2014 World Cup

[pineapple stu]

Not a bad aul finish there.

[strangeirish]

Cracker there for the US, fully deserved!

[ArdeeBhoy]

And decent goal from the Welsh American there...

[DannyInvincible]

Another German comes to the rescue for the US.


Yes, but the 'top' teams are generally much better, at least in theory, and there's far far more travelling involved. Though can understand your logic.
Also if this was the case, why don't Turkey and some of the former Russian republics which are actually in Asia join them...and even in theory, er, Israel....

There's more money in UEFA, even if it might be a bit tougher to qualify. Joining the Asian confederation was more lucrative for Australia than remaining in Oceania.

[NeverFeltBetter]

American football culture all seems very artificial. All footballing cultures obviously have to find their roots and influences somewhere, but there's just something about the American one that seems really manufactured. It probably doesn't help that their clubs are franchises. I thought this example of cultural appropriation by an American supporters' club was amusing: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-27668750

You might enjoy this: http://northernladsclub.wordpress.com/2014/06/17/the-wall-street-hooligans-and-the-artificiality-of-american-football-culture/

It was written by a pretty interesting guy I happened to meet and converse with after a night out a while back on the nature of football support amongst other things.

That's part of it certainly. But they also have an awful bandwagon culture, that mixes terribly with expectation of instant success.

I have an American friend who went off on a mad rant during the Olympics about how dressage wasn't a "real" sport and had no place in the Games. He suggested replacing it with horseback lasso competitions. I wanted to point out he was suggesting replacing a sport American never won anything in with a sport they would win everything in, but couldn't psyche myself for the argument. And lo and behold, you get ****e like this during the World Cup: http://time.com/2864483/world-cup-2014-soccer-brazil-america/

[BonnieShels]

Agreed, but far far harder for them to qualify for Finals too...

Besides Israel, Turkey's is more political as they always wanted join NATO(!) and the EU. Personally, in both cases along with UEFA feel there should be more rigid geographic constraints...though not just them.

The rigidity of the confederations is pretty absolute unless the odd team manages to move.

Israel, Australia, Suriname and Guyana are the only ones I can think of that don't play in their continental confederations but the reasoning behind that is pretty sound and obvious for al of them.


Nothing artificial about that goal.

My feed is behind the forum so I waited and waited... worth the wait.

[pineapple stu]

Not just about the international team of course. More money for Galatasaray, Fenerbache, et al playing Champions' League rather than the Asian equivalent.

I think the main reason Australia (re) joined Asia was because the competition in Oceania was basically worthless.

On this group - what odds Germany beat the US and Ghana get a result off Portugal to go through?

[ArdeeBhoy]

There's more money in UEFA, even if it might be a bit tougher to qualify. Joining the Asian confederation was more lucrative for Australia than remaining in Oceania.
A bit tougher? Hmm.
Though agree leaving Oceania would be an upwards move financially.

[Stuttgart88]

USA playing a great second half. Are they playing a regular 442, with Jones and Bradley? They may be lacking something in finesse but nothing in athleticism.

Edit: nah, Bekerman looks to be deep lying.

[A N Mouse]

I was having a brief look earlier but I just couldn't see any team other than Germany that would likely be filled with a significant number of Germans. Turkey usually have a few Germany-born players in their squads, don't they, as there's a significant Turkish diaspora in Germany, but they've not qualified this year. I might have trawled through the squads a bit further if I'd had a bit of time to pass and thought the claim might actually be accurate, but I think Richardson must have been mistaken. I just can't see how there'd be 18 players from Germany playing in this World Cup for teams other than Germany. Maybe he'd meant to say 8...

Three in both Bosnia Herzegovina and USA.
Two in Cameroon and Ghana
One in Iran. Probably also one a piece in Greece and Croatia

Too difficult to call Dutch and Swiss based only on place names. Schneiderlin is French side of border. I may have missed some.

One of the French players is listed as born at sea. How would that work?

[ArdeeBhoy]

Not just about the international team of course. More money for Galatasaray, Fenerbache, et al playing Champions' League rather than the Asian equivalent.

Yeah, very much agreed! But the rest of Europe needs to demand a cull, as it should make it easier to qualify...

[Stuttgart88]

Please God give me an alternative to Mark Lawrenson.

[ArdeeBhoy]

One of the French players is listed as born at sea. How would that work?

In international waters, or on a plane?!

What does the rest of your post refer to? Is that just one squad?

[BonnieShels]

One of the French players is listed as born at sea. How would that work?

On a boat.

[ArdeeBhoy]

It's actually the opposite. They qualified for only 2 world Cups from Oceania ever. And the last one was 2006 just before they moved to the AFC. They have since easily qualified for 2010 and 2014. They will continue to qualify from the AFC with ease.

Disagree with that last sentence...

[BonnieShels]

Please God give me an alternative to Mark Lawrenson.

http://www.rte.ie/sport/soccer/worldcup/live/

http://www.unblock-us.com/

[pineapple stu]

Yeah, very much agreed! But the rest of Europe needs to demand a cull, as it should make it easier to qualify...
Eh?

That's nonsense.

[DannyInvincible]

And lo and behold, you get ****e like this during the World Cup: http://time.com/2864483/world-cup-2014-soccer-brazil-america/

Ha, ridiculous, but it's in Time, so it must be genuine? It reads like a parody, especially this bit:


Compare that to soccer, where it’s not unusual to see a team reset the play by kicking the ball back towards their own goal. The play never stops, but nobody gains lasting advantage. “When do you go the bathroom?” says Clark. “When do you get a beer?” More crucially, he points out: When does the broadcaster get a commercial break?

The last few paragraphs are bonkers.

[BonnieShels]

Disagree with that last sentence...

We will see in 2017 won't we?

[A N Mouse]

In international waters, or on a plane?!

What does the rest of your post refer to? Is that just one squad?

Am replying to danny's quoted post about number of German born players in other squads

[pineapple stu]

Another one bites the dust.

Are Portugal out if it stays like this?

Edit - yep; US on 6 and Germany on 4. Frees up another "surprise" quarter finalist spot in my list earlier.

[BonnieShels]

FUPP!

Offside?

EDIT: Close one.

[ArdeeBhoy]

Eh?

That's nonsense.
Er, it's not. Less countries=less competition!

[Stuttgart88]

Dempsey. Leader.

[ArdeeBhoy]

We will see in 2017 won't we?

And every four years thereafter...
:rolleyes:

[pineapple stu]

Duh.

It's your proposal I'm calling nonsense.

US knocked Portugal out in 2002 too actually.

[NeverFeltBetter]

Onside. Great call.

[Stuttgart88]

FUPP!

Offside?

EDIT: Close one.
No, definitely on.

[ArdeeBhoy]

Dempsey. Leader.
Yeah, but was that offside?

[ArdeeBhoy]

Duh.

It's your proposal I'm calling nonsense.

Except there's no logic to doing so!

[pineapple stu]

Five Portuguese offside.

Not seen that before.

[strangeirish]

FUPP!

Offside?

EDIT: Close one.Definitely on.

[pineapple stu]

Except there's no logic to doing so!
Sure let's kick everyone out of UEFA and take over it ourselves.

Dundalk - Champions' League winners!

Yay!

Or should we kick out "Asians" Kazakhstan, Belarus, Georgia, Israel, Azerbaijan and Armenia, who are such threats that between them they have never qualified from UEFA?

And all because you don't understand the concept of "European"?

Right so Ted.

[pineapple stu]

Our 5-1 defeat isn't looking too smart now.

Nor is my earlier prediction that modern football should negate the local advantage of playing in South America.

[BonnieShels]

Our 5-1 defeat isn't looking too smart now.

Nor is my earlier prediction that modern football should negate the local advantage of playing in South America.

I think we can all agree that this is the mentalist world cup ever. And that we should be just happy that we survived,

[ArdeeBhoy]

Or should we kick out "Asians" Kazakhstan, Belarus, Georgia, Israel, Azerbaijan and Armenia, who are such threats that between them they have never qualified from UEFA?
Yes!


And all because you don't understand the concept of "European"?

Right so Ted.
Aye. Try looking in an atlas...
And only one of your 'list' makes Wiki's. A country of which 95% is on another continent.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_European_countries_by_population

[DannyInvincible]

Three in both Bosnia Herzegovina and USA.
Two in Cameroon and Ghana
One in Iran. Probably also one a piece in Greece and Croatia

Too difficult to call Dutch and Swiss based only on place names. Schneiderlin is French side of border. I may have missed some.

One of the French players is listed as born at sea. How would that work?

Nice work. Have you got the names handy or where'd you get the info? Did you just scan through Wiki? I was thinking Bosnia might have had a couple. I think it's actually five German players the US have. Definitely more than three anyway.

Just found this piece, which claims that there are 25 France-born players playing for countries other than France at the World Cup with 14 from Germany playing for countries other than Germany: http://www.newstatesman.com/staggers/2014/06/world-cup-tournament-nations-and-migrants

I assume they've double-checked the figures. It also explains how Rio Mavuba was "born at sea".


The country of birth most likely to be rejected by a World Cup footballer, to play for somebody else, is France. No fewer than 25 French-born footballers will represent other teams in Brazil, ahead of Germany (14) and Brazil (5). The sole English-born player to play for another country is the Lambeth-born Middlesborough striker Albert Adomah. Having lived in Ghana until he was nine, and who has seized an unlikely chance to play at a World Cup for the Black Stars.

16 of the Algerian squad of 23 being born in France. This partly reflects an active Algerian strategy of diaspora recruitment, broadly similar to that which took the Republic of Ireland to several World Cups. But do the number of French-born players in the Algeria, Cameroon, Ghana and Ivory Coast sides also say something about the shortcomings of French integration?

Cameroon player Assou-Ekotto, born in Arras, France to a French-born mother, thinks that it does. He has spoken about his surprise at finding that his black British Tottenham team-mates naturally think of themselves as English.

He told the Guardian that "the country does not want us to be part of this new France. So we identify ourselves more with our roots. Me playing for Cameroon was a natural and normal thing. I have no feeling for the France national team; it just doesn't exist. When people ask of my generation in France, 'Where are you from?', they will reply Morocco, Algeria, Cameroon or wherever. But what has amazed me in England is that when I ask the same question of people like Lennon and Defoe, they'll say: 'I'm English.' That's one of the things that I love about life here."

France has done rather less with the inclusive patriotism of its World Cup and European champions of 1998 and 2000 than many had anticipated.

Yet the French 2014 squad does again capture the story of migration to France. Two of its players were born abroad - and more than half of the French squad have migrant heritage. Lille midfielder Rio Muavba's father had played at the 1974 World Cup for Zaire. But Muavba's own birth certificate reads "born at sea", as he was born, without a nation, on a boat, as his parents fled the Angolan civil war in 1984, before the family was granted refugee status in France. "I grew up in France, and I am French", Muavba said, when turning down the offer to play for Congo instead.

[pineapple stu]

Aye. Try looking in an atlas...
You wouldn't think of asking them what they think?

Bordering a bit on the racist there, ArdeeBhoy.

[pineapple stu]

What a suitably dramatic finish!

What a tournament! Just keeps on giving!

[Stuttgart88]

Bradley, what an idiot.

Ronaldo, what a cross.

Interesting draw scenario in final games.

[ArdeeBhoy]

Nothing to do with being racist...you have to have geographical limits, or it makes it a farce...we could join up with N.America...along with Iceland!
;)

[NeverFeltBetter]

What a cross, what a header. The vitriol towards Ronaldo on Twitter was bugging the hell out of me, so over the moon with the finish.

[BonnieShels]

Well!!!!!!

[BonnieShels]

What a suitably dramatic finish!

What a tournament! Just keeps on giving!

2018 hasn't a hope.

[DannyInvincible]

Will a draw between the USA and Germany see both through then?

[ArdeeBhoy]

Will a draw between the USA and Germany see both through then?
Yeap. Shades of 1982?

[NeverFeltBetter]

USA/Germany has real potential for Austria/Germany levels of non-attacking now.

[pineapple stu]

Will a draw between the USA and Germany see both through then?

It will, yeah.

US 4 points
Germany 4 points
Ghana 1 point
Portugal 1 point

[Stuttgart88]

Yes, and a draw in the other game will also see them go through.

[Stuttgart88]

Yeap. Shades of 1982?
Was that not 1978?