Unemployment

[dahamsta]

Read the article.

Of course they won't all be approved for the dole. But how many will -- half, two-thirds?

adam

[pete]

Responding to queries from this paper, the department said there were 16,941 jobseeker’s benefit claims and 20,982 jobseeker’s allowance claims — a total of 37,923 — awaiting decision. The department could not estimate how many of these claims would ultimately prove successful.

Benefit should be fairly easy to determine if entitled. You either have the PRSI contributions or you do not. Allowance could take longer as this might be means tested? Would guess these are people trying to enter the jobs market or could be construction self employed unemployed.

I presume the department could have estimated the number of successful claims if they wanted to based on historical data.

[mypost]

Should be merged with the "unemployment" thread, imo.

Would well believe those figures. With the amount of bureaucracy involved, it can take anything from 10 days to 6 weeks for the application to be processed, and in the local office where I'm based, there is only the telephone available for out of office assistance,which 99% of the time is unanswered. In 2008, there is no answerphone, no fax, and no e-mail facilities available to speed up the process. :rolleyes::mad:

[dahamsta]

Sorry about that, I knew it belonged somewhere but didn't look far down enough.

[Newryrep]

Two possible rays of hope (very, very thin rays mind):
1) Oil price falling back which should impact inflation growth
.

Oil rose yesterday up $16 dollars a barrel and likely to rise further due to US uncertainity and if there is a pick up then an increase in demand. donald ducked either way. I had been holding off in the hope that heating oil will come down

[Dodge]

Would well believe those figures. With the amount of bureaucracy involved, it can take anything from 10 days to 6 weeks for the application to be processed, and in the local office where I'm based, there is only the telephone available for out of office assistance,which 99% of the time is unanswered. In 2008, there is no answerphone, no fax, and no e-mail facilities available to speed up the process. :rolleyes::mad:

The only answer is to employ more staff. Which the government won't allow.

[OneRedArmy]

Oil rose yesterday up $16 dollars a barrel and likely to rise further due to US uncertainity and if there is a pick up then an increase in demand. donald ducked either way. I had been holding off in the hope that heating oil will come downYesterdays rise was due to speculators having to unwind positions before a futures delivery date.

Agree though that future prognosis is unclear, at best, on both the demand and supply side.

[mypost]

The only answer is to employ more staff. Which the government won't allow.

It doesn't need more staff to provide an answerphone service, or e-mail/fax facilities for correspondance purposes. This is not a recent development, this farcical situation has been going on for as long as I can remember.

It's 2008 now, there should be some form of outside assistance available.

[mypost]

What Ireland were these guys living in for the past 12 months?:confused:

http://www.rte.ie/news/2008/1030/economy.html

We are long since above 5% unemployment, and the rate may go up as far as 9% by the end of next year, with the amount of jobs lost every month.

[pete]

Mr Cowen said that we have to change the economic paradigm and policies, but that this cannot be done if people oppose every cut that is proposed.


He is correct about this. No point complaining about cuts unless you can propose an alternative.



Mr Cowen said that 10% of Government spending this year has to be borrowed and this is not sustainable.


Really? 10% increase in spending while GNP is actually decreasing. :rolleyes:

The National Pay Deal is already irrelevant. Surprising to hear talk from some unions about opposing it even though all the leaders back it as the only option.

[dahamsta]

Heh, the photo on that RTE article makes Biffo look like he's trying to big it up to the Dail Massive. :)

http://dynimg.rte.ie/0001c11010dr.jpg

You're absolutely right pete, but this has to have been one of the worst budgets from a political standpoint in Irish history. You just don't make cutbacks in health, and politicians should know this given that it's the subject that comes up time and time again on the doorstep*. Even if the health service is a floundering mess with massive overemployment and incomptence at middle management level - hmmm, sounds familiar - you don't make cutbacks. By all means cut staff, but don't cut spending. Ever, ever, ever, never.

Less politically, for completely different reasons you don't make cutbacks in education. Say what you want about Tony Blair - for the record, I can't stand "New Labour", over there or over here - but the "Education, Education, Education" mantra was and always will be right: you have to invest in education if you want to invest in your country, you have to teach your population if you want them to suceed.

By all means make cutbacks, but don't make them in health or education; the former if you want to get re-elected, the latter if you want your country to prosper. Of course the latter never matters a damn to FF, all they ever care about is the former. Which, perhaps, is why they want to make cutbacks in the latter. :)

adam


* Which just demonstrates how out of touch with reality FF really are, but I won't press the point in the post proper because it takes from the main point I'm trying to make.

[Sheridan]

Heh, the photo on that RTE article makes Biffo look like he's trying to big it up to the Dail Massive. :)

http://dynimg.rte.ie/0001c11010dr.jpg

http://splinteredsunrise.files.wordpress.com/2008/02/david_brent_111.jpg

[dahamsta]

ROFL Sheridan!

[Sligo Hornet]

Figures now at highest level for ten years.....not unsurprising, but painful reading nonetheless

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/business/7711025.stm

[mypost]

http://www.rte.ie/news/2008/1105/employment.html

[2legged tackle]

http://dynimg.rte.ie/0001c11010dr.jpg

http://file046a.bebo.com/5/large/2008/11/05/19/256121227a9345459528l.jpg

Mr. Cowen in his junior football days.

[Reality Bites]

320,000 next year Cowens estimate, I can see it tipping 350,000

[mypost]

Great idea (http://www.rte.ie/news/2008/1111/bank.html)

This measure keeps people technically employed, and employees happy.

Contrast that with the way Aer Lingus is dealing with it's financial problems.

[pete]

Great idea (http://www.rte.ie/news/2008/1111/bank.html)

This measure keeps people technically employed, and employees happy.

Contrast that with the way Aer Lingus is dealing with it's financial problems.

I would be surprised if TSB wanted to offer that to all employees. They probably really only want to give this to people with knowledge they don't want to lose to give to their competitors. I would guess union issues ensure this has to be offered to everyone. If they let people go would possibly cost similar amount in redundencies.

Aer Lingus decision may not be good for the staff but strike is insane as will ensure the company loses more money & staff shares worth less m
oney. They are an Independent private company who don't make big profits even in the good times (almost no airlines do). There is no one left to bail out Aer Lingus.

[Reality Bites]

If the Head of Coillte is earning €409,000 per year which is more than President Elect Barack Obama will earn , then its no surprise that we're in the mess we're in!

[mypost]

Ah that's alright. He hasn't got the trimmings that go with Obama's position anyway. Bertie logic. :rolleyes:

News on RTE today, that the Fas CEO brought his wife with him on "business" trips to Florida, while the state agency spent €600k+ transatlantic travel over 4 years promoting programmes.

Meanwhile, every week, there are half hour queues signing on at SW offices throughout the country, full of people that Fas are supposed to be helping.

[Dodge]

Having to queue a half an hour?! jaysus....

[OneRedArmy]

Getting back on topic, the latest unemployment numbers (as well as some of the economists projections going forward) are very, very bleak.

Whereas c8% seemed to be consensus for 2009/10, now starting to see projections above 10%. Very worrying indeed.

Meanwhile the Government has completely abdicated on anything resembling a stimulus package like the rest of the developed world is busy putting in place.

Oh, but they did manage to grow public sector employment by 3% in the last quarter.... :eek::confused:

[pete]

News on RTE today, that the Fas CEO brought his wife with him on "business" trips to Florida, while the state agency spent €600k+ transatlantic travel over 4 years promoting programmes.

Meanwhile, every week, there are half hour queues signing on at SW offices throughout the country, full of people that Fas are supposed to be helping.

Seems to be something rotten in the top level at Fas. Apparently their budget equates to 5k spent per unemployed person. Annual Board 2 day meeting at the K Club. Alleged fraud in the spending of advertising budget.

The only thing consistent of FF in the last 10 years is they take credit for good times, blame others for the bad times & ignore their responsibility in running state bodies.

FF policy seems to be to raise taxes to pay for spending & wait for the world to awaken from recession.

[mypost]

The entire Joe Duffy show today was devoted to the Fas Scandal.

[Poor Student]

Oh, but they did manage to grow public sector employment by 3% in the last quarter.... :eek::confused:

Any explanation as to why the public sector is still growing?:confused: Is that in terms of expenditure on salary or pure number of people?

[pete]

Any explanation as to why the public sector is still growing?:confused: Is that in terms of expenditure on salary or pure number of people?

Irish Times (http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/breaking/2008/1016/breaking35.htm)



According to data from the Central Statistics Office, overall employment in the public sector, including the health sector, was 373,100 in June, an increase of 7,500 compared with June 2007.

Employment in the education sector increased from 97,000 to 101,600 in the year to June, a rise of 4,600. Employment in Regional Bodies meanwhile rose by 1,200 to 41,200.

The numbers of people in the health sector declined by by 1,100 from 111,600 in June 2007 to 110,500 in June of this year.

Education & Health obvious but what are Regional Bodies? Are they Local Authorities?

[mypost]

Fasjobs.ie this time last year, had 400-odd jobs available every day in all sectors, now, it's barely 150 a day.

January is going to be mad. Transport fares automatically up, and jobs slashed across all sectors. Most non-profitable firms are going to go to the wall within weeks. As usual in these instances, the manufacturing sector will be hit very hard.

[Reality Bites]

FBD laid off 150 plus workers today, January is going to be quiet shocking...does anyone suspect civil unrest like Iceland last month and Argentina a few years ago.. I wouldn't be surprised.

[mypost]

does anyone suspect civil unrest . I wouldn't be surprised

Won't happen. There isn't the will, nor would it make a difference.

[pete]

FBD laid off 150 plus workers today

FBD Redundencies (http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/breaking/2008/1202/breaking35.htm)



Insurer FBD Holdings is to close 13 of its 47 branches in Ireland and introduce a voluntary redundancy programme in a bid to reduce staff numbers by 150.

In a statement FBD said customer behaviour was changing with 70 per cent now using the phone and internet to buy insurance with fewer customers visiting local office


Note sure I would put this down to recession. I would have guessed local branches would have been closed eventually as almost all insurance down by phone now.

[OneRedArmy]

FBD laid off 150 plus workers today, January is going to be quiet shocking...does anyone suspect civil unrest like Iceland last month and Argentina a few years ago.. I wouldn't be surprised.With the Playstation generation?!?!

Apathy is the only thing most people believe in these days.

[Reality Bites]

Unemployment Closing in on 8% - retail sector layoffs and those seeing out their notice till Christmas should see it push up to 10% early New Year

[mypost]

Remember there is no signing on in December, so the next figures aren't released until February. May easily hit 300k in 9 weeks time.

[RonnieB]

Went on short time myself a few days ago. Funnily enough the industry I was working in if the grant aid for the building of the agricultural buildings was spread out over a more realistic time scale of more than two years it would have been better for a hell of a lot of people. As it was a monumental amount of agricultural buildings were put up in 18 months with the deadline for completion the end of this year.

There was easily enough work to have been spread for well over three years. If they think tax revenue is down this year they are in for a shock when the amount of tax from the contractors doing these jobs dries up next year.

[OneRedArmy]

If they think tax revenue is down this year they are in for a shock when the amount of tax from the contractors doing these jobs dries up next year.Self-employed people pay tax?




:D

Joking aside, sorry to hear about your circumstances, its hitting more and more as the weeks go by.

[bennocelt]

The way things are at the moment it would nearly be better if my wife and myself were drawing the dole (and get the rent paid) such is the tax we have to bloody pay! I'm not complaining about the dole but why are ordinary people getting screwed by tax!:mad:

[Reality Bites]

The way things are at the moment it would nearly be better if my wife and myself were drawing the dole (and get the rent paid) such is the tax we have to bloody pay! I'm not complaining about the dole but why are ordinary people getting screwed by tax!:mad:


Strange Post when you consider Taxes are still historically low compared to the eye watering rates paid in the Eighties

[OneRedArmy]

The way things are at the moment it would nearly be better if my wife and myself were drawing the dole (and get the rent paid) such is the tax we have to bloody pay! I'm not complaining about the dole but why are ordinary people getting screwed by tax!:mad:As Reality Bites says we have some of the lowest direct taxes in the developed world.

The indirect taxes and whether we get good value for money for our tax paid is a whole other question.

[bennocelt]

As Reality Bites says we have some of the lowest direct taxes in the developed world.

The indirect taxes and whether we get good value for money for our tax paid is a whole other question.


yeah fair enough - but you know what i mean - the both of us are not earning that much better than what we could get on the dole

[mypost]

The standard weekly minimum wage is 75% more than the standard dole allowance, so that's a considerable sum over the year.

1,500 odd lost their jobs over the pork crisis in a single day.

[pete]

1,500 odd lost their jobs over the pork crisis in a single day.

Some of them are protective notice. Fairly predictable if no pigs to slaughter. Export contracts will be most at risk as retailers abroad will have to source products elsewhere if Irish deliveries do not arrive. Will be difficult to get those contract back if lost.

The government has not taken to directly taking jobs off people.

[bennocelt]

The standard weekly minimum wage is 75% more than the standard dole allowance, so that's a considerable sum over the year.

1,500 odd lost their jobs over the pork crisis in a single day.

yeah i figured we are both better off by 600 a month - which is not bad
- but then you also have to figure in rent allowance, free travel, medical card, and wathin daytime tv and in the pub the rest of the day over actually work which is increasingly stressful:)

by the way wasnt the dole doubled this week - a nice thank you from the government to say thanks for all the hard work.:eek:

[ruben_sosa]

Some of them are protective notice. Fairly predictable if no pigs to slaughter. Export contracts will be most at risk as retailers abroad will have to source products elsewhere if Irish deliveries do not arrive. Will be difficult to get those contract back if lost.

The government has not taken to directly taking jobs off people.

i feel sorry for the piggery workers, a lot of them are brazillian and imagine having to fork out for a flight back there 2 weeks before christmas. The paper said it'd take 8 weeks for their dole applications to be processed ! what are they supposed to do until then. I wonder if it'll spread to the beef industry too, Governments are only too happy to slap a ban on foreign produce to gain political clout with their own farmers.

[RonnieB]

i feel sorry for the piggery workers, a lot of them are brazillian and imagine having to fork out for a flight back there 2 weeks before christmas. The paper said it'd take 8 weeks for their dole applications to be processed ! what are they supposed to do until then

I would imagine they are going to have to do the same every other worker has to do and wait.

[Royal rover]

gents how bad is the situation now , i only ask because i live abroad and have done for the last 2 years , i tried to come last summer but a recruitment guy advised me to stay away, london is as bad as it's ever been, but as yet none of my mates are out of work regardless whether there in construction banking etc,

[pete]

gents how bad is the situation now,

What industry do you work in? Construction obviously an Irish issue, world recession will affect other sectors but possibly the same in other countries?

[Noelys Guitar]

What industry do you work in? Construction obviously an Irish issue, world recession will affect other sectors but possibly the same in other countries?

I live in Pennsylvania and the situation job wise here is dire. Worse than Ireland in the 80's. No construction jobs. People with degrees having to apply for security jobs and getting turned away as these jobs are full. Nursing jobs are still available but that is about it.

[mypost]

by the way wasnt the dole doubled this week - a nice thank you from the government to say thanks for all the hard work.:eek:

The dole was only doubled for those claiming longer than the standard 13-month initial allowance. In other words, you have to be on the dole for more than a year before you are entitled to a "bonus" payment at Christmas time.

The 8-week backlog is a standard time frame for initial claims to be processed. You're required to make a claim on the first day of unemployment. Often all the paperwork from the employer hasn't been issued at that time. 6-8 weeks later, the claim is processed, and the backlog of outstanding payments are then issued to the claimant.

It's a bang-head, brick-wall process, and not helped by the long waits at SW offices, coupled with an inadequate telephone service, and non existent electronic facility in order to speed it up. And that was in the boomtimes. The current haemorraging of jobs in all sectors, is not going to help the situation.

[BohsPartisan]

It's a bang-head, brick-wall process, and not helped by the long waits at SW offices, coupled with an inadequate telephone service, and non existent electronic facility in order to speed it up. And that was in the boomtimes. The current haemorraging of jobs in all sectors, is not going to help the situation.

The SW offices are really snowed under. I don't work in one myself but I know people who do and they are up to their eyes from the time they start. A new claims processing section has been set up to assist the situation but because of cuts people have had to be taken away from other areas to do it. Its ironic that with unemployment on the rise, short sighted blanket cuts inthe public sector mean that the DSFA can't actually employ more staff to cope with the problem, which would of course ease the problem slightly because you'd be creating employment.