2023 FAI Cup

[DCWA]

Full replay in the Bowl. Tickets for tonight valid for the rematch

Not our fault the weather was so bad

That’s interesting. I would have thought see out the 45 would be more appropriate, tough on Galway and whilst not UCD’s fault weather was bad, not Galway’s either and certainly UCD’s fault they were 0-2 down.

I understand a full replay if scores level but hard to understand the rational about a full replay from 0-0 when one team already has the game half won.

[Olander]

Of course it's not UCD's fault that the weather was terrible, but the weather was also awful in Dalymount, at the Carlisle Grounds, but both of those games finished.... there was little or no work done on the pitch pre game or at half time by groundstaff, which was farcical.

I read that there was surface water on the pitch at the Carlisle Grounds, but that game finished. Amateur enough stuff last night.

Of course UCD were happy enough for it to be postponed, they were getting pasted and it could've been 3 or 4-0 by HT alone last night. It's a free hit for them on Monday, which they didn't deserve, but it is what it is. Let's be honest, if we're not beating that UCD team, then we don't deserve to go to the next round anyway.

[pineapple stu]

Well I presume it's a full replay (on Monday at 7:45 as Joey notes). I've never known an LoI game to restart from midway through a game as happens in other leagues

Tough on Galway for sure but the pitch made a nonsense of the game for both sides. In particular UCD could say we were impacted by standing water on the edge of the Galway box which made it harder for us to attack. Galway's second goal involved a player in the middle of the park playing a pass forward but ultimately picking up on it himself as the water held it up, so that turns things into a bit of a lottery too.

I don't doubt Galway will win on Monday but in a way it wasn't entirely our fault we were 2-0 down.

[pineapple stu]

there was little or no work done on the pitch pre game or at half time by groundstaff, which was farcical.
Tell me how you know what work was done on the pitch during the day?

By halftime the game was clearly going to be abandoned. The first half was already problematic, the standing water patch was growing, and the rain was getting heavier.

[Olander]

Tell me how you know what work was done on the pitch during the day?

By halftime the game was clearly going to be abandoned. The first half was already problematic, the standing water patch was growing, and the rain was getting heavier.
I arrived at the game at around 7.00pm and it was as clear as day that water was starting to pool up in certain areas of the pitch, little or no work was being done to disperse it. I've been at games before where you had cases like this and 5-6 people were working with brushes, rakes, etc to shift surface water.

The rain was heavy in Dalymount and Bray, I saw pictures of pools of water on the pitch at Bray, yet they both finished... maybe they had more than one guy working on the pitch... I wonder could that have contributed.

[legendz]

Kerry were very competitive in their first test against a Premier opponent. Been the story of the summer, competitive but no result to show for their efforts. Unlucky not to take the game to extra time. Kerry probably need 4 wins from their remaining 9 games for some kind of respectable points total. Only one league win on the board so far and at least 12 league points left behind since the summer break.

[gufct]

No one is blaming Ucd for the weather but their was zero work done on the pitch from when the 1st of the United fans arrived and at half time one lad went out with a rake and fork for no more than 2 minutes. Total lack of respect for the gufc supporters who travelled in such large numbers and have to face back into another long journey on Monday.

[Larry 'da' Wyse]

Skerries were very, very bad. Another four or five goals wouldn't have flattered Harps, if truth be told.

A professional job though and into the quarter finals.

In defense of non-league teams, their season is just up and running a few weeks or even in pre-season. Very hard to get up to speed and try and match a LOI team.

[D24Saint]

What is the story with the LoI stream of the Bray Dundalk game, every so often sponsors come up on the full screen blocking the game, even when it’s in play.

Reminded me of watching MLB games but even they are more subtle than to block the entire screen.

[Nesta99]

There is so much fuss about pitches these days/ Yes in an ideal world all pitches should be like carpets (cough), hoping that the standard is maximised. But mucky, wet, soft, snow, dry, hard etc all throw up different challanges. People will talk about injury potential but Ive not seen (not sayin doesnt exist) evidence that less than optimum pitches significantly increase risk of injury - certainly a soft/mucky pitch any more than a hard dry pitch or artificial surfaces even. I think too much is made of this, too much being careful by refs in case they get targeted for not calling off games. As mentioned, who is to say that the pitch in Bray was any worse than UCD but a differnt ref has a different opinion. I enjoyed that old days where top level games on a mud bath was a leveller in games. RoI made a success of it, tactically using a torn up Rugby pitch in Landsdowne to beat the likes of Spain. I enjoyed playing in condiitions where you could slide half the length of a pitch, digging hands and studs in to the surface to try and stop.

Its all a bit gone soft imo, with many other aspects of the game eg diving, rolling around at minimal contact etc.

As for accusations of UCD not doing work on the pitch - so what, prior to the game it may have suited to enhance home advantage against possibly a better footballing side. Maybe it was known or not, but why try and make the pitch better for the visitors and improve their stock. When 2 down and there is a chance of a match abandoned with a refixture starting from scratch - do you go out to do everything to make sure you are knocked out by trying to drain or water a pitch so a losing match can continue!? It is what it is and if Galway had been 2 down the same thing would have beneftted them.

While I dont remember it, I have heard any times about an Athlone(?) keeper swinging out of the crossbar in Oriel to break it and force a match abandoned, oviously not in the same league as a game being rained off but Im still a bit 'fair dues' he acted up but it worked.

If Dundalk were playig a Pep Barcelona in Oriel during a real grass pitch days, id have the grass like a meadow, ploughed , and watered for weeks solid - try yer tika taka on that, while we went a fashinable purist route 1 making sure the keeper was clobbered under the high ball every few minutes.

[pineapple stu]

As for accusations of UCD not doing work on the pitch - so what, prior to the game it may have suited to enhance home advantage against possibly a better footballing side.
I should add I don't ever remember seeing groundstaff working on the pitch before a UCD match. But we've never once had a game abandoned, and I can only think of one other game postponed for rain (against Rovers in 2011). There was a couple of other games postponed where all the league fixtures were cancelled (stuff like Storm Emma or Hurricane Ophelia)

It's usually a decent playing surface too once the egg chasers bugger off.

So when a game gets abandoned for the first time in 44 years of league membership, was it (a) amateur hour stuff or (b) exceptional weather conditions?

The first pitch inspection only took place at 7:30 so far as I'm aware, so presumably the refereeing panel had no issues with the pitch up until that point. The rain only started getting really heavy about 20-30 minutes before kick-off.

[Nesta99]

Footage of UCD bowl last night...no effort made with the pitch indeed:p
https://www.dailymotion.com/video/x17teib

(I also love this old classic from The Oval when the orange ball burst, just a pity it cant ...yet... be included in the GLITW archive. None of this unplayable pitch rubbish! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d48a6MDmCBM )

[Dermobohs]

Very easy win for bohs in awful conditions Friday, Rockmount to give them their due credit we’re on a hiding from ko with that gale lashing down and only just starting their season.
Keeper pulled off a couple of fine stops too, and the two centre backs kept Afolabi quiet for 20 minutes anyway( with extreme difficulty)but a 3-0 ht was kind to them, as was the final score.
Home draw next is all I’d like, don’t fear anyone left, our names on it anyhow.

[Philosophizer]

Very easy win for bohs in awful conditions Friday, Rockmount to give them their due credit we’re on a hiding from ko with that gale lashing down.
That gale was actually at Rockmount’s back for the 1st half but it didn’t make any difference. They could barely get out of their own box, never mind their half. I know they’re in preseason but the standard of even the best intermediate teams seems to be miles below LOI. And they’re the best intermediate team in Munster…

[nigel-harps1954]

That gale was actually at Rockmount’s back for the 1st half but it didn’t make any difference. They could barely get out of their own box, never mind their half. I know they’re in preseason but the standard of even the best intermediate teams seems to be miles below LOI. And they’re the best intermediate team in Munster…


Current Intermediate Cup holders..

The gulf in standard between LOI and non-LOI is massive. It was almost embarrassing watching Skerries against Harps the other night at times, with no disrespect to Skerries, but it was men against boys.

[Shinkicker]

In defense of non-league teams, their season is just up and running a few weeks or even in pre-season. Very hard to get up to speed and try and match a LOI team.
I fully understand your point, but if I was the manager of a non league team in the FAI CUP, I would have started training earlier, played additional friendlies and possibly trained 3 or 4 days a week. I know it's easier said than done but you have to do something to ensure you are not on the end of a drubbing. Everyone knows when the cup matches are on and has the opportunity to do something about it. Unfortunately the gap in quality is to big for many to do something so they just don't bother. In saying that Rockmount were well set up but lacked fitness and quality.

[Nesta99]

Its interesting to see the gap between LoI and non=league sides growing. There wasnt such a gap in days of yore were a shock result happened (Ashownvilla/Malahide/Drogheda still hurt as a Dundalk fan). Id imagine it is to do with the increase of full-time training for starters, that the seasons are not aligned with non-league preseason. Any other opinions on things? Does it erode a powerbase, influence the argument to align seasons. It seems to me that the arrogance from some quarters of inter/junior game that they were just as good as LoI and dismissive toboot. Any statos that would have the records of non league v senior in the FAI Cup, mainly in the days of the old winter season? St Francis obviously being the high watermark in reaching the final.

Harps are no great shapes currently yet were ridiculously superior, Bohs a very good side so less of a surprise to be do dominant but as Philosiphiser suggests, considering the weather, a goal kick with a gale behind a team should have opposition turnng and heading deep toward their goal. Thoughts? could it influence a seachange in resistance to restructuring the wider setup?

[Philosophizer]

Any statos that would have the records of non league v senior in the FAI Cup, mainly in the days of the old winter season? St Francis obviously being the high watermark in reaching the final.

Someone on here analysed it recently. They compared the LOI v non league sides over the past 20 years or so. The data showed the gap has widened in the past few years.

I suppose it’s a good thing, as it shows our league is progressing.

[Philosophizer]

Moving this table to the top again since the LOI Vs Non league debate is being discussed. It’s quite clear that LOI has pulled away significantly in the last 5 years.

[Philosophizer]

Here below is Non-League vs LOI statistics since 2007. I'm counting 'A' Championship teams during 2008-2011 as non-league.. Penalty shootout outcomes are not counted as a result these are counted as a draw. PPG = Points per Game i.e. 3 points for win/1 point for a draw. GDPG = Goal Difference per Game

40 defeats in 41 games for Non-League teams in the past 5 FAI Cup seasons is pretty damning even considering results were not great 10-15 years ago

I would have to try find time to work through further season backwards and something similar for Premier Division vs First Division I feel may also tell a growing gap





P
W
D
L
GF
GA
GD
PPG
GDPG


2007
11
1
2
8
8
28
-20
0.45
-1.81


2008
10
1
1
8
4
25
-21
0.40
-2.10


2009
13
1
3
9
7
38
-31
0.46
-2.38


2010
11
0
2
9
6
30
-24
0.18
-2.18


2011
12
1
0
11
10
34
-24
0.25
-2.00


2012
12
1
1
10
10
29
-19
0.33
-1.58


2013
13
1
2
10
11
35
-24
0.38
-1.84


2014
9
0
1
8
4
30
-26
0.11
-2.88


2015
13
3
2
8
13
24
-11
0.85
-0.85


2016
12
1
1
10
6
39
-33
0.33
-2.75


2017
11
2
1
8
10
29
-19
0.63
-1.73


2018
10
0
0
10
7
47
-40
0.00
-4.00


2019
7
0
0
7
4
21
-17
0.00
-2.42


2021
9
1
0
8
5
32
-27
0.33
-3.00


2022
9
0
0
9
0
41
-41
0.00
-4.56


2023*
6
0
0
6
2
18
-16
0.00
-2.67


Here it is.

[pineapple stu]

I suppose it’s a good thing, as it shows our league is progressing.
Or is non-league regressing?

Either way, we've talked here about where new clubs might come from and it's not great to see that there's so few who could be competitive at First Division level

[EalingGreen]

Someone on here analysed it recently. They compared the LOI v non league sides over the past 20 years or so. The data showed the gap has widened in the past few years.

I suppose it’s a good thing, as it shows our league is progressing.You may well be right.

As against that, recent LOI experiences in Europe may suggest otherwise, so that it is in fact the Intermediate sides are regressing? (Or a bit of both?).

Either way, this can't be good for the overall health of football in ROI, if only because it makes it even harder for Intermediate clubs to bridge the gap and "keep the Senior clubs honest".

And I have to say, for all the other advances domestically in the LOI (most notably attendances), for a country with your tradition, resources and potential only to support 16* Senior sides seems less than optimal to me.

All of which for me hardens the argument against the Irish League (only) moving to a summer season, as some in NI are advocating.


* - Not counting 2 amateur sides (Treaty and Kerry), a University side and DCFC.

[joey B]

St Patrick’s CY seem to have gave Wexford a decent game even if the result didn’t go their way…

[Nesta99]

Or is non-league regressing?

Either way, we've talked here about where new clubs might come from and it's not great to see that there's so few who could be competitive at First Division level

Tbh I hadnt really considered a regression of non-league rather than progression of professionalism at senior level. If this is the case what would be the cause. It isnt levels of participation, coaching standards have likely improved. So are LoI now skimming the cream of the crop. Are the introduction of new sides ie Kerry, Wexford and Treaty relying more on local talent, ditto Harps with a longer term vision on developing local youth. Clubs like Cork, Longford, Athlone (maybe) among others that have to be pragmatic on a budgetry basis and not just take on the fringe players from say Dublin academy players. I dont intend to tease out issues that I already have a notion of here, Im genuinely out of the loop and interested in the changing enviornment of the game here at all levels. National youth leagues will have a bearing but cant just be this. There were non senior teams that were a right nuisance to draw in the past, full of ex LoI players often with an axe to grind. Could it legitimately be the basis of an argument or even leverage to drag them along with wider FAI reform of the admin of the game? Im also thinking less about potential senior clubs and more about the greater development of talent - players that are late developers getting a shot etc.

[EalingGreen]

Tbh I hadnt really considered a regression of non-league rather than progression of professionalism at senior level. If this is the case what would be the cause. It isnt levels of participation, coaching standards have likely improved. So are LoI now skimming the cream of the crop. Are the introduction of new sides ie Kerry, Wexford and Treaty relying more on local talent, ditto Harps with a longer term vision on developing local youth. Clubs like Cork, Longford, Athlone (maybe) among others that have to be pragmatic on a budgetry basis and not just take on the fringe players from say Dublin academy players. I dont intend to tease out issues that I already have a notion of here, Im genuinely out of the loop and interested in the changing enviornment of the game here at all levels. National youth leagues will have a bearing but cant just be this. There were non senior teams that were a right nuisance to draw in the past, full of ex LoI players often with an axe to grind. Could it legitimately be the basis of an argument or even leverage to drag them along with wider FAI reform of the admin of the game? Im also thinking less about potential senior clubs and more about the greater development of talent - players that are late developers getting a shot etc.Interesting thoughts there.

Might it also be that in the absence of a realistic chance of attaining Senior status, clubs are instead concentrating on expanding their community involvement - boys/girls/women/Football For All etc? So that if they do raise a bit of money (Social club, sponsorship, advertising etc), rather than paying 1st team players a wage, or investing in the stadium to attract extra spectators etc, they instead divert it towards subsidising membership, or extending playing facilities (eg artificial training pitches)?

Also, may it be harder now to attract players from GAA, if there is a barrier to how far they can go in our code? Am open to correction here, but if GAA is raising its game generally (no pun intended), including improving facilities and (shall we say) pushing the boundaries of Amateurism etc, might it be that Intermediate soccer is now less attractive by comparison?

[joey B]

Derry dominated for the first 35 odd minutes but Pats had 2 good chances towards the end of the half there,decent game…..

[Shinkicker]

Its interesting to see the gap between LoI and non=league sides growing. There wasnt such a gap in days of yore were a shock result happened (Ashownvilla/Malahide/Drogheda still hurt as a Dundalk fan). Id imagine it is to do with the increase of full-time training for starters, that the seasons are not aligned with non-league preseason. Any other opinions on things? Does it erode a powerbase, influence the argument to align seasons. It seems to me that the arrogance from some quarters of inter/junior game that they were just as good as LoI and dismissive toboot. Any statos that would have the records of non league v senior in the FAI Cup, mainly in the days of the old winter season? St Francis obviously being the high watermark in reaching the final.

Harps are no great shapes currently yet were ridiculously superior, Bohs a very good side so less of a surprise to be do dominant but as Philosiphiser suggests, considering the weather, a goal kick with a gale behind a team should have opposition turnng and heading deep toward their goal. Thoughts? could it influence a seachange in resistance to restructuring the wider setup?
You mentioned Ashtown Villa. They had a centre half called O Brien who's brother was Rocky O Brien who was with sligo I believe. Ashtown O Brien was on more money than Sligo O Brien and played in leinster, while Sligo played nationwide. I think that gap has now been reversed and widened even with the part time top level clubs as the Harps game proved.

[Dermobohs]

You mentioned Ashtown Villa. They had a centre half called O Brien whose brother was Rocky O Brien who was with sligo I believe. Ashtown O Brien was on more money than Sligo O Brien and played in leinster, while Sligo played nationwide. I think that gap has now been reversed and widened even with the part time top level clubs as the Harps game proved.
Whose brother Rocky was with Sligo”
You do know who Rocky OBrien is yeah?
****in bohs legend

[TonyD]

LOI tv stream cuts off just after the start of extra time in Pats v Derry. WTF ? Infuriating.

[Calcio Jack]

LOI tv stream cuts off just after the start of extra time in Pats v Derry. WTF ? Infuriating.

Pats win on penalties (Duffy missed one - for his own sanity he should stop taking them)

[TonyD]

Pats win on penalties (Duffy missed one - for his own sanity he should stop taking them)

LOI tv came back thank God. Great win for Pats. Derry must be absolutely sick. To lose one shootout in 4 days is unfortunate, to lose two..............

Derry had the better of the play, but we defended well and probably had the best two chances with Curtis and Lonergan. Dreaming of the Aviva now .......

[ger121]

2 shootout losses in less than 72 hours will be hard to take. Be interesting to see how they react in the league.

Home draw on Tuesday is the hope.

[joey B]

Derry looked miles better than Pats for most of it ,Joe Redmond is immense though and should be looking for a raise or a move acros the water,terrible penalties from Duffy and Mulreaney who was shocking when he came on I thought....
Cup looks wide open now,Pats,Bohs and Dundalk will fancy their chances...

[D24Saint]

I’ll take it. We played poor and I’m delighted to come out on top. The security in the Brandywell should take a chill pill very over the top these days.

[Nah Nah Nah Nah]

Whose brother Rocky was with Sligo”
You do know who Rocky OBrien is yeah?
****in bohs legend

I would imagine he’s on about the time when he was playing with us

[D24Saint]

Hard to believe when you see a lad of 15 like Mason Melia step up and score a peno especially compared to Mulraneys effort.

[SwanVsDalton]

All part of our grand plan to win the league lads*! :cool::cool::cool:

*Ihatefootball

[Martinho II]

Philip Quinn had an excellent article in the Mail on Sunday today about the FAIs lack of preparation with the storm last friday and the FAI cup. He has some great points that the FAI have more immediate realities which is a sad reflection !

[Shinkicker]

Whose brother Rocky was with Sligo”
You do know who Rocky OBrien is yeah?
****in bohs legend
Rocky played for Sligo. Look it up.

[Shinkicker]

I would imagine he’s on about the time when he was playing with us

Correcto amigo

[D24Saint]

Philip Quinn had an excellent article in the Mail on Sunday today about the FAIs lack of preparation with the storm last friday and the FAI cup. He has some great points that the FAI have more immediate realities which is a sad reflection !

So Philip has yet to realise that the FAI couldn’t arrange a pint of Guinness in St James Gate. I’d feel for anyone expecting anything from that shower of wasters.

[kksaints]

We were dreadful for the most part but we through to the quarter finals and that's all that matters.

[TonyD]

Hard to believe when you see a lad of 15 like Mason Melia step up and score a peno especially compared to Mulraneys effort.

Absolutely. I had big reservations about asking a lad of that age to step up, but fair play to him. Magnificent. I don’t think anyone would have blamed him if he’d missed. I didn’t fancy Mulraney with his penalty funnily enough. He strikes me as that kind of a hot and cold player. Capable of great moments, but inconsistent.

[ciaraa]

Absolutely. I had big reservations about asking a lad of that age to step up, but fair play to him. Magnificent. I don’t think anyone would have blamed him if he’d missed. I didn’t fancy Mulraney with his penalty funnily enough. He strikes me as that kind of a hot and cold player. Capable of great moments, but inconsistent.

A near sighted badger could score a penalty against Derry these days in fairness.

[2 Year Contract]

A near sighted badger could score a penalty against Derry these days in fairness.

Spot on, hit the target against Brian Maher in a shootout and you’ve scored. That’s Ireland vs Israel U21 European championship playoff game, the Tobol game and now today's one that he’s failed to save a penalty in. Good goalkeeper but it’s a real weak point in his game

[TonyD]

A near sighted badger could score a penalty against Derry these days in fairness.

Jake Mulraney says different. :p Mason Melia is only 15 years old. Incredible nerve to step up and score

[Nah Nah Nah Nah]

Funny watching Mahers antics during the shootout. Feck all use it did him.

[nr637]

We were dreadful for the most part but we through to the quarter finals and that's all that matters.

Don't they say its all about getting thru to the next round!

[Dermobohs]

Rocky played for Sligo. Look it up.
Well aware of Rocky’s clubs, he’s a mate.
was surprised to hear a bohs fan mention him as a Sligo player first, that’s all .
no offence meant.

[Straightstory]

Very easy win for bohs in awful conditions Friday, Rockmount to give them their due credit we’re on a hiding from ko with that gale lashing down and only just starting their season.
Keeper pulled off a couple of fine stops too, and the two centre backs kept Afolabi quiet for 20 minutes anyway( with extreme difficulty)but a 3-0 ht was kind to them, as was the final score.
Home draw next is all I’d like, don’t fear anyone left, our names on it anyhow.

I'd be very surprised if you don't get Drogheda next - probably at home.