Trap Out and/or Delaney Out

[Charlie Darwin]

He's getting his info from Dennis O'Brien afaik.
No he's not, he's getting it from FAI sources. O'Brien has no influence at the Indo, hence why he's always suing his own journalists.

[paul_oshea]

Why don't you then? You're always referring to posters here by how you perceive their attributes. Stop hiding and spit it out.

I share your concerns about Mick making same mistakes, but I think he'd be a lot better. I still highly rate Trap's away record and wish we could continue on same basis, but we are now rubbish at home and rubbish against strong teams. That's not just down to the quality of the players.

Well I don't want to embarrass any of them as I'd imagine at this stage they are embarrassed enough. Don't worry stutts you're not one of them :P

Ya i'd think if he could scrape those wins, but we never really had an austria or a sweden to beat away from home. And slovakia arent as good as sweden, and we could only draw with them anyway. We had no team as good as austria that we beat before, macedonia or armenia the closest

[tetsujin1979]

Well I don't want to embarrass any of them as I'd imagine at this stage they are embarrassed enough. Don't worry stutts you're not one of them :P

Ya i'd think if he could scrape those wins, but we never really had an austria or a sweden to beat away from home. And slovakia arent as good as sweden, and we could only draw with them anyway. We had no team as good as austria that we beat before, macedonia or armenia the closest
Austria are currently ranked 59th in the world. Armenia were ranked 44th when we beat them at home

[Charlie Darwin]

Austria are currently ranked 59th in the world. Armenia were ranked 44th when we beat them at home
Armenia were plateauing due to recent results, while Austria are probably ranked lower than their true ability. I think we'll probably find they're about the same in terms of overall quality.

[KK77]

No he's not, he's not getting it from FAI sources. O'Brien has no influence at the Indo, hence why he's always suing his own journalists.

I can assure you he is!

[Charlie Darwin]

I can assure you he is!
Your sources are unreliable then.

[KK77]

Your sources are unreliable then.

No not at all.

[paul_oshea]

Tets point taken, but those rankings in my opinion are never really accurate. CD, i reckon it would be easier to get a win out in Armenia than it would be in Vienna.

I also think it would be a lot easier to beat Armenia at home.

[shakermaker1982]

Right who is still in the Trap camp? Don't be shy.....

[Fergie's Son]

McCarthy would be a step backwards. Time for new blood.

[shakermaker1982]

Also what about these Harry Redknapp rumours I read this morning. Would that be something that posters would like to see?

How the hell could we afford him?

Do we need an Irish manager?

[Charlie Darwin]

Also what about these Harry Redknapp rumours I read this morning. Would that be something that posters would like to see?

How the hell could we afford him?

Do we need an Irish manager?
We need somebody who will prioritise bringing through the next generation rather than somebody who comes in to make the best of what we have to get results, like Trap. Unfortunately the FAI and the Irish public will demand immediate results.

[TrapAPony]

Also what about these Harry Redknapp rumours I read this morning. Would that be something that posters would like to see?

How the hell could we afford him?

Do we need an Irish manager?

I want him. Might bring a few lads like Noble, O'Hara, Naughton etc with him

[paul_oshea]

Redknapp would jump ship just after austria game when an offer in the premiership came in for him.

I actually think international football would suit him, I think he would get the best out of what we have - granted he used to always make an awful lot of signings. There isn't really a whole lot of decent candidates out there. I like someone young like deschamps, fresh ideas, i dont see him leaving france though :D Coyle might not be a bad idea. I think at the moment we need someone with good man management skills.

I've a friend who says we need to send an SOS out to all premier league teams a bit like Jack did.

[IsMiseSean]

I want him. Might bring a few lads like Noble, O'Hara, Naughton etc with him

Are you serious?
Is Noble & O'Hara any better than what we have in CM? I hope we never see them in an Ireland shirt!!

[Charlie Darwin]

Redknapp would jump ship just after austria game when an offer in the premiership came in for him.

I actually think international football would suit him, I think he would get the best out of what we have - granted he used to always make an awful lot of signings. There isn't really a whole lot of decent candidates out there. I like someone young like deschamps, fresh ideas, i dont see him leaving france though :D Coyle might not be a bad idea. I think at the moment we need someone with good man management skills.

I've a friend who says we need to send an SOS out to all premier league teams a bit like Jack did.
When has he ever made the best of what he had? He has always had a lot of money to work with and generally his position in the league has been a reflection of the club's financial power or worse.

[tetsujin1979]

He's also pretty culpable for the mess Portsmouth are in at the moment

[BonnieShels]

He's also pretty culpable for the mess Portsmouth are in at the moment

I think it would be nigh on crazy.

Like all the other times we have had Venables linked to us. It would sicken me.

[John83]

Fed up listening to this kind of defence of Trap.
That's funny because the entire thread up to that post was unanimously in favour of Trap leaving.

[Olé Olé]

Maybe getting in Redknapp would be a good money-making method for the FAI. Sign him up to an 18-month contract and if he walks away before it's completion to a Premier League side then the FAI are due compensation. God, I hope none of this happens.

Redknapp, Trap or Venables or anyone of their ilk could currently be seen as mere mercenaries in relation to the job and it's current context. A younger manager would be seen as ideal. If there are funds available, how about testing Brian McDermott's loyalty to Reading? His desire to manage Ireland isn't immediate but if he was sought out then it could prove too good to be refused.

Coyle is a very good option. As a young manager with plenty energy and vibrance and base in England, he'd be more than willing to see the talent at our disposal and how to incorporate it if possible. He'd probably be a cheap enough option, given that his wages at Burnley should he take the job there would hardly be astronomical and he is a free agent. He's passionate with a strong Irish identity and would surely prove a strong leader to James McCarthy and Aiden McGeady as Glaswegians of Irish descent, with both players being quite integral to the future of our midfield.

As I've stated, there are some quite good players at our disposal were a new manager set on employing a better brand of football than Trap. But, even at that, whereas tiki-taka football hasn't been the prime trait of Irish football in the past, spirit, workrate and hunger have been. These weren't on show Friday night. And if you can argue that they were, then the likes of O'Dea and Ward aren't of the requisite standard to apply these traits to international football. There are willing alternatives who should be able to do so.

[Closed Account 2]

Right who is still in the Trap camp? Don't be shy.....

I've about half a toe left in the Trap camp and the rest of me is in the get rid camp. In an ideal world he would go, but it would be a big financial hit, it seems he is not going to resign without payment. Aside from the cost of getting rid of him, paying out not only his contract but also the contract of all his support team (e.g. Tardelli as I dont think his sucessor would want to work with him, and the translator as there is no need for her) would be expensive and there would be the cost of the new manager (and his support team) over the rest of the qualification campaign. Put it this way if we did get rid of Trap and say got in Sean O'Driscoll, from now until 2014 we would be paying the wages of both Trap and O'Driscoll. If there was a standout candidate it might be justifiable but I cant see one. The football is fairly horrendous to watch, but on paper if we beat the Faeroes then 6 points from the three games would be on par with most peoples expectations and given the cost of termination I would probably give him a stay of execution so to speak. I always thought his position in this qualification campaign was akin to knockout football, so long as the results were on par we sould keep him but as soon as we dropped points against a lesser team we should consider getting rid of him. If we dont win against the Faeroese then I would get rid of him on the basis the results are impacting on future seedings. If we have another insipid performance and are drubbed in Stockholm I would probably get shot of him that night.

[pineapple stu]

Paddy Power suspend betting on him being sacked by the year end (http://www.independent.ie/sport/soccer/paddy-power-suspends-betting-on-trapattoni-losing-his-job-3259510.html).

Though God knows bookies have suspended enough of betting for little or no reason down the years.

[the doc]

There's an old saying "Be careful what you wish for"
A very sad day if Trap is forced to leave.
Who will come in?

Harry Rednapp? He'd call up half the West Ham team plus his old players such as Anton Ferdinand! Shudder at the thought!

Mad Mick? Never go back? Nice bloke but he's had his time

Brian Kerr? Talks a good game still living off the back of the youth side success way back.

Brian Mc D from Reading, nice guy, gets the best out of his players but too soon for him right now.

Roy Keane???? Don't even go there!

What's the betting we end up with Sven?

Not looking too good is it?

In Trap I trust!

[Charlie Darwin]

I would be very surprised if Harry called up Rio Ferdinand, Sean.

[youngirish]

https://fbcdn-sphotos-h-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/s480x480/404722_482637518437366_972597127_n.jpg
Almost right but I'd stick Staunton's head on an amoeba as even though it might ruin the sequence it would be more accurate in an evolutionary sense.

[Charlie Darwin]

Why? We played more positive football under Staunton than any of those managers bar McCarthy.

[youngirish]

Why? We played more positive football under Staunton than any of those managers bar McCarthy.
Staunton had us playing the most tactically inept brand of football you're ever likely to see outside a playground.

[Charlie Darwin]

And yet the players passed the ball short distances.

[Bungle]

I agree with other posters concerns about who we would and could get in. The main questions asked by any decent manager would be along the lines of
(1) How good are the team now?
(2) How good can they be in the future? (by this I would say 2-4 years)


(1) Right now, I would say that we are a team that looks in transition. We have lost Given and Duff (two world class players in their day and in Duff's case still a very good player). We have a very good forward like Robbie Keane who is in the twilight of his career and a very good defender and leader of men like Richard Dunne who is not likely to make the campaign for Euro 2016. These were four massive players for us, not just in terms of playing ability, but in terms of their experience and leadership. All four loved and love playing for Ireland and set an example for the younger players in particular. The next batch of experienced players like O'Shea and McGeady are not leaders of men. This would be a concern for any would be manager.

All is not totally unattractive. In Coleman, Clarke, Wilson, McClean and McCarthy we have five very good young players that would be attractive for any manager to work with. In goal, we have Westwood, who I believe will become a decent premiership goalie over time. In Long, we have a very very good player. Walters is a decent striker. O'Shea and McGeady have earned their reputations, but neither have ever really looked like international players on a consistent basis. However, they have both shown that they can play at a high level and it would be the challenge of any would be manager to get them back playing at this level for Ireland. Gibson was in great form for Everton prior to his injury and he could form a very good partnership with McCarthy.

Players like St Ledger will also be important and his experience over the last number of years could be crucial, especially with the more senior players retiring. The likes of Hoolahan could be massive players for us with a new regime and any football man that has watched the premiership can't but be impressed with his ability with the ball and his ability to keep possession, two qualities badly lacking in our current team. Andy Reid and Stephen Ireland are two players that could come into consideration with any new manager. In Ireland's case, there would be major question marks over whether he would ever want to play for Ireland again and whether despite his brilliant talent, he would be more trouble than he is worth, especially in a team that is likely to be in transition.

All in all, I would say we look like a reasonably decent team on paper, but a team that is lacking a "top player". We are a team of primarily premiership journeymen. Comparisons could be made with a team like Sweden, who bar Ibrahimavic, are a fairly ordinary batch of players. We don't have a Belgian golden generation, but we look like a team that should be challenging for a play off.

(2) Mick McCarty's tenure became successful not just because he had players like Irwin and Keane at his disposal, but also because he had a brilliant batch of young players coming through. In the current team, there is no guys coming through that stand out as having the brilliant talent of a Keane, Duff or Given. Only Brady looks to be anywhere near that level. He looks like he has the making of a good international player and a guy who could have a good career in the game but he has done nothing thus far to make us believe that he could be the world class player that we haven't produced in more than a decade (at times Ireland looked world class at Man City). Duffy and Cunningham seem to be doing well and have alot of talent, but neither stand out as really special. Clifford appears to be going nowhere and at one point he appeared to be one of the best underage players in the British game. To put it in perspective, I would have felt 2 years ago that barring injury, Clifford would be a starter for us by now.

Anybody who watches our underage teams will know that there are some brilliant young talents bubbling under. Guys like Conor Henderson, Graham Burke, Jeff Hendrick and Sean Murray all offer great hope. However, in the global context of what constitutes a world class u21 player, none of these have had any real success of note (Suso and Sterling for example would be in the category of world class u21 players imo). However, it must be taken into account that this does not mean that they cannot get to this level over time.

I would say that we have a healthy number of young players that look like they could have a very good future in the game. If I was a manager thinking at applying for the Ireland job, I would be on the whole impressed with the possibilities for the next few years.

[youngirish]

And yet the players passed the ball short distances.
To the opposition.

[tetsujin1979]

haven't read through all the thread, so this may have been already discussed. If there is a positive reaction in the performance tomorrow, is it down to the manager or the players themselves?

[Fergie's Son]

My18 month old can do that. Still doesn't mean I'd line him up against Cyprus.

[Charlie Darwin]

I wouldn't pick him either to be fair. Not enough experience at this level.

[gastric]

The Indo has become a lot more assertive in its belief that Trap is gone unless we win by 10 tomorrow! He's gone therefore.

http://www.independent.ie/national-news/if-we-win-100-trap-might-keep-his-job-3259683.html

[Spudulika]

All you need to know about the Indo and INM - Eoghan Harris and Ruth Dudley Edwards. The paper has the morals of the English Sun and cane be summe dup in one of it's most recent "exposes". The traveler family who Phil Hogan was contacted about were supposedly "dignified" in their responses to the Minister's reaction. INM beat the head off Hogan and lined up all the usual talking heads to slam him (Pavee Point etc), they did their business then once it died down went after the father of the traveler family and exposed him as a serial offender with a track record of brutality to animals and drink driving, as well as public order offences. Of course the latter story appeared as a small article so they could claim unbiased reporting. They're lining up the next sacrificial lamb and won't stop until Trap is gone and Denis O'Brien humiliated.

[gastric]

All you need to know about the Indo and INM - Eoghan Harris and Ruth Dudley Edwards. The paper has the morals of the English Sun and cane be summe dup in one of it's most recent "exposes". The traveler family who Phil Hogan was contacted about were supposedly "dignified" in their responses to the Minister's reaction. INM beat the head off Hogan and lined up all the usual talking heads to slam him (Pavee Point etc), they did their business then once it died down went after the father of the traveler family and exposed him as a serial offender with a track record of brutality to animals and drink driving, as well as public order offences. Of course the latter story appeared as a small article so they could claim unbiased reporting. They're lining up the next sacrificial lamb and won't stop until Trap is gone and Denis O'Brien humiliated.

And how does this relate to Trap!:)

[paul_oshea]

haven't read through all the thread, so this may have been already discussed. If there is a positive reaction in the performance tomorrow, is it down to the manager or the players themselves?

I think its a bit of both to be honest.

Its strange when he finally starts deciding to make the changes everyone wants, now everyone wants him out....

That's the sad thing, if Trap had sorted all these little issue, that were pointed out over a year or so ago - as he so often referred to leetle details in the past - then we wouldn't be, or he wouldn't be in the position he is now.

[ifk101]

All that's needed to win against the Faroes is possession, movement and speed. Everything that is lacking under Trapattoni's reign. :smile:

[shakermaker1982]

We just need personality to beat the Faroes tonight.

[brine3]

The FAI have one card to play against Trap. They can say they will relieve Trap from his duties, but if he wants the full payoff, he must adhere to his contract and receive his salary until his contract ends in 2014.

This, of course, means that Trap could not work for anybody else for two years. And considering his age, he's probably not going to want that.

[the bear]

The FAI have one card to play against Trap. They can say they will relieve Trap from his duties, but if he wants the full payoff, he must adhere to his contract and receive his salary until his contract ends in 2014.

This, of course, means that Trap could not work for anybody else for two years. And considering his age, he's probably not going to want that.

That would be a good deal for Trap, he would get all the money without having to live in Ireland or watch any Irish players play matches for their clubs. Oh wait.........

[DeLorean]

I think I'm more on Trap's side than ever now. The media pressure is barbaric, pure Brit-influenced c rap from watching Sky Sports for too long. The man's done well, I don't agree with some of the tactics and some of the team selections but he got us to a major tournament and within an inch of another from a very low starting point. A win tonight and we're pretty much where we expected to be after three games. Get the Dunney Monster back for Stockholm in March and grab a 1-1 and off we go! To challenge Sweden for second would be an achievement in itself this time round I feel. I know there is much more detailed analysis of his performance being ignored here, and I know the counter arguments to what I have said, but I don't care...overall he's done a good job and that cartoon thing a few pages back is idiotic. It might only be a little joke but it's not funny as it has no substance whatsoever.

I like the team for tonight too, well under the circumstances. Brady and Wilson for Cox and Ward makes plenty of sense. If only we could strengthen the centre a bit.

[marinobohs]

I think I'm more on Trap's side than ever now. The media pressure is barbaric, pure Brit-influenced c rap from watching Sky Sports for too long. The man's done well, I don't agree with some of the tactics and some of the team selections but he got us to a major tournament and within an inch of another from a very low starting point. A win tonight and we're pretty much where we expected to be after three games. Get the Dunney Monster back for Stockholm in March and grab a 1-1 and off we go! To challenge Sweden for second would be an achievement in itself this time round I feel. I know there is much more detailed analysis of his performance being ignored here, and I know the counter arguments to what I have said, but I don't care...overall he's done a good job and that cartoon thing a few pages back is idiotic. It might only be a little joke but it's not funny as it has no substance whatsoever.

I like the team for tonight too, well under the circumstances. Brady and Wilson for Cox and Ward makes plenty of sense. If only we could strengthen the centre a bit.

Never convinced by Trap and still believe we should have got rid of him after Euro debacle. But, having kept him on we must stick with him for this campaign (until we are definately out). Win tonight and we are still in contention for 2nd plae so why the hell sack him (even if FAI could afford it ?). we were always playing for 2nd - God Almighty could not get those players to finish ahead of Germany - and nothing much has changed.

Group will be decided on our games with Sweden and Austria and then we can judge Trap.

[SwanVsDalton]

Cathal Dervan (I know, I know) talking on Radio Ulster, says Trap will almost certainly be gone by the end of the week. Said the wheels have been set in motion to replace him, and all that's left to discuss is the money.

[jbyrne]

Its strange when he finally starts deciding to make the changes everyone wants, now everyone wants him out....

That's the sad thing, if Trap had sorted all these little issue, that were pointed out over a year or so ago - as he so often referred to leetle details in the past - then we wouldn't be, or he wouldn't be in the position he is now.

you would wonder why anyone pays a manager really when its the fans / media / internet forums that are really the ones with all the correct solutions

[pineapple stu]

Win tonight and we are still in contention for 2nd plae
Beating the Faroes will not suddenly mean we're in contention for second place given the last two performances.

[IsMiseSean]

The media pressure is barbaric, pure Brit-influenced c rap from watching Sky Sports for too long. The man's done well, I don't agree with some of the tactics and some of the team selections but he got us to a major tournament and within an inch of another from a very low starting point. A win tonight and we're pretty much where we expected to be after three games. Get the Dunney Monster back for Stockholm in March and grab a 1-1 and off we go! To challenge Sweden for second would be an achievement in itself this time round I feel. I know there is much more detailed analysis of his performance being ignored here, and I know the counter arguments to what I have said, but I don't care...overall he's done a good job and that cartoon thing a few pages back is idiotic. It might only be a little joke but it's not funny as it has no substance whatsoever.

I like the team for tonight too, well under the circumstances. Brady and Wilson for Cox and Ward makes plenty of sense. If only we could strengthen the centre a bit.


I agree with most of what you say. The media have been pure ignorant for the last few days.
Trap done what was asked of him and in very difficult circumstances after Stan's chaos. He should be applauded for that, I don't think there is many other managers out there that would have been able to get so close to a WC and then qualify for the Euros.

I think he's time is up though, it's just a shame it's happening this way.

[Murfinator]

22 qualifying matches with 2 defeats
Qualified for playoffs twice
Qualified for our first major tournament in 10 years and our first Euros in 24 years
Overshot our seeding in both qualifying campaigns
Increased our FIFA ranking through his tenure significantly
All while operating with the weakest Irish squad in about 20 years.


I'll just say that if we sack this man we'll be the laughing stock of the world. The animosity against him in the current position is exactly why we have the worst fanbase out there, simply disgraceful. I'm embarrassed by some of the gutter tabloid nonsense said around here.
While I can respect somebody saying that trap's tenure was successful but it's run its course and time to move on, there are literally people who believe Trap's tenure was poor and that his appointment was a mistake. We have an admin on this board today proclaiming that the selection team who got him should be hung for their transgressions, it'd be comedy gold if this wasn't my country.

[Charlie Darwin]

We just need personality to beat the Faroes tonight.
Our mentalitee is strong.


22 qualifying matches with 2 defeats
Qualified for playoffs twice
Qualified for our first major tournament in 10 years and our first Euros in 24 years
Overshot our seeding in both qualifying campaigns
Increased our FIFA ranking through his tenure significantly
All while operating with the weakest Irish squad in about 20 years.


I'll just say that if we sack this man we'll be the laughing stock of the world. The animosity against him in the current position is exactly why we have the worst fanbase out there, simply disgraceful. I'm embarrassed by some of the gutter tabloid nonsense said around here.
While I can respect somebody saying that trap's tenure was successful but it's run its course and time to move on, there are literally people who believe Trap's tenure was poor and that his appointment was a mistake. We have an admin on this board today proclaiming that the selection team who got him should be hung for their transgressions, it'd be comedy gold if this wasn't my country.
I could hardly be described as a member of the Trap Out Brigade but even I've lost faith in him. His record in terms of results is very good, or at least was until the Euros, but it's clear at this stage that this is a side on a very steep decline unless there are big changes.

[Spudulika]

What is most disgusting in all of this is how the meeja are hunting like a pack, there is no independent thinker - though I will give an exception to Vincent Hogan who, I believe, wrote a balanced and decent article today. If you say something often enough it then becomes true. INM are behaving like scum in this respect and I hate to say that I've actually started to "take" the Times, or actually not read Irish newspapers online at all. It is all backslapping, drinking buddies and no end of agenda from each one involved. This was set in motion a long, long time ago and these people who largely ignore domestic football, are pushing the lie that removing the manager and his crew will mean something good for football in Ireland. Murfinator has it right, I had to listen today to a local clown sneer about how Ireland are just minnows now, that even our media say so. This is the same gobsheen who blew up (with the connivance of Irish journos at the Olympics) a non-existent row between Katie Taylor and her Russian opponent. The Irish meeja lapped it up, regardless of the extra pressure it put on our own fighter, and it was all a lie to begin with - but when did that ever get in the way of Fleet Street/Irish journos.