2014 World Cup

[pineapple stu]

Didn't know the fourth official is watching TV replays and could let the ref know about stuff he'd missed. That's interesting. Good idea too.

[pineapple stu]

I cant see whos on the panel so Im not sure if Im happy or freaked out that I have the same opinion as them :)
Ha!

Giles and Brady.

Brady saying that the fourth official doesn't know as much about over-the-top fouls as Giles. :p

[NeverFeltBetter]

Has to be a red. Officials don't tolerate tackles like that anymore (by and large).

[Razors left peg]

I think if a guy goes in over the the top of the ball theres not doubt its a straight red but to me that one was caused by the contact on the ball.... either way I dont think it would have affected the outcome too much with the Swiss scoring 3

[Charlie Darwin]

Ha!

Giles and Brady.

Brady saying that the fourth official doesn't know as much about over-the-top fouls as Giles. :p
Caught that, Giles didn't seem to pick up on it!

I disagree with John about Valencia. I don't think it was a malicious tackle at all but it was reckless and dangerous and he put himself in a position where he wouldn't be able to control his leg once it slipped off the ball.

[BonnieShels]

John and Liam.

[Charlie Darwin]

John and Liam.
Ann and Barry. What's your point?

[DannyInvincible]

The Ecuadorian keeper was catching everything. Made for a nice change. It was a spirited performance by Ecuador, but they're the first South American side to drop out.

I'm sure anyone watching the Argentina game saw what appeared to be Lavezzi dissing his manager with a squirt of water over the head whilst otherwise completely ignoring his instructions earlier?


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_TSWlCC1shU

Was that serious or was it a joke?

Kenny Cunningham didn't have much time for it: http://www.rte.ie/sport/soccer/worldcup/2014/0625/626524-analysis-a-deliberate-snub-by-lavezzi/


I know from playing football that if I was having an ongoing thing with a fella on the pitch there would be times where you would go into a challenge harder than needed and at times I probably intended to hurt the guy. But again I think that is normal human behaviour when you get angry. I wouldnt like it at the time but I could understand a guy going in hard or leaving a foot in on me for the same reasons.

Well, of course you'd consider it normal human conduct if you admit you'd be liable to lapsing into it yourself. Just like Suarez might be of the opinion that biting is a completely normal human behaviour. :p


But if a guy spat at me I think I would completely go bananas, that is far less dangerous than anything else that might happen on a football pitch but its disgusting and disrespectful. Most people would agree that it is completely unacceptable. To me though biting is much worse again, there is something very wrong about it. It is not normal behavior in any way at all.

I don't doubt it immediately strikes the raw senses as very wrong, but it's what makes it more wrong in people's minds that I find interesting. Lineker on the BBC was just discussing retrospective punishment generally after the France-Ecuador game and said in a steadfast manner, as if reflecting the view of the nation, "Well, I'm not going to compare a bite with an elbow..." Are they that incomparable? They're both abhorrent examples of violent conduct. Is it rational to view it as incomparably wrong or weird, or is such an emotionally-charged response? Maybe there are valid reasons to view biting as more harmful. Maybe not. I think EG suggested it earlier, but perhaps we're hardwired by evolution to be disgusted by it. Who knows? It's quite a fascinating controversy all the same.

[BonnieShels]

Ann and Barry. What's your point?


Responding to Razor's worry that he may have agreed with Dunphy and Sadlier. Sadly my Canadian broadband failed to refresh the page quickly enough and you all beat me to it.

I apologise for my impervious interruption.

As you were...

[Razors left peg]

The difference is Danny I think that most people would agree with what I find normal behaviour.... I doubt many(outside of Uruguay and Merseyside) would agree with Suarez view on normal :)

For what its worth I actually think both Sahko and Giroud should get punished for the elbows, but again they are pretty much first time offenders and dont do that regularly!

[Razors left peg]

Responding to Razor's worry that he may have agreed with Dunphy and Sadlier. Sadly my Canadian broadband failed to refresh the page quickly enough and you all beat me to it.

I apologise for my impervious interruption.

As you were...

I actually like Sadlier, after Gary Neville I would have him as my 2nd fav pundit on the box

[Charlie Darwin]

I actually like Sadlier, after Gary Neville I would have him as my 2nd fav pundit on the box
the last few days he seems to have made a conscious effort to lighten up, almost as if he reads what people say about him on twitter and message boards. The only problem is he's now turned into one of those born-again types who, despite having only stopped being a moanyhole about 72 hours ago, is now going around cheerfully reminding people that their negative vibes are really bringing everyone down.

[DannyInvincible]

Because they don't trust the Federation to have the capital from just them saying so. Every tournament I hear about this sort of thing with the African sides, never any other confederation.

But couldn't they just have requested it be transferred electronically? They'd have gotten it quicker that way, assuming the federation does actually have the capability to produce such funds.

[BonnieShels]

But couldn't they just have requested it be transferred electronically? They'd have gotten it quicker that way, assuming the federation does actually have the capability to produce such funds.

I'd say they were worried about the Nigerian prince the GFA had set up as the middle man.

[Charlie Darwin]

But couldn't they just have requested it be transferred electronically? They'd have gotten it quicker that way, assuming the federation does actually have the capability to produce such funds.
According to the coach (http://www.theguardian.com/football/2014/jun/25/ghana-boycott-portugal-world-cup-2014), James Appiah, most of the players don't have bank accounts in Ghana and apparently the banking system isn't quite as seamless there as it is in Europe, so players prefer to be paid in cash. I suspect it's probably more a case of them not trusting they'll be paid until it's in their hands. The problem in this case is that the players expect to be paid before the tournament (as is reasonable if they don't trust the FA) and FIFA doesn't pay out until after a tournament (a few months later I think) so the FA has to find a line of credit to pay bonuses until the FIFA payment comes in. That shouldn't really be a problem for an organisation that has $8 million guaranteed income, but who knows what goes on between the FA and banks.

[DannyInvincible]

the last few days he seems to have made a conscious effort to lighten up, almost as if he reads what people say about him on twitter and message boards. The only problem is he's now turned into one of those born-again types who, despite having only stopped being a moanyhole about 72 hours ago, is now going around cheerfully reminding people that their negative vibes are really bringing everyone down.

He was telling Kenny he was getting "too angry" over Lavezzi squirting his manager with water.

[Charlie Darwin]

He was telling Kenny he was getting "too angry" over Lavezzi squirting his manager with water.
It's funny because a week ago I reckon he probably would have been really annoyed by Cunningham and got quite agitated, but new chilled-out Richie was just like "dude, relax..."

[DannyInvincible]

I'd say they were worried about the Nigerian prince the GFA had set up as the middle man.

Let's nip this myth in the bud before it gathers wings; the Good Friday Agreement has absolutely nothing to do with the Nigerian prince's eligibility to effect the switch to the Ghana team.

[ArdeeBhoy]

According to the coach (http://www.theguardian.com/football/2014/jun/25/ghana-boycott-portugal-world-cup-2014), James Appiah, most of the players don't have bank accounts in Ghana and apparently the banking system isn't quite as seamless there as it is in Europe, so players prefer to be paid in cash. I suspect it's probably more a case of them not trusting they'll be paid until it's in their hands. The problem in this case is that the players expect to be paid before the tournament (as is reasonable if they don't trust the FA) and FIFA doesn't pay out until after a tournament (a few months later I think) so the FA has to find a line of credit to pay bonuses until the FIFA payment comes in. That shouldn't really be a problem for an organisation that has $8 million guaranteed income, but who knows what goes on between the FA and banks.

More like their players don't want to pay tax on it, allegedly...

[Charlie Darwin]

More like their players don't want to pay tax on it, allegedly...
I doubt it. If they wanted to hide it they'd just have it paid to an offshore bank account. I'd say it's a lot more to do with lack of trust in their football association.

[DannyInvincible]

Uruguay's in-denial captain Diego Lugano answers the BBC's questions on "nothing important": http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/28026610

His opening answer is just comical.


BBC: "Can you comment on the incident with Luis Suarez? Can you comment on what the world saw yesterday?"

Diego Lugano: "What incident? I don't know what incident you're talking about. I don't know what incident you're talking about. Are you talking about the Premier League or the national team? Have you got something against Luis?"

BBC: "Chiellini? Are you saying nothing happened?"

Lugano: "No. The pictures don't show anything. They show an approximation but nothing important."

BBC: "Why then has Fifa charged Luis Suarez?"

Lugano: "I don't know. As far as I know."

BBC: "Are British media to blame?"

Lugano: "No. Everybody knows the British media have an issue with Suarez. It must sell newspapers in England. Otherwise you wouldn't be here. Yesterday Uruguay played against Italy and Saturday it will play Colombia. I don't know what a British journalist is doing talking about Suarez. It must be popular with the British media. I don't see another explanation.

"But we're happy with yesterday's win. You don't look that happy with Uruguay's victory but, well, now comes the hardest part which is facing what I believe is the best team so far in the tournament. Colombia has scored a lot of goals and won easily."

[NeverFeltBetter]

Its like the Liverpool team after the Evra incident. Circle the wagons/us against them etc. I wish he had the balls to just say "It was wrong, but there's nothing we can do about it now" but I guess he'd be more worried about squad cohesion.

On another note, what are the chances Germany and the US actually try and win the game tomorrow? I'd say they'd give it a decent go for at least an hour, without trying to really kill themselves. I wonder if Klinsmann would pull a Holloway, and lose while trying too hard to win.

Not that it really matters I suppose, unless Ronaldo really kicks it into gear.

[Charlie Darwin]

Its like the Liverpool team after the Evra incident. Circle the wagons/us against them etc. I wish he had the balls to just say "It was wrong, but there's nothing we can do about it now" but I guess he'd be more worried about squad cohesion.

On another note, what are the chances Germany and the US actually try and win the game tomorrow? I'd say they'd give it a decent go for at least an hour, without trying to really kill themselves. I wonder if Klinsmann would pull a Holloway, and lose while trying too hard to win.

Not that it really matters I suppose, unless Ronaldo really kicks it into gear.
I'd say a semi-competitive game will suit Germany. If the US aren't going full-tilt, they could tear them apart.

[Closed Account 2]

Was at the Greece game, it didn't look like a penalty to me but I didn't have the benefit of a replay. The locals were not too fond of Greece's tactics, I can see them edging Costa Rica though.

[Charlie Darwin]

Was at the Greece game, it didn't look like a penalty to me but I didn't have the benefit of a replay. The locals were not too fond of Greece's tactics, I can see them edging Costa Rica though.
To be fair to the home fans, they've seen enough of those tactics from their own team so they're bound to be worn out by the time they get to Greece.

[DannyInvincible]

Do you still think it was a dive having seen television replays?


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XUmuwaZp5vU

I thought it was a pretty clear-cut penalty. Samaras' leg was caught as he swung it to kick the ball, which caused it to change course and his foot to pummel into the ground, thus, tripping him up.

[OwlsFan]

There are different angles which show him being clipped by the defender. Penalty.

One of the most disappointing moments of the World Cup so far for me was the huge ovation Drogba got when leaving the pitch. Good player and all that he is, to me he represents much that is wrong with football today with his diving and particularly feigning injury and these people would have seen it on TV and yet applaud him. Perhaps all that s**t is now accepted by many fans :(

[BonnieShels]

Read this...

Laughed lots...
http://babb.telegraph.co.uk/2014/06/34-2014-reasons-this-has-been-the-best-world-cup-ever/

[DannyInvincible]

Ha, I'm guessing this was from the England game:

http://thechive.files.wordpress.com/2014/06/dar-today-321.jpg

Still no verdict on Suarez, although Danny Mills recommended the following: "They have got to throw him in jail and lock him up forever."

I'm surprised by some of the things people like Mills are coming out with. If anything, they should be bringing back capital punishment!

If Suarez does play for Uruguay in the next match against Colombia though, and Carlos Bacca plays for them, might Suarez chew Bacca?

(OK, I'll be honest; my friend came up with that on Facebook.)


On another note, what are the chances Germany and the US actually try and win the game tomorrow? I'd say they'd give it a decent go for at least an hour, without trying to really kill themselves. I wonder if Klinsmann would pull a Holloway, and lose while trying too hard to win.

I think they'll play out a conservative and risk-free draw. I don't necessarily think it'll be a stitch-up where the two teams will have agreed to ensure safe passage through for both of them or anything like that. I just think the players will be primarily concerned with protecting what they have - self-preservation will dictate matters - and this will have the inevitable consequence of both sides committing little in attack. There may be a brief early period of inventive play - they'll have heard wind of the conspiracy theories and may want to do just enough to prove their professional integrity - but, if so, both teams will very soon realise the perils of allowing such play to continue. Imagine you were playing in this game; how would you approach it?


There are different angles which show him being clipped by the defender. Penalty.

Aw aye, definitely. It's evident from the angle in that video above even, despite the idiot who uploaded it sticking "dive" in the title.


One of the most disappointing moments of the World Cup so far for me was the huge ovation Drogba got when leaving the pitch. Good player and all that he is, to me he represents much that is wrong with football today with his diving and particularly feigning injury and these people would have seen it on TV and yet applaud him. Perhaps all that s**t is now accepted by many fans :(

Well, of course it would be accepted. As we all know from the summer friendlies thread, the majority of football fans around the world are them poor types with no moral backbone...

[bennocelt]

Ha, I'm guessing this was from the England game:

http://thechive.files.wordpress.com/2014/06/dar-today-321.jpg



Did it really cost him £2000 for accommodation! That's usually the last thing I worry about on football away days!!

[Charlie Darwin]

If Suarez does play for Uruguay in the next match against Colombia though, and Carlos Bacca plays for them, might Suarez chew Bacca?

(OK, I'll be honest; my friend came up with that on Facebook.)
I think you're more honest than your friend - that one's been doing the rounds since Tuesday.

Sulley Muntari and Kevin Prince Boateng have been kicked out of the Ghana camp today over disputes with management. Muntari apparently attacked an FA official.

[DannyInvincible]

I think you're more honest than your friend - that one's been doing the rounds since Tuesday.

Ha, he claimed it was all his own work. I had a suspicion it might have been doing the rounds though, so thought it best to play it safe and admit it wasn't an original. Phew! :p


Sulley Muntari and Kevin Prince Boateng have been kicked out of the Ghana camp today over disputes with management. Muntari apparently attacked an FA official.

They won't play later then? Boateng strikes me as serious mercenary material. Maybe Tommie Gorman could help patch things up?

[NeverFeltBetter]

Everything is lining up for Portugal....

[A N Mouse]

This talk about about the lack of catching from goalkeepers baffles me. Not that it would matter, but is there any evidence to back up these claims?

There seems to be some misplaced importance on catching (in the anglosphere). The priority is preventing goals; and sure catching the ball, and ensuring your team retains possession is the optimal way of doing this.

But punching is just as vaild an option, especially under pressure. I'd argue a punch is more difficult to execute, but easier to recover from.

A good punch, like a good parry, should remove the immediate danger, and ideally find a team mate, empty space or touch.

It's all about picking the best option in a given situation.

[peadar1987]

Did it really cost him £2000 for accommodation! That's usually the last thing I worry about on football away days!!

Perhaps Brazil isn't like most of Europe, where you can usually get away with staying in a hostel in the dodgy part of town for £15 a night. You could run into safety issues.

That said, I doubt he's staying for more than 3 weeks, especially if he's only arriving after the second game. That works out to about £100 a night, which is definitely more than you need to shell out. Same for "Enjoying the ambience". If you're spending £100 a night on just generally having the craic, you're either doing it wrong, or doing it very, very right!

[peadar1987]

This talk about about the lack of catching from goalkeepers baffles me. Not that it would matter, but is there any evidence to back up these claims?

There seems to be some misplaced importance on catching (in the anglosphere). The priority is preventing goals; and sure catching the ball, and ensuring your team retains possession is the optimal way of doing this.

But punching is just as vaild an option, especially under pressure. I'd argue a punch is more difficult to execute, but easier to recover from.

A good punch, like a good parry, should remove the immediate danger, and ideally find a team mate, empty space or touch.

It's all about picking the best option in a given situation.

Oliver Kahn was always great fun to watch. He used to punch the ball crazy distances at the slightest excuse. Long ball played over the top, no opposition player within 40 yards, Kahn comes haring out to the top of his area and punches the ball into the stratosphere...

[DannyInvincible]

Just to go back to a few comments on the Suarez incident...


I dunno, maybe because it is so weird to see some one bite it causes more of an outrage but thats the thing... it is actually really really weird!

It is weird, sure, but is weirdness worthy of greater punishment than, say, a forceful elbow to the nose?


Is it relatively harmless though? If a dog bites you would need to go get a tetanus shot, if a person bites you and breaks the skin I would imagine its the same thing.


You'd need more than a tetanus shot if a dog bit you. Rabies has a mortality rate in excess of 99.5%.

The tetanus bacterium can easily be transmitted through soil - e.g. a muddy boot raking down and cutting your leg. Or by a bite. But I think there's extra infections a bite can cause - HIV or hepatitis, for example. So for that reason, it is worse than an elbow.

Or a muddy football stud raking down and cutting your leg maybe? Is it really worse than an elbow though? Suarez might have bitten in a fashion society deems weirdly animalistic, but he isn't a dog with rabies or tetanus, so I don't see the relevance of drawing sensational comparisons with bites from dogs with rabies. We should remain rational rather than lapsing into factually-suspect alarmism. He's a seemingly-healthy human being, at least physically, and presumably free from HIV, hepatitis and other blood-transmitted diseases. Not that there was any exchange of blood anyway, and HIV cannot be transmitted via saliva-blood contamination either. Even if Suarez had broken the skin - and he didn't - of what would Chiellini have been at risk from his saliva to render it worse than an elbow?

[DannyInvincible]

This talk about about the lack of catching from goalkeepers baffles me. Not that it would matter, but is there any evidence to back up these claims?

There seems to be some misplaced importance on catching (in the anglosphere). The priority is preventing goals; and sure catching the ball, and ensuring your team retains possession is the optimal way of doing this.

Aye, maybe it's just that the media in the Anglosphere makes such a big deal out of it when a goalkeeper is - shock, horror - seen to punch a ball, so we think it's more prevalent. A keeper who punches is seen as flaky, eccentric and risky. Why would there be a greater appreciation for goalkeepers catching the ball in the UK and Ireland though? Could it be related to an historical emphasis upon catching the ball in sports like rugby or Gaelic football where holding on to it ensures possession is preserved?


Perhaps Brazil isn't like most of Europe, where you can usually get away with staying in a hostel in the dodgy part of town for £15 a night. You could run into safety issues.

That said, I doubt he's staying for more than 3 weeks, especially if he's only arriving after the second game. That works out to about £100 a night, which is definitely more than you need to shell out. Same for "Enjoying the ambience". If you're spending £100 a night on just generally having the craic, you're either doing it wrong, or doing it very, very right!

Obviously trying to pass themselves off as more affluent than they actually are. If they were really that well-off, they would have at least laminated the card and been able to buy a dictionary to check the spelling of "ambience"! :p

[A N Mouse]

Or a muddy football stud raking down and cutting your leg maybe? Is it really worse than an elbow though? Suarez might have bitten in a fashion society deems weirdly animalistic, but he isn't a dog with rabies or tetanus, so I don't see the relevance of drawing sensational comparisons with bites from dogs with rabies. We should remain rational rather than lapsing into factually-suspect alarmism. He's a seemingly-healthy human being, at least physically, and presumably free from HIV, hepatitis and other blood-transmitted diseases. Not that there was any exchange of blood anyway, and HIV cannot be transmitted via saliva-blood contamination either. Even if Suarez had broken the skin - and he didn't - of what would Chiellini have been at risk from his saliva to render it worse than an elbow?

This will have to suffice for now

http://healthcare.utah.edu/healthfeed/postings/2014/06/062414_world.cup.bite.php

Can't find the article, but there was one recently think was cat bites are worse than (non-rabid) dog bites - basically doggy mouth bacteria was less harmful to humans. But there was some kind of throwaway at the end, about how the same was true of human bites.

Found something (not one I remember) - but unfortunatley its from the daily mail

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/health/article-2144366/Moggie-lovers-beware-One-bite-cat-critical-list.html

[Crosby87]

Massive flooding at the stadium US/Germs are playing at. Easy money today gents. This one has draw written all over it. Fans having trouble getting there, streets flooded. Ive never seen this country so mad for a soccer game and its going to be a buzz kill. My office is even getting it catered and giving everyone the chance to watch on the big projector. Rare.

[DannyInvincible]

This will have to suffice for now

http://healthcare.utah.edu/healthfeed/postings/2014/06/062414_world.cup.bite.php

Is that the best on offer? :p


“Human bites are capable of transmitting infectious diseases,” says Jamie Quinlan, DNP, nurse manager of the emergency department at University of Utah Hospital. Quinlan says even what appears to be a minor wound contains high levels of bacteria -- in fact more than 600 types of bacteria are present in the human mouth at any time including strains of staph and strep. Those bacteria could lead to conditions like cellulitis, lymphangitis, or impetigo. A bite could also lead to transmission of hepatitis or HIV if those illnesses are present, and blood to blood contact is made.

All very vague with a lot of "could have this" and "could have that" - unlikely complications, in other words - rather than actual statistics relating to the health risks an actual human bite might pose. I'd imagine the risk of infection by the conditions mentioned above would be very rare. I don't see any compelling evidence to suggest otherwise. Why is she even bringing blood-to-blood contact into it? I'm looking for info on the health risks of human bites myself and, as I've said, I've failed to turn up anything really solid, which would seem to indicate to me that they're generally not that significant a health risk, especially if there's no breakage of the skin and the biter is a physically-healthy individual. Even if there is a breakage of the skin, the NHS website says of animal and human bites that even "infected bites rarely cause serious problems".

The piece is rather frivolous and tabloidy itself anyway, even after she rebukes those making light of the situation with their internet memes...


Instantly, no one cared about the score any more, as fans rushed to their keyboards to weigh in on Suarez’s unsportsmanlike behavior, and launch a thousand internet memes based on the incident. But while many are making this into a joke, in reality a bite wound is no laughing matter.

...

Chiellini is going home from the World Cup with no victory, but a part in one of the most talked about incidents during the competition. Hopefully, that’s all he taking home, and not a bite related infection as well. While Uruguay is still in the tournament, Suarez could face suspension from game play.

His biting may come back to bite him.


There is no word on whether Suarez seriously injured Chiellini with the bite.

Probably best we stick to that fact then before losing the run of ourselves with ill-informed speculation and sensationalist what-could-have-beens. Not saying you're guilty of that AN; just speaking of the media and the outraged generally.

[jbyrne]

9 match ban and 4 months ban from any football activity for suarez. he can appeal but one way or another he is out of the WC

[osarusan]

And what about that Japanese chick that the cameras focused on on 64 minutes? OMG.

http://foot.ie/threads/137011-NSFW-Sporty-Totty-%28DON-T-QUOTE-PICS%29?p=1762582&viewfull=1#post1762582

[OwlsFan]

And Ghana have their own Saipan with two players sent home http://www.rte.ie/sport/soccer/worldcup/2014/0626/626681-ghana/

[NeverFeltBetter]

9 match ban and 4 months ban from any football activity for suarez. he can appeal but one way or another he is out of the WC

And the Copa America. With the repeated behavior and total, astonishing lack of remorse, its entirely justified. Maybe even lenient.

[Eminence Grise]

Report on the Suarez decision.

http://www.independent.ie/sport/soccer/world-cup/suarez-banned-for-nine-matches-and-four-months-30387318.html

Seems a bit harsh on Liverpool (being born in Manchester, I should care less, but still...:p)

[Real ale Madrid]

Nice to see him get a good old fashioned GAA type suspension. Time as opposed to games.

[NeverFeltBetter]

Watch them circle the wagons, cry conspiracy, and be stunned when he does something crazy again next year.

[NeverFeltBetter]

Report on the Suarez decision.

http://www.independent.ie/sport/soccer/world-cup/suarez-banned-for-nine-matches-and-four-months-30387318.html

Seems a bit harsh on Liverpool (being born in Manchester, I should care less, but still...:p)


As part of their defence of the 27-year-old striker, Alejandro Balbi, a board member of the Uruguayan Football Association (AUF), claimed that Suarez actually came off with worse injuries than his opponent.

Absolutely disgraceful.

[Charlie Darwin]

Hopefully this will put an end to all the Suarez talk and we can get back to enjoying a great World Cup.