Group D - opponent watch!

[DannyInvincible]

Funnily enough, the harder we tried to score, the luckier we got... To paraphrase Ralph Waldo Emerson: shallow men believe in luck; strong men believe in cause and effect. :)

[paul_oshea]

I wasn't denying that there wasn't any skill, in fact I think there was lots of skill involved, and it was a quality goal, but I think the luck element comes in that we pulled it all off and with such perfect accuracy for each individual bit of skill, for had we not, it wouldn't have been a goal. It's not like something they would have been practicsing every day in training and as said not something that they would be able to repeat again and again. The luck is the fact that out of 10 chances at that, you were only likely to score 1 from 10, when everything came off perfect, we were lucky in that it all came off perfect.

Its not luck like the hoolahan deflected/rebound/off the crossbar Gibraltar goal :)

Also meant to add to the top post, that the saves forde made bar the one where he spread himself very well are all saves I'd expect a keeper to make. Kroos' goal was right in the corner and I don't think many(or even any) kieeper would save it, but forde could have boiled the kettle and made the tea, stamped the envelope and delivered it by the time he got down for the goal. He is so slow and cumbersome getting down low and fast at a stretch. I think this was a problem with the sweden goal, and I think we will have 1 more in this campaign also.

[jbyrne]

it was a quality goal, but I think the luck element comes in that we pulled it all off and with such perfect accuracy for each individual bit of skill, for had we not, it wouldn't have been a goal.

we didn't though. Hoolahans cross was poor. Hendricks intervention turned it into something

[DannyInvincible]

I wasn't denying that there wasn't any skill, in fact I think there was lots of skill involved, and it was a quality goal, but I think the luck element comes in that we pulled it all off and with such perfect accuracy for each individual bit of skill, for had we not, it wouldn't have been a goal. It's not like something they would have been practicsing every day in training and as said not something that they would be able to repeat again and again. The luck is the fact that out of 10 chances at that, you were only likely to score 1 from 10, when everything came off perfect, we were lucky in that it all came off perfect.

It didn't all come off perfect though. Hoolahan over-hit his cross and Hendrick did brilliantly to salvage it. And they're footballers; they practice playing football every day of their lives so they can engineer and deal with situations of a similar nature to this. It was a goal created by our own strengths (and weaknesses); not by some volatile or flighty notion of luck.

[paul_oshea]

The thing is though, if his cross hadn't gone where it was we more than likely wouldnt have anyone to get on the end of it he was well outside the box, down close to the touchline near the 18 yard line mark and it was behind everyone, even if he hadn't overhit it! Mcgeady taking the ball into the corner, dragging the two players into him, who were stupid enough to double team and leave Hoolahan free, but ya Hendrick turned it into something, so did Mcgeady, so did hoolahan and O'Sheas finish was sublime.

[Charlie Darwin]

So, basically, what you're saying is that it's down to pure luck that players like McGeady, Hendrick and O'Shea perfectly pulled off the skills they have spent years practising?

[paul_oshea]

Oshea has spent years practising scoring from the outside of his right boot into the far corner for years? I would have thought he would have been practising clearing the ball the opposite direction!

[Charlie Darwin]

Yes, Paul, that's exactly what I meant.

[DeLorean]

In fairness, Paul is probably right in what he is saying. The only difficulty I would have with it is that you could probably apply it to every goal ever scored, in one way or another.

[paul_oshea]

Ya it could also be argued that the ball over the top by hoolahan had luck because the fact it was so bad a ball and to the back it pulled out the other central defender which gave oshea space to run into and time to get in front of hummels.

I know what you are saying but lots of well worked goals wouldnt fit in that, we have seen kroos score goals like that before, and we have seen them score goals where they missed the one that Kingdom described so well, mazing runs all over the place and then a through ball in behind wilson and ward.

[Stuttgart88]

In fairness, Paul is probably right in what he is saying. The only difficulty I would have with it is that you could probably apply it to every goal ever scored, in one way or another.

Exactly. Ask James Rodriguez to hit that volley against Uruguay again. One out of ten attempts again, maybe? It doesn't make it lucky though. It makes it excellent.

And I think Paul is being harsh on Forde. If he does his job well he deserves credit. He did his job well and set the tone for the rest of the team at times. If he had been nervy the defence would have been nervy, but he was solid and convincing. Solid foundations and all that. I don't think he was particularly slow down for the shot. I can see Paul's point but by those standards credit is only due when he is exceptionally good and that's too demanding. I know from being a keeper that defenders really appreciate a keeper being safe. Anything else is a bonus.

I thought Chesney was slow slown for Maloney's shot in Warsaw mind you. The look on his face as the ball evaded his fingers tells me he thought so himself too.

[paul_oshea]

He scored another smash mid week against canadia.

No, I can't say he was nervy and I can't say he did badly, he did as well as those around him doing well by keeping us in the game, but thats what you expect from a keeper, to keep the ball out, keep the team in the game, keep the team from conceding, and keep those kinda attempts out of the goal. Which he did. He was solid and i was happy for him, but when the goal went in, looking straight down you could see he was positioned reasonably well, but he got nowhere near it, even if kroos shot was a foot to the right he was too slow to get down and too far away.

[DeLorean]

We were very lucky he didn't do this....


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yYcbwiAr-xM

[Stuttgart88]

I still don't see how it's lucky that an overhit cross was turned back into a dangerous area by an exquisite piece of skill by Hendrick and an equally exquisite piece of finishing by O'Shea put the ball in the net. When the going got tough the tough got going. When Jamie Donaldson needed a great shot in the Ryder Cup he played one. That's quality, not luck.

Now, if the point was that the margin for error was about as fine as possible then I'd agree. Two bits of brilliant skill with one second left of the match - that doesn't happen very often, especially to us!

[BonnieShels]

There was 50secs left. A nice looooong celebration.
Well done ref. Just like the All Ireland Final in 2011.

[geysir]

If Hoolahan had lobbed it perfectly, it would have been cleared by a defender..... fact!!

[Stuttgart88]

Rumour has it a mini-triangular tournament involving a Pole, a Scot and an Irishman was played out in a trendy part of Glasgow in the last day or two. I'm sure AB has more meat to add to the bone.

Sorry Tets, it is a fact that there was an incident, but the rumour relates to the identity of the protagonists, and no names are mentioned here.

This is pure speculation but I think it had something to do with disagreement over the respective people's national teams' relative performances against Germany and whether luck played a part in the outcome.

[ArdeeBhoy]

All that sounds pretty far fetched. Knowing Glasgow they were just all pished. Though most footballers tell me/us they can only handle 2-3 drinks before they 'lose it'.

[DannyInvincible]

Gibraltar will play the remainder of their home games in Faro: http://www.rte.ie/sport/soccer/international/2014/1028/655332-gibraltar-qualifier-confirmed-for-faro/


Gibraltar have confirmed that next September's home Euro 2016 qualifier with the Republic of Ireland will be played in Faro, Portugal, quashing speculation that the game would be moved to London.

The Gibraltar FA revealed problems it had with using the Estadio do Algarve in Portugal have been addressed and said it is now committed to playing all games in the group in the stadium.

“The two issues of concern regarding the continued use of the Estadio do Algarve have now been resolved to the GFA’s satisfaction," a statement read.

“Concerns over VAT and other tax issues have been resolved following discussions with the Portuguese FA, Portuguese tax authorities and UEFA.

“Concerns over security arrangements have also been resolved after the GFA contracted a new security company to deal with security at the stadium on match-days.

“The new company performed satisfactorily during the recent match versus Georgia and the feedback received by the GFA from our supporters was very positive in that respect.

“Furthermore, the GFA had also received representations from the German, Irish and Scottish FAs on behalf of German, Irish and Scottish fans who had already booked flights and made accommodation arrangements in Portugal. The GFA will now provide those FAs with assurances that the matches will take place in Portugal.

“Given all these considerations, the GFA is content to continue using the Estadio do Algarve as our ‘home’ stadium, until such time as there is a stadium in Gibraltar which meets with UEFA’s approval for the hosting of competitive international matches.”

[Charlie Darwin]

Wasn't the idea of moving the games a non-runner to begin with?

[geysir]

For a second, Danny's intro read as, Gibraltar will play the remainder of their home games in Faroe.

[DeLorean]

You have to laugh (http://balls.ie/football/156613-lukas-podolski-twitter-abuse/)

[geysir]

I just fired up the computer to watch georgia v poland when the first thing i see is a replay of Poland's goal, to go 1 up, just how unlucky can you get.
And to top it all, the georgian goalie spilled the ball to allow the tap in.

[Closed Account]

The Georgians have yet to have a shot on target.

Edit: 2-0 Poland now.

[geysir]

At last Poland get a decent goal, lovely finish to the top corner from just outside the box, 3 nil

[Charlie Darwin]

Shoulda known the Georgians wouldn't do us a favour. Look at their flag for god's sake.

[geysir]

Poland were fortunate we softened them up, we are the pioneers.

[TheOneWhoKnocks]

Kamil Glik is out of the game in Dublin after getting booked with Poland in the ascendancy.

[tricky_colour]

German 1 Gibraltar 0 Müller 12 didn't have to do much for the goal mind you they said the same about Walters.

[pineapple stu]

3-0 Germany now; an hour gone.

Worth noting we were 7-0 up at this stage.

I think the spread was Germany -10

[Colbert Report]

Germany -8.5 -148 before the match

[tricky_colour]

Germany -8.5 -148 before the match

What does that mean?

[tricky_colour]

If we can win our next two matches at home to scotland and poland we will be doing fine.

However that is a massive If given todays result.

[tetsujin1979]

What does that mean?
you'd have to bet €148 to win €1 on Germany to score less than 8 and a half goals

[geysir]

If we can win our next two matches at home to scotland and poland we will be doing fine.

However that is a massive If given todays result.
Why the conditional? the result has happened.

[tricky_colour]

you'd have to bet €148 to win €1 on Germany to score less than 8 and a half goals

That is just crazy, nobody sane would take up that offer.

A reasonable offer would be to a £1 return on a £1 if Germany score 8.5 or more goals.

[tricky_colour]

Why the conditional? the result has happened.


The IF refers to the next two home games, the conditional is there because after
todays defeat winning the next two game is far from certain, indeed it is
into the realms of 'somewhat unlikely', or 'not a cat in hells chance'.

[geysir]

Okay, just insert a (fxckin) comma next time to radically effect the emphasis :)

[tricky_colour]

Okay, just insert a (fxckin) comma next time to radically effect the emphasis :)

Actually i did think about a comma

However that is a massive If, given todays result.

But I don't think there should be one there.

[elroy]

Have we any lads suspended for the next game?

[TheOneWhoKnocks]

No. Whelan, Walters & Wilson were on bookings and Walters sadly didn't get carded yesterday so he will get his token 90 minutes again in March.

[BonnieShels]

Is Walters now your new bete noir?

[Stuttgart88]

Is Walters now your new bete noir?
It would seem that way.

I can see the point somewhat. I thought Walters worked his socks off on Friday and really put in an impressive shift - for his type of player. He went short, he went alongside Long, he fought, scrapped, put himself about and was genuinely a bit of a nuisance for Scotland. Championship centre backs like Hanley can cope with "a bit of a nuisance" though.

However, his selection in Georgia betrayed a lack of trust by O'Neill in better footballers. To O'Neill's subsequent credit he admitted afterwards that he had paid Georgia too much respect. I think Walters' selection in Germany was justified to bolster a right flank missing Coleman and occupied by a rookie full back.

But despite putting in a ball-breaking effort on Friday, and in my opinion doing better than Long, he is not a "get the ball down and play it" footballer. Scotland had Naismith, we do have Hoolahan when he's fit. Maybe McGeady, McGoldrick and Brady too. Didn't Brady finish last season playing off a forward at Hull?

Brian Kerr called it right in the Times. Walters doesn't have the skill or the instinct to play between the lines effectively, his selection dictates that we play a physical brand of football. My gripe wouldn't be with Walters per se, but rather what his selection signifies in terms of how we approach a game.

[paul_oshea]

You have answered your own question in the first line of the last paragraph, physical play was exactly what we needed Friday to match Scotland given how we played and lined up, so you need Walters in there. He worked very hard and was definitely one of our best performers. It's an ill of O'Neills selection and game plan rather than Walters ability and performance itself.

[Stuttgart88]

I didn't ask a question! Other than where Brady played last season...

But I think we agree: Walters played very well, but in a role that suited the Scots and at the expense of a player better able to link midfield to attack. Yes? My point, and Kerr's is that it was a mistake to rely on physicality to get the better of Championship defenders who can cope with the physical stuff, but would find it harder to cope with clever football. Although he did his job well it was of no great benefit to the overall performance.

[back of the net]

Currently :

Spain 0 Germany 0

Poland 2 Switzerland 1

Scotland 0 England 2


All games well into second halves

[elroy]

Poles had Zyro sent off

Any chance that will mean a suspension?

[back of the net]

Poles had Zyro sent off

Any chance that will mean a suspension?


Not sure tbh - don't think it does


Full times

Poland 2 Switzerland 2

Spain 0 Germany 1

Big win for Germany....cud it be the result to kick them back into Gear


Scotland still losing 2-0 to England (10 mins left)

[geysir]

Poles had Zyro sent off

Any chance that will mean a suspension?
I'd say he'll be suspended from the next friendly.

Good work by England, bravo.

[DannyInvincible]

No. Whelan, Walters & Wilson were on bookings and Walters sadly didn't get carded yesterday so he will get his token 90 minutes again in March.

To what exactly would a Walters 90 minutes in March be a token gesture?... :confused: