The John Delaney Thread

[Stuttgart88]

I dunno, I think there is a general truth in GR's post. Some "rebel" songs are more politically charged than others. Songs referencing The Troubles era are likely to be more sensitive than the good old romantic idealistic days of the Irish independence movement. As a rule of thumb I think it's acurate enough although obviously passing judgment on a song's potential to offend can't be rule driven. The Town I Loved So Well is a Troubles era song and as far as I know (I don't really know the words) it couldn't really offend anybody. Danny?

Tets, sorry, but isn't debate on the political-ness and possible offensiveness of certain songs relevant to appraisal of JD's behaviour?

[Gather round]

Lads, there's a current affairs forum if you want to discuss the affiliation of various Irish folk songs, let's keep the discussion on Delaney here, ok?

I've no problem which forum you choose to allocate various discussions to, but this is hair-splitting and a bit silly. My point was all about Delaney: if the present sh*t-storm was just about obvious incompetence, drunkenness, ludicrous press statements and inability to sell tickets fairly or nobble the media, he'd have resigned or been forced out years ago.


Think you might be over-thinking this one. I'd make one broad distinction, between the period when the British state was habitually murdering Irish people and the period after. So Joe McDonnell is fair game, Pearse McAuley not so much

No, I was just drawing a straightforward distinction to simplify things, as I said. It's all subjective, of course. For me, McDonnell and any gobsh*te lauding him are fair game from a different point of view: they intimidated me out of home and primary school while habitually murdering Irish people.

[ArdeeBhoy]

Yeah, but we all knew that decades ago. It's hardly news or even worth saying...

Especially when it's done to claim the moral high ground.

As for JD it wouldn't matter if he'd sung 'The Fields' or 'Go On Home', the man's a fool not for his singing (which was rank) but his general behaviour, especially given what's common knowledge.

[GypsyBlackCat]

That's got to be some of the most patronising claptrap ever;We're not American tourists...



Except we can't all go on there, so a bit of a pointless assertion...

But he's right. Songs like 'God Save Ireland' or 'A Nation Once Again' wouldn't and shouldn't be class a Republican ballads as they came from a different era and circumstances. A song like 'The Town I Loved So Well' is a Troubles era song but it's not Republican it's about someone talking about the impact the Troubles have on their town. Joe McDonnell is seen as a terrorist to some people. So people do feel songs like that are bad taste as they support a man involved in a terrorist organisation who killed four people innocent people.

To get back on track, regardless of his sing song, any other CEO of a football association would have been sacked long before now if they had Delaney's record. Not given a massive six year contract. I posted a list of problems that most Irish football fans have will John the Baptist on a Sunderland forum and people were laughing that a man like that is charge of anything nevermind the CEO of FAI!

The way he has acted this week is the most sickening!

[DannyInvincible]

Just for the record, here's a graph of our FIFA ranking since recording began in 1993 (thanks Coca-Cola®!).

http://i218.photobucket.com/albums/cc12/poguemahone85/ranking_zps47b3c2e0.png

The point at which Delaney became chief executive of the FAI is marked with the red dot; December of 2004. At the time, the national team was ranked 12th, its highest ever position outside of the very early years prior to mid-1995. From October of 2001, we hadn't dropped outside of the top twenty, but that all changed in 2005 and, by November of that year, we had plummeted to 49th. We have since fallen as low as 70th and currently sit in 61st. We peaked again at 18th in April of 2012, but, more than anything, it looks like it was a short-lived deviation from a general decline.

The national team is the FAI's cash-cow and Delaney likes to put it to the forefront. It's supposed to be his success story given the disproportionate level of attention he devotes to it. It's anything but. If the decline had been as a result of taking a hit you might expect from a diversion of funds towards investment in a sustainable model of development (that might also have involved improving the general footballing structure within Ireland), you could forgive him, but he's instead been throwing money at high-profile managers (and assistants) in the hope they'll be able to paper over the cracks and glaring deficiencies of his reign.

[DannyInvincible]

Was thinking last night, it's unlikely that last week was the first time Delaney has sung that song, or any other rebel tune for that matter, and probably equally as unlikely that it's the first time he's been recorded doing so.
Is the recent bad will towards him, with the Scotland tickets fiasco and the heavy handed approach from stewards at the USA game, the reason this recording in particular was made public? Like Richard Keys and Andy Grey before him, will more recordings surface in the coming days?

I would agree with you, definitely. He's said he has often sung the song himself and stated he's from a republican background where the rebel sing-song is tradition. There's nothing even remotely wrong with that, but I reckon the media sense he's there for the taking. He's down and ripe for a kicking, so it's a case of latching on to anything that can cause further damage. (I won't complain.) If he didn't have baggage already, I doubt there'd even have been an issue made of the sing-song, because it's really not that big of a deal in isolation. The outrage towards the particular song is amusing in itself. I mean, he's been video-recorded in plenty of potentially-embarrassing situations or where he's making an idiot of himself before, but little was made of those recordings; people just laughed at his foolishness then. Now, though, the knives are out.

I wonder what he'll be singing in the next video... :eek:

[ArdeeBhoy]

It'll be all part of a 'rebranding' exercise, so "Ireland's Call" probably, now that really is offensive!

[DannyInvincible]

I dunno, I think there is a general truth in GR's post. Some "rebel" songs are more politically charged than others. Songs referencing The Troubles era are likely to be more sensitive than the good old romantic idealistic days of the Irish independence movement. As a rule of thumb I think it's acurate enough although obviously passing judgment on a song's potential to offend can't be rule driven. The Town I Loved So Well is a Troubles era song and as far as I know (I don't really know the words) it couldn't really offend anybody. Danny?

You're right. Each song should be judged on its own merits (or lack thereof). 'The Town I Loved So Well' is a pretty neutral Troubles-era ballad; definitely not a rebel song or anything of the sort. Not even the serially offended could find fault with it. It laments both "the armoured cars and the bombed-out bars". It was written by Phil Coulter (son of a Catholic RUC officer) and has even been recorded by the telegenic and universally-safe Irish Tenors.

[DannyInvincible]

It'll be all part of a 'rebranding' exercise, so "Ireland's Call" probably, now that really is offensive!

That's a Phil Coulter one too, of course.

[DeLorean]

Each song should be judged on its own merits

I just pictured Johnny Giles as an X Factor judge.

[DannyInvincible]

For me, McDonnell and any gobsh*te lauding him are fair game from a different point of view: they intimidated me out of home and primary school while habitually murdering Irish people.

You've got a point, fair enough, but do you really think Delaney is advocating sectarianism/intimidation or lauding militant republicanism by singing a rebel ballad in the pub of a leafy Dublin suburb? I think he's just trying to be "one of the lads", and not doing a very good job of that either.

[DannyInvincible]

I just pictured Johnny Giles as an X Factor judge.

Something for after the RTÉ gig is up, without doubt.

[Gather round]

You've got a point, fair enough, but do you really think Delaney is advocating sectarianism/intimidation or lauding militant republicanism by singing a rebel ballad in the pub of a leafy Dublin suburb? I think he's just trying to be "one of the lads", and not doing a very good job of that either

I imagine his interest in/ knowledge of McDonnell's career is roughly the same of the England fans at Celtic Park the other day, ie fcuk all. But he's not a dumb teenager, so aye to the latter at least.

What has suburban leafiness got to do with it. Are you an Irishtown estate agent?

[ArdeeBhoy]

Given what he'd probably been indulging in, we should be grateful for small mercies...

[DeLorean]

What has suburban leafiness got to do with it. Are you an Irishtown estate agent?

Come on GR, you know it paints a more harmless picture. If he had been singing in a run down alleyway in an unnamed part of town, broken glass on the ground, graffiti on the walls and a flagon of Linden Village in his hand, he'd clearly be a more hardcore sympathiser. The logic is flawed, however, as this time of year leaves are fairly scarce. :)

[tetsujin1979]

Lads, there's a current affairs forum if you want to discuss the affiliation of various Irish folk songs, let's keep the discussion on Delaney here, ok?
To clarify this, I'm not taking potshots at anyone in particular. The discusson on Joe McDonnell as sung by Delaney is fine, if you want to debate The Sash VS The Fields (or whatever tune) please move it to the current affairs forum

[ArdeeBhoy]

Yeah, but we can't all go on there...

Plus at least one person is exaggerating a good bit in this thread for 'effect'.

[DannyInvincible]

What has suburban leafiness got to do with it. Are you an Irishtown estate agent?

Haha, I mean it was bluster. Dublin 4 isn't the hardest of militant republican heartlands now. If he'd been stirring up emotions in the Felons in west Belfast, the context would be very different.

[tetsujin1979]

What has suburban leafiness got to do with it. Are you an Irishtown estate agent?
The area around Aviva stadium is usually referred to euphemistically as "leafy suburbs" by various broadsheets. Knowing Danny, it was probably tongue in cheek.

[tetsujin1979]

Yeah, but we can't all go on there...

Plus at least one person is exaggerating a good bit in this thread for 'effect'.
PM sent

[ArdeeBhoy]

Replied...

[ArdeeBhoy]

Meanwhile, back in the surreal world...
http://www.wsc.co.uk/forum-index/27-football/986674-a-new-front-in-the-war-on-terrorism-sinn-fein

[DannyInvincible]

I've been looking through a few John Delaney (drunk) videos on YouTube. Many of them are comical (strictly in a "laughing at" rather than a "laughing with" sense), but I still think this is my favourite:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GZ_pMX_MvGM

[DannyInvincible]

Meanwhile, back in the surreal world...
http://www.wsc.co.uk/forum-index/27-football/986674-a-new-front-in-the-war-on-terrorism-sinn-fein

I'll just pluck this comment out of the pack there and post it here:


I think the Freestaters are over-reacting a little. Is singing a Daniel O'Donnell cover really that bad?

You have to guess who... :p

[ArdeeBhoy]

Don't encourage him...

Plus there's more than a whiff of hypocrisy about the whole thing.

[bennocelt]

Wasn't it just a few posters in a John Delaney thread on YBIG? I'm not sure what its nature was exactly, but the whole thread was promptly deleted and a number of posters decided to make a donation to a charity of Emma English's choosing as a means of apology, as far as I know. The Irish Mirror (I think) was reporting there was abuse directed towards her on Twitter and Facebook, but I'm not even sure that was the case. Unpalatable stuff from a few pseudonymous unsavouries, certainly, but it's so obviously being slyly exploited by Delaney as a means to distract from genuine criticism. It's completely irrelevant to the clumsy sing-song matter and other concerns arising or outstanding regarding Delaney's fitness to run and represent the FAI in a professional and discerning manner, so it's frustrating to see it being used to help sweep genuine questions and potential ammunition for change under the carpet.

.

I dont mind admitting i sent her a few tweets, not anything nasty, but from her page its obvious John the Baptist uses it as a defacto twitter account for himself, since he has no account or fbook page, and with the constant barrage in the Indo I think its fair game tbh

[OwlsFan]

2199

The wolves gather around the victim. Will it escape?

[The Fly]

The CEO of the Spanish FA and the Italian FA get €150,000 each. That's €250,000 extra a year Delaney gets! Why?

Because this is Ireland. Duh!

[DannyInvincible]

2199

The wolves gather around the victim.

The victim? That buffalo has a considerable amount of power. What was he doing anyway to get himself into such a precarious situation? Advertising himself to the pack in broad daylight on a snowy white plain? You'd have to think of him as rather foolish. He'd have been better searching for a drink in a more secluded spot.


Will it escape?

Probably. He'll live on another few years yet.

[tetsujin1979]

I dont mind admitting i sent her a few tweets, not anything nasty, but from her page its obvious John the Baptist uses it as a defacto twitter account for himself, since he has no account or fbook page, and with the constant barrage in the Indo I think its fair game tbh
Nasty or not, are you proud of that? Whatever about Delaney, the woman has done nothing wrong yet she's being judged as culpable as her partner for what's gone on over the last few weeks
Have a look down through the list of messages she's received over the last few days here: https://twitter.com/search?q=to%3AEmmaKEnglish
Again, this woman has done nothing wrong, and certainly nothing that deserves some of those comments

[DannyInvincible]

I dont mind admitting i sent her a few tweets, not anything nasty, but from her page its obvious John the Baptist uses it as a defacto twitter account for himself, since he has no account or fbook page, and with the constant barrage in the Indo I think its fair game tbh

Well, just tweets are fine. She's on Twitter, after all, and is, like St. John, more than happy to publicise herself and their relationship (in spite of her talk of it being a private thing). In fact, I see she's been really promoting his case since: https://twitter.com/EmmakEnglish

Abuse is a different matter entirely though.

I understand those who posted the abuse on YBIG were also banned by a moderator immediately.

[tetsujin1979]

irrelevant posts on nationalist and loyalist songs moved to the current affairs forum here - http://foot.ie/threads/196215-Debate-on-nationalist-and-loyalist-anthems
Continue the debate there if you want

This is the third time I've posted this in the last few hours - discussion on Delaney singing Joe McDonnell, and its repercussions, in this thread is fine. Debate on the genre of nationalist and loyalist songs is not

I won't make a fourth warning.

[bennocelt]

Nasty or not, are you proud of that? Whatever about Delaney, the woman has done nothing wrong yet she's being judged as culpable as her partner for what's gone on over the last few weeks
Have a look down through the list of messages she's received over the last few days here: https://twitter.com/search?q=to%3AEmmaKEnglish
Again, this woman has done nothing wrong, and certainly nothing that deserves some of those comments

Nothing abusive, but if the head of football in the country hides away from any serious debate with fans of the game then so be it. Even series journalists find it hard to nail him down these days.
Cant on the one hand court the media etc and on the other cry when it comes back and bites you on the ass. The faux outrage is nauseating. I thought he was a die hard republican

[Charlie Darwin]

Nothing abusive, but if the head of football in the country hides away from any serious debate with fans of the game then so be it. Even series journalists find it hard to nail him down these days.
Cant on the one hand court the media etc and on the other cry when it comes back and bites you on the ass. The faux outrage is nauseating. I thought he was a die hard republican
What's the point messaging his girlfriend though?

[bennocelt]

What's the point messaging his girlfriend though?

He uses that account

[Charlie Darwin]

Ah would you go away? It's clearly her and he just likes talking about him. Delaney couldn't operate a bloody calculator let alone a twitter account.

[DeLorean]

We're going to need to know what you said Benno :)

[DannyInvincible]

Nasty or not, are you proud of that? Whatever about Delaney, the woman has done nothing wrong yet she's being judged as culpable as her partner for what's gone on over the last few weeks
Have a look down through the list of messages she's received over the last few days here: https://twitter.com/search?q=to%3AEmmaKEnglish
Again, this woman has done nothing wrong, and certainly nothing that deserves some of those comments

I can see one of a personal nature (https://twitter.com/BrendanDonaghy/status/535472515251183616) (not abusive but mildly intrusive with a hint of boorish humour possibly) and another (for the attention of Delaney, most likely) featuring a photo of a few fans holding up a "DELANEY OUT" banner (https://twitter.com/eirerobbie/status/534804119848898560), but I can't see much else in terms of tweets relating to Delaney or from Ireland fans, and nothing explicitly abusive. Am I blind?

If the profile was being used as a mouthpiece for the promotion of Delaney and his professional business, or possibly by Delaney himself, then it's only inevitable it would draw attention and possible reaction from disgruntled Ireland fans. I can't confirm whether or not it has been used in such a way as I've not been following, or whether the tweets to the profile, if there were others, were warranted or unprovoked, although bennocelt seems to suggest the profile has been used in such a way. Can you point out the tweets you think were published by Delaney or what makes you think he uses it, bennocelt? She does seem to be involving herself in the public debate now, mind.

Nevertheless, anything abusive, directed at her private life or of a personally-demeaning nature is most certainly out of order.

[DannyInvincible]

We're going to need to know what you said Benno :)

I second that. :p

[Crosby87]

She needs a thicker skin imho.

Who do you chaps think will win Cowboys Eagles today? I should be plenty liquored up for that one.

[DannyInvincible]

She needs a thicker skin imho.

Well, she was referred to in pretty nasty terms on YBIG. You can't condone that or try to blame her "lack of thick skin" for any insult taken.

At the same time though, I don't think the abuse was deserving of the exposure Delaney wanted to give it. It wasn't newsworthy. It was a few now-banned idiots posting cretinous stuff under the protection of their pseudonyms. The material was promptly deleted, a charitable donation was offered by YBIG in apology and nobody in the outside world would have known about it at all had Delaney not brought up the matter - an irrelevancy - on the radio with Pat Kenny.

[BonnieShels]

The Eagles. Cowboys have been brittle when in the limelight this year.

[BonnieShels]

My thoughts were published. But the President then issued another statement last night of course rendering my thoughts "old hat"-ish. Needless to say I have to write up the latest.

http://www.krank.ie/category/opinions/john-delaney-joe-mcdonnell-saga/

[bennocelt]

I second that. :p

Ha ha now now
Nothing personal, I'm not that stupid. As Danny has showed, just re-tweeting photos and stuff like that.

I havent a clue what she normally gets upto on her feed, but type in JD on a quiet day and you can see a lot of gruff from her feed. There was even a tweet highlighting all the good work JD does with a few photos of him down in Mayo with the Mayo League for example. I mean thats not the kind of rubbish an Indo socialite tweets about, or am I wrong!

I dont know who the CEO of the Gaa or Rubgy is these days, never mind who they are going out with! Which says a lot IMHO

[GypsyBlackCat]

Well, just tweets are fine. She's on Twitter, after all, and is, like St. John, more than happy to publicise herself and their relationship (in spite of her talk of it being a private thing). In fact, I see she's been really promoting his case since: https://twitter.com/EmmakEnglish

Abuse is a different matter entirely though.

I understand those who posted the abuse on YBIG were also banned by a moderator immediately.

The best thing for her do is to quit Twitter until this thing blows over. She's tweeting stuff about the whole thing and making it worse!

That GeorgeBestLookalike is one of the many reason to avoid Twitter. #TeamDelaney.:eek:

[DannyInvincible]

My thoughts were published. But the President then issued another statement last night of course rendering my thoughts "old hat"-ish. Needless to say I have to write up the latest.

http://www.krank.ie/category/opinions/john-delaney-joe-mcdonnell-saga/

Good summation. I still can't get over the gall of him throwing false legal threats at the Guardian and the Telegraph. What was he thinking?

[BonnieShels]

Cheers. I am currently writing up a new follow up and whilst looking for the statemet I found the new Fan Direct scheme. Even that seems ham-fisted as a solution. http://www.fai.ie/ireland/news/fans-direct-applications-open

[TheOneWhoKnocks]

I couldn't be arsed looking back over this thread and deciphering <MOD EDIT>content deleted. Educate yourself about the debate before you join it</MOD EDIT>

I heard the faithful on YBIG have been putting their feet in it again. Then again..... we are talking about the same standard of people that created and commented in a "Is Stephen Kelly black or white?" thread.

[tetsujin1979]

I can see one of a personal nature (not abusive but mildly intrusive with a hint of boorish humour possibly) and another (for the attention of Delaney, most likely) featuring a photo of a few fans holding up a "DELANEY OUT" banner, but I can't see much else in terms of tweets relating to Delaney or from Ireland fans, and nothing explicitly abusive. Am I blind?Apologies, I didn't see them, I was going on newspaper reports, some of the language there is pretty abusive and totally undeserved. I didn't see the posts on YBIG either.


Ha ha now now
Nothing personal, I'm not that stupid. As Danny has showed, just re-tweeting photos and stuff like that.I'd still be curious to see what was "retweeted and stuff like that". You really should stand beside what you post online


I havent a clue what she normally gets upto on her feed, but type in JD on a quiet day and you can see a lot of gruff from her feed. There was even a tweet highlighting all the good work JD does with a few photos of him down in Mayo with the Mayo League for example. I mean thats not the kind of rubbish an Indo socialite tweets about, or am I wrong!

I dont know who the CEO of the Gaa or Rubgy is these days, never mind who they are going out with! Which says a lot IMHOProbably not, but it's the sort of thing a girlfriend would post about her partner fairly regularly. I had a look through her page, and I didn't see any evidence that Delaney does use it as his own account

[TheOneWhoKnocks]

I know the cliffnotes version of it. I know that someone who is supposed to represent us, and routinely makes a fool of himself, on foreign trips was caught red handed singing sectarian songs.

The Irish national team has Protestant fans too. It is embarrassing that a man of his stature is marginalising them like this.

His girlfriend/wife deserves better than the vitriol she is getting on that site but it is par for the course there, unfortunately.