Tipp South & District League 2009/10

[DrRobert]

i will have to agree with fred on some of those points.i drove all the way over from tipp town to have a look at the game and was sorely disappointed with cashel and hugely impressed with celtic.we played them a few weeks ago and even then they looked very good.but they made cashel look very poor.they did not do themselves any favours at all.they lacked imagination and creativity.i know that they are missing some key players but 1 or 2 players should not make that much of a difference...rock are u involved in the cashel town management? if so,what went wrong the weekend?

as for our game against town,sorely disappointed with our performance especially when it was a game we needed to win to keep up our chances of winning the league.i know we had our chances but theres nothing really else i can take from the game.just really disappointed.

[hooper74]

saints posed no goal threat whatsoever and the bench is nowhere near strong enough

[bishbash]

got to be honest i wouldnt rule town out yet. when they have their strongest team avilable they will be extremely strong and they still have 27 points to play for.

[ronburgundy]

lads dont be so quick to write off peake. they have gone away to both celtic and saints and got draws, they have also beaten town. if it wasnt for a poor showing against cashel they would be top. they also have mostly home games left and players playing in their proper positions at the moment

[bishbash]

on a more sombre note is it true about michael ryan's brother?

[Insidetherock]

i will have to agree with fred on some of those points.i drove all the way over from tipp town to have a look at the game and was sorely disappointed with cashel and hugely impressed with celtic.we played them a few weeks ago and even then they looked very good.but they made cashel look very poor.they did not do themselves any favours at all.they lacked imagination and creativity.i know that they are missing some key players but 1 or 2 players should not make that much of a difference...rock are u involved in the cashel town management? if so,what went wrong the weekend?

as for our game against town,sorely disappointed with our performance especially when it was a game we needed to win to keep up our chances of winning the league.i know we had our chances but theres nothing really else i can take from the game.just really disappointed.

Not involved with management, just an interested observer, and will concur with what much of you and Fred said, although it pains me. Any real fan of the game should be able to recognise the short comings of their own team before commenting on those of others, so it's only fair to put my hands up regarding the game, and call it an extremely bad day at the office.

I wouldn't get too down about it yet though, I feel that the eleven points we have won are a respectable tally so far and but for a few other hard luck cases, we could have a few more in the bag, but yes, we were taken apart last Sunday. Who knows why, sometimes you just can't put your finger on a bad performance and hope that you can bank it and move on.

There are a fine bunch of players at the club, and like I said, aren't 5 goals worse than Celtic. If we look at it realistically, that was the first time we were beaten this year by more than one goal, and the first time we gave up more than two, but we were caught flat footed. It won't happen again.. I hope :)

[bishbash]

how many players were cashel missing on sunday?

[likealion]

hes on fire alright but whats goin on that he is playin in goal now and again????



I dunno why he ended up in goal on Sunday but the game against peake their 1st choice keeper was injured and I think there was a death in the family of 2nd choice keeper shortly before kick off. He's not a bad keeper even, some utility man. Still barely played in his best position this year

[maxwellsmart]

saints posed no goal threat whatsoever and the bench is nowhere near strong enough

Lads, thought Barry Ryan was in America? or does he just have amazing binoculars?

[Mega Tots]

as manager of peake villa barry ryan is no longer part of your thinking yet every time you venture on to this site its in reference to him,i genuinely hope that he is not staying up until 4 or 5am in america to post comments on st michaels games

[the only 1]

as manager of peake villa barry ryan is no longer part of your thinking yet every time you venture on to this site its in reference to him,i genuinely hope that he is not staying up until 4 or 5am in america to post comments on st michaels games

u tell him barry;)

[Tipp Top]

The title race is right back on again with 4 teams involved in it. I agree with ron villa can not be over looked at all. Michaels have only one point at home againts their so called biggest rivals that type of form might just be what could stop them from winning the title . I think Town could still have a good chance of retaining their title if they put a run of form together.

[ponyobrien]

I dunno why he ended up in goal on Sunday but the game against peake their 1st choice keeper was injured and I think there was a death in the family of 2nd choice keeper shortly before kick off. He's not a bad keeper even, some utility man. Still barely played in his best position this year

The decision was made after the 3rd goal to let the keeper leave because he had a GAA match. The 2nd keeper was in England for the weekend

[ronburgundy]

The title race is right back on again with 4 teams involved in it. I agree with ron villa can not be over looked at all. Michaels have only one point at home againts their so called biggest rivals that type of form might just be what could stop them from winning the title . I think Town could still have a good chance of retaining their title if they put a run of form together.

no i think town are out of it. the will probably concentrate on other competitions. dont be fooled by the result on sunday, they are a softer touch without paul scully and dont have anyone, at the moment, with that kind of influence. you just cant replace a player like him

[Tipp Top]

no i think town are out of it. the will probably concentrate on other competitions. dont be fooled by the result on sunday, they are a softer touch without paul scully and dont have anyone, at the moment, with that kind of influence. you just cant replace a player like him

They might be a softer touch without him but with barnes, kiely, burns, and scully across the middle and ryan and moroney up top they still have a heck of a lot to offer. To be honest they could have and should have beat Saints by 2 or 3 on Sunday.If Town were to go on and win every game between now and the end of the league they would end up with 36 pts thats the same amount of points that won them the league last year......... Im not saying this will happen but i just feel they certainly will be their abouts at the end of the season. Hopefully you are right that they will concentrate on other competitions and leave the league title to Celtic or Villa .

[ronburgundy]

They might be a softer touch without him but with barnes, kiely, burns, and scully across the middle and ryan and moroney up top they still have a heck of a lot to offer. To be honest they could have and should have beat Saints by 2 or 3 on Sunday.If Town were to go on and win every game between now and the end of the league they would end up with 36 pts thats the same amount of points that won them the league last year......... Im not saying this will happen but i just feel they certainly will be their abouts at the end of the season. Hopefully you are right that they will concentrate on other competitions and leave the league title to Celtic or Villa .

leave the league title?? they are not real madrid, they dont have a choice, they are out of contention

[Tipp Top]

leave the league title?? they are not real madrid, they dont have a choice, they are out of contention


Out of contention... You seem to be very sure and i hope your right but only time will tell. I hope your not eating humble pie come the end of the season Ron.....

[ponyobrien]

leave the league title?? they are not real madrid, they dont have a choice, they are out of contention

Town can't be ruled out at the moment. They have a strong squad and a winning mentality, but they have left themselves with a lot of work to do. Time will tell

[hoops12]

lads was wondering if any of ye had contact name or number for the glasgow celtic supporters clubs out yer way would much appreciate it ,ye can pm me if ye want cheers

[DrRobert]

What has happened in cashel,is it true glenn doherty has stepped down as manager.can anyone from cashel explain what has happened.

[useless]

Hi Lads,

Im looking for clarification on a matter that happened recently to one of our players.

During a league game the player was booked for a missed timed tackle.Later on in the same game the same player had a verbal argument with the referee about a decision that he taught the ref had made wrong.There was some swear words used as there is in every game but he did not call the ref any unsavoury names.The ref gave the same player a strong and lengthy talking to and that was it no second yellow card.The game eneded and both teams and ref went there seperate ways.

Two weeks later the club recieved a phone call from Tommy Lewis stating the player in question had recieved a 2 game ban for abusive language towards the referree.

Can a player be suspended after a match even though the ref hadnt sent the same player off.Instead he decides to put it in his match report.If this is the case whats to stop refs doing this to players they may have a dislike towards.Its surely just a case of the refs word against the players word and we all know who will get the benefit of the doubt.

Hope someone can put some clarity on this.

[ponyobrien]

Hi Lads,

Im looking for clarification on a matter that happened recently to one of our players.

During a league game the player was booked for a missed timed tackle.Later on in the same game the same player had a verbal argument with the referee about a decision that he taught the ref had made wrong.There was some swear words used as there is in every game but he did not call the ref any unsavoury names.The ref gave the same player a strong and lengthy talking to and that was it no second yellow card.The game eneded and both teams and ref went there seperate ways.

Two weeks later the club recieved a phone call from Tommy Lewis stating the player in question had recieved a 2 game ban for abusive language towards the referree.

Can a player be suspended after a match even though the ref hadnt sent the same player off.Instead he decides to put it in his match report.If this is the case whats to stop refs doing this to players they may have a dislike towards.Its surely just a case of the refs word against the players word and we all know who will get the benefit of the doubt.

Hope someone can put some clarity on this.

It's happened to us before as well, when a ref lied in his report, but the TSDL Committee still fined us.

[Referee09]

Hi Lads,

Im looking for clarification on a matter that happened recently to one of our players.

During a league game the player was booked for a missed timed tackle.Later on in the same game the same player had a verbal argument with the referee about a decision that he taught the ref had made wrong.There was some swear words used as there is in every game but he did not call the ref any unsavoury names.The ref gave the same player a strong and lengthy talking to and that was it no second yellow card.The game eneded and both teams and ref went there seperate ways.

Two weeks later the club recieved a phone call from Tommy Lewis stating the player in question had recieved a 2 game ban for abusive language towards the referree.

Can a player be suspended after a match even though the ref hadnt sent the same player off.Instead he decides to put it in his match report.If this is the case whats to stop refs doing this to players they may have a dislike towards.Its surely just a case of the refs word against the players word and we all know who will get the benefit of the doubt.

Hope someone can put some clarity on this.
OK lads, I saw this and said I'd reply before all the conspiracey theories about referees and the Leagues being against Clubs start flooding in!!

So the player was cautioned for a "late tacke" as you put it, no problems there......it's the rest of your message I have problems with for several reasons.
Firstly: "Later on in the same game the same player had a verbal argument with the referee about a decision that he taught the ref had made wrong." IMO from the way you describe it, the player should have been cautioned for dissent and dismissed from play. The fact that the referee didn't caution him but gave him a talking to sounds like the ref saved the player a red card.

Secondly: "Two weeks later the club recieved a phone call from Tommy Lewis stating the player in question had recieved a 2 game ban for abusive language towards the referree." again IMO if the referee hasn't acted on something during the game i.e. not sending the player off then 1. he has nothing to report. 2. The league have nothing to act on.

"If this is the case whats to stop refs doing this to players they may have a dislike towards.Its surely just a case of the refs word against the players word and we all know who will get the benefit of the doubt."

Whenever a referee reports a player or Club, then it's always word against word, and your technically correct, the referees word is normally taken, this is because he is employed to control the match and report any misbehaviour that takes place. It's his job and he's paid to be there and do it.

Hope this helps!:)

[likealion]

Wednesday,s deadline is an F.A.I set date. All junior leagues playing winter leagues are bound by this rule. The only players that can sign after Wednesday are those that are unregistered by any other club. The next Transfer window starts Dec 1st and ends 31st Jan.


You certain it starts the 1st December?

[West Hammer]

Certain. There are 2 Transfer windows for Junior Clubs playing winter leagues,
1st June - 30th Sept and 1st Dec - 31st Jan. As stated a player may not register for a club after 31st March.

[balls]

how bout players that have not signed for anyone yet. Can they still sign for there first club of season inside window or have they to wait for it to re open

[West Hammer]

You can sign for your first club at anytime up till 31st March 2010, even outside transfer windows.

[balls]

nice one cheers for that west hammer

[ronburgundy]

i hear former villa manager noel byrne has approached foggy, derek loughnane, aaron ryan and mike ryan from his old club and wants them to join town, obviously cant be done until january but i dont know if either club will want that

[West Hammer]

Not great for the players either as they would be cup tied for F.A.I and Munster Cups if all ready played in them for Peake. By January there may be only a handfull of league games to left to play.

[Tipp Top]

i hear former villa manager noel byrne has approached foggy, derek loughnane, aaron ryan and mike ryan from his old club and wants them to join town, obviously cant be done until january but i dont know if either club will want that

sounds like your trying to stir it up as usual ron,i can confirm there is absolutely no truth in that post,i know noel personally,some of the players mentioned he had at kilkenny but michael ryan is a player he particularly doesnt rate and didnt invite to kilkenny so he definitely would not have approached him,i dont think clonmel would welcome a big influx of villa players and i know from speaking to noel he has no intention of going down that route

[Insidetherock]

And any influx like that from one club to another, especially when they are both rivals for honours woiuld cause the world of hassle.

Apart from that, best of luck to the Cashel B team Sunday in the Shield final against Dundrum. It's a local derby and a chance for Cashel to show off their new field, so it should be a good occasion

Here's hoping the first's can avenge the early season defeat by St Michael's as well Sunday morning. A somewhat tougher proposition :)

[tipp man]

sounds like your trying to stir it up as usual ron,i can confirm there is absolutely no truth in that post,i know noel personally,some of the players mentioned he had at kilkenny but michael ryan is a player he particularly doesnt rate and didnt invite to kilkenny so he definitely would not have approached him,i dont think clonmel would welcome a big influx of villa players and i know from speaking to noel he has no intention of going down that route


What exactly (if any) is Noel Byrne's role, official or otherwise, with Clonmel Town?

[MunsterMunch]

sounds like your trying to stir it up as usual ron,i can confirm there is absolutely no truth in that post,i know noel personally,some of the players mentioned he had at kilkenny but michael ryan is a player he particularly doesnt rate and didnt invite to kilkenny so he definitely would not have approached him,i dont think clonmel would welcome a big influx of villa players and i know from speaking to noel he has no intention of going down that route


I doubt Michael Ryan would have any interest in going to a club where Noel is involved either. Any loyal Villa player wouldnt for that matter. Especially after what Noel did to the club. To say that he's not looked on favourably by current people assocaited with Villa for the last 15+ years would be putting it mildly.

[Mega Tots]

I doubt Michael Ryan would have any interest in going to a club where Noel is involved either. Any loyal Villa player wouldnt for that matter. Especially after what Noel did to the club. To say that he's not looked on favourably by current people assocaited with Villa for the last 15+ years would be putting it mildly.

and equally noel would burn them,2 sides to every story,the one thing about noel is he is a winner and his record at villa is frankly untouchable,they won everything from schoolboys to youths to junior,they havent won a single trophy since he left,top players have ambition....the loyalty card is a joke,the one thing saint michaels have and clonmel have is profesionalism,some of the people involved with peake are straight out of a comedy sketch,its beyond believe some of the things that take place,quick example...villa are challenging for the league,they trained the other night and a player had to take the session as there was nobody from the management team present,this is just minor compared to the usual goings on

[the dazzler]

I doubt Michael Ryan would have any interest in going to a club where Noel is involved either. Any loyal Villa player wouldnt for that matter. Especially after what Noel did to the club. To say that he's not looked on favourably by current people assocaited with Villa for the last 15+ years would be putting it mildly.

just proves barry ryan is not a loyal villa player:p

[Tipp Top]

just proves barry ryan is not a loyal villa player:p

every time we try to discuss anything on this site someone from limerick posts something stupid about barry ryan,we dont care,were bored of it,now run along

[Freddy]

What has happened in cashel,is it true glenn doherty has stepped down as manager.can anyone from cashel explain what has happened.

Was talking to a few lads i know from cashel, it's true the manager is gone alright. They didn't go into too much detail about it but i got the impression they weren't too dissapointed with his departure! I wouldn't really like to comment on it as our own club has had it's difficulties with managment also..what club doesn't?? The only thing i will sat though is that i feel sorry for the players who would have obviously put in a lot of effort during pre-season and over the years to get back to the Premier. It's not very fair on them when their manager, who is supposed to lead by example, walks out on them half-way through the season. Hopefully they can get a replacement with a bit more loyalty and commitment to the players.

[bishbash]

Was talking to a few lads i know from cashel, it's true the manager is gone alright. They didn't go into too much detail about it but i got the impression they weren't too dissapointed with his departure! I wouldn't really like to comment on it as our own club has had it's difficulties with managment also..what club doesn't?? The only thing i will sat though is that i feel sorry for the players who would have obviously put in a lot of effort during pre-season and over the years to get back to the Premier. It's not very fair on them when their manager, who is supposed to lead by example, walks out on them half-way through the season. Hopefully they can get a replacement with a bit more loyalty and commitment to the players.
Thought you said you would'nt like to comment on it.....

[zizu's head]

Was at the Town v Bridge game today. Fairly poor stuff from both sides really. Town won 4nil in the end and it could have been a lot more! They were 1 up inside 30 seconds; a terrible mix up between defender and keeper and Aaron Moroney nipped in the knock the ball home. Bridge steaded the ship a bit after that and created a few chances but didn't really look like scoring. In the end, Town just pulled away and got three more. Stephen Ryan scored a beauty from outside the box!
Cahir were beaten by Two-Mile-Borris and Michael's beat Cashel 5nil.

[balls]

town playing poor and winning 4-0 decent compaint to have. not looking good for the bridge this season. stuck in 3 way battle with cahir and borris for survival

[Tipp Top]

Was talking to a few lads i know from cashel, it's true the manager is gone alright. They didn't go into too much detail about it but i got the impression they weren't too dissapointed with his departure! I wouldn't really like to comment on it as our own club has had it's difficulties with managment also..what club doesn't?? The only thing i will sat though is that i feel sorry for the players who would have obviously put in a lot of effort during pre-season and over the years to get back to the Premier. It's not very fair on them when their manager, who is supposed to lead by example, walks out on them half-way through the season. Hopefully they can get a replacement with a bit more loyalty and commitment to the players.


Freddy i am really dissapointed with this comment out of you when clearly you dont know the full side of the story. Glenn was the person who was crucial in getting the club back to the premier league. Your Quote of loyalty and commitment is crazy if you knew anything about cashel you would know glenn has being involved in the club for a very long time now and being involved with teams of all ages at the club. He had no other option but to step down at the way he was being treated by the committe and some of the players....Its amazing what happens to the heads of certain players and committe members when success comes about at a club.. 90% of the players would still love for glenn to be manager and so does anyone who knows whats good for the club. Cashel wont get a more loyal and committed manager no matter how far and wide they look.

[Insidetherock]

Freddy i am really dissapointed with this comment out of you when clearly you dont know the full side of the story. Glenn was the person who was crucial in getting the club back to the premier league. Your Quote of loyalty and commitment is crazy if you knew anything about cashel you would know glenn has being involved in the club for a very long time now and being involved with teams of all ages at the club. He had no other option but to step down at the way he was being treated by the committe and some of the players....Its amazing what happens to the heads of certain players and committe members when success comes about at a club.. 90% of the players would still love for glenn to be manager and so does anyone who knows whats good for the club. Cashel wont get a more loyal and committed manager no matter how far and wide they look.

Pretty much on the button there TT... it's a pity really, the club had a very successful return to the Premiership, and had a few results gone their way eg draws at Rock and Cahir instead of wins, they could even be looked at as possible title challengers, but two 5-0 defeats on the bounce could mean a long season yet for us. I hope not.

[zizu's head]

Pretty much on the button there TT... it's a pity really, the club had a very successful return to the Premiership, and had a few results gone their way eg draws at Rock and Cahir instead of wins, they could even be looked at as possible title challengers, but two 5-0 defeats on the bounce could mean a long season yet for us. I hope not.

What exactly happened as regards the Cashel manager stepping down/being forced out??

[Insidetherock]

What exactly happened as regards the Cashel manager stepping down/being forced out??

To be honest Zizu, a public forum isn't the place to discuss it. Needless to say, either way, the best interests of the club are what all involved, including Glen so far as I know, have in mind. We would be better off congratulating the B team for winning the Third division Shield yesterday.

[zizu's head]

To be honest Zizu, a public forum isn't the place to discuss it. Needless to say, either way, the best interests of the club are what all involved, including Glen so far as I know, have in mind.

That's fair enough. Didn't really think that through!!!

[CashelMan]

Freddy i am really dissapointed with this comment out of you when clearly you dont know the full side of the story. Glenn was the person who was crucial in getting the club back to the premier league. Your Quote of loyalty and commitment is crazy if you knew anything about cashel you would know glenn has being involved in the club for a very long time now and being involved with teams of all ages at the club. He had no other option but to step down at the way he was being treated by the committe and some of the players....Its amazing what happens to the heads of certain players and committe members when success comes about at a club.. 90% of the players would still love for glenn to be manager and so does anyone who knows whats good for the club. Cashel wont get a more loyal and committed manager no matter how far and wide they look.

Im going to have to disagree with you on alot of those points TT and say that i know alot of the story.Glenn played a small part in getting the club back to the premier,the main ingredient in getting them back to the premier was the quality of players that he had.anybody could have done what he did.you could go as far as to say that they did not even need a manager in the lower leagues because the quality of players they have and the opposition is pretty poor.
Glenns strong points was that he had good commitment and loyality but as for his soccer knowledge and people skills it is pretty poor.in a few games this year and from watching from the line a few things were going wrong and things needed to be done but nothing was happening from the sideline.i think he fell out with too many people and players and because of this was the reason for his own demise.i wont go into exact situations but there is many.
i can also say from talking to alot of the players they would not like to have him back.i think they need a strong manager,maybe somebody from outside the club who doesnt know the players.someone with soccer knowledge and know how and when the right changes need to be made you make them.there are plenty of managers out there that would love to come in and manage a premier team.cashel will have to either look hard for one or someone comes knocking on the door...i wish them all the best in their search

[Insidetherock]

Im going to have to disagree with you on alot of those points TT and say that i know alot of the story.Glenn played a small part in getting the club back to the premier,the main ingredient in getting them back to the premier was the quality of players that he had.anybody could have done what he did.you could go as far as to say that they did not even need a manager in the lower leagues because the quality of players they have and the opposition is pretty poor.
Glenns strong points was that he had good commitment and loyality but as for his soccer knowledge and people skills it is pretty poor.in a few games this year and from watching from the line a few things were going wrong and things needed to be done but nothing was happening from the sideline.i think he fell out with too many people and players and because of this was the reason for his own demise.i wont go into exact situations but there is many.
i can also say from talking to alot of the players they would not like to have him back.i think they need a strong manager,maybe somebody from outside the club who doesnt know the players.someone with soccer knowledge and know how and when the right changes need to be made you make them.there are plenty of managers out there that would love to come in and manage a premier team.cashel will have to either look hard for one or someone comes knocking on the door...i wish them all the best in their search

Again Cashel Man, I'd ask that much of what is happening in the club be kept in house, as it is very easy to take sides and present the situation from whichever viewpoint someone feels suits their own perspective.

I would agree that Cashel do have very good players, and yes, they were playing in lower divisions, but perhaps not enough credit is given in your post for Glen actually assembling that group of players, because as you know one of Cashel's biggest problems over the years has been the fact that many of the towns best players choose for one reason or another not to play with the local club. Even this season Cashel added some strong players to their squad, and were unfortunate perhaps to not strengthen it even more when Rosegreen decided at the last minute to put a team into the first division.

Be that as it may though, the fact remains that whether people agree or disagree with the way the club was managed up to now this year, Cashel do already have 11 points in the league, and have shown up to the last two games, that they have the players who when they play to their strenghts, are capable of surviving in the division. It would be a terrible pity if all that good work was wasted now by infighting, bickering and gossiping, and the club was to slide backwards again. It's time now to move on and rally round and pick up probably 5 or 6 more points to ensure survival, and then worry about who will be in charge next year.

[CashelMan]

Again Cashel Man, I'd ask that much of what is happening in the club be kept in house, as it is very easy to take sides and present the situation from whichever viewpoint someone feels suits their own perspective.

I would agree that Cashel do have very good players, and yes, they were playing in lower divisions, but perhaps not enough credit is given in your post for Glen actually assembling that group of players, because as you know one of Cashel's biggest problems over the years has been the fact that many of the towns best players choose for one reason or another not to play with the local club. Even this season Cashel added some strong players to their squad, and were unfortunate perhaps to not strengthen it even more when Rosegreen decided at the last minute to put a team into the first division.

Be that as it may though, the fact remains that whether people agree or disagree with the way the club was managed up to now this year, Cashel do already have 11 points in the league, and have shown up to the last two games, that they have the players who when they play to their strenghts, are capable of surviving in the division. It would be a terrible pity if all that good work was wasted now by infighting, bickering and gossiping, and the club was to slide backwards again. It's time now to move on and rally round and pick up probably 5 or 6 more points to ensure survival, and then worry about who will be in charge next year.

Rock i agree and have said that Glenns strong points is his commitment and loyality.but his loyality and commitment to the club now is,i think,ruined.the way he left was not the sign of a proper manager or a committed person to the club.and i know that alot of the players arent happy about that either.i think it should have been done a different way and if it was he would have gone out with a bit more respect.thats just my view.i do not play myself but am a keen follower and go to every game that i can.but from lookin from the outside i think it is better for the club all round.

and i agree its time to get the thing back on track and to survive this year and build on the next.

[Freddy]

I didnt mean to step on any toes regarding the issue Rock..obviously the Cashel manager leaving is a sore issue for the club as a whole. Im just trying to offer an outside, objective viewpoint. Obviously the manager did a lot for the club in getting back players and getting them up through the divisions etc. My main point is, and i think im right, is that credit where credit is due (i.e. getting players,building the team etc), but also you have to be analytically critical also when looking at the situation,,no matter what club is involved in the discussion! Its completely disrespectful for any manager to abandon his team mid-way through their first Premier season in years. A manager is supposed to lead by example etc. I know you said a few players left or were unhappy and this was part of his reason for departing. But, in my opinion, he is no better than them for then leaving himself. He should have stuck with his players for remainder of this season and then left if he so wished. Also, i still stand by the view that alot of your players are quite happy he has left, as other posts have indicated. Im really not trying to be bitter here, but you have to realise that in order to be a top club in this division you at least need a good manager. And you have to admit that your ex-manager had no genuine experience whatsoever other than his previous endevours in the lower divisions in the previous years. To be a top club, your manager should be striving to better himself as well as his team, i.e. - gaining coaching badges etc. Was your ex-manager doing this. At the end of the day, your team is a fine team,,and a good team doesnt become a bad team overnight! But a ggod team can easily be held back and become quite an average team if they are being managed by an average manager with no real experience - Fact! Really, it's like holding the keys to a treaure trove of possibilites,,but being unable to use the keys properly and thus failing to unlock the full potential on offer. In other words,,i think with a proper manager your team can achieve an awful lot more. In response to an early post that claimed it would be difficult to find a better manager than what Cashel had already i strongly disagree! How hard is it to find someone that wants to manage a Premier team, full of young, good players, that has experience and know how? Your club needs to further its horizon regarding this issue!