Shane Ferguson

[The Fly]

I love the attention to detail at the left end of the scarf.

I take it you're refering to the motto on the coat of arms.

I suppose it could raise a few eyebrows. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quis_separabit%3F) ;)

[DannyInvincible]

It's quite simple. For the "Irish Nation" to have a "firm [implicitly, broadly agreed] will" on this issue, either unionists are aren't part of the Irish nation, or the Constitution is inventing support which isn't there.

Whether unionists (somewhere around 14 per cent of the population of the island of Ireland, as you say) were to be considered part of the Irish nation or not, either way, I would still argue that broad agreement exists within the Irish nation for unity. To be considered part of the Irish nation, however, wouldn't unionists be first expected to accept their birthright entitlement?


I'll repeat. As long as it aspires to get rid of the border it meets the basic criterion to be irredentist, as simply defined above. Regardless of how formal the GFA, how great its popularity, or how obvious the widespread feeling that the Irish Republic's political institutions and most of its electorate haven't the remotest intention of following it up.

I generally understand the term to possess negative connotations of unilateral coercion or aggression whereas the clause outlines that unity can "be brought about only by peaceful means with the consent of a majority of the people" in both jurisdictions on the island. Thus, unity would be a bilateral decision and unionists should have nothing to be irritated about so long as they support the democratic process.

Besides, a significant majority of unionists did vote in favour of the GFA, after all, which is where the clause finds its roots. The territorial claim was "demoted" to an aspiration following mutual agreement with the NI electorate and the UK government. Furthermore, the GFA even describes the aspiration as the "legitimate wish of a majority of the people of the island of Ireland for a united Ireland".


Not really the same thing. If you want to offer me RoI citizenship, fine. I'm not interested but don't mind you offering.

If a referendum on Irish unity ever comes around in your lifetime and you happen to be on an electoral register north or south of the border, you'll also be offered a vote on the matter. You'll be perfectly entitled to vote against it.


The constitution is a bit more irritating because it

a) keeps going on about unity by consent when there's no realistic chance of that happening in the foreseeable future

Depends on what you deem the "foreseeable future", although the further away the realisation of unity appears to be would surely do anything but irritate unionists. Not that any time-frame, realistic or otherwise, ought to be placed upon something like that anyway against which its worth, legitimacy or validity as an aspiration be adjudged. Some form or other of complete Irish independence from Britain or repeal of the Act of Union has been an aspiration held by many in Ireland for centuries. I suppose it could prevail for another few if needs be, to be entirely speculative.


b) ignores the likelihood that even a notional 50%+1 nationalist majority in NI is unlikely to be widely accepted as consent to a united Ireland, or perceived as fair/ achievable beyond Ireland

That's arguable, considering harmony, friendship and peace appear to be over-riding concerns in achieving consent. Either way, it's in line with the GFA which stated that "it would be wrong to make any change in the status of Northern Ireland save with the consent of a majority of its people".

I must ask you though why a theoretical democratic majority of 51 per cent in favour of unity wouldn't be considered fair or acceptable, considering those were the terms to which the NI electorate signed up? Democracy's ethos seeks consensus, but not absolute agreement from each and every one of its subjects, so whilst the view that unity would be unacceptable might be widespread within NI, so long as the view was held by no more than 49 per cent of the electorate, it would be of little consequence, in theory at least. And I'm not sure what the perception of those beyond Ireland would have to do with anything so long as the Irish state/electorate, the UK and the NI electorate were in agreement. I'd imagine that international opinion would follow suit - it would be rather uncustomary and indecorous for it not to - so long as the UN or whoever you're referring to exactly were confident that the referendum was conducted in a method that was above board.


c) is implicitly self-contradicting as above: if FG and FF and their supporters were that bothered you might have expected them to seek electoral support in NI sometime in the last 85 years. But they haven't.

I don't profess to be a supporter of either party so more shame to them for being hypocritical, I suppose. I don't think it means that the constitution is self-contradicting, however. Would unionists rather they did contest elections in NI then in the interests of being faithful to their word?


d) It also doesn't take into account all the immigrants who have children who will dillute the ones for a United Ireland.

It most certainly does. Have another read of the particular clause we're discussing if you wish. Their opinion will also be taken into account.

[DannyInvincible]

Ealing Green - you're obviously a NI supporter and fair play to you. But didn't it ever cross your mind how good an Irish representative team would be with the best of the North and South combined? I really think we could do some damage. Obviously I'm a ROI supporter but I'm really getting excited about the influx of the likes of Shane Duffy and Shane Ferguson not to mention Darron Gibson. It may be beyond both our controls but we could be looking at something very close to an all-ireland team in the next few years.

Hehe, steady on. Ferguson hasn't switched. Just yet...

[awec]

There's a lot of assumptions being posted on this thread, about him being an ROI fan, etc etc.

All that is known as fact is that he has represented us at all levels except senior quite happily, and he has not made any noises about wanting to declare for the ROI.

Was speaking to a lad today who is from his neck of the woods and he says that the area Ferguson is from is more likely to be Northern Ireland supporting than ROI (though admittedly this means nothing).

[DannyInvincible]

I take it you're refering to the motto on the coat of arms.

Hmmm.......I suppose it could 'raise a few eyebrows'. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quis_separabit%3F) ;)

Was actually referring to the deletion of the letters "ERN" from the vertical text as well.

[DannyInvincible]

There's a lot of assumptions being posted on this thread, about him being an ROI fan, etc etc.

All that is known as fact is that he has represented us at all levels except senior quite happily, and he has not made any noises about wanting to declare for the ROI.

Was speaking to a lad today who is from his neck of the woods and he says that the area Ferguson is from is more likely to be Northern Ireland supporting than ROI (though admittedly this means nothing).

A Northern Ireland fan engaging in speculative profiling?! ;)

He's from Eglinton or thereabouts, as far as I know, which wouldn't really provide any indication as to who he might have supported growing up. The area has a very slight unionist majority.

[TrapAPony]

Was speaking to a lad today who is from his neck of the woods and he says that the area Ferguson is from is more likely to be Northern Ireland supporting than ROI (though admittedly this means nothing).

Good gaelic footballer that Ferguson lad. ;)
http://www.sundaysun.co.uk/sport/newcastle-united/nufc-news/2010/10/10/shane-ferguson-reveals-his-tough-side-79310-27439091/2/

[Not Brazil]

Ealing Green - you're obviously a NI supporter and fair play to you. But didn't it ever cross your mind how good an Irish representative team would be with the best of the North and South combined? I really think we could do some damage. Obviously I'm a ROI supporter but I'm really getting excited about the influx of the likes of Shane Duffy and Shane Ferguson not to mention Darron Gibson. It may be beyond both our controls but we could be looking at something very close to an all-ireland team in the next few years.

EG is "away" for a few days, but as a Northern Ireland supporter, I'll give you my thoughts.

There already is a de facto All Ireland representative side - it is that operated by the FAI.

Any player born in Northern Ireland has to choice to play for the FAI representaive side - that choice was hard won.

Players who do not wish to play for the FAI, have the choice to play for the IFA representative side.

Perhaps you should respect that choice, and appreciate that many, many, players are proud to play for Northern Ireland, and that Northern Ireland supporters intend supporting them playing for Northern Ireland long into the future.

[DannyInvincible]

Good gaelic footballer that Ferguson lad. ;)
http://www.sundaysun.co.uk/sport/newcastle-united/nufc-news/2010/10/10/shane-ferguson-reveals-his-tough-side-79310-27439091/2/

The word around Eglinton is that he confessed to his priest after Sunday Mass the other week that he harboured ambitions of playing for us. ;)

[Stuttgart88]

I think Mark's just saying he'd love to see an AI team, just like in rugby and cricket. I don't think he's ignoring cultural or identity issues, or not respecting choice. It's a valid view, just as yours is.

[Not Brazil]

I think Mark's just saying he'd love to see an AI team.

Mark will be delighted he can watch one then - everytime the FAI field a representaive side.

[Not Brazil]

Good gaelic footballer that Ferguson lad. ;)
http://www.sundaysun.co.uk/sport/newcastle-united/nufc-news/2010/10/10/shane-ferguson-reveals-his-tough-side-79310-27439091/2/

Our Captain tomorrow night is from good GAA stock.

[The Fly]

Interesting tweet by Sky News reporter Enda Brady (http://twitter.com/endabrady/statuses/51396825567076352)

[Predator]

I take it you're refering to the motto on the coat of arms.

I suppose it could raise a few eyebrows. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quis_separabit%3F) ;)Quis separabit?

Well, the FAI, of course.

[ifk101]

Ferguson ‘too good to lose to Republic’

http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/sport/football/international/ferguson-lsquotoo-good-to-lose-to-republicrsquo-15132049.html

I'd take everything published by the Belfast Telegraph with a pinch of salt but the rumours seem to be gathering pace.

[boovidge]

still the same old rubbish about shane duffy who would qualify through his father even if the rules didnt allow northern born players with no family connection to the roi to declare for us.

[ifk101]

Well I did warn that it was the Belfast Telegraph :)

[awec]

If he does go then I'll be kicking Nigel Worthingtons door down and demanding that he explains why he is messing about the useless, grey haired prat

[SwanVsDalton]

Why would you blame Worthington? Would you have had Ferguson capped to secure him? Just curious.

[Predator]

"You win some. You lose some.", should be the attitude at this stage. It's time to wise up and get over it.

[SkStu]

or in in the case of Northern Ireland and in pretty much all respects, "you win few, you lose many".

[Not Brazil]

From the latest BT article, posted earlier:

"Two years ago FIFA decreed that under the Good Friday Agreement if a player eligible for Northern Ireland has an Irish passport he can play for the Republic"

That's **** poor "analysis", yet again, from the BT.

[Gather round]

or in in the case of Northern Ireland and in pretty much all respects, "you win few, you lose many"

Competitive games since 2006:

NI 27-11-8-8-41 points
RoI 29-11-13-5-46 (including one for drawn play-off game)

Not very methodical from the mountie there.

[backstothewall]

From the latest BT article, posted earlier:

"Two years ago FIFA decreed that under the Good Friday Agreement if a player eligible for Northern Ireland has an Irish passport he can play for the Republic"

That's **** poor "analysis", yet again, from the BT.

I don't agree with you on much, but hear hear to that. Bought the tele and thought the same reading that article.

Taking this back to football, I would love to see this team in a few years.

-------- Pimp My Goal ---------
Coleman Duffy Clark Ferguson
------------- Wilson ------------
-------McCarthy Gibson-------
-Stokes----------------Treacy-
------------ Long ---------------

And hopefully more to come...

And taking it away from it again...



d) It also doesn't take into account all the immigrants who have children who will dillute the ones for a United Ireland.

You're working under the impression immigrants will support the status quo. But the likelyhood is they will support the status quo in the communities they live in. I'm sure it won't be long until the first of the 2nd generation eastern European immigrants from West Belfast togs out for Antrim in the Ulster Championship. Indeed there is a Pole standing for the assembly under an SDLP ticket in East Belfast.

And from a football perspective, footballing 2nd gen immigrants are likely to be quite mercenary in which country they declare for. I'd say if they are top class, they're best option is likely to be Poland, Romania or Czech Rep if they qualify for those countries, but for the Latvians/Lithuanians/Hungarians/etc ROI is likely to be the best option.

[Gather round]

You're working under the impression immigrants will support the status quo. But the likelyhood is they will support the status quo in the communities they live in

The status quo in NI (that there's a border, basically) is the same for both communities.


Indeed there is a Pole standing for the assembly under an SDLP ticket in East Belfast

I think the DUP fielded a Polish Council candidate a few years ago- I read about it in Fortnight, IIRC.


And from a football perspective, footballing 2nd gen immigrants are likely to be quite mercenary in which country they declare for

Why would they be any more mercenary than anyone else in NI?


I'd say if they are top class, they're best option is likely to be Poland

WC 2010 qualifying

NI 4-3-3-15
PL 3-2-5-11


for Latvians...ROI is likely to be the best option

Why do you say that? Their recent record in qualifying for tournaments is similar (one each of the last eight).

[backstothewall]

GR, I'm not getting into a quotefest with you. Regardless of how well Latvia did in getting to Euro 2004, you know the point I'm making. Our qualifying record over the last 8 tournaments equals all 3 of the eastern countries I mentioned combined, and I could have gave a dozen examples.

Those Eastern Europeans will be likely to be more mercenary than average, because kids born and bred in NI seem difficult to tie down to NI. What makes you think you have a better chance, or even an equal chance with a kid with no parental connection to any part of Ireland at all?

And yes the DUP fielded a Polish candidate. The DUP have a polish council candidate, but the SDLP have several EE council candidates, and a Polish assembly candidate. Its all within the margin of error with such small numbers, but you would have to admit that it still illustrates my point that the split won't be entirely towards one community or the other, rather that people will probably join the community they live in, and adopt the appropriate political opinions.

[Gather round]

GR, I'm not getting into a quotefest with you

I think you are :rolleyes:


Regardless of how well Latvia did in getting to Euro 2004, you know the point I'm making

I understand your point, I don't agree with it. Even if perceived chance of qualifying was the only criterion for a dual-qualified player to weigh up in picking which offer to accept, your record over 16 years is no better than Latvia, and a third as good as Slovenia. A notional Slavic or Baltic wunderkind isn't immediately going to associate the RoI with regular qualification.


Those Eastern Europeans will be likely to be more mercenary than average, because kids born and bred in NI seem difficult to tie down to NI

One doesn't follow from the other, does it? You're just guessing, there's no real way of knowing how an individual case, or a few of them, will behave.


What makes you think you have a better chance, or even an equal chance with a kid with no parental connection to any part of Ireland at all?

I didn't claim you could measure such chances, you did. In general, there are other factors which might influence the player: which team would be the most likely to offer representative football, whether this would help get professional contracts and so on.


you would have to admit that it still illustrates my point that the split won't be entirely towards one community or the other, rather that people will probably join the community they live in, and adopt the appropriate political opinions

Indeed, I agree it's unlikely all the Latvians (say) in NI are likely to be entirely unionist or nationalist. I suspect many of them- even if settling locally, having kids and grandkids etc.- may choose to remain 'neutral'. Political opinions are a choice btw, not for others to determine as inappropriate unless they are illegal.

[Yard of Pace]

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/sport/2011/0401/1224293540053.html

This is delicious

[cufc champions]

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/sport/2011/0401/1224293540053.html

This is delicious


The Star have it aswel ,looks a good prospect, the IFA will be seething after this.

[Stuttgart88]

It's an April fool. Just like the bank stess tests.

[Charlie Darwin]

In future years, the last four years in Irish history will be known as "The Long April Fools' Day"

[Murfinator]

Very kind of Northern Ireland to continue being a feeder team to help give valuable international experience to our blossoming youth.

[Gather round]

Very kind of Northern Ireland to continue being a feeder team to help give valuable international experience to our blossoming youth

You're welcome. Although a youth set up that's just finished last in a group behind Estonia, Armenia and Georgia might better be described as wilting.

[Stuttgart88]

Competitive games since 2006:

NI 27-11-8-8-41 points
RoI 29-11-13-5-46 (including one for drawn play-off game)

Not very methodical from the mountie there.Hey, we get French guys handling the ball to score against us in WC play-offs, you guys get Polish goalies (holy or otherwise) fresh airing back passes. Not fair!

[Gather round]

Hey, we get French guys handling the ball to score against us in WC play-offs

A fair point. I expect you'd win rather more competitive games than us if you got to the finals of competitions.


you guys get Polish goalies (holy or otherwise) fresh airing back passes. Not fair!

As you'll have seen, that clown gifted us all three goals. If only he had a Faroese or Estonian imitator...

[ifk101]

As you'll have seen, that clown gifted us all three goals. If only he had a Faroese or Estonian imitator...

That pretty much sums up NI's qualification prospects.

[Gather round]

That pretty much sums up NI's qualification prospects

We'll settle for a scraped 1-0 win over the Faeroes, then it's game on :D

Yes, NI are poor this series, but Slovenia and Serbia have underperformed while even the improviong Estonians have already lost twice at home.

16 or 15 points might be enough for second. We'd have to beat both Serbia and Estonia at home, realistically.

[ifk101]

We'll settle for a scraped 1-0 win over the Faeroes, then it's game on :D

I'm sure you would given NI's record in front of goals and the Faroes' ability to get a draw in Belfast.


Yes, NI are poor this series

Aren't they always :)


but Slovenia and Serbia have underperformed while even the improviong Estonians have already lost twice at home.

16 or 15 points might be enough for second. We'd have to beat both Serbia and Estonia at home, realistically.

Estonia have three away games in a row which might knock them out of contention for qualification before the double-header with NI. With Italy qualified by the time NI are due to play them, 9 points from the last 3 games should be very achievable.

[gspain]

Hey, we get French guys handling the ball to score against us in WC play-offs, you guys get Polish goalies (holy or otherwise) fresh airing back passes. Not fair!

If a certain keeper didn't have a Macedonia last saturday our group could look a lot different.

[ifk101]

If a certain keeper didn't have a Macedonia last saturday our group could look a lot different.

You need to get shots on goal to score.

[Gather round]

Aren't they always :)

I thought we were respectable in the last two series. Our expectations are lower but maybe more realistic than yours: respectability means winning more qualifiers than we lose in any given tournament.


Estonia have three away games in a row which might knock them out of contention for qualification before the double-header with NI. With Italy qualified by the time NI are due to play them, 9 points from the last 3 games should be very achievable

Are you suggesting NI might win in Italy? :)

I see Paddy Power have Serbia as favorite to finish second. I'd go for Slovenia- they're likely to go into the last game at home with the Serbs wth 14 points. To be ahead at that stage, Serbia would need to have either won in Windsor or at home to Italy. Of course both are feasible but given their off-field discipline problems I think less likely.

[ifk101]

I thought we were respectable in the last two series. Our expectations are lower but maybe more realistic than yours: respectability means winning more qualifiers than we lose in any given tournament.

Our expectations are to be involved in at least the qualification shake-up. Given our ranking and the "small" number of teams in each qualification group, there's nothing unrealistic in expecting to be challenging for qualification.


Are you suggesting NI might win in Italy? :)

Yes. Why not? They're likely to qualified at that stage and willing to field an understrength side. Italy aren't a s strong as they used to be. In retrospect we should have beaten them home and away.


I see Paddy Power have Serbia as favorite to finish second. I'd go for Slovenia- they're likely to go into the last game at home with the Serbs wth 14 points. To be ahead at that stage, Serbia would need to have either won in Windsor or at home to Italy. Of course both are feasible but given their off-field discipline problems I think less likely.

I think Serbia have a strong group of players but their temperament is always questionable. Slovenia would be the team I'd tip as well. Good organisation, decent on the ball, hard to beat.

[Gather round]

Our expectations are to be involved in at least the qualification shake-up. Given our ranking and the "small" number of teams in each qualification group, there's nothing unrealistic in expecting to be challenging for qualification

Fair enough. I assumed most of your fans saw only a finish in the top two and thus the play-offs at least as respectable, but maybe that's setting it a bit too high.


Yes. Why not? They're likely to qualified at that stage and willing to field an understrength side. Italy aren't a s strong as they used to be. In retrospect we should have beaten them home and away

We haven't beaten a really top side in an away qualifier since the 80s (Romania). I agree you should really have won in Bari; they had 10 men for 85 minutes ;)

[ifk101]

they had 10 men for 85 minutes ;)

We had Paul McShane on the pitch for 90 mins.

[Predator]

You're welcome. Although a youth set up that's just finished last in a group behind Estonia, Armenia and Georgia might better be described as wilting.I blame Don Givens for that one, because there were some very talented players in that group. I watched our recent 2-0 defeat to Portugal and Noel King has an equally as talented group and I doubt that they will repeat that catastrophe in a qualifying group. In fact, Shane Ferguson, while he is very good, would probably have a fight on his hands for either LB or LW.

[Stuttgart88]

Point taken gs, but when you've scored early you don't (we don't anyway) try as hard to score as if it was 0-0. We tend to score in most games, errors or not.

The NI group's second place is still very much up for grabs. It's a very "low points" group so far, so NI are only one more good win away from being right back in it, especially if the other teams draw. I wouldn't bet much against them getting second with Estonia, Faroes and a very disappointing Serbia still to go to Belfast.

[seanfhear]

I thought we were respectable in the last two series. Our expectations are lower but maybe more realistic than yours: respectability means winning more qualifiers than we lose in any given tournament.




I thought NI did reasonably okay the last two series as well.

With regard to Shane I think players should go with the heart in this situation as when the clubs put on so much pressure not to turn up for internationals the players heart has to be in it to fight the pressure from the clubs.

[ArdeeBhoy]

The status quo in NI (that there's a border, basically) is the same for both communities
What does any notional 'border' have to do especially with the status of any communities on the island??


I think the DUP fielded a Polish Council candidate a few years ago- I read about it in Fortnight
'Searchlight', surely in their case.....


Why would they be any more mercenary than anyone else in NI?
Those immigrants aren't, er, carrying the same amount of baggage, per chance....


WC 2010 qualifying

NI 4-3-3-15
PL 3-2-5-11

Comparing records over the last 50 years or more would make more sense. Plus guessing given the choice, a nominally Catholic Pole would be less keen on playing for the North, just like some of the locals....
The rest of the Eastern Europeans could be up for grabs, though loyalist paramilitaries have not exactly embraced the ethos of 'Football For All' in their approach to outsiders!


What makes you think you have a better chance, or even an equal chance with a kid with no parental connection to any part of Ireland at all?
It really comes down to how integrated they feel, and the, er, 'welcome' they are accorded.

There has definitely been residual racism all over the island, but anti-Nazi blogs have confirmed it's at its worst in areas dominated by loyalist activity.


the DUP fielded a Polish candidate. The DUP have a polish council candidate, but the SDLP have several EE council candidates, and a Polish assembly candidate. Its all within the margin of error with such small numbers, but you would have to admit that it still illustrates my point that the split won't be entirely towards one community or the other, rather that people will probably join the community they live in, and adopt the appropriate political opinions.

Clearly they were unfamiliar with the stance on Catholics taken by certain prominent members of the said party's hierarchy !
Though maybe said councillor was of an Orthodox persuasion....


Even if perceived chance of qualifying was the only criterion for a dual-qualified player to weigh up in picking which offer to accept, your record over 16 years is no better than Latvia, and a third as good as Slovenia. A notional Slavic or Baltic wunderkind isn't immediately going to associate the RoI with regular qualification.
Nor possibly their own countries in 20 years time....and what has qualification to do with anything especially, or certain teams in green would have given up long ago.

As you alluded to, it's access to teams which help them achieve relative professional status and to be fair to the North if they still have a team by the middle of the century, they may be very glad of any eligible pick-ups along the way.


One doesn't follow from the other, does it? You're just guessing, there's no real way of knowing how an individual case, or a few of them, will behave.
That's one of the very few sensible things you've posted on here.....:eek:
And similarly.

I suspect many of them- even if settling locally, having kids and grandkids etc.- may choose to remain 'neutral'. Political opinions are a choice btw, not for others to determine as inappropriate unless they are illegal.

[Gather round]

I thought NI did reasonably okay the last two series as well

Our aim should be to move beyond respectability- finishing second or third- to progress, ie second and the play-offs. Wales have done that recently, ditto Latvia, the similarly-sized Slovenia manage it regularly.


What does any notional 'border' have to do especially with the status of any communities on the island??

Er, the border's real not notional. Its effect on, say, a Polish immigrant wanting to get involved in local politics in NI is that they just can't easily join most of the mainstream Dublin or London parties. Because they don't organise locally.


Those immigrants aren't, er, carrying the same amount of baggage, per chance....

I agree their 'baggage' is likely to be different, ie they won't have grown up with the ingrained attitudes of NI. My point about football eligibilty was simply that since pretty much every footballer from NI is eligible to play for two international sides, people who qualify for a third aren't likely to be stand out- or be any more 'mercenary'- than the rest.


Comparing records over the last 50 years or more would make more sense

Why? Clearly Poland's long-term record in international football is better than NI's, but that isn't the only criterion a dual-qualified player might use when deciding which offer to accept. If his priority is to simply to play international football, we offer it more readily than they do because of the limited pool to choose from.


Plus guessing given the choice, a nominally Catholic Pole would be less keen on playing for the North, just like some of the locals....

Plenty of other Catholic-background locals are obviously quite happy to play for NI. You're assuming that not only do these notional Polish wunderkinds share your political prejudices, but that they'd put them before their footbal career.


loyalist paramilitaries have not exactly embraced the ethos of 'Football For All' in their approach to outsiders!

Indeed. Paramilitary organisations and football in the community schemes don't tend to overlap.

[awec]

What does any notional 'border' have to do especially with the status of any communities on the island??


'Searchlight', surely in their case.....


Those immigrants aren't, er, carrying the same amount of baggage, per chance....



Comparing records over the last 50 years or more would make more sense. Plus guessing given the choice, a nominally Catholic Pole would be less keen on playing for the North, just like some of the locals....
The rest of the Eastern Europeans could be up for grabs, though loyalist paramilitaries have not exactly embraced the ethos of 'Football For All' in their approach to outsiders!


It really comes down to how integrated they feel, and the, er, 'welcome' they are accorded.

There has definitely been residual racism all over the island, but anti-Nazi blogs have confirmed it's at its worst in areas dominated by loyalist activity.



Clearly they were unfamiliar with the stance on Catholics taken by certain prominent members of the said party's hierarchy !
Though maybe said councillor was of an Orthodox persuasion....


Nor possibly their own countries in 20 years time....and what has qualification to do with anything especially, or certain teams in green would have given up long ago.

As you alluded to, it's access to teams which help them achieve relative professional status and to be fair to the North if they still have a team by the middle of the century, they may be very glad of any eligible pick-ups along the way.


That's one of the very few sensible things you've posted on here.....:eek:
And similarly.
Let's not go down this route of football for all seeing as it's the FAI that seeks to recruit young Catholics from the North to ensure that no Catholic players can play for the North. Hardly an embrace of any sort of cross-community scheme.

Ironically the FAI's current activities are likely to lead to a Protestant Northern team and a Catholic southern team, and the media in all their idiocy will probably blame the north when any blame will lie squarely with the FAI and their sectarian selection policy. :)