Marc Wilson

[Murfinator]

Was Wilson actually not injured at the time? As opposed to somebody like Stokes who withdrew as he was tired.

He repeatedly withdrew from squads along with mccarthy, walters, gibson and stokes. While McCarthy and Walters were seemingly forgiven since or there was never a problem with them to begin with and Gibson unavailable most of the time it was Wilson and Stokes who were the ones never picked again since despite both being available. Presumably Trap believes Wilsons cause wasn't genuine.

As was said before he was never releasing these stories about his Irish ambition prior to Euro 2012 qualification so I haven't changed my opinion of him.

Point of the Pulis interview is pretty obvious, he's trying to claim him as the perfect utility player. Tournament squads need those guys as cover and his claim is Wilson is the man for that job. It was the whole reason Donnocha Ryan and Fergus McFadden were included in the rugby world cup squad ahead of more experienced, less versatile players. And while that kind of role could be useful to have Wilson for I wouldn't like him going to Euro 2012 on principle. The guy had his chance to stake his claim on the pitch several times and snubbed it, now he's trying to stake his claim on the tabloid backpages. Forgive and Forget next campaign and he'll get that chance again but he doesn't deserve a Euro spot.

[geysir]

As was said before he was never releasing these stories about his Irish ambition prior to Euro 2012 qualification so I haven't changed my opinion of him.

Balderdash!
and who said what before?

Wilson declared for the FAI 7 years ago, more than a few years ago he stated "I think everybody has their own personal reasons for wanting to play for the Republic or the North. I grew up supporting the Republic so it was a comfortable decision for me."
What do you want, a monthly update to appease your chronic reoccurring mistrust?

[DannyInvincible]

I'm just thinking, could Wilson have switched to the IFA anyway? Surely he has represented us in a competitive fixture at some point over the past number of years. Although possibly his appearance/s(?) for NI at under-15 level wasn't/weren't competitive, or mightn't count for the purpose of formally linking a player to an association. Anyone know for certain?

[Predator]

Although possibly his appearance/s(?) for NI at under-15 level wasn't/weren't competitive, or mightn't count for the purpose of formally linking a player to an association. Anyone know for certain?I'm inclined to believe this, but I am not 100% sure. Games between schools FAs, I am guessing, do not necessarily come under FIFA's remit. But I am open to correction, as always.

[Predator]

UEFA/FIFA only run youth competitions at under 17, 19 and 21. Seemingly any under 15 and under 16 level cannot, therefore, be deemed to be competitive/official??

[Sullivinho]

Wilson not for turning. Good to hear.

http://www.independent.ie/breaking-news/sport/wilson-not-giving-up-on-euro-2012-2985306.html

Himself and young McClean are being proper spoilsports with all this clarity stuff. I see Darron Gibson has even commissioned a TV advertisement offering us his assurance.The prospect of Michael O'Neill phoning and visiting them all presented an amusing discrepancy in the 'beggars' drollery.


I'm just thinking, could Wilson have switched to the IFA anyway? Surely he has represented us in a competitive fixture at some point over the past number of years. Although possibly his appearance/s(?) for NI at under-15 level wasn't/weren't competitive, or mightn't count for the purpose of formally linking a player to an association. Anyone know for certain?

I don't know the answer to that Danny, but I get this ominous feeling of uncertainty whenever I see you asking questions rather than definitively answering them.

[geysir]

Wilson can declare for NI, if he so desired.
I already stated this 'fact' :) on the eligibility thread.
It is as Predator explained, he has not played in any underage official uefa/fifa tournament for NI.

[The Fly]

Balderdash! B***ocks!


Fixed.

This is a football forum!

[SwanVsDalton]

This is a football forum!

Poppycock.

[The Fly]

Poppycock.

Stop!

(you're heightening the tone)

[Olé Olé]

Balderdash!
and who said what before?

Wilson declared for the FAI 7 years ago, more than a few years ago he stated "I think everybody has their own personal reasons for wanting to play for the Republic or the North. I grew up supporting the Republic so it was a comfortable decision for me."
What do you want, a monthly update to appease your chronic reoccurring mistrust?

Well said. It's not as if Wilson released the story himself. Most likely a hack in Stoke City dropped him a line and asked him where he stood. Had Wilson released the statement via twitter it would have been a clear indication of his intention to release the story.

In fairness to McClean, as someone else probably said, with his name being specifically referenced in interviews with O'Neill and his switch being far more recent than Marc Wilson's, it was a good idea for him to emphatically put the NI matter to bed.

[DannyInvincible]

UEFA/FIFA only run youth competitions at under 17, 19 and 21. Seemingly any under 15 and under 16 level cannot, therefore, be deemed to be competitive/official??

Indeed, should have known. I think we may have had this conversation before with Geysir clarifying matters, plus Barry Maguire played for us at under-16 level but subsequently playing for Holland wasn't considered to have amounted to a switch of association.

[DannyInvincible]

Well said. It's not as if Wilson released the story himself. Most likely a hack in Stoke City dropped him a line and asked him where he stood. Had Wilson released the statement via twitter it would have been a clear indication of his intention to release the story.

A poster on OWC is reporting that O'Neill approached Wilson.

[Murfinator]

Balderdash!
and who said what before?

Wilson declared for the FAI 7 years ago, more than a few years ago he stated "I think everybody has their own personal reasons for wanting to play for the Republic or the North. I grew up supporting the Republic so it was a comfortable decision for me."
What do you want, a monthly update to appease your chronic reoccurring mistrust?

Completely missing the point.
You're making an incorrect assumption that the issue is national loyalty, Northern Ireland have absolutely nothing to do with this. The issue is very much club versus internationals and you're a gullible fool if you think he hadn't wavering interest during the last campaign when twice he pulled out of a midweek tie and played 90 minutes 3 days later for Stoke. Trap certainly wasn't impressed with him since he was pushed out of the frame entirely after the 2nd time he did this.

[tricky_colour]

Completely missing the point.
You're making an incorrect assumption that the issue is national loyalty, Northern Ireland have absolutely nothing to do with this. The issue is very much club versus internationals and you're a gullible fool if you think he hadn't wavering interest during the last campaign when twice he pulled out of a midweek tie and played 90 minutes 3 days later for Stoke. Trap certainly wasn't impressed with him since he was pushed out of the frame entirely after the 2nd time he did this.

Just because you were fit 3 days later does not mean you were fit before.
It might look bad but a lot of healing can take place in 24 hours.
No point in coming back too soon and then being out for weeks because you aggravate the injury.

[drummerboy]

Wasn't Wilson actually named in the team to play in the Nations Cup. Anyway I think this lad has a future with us, whether its begins this summer remains to be seen.

[Stuttgart88]

I was compiling my own list yesterday of definites (if fit), possibles and totally unlikelies / definite nos. I did a nice colour-coded spreadsheet (green, amber and red - I was very happy with it!).

Wilson is amber, as is McCarthy. However, I have only 21 greens and I have Foley, Coleman and McCarthy as amber - 2 of those 3 will make it I'm sure. I have 5 forwards.

Gibson is a green in my mind, but he could very easily slip into the amber zone in next 3 weeks.

[geysir]

Completely missing the point.
You're making an incorrect assumption that the issue is national loyalty, Northern Ireland have absolutely nothing to do with this. The issue is very much club versus internationals and you're a gullible fool if you think he hadn't wavering interest during the last campaign when twice he pulled out of a midweek tie and played 90 minutes 3 days later for Stoke. Trap certainly wasn't impressed with him since he was pushed out of the frame entirely after the 2nd time he did this.
Piffle!
Wilson was named in the squad for the Croatia friendly last August, he turned up, was deemed unfit to play by the FAI doctor and sent back to Stoke (not Coventry).

[Murfinator]

Just because you were fit 3 days later does not mean you were fit before.
It might look bad but a lot of healing can take place in 24 hours.
No point in coming back too soon and then being out for weeks because you aggravate the injury.

He must have an incredible midweek regenerative process that lad. Himself, Stokes and McCarthy must have witch doctors for physios. :p

[geysir]

Both Walters and Wilson were deemed unfit to play by the FAI doctor 3 days before the Croatia game. Deemed unfit as in they were unlikely to recover in time for the Wednesday game. Both players recovered in time for the game against Chelsea, some 4 days after the Croatia game.

[Charlie Darwin]

I don't know why people have such a hard time understanding this. If a footballer sustains a niggle on Saturday with a league game the following week, he can spent the week resting up to get fit. If a player sustains a niggle on Saturday with an international on Tuesday...

Even if there is a longer gap, players get injured. It happens several times a season to every player. The more games you play, the more you're likely to miss.

[Murfinator]

Considering he failed to report for Ireland duty at the end of the season last May he's got form in that department so it will naturally draw suspicion on his unusually high "niggle" rate. Also since he was left out of the squad entirely for the Russia game and beyond at a time when Trap was raising the point about commitment I'm assuming the bossman wasn't impressed by his attitude.

[Stuttgart88]

I can see that point of view alright, but what position should he be in the squad for?

Left-back? Ward is the man now, right or wrong and Trap sees Kelly and maybe even O'Shea as cover.
Right back? Kelly, O'Shea, Foley and Coleman (maybe less so) can claim to be ahead of him there.
Centre back? Dunne, SSL, O'Dea, O'Shea and Kelly have all played there under Trap - and dare I say it - McShane
Centre-mid (defensive minded): Whelan, is the main man who might require cover that wilson could provide. But if Whelan is out Andrews would work well alongside some of our more technical central midfielders (Gibson, Fahey, McCarthy etc.)

My point is that yes, Wilson's perceived attitude may be an issue and it has certainly not helped him (nor have injuries) but right now we actually are quite well placed for where he can play. He may be better than Ward but we don't have long to find out.

[seanfhear]

There may be one or possibly two questionable no shows by Marc Wilson but I am not sure if the lad has had a fair crack of the whip before that. He had been playing in the premiership with Portsmouth and then with Stoke so he may have been a bit miffed that he had not been given a chance to impress( or more of a chance if anyone is going to be pedantic) in friendlies. I am not normally a critic of Trap but I think he could have given Wilson more of a chance. Wilson can play in a number of positions and possibly midfield (not a great deal of evidence for this mind ?)

[Stuttgart88]

There was a time - WC 2010 Campaign - where Trap stuck only with those he knew. Since then there has been more flexibility and more new caps. In that time, Wilson has generally been unavailable I think.

[geysir]

Considering he failed to report for Ireland duty at the end of the season last May he's got form in that department so it will naturally draw suspicion on his unusually high "niggle" rate. Also since he was left out of the squad entirely for the Russia game and beyond at a time when Trap was raising the point about commitment I'm assuming the bossman wasn't impressed by his attitude.

Wilson was called up to the Croatia game, an event which succeeded all what happened before, he turned up, was declared unfit and sent home.
There is nothing to read into him not being picked for subsequent competitive squads, he was not in contention as per Trap's strict methodical approach. Also he is not an outstanding full back. There is not a damn thing now to indicate that Wilson has any less commitment to playing for Ireland than Walters or McCarthy.

[Closed Account]

The plot thickens.........
http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/sport/2012/0114/1224310245185.html?

Trapattoni made it clear he would not lose any sleep over the loss of Wilson just now and said the player would, at the very least, have to apologise for what he implied was a significant breach of discipline on international duty before he would be called upon again.

“There are certain situations where a player betrays the spirit of the group and there has to be discipline,” he said. “When he sees us he must say: ‘I’m sorry, I made a great mistake.’ Because when you come you work.”

Trapattoni suggested another player was involved in the breach of discipline but refused to say who.

So what did he do? Turned up for the squad but wasn't prepared to do some sort of training? Or did he go out on the lash? To be continued....

[Predator]

Trapattoni's press-conference English can be dressed up in many different ways. For all we know, he might have said that he owes Wilson an apology.

[Murfinator]

Wilson was called up to the Croatia game, an event which succeeded all what happened before, he turned up, was declared unfit and sent home.
There is nothing to read into him not being picked for subsequent competitive squads, he was not in contention as per Trap's strict methodical approach. Also he is not an outstanding full back. There is not a damn thing now to indicate that Wilson has any less commitment to playing for Ireland than Walters or McCarthy.

Still believing that after Trap's comments? He's taking the right approach with players like him but what amazes me is the reaction from you guys. People here who'd crucify Stephen Ireland all day long but despite repeated damning evidence are happy to have the back of Wilson, why? He's even gone one step further than Ireland and had the nerve to claim to the media about his Euro 2012 ambition, a tournament in which he played no part in qualifying for presumably by his own choosing.

He mentioned loyalty in his interview and letting teammates down so I presume there's more to what Wilson did than just breaking a curfew or discipline ruling given that Trap never took that severity with Andy Reid. It's strong words to tell him that he wouldn't care if he declared for Northern Ireland, it makes it appear that his career with us is probably over.

[Stuttgart88]

It's strong words to tell him that he wouldn't care if he declared for Northern IrelandThat was more how Malone worded the article- Trap's quote didn't say that at all.

[Olé Olé]

That was more how Malone worded the article- Trap's quote didn't say that at all.

I'd agree with this. The actual quote is:

I cannot say why. But important reasons. The players have to have a certain behaviour when they come into the team. They cannot betray the other, loyal players. If he wishes to go, then no problem.

Maybe Trap's stating that if he wishes to go to Poland, then no problem; he'll be considered once he apologizes for the breach of discipline.

I can't imagine what Trap would have to gain by telling a 24 year-old Premiership player that he can switch his allegiance to another country and it'll be treated with ambivalence.

[Sullivinho]

A bit more on this via a James McClean article (http://www.irishexaminer.com/sport/soccer/trap-keeps-tabs-on-mcclean-180187.html) from the Examiner.


Asked if he would pick Wilson again, Trapattoni said: "When he says sorry, I made a great mistake. When you work, you do not go in the night. It’s important that you have one line to follow."

Apparently referring to the breaking of a curfew, Trap also mentioned "four or five" other players who broke the rules but who subsequently apologised and didn’t repeat the transgression.

"It’s important players understand they’re not indispensable because Ireland can win without them," he said.

Trap's thoughts on the eligibility 'issue':


Trapattoni said he could "understand" Northern Ireland manager Michael O’ Neill’s desire not to have players defecting from north to south but the Italian insisted the decision had to be up to the players themselves.

"The players are adults, they can decide," he said. "I can not keep a player in handcuffs, or force a player to come with us. They are clever and intelligent, they can decide their destiny."

[Predator]

Brilliant!

Trapattoni has read Dan's piece on eligibility.

[DannyInvincible]

Haha, I was actually going to say how, for an Italian/complete outsider with regard to Irish socio-political issues, Trap had a better grasp of the eligibility issue than the likes of Gary McAllister.

[geysir]

Still believing that after Trap's comments? He's taking the right approach with players like him but what amazes me is the reaction from you guys. People here who'd crucify Stephen Ireland all day long but despite repeated damning evidence are happy to have the back of Wilson, why? He's even gone one step further than Ireland and had the nerve to claim to the media about his Euro 2012 ambition, a tournament in which he played no part in qualifying for presumably by his own choosing.

He mentioned loyalty in his interview and letting teammates down so I presume there's more to what Wilson did than just breaking a curfew or discipline ruling given that Trap never took that severity with Andy Reid. It's strong words to tell him that he wouldn't care if he declared for Northern Ireland, it makes it appear that his career with us is probably over.
As has been pointed out you appear incapable of separating journalist comment from direct quote.
Also you had incorrectly claimed that Wilson had pulled out twice from midweek squads.
So why on earth do you expect credibility for your surmises about Trap and the players?

What damming evidence is there against Wilson that compares him to Ireland? Wilson it appears broke discipline with 4 or 5 others and hasn't apologised. Trap appears quite content to accept a sincere apology, so the question of loyalty doesn't come into it.

[youngirish]

Unfortunate set of circumstances this. As far as I'm concerned on form alone Wilson has far more claim to a place in the squad than McClean (very early days but promising), Best (very hit and miss) and Hoolahan (really?). His versatility could be crucial and he's a far better left back than Ward (not difficult), a very useful option at centre back (if St Ledger doesn't start getting regular football) and a decent holding midfield player (possibly better than Whelan). To add to this he's also a decent set piece taker and perhaps most importantly he's one of our few players that has been consistently a first team player in a good premiership team for well over a season now.

Hopefully he sorts out his problems with Trap before the next friendly and gets some time on the pitch though it's starting to look like it may be too little too late for the Euros even at this stage.

[seanfhear]

It can take a big man to apologise and I believe Trap likes his players to be big men. Marc Wilson would be better to be a big man and apologise and see where that takes him with Trap because if he does'nt he ain't going nowhere with Trap.

[Paddy Garcia]

Unfortunate set of circumstances this. As far as I'm concerned on form alone Wilson has far more claim to a place in the squad than McClean (very early days but promising), Best (very hit and miss) and Hoolahan (really?). His versatility could be crucial and he's a far better left back than Ward (not difficult), a very useful option at centre back (if St Ledger doesn't start getting regular football) and a decent holding midfield player (possibly better than Whelan). To add to this he's also a decent set piece taker and perhaps most importantly he's one of our few players that has been consistently a first team player in a good premiership team for well over a season now.

Hopefully he sorts out his problems with Trap before the next friendly and gets some time on the pitch though it's starting to look like it may be too little too late for the Euros even at this stage.

This makes good sense.

Better check your account has not been hacked. ;)

[youngirish]

This makes good sense.

Better check your account has not been hacked. ;)

It was hacked by Ciaran. The real me is back now.

[BonnieShels]

Ridiculous article on Marc in Herald by Aidan Fitz.

Can't link to it at moment.

[Charlie Darwin]

Ridiculous article on Marc in Herald by Aidan Fitz.

Can't link to it at moment.
http://www.herald.ie/sport/soccer/wilson-baffled-by-criticism-2990730.html

[Sullivinho]

Wilson Olive Branch to Trap (http://www.herald.ie/sport/soccer/wilson-olive-branch-to-trap-2990725.html)

Same story without the Fitz garnishing, from the same source.

[seanfhear]

Time for Trap and Marc to have a clear the air chat and hopefully have a freah start.

It would probably better if Marc does most of the listening and an apology if he works out what he did wrong would'nt go astray as well.

[ArdeeBhoy]

Haha, I was actually going to say how, for an Italian/complete outsider with regard to Irish socio-political issues, Trap had a better grasp of the eligibility issue than the likes of Gary McAllister.

To be fair the late Kim Jong-il or even George W.Bush would have...

[elroy]

Interview with MW in the Times today.

He is basically p*ssed off with the non communication from Trap, feels he hasnt done anything wrong to be left out as was wrongly accused by Trap (subsequently retracted by Trap) of breaking curfew last summer. I think the lad has a case and probably should be in the squad given how he is a starter most weeks for Stoke in a troublesome position for us.

One caveat being that the article is written by Paul Rowan who never ever seems to write anything positive about the Irish team. His "interviews" in recent months have included Lawrence, Stokes and now Wilson.

[Predator]

Do you have any actual quotes from Wilson?

Rowan wants to sell papers and justify his existence with the ST. To this end, he has written some disturbingly sensationalist balls about the eligibility debate, for example.

Whatever the facts of the matter, one thing is certain: complaining about Trap in a national paper will not increase one's chances of selection.

[elroy]

"if I have done something wrong, I am man enough to hold my hands up. But I will never apologise for something I havent done."

"Saying things about me in the paper and then saying after that it wasnt me. That is a bit ridiculous. thats what annoyed me. I didnt know about the retraction. I just knew what he said in the paper and that is where my head is. I feel totally disregarded."

Also saying that NI approaching him recently but he declined.

[Colbert Report]

I'm a big Trap fan but Wilson is right, just because he's young doesn't mean he should have to apologize for someone else's mistake.

[Predator]

Cheers elroy.

I'm sympathetic to Wilson's plight, but the Sunday Times is not the place to air his grievances. He should make the FAI his first port of call to inform them of his distress.
I wonder who the player was whom Trap mistook Wilson for?

[Yard of Pace]

This all seems a bit silly. If I have a problem with my boss, I go and talk to my boss and try and sort it out. Wilson might be well advised to do the same rather than blathering about it in a newspaper.