Nathan Collins D Brentford b.2001

[SkStu]

Struggling against Man City and Haaland today so far it has to be said. Static and beaten to the ball by Haaland for their opener and very lucky not to have a penalty called against him for a challenge on Grealish in the box.

But of course as soon as I hit post :D he makes a superb clearance off the line. A smart decision.

[paul_oshea]

He didn't even jump. He's hard to work out if he's just not good enough or inconsistent

[SkStu]

He didn't even jump. He's hard to work out if he's just not good enough or inconsistent

He’s definitely good enough. It’s more of what PC said about Haaland and the strength of Man City in general. That goal came through a pass and a cross in about a second they moved it so quick.

He’s 21 and will just get better and better for the next few years. Could see him move to a team like City at some point. He’s got what it takes.

[Eirambler]

He didn't even jump. He's hard to work out if he's just not good enough or inconsistent

I'd say neither to be honest. He's just running the defence of a team that's being overpowered. Only so much he can do. Grealish made an absolute mean of what was very light contact for the pen claim.

[paul_oshea]

Ya I'll reserve judgement for now, I haven't seen enough full games at wolves to judge but for Ireland he's been pretty good if a bit wayward. Hopefully that's the learning of him being a young fella.

Dare I say it but if we find one more young lad in the middle and we could have the makings of a very good team. A team that can actually play football not just wants to

[ontheotherhand]

Ya I'll reserve judgement for now, I haven't seen enough full games at wolves to judge but for Ireland he's been pretty good if a bit wayward. Hopefully that's the learning of him being a young fella.

Dare I say it but if we find one more young lad in the middle and we could have the makings of a very good team. A team that can actually play football not just wants to

So he might be on somewhat of a learning curve Paul?

[ifk101]

Nathan Collins 6

The scoreline would have been much worse had it not been for Collins. He made two vital clearances from underneath his own crossbar in the first half and was the pick of the Wolves defence.

https://www.birminghammail.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/wolves-player-ratings-vs-man-26043434

I think that's a fair, if brief, assessment of his performance. Should be doing better for the first goal, wasn't a penalty imo, but otherwise his team's man of the match imo.

[TonyD]

O’Leary’s situation was somewhat self-inflicted. Did he Not turn up ( was it in Iceland ) for some match early in Big Jack’s reign and Big Jack never seemed to forget that. O’Leary may have refused the call up rather than just Not turned up.

Charlton left him out of the original squad for a short summer tour. O’Leary went and booked a family holiday. A run of injuries led to Charlton calling him up last minute, but he declined, saying he had already booked his holiday. To be honest it was a flag of convenience for Charlton to blame subsequent omissions on the issue. He never wanted O’Leary in the team, preferring the more basic attributes of McCarthy and Moran. If it had been a player he wanted it would have been a different story. He only started to call O’Leary up to squads when he was running out of options, and rarely put him in the team if he had a choice.

On Nathan Collins, I think he’s a gem, and is going to be one of our most important players for the foreseeable future. Future captain I’m guessing too.

[Kingdom]

I'm biased because I've a vested interest in Collins, some here would be aware of it. I've seen him since 15 and I'm a huge fan. I've seen nothing to concern me greatly in the past 6 months to think that his trajectory isn't going to keep going up. I think he's probably a bit weak going towards his own goal - or better way of putting it he's got some work to do - and while he's not slow, he's not the speediest without the ball either. When you're playing in weak teams failing in defensive duties, everyone suffers and everyone is prone to messing up - either because of the dirge around you, or because of the uncertainty around you. You're almost second guessing what your teammates are going to do (or more inappropriately, what they aren't going to do).

For me, I'd have him in the centre of a 3, particularly when he's so adept at taking the ball out of defence and into traffic. Also, from an Irish perspective, if the ball breaks down while he's moved into the next phase of play, it's better if he's that middle cog, rather than the right cog. I'd have Andy RCB, Nathan CB and Dara LCB going forward. I love John Egan to bits, and he's a super option from set-pieces in the opposition box, but he's made a few mistakes in the last 6 months for Ireland.

Nathan is absolutely a future captain for us. I've said that I see him in the CL in the next 3 years (probably 2 its so long since I said it :-) ) and not necessarily in England either.

[Eirambler]

I agree actually, I think he's doing fine overall. Would be better if he didn't end up with another relegation on his CV, but then that didn't do Aaron Ramsdale any harm.

I think it's too soon to put the three young lads together and drop Egan though. I'm not sure Omobamidele is quite there just yet, though he's another promising talent. I'd keep Egan along with Collins and O'Shea for now.

[joey B]

Benched for Craig Dawson today….

[SkStu]

Who scores Wolves second in a 2-0 lead against Liverpool.

[ontheotherhand]

Not ideal that our two breakout EPL level hopefuls are either dropped or probably would be dropped if a better option was available. Bazunu and Collins are not having the best starts to life at that level but they have time on their side. There shouldn't be so much pressure on a pair of lads who are 21 and 20 but that's where we are.

[Olé Olé]

Not ideal that our two breakout EPL level hopefuls are either dropped or probably would be dropped if a better option was available. Bazunu and Collins are not having the best starts to life at that level but they have time on their side. There shouldn't be so much pressure on a pair of lads who are 21 and 20 but that's where we are.

Yeah, the pair of them are finished. Collins won't get another game this season. And Bazunu shouldn't. At least Wolves saw sense to sign Dawson to replace Collins for good. Southampton on the other hand.. what are they thinking?

[ontheotherhand]

Yeah, the pair of them are finished. Collins won't get another game this season. And Bazunu shouldn't. At least Wolves saw sense to sign Dawson to replace Collins for good. Southampton on the other hand.. what are they thinking?

Yeah that's exactly what I said.

They'll bounce back. To be honest I wish Bazunu had someone to fight for the jersey with. He's very young to be in the firing line week in week out. Collins battling it out with Dawson will be good for him. If that's how their manager sees it obviously. He's talking about rotating more which would also be fine.

[CraftyToePoke]

They'll bounce back. To be honest I wish Bazunu had someone to fight for the jersey with. He's very young to be in the firing line week in week out. Collins battling it out with Dawson will be good for him. If that's how their manager sees it obviously. He's talking about rotating more which would also be fine.

I'd agree, Wolves bringing in a bit of nous is good even if short term Collins watches a few matches as the last thing he needs is another relegation, one can happen two is just careless ;) but Southampton bringing in Jones is a real head shaker & looks like putting a relegation on Bazunus CV. He cracked under it at Stoke & he cracked again at the weekend in the post match. Tough time for both but all our emerging underage lads have had realities to deal with & will again, they remain good players.

[CraftyToePoke]

Yeah, the pair of them are finished. Collins won't get another game this season. And Bazunu shouldn't. At least Wolves saw sense to sign Dawson to replace Collins for good. Southampton on the other hand.. what are they thinking?

Wow. WTF. Bit triggery there Ole maybe ?
OTOH offerd a pretty fair assessment IMO, surely. Both players ( & the clubs who spent on them ) hoped to be in better shape than they currently are. Nothing wrong with pointing that out at all.

[Olé Olé]

Wow. WTF. Bit triggery there Ole maybe ?
OTOH offerd a pretty fair assessment IMO, surely. Both players ( & the clubs who spent on them ) hoped to be in better shape than they currently are. Nothing wrong with pointing that out at all.

Relax. It was a joke.

I probably agree re Bazunu but Collins has had some very good games and it remains to be seen whether he has been dropped or rotated I feel.

Either way, there are very few centre halves and goalkeepers their age in the Premiership playing as many games as they have, not to mind playing and performing in a consistent manner. And both lads have been very good for Ireland. Whatever fortunes they have this season at club level probably won't impact them for Ireland and will probably serve them well in the future.

[ifk101]

He did well against Man City so odd he was left out for Liverpool. Going to be difficult to get back in as Dawson had a good game against Liverpool and Wolves aren't changing a winning team unless forced, especially with games against fellow relegation candidates coming up.

[texidub]

I thought Dawson caused panic with a sloppy pass at one point. In fairness, it was the type of pass Collins is capable of too, but it made me think that there isn't much between them.

[pineapple stu]

Benched again yesterday for the trip to Southampton. Bit concerning now I think - certainly bad timing with the Latvia/France games coming up. That goal in Lviv feels a whlie back now.

[MancIrishWolf]

He’ll come good. Think Dawson coming in will be good for him. He’s looked imperious in parts and then unnecessarily sloppy in others. Dawson is a seasoned centre-half who will give him someone to learn from, whilst giving him some healthy competition and allow him to get out of the firing line when out of form. Kilman made a few mistakes yesterday - with some fans calling for him to come back in. He’s been taught a lesson by both Kane and Haaland this season (as you’d expect for a young lad), so a bit of tuition by an old pro will see him truly fulfil his potential.

[paul_oshea]

What will be good for him is playing games. All other talk is nonsense.

[MancIrishWolf]

Great idea, Paul. Best to concentrate on the short term! In that case let’s throw him in at the deep end and watch his confidence get shot to ****e from an unforgiving crowd in the most competitive league in the world, whilst learning from an ex-non league player with relatively little more experience than him and continue to make unnecessary errors. Why not even loan him back to the championship, based upon that logic, for him to develop? I’m sure he’ll prosper.

Alternatively, rather than bed wetting we could have faith in his ability in the long term and merely see his brief absence as a learning curve in which when the opportunity arises, which it should do shortly, he needs to be at the top of his game, cut out stupid errors and learn increasingly from those around him, such as Dawson and Lopetegui in training. Exactly like O’Shea did when he was dropped at the expense of more experienced players, before going on to become Captain.

[elatedscum]

Am I wrong to not really rate Craig Dawson? I've never really paid close attention to him but I always saw him as a journeyman - and I would have instinctively picked Duffy and Egan over him - but maybe I've underrated a decent defender

[MancIrishWolf]

In all honesty, he went under the radar with me also, however West Ham fans love him and has looked good so far… https://www.kumb.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=178850&sid=da89263e70bba2766930b9af9f200d1b&start=1180 Remember Keith Curle teaching Lescott the tricks of the trade, who was prone to similar lapses, when he started out, so could be a good role model.

[Razors left peg]

Great idea, Paul. Best to concentrate on the short term! In that case let’s throw him in at the deep end and watch his confidence get shot to ****e from an unforgiving crowd in the most competitive league in the world, whilst learning from an ex-non league player with relatively little more experience than him and continue to make unnecessary errors. Why not even loan him back to the championship, based upon that logic, for him to develop? I’m sure he’ll prosper.

Alternatively, rather than bed wetting we could have faith in his ability in the long term and merely see his brief absence as a learning curve in which when the opportunity arises, which it should do shortly, he needs to be at the top of his game, cut out stupid errors and learn increasingly from those around him, such as Dawson and Lopetegui in training. Exactly like O’Shea did when he was dropped at the expense of more experienced players, before going on to become Captain.

I seem to remember a time on here that there was a post of the month award or something.... Id bring it back just for this post alone!

[paul_oshea]

Great idea, Paul. Best to concentrate on the short term! In that case let’s throw him in at the deep end and watch his confidence get shot to ****e from an unforgiving crowd in the most competitive league in the world, whilst learning from an ex-non league player with relatively little more experience than him and continue to make unnecessary errors. Why not even loan him back to the championship, based upon that logic, for him to develop? I’m sure he’ll prosper.

Alternatively, rather than bed wetting we could have faith in his ability in the long term and merely see his brief absence as a learning curve in which when the opportunity arises, which it should do shortly, he needs to be at the top of his game, cut out stupid errors and learn increasingly from those around him, such as Dawson and Lopetegui in training. Exactly like O’Shea did when he was dropped at the expense of more experienced players, before going on to become Captain.

I was away for a week or so there on a bit of a holiday, I thought this post might make a bit more sense a week later. But no it doesnt. Tbh I'd to google Dawsons career really cos I could only remember the time at West Ham. Since Collins has been dropped theyve lost 2/3 so a strange one really. And then you tried to compare it to O'shea being dropped at a PL side winning side with a World cup Winner in their ranks. Some serious Green tinted BS spin on this site from usual suspects but wasn't expecting the same from you. Being dropped for a PL/Championship career CB is not going to give him confidence and he's not going to learn much from him either.

We can hope the poor run of results since hes dropped sees him back in but wouldnt be too confident of that.

[CSAD]

Someone really must have put a gun to Lopetugi’s head telling him to play Dawson no matter what. I don’t really see any other logic.

[MancIrishWolf]

Funny that, as you were active enough on YBIG that night and the following week making friends?

Have neither the time or the patience to get embroiled in a petty argument, so will make this my last words on the matter:

1) Collins confidence was already shot and he was making unnecessary mistakes, including getting taught a lesson on movement and marking in the preceding game by Man City - he’s been taken out of the limelight temporarily, possibly as a lesson until he gets the opportunity again, which I’m sure he’ll seize, giving the management the opportunity to work with him in training in the interim.

2) Dawson will play his 250th Premier League game on Saturday in his 11th PL season (only one in the last 10 years has been in the Championship), so definitely more the former than the latter. In his first game we kept a clean sheet against Liverpool (something the mighty Real Madrid couldn’t last night). He’s a player who has come from the lower leagues to mature into an established and experienced centre half in the top flight (see West Ham link). Like Babb with McGrath, Collins will learn from him, especially when he eventually gets his opportunity to play alongside him.

3) All the best Players and Sportsmen have to overcome adversity - from Messi, Maradona to Muhammad Ali - it’s what makes them stronger for the future. Competition is good for Collins. Success can’t be seen as a formality.

4) When have West Brom ever had a World Cup winner in their ranks? I was referring to Dara.

It’s Ash Wednesday, on this auspicious day and as with Collins, Keep the Faith!

[paul_oshea]

Sorry I thought you meant Captaining Ireland. I thought you were on about JOSH.

[elatedscum]

No minutes on the pitch for Collins for February. Not great for a young lad with that much potential who is still developing.

I might view it slightly differently if he were in a top 6 club where the players around him and the quality of training might take him up a level but genuinely think, even with his flaws, he’s a level above his teammates.

Wolves are playing again on Wednesday which is the first time they’ve had 2 games in a week since Dawson signed. Outside chance that might lead to Collins playing, either against Liverpool (Wednesday) or Spurs (Saturday).

Probably the best opportunity he’ll have to play before the international break, unless there’s an injury to Dawson or Kilman.

[Exgrad]

He's been dropped becasue his perfomances havent been at the required level, how he bounces back from this is part of his development.

[pineapple stu]

On as a half-time sub in the 1-0 win over Spurs yesterday, his first game in six weeks. One of two subs at half-time and Wolves were much better in the second half by all accounts. How much of that was down to Collins or if it's enough for him to start next week is another question, but good to see at least.

[irishfan86]

On as a half-time sub in the 1-0 win over Spurs yesterday, his first game in six weeks. One of two subs at half-time and Wolves were much better in the second half by all accounts. How much of that was down to Collins or if it's enough for him to start next week is another question, but good to see at least.

Got praise from his manager:

"I want to mention Nathan Collins, who did not play the last matches, but he was ready when I looked to him,” said the Wolves boss, as the win lifted his side to 13th.

“In the last matches, we have made the changes with good intentions, and they didn’t work, but today they worked. We have played against one of the best teams in the Premier League. It’s important to keep going, we have a lot of points ahead to get.”

Source: https://m.independent.ie/sport/soccer/udinese-boss-lauds-festy-ebosele-after-full-serie-a-debut-nine-months-after-joining-the-club-42370617.html

[SkStu]

Gets a start today. His first since the end of January.

[pineapple stu]

Seems to have had a tough afternoon today; 5-0 defeat against Arsenal. Hopefully the new season gives a fresh start; has been a disappointing few months for him lately

[Stuttgart88]

The whole team was just overrun. Wolves looked like they were already on holidays. Hard to fault Collins in that performance.

[joey B]

Brentford rumoured to be interested,could be a decent move,they seem a more settled club than Wolves at present….

[Diggs246]

Brentford rumoured to be interested,could be a decent move,they seem a more settled club than Wolves at present….

He is too good to panic and move so quickly
He can and I think will win his place back with wolves

[JR89]

Brentford rumoured to be interested,could be a decent move,they seem a more settled club than Wolves at present….

Rumours getting stronger

1671562975528747031

[Razors left peg]

I still think Id rather him stay at Wolves, but if it means he plays every week next season then it might not be a bad move. Brentford are a well run club

[JR89]

Some rumours that Spurs have been keeping an eye on Kilman but can't see them selling both. If financial issues that some Wolves fans are talking about are behind some of the sales then Kilman would make more sense than Collins when taking FFP into it. They'll only be making a few mill profit on Collins whereas Kilman came in on a free I think.

[Trequartista20]

Brentford finished 18 points ahead of Wolves, and a point behind Spurs, two behind a very impressive Unai Emery-managed Villa and three behind an excellent and much-praised Brighton.

So, on the face of it, this move looks like a step up from a Wolves side that struggled for much of last season. The question is can Brentford maintain that form into next season and beyond. I suspect much will depend on whether they can hang onto Thomas Frank.

Whatever, the most important thing for us is that Collins manages to secure more regular game time. Only 19 league starts last season and only two of those after January.

[JR89]

If they do spend the £25m that Wolves want it will likely be a club record. Current record is £22m they just spent on Kevin Schade though there's probably clauses include that make it more.

[Demesne Lad]

"Collins could leave Molineux this summer in a deal that would help Wolves stay the right side of Financial Fair Play regulations and potentially also provide money for new signings. Wolves are believed to be asking for £25m for the 22 year old who joined them from Burnley for £20.5m last summer. Brentford have reportedly had a £21m bid rejected and the Athletic reports they have also inquired about Crystal Palace defender Joachim Andersen only to be told he is not available." (Birmingham Mail, 28 June)

https://www.birminghammail.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/wolves-transfer-news-collins-brentford-27213502

[elatedscum]

interesting - if they sold him for 25m - they make 4.5m profit which can be used this year. plus 4.1m amortised from last year. so overall 8.6m up.

that would allow them to spend up to 43m on players (if players all got 5 year deals like Collins did) and be in the same situation as they were before the window began.

saying that, if they sold Kilman for the same fee (his original price must have been somewhere in the six figure mark), they could spend 125m in the same way - which would actually allow you to do good business...

saying that, they already got 47m for Neves - which really should give them 235m to work with. sounds more like it's a cumulative losses issue which is catching up to them quickly

[joey B]

Nottingham Forest reported to be intrested in Collins aswell.

[zero]

Looks like the Brentford deal is going through, £23m mentioned as the fee but TBC.

[nigel-harps1954]

Sky Sports reporting a £23m fee has been agreed. Good move for him.

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