Hull City owners to take majority stake in Dundalk?

[Another Bohemia]

So I recently learned a little tid bit about defamation because of Enoch Burke, probably one of the few things I'm thankful for with Enoch. He had a defamation case thrown out by the court. He was also ordered to pay costs.

https://www.rte.ie/news/2024/0718/1460689-enoch-burke/


The judge said while the contents of the article were untrue, they did not injure his reputation.

So a paper printed literal lies and because there was no damage to the reputation of the person there was no issue. Now if there are a considerable cohort of Dundalk fans who post online, talk in the town, at work etc calling these lads cheats, thieves and scumbags before this podcast it's reasonable to believe that this doesn't damage their reputation. It's in line with their reputation.

Law is all about interpretation and what you can prove. Temple may just have to prove that people already thought the former owners were cheats, thieves and scumbags.

[Another Bohemia]

About 3/4 of the way through the podcast but I see absolutely no way that anything he said could come back to him.

In relation to pretty much any debt he says it's before his time and on occasion it was also before Ainscoughs time. That would be obvious once the accounts are published and he also doesn't single out any individuals.

On the court cases they would be a matter of public record, Zahibos particularly got a fair few column inches if I remember correctly. Again he highlights that this is before his time which is fair he's only in the door a wet day!

The set up of the academy is odd with it all flowing into the main bank account but is it illegal or malpractice I couldn't say but I would also be surprised if Dundalk were the only club operating this way as I remember plenty of people on here raising that Rovers academy being it's own entity with its own accounts being odd.

At the start he raised the very relevant question of "where's the money gone?" In relation to the euro monies and money from the league winning years etc but later on probably highlights exactly where it's gone. He said that Dundalk operations budget was about 40% more than anyone else in the league. That would very quickly eat into any money left behind by any owners and again is it foolish? Certainly, is it illegal? I doubt it.

Overall it's a well done PR piece. Temple needs people in the town to row in behind him and the club while they try to get through what is going to be a very difficult winter. He's got local journalists onside with this and the digs at national media and the clarity he's giving on how dire the situation is will most certainly help get the town rowing in behind him for the immediate future.

What would worry me is he seems somewhat naive to the costs of running the club. He mentions insurance costs and having multiple policies etc but anyone who owns and operates a public facing business, like a football club, has been bemoaning the cost of insurance for what must be decades at this stage. You also need insurance on players and multiple other things from my understanding so when he said he had to pay money for Dan Pikes injury I initially thought, well yeah but paying that likely offset other significantly higher costs, that's what insurance is for. The electricity bills seemed a shock from the way he said it but your running how many floodlights on a match night? And lighting in the stands, heating the dressing rooms, showers etc. It all adds up pretty quickly. These "hidden" costs are probably accounted for now though.

All in all though he certainly seems like his heart is in the right place. I think now it's a case of doing the redundancy process, which seems like it's started, with those who he is saying are in paid positions that don't exist or aren't paid at other clubs. Cutting any other costs where they can and dealing with creditors as best he can and hoping the town row in behind him.

[outspoken]

Donal Greene responds https://dnlgrn.substack.com/p/statement-regarding-dundalk-fc-acquisition?r=1tmulb&utm_campaign=post&utm_medium=web&triedRedirect=true

[joey B]

Whatever about his comments about the current financial situation at the club and how it got there being accurate ,he’s being called out by another interested investor for stating falsehoods about the process for future investment into the club,but again who knows what’s really going on here…..

https://dnlgrn.substack.com/p/statement-regarding-dundalk-fc-acquisition?r=1tmulb&utm_campaign=post&utm_medium=web&triedRedirect=true

[nigel-harps1954]

Again, where are the FAI in all of this?

They shouldn't be allowing such a sh!t-show to develop.

[Nesta99]

When there is next to no information beyond whispers in quiet corridors and a slanging match occurs people will just join the dots and decide on who they prefer. The local saviour Statsports/AC ownership ended in failure ('worse' than P6 but missed by the crystal ballix) rumours of debt was reported and denied along with other stuff. AC as minority owner with Statsports will likely say he was outvoted but he could have walked in protest - my opinion if thats how it gets spun. Annesley was signed under Statsports/AC, Zahibo under P6, both with daft contract clauses, 2 different owners with any pointing the finger at predecessors or laying the blame in previous regimes just deflection, JT gets a newbie pass. Clauses that are obviously contentious and/or disputed.

Its not a good look but there is something cathartic about this, finally someone call out messing irrespective of details. Fans knew there were significant issues and the wool was being pulled. That there were various agendas in Oriel apparent for years and it come to a head. JT is only in the door so legacy issues are not his, first to talk can call the truths. I still would like to know how JT, who has stated he has no financial backing, is planning to fund things generally not including debt - a membership scheme wont cover shorfalls in the short timeframe, renting out YDC or public use of the gym will hardly pay the bills to have them open. Donal Greene has a point just on his claim of club valuation of 2.7m by JT. It is pretty typical that as an additional party, he has questioned some interpretation of events and his character and motives are being snidely questioned. If its thought that Barristers dont lie or at the very least dont use a particular skill in framing the facts as it suits them well its naive.

There have always been personal agendas at OP, what club doesnt? But in more recent times its gone in to overdrive from fans, local poliical groups eg detesting everything and anything American, to personal petty infighting, undermining opponents with stories leaked to media, even to members of the coaching team sniping behand other coach backs. It has been a mess with many holding things together out of loyalty to the club with no love these antics of either, the time to worry is when even these people walk away.

There is plenty to run in all of this. It will be interesting to see how some people react, there are quite a few that itd be no shame if they stay clear of the club, others should be courted to return! But I think we are having the boil lanced, it could be at the ultimate expense of the club but right now its all tiresome not least the absolute inability of people within the fanbase trying to save the day, to put aside their little p1ssing matches!

What was the 'Battle of the Boadroom' Dundalkfc10?

[Nesta99]

Whatever about his comments about the current financial situation at the club and how it got there being accurate ,he’s being called out by another interested investor for stating falsehoods about the process for future investment into the club,but again who knows what’s really going on here…..

https://dnlgrn.substack.com/p/statement-regarding-dundalk-fc-acquisition?r=1tmulb&utm_campaign=post&utm_medium=web&triedRedirect=true

The Lukens aspect had passed by me somehow - so we could have been Irish Sea FC....

[Another Bohemia]

Again, where are the FAI in all of this?

They shouldn't be allowing such a sh!t-show to develop.

Not sure what the FAI can do to stop private individuals speaking on podcasts and throwing jabs on social media. It's a ****show for sure but they can't ban people from speaking no matter how much they may want to

[Nesta99]

Its probably the whole owners and directors test or lack of when FAI are mentioned. Simply can people back up their finances or not. Whats stopping me from walking up to buy a club just cause I want some attention and hope that I can entice some investors in or leverage borrowing against club assets to pay my own bill. Things could have halted at BA possibly considering he ran out of money. But its a bottomless pit currently. Id like to think the 40% greater runnings costs compared to other clubs was exaggerated but it wouldnt shock to anyone if it was true, Its possible that the comparison figures are taken from the smallest club in LoI to make a point. I cant see running costs at Dundalk being bigger than say Rovers albeit its relative and our floodlights being ancient are costing 100m per year in electricity!

[sbgawa]

Temple saying he isnt a millionaire is a bit strange (mustnt be that great a barrister :) ) but seriously if he isnt his end game can only be to get other investors in quick and end up with a nice minority share for little or no investment.
I wouldnt begrudge him it to be fair as the club may have gone under without him and if he drains the swamp as such he will have "done the state a service" as CJH so elequntly put it all those years ago

[nigel-harps1954]

Not sure what the FAI can do to stop private individuals speaking on podcasts and throwing jabs on social media. It's a ****show for sure but they can't ban people from speaking no matter how much they may want to

Nesta has it covered largely above. I wasn't talking about the podcast or the very public fallout between two would-be investors in the club.

I'm wondering where the FAI are when it comes to any takeover of any club in Ireland. Have the FAI gave the go-ahead or done any backround checks, or fit and proper ownership tests of any investor in any club in Ireland?

Have the FAI done any checks on Cobh Ramblers new owners, or have they just walked in without any checks?

The whole thing is incredibly dodgy to me. You can't own a club in England without passing FA tests, so why can any random person walk into an Irish club and take on ownership?

[Another Bohemia]

Nesta has it covered largely above. I wasn't talking about the podcast or the very public fallout between two would-be investors in the club.

I'm wondering where the FAI are when it comes to any takeover of any club in Ireland. Have the FAI gave the go-ahead or done any backround checks, or fit and proper ownership tests of any investor in any club in Ireland?

Have the FAI done any checks on Cobh Ramblers new owners, or have they just walked in without any checks?

The whole thing is incredibly dodgy to me. You can't own a club in England without passing FA tests, so why can any random person walk into an Irish club and take on ownership?

Apologies, I got the wrong end of the stick. Not sure if there is a process but I know Drogheda had to jump through a few hoops with the trivela group but I don't think BA or Temple had similar hoops given the speed at which both deals were closed. Either way I agree it all looks like a farce and really poor management from the FAI.

[Glen Of Aherlow]

Nesta has it covered largely above. I wasn't talking about the podcast or the very public fallout between two would-be investors in the club.

I'm wondering where the FAI are when it comes to any takeover of any club in Ireland. Have the FAI gave the go-ahead or done any backround checks, or fit and proper ownership tests of any investor in any club in Ireland?

Have the FAI done any checks on Cobh Ramblers new owners, or have they just walked in without any checks?

The whole thing is incredibly dodgy to me. You can't own a club in England without passing FA tests, so why can any random person walk into an Irish club and take on ownership?

Some seriously dodgy people have passed ownership tests in English football

[placid casual]

A question not directly related to dundalk going down the plughole, but has the away allocation always been capped at 500 , which is what Rovers received for the game on Sunday?
I could have sworn there was more available in previous games this season/last few seasons.

[Nesta99]

Thought it was 900 including stand section.

[EatYerGreens]

Some seriously dodgy people have passed ownership tests in English football

Indeed. It makes you wonder who DOESN'T get approved there (if anyone).

[Asterix]

A question not directly related to dundalk going down the plughole, but has the away allocation always been capped at 500 , which is what Rovers received for the game on Sunday?
I could have sworn there was more available in previous games this season/last few seasons.

Its been 500 the last few times anyway.

[outspoken]

I would have been critical of FAI too for the perceived lack of checks on new owners but what's to stop a lad showing the FAI a bank statement with 100 million on it and then sending it off to some lad or simply deciding, f*ck this i'm not spending any money on this club, it's not that straight forward. The more and more I see horror stories like Dundalk the more I wonder if Bohs and Sligo are right to sacrifice trophies for the benefit of being in control of their own fate.

[2 Year Contract]

Listening to LOI Central and I was shocked to hear Stephen McGuinness say he believes Dundalk are looking to stay full time next season in order to bounce straight back up. Utter madness with the debts they’re in, added to the fact that it’s looking like they’ll be getting a points deduction due to Scarp anyways

[sbgawa]

They won't have debts when they come out of Scarp or very little anyway

[nigel-harps1954]

They won't have debts when they come out of Scarp or very little anyway

They'll still be starting with a heavy points deduction

[ger121]

They'll still be starting with a heavy points deduction

I think getting back into the PD at the first attempt is not the main priority for now. It will be to ensure they have a club next season, then they can start to rebuild and see where it will take them.

[dundalkfc10]

Thought it was 900 including stand section.

Must be a Gardai or health and safety decision if it's been 500 last few times. 400 terrace and 100 stand

They will not get anymore than them 2 sections allows anyway as their is nowhere to segregate fans only over there.

If I was Rovers fan I'd just buy a home ticket for the stand and sit beside where the away section in stand is. Plenty of Dundalk fans done the same the night we won the league in Tallaght

[2 Year Contract]

Must be a Gardai or health and safety decision if it's been 500 last few times. 400 terrace and 100 stand

They will not get anymore than them 2 sections allows anyway as their is nowhere to segregate fans only over there.

If I was Rovers fan I'd just buy a home ticket for the stand and sit beside where the away section in stand is. Plenty of Dundalk fans done the same the night we won the league in Tallaght

Yeah it’s difficult enough as it is to segregate current and former owners in that main stand let alone home fans and away fans ;)

[Nesta99]

There's a few empty seats going in that regard + cronies in solidarity.

[ToberonaTornado]

Temple talks well and also always good to not have the hosts talking over every point during the interview.

The meeting of the new DFC trust on Friday night will be very interesting to say the least .
Free popcorn for all - sponsored by fastfix

[Longfordian]

I think getting back into the PD at the first attempt is not the main priority for now. It will be to ensure they have a club next season, then they can start to rebuild and see where it will take them.

The latter should be the priority. I'm not sure who's owed what by Dundalk but I can't imagine there'll be too much goodwill from any small businesses who've been screwed over. Seeing money being spent on an unnecessarily expensive playing squad won't be too popular.

[joey B]

1849503906579017929

Interesting post from Mike Treacy,where exactly did the figure of 1.7 million come from?

[2 Year Contract]

Mike Treacy of Peak 6 has thrown his 2 cents into the soap opera

https://x.com/miketreacy/status/1849503906579017929?s=46


The €1.7m number being floated is outrageous and intellectually dishonest. €850k ex debt and cost to run club until end of 2021 more accurate. SS reduced costs by 20% the following season and put in cash for SCP. They also didn’t hand over a club with €1.5m in debt as of Dec 1st last year

[dundalkfc10]

I'm sure Mike knows people in Peak 6 still and is close to them, but he didn't work for Peak 6 and doesn't since the day he left Dundalk

Ironically the day he left was the day we started to go downhill

How exactly would be knows how much Peak 6 left? Id say he's trying to cover for his mates the Connollys

[Nesta99]

More conjecture? Go on Battle of the Boardroom, spill!?

[Nesta99]

I'm sure Mike knows people in Peak 6 still and is close to them, but he didn't work for Peak 6 and doesn't since the day he left Dundalk

Ironically the day he left was the day we started to go downhill

How exactly would be knows how much Peak 6 left? Id say he's trying to cover for his mates the Connollys

More mates and agendas? Shocker! Go on Battle of the Boardroom? Spill dfc10....

I wonder if 850k excluding debt and cost to run club until the end of 2021 might be circa 1.7m? Either way the accounts will show and can be spun or out lies!

[LTFC]

I suppose "how we got here" has some merit, or a minimum we wont do that again, but the new reality is how do we deal with todays problems. First step is to stop the bleeding, and that may means any player out of contract is gone next week, and anyone under contract is available next week. Permanent staff will be much trickiers, although how many Dundlak would have I imagine is small.

Then the hard graft of the legacy debts. In the short term , next season, thats about not adding to those, so running a first div club at a profit. Could they turn over 500k from gates and sponsorship, advertising? I reckon Dundalk could and be competitive in first.

[Shearer]

Not suggesting anything untoward but looks like Dundalk are stepping away from online/card purchases for today's game.
Don't understand no programme as it's a good money spinner regardless of what people say.

- Dundalk's bar is definitely cash only.
- Match tickets not available online, seems to be at the ground (and presumably cash) only.
- No match programme printed.

[dundalkfc10]

The bar has always been cash only

You can usually pay with card in the office and they give u a receipt to get a ticket at the ticket hut

[joey B]

I’d say not selling tickets online is stop Rovers fans buying for the home end ….

[Buckett]

A terrible time to be relegated too with the higher UEFA payments for Premier clubs next season

[Shearer]

I’d say not selling tickets online is stop Rovers fans buying for the home end ….
Seems like an odd reason to completely shut up shop for online sales.

[oriel]

A terrible time to be relegated too with the higher UEFA payments for Premier clubs next season

Is there any particular good time to be relegated? Look it is what it is, we re-started winnings leagues when euro monies went from 300k or so to almost 1m if you won a game, spent it all on retaining leagues, and almost nothing to show for it, all our fault.

[outspoken]

Not suggesting anything untoward but looks like Dundalk are stepping away from online/card purchases for today's game.
Don't understand no programme as it's a good money spinner regardless of what people say.

- Dundalk's bar is definitely cash only.
- Match tickets not available online, seems to be at the ground (and presumably cash) only.
- No match programme printed.

Bar always cash only in last few years, tickets are always online but rovers fans were buying home end, programme only stopped recently as many other clubs have too

[ToberonaTornado]

Not suggesting anything untoward but looks like Dundalk are stepping away from online/card purchases for today's game.
Don't understand no programme as it's a good money spinner regardless of what people say.

- Dundalk's bar is definitely cash only.
- Match tickets not available online, seems to be at the ground (and presumably cash) only.
- No match programme printed.

Cash sales only IN BAR - busy matchday bar enviroment,card sales can take up to a minute to process. absolute pain

Tix sales cash only,as explained .

Dundalk award winning matchday programme - sad to see it go but obv the club were supplementing to some extent and with costs being cut was one of the 1st items to feel the axe when JT took over. Will be back next season abs no doubt and some very determined people behind it to make sure that happens put probably with a smaller print run.

[cláirseach]

Like a lot of things a programme involves spending money to make money, and that advance mighn't have been available even if there is a predictable higher return.

[Shearer]

Cash sales only IN BAR - busy matchday bar enviroment,card sales can take up to a minute to process. absolute pain
Unless they're still using dial-up I can't see that being a problem.


Dundalk award winning matchday programme - sad to see it go but obv the club were supplementing to some extent and with costs being cut was one of the 1st items to feel the axe when JT took over. Will be back next season abs no doubt and some very determined people behind it to make sure that happens put probably with a smaller print run.
Sorry to see the programme go, at least there's a genuine reason for letting it happen unlike some of the mealy-mouthed excuses other clubs have given for discontinuing.

[EalingGreen]

Sorry to see the programme go, at least there's a genuine reason for letting it happen unlike some of the mealy-mouthed excuses other clubs have given for discontinuing.Not esp Dundalk-related, but I can never understand how you couldn't at least break even on selling programmes i.e. volunteers providing content and actually selling them vs advertising + cover price revenue.

Perhaps Dundalk owe the present printers money which they can't/won't pay, while word of this has got round other local printers?

[brendy_éire]

Not esp Dundalk-related, but I can never understand how you couldn't at least break even on selling programmes i.e. volunteers providing content and actually selling them vs advertising + cover price revenue.

Perhaps Dundalk owe the present printers money which they can't/won't pay, while word of this has got round other local printers?

Suppose it depends on who you get to sponsor it, but I know that Derry's printed programme costs are more than covered by advertising. Online sales would be more profitable again.

[pineapple stu]

UCD don't have any programme-specific ads and still make a few quid off ours in the First Division.

You definitely won't lose money on a couple of hundred sales for a match against Rovers. (Or shouldn't, at least)

[oriel]

I think its a PD requirement for licensing to have as min printed programme or at least online, which Dundalk did for free last few games.

Still think very disappointing no printed programme final 3 games, would think its obv due to printer credit, but I am not sure.

[ger121]

UCD don't have any programme-specific ads and still make a few quid off ours in the First Division.

You definitely won't lose money on a couple of hundred sales for a match against Rovers. (Or shouldn't, at least)

I know UCD have gone to Bi-Monthly now they are in the 1st Division but as an avid match day programme buyer, it’s good to still see one being produced and to hear it is making a few quid. Must say it is a decent quality production too.

[Nesta99]

Ive never bothered with online versions. HT/FT read at the game and then the next day there was always reading left. Its not old fashioned not to be fussed on online editions I think, well maybe it is when you could use your phone!? But it's always a shame when programmes go. Ive wondered if the Dundalk programme wasnt presented specifically as a matchday programme and had spot in local newsagents whether it could it have generated wider sales. It certainly was good enough. Ive had a few in the UK with me after being home and they were picked up by curious English club fans at work and they were still reading an hour later. One occasion a colleague turned and said 'Did you know Dundalk played Ajax in Europe?' I was yes I was at the game and shaking his head his reply was 'F*cking mental!'. I told him after about Athlone v AC Milan in the mud of St Mels among others and he really was WTF). Silly story but he seemed to appreciate these wee things more than Irish football fans, indeed Dundalk people too!!

[DCSIL]

I’d say not selling tickets online is stop Rovers fans buying for the home end ….

I've been to a couple of Dundalk home games this year and was "invited" to buy tickets for the Rovers game. Shout out to the T/O for resending me the tickets when i lost the email on the night of the game.