Wild hyperbole - a lot more dangerous than the domesticated hyperbole.

[tetsujin1979]

Kilbane has been responsible for every goal Ireland have ever conceded. Wait, no, that sounds dangerously like wild hyperbole.
Kevin Kilbane is solely responsible for every goal conceded by every team throughout history in all sports, real or imaginary, in perpetuity throughout the universe in all known, and unknown, dimensions

now, that's hyperbole

[Supreme feet]

I'm bored. I'll do it. Competitive goals conceded in the last two years...

Bulgaria (a) - 1-1. Kilbane definitely at fault. Let a long ball go over his head.
Cyprus (a) - 2-1. Ball came in from O'Shea's side. Kilbane probably could have got tighter to the goalscorer, but it wasn't his man. Harsh to blame Kilbane.
Italy (h) - 2-2. Goals came from a corner, and a slip from St. Ledger. Was Kilbane supposed to be marking Camoranesi for the corner?
France (h) - 0-1. Huge deflection from a speculative shot when Ireland were otherwise defending solidly. Kilbane blameless.
France (a) - 1-1. McShane lost his man. Kilbane blameless.
Andorra (h) - 3-1. Freak volley. Possibly O'Shea's fault. Kilbane blameless.
Russia (h) - 2-3. Whelan mostly at fault for the first. Second came from our left, McGeady was more at fault - didn't track the full back who got the cross in. The goalscorer for the third - the holding midfielder - should have been closed down by the midfield. Harsh to single out Kilbane for that horror show.
Slovakia (a) 1-1. Header, corner. Kilbane blameless.
Macedonia (h) 2-1. A clearly unfit Dunne got turned easily. Kilbane blameless.

The only goal Kilbane was obviously at fault for was Bulgaria away. O'Shea's been directly responsible for more, as has Whelan. Our general defending from set-pieces and our closing down in midfield has been responsible for more goals conceded than any one individual.

[geysir]

I'd go along with that, no team on their own merits, deserved to score a goal against us :)

[Supreme feet]

:) Good point geysir! However, it is worrying that we've conceded in all but three competitive games under Trap. For a game plan that's based on solidity and grinding out wins, we're making too many mistakes and conceding soft goals. I do agree that we need a more convincing left-back than a converted midfielder who is winding down his career, but replacing Kilbane wouldn't simply eliminate this problem. Defensive mistakes are coming from all of the back four.

[elroy]

I'm bored. I'll do it. Competitive goals conceded in the last two years...

Bulgaria (a) - 1-1. Kilbane definitely at fault. Let a long ball go over his head.
Cyprus (a) - 2-1. Ball came in from O'Shea's side. Kilbane probably could have got tighter to the goalscorer, but it wasn't his man. Harsh to blame Kilbane.
Italy (h) - 2-2. Goals came from a corner, and a slip from St. Ledger. Was Kilbane supposed to be marking Camoranesi for the corner?
France (h) - 0-1. Huge deflection from a speculative shot when Ireland were otherwise defending solidly. Kilbane blameless.
France (a) - 1-1. McShane lost his man. Kilbane blameless.
Andorra (h) - 3-1. Freak volley. Possibly O'Shea's fault. Kilbane blameless.
Russia (h) - 2-3. Whelan mostly at fault for the first. Second came from our left, McGeady was more at fault - didn't track the full back who got the cross in. The goalscorer for the third - the holding midfielder - should have been closed down by the midfield. Harsh to single out Kilbane for that horror show.
Slovakia (a) 1-1. Header, corner. Kilbane blameless.
Macedonia (h) 2-1. A clearly unfit Dunne got turned easily. Kilbane blameless.

The only goal Kilbane was obviously at fault for was Bulgaria away. O'Shea's been directly responsible for more, as has Whelan. Our general defending from set-pieces and our closing down in midfield has been responsible for more goals conceded than any one individual.

Good analysis, the one other goal that I would apportion blame to KK, that is probably just outside the two year timeframe, is the one conceded in the home game with Bulgaria.

[French Toasht]

Nothing annoys me more than the ignorant "Kilbane ya donkey" chant from some idiot sitting in front of you at an Ireland game.

I challenge anyone to name a player that has been more committed to the Irish cause over the last 15 years. Whilst he may not have been the most gifted player to play for Ireland over that period, his workrate, dedication and unwillingness to give up surpass any player in that era. I know its just a mere aside, but it highlights the point; next time we play watch how many players sing the national anthem and watch English born KK belts out the lyrics with gusto. No one takes more pride in wearing the green jersey than him. Also by all accounts apparently he is an influential leader in the dressing room.

KK will always be up there with Denis Irwin and Steve Staunton for me as the most consumate professionals who wore the green jersey.

Also is I have heard this rumour do the rounds and was wondering could anyone verify it? KK was called up to England U-15 trials and went along wearing an Ireland jersey. He was promptly sent home. What a man!

[ArdeeBhoy]

Yes, that story's true. And appreciate his efforts when he's played.

However, regardless of any 'analysis' on here, it doesn't mean that's he's not mediocre at best in that position. Hence the SF suggestion.
KK's a liability in every game he plays there for Ireland.

[TrapAPony]

With Shane Ferguson, Greg Cunningham and Marc Tierney coming through at left back, Kilbane's time should be up.

[Charlie Darwin]

Yes, that story's true. And appreciate his efforts when he's played.
Did KK say that himself?

[SwanVsDalton]

However, regardless of any 'analysis' on here, it doesn't mean that's he's not mediocre at best in that position. Hence the SF suggestion. KK's a liability in every game he plays there for Ireland.

By 'analysis', I hope you're referring to the posts where your ridiculous hyperbole was 'totally sunk'...

Not sure what you mean by SF either but, regardless, being mediocre (arguable) does not make him a liability. I think Kilbane's failings have been overstated. As SF pointed out, he's been as culpable as anyone else but has found himself on the end of a huge amount of criticism. Criticism on him should focus on his inability to support the left-winger and occasional (that's once in a while, not half the time he's on the pitch) lapses in concentration. And there haven't been many of those recently...

Kilbane's done fairly well at left-back on many occasions, but it's been overshadowed by a couple of poor mistakes that people like to bang on about as if they happen in every game.


With Shane Ferguson, Greg Cunningham and Marc Tierney coming through at left back, Kilbane's time should be up.

Arn't you getting ahead of yourself? Ferguson's an NI player and Cunningham's crocked. Don't know much about Tierney, is he the Norwich player and does he qualify? Again though, these guys arn't exactly coming into contention next month. And that post could've been written last month with Ciaran Clark in mind but Kilbane ended up in credit over him.

All this isn't to say I'm not against someone emerging, there are options. I'm still keen to see what O'Halloran will do, hope he goes on the US tour.

[theworm2345]

Also is I have heard this rumour do the rounds and was wondering could anyone verify it? KK was called up to England U-15 trials and went along wearing an Ireland jersey. He was promptly sent home. What a man!
I believed Kilbane confirmed that himself in an issue of YBIG. Sam Allardyce pressured him to go.

[TrapAPony]

Arn't you getting ahead of yourself?

I'm still keen to see what O'Halloran will do, hope he goes on the US tour.

Yes I am, which is why I highlighted both Ferguson & Tierney. Is the US Tour definitely going ahead?

[French Toasht]

I believed Kilbane confirmed that himself in an issue of YBIG. Sam Allardyce pressured him to go.

Your right. The quote is on page 6. http://www.ybig.ie/uploads/file/YBIG_iSSUE_19_web.pdf

Also another rumour I've heard is that when we played Brazil in the 0-0 draw back in 2004, that at the final whistle apparently Ronaldo ran half the pitch to swap jerseys with Kev Kilbane. Anyone able to verify that?

Theres only Zinedine Kilbane!

[ArdeeBhoy]

OK, good to see people are sticking their head in the sand on this one. Been going to football long enough, to spot a 'square peg in a round hole'.

Apart from anything else, he's playing out of position compared to where he's been playing for Huddersfield, where he did very well in the game I saw recently. I don't care if he has a 1000 caps, he's no left-back.
Apart from anything else, he's one-footed and has no pace. Fundamental failings at this level, in that position.
And that's where he gets shown up in every international he plays.

Hence my suggestion re.Shane Ferguson. He might be young, but at least he's playing in the PL. Which KK won't be gracing again....

[SwanVsDalton]

OK, good to see people are sticking their head in the sand on this one. Been going to football long enough, to spot a [I]'square peg in a round hole'

Goalposting moving like a champ - think we'd all agree on the 'square peg' even though you're somehow convinced otherwise...


Apart from anything else, he's playing out of position compared to where he's been playing for Huddersfield, where he did very well in the game I saw recently. I don't care if he has a 1000 caps, he's no left-back.
Apart from anything else, he's one-footed and has no pace. Fundamental failings at this level, in that position.

Mostly fair enough, some arguable...talking of which...


And that's where he gets shown up in every international he plays.

When was he shown up against Slovakia? Or France home and away? Or Macedonia? If you're talking about a few errors, which player in the team has committed no errors? Wildly OTT comment - again. Anyone can sling out a few of those. For instance, I could say ArdeeBhoy is the biggest supporting of Irish partition since Edward Carson but it doesn't mean much if I don't back it up with anything except vaguely muttering something about an erroneous vote two years ago...


Hence my suggestion re.Shane Ferguson. He might be young, but at least he's playing in the PL. Which KK won't be gracing again....

Has Ferguson even started a Prem game yet? And what part of his game makes you think he could immediately step in for a guy who has over 100 caps and can still compete, even in a more limited capacity, at that level?

[SwanVsDalton]

Yes I am, which is why I highlighted both Ferguson & Tierney. Is the US Tour definitely going ahead?

Fair nuff. Thought they were still planning on it, I hope it happens think it would be a far more useful exercise than in the Staunton era. Could be Ferguson's first call-up too if he declares in time...