View Full Version : Celtic Cup thread
ArdeeBhoy
05/02/2011, 3:42 PM
To answer yer question to geysir, Yes! As defined by the C.A.S. judgement.
;)
But as you keep reminding us, they can always say No!
Re Boyce, his newspaper comments indicate he's happy enough to play for us.
Re. Barton, if he doesn't make it for England, then he'll consider NI - if we still want him by then. Either way, there is no indication he has ever been interested in playing for ROI.
Re Camp, he doesn't qualify.
Boyce just happy to play international football, but eligible for both. Barton/Camp, based on the CAS If they're eligible for you, eligible for us?
But would say your need is greater. As your goal-keeping situation is potentially more dire once the German fella steps down.
I'm not sure that the Nations Cup meets FIFA's definition of a "competitive" tournament for elibility purposes. And even if it should, I'm uncertain about the ethics or practicality of such a ruse.
Inclined to agree! :eek:
No idea, but in any case, I've no more interest in Westwood than I have in any other foreign keeper.
Given he, as many of the diaspora, could technically have had a Brit.passport and they then would be eligible for any of the Brit. associations, hmm.
Which is a rule that the IFA have ruthlessly (and fairly) exploited by recruiting all those players born outside the Six Counties for their U-21 team and doubtless have to rely even more so on in the future as more players drift Dublin-wards.
I somehow imagine that Celtic would not thank you for ascribing a sectarian element to their recruitment policies*.
* - On the playing side, at least...
How so? Celtic have had hundreds of Protestants (& various others) work for them over many years. Jock Stein & Kenny Dalglish being two notable examples. Not to mention a good no. of the locally-born '67 team.
Closed Account
05/02/2011, 4:16 PM
Squad Watch
Westwood 90 Minutes Conceded 1
Given Unused Substitute
Coleman 90 Minutes RM
Dunne 90 Minutes CB
St Ledger 90 Minutes CB
Clark 90 Minutes LB
O'Shea Unused Substitute
O'Dea Unused Substitute
Kelly Not in Squad
Green 90 Minutes CM
McCarthy 82 Minutes RF Scored 2
Duff 67 Minutes LM
Fahey Substitute
Wilson Unused Substitute
Whelan Unused Substitute
Gibson Not in Squad
Long 90 Minuted ST
Doyle 90 Minutes ST Scored 1(maybe)
Keogh 90 Minutes Scored 1
Keane -- Minutes
Walters Sub 24 Minutes
Stokes Substitute
Teams picks itself....
Sullivinho
05/02/2011, 4:16 PM
St. Ledger played today as Preston were hammered 4-0 by Bristol City. (Keogh on the scoresheet for Bristol.) Brown Phil will need more than an on-pitch sit-down to save them from relegation. A worryingly poor season for Sean.
Colbert Report
05/02/2011, 5:03 PM
I think it'll be
Given
Coleman Dunne St Ledger O'Shea
Lawrence Gibson Whelan Duff
Keane Doyle
McCarthy on for Gibson
Fahey to come on for either winger
Long to come on for Keane
There's no way O'Shea starts at LB under Trap. Not in a million years.
EalingGreen
05/02/2011, 5:33 PM
To answer yer question to geysir, Yes! As defined by the C.A.S. judgement.Balls! The CAS determined that NI-born players (and by extension, the sons of NI-born parents) are eligible for the FAI. It did not address the question of territoriality.
Boyce just happy to play international football,Who said anything different?
Barton/Camp, based on the CAS If they're eligible for you, eligible for us?
But would say your need is greater. As your goal-keeping situation is potentially more dire once the German fella steps down.With an NI-born parent, Barton is eligible for both NI and ROI. There is absolutely no indication whatever that he is interested in playing for the ROI. On the contrary, he very likely is not. Therefore if he doesn't ever come under consideration for England, then he may revert to NI. If we want him, that is.
As for Camp, no-one on this thread has produced any evidence from FIFA's Articles as to why he should be eligible for ROI; on the contrary, any rational reading of the relevant Articles (15 and 17) make it clear that he is not. On top of which, whilst he has expressed clear enthusiasm for playing for NI, he has never even mentioned ROI.
Oh, and btw, your reference to "the German fella" is not so clever as you think. Big Maik may have been born in Germany, but that is only because his Da was stationed there with the British Army. And since Maik later joined the Army himself, he can justly claim to be as British as they come.
Given he [Westwood], as many of the diaspora, could technically have had a Brit.passport and they then would be eligible for any of the Brit. associations, hmm. Double balls!
First, Westwood already is British, since he was born in the UK. And if he ever travelled abroad before seeking (dual) Irish nationality, then he must already have acquired a British Passport.
Second, under an agreement between the four British Associations, which has been lodged with FIFA, English-born players may not represent NI, Scotland or Wales unless they have a parent or grandparent from one of those places.
Which is a rule that the IFA have ruthlessly (and fairly) exploited by recruiting all those players born outside the Six Counties for their U-21 team and doubtless have to rely even more so on in the future as more players drift Dublin-wards.With the exception of Big Maik (and maybe Channel Islander Trevor Wood?), every single NI player at every level for the last 20 years (at least) has had a parent or grandparent who was born in NI. And the anomaly whereby we could select Maik (and Wood) has long since been closed, with the IFA's willing agreement.
How so? Celtic have had hundreds of Protestants (& various others) work for them over many years. Jock Stein & Kenny Dalglish being two notable examples. Not to mention a good no. of the locally-born '67 team.You were the one who introduced religion into the thread, by bleating on about Celtic recruiting "Northern-born Catholics" etc.
As it happened, there is plenty I could say about sectarianism in the green half of the Auld Firm, but I won't clog up this thread further with it.
However if you are interested in educating yourself further, you might want to read Tommy Gemmell's Autobiography, "Lion Heart", for a few pointers on the topic.
can we please leave this thread to discussion of the tournament? Im getting sick of these arguments surfacing in every second thread.
BonnieShels
05/02/2011, 6:44 PM
Cue EG and AB telling Stu that he doesn't have to read the thread...
Charlie Darwin
05/02/2011, 6:49 PM
We should have a thread specifically for not discussing eligibility issues and let everything else be fair game.
Colbert Report
05/02/2011, 6:52 PM
Let's get a thread going on how O'Shea can't play left back.
Charlie Darwin
05/02/2011, 7:01 PM
Best and Lawrence both withdrawn from the squad and replaced by Keogh. Stokes still on standby and no word on McCarthy.
Drumcondra 69er
05/02/2011, 7:23 PM
We should have a thread specifically for not discussing eligibility issues and let everything else be fair game.
There's already a monster thread on it, the posts should really be put into it. I gave up on going round in circles on it long ago....
http://foot.ie/threads/132063-Player-eligibility-row?highlight=Eligibility
theworm2345
05/02/2011, 8:09 PM
Long and Doyle both got pretty well battered in their matches today and yesterday, not sure of their statuses.
ArdeeBhoy
05/02/2011, 9:46 PM
You were the one who introduced religion into the thread, by bleating on about Celtic recruiting "Northern-born Catholics" etc.
As it happened, there is plenty I could say about sectarianism in the green half of the Auld Firm, but I won't clog up this thread further with it.
However if you are interested in educating yourself further, you might want to read Tommy Gemmell's Autobiography, "Lion Heart", for a few pointers on the topic.
Ha ha. The rest was all the round spherical objects you kept referring to!
See the Eligibility thread for a reality check!
Though you totally misrepresent what I say about Celtic and their players. Thanks.
You might actually read what other people say??
Will leave people to draw their own conclusions.
With 'friends' like that, Messrs. Lennon, McCourt & McGinn must be so 'proud' of their fans (as in some of those of the country they're supposed to represent) being so 'open-minded', not.
Sullivinho
05/02/2011, 10:35 PM
There's already a monster thread on it, the posts should really be put into it. I gave up on going round in circles on it long ago....
http://foot.ie/threads/132063-Player-eligibility-row?highlight=Eligibility
It's a repetitive bore for some poor mod to manage, but I completely agree. The ignore function (http://foot.ie/profile.php?do=ignorelist) tidies things up nicely enough though.
ArdeeBhoy
05/02/2011, 11:02 PM
But then you don't know what you're missing??
And you might actually learn something....
;)
Sullivinho
05/02/2011, 11:18 PM
But then you don't know what you're missing??
And you might actually learn something....
;)
I read the thread Drumcondra quoted back to front. That's all (in fact, more than!) anyone needs to know.
an_ceannaire
07/02/2011, 10:57 AM
Lads......seriously.......does anyone care? Most Irish people are not even aware of this tournament...!!
This has been a marketing disaster for the FAI
There will be no one at any of these games except gurriers looking for a ruck with the Nordies!
See Italksport Friday night on Setanta....said it all about the level of intertest in Irish Football in 2011......:(
OwlsFan
07/02/2011, 11:13 AM
It would be nice if we could win this trophy. Must be the first one we have ever entered as favourites. Off the top of my head, I don't think we have ever won anything as a senior international team, other than some tournament in Iceland in the 1980s I think, but I may be wrong. We are never going to win the World Cup or European Cup so hopefully we'll do well in this. Feck the begrudgers.
Predator
07/02/2011, 11:27 AM
I hope we win this too. I hope we win every game we play.
We are never going to win the World Cup or European Cup so hopefully we'll do well in this. Feck the begrudgers.I don't agree that we'll never win the World Cup or European Championships. Whoever thought that Greece would win something?
OwlsFan
07/02/2011, 12:01 PM
We can always live in hope. That's what football fans of the non big countries and clubs do but Greece has a much stronger home league than us, much bigger population etc etc - we don't compare. I suppose one should never say never so let's stick to most unlikely. ANyway, let's qualify for the tournaments first of all.
Duggie
07/02/2011, 12:37 PM
ANyway, let's qualify for the tournaments first of all.
exactly
Wolfie
07/02/2011, 12:55 PM
It would be nice if we could win this trophy. Must be the first one we have ever entered as favourites. Off the top of my head, I don't think we have ever won anything as a senior international team, other than some tournament in Iceland in the 1980s I think, but I may be wrong. We are never going to win the World Cup or European Cup so hopefully we'll do well in this. Feck the begrudgers.
Yes - The tournament we won was a triangular tournament in 1986 which included Iceland, Ireland and Former Czechoslovakia.
Charlie Darwin
07/02/2011, 1:30 PM
Given; O'Shea, Dunne, St. Ledger, Clark; Coleman, Whelan, Gibson or Green, Duff; Doyle, Walters.
I guess this means Gibson is the first choice but there's a question mark on his fitness?
Duggie
07/02/2011, 1:35 PM
Given; O'Shea, Dunne, St. Ledger, Clark; Coleman, Whelan, Gibson or Green, Duff; Doyle, Walters.
I guess this means Gibson is the first choice but there's a question mark on his fitness?
is this the team? no long? WTF
shakermaker1982
07/02/2011, 1:43 PM
I'd rather have Green over Gibson.
Long over Walters as well if true.
Charlie Darwin
07/02/2011, 1:43 PM
He took a heavy knock a couple of weeks ago and didn't look comfortable against QPR on Friday so it's probably best to go with a fully-fit Walters. Shame, he would have been well-rested having played on Friday rather than Saturday or Sunday.
Duggie
07/02/2011, 1:49 PM
how stokes isnt in the squad is crazy, id have played him if long wasnt fully fit. dont really rate walters.
tetsujin1979
07/02/2011, 1:59 PM
Green apart, I'm happy with that side
Long and Doyle played together at Reading, so trying Walters and Doyle will be something new.
SwanVsDalton
07/02/2011, 2:46 PM
Interesting team, plenty of scope for the new guys to play their way into contention.
OwlsFan
07/02/2011, 2:53 PM
how stokes isnt in the squad is crazy, id have played him if long wasnt fully fit. dont really rate walters.
The guy who was dropped by Celtic - that chap?
Stuttgart88
07/02/2011, 3:42 PM
Oh come on Owls Fan, he's been in great form for Celtic. It was a cup game. "Dropped" is hardly the word for it. Far more deserving of a squad place than Keogh.
geysir
07/02/2011, 4:08 PM
Celtic played one up front and Stokes does not play that role well enough.
theworm2345
07/02/2011, 4:26 PM
Very disappointed it will be Gibson/Green over Wilson. Also I think I'd prefer Best over Walters, even the Stoke fans think Walters is mainly someone who can come off the bench to add energy, though I guess Best/Doyle might be more similar than Walters/Doyle. Long/Doyle worked for Doyle though Long never really flourished like he has now. I can't really believe that there are people complaining about Stokes not being involved and yet championing the cause for Kilbane (who has also been in great form) to get dropped...if you look at it, when you remove Rangers, the two are playing at basically the level of competition (nevermind Kilbane's dedication and possible influence on some of the younger players).
ArdeeBhoy
07/02/2011, 4:34 PM
Come on people. Keep this tread on topic! Like some of you are always whining.
There's a separate thread for the game about which, frankly, who cares?
seanfhear
07/02/2011, 8:07 PM
Its looking like if anyone is going to these games then you should bring your boots. You might get a cap for Wales/Scotland/Northern Ireland/ Ireland. Maybe even the full set !:)
Junior
08/02/2011, 1:44 PM
Off topic I guess but Stokes and Hooper are Celtics first choice strikers - No question. Sunday was a tactical switch nothing more. Anyone suggesting that Walters has done more than Stokes or moreso Long for that matter, in getting a starting spot for tonight is way off the mark in my opinion.
legendz
08/02/2011, 4:34 PM
I don't see how the tournament will be a success if the games not involving the hosts will be so poorly attended. It should possibly interchange home and away fixtures as in the 6 Nations if the tournament is gong to be permanent. Otherwise, maybe Thomond Park or a lower capacity stadium be used for the other game.
ifk101
09/02/2011, 8:37 AM
Last night's result effectively rules Wales out of the running for the crown of tournament champions. They must be devastated.
Tonight's game sees NI play against Scotland. NI are currently ranked 38th in the World by FIFA while Scotland are ranked 53rd. Despite this Scotland are favourities with the bookies to win the game. Have the bookies got it wrong? Only time will tell .....
Supreme feet
09/02/2011, 8:52 AM
It's going to be a classic. Edge of the seat stuff between two great rivals.
tetsujin1979
09/02/2011, 9:12 AM
A small crumb of comfort for Wales, the last team we beat 3-0 went on to draw 0-0 with England less than a month later.
geysir
09/02/2011, 11:21 AM
It is a credit to the set up that so many of the regular players turned up for duty.
From the regulars in the last few games who were missing this time,
McGeady - off season for him
Kilbane, replaced by Clark
Keane - injured - allegedly - but we all know it was a serious vote of no confidence in Trap :rolleyes:
paul_oshea
09/02/2011, 11:42 AM
Geysir on a one man mission to right the ills of the fai and trap becomes the self appointed PR man for the FAI and Ireland management team.
Wolfie
09/02/2011, 12:50 PM
What sort of turn out can be expected tonight?? 10,000???
Duggie
09/02/2011, 12:52 PM
Keane - injured - allegedly - but we all know it was a serious vote of no confidence in Trap :rolleyes:
keane is injured, no question.
geysir
09/02/2011, 12:53 PM
Careful now Duggie or you will be branded a Trap apologist.
geysir
09/02/2011, 12:54 PM
Geysir on a one man mission to right the ills of the fai and trap becomes the self appointed PR man for the FAI and Ireland management team.
Are you referring to my fact based comments as opposed your self proclaimed devilish mutterings.
cornflakes
09/02/2011, 2:56 PM
Have the FAI set ticket prices for the last two games?
Its ridiculous to have an empty stadium for these games. They should be lowered to 20euro
Have the FAI set ticket prices for the last two games?
Its ridiculous to have an empty stadium for these games. They should be lowered to 20euro
The point isn't to fill them. The point is get the most money
If they dropped the price to €20 and got an extra 10,000 at last nights game (they wouldn't have got more), they'd be worse off financially
pineapple stu
09/02/2011, 3:10 PM
What was the crowd yesterday, by the way?
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