2023 FAI Cup

[legendz]

If you exclude the 4 European teams it could just be a flat 16 draw, so just 4 matches for the eventual finalists.If you are excluding the 4 European qualified teams, they should all enter the President's Cup instead?


I don't see the point in expanding the President's Cup to just a few more teams. ...

"Why" - An elite competition with 3 rounds or less for those qualified for Europe.
If the 16 clubs not qualified for Europe were contesting the League Cup, the League Cup winner at least should also be included in the following year's President's Cup.
With the President's Cup established and the League Cup not contested since 2019, there is an opportunity to bring back the League Cup and have the European qualified teams in the President's Cup. If it is a non runner, it is a non runner.
I was in Mounthawk Park the day Kerry League knocked out Waterford United of the League Cup. If the League Cup does return and the Third Tier is to be established eventually, the League Cup should be for League of Ireland clubs and first team clubs in the Third Tier.
If European qualified clubs are supportive of a return of the League Cup, maybe they should have a bye to the later rounds. The League Cup with European teams would need to be completed before the European qualifiers begin.

[nigel-harps1954]

The Presidents Cup is the Irish Super Cup. The Super Cup is played all over Europe as the league winners against the cup winners as the curtain raiser to the season. Adding teams to a glorified friendly competition would be utter nonsense, and ultimately completely pointless.

[legendz]

The Presidents Cup is the Irish Super Cup. The Super Cup is played all over Europe as the league winners against the cup winners as the curtain raiser to the season. Adding teams to a glorified friendly competition would be utter nonsense, and ultimately completely pointless.
Supercopa de España?

[Eminence Grise]

Needs more pyramid.


Said the Egyptian FA....

So any non-league club standing at the doorway of the big leagues would be invited to just ring the bell for admittance?

Y'know, Toot 'n' come-in?

[EatYerGreens]

"Why" - An elite competition with 3 rounds or less for those qualified for Europe.
If the 16 clubs not qualified for Europe were contesting the League Cup, the League Cup winner at least should also be included in the following year's President's Cup.
With the President's Cup established and the League Cup not contested since 2019, there is an opportunity to bring back the League Cup and have the European qualified teams in the President's Cup. If it is a non runner, it is a non runner.
I was in Mounthawk Park the day Kerry League knocked out Waterford United of the League Cup. If the League Cup does return and the Third Tier is to be established eventually, the League Cup should be for League of Ireland clubs and first team clubs in the Third Tier.
If European qualified clubs are supportive of a return of the League Cup, maybe they should have a bye to the later rounds. The League Cup with European teams would need to be completed before the European qualifiers begin.

The 4 European clubs have at least 2 rescheduled league games caused by their European participation. If they progress a round or two , it starts to get a bit tricky and disruptive. So why would you want to add even more games on to their schedule? And just for a makey-uppey 'exclusive' trophy that they will completely deprioritise in favour of Europe and the league.

Why do our European clubs need even more games?

[EatYerGreens]

So any non-league club standing at the doorway of the big leagues would be invited to just ring the bell for admittance?

Y'know, Toot 'n' come-in?

I think you're in denial/The Nile...

[legendz]

The 4 European clubs have at least 2 rescheduled league games caused by their European participation. If they progress a round or two , it starts to get a bit tricky and disruptive. So why would you want to add even more games on to their schedule? And just for a makey-uppey 'exclusive' trophy that they will completely deprioritise in favour of Europe and the league.

Why do our European clubs need even more games?
Are you saying the European clubs should not be in the League Cup?

[Another Bohemia]

Are you saying the European clubs should not be in the League Cup?

I think he's saying that losing the league cup wasn't actually a loss and is actually more of a hindrance to some clubs.

[EatYerGreens]

Are you saying the European clubs should not be in the League Cup?

I've very clearly said in a previous post that the League Cup should be for ALL clubs in the league (plus a few non-league ones).

If you're asking because it addss more games, then at least it does so for a propoer trophy. And it's just restoring things to the way they were before Covid.

[EatYerGreens]

I think he's saying that losing the league cup wasn't actually a loss and is actually more of a hindrance to some clubs.

I'm saying the complete opposite. Bring it back!

[legendz]

I've very clearly said in a previous post that the League Cup should be for ALL clubs in the league (plus a few non-league ones).

If you're asking because it addss more games, then at least it does so for a propoer trophy. And it's just restoring things to the way they were before Covid.
If the league season was extended by two weeks and started on the first weekend of February, 8 First Division clubs could start in the League Cup round 1 on the final weekend of January. Round 2 of the League Cup could be on the new February Bank Holiday Monday, unless it's a Friday 1st of February where the Bank Holiday is on a Friday.
The League Cup can then have quarter-finals in March, semi-finals in April and final in May.

[bohsmug]

If it returns then yeah, I agree. It could work as a first half of the season competition. That said, I've no real appetite for it myself. If Bohs won it I'd enjoy it but not so sure it would feel like we're back winning silverware. Maybe I'd feel different if it actually happened.

Final in Tallaght in early summer, I could see how it could potentially work but has to be made feel important somehow.

[Buckett]

https://www.thesun.ie/sport/11761457/st-patricks-athletic-bohemians-pyro-damage-aviva/

€32k for winning the Cup, basically the same amount that our absentee landlord was over-paid by

[Mr A]

Cup prize money was realigned to allocate more to round by round, while the finalists now get a 1/3 share of profits from the final so overall that's a good thing I think, albeit obviously higher prize money would be better

[2 Year Contract]

Would be interesting to see the final figure on gate receipts. Being conservative it’s probably over 200k for each club for this years final which is more than winning the league gets you (not including UEFA prize money of course)

[outspoken]

Would be interesting to see the final figure on gate receipts. Being conservative it’s probably over 200k for each club for this years final which is more than winning the league gets you (not including UEFA prize money of course)

Not after today's story: https://twitter.com/OCowzer/status/1729837832254939541?t=mvK20mT8m8zFJ_FQfoIewQ&s=19

[2 Year Contract]

Not after today's story: https://twitter.com/OCowzer/status/1729837832254939541?t=mvK20mT8m8zFJ_FQfoIewQ&s=19

Yes I’m aware €46k has been taken off the gate receipt but the article says the gate receipt is still being split in 3 (a third for each club and a third for the FAI).

48k tickets were sold. Obviously without knowing the breakdown of kids to adults tickets, I’ve gone with an average of €15 per ticket multiplied by 48k = €720k, minus €46k = €674k, divided by 3 = €224,666 per club as an estimate

[patsdad]

Yes I’m aware €46k has been taken off the gate receipt but the article says the gate receipt is still being split in 3 (a third for each club and a third for the FAI).

48k tickets were sold. Obviously without knowing the breakdown of kids to adults tickets, I’ve gone with an average of €15 per ticket multiplied by 48k = €720k, minus €46k = €674k, divided by 3 = €224,666 per club as an estimate


I think it's a third of the profit, not the gate receipts. I read somewhere before that it takes about 30k tickets to cover using the Aviva so you'd possibly by looking at the value of 6k tickets for each club. Still a sizable amount.

[2 Year Contract]

I think it's a third of the profit, not the gate receipts. I read somewhere before that it takes about 30k tickets to cover using the Aviva so you'd possibly by looking at the value of 6k tickets for each club. Still a sizable amount.

Just basing it off the article stating the gate receipt was split in 3, rather than the profits split in 3


And that figure was taken out of the gate receipts, which were split three ways between the FAI and two clubs, effectively reducing all threes takings by €15,333.

[EatYerGreens]

I read somewhere before that it takes about 30k tickets to cover using the Aviva so you'd possibly by looking at the value of 6k tickets for each club. Still a sizable amount.

That sounds suspiciously like the persistent tale that Croke Park needed 30,000+ attendance/tickets to cover its costs. Which the GAA then came out publicly and said wasn't true. If it's not true for a much bigger stadium like that, I can't see how it would be for Lansdowne? It would surely be a silly situation if a stadium could only pay its way when it was two-thirds full.

[EatYerGreens]

Yes I’m aware €46k has been taken off the gate receipt but the article says the gate receipt is still being split in 3 (a third for each club and a third for the FAI).

48k tickets were sold. Obviously without knowing the breakdown of kids to adults tickets, I’ve gone with an average of €15 per ticket multiplied by 48k = €720k, minus €46k = €674k, divided by 3 = €224,666 per club as an estimate

I think you'd have to go with higher than a €15 average ticket, to account for the thousands of Premium seats as well.

[2 Year Contract]

I think you'd have to go with higher than a €15 average ticket, to account for the thousands of Premium seats as well.

That's true, good point. As I said I’ve no breakdown to base it off so decided to be conservative with the figure but it’s safe to say the gate was somewhere in the region of €225–350k per club if the reports of the gate receipt being split in 3 are accurate (I’ve no reason to believe they’re not)

[Mr A]

It is definitely by profit not by gate receipts.

[2 Year Contract]

It is definitely by profit not by gate receipts.

If that’s the case then it’s probably in the region of €75k-115k per club

[nigel-harps1954]

If both clubs came away with 30-40k each, that would be the height of it, and would be decent money to be getting.

[oriel]

Yes I’m aware €46k has been taken off the gate receipt but the article says the gate receipt is still being split in 3 (a third for each club and a third for the FAI).

48k tickets were sold. Obviously without knowing the breakdown of kids to adults tickets, I’ve gone with an average of €15 per ticket multiplied by 48k = €720k, minus €46k = €674k, divided by 3 = €224,666 per club as an estimate


43,881 was the official attendance, where is the 48k tickets sold coming from as well over 4k hardly bought a ticket and didn't go?

Didn't realise distribution of money changed, used to be 50k for the winners regardless of the crowd.

Would imagine a lot of other expenses to pay, 100's employed on the day not to mention standard costs, so wouldn't think anywhere close to 200k per club is right, if they got 100k would be doing very well, but Pats have to be getting more for winning it obviously.

[2 Year Contract]

43,881 was the official attendance, where is the 48k tickets sold coming from as well over 4k hardly bought a ticket and didn't go?

Didn't realise distribution of money changed, used to be 50k for the winners regardless of the crowd.

Would imagine a lot of other expenses to pay, 100's employed on the day not to mention standard costs, so wouldn't think anywhere close to 200k per club is right, if they got 100k would be doing very well, but Pats have to be getting more for winning it obviously.

There were 4k seats covered by seat kills and the game was announced sold out, which is where the 48k tickets sold figure comes from. It was widely reported in the media that 48k were sold

for example: https://www.the42.ie/fai-cup-final-attendance-6220882-Nov2023/

[Jack B]

43,881 was the official attendance, where is the 48k tickets sold coming from as well over 4k hardly bought a ticket and didn't go?

The FAI and both clubs claimed it had completely sold out on the morning of the game. Was mentioned a few times on the broadcast too, so 48k+ was being quoted until the attendance was announced during the game.

[pineapple stu]

There were 4k seats covered by seat kills and the game was announced sold out, which is where the 48k tickets sold figure comes from. It was widely reported in the media that 48k were sold
Isn't capacity 52k though?

I presumed the seat kills brought capacity down to 48k, which was then sold out

[2 Year Contract]

Isn't capacity 52k though?

I presumed the seat kills brought capacity down to 48k, which was then sold out

Yes 48k tickets sold plus 4k seat kills equals 52k. As in, the capacity was reduced to 48k and was sold out, and announced as such

[pineapple stu]

That's what I thought - so 4k did buy a ticket and not turn up (which is what Oriel was querying)?

[sbgawa]

Can't swear to it but I'm sure someone asked that question at a rovers meeting about the 2019 final and our share was 20k or something like that. I remember thinking it was pathetic anyway

[wonder88]

I have seem it mentioned as well in relation to Croke Park that a certain figure (like 30k tickets) need to be sold to just cover the cost of opening the stadium. Tickets were relatively cheap as well, 35e for Premium level for example, so I think the profit from the fixture wouldn't be that huge.
Would Bohs fans/members have an idea what they got from the semi-final?

[oriel]

Yes 48k tickets sold plus 4k seat kills equals 52k. As in, the capacity was reduced to 48k and was sold out, and announced as such

But didn't the FAI graphic not flash up with the actual attendance of 43,881, also backed up here in this link. If capacity is 52k and call it 44k at it, still very good and equates to almost 85% capacity, which is very impressive.

https://www.extratime.com/fixtures/2023-fai-cup-final/bohemians-v-st-patricks-athletic/62205/4/report/

[2 Year Contract]

But didn't the FAI graphic not flash up with the actual attendance of 43,881, also backed up here in this link. If capacity is 52k and call it 44k at it, still very good and equates to almost 85% capacity, which is very impressive.

https://www.extratime.com/fixtures/2023-fai-cup-final/bohemians-v-st-patricks-athletic/62205/4/report/

Yes. 48k were sold and just under 44k attended. Either way the gate receipts would be for 48k tickets, whether they attended or not

[oriel]

44k at the game makes sense as accounts for 85% capacity, still can't understand why 4k would buy a ticket and not attend, that doesn't stack up.

Don't get me wrong, super attendance, and more may it continue, but where did the 4k go to, the pub?

[wonder88]

Hope there is not a significant number of no-shows, like you are having with the womens national team games. Also 6,000 didn't turn up for the Dublin city marathon at the bank holiday weekend. Cost of accommodation must be a factor with that, so with two Dublin teams we should get close to the number of tickets sold.
It not really a surprise to have people with tickets not turning up, if tickets are fairly cheap and if there are a large number given away/discounted.

[EatYerGreens]

I have seem it mentioned as well in relation to Croke Park that a certain figure (like 30k tickets) need to be sold to just cover the cost of opening the stadium. Tickets were relatively cheap as well, 35e for Premium level for example, so I think the profit from the fixture wouldn't be that huge.
Would Bohs fans/members have an idea what they got from the semi-final?

That Croke Park '30,000 to break even' figure is a myth, and the GAA have publicly stated so.

[sbgawa]

44k at the game makes sense as accounts for 85% capacity, still can't understand why 4k would buy a ticket and not attend, that doesn't stack up.

Don't get me wrong, super attendance, and more may it continue, but where did the 4k go to, the pub?

Im not going to complain about cheap tickets as selling out the stadium is important but the downside is people buy them on the off chance of going and then dont bother.

[2 Year Contract]

Im not going to complain about cheap tickets as selling out the stadium is important but the downside is people buy them on the off chance of going and then dont bother.

That and the family tickets. 2 adult tickets is €40, while a family ticket of 2 adults and 2 kids is €50. I know people who bought the family ticket to bring 2 adult mates in on the kids tickets (as tickets are not checked at all) and then those people backed out of going so only 2 of the 4 were used. I’d say that was common enough.