FAI Investigate Alleged Racist Abuse Of Zayed [Archive] - Page 9

SkStu

09/07/2011, 4:01 PM

But if there's no corroborating evidence then it's just one man's word over another and any positive ruling from the FAI would have serious legal implications.

most trials are one persons word against another. In cases where it is one persons word against another (e.g. rape) other evidence (including things such as believability and character) can lead to a court finding someone guilty. No legal implications whatsoever provided the FAI investigation is conducted fairly and properly.

Well what I mean is that the FAI is (in a sense) a media organisation and they have no more a right than the Evening Herald to make definitive judgements based on two people's contrasting stories.

no way CD. Do you really believe that?!

willing to concede on that point now CD? :p

dfx-

09/07/2011, 4:22 PM

FFS Rovers fans, forgetting about whatever was said or not said for a second, instead of acting put out by all this and coming across as vindicated and victimised, you need to ask yourselves the tough questions like what is the value of having a complete scuzzball like Chris Turner (whose moral fibre is non-existent) at your club and being banned for 3 important games of the season.

Time to get real lads and start asking the right questions. Who is going to step up within your ranks and be that person?

Oh Please :rolleyes:

http://www.sondrakistan.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/06/Helen_Lovejoy.jpg

Moral fibre, value of a player scoring winners in semifinals etc..if you weren't such a Bohs fan, I'd be questioning had you taken the wrong tablets today, Sk :)

dcfc_1928

09/07/2011, 4:29 PM

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RovF1zsDoeM

SkStu

09/07/2011, 4:41 PM

Oh Please :rolleyes:

http://www.sondrakistan.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/06/Helen_Lovejoy.jpg

Moral fibre, value of a player scoring winners in semifinals etc..if you weren't such a Bohs fan, I'd be questioning had you taken the wrong tablets today, Sk :)

"Carry On... Regardless" Rovers fans.. I dont give a sh!t.

Frame my post whatever way you want to make yourself feel better but they are the questions you should be asking yourselves today.

Charlie Darwin

09/07/2011, 5:06 PM

willing to concede on that point now CD? :p
Well I think the verdict fits with what I was saying: the FAI couldn't get enough evidence to rule he'd made a racist comment but did decide he said something less serious. I have no idea how the hearing actually went down: it could have been that Zayed said Turner called him X and Turner replied that he actually said Y, and the FAI punished him for saying Y.

Algebra.

dfx-

09/07/2011, 5:16 PM

Frame my post whatever way you want to make yourself feel better but they are the questions you should be asking yourselves today.

Spare the moral fibre tripe. The questions being asked about Turner will be whether he's good enough to start ahead of Rice McCormack Finn or O'Donnell. He'll be judged on the pitch.

sullanefc

09/07/2011, 5:34 PM

FFS Rovers fans, forgetting about whatever was said or not said for a second, instead of acting put out by all this and coming across as vindicated and victimised, you need to ask yourselves the tough questions like what is the value of having a complete scuzzball like Chris Turner (whose moral fibre is non-existent) at your club and being banned for 3 important games of the season.

Time to get real lads and start asking the right questions. Who is going to step up within your ranks and be that person?
Good post. It is obvious at this stage that Shamrock (Management/Players/Fans etc) can do no wrong in the eyes of Shamrock fans. Even the most odious of behavior will be defended by them and they will then profess to be the "model club".

Spare the moral fibre tripe. The questions being asked about Turner will be whether he's good enough to start ahead of Rice McCormack Finn or O'Donnell. He'll be judged on the pitch.
It comes as no surprise to myself (and probably the majority on here) that morals are a long way down the list on Shamrock's priorities.

nzamcdza

09/07/2011, 5:49 PM

Glad to see that Turner was found guilty of the racist abuse. It came as no surprise once we heard who it was who made the comments. They guy is a complete scumbag and I would hate to have him at my club.

Only sad thing is that it is only 3 games. If Rovers had any class they would have some sort of internal punishment on top of the FAI one but I wouldnt hold my breath.

HulaHoop

09/07/2011, 5:49 PM

Only one party found guilty of racial abuse yet there isn't a word about them from the usual suspects on here, the focus is entirely on Shamrock Rovers. Funny that but not surprising.

HulaHoop

09/07/2011, 5:54 PM

Glad to see that Turner was found guilty of the racist abuse.

He hasn't been found guilty of racist abust, he's been found guilty of saying something offensive to Zayed that wasn't construed to be racist by the disciplinary committee of the FAI. That's the fact no matter how much you don't want it to be true.

DannyInvincible

09/07/2011, 5:54 PM

It comes as no surprise to myself (and probably the majority on here) that morals are a long way down the list on Shamrock's priorities.

I think you're getting mixed up, sullane. Nobody claimed Rovers were the moral club; everyone knows Rovers are the model club.

dfx-

09/07/2011, 5:55 PM

Glad to see that Turner was found guilty of the racist abuse. It came as no surprise once we heard who it was who made the comments.

Except he wasn't..

Hibs4Ever

09/07/2011, 6:10 PM

What did you think about St Pats fans being found guilty of racist abuse?

I think the ONE fan who done it, even though he came forward the next day admitting it, should definitely be further punished by the club

Jicked

09/07/2011, 6:16 PM

I think the ONE fan who done it, even though he came forward the next day admitting it, should definitely be further punished by the club

ONE fan? The FAI clearly stated it was a (albeit small) number of supporters?

Hibs4Ever

09/07/2011, 6:23 PM

ONE fan? The FAI clearly stated it was a (albeit small) number of supporters?

Yep, it was one fan. The FAI also clearly state that in the recent racism allegations made by Zayed, Turner has been found guilty and recieved a ban. Do you think SRFC should take further action for the embarrassment he's caused your club?

Charlie Darwin

09/07/2011, 6:27 PM

The FAI should have just released a short statement saying: "Believe whatever you want."

Jicked

09/07/2011, 6:27 PM

Why did the FAI say there was multiple fans involved?

Terrific bit of wording there to make it seem like he's been found guilty of making racist comments. But no, I don't think we should take further actions, despite SkStu's fantastic post on the previous page.

bluewhitearmy

09/07/2011, 6:30 PM

I think the ONE fan who done it, even though he came forward the next day admitting it, should definitely be further punished by the club

Id find ONE fan racially abusing someone worse then ONE player saying something offensive.

Most people were telling Rovers fans to wait and see what came from the investigation before calling Zayed a liar now that the investigation has said that Turners comment whatever he said was not racist they are ignoring it.

dfx-

09/07/2011, 6:31 PM

Unsurprising to see Shams fans defending the scumbag. Player and club are a perfect match

Defending him against what exactly?

sundance kid

09/07/2011, 6:37 PM

I'd say Turner is a relieved man that it was an offensive comment and not a racist comment he got banned for. Jason McGuinness has said that the punishment of having to sign for Sligo because of his indiscretion was too high a price to pay.

R�iteoir

09/07/2011, 7:27 PM

SkStu

09/07/2011, 7:31 PM

Well I think the verdict fits with what I was saying: the FAI couldn't get enough evidence to rule he'd made a racist comment but did decide he said something less serious. I have no idea how the hearing actually went down: it could have been that Zayed said Turner called him X and Turner replied that he actually said Y, and the FAI punished him for saying Y.

Algebra.

Well no, it doesnt fit in any way with what you were saying. You said they couldnt make a decision based on one persons word against another. They did. If we go on your version of events, they believed Turners version ahead of Zayeds version. If we go with another approach, namely, the comments to Zayed were not technically racist but were "offensive", they also believe one word over another though didnt agree with the characterisation of those words.

R�iteoir

09/07/2011, 7:34 PM

To quote PC Paul McInally of Charing Cross Police Station in the Mark Thomas docu about the SOCPA Laws and what constitutes offensive comments:

"One man's **** is another man's crap is another man's poo"

Charlie Darwin

09/07/2011, 7:42 PM

Well no, it doesnt fit in any way with what you were saying. You said they couldnt make a decision based on one persons word against another. They did. If we go on your version of events, they believed Turners version ahead of Zayeds version. If we go with another approach, namely, the comments to Zayed were not technically racist but were "offensive", they also believe one word over another though didnt agree with the characterisation of those words.
I said they couldn't brand him a racist based on one man's word and they didn't. Of course they can make minor disciplinary decisions based on a lower standard of evidence.

dfx-

09/07/2011, 8:07 PM

I clearly said that Rovers fans should be questioning the wisdom or value of having a well documented racist, bigotted scumbag at their club instead of worrying about defending his "honour". He clearly made comments serious enough to warrant a 3 match ban. Those comments were racially motivated or, at best, borderline racist. Is this the sort of player that Rovers fans want to support or defend? Your collective answer is a resounding yes. Fair enough.

Care to explain those statements?

Could you not have explained it in a letter to SARI (R�iteoir will have the address) who could pass it on to the FAI disciplinary panel so the punishment would've been suitably altered and action could be taken. It is clearly information that you have that they didn't.

HulaHoop

09/07/2011, 8:14 PM

thats not what my fantastic post said though Jicked. Please point out to me where i called for further action to be take. I clearly said that Rovers fans should be questioning the wisdom or value of having a well documented racist, bigotted scumbag at their club instead of worrying about defending his "honour". He clearly made comments serious enough to warrant a 3 match ban. Those comments were racially motivated or, at best, borderline racist. Is this the sort of player that Rovers fans want to support or defend? Your collective answer is a resounding yes. Fair enough.

The bits in bold Stu. Where are you plucking them from? Do you know Turner personally to label him a racist bigotted scumbag? He's been cleared of being a racist by an independent disciplinary panel, if he was a bigot would he be playing for Shamrock Rovers with all these catholic irishmen? If he was such a bigot would he (a protestant Rangers fan) be friends and share banter with someone like Gary Twigg (a Catholic Celtic supporting Glasweigian)?

As for your claim that his comments "were racially motivated or, at best, borderline racist" well how do you know, were you there? The FAI have cleared him of saying anything racist and I don't believe whatever he said to him was racially motivated either. In the 15 minutes Turner was on the pitch the only time I seen them near each other was when Zayed dived over Turner's leg near the sideline earning himself a free kick and Turner an undeserved yellow card. If Turner then turned around and said something offensive to Zayed it was motivated by Zayed getting Turner booked not from the colour of Zayed's skin or his ethnicity.

DannyInvincible

09/07/2011, 8:16 PM

Nah Nah Nah Nah

09/07/2011, 8:30 PM

Never seen a club welcome a 3 game ban

Ezeikial

09/07/2011, 8:45 PM

For what it's worth I think if Turner had've been found guilty of racism he should've got a 10 match ban.

Your claim would have had a lot more credibility if you had made this call BEFORE the ruling was known

Ezeikial

09/07/2011, 9:02 PM

The club statement is astonishing.

It celebrates that the abuse was not established as racist as though this is some form of vindcation of the club and player.

Shamrock Rovers does not condone any form of abuse, racial or otherwise, and has strict policies in place to deal any such activity, if it were to occur.

What are these strict policies? How will Turner be dealt with now by the club as a consequence of his abusive behaviour?

While the committee ruled that Chris Turner made an offensive comment to Eamon Zayed, for which he received a three match ban, it did not find that this was racist in nature. In fact, the committee imposed the ban under a separate rule, one which does not cover racist behaviour

Although the statement acknowledges the ruling and the ban, the absense of any acceptance that this abuse occured speaks volumes.

Rovers may not condone this sort of behaviour, but they certainly don't condemn it either!

wexfordned

09/07/2011, 9:40 PM

Jason McGuiness holds his hands up & admits straight away he made a stupid comment & gets 5 game ban.

Chris Turner denies it, is found guilty & gets only a 3 game ban. What a joke.

Typical of the "model club" in their response to the matter. Head in the sand & deny everything.

They have shown by their comments/actions on the matter the club's standard of conduct is so low they could parachute out of a snake's arse.

Jicked

09/07/2011, 9:46 PM

This is classic stuff, keep it coming guys. Some of the outrage is absolutely priceless.

Fair play to Pats though, have they got this guy in as a spin doctor?

http://images1.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20091212153039/thethickofit/images/4/4f/Tucker.jpg

kdjaC

09/07/2011, 9:52 PM

Whatever Turner said was in the heat of a game.

"Gaddafis love child"

dfx-

09/07/2011, 9:54 PM

This is classic stuff, keep it coming guys. Some of the outrage is absolutely priceless.

Fair play to Pats though, have they got this guy in as a spin doctor?

In my 6 years on foot.ie, I haven't read make-it-up and refuse-to-read-the-verdictism to compare with today.

And that's a lot of outrage and make-it-upness in that time..

HulaHoop

09/07/2011, 10:01 PM

"Gaddafis love child"

Are you sure it wasn't "shoe bomber", "paki", "camel jockey", Libyan c**t or any of the other internet rumours that claimed this was what he definitely said?

Have to endorse what jicked said above. Some of the stuff here today is priceless. KOH - Keep on Hating lads :)

DannyInvincible

09/07/2011, 10:09 PM

In my 6 years on foot.ie, I haven't read make-it-up and refuse-to-read-the-verdictism to compare with today.

And that's a lot of outrage and make-it-upness in that time..

The club's statement is bizarre, is all, in light of the fact that one of their players has just been found guilty of offensive/abusive behaviour and been handed a three-match ban. The statement strangely celebrates that as some sort of vindication of the player and you'd be forgiven for thinking that Turner was cleared of any wrongdoing by the tone of it, save for a relatively brief addendum at the end. I just think that's odd. Whatever about people getting outraged - I'm not getting all het up about it - but you'd nearly wonder did Rovers read the verdict?

dfx-

09/07/2011, 10:55 PM

Ezeikial

09/07/2011, 11:29 PM

Perhaps given some people's inability to figure out the punishment is for offensive comments not racism (many many examples in this thread all day of people not getting this), perhaps it is needed to highlight it. I'd consider the clearance of racism charges more important to stress than the punishment for offensive comments.

Your point is not at all unreasonable and I have no difficulty with the Rovers statement (or any poster here) clarifying that Turner was sanctioned for offensive or abusive behaviour as opposed to racist abuse.

The absense of any inkling that this behaviour is regarded as unacceptable by Shamrock Rovers is the kernal of the problem.
The statement waffles on how "Shamrock Rovers does not condone any form of abuse, racial or otherwise, and has strict policies in place to deal any such activity, if it were to occur", but does not acknowledge that it did occur or what these "strict policies" are or how they will be applied to Turner by the club.

It smacks of denial!

Lim till i die

10/07/2011, 12:25 AM

"Gaddafis love child"

If this is true Eamon Zayed needs to toughen up in a major way.

Petty to even make an issue of it to be honest.

colinf

10/07/2011, 2:27 AM

mypost

10/07/2011, 5:01 AM

The statement strangely celebrates that as some sort of vindication of the player and you'd be forgiven for thinking that Turner was cleared of any wrongdoing by the tone of it, save for a relatively brief addendum at the end. I just think that's odd.

What would you like? A statement in Font 72 Capitals?

The club, fans, and player were found not to engage in racist behaviour. That clears that issue up.

The punishment is bizarre, and sets a weird precedent, in what comments are constituted as "offensive behaviour"? If refs are called "fn sht" on the pitch, is that worthy of a 3 game ban? If a Corkonian brands his Dub marker as a "jackeen bastrd", is that worthy of a 3 game ban?

Strange.

Cuyahoga

10/07/2011, 9:29 AM

Never seen a club welcome a 3 game ban
What really annoys the Sligo fans is that they are the only club to have a proven racist player - Jason mc guinness . The news of Turner's exoneration of racist comments took away from sligo's win against drogheda last night. I think some of the sligo posters on this site would have swapped their team losing last night for Turner getting the same outcome as Mc Guinness. Shows what a sad bunch of fans Sligo are that they hate Shamrock Rovers more than they love their own club.

sundance kid

10/07/2011, 9:30 AM

born2bwild

10/07/2011, 9:54 AM

What would you like? A statement in Font 72 Capitals?

The club, fans, and player were found not to engage in racist behaviour. That clears that issue up.

The punishment is bizarre, and sets a weird precedent, in what comments are constituted as "offensive behaviour"? If refs are called "fn sht" on the pitch, is that worthy of a 3 game ban? If a Corkonian brands his Dub marker as a "jackeen bastrd", is that worthy of a 3 game ban?

Strange.
If the punishment is for 'offensive behaviour' then it is truly bizarre. Every single football match in the entire known universe, past, present and future involves players swearing at one another. Can you imagine the chaos if such punishment became the standard response to players making offensive comments?

Basically it's a fudge. What could they do, though?

Option 1: Not punish Turner at all. Zayed then becomes a pariah for squealing like a little pansy on a fellow player. There's uproar and accusations of FAI reach arounds for the model club.

Option 2: Punish Turner for racism. Turner becomes a pariah for being a racist scumbag. The league (and its shiny golden model club) is exposed as the KKK kickabout club.

This way, there's face saving all round: damage has been minimised for both clubs, both players, and most important of all, the league.

All in all, not a bad recovery by the FAI.

Nah Nah Nah Nah

10/07/2011, 10:17 AM

What really annoys the Sligo fans is that they are the only club to have a proven racist player - Jason mc guinness . The news of Turner's exoneration of racist comments took away from sligo's win against drogheda last night. I think some of the sligo posters on this site would have swapped their team losing last night for Turner getting the same outcome as Mc Guinness. Shows what a sad bunch of fans Sligo are that they hate Shamrock Rovers more than they love their own club.

That is possibly the greatest load of rubbish I have ever heard but sure you keep thinking that anyways.

hoopy

10/07/2011, 10:32 AM

I think most people know that whatever way this turned out it was still a great opportunity for the usual suspects from the usual clubs to try to get a dig in at Rovers. That a fact so we move on. I always smile when I hear of how the great Jason McGuinness held his hands up and admitted what he did. What a man. Of course it had abosolutely nothing to do with the fact that the ref heard what he said. Of course not. That bit always seems to get lost in translation. If it makes people that bit happier to get over all their petty jealousy's of our club to always think Rovers are wrong no matter what then by all means do. I have no particular liking for Chris Turner, but he WASNT found guilty of racist behaviour and that a fact, even though it doesn't fit into some sad, petty people's agendas. Of course when he played for Bohs and Sligo the same people who moan on here wouldn't say a bad word about him then. He was a choirboy back then of course. That's life.

Spudulika

10/07/2011, 12:03 PM

As with off-field financial funny business, on field poor behaviour and general stupidity, our own club is always better than others, and there will always be other clubs we'd like to use whatever we can to get a dig in. The situation was investigated, statements given and a judgement made. Just keep your head down in case it's your own club that has a numpty spouting crap, because we'd all like for an investigation to come to a relatively decent conclusion.

Charlie Darwin

10/07/2011, 12:08 PM

I don't know if anyone's mentioned this, but Shamrock Rovers actively recruit racists because it fits in with our worldview as a club.

shellyriver

10/07/2011, 12:35 PM

Seriously, take a chill pill. Nobody in Sligo cares about Turner -- barring the fact that generally the believe is he got a decent start in LOI of football here, when Cook agreed to sign him, he wanted to do a runner with up-front money. You're welcome to him. Like your welcome to Mccabe. We have others from Tallaghtfornia doing a great job in Sligo. Bit-a-Red are simply focussed on winning the league -- of course we love getting one over Shams, but we had been on the right side of results long enough.

I do think Zayed tried to get Turner in the s****e -- both of them are prats, imo. The whole thing was a storm in a tea cup.

Funny enough McGuinness will be playing along side the French Mercenary! Ironic or what!