American Politics

[seanfhear]

You hit the nail on the head Sean, as usual. Zelensky showed zero respect to the president of the United States. Even if he wasn't the president, his country (Trump's) has given billions to Ukraine, and Zelensky showed absolutely no gratitude. He (Zelensky) has been used to dealing with the previous regime (the most corrupt in US history) where money was printed for him at the American taxpayers' expense. And he himself (Zelensky) said last week that he didn't know where $100 billion of the money went to. And now he's back in Washington looking for more?

And I was glad to see Trump put him in his place - asking him if he remembered him (Trump) giving him those javelin missiles for the defence of his country when all Obama gave him was blankets. Zelensky has become a world traveler in the past few years and hasn't met a camera lens he doesn't like, while the poor citizens of his country are left to fight the battle. I honestly don't know where we go from here but there was a great deal on the table for everyone - Russia would have been out of Ukraine, the Ukrainians would have had a rare mineral deal with the US which would have brought a degree of military protection and Europe also misses out if I am not mistaken.
Zelensky failed the People of the Ukraine today.

[Razors left peg]

Doesn't take a wage but charges the Secret Service to stay in his hotels and protect him golfing.
https://www.citizensforethics.org/reports-investigations/crew-investigations/the-secret-service-spent-nearly-2-million-at-trump-properties/

Keep believing the grifter sure

[mark12345]

The sit-down press event was a disaster due to Zelensky not showing due respect to the People he came looking for help from ~ If Zelensky was un-willing to show due respect to the people he was looking for help from, in the American White-House, then Zelensky should just not have come to the White-House.

Zelensky achieved nothing for the Ukrainian People or the Ukraine by his behaviour today ~ ~ All of this should have gone on behind closed doors away from a public press event ~ ~ Zelensky has done huge damage to the Ukrainian people and the Ukraine by his stupid behaviour today ~ ~ That is completely clear.

The little details that get missed in the initial reporting (but I'm sure RTE, Sky et al will be sure to tell everyone about it tomorrow).

First - US Treasury Secy Scott Bessent met with Zelensky on February 12 in Kiev. Zelensky was supposed to sign the deal there but reneged.

Second - Zelensky promised Bessent that he would sign the deal in Munich, but never did.

Third - He comes to Washington on Friday (why the heck did he come if he didn't want to sign the deal) to ostensibly sign a deal. But lo and behold he engages in an argument with the US President. Was it all for show? It certainly looks that way.

[seanfhear]

The little details that get missed in the initial reporting (but I'm sure RTE, Sky et al will be sure to tell everyone about it tomorrow).

First - US Treasury Secy Scott Bessent met with Zelensky on February 12 in Kiev. Zelensky was supposed to sign the deal there but reneged.

Second - Zelensky promised Bessent that he would sign the deal in Munich, but never did.

Third - He comes to Washington on Friday (why the heck did he come if he didn't want to sign the deal) to ostensibly sign a deal. But lo and behold he engages in an argument with the US President. Was it all for show? It certainly looks that way.
I suggest that Zelensky has pushed his luck too far ~ ~ Maybe Zelensky made that mistake of believing too much of his own publicity ~ ~ Maybe Zelensky thinks that he is indispensable ?

Like many more before him. He is wrong about that.

[Razors left peg]

So MAGAs position is that Ukraine should let Russia take them back and don't dare fight back? Russia can take back Poland then, maybe just build back the full Iron curtain while they are at it and no one is allowed fight back? And since MAGA thinks the old colonizers have a right to take what was once theirs we must give Ireland back to the Brits? Actually wouldn't that mean The US back to the Brits too??? Make America Great Again... under the rule of the King of England

[tetsujin1979]

The little details that get missed in the initial reporting (but I'm sure RTE, Sky et al will be sure to tell everyone about it tomorrow).

First - US Treasury Secy Scott Bessent met with Zelensky on February 12 in Kiev. Zelensky was supposed to sign the deal there but reneged.

Second - Zelensky promised Bessent that he would sign the deal in Munich, but never did.

Third - He comes to Washington on Friday (why the heck did he come if he didn't want to sign the deal) to ostensibly sign a deal. But lo and behold he engages in an argument with the US President. Was it all for show? It certainly looks that way.Bessent brought a draft to Kyiv, not the final agreement. It was rejected because it would have meant signing 50% of Ukraine's mineral wealth to the United States.
There's no indication it was going to be signed in Munich
https://www.smh.com.au/world/europe/security-shield-us-hands-zelensky-draft-deal-on-rare-minerals-20250213-p5lbxo.html
https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/politics-news/zelenskyy-tells-aides-reject-trump-pitch-ukraine-mineral-reserves-rcna192426
https://kyivindependent.com/us-treasury-secretary-meets-zelensky-passes-draft-agreement-on-critical-minerals/
https://time.com/7260890/zelensky-minerals-deal-trump-us-ukraine-peace-negotiations/

[mark12345]

So MAGAs position is that Ukraine should let Russia take them back and don't dare fight back? Russia can take back Poland then, maybe just build back the full Iron curtain while they are at it and no one is allowed fight back? And since MAGA thinks the old colonizers have a right to take what was once theirs we must give Ireland back to the Brits? Actually wouldn't that mean The US back to the Brits too??? Make America Great Again... under the rule of the King of England

Trump has said several times during this process that he wants to achieve peace. He also said to Zelensky yesterday that he (Zelensky) wanted to keep the war going instead of achieving peace and that's something he (Trump) wasn't interested in doing. He also said that if Zelensky wants to keep on fighting then let him do that. And as far as MEGAN'S position on Ukraine.....are you forgetting the javelin missiles Trump gave them in 2018? Does that sound like someone who wants the Russians to take back Ukraine or someone who is bought and paid for by Putin?


So MAGAs position is that Ukraine should let Russia take them back and don't dare fight back? Russia can take back Poland then, maybe just build back the full Iron curtain while they are at it and no one is allowed fight back? And since MAGA thinks the old colonizers have a right to take what was once theirs we must give Ireland back to the Brits? Actually wouldn't that mean The US back to the Brits too??? Make America Great Again... under the rule of the King of England

I got an eye opener ten days / two weeks ago when I was sitting in a house in Ireland. It was the day when the ceasefire agreement in Gaza had stalled. Trump's image came on the TV and all of a sudden the volume is turned up. Trump said words to the effect that all hell would break loose if the hostages were not released by 12 o'clock on the following Saturday. And the people in the house were totally appalled. How could he possibly say that? Does he have no compassion? What is he thinking? It was as plain as day to me who Trump was talking to. It wasn't people in Ireland or Europe, but he was speaking instead to Hamas. And he was speaking a language they would understand. And that Saturday the hostages were released. But that sound bite on RTE or Sky or BBC was followed by as many "expert" commentators they could find who did nothing but question Trump's words in as critical a tone as possible.

And right there I discovered why opinions in Ireland differ so drastically from those in America (for context Trump is getting a lot of plaudits for how he handled Zelensky yesterday). You have no balanced media in Ireland (which includes British TV). It is one way of thinking and that's it. Here in America we have what you have essentially plus a contrasting viewpoint. And the viewers can form their own options.


So MAGAs position is that Ukraine should let Russia take them back and don't dare fight back? Russia can take back Poland then, maybe just build back the full Iron curtain while they are at it and no one is allowed fight back? And since MAGA thinks the old colonizers have a right to take what was once theirs we must give Ireland back to the Brits? Actually wouldn't that mean The US back to the Brits too??? Make America Great Again... under the rule of the King of England

Forgot to mention this. I only found this out last night. Did you know that Biden lost it with Zelensky at couple of times behind closed doors because of his demanding more and more from America and then going in front of the cameras and continuing his PR role.

And did you know that Zelensky campaigned with Josh Shapiro against Trump in the run up to the November election? If you did fair play to you. I didn't. But I doubt the media in Ireland and Britain told the public that? And if not, why not?

[seanfhear]

Forgot to mention this. I only found this out last night. Did you know that Biden lost it with Zelensky at couple of times behind closed doors because of his demanding more and more from America and then going in front of the cameras and continuing his PR role.

And did you know that Zelensky campaigned with Josh Shapiro against Trump in the run up to the November election? If you did fair play to you. I didn't. But I doubt the media in Ireland and Britain told the public that? And if not, why not?It looks more and more that ~ Zelensky is Not the sharpest tool in the box !

[Fizzer]

He’s probably capable of typing a coherent sentence though.

[Razors left peg]

I got an eye opener ten days/two weeks ago when I was sitting in a house in Ireland. It was the day when the ceasefire agreement in Gaza had stalled. Trump's image came on the TV and all of a sudden the volume is turned up. Trump said words to the effect that all hell would break loose if the hostages were not released by 12 o'clock on the following Saturday. And the people in the house were totally appalled. How could he possibly say that? Does he have no compassion? What is he thinking? It was as plain as day to me who Trump was talking to. It wasn't people in Ireland or Europe, but he was speaking instead to Hamas. And he was speaking a language they would understand. And that Saturday the hostages were released. But that sound bite on RTE or Sky or BBC was followed by as many "expert" commentators they could find who did nothing but question Trump's words in as critical a tone as possible.

And right there I discovered why opinions in Ireland differ so drastically from those in America (for context Trump is getting a lot of plaudits for how he handled Zelensky yesterday). You have no balanced media in Ireland (which includes British TV). It is one way of thinking and that's it. Here in America we have what you have essentially plus a contrasting viewpoint. And the viewers can form their own options.


Small thing you're missing there dude is that I live in the US. I'm a US citizen and see what all the coverage is. News here is despicable. People watch whatever channel backs up their opinion and only reinforces what they want. So I'm assuming you watch Fox News all day to get your balanced views... a company that when sued for defamation had the defense in court that "as they are purely entertainment nothing that they say can be taken seriously... and they won.


https://www.npr.org/2020/09/29/917747123/you-literally-cant-believe-the-facts-tucker-carlson-tells-you-so-say-fox-s-lawye


I don't watch any news here now for those exact reasons. But I will tell you I got a message last night from a neighbor. He's a gun tote:n, big hat wearing cowboy, who has been a republican all his life. The exact message was "So fcking embarrassed by the orange idiot". I just replied and said that I basically told you so before the election, but I did think it was interesting that he of all people messaged me.

So keep thinking your Orange hero is infallible, but don't believe he has the full support of all Americans.

Edit: Russian State TV (TASS) were in the Oval office yesterday, but Reuters and AP weren't allowed by Trump... free press huh?

[tetsujin1979]

Ireland ranked eighth in the world in Press Freedom, United States at 55th, just ahead of Gabon and Mauritius, and behind Belize and the Ivory Coast
https://rsf.org/en/index?year=2024


Trump has said several times during this process that he wants to achieve peace. He also said to Zelensky yesterday that he (Zelensky) wanted to keep the war going instead of achieving peace and that's something he (Trump) wasn't interested in doing. He also said that if Zelensky wants to keep on fighting then let him do that. And as far as MEGAN'S position on Ukraine.....are you forgetting the javelin missiles Trump gave them in 2018? Does that sound like someone who wants the Russians to take back Ukraine or someone who is bought and paid for by Putin?
Funny you mention those javelin missiles. When Trump was approached in 2019 for missiles, he withheld them unless Zelenskyy could provide him with assistance against Joe Biden in the 2020 Presidential Election, which led to the his first impeachment.

Recently, Trump has cancelled all planning on Russian cyber attacks, called Zelenskyy a dictator, and said that the Ukrainian president started the war against Russia.
Even if he's not "bought and sold" by Putin, he's doing a lot that Putin approves of.

[osarusan]

Yes indeed, if only Ireland had high quality media like the USA does.

https://images.theconversation.com/files/345601/original/file-20200703-33935-elrvg1.png?ixlib=rb-1.1.0&q=45&auto=format&w=1000&fit=clip

[mark12345]

Ireland ranked eighth in the world in Press Freedom, United States at 55th, just ahead of Gabon and Mauritius, and behind Belize and the Ivory Coast
https://rsf.org/en/index?year=2024

And yet you have no counterbalance to the liberal media in Ireland. Those rankings really mean an awful lot.

[mark12345]

Yes indeed, if only Ireland had high quality media like the USA does.

https://images.theconversation.com/files/345601/original/file-20200703-33935-elrvg1.png?ixlib=rb-1.1.0&q=45&auto=format&w=1000&fit=clip

This is something I heard last night, and Tucker Carlson picks up on it today (text below in quotation marks is his post). Isn't it great that we all are able to get the same information - we have our guys over here and you have RTE.

"One of the most striking things about yesterday’s Zelensky press conference was Lindsey Graham’s reaction to it. The two are old friends, but Graham disavowed him within the hour. This was more than just transactional disloyalty. It was scapegoating. Lindsey Graham knows what’s coming. Over the past three years, with the tacit support of its western patrons, the Ukrainian government has committed a remarkable number of serious crimes. The Ukrainians sold huge quantities of American weapons on the international black market at twenty cents on the dollar. These weapons are now in the hands of armed groups around the world, including Hamas, the Mexican drug cartels and the forces now controlling Syria. God knows what the Ukrainians have done with the pathogens in American biolabs in their country. Even US intel agencies aren’t sure. The Ukrainians have also murdered a number of people in various countries in political assassinations, and tried to murder others, including American journalists and a European head of state. This is all true, and it’s all going to come out at some point. Better to start blaming it on Zelensky now."

[tetsujin1979]

And yet you have no counterbalance to the liberal media in Ireland. Those rankings really mean an awful lot.
They mean there's more press freedom in Ireland


This is something I heard last night, and Tucker Carlson picks up on it today (text below in quotation marks is his post). Isn't it great that we all are able to get the same information - we have our guys over here and you have RTE.

"One of the most striking things about yesterday’s Zelensky press conference was Lindsey Graham’s reaction to it. The two are old friends, but Graham disavowed him within the hour. This was more than just transactional disloyalty. It was scapegoating. Lindsey Graham knows what’s coming. Over the past three years, with the tacit support of its western patrons, the Ukrainian government has committed a remarkable number of serious crimes. The Ukrainians sold huge quantities of American weapons on the international black market at twenty cents on the dollar. These weapons are now in the hands of armed groups around the world, including Hamas, the Mexican drug cartels and the forces now controlling Syria. God knows what the Ukrainians have done with the pathogens in American biolabs in their country. Even US intel agencies aren’t sure. The Ukrainians have also murdered a number of people in various countries in political assassinations, and tried to murder others, including American journalists and a European head of state. This is all true, and it’s all going to come out at some point. Better to start blaming it on Zelensky now."
Do any RTE journalists have a court case in their history that includes the following quote
https://assets.documentcloud.org/documents/7216968/9-24-20-McDougal-v-Fox-Opinion.pdf
(See page 12)

Fox persuasively argues, given Mr. Carlson’s reputation, any reasonable viewer “arrive[s] with an appropriate amount of skepticism” about the statements he makes.

[Razors left peg]

Invoking Tucker Carlson into the discussion shows how pointless it is even having a conversation with you Mark. The man has zero credibility, see my above piece that I referred to in regards to Libel trial

Sorry just seen Tets reference same trial

[mark12345]

Invoking Tucker Carlson into the discussion shows how pointless it is even having a conversation with you Mark. The man has zero credibility, see my above piece that I referred to in regards to Libel trial

Sorry just seen Tets reference same trial

I can't open the link but I believe he's referring to the suing of Fox News for comments Tucker made about the Dominion machines that counted votes in 2020?

I take it you don't know the back story of that? Fox was sued by Dominion but both companies are owned by Blackrock. So Blackrock was essentially suing itself and the money that was paid out would have been written off as a business expense. So essentially no harm no foul while the public was left believing it was a massive embarrassed for Fox.

Fox wanted to get rid of Carlson because he was getting too close to matters they didn't want to discuss like the 44k hours of tape which showed January 6 in a completely different light. Tucker began to release them on his show until Chuck Schumer went on the Senate floor and strongly suggested to Fox that they stop Carlson from releasing any more. Why would he do that?

Hopefully at this point you are getting a sense of Tuckers credibility versus what you and I have been led to believe?

Tuckers credibility and popularity went through the roof after he left Fox. If he had no credibility why would many top figures in America allow
Themselves to be interviewed by him?

I take it that you are unaware that the mainstream media in America is dying a death right now? Their leading figures like Lester Holt, Jim Acosta, Cuomo, Joy Reid and the members of The View have all been let go or had their salaries reduced. That's because viewership is way down and the confidence the public have in traditional media is at an all time low. Meanwhile Carlson and Joe Rogan are standing strong.


Doesn't take a wage but charges the Secret Service to stay in his hotels and protect him golfing.
https://www.citizensforethics.org/reports-investigations/crew-investigations/the-secret-service-spent-nearly-2-million-at-trump-properties/

Keep believing the grifter sure

What's the problem? The Secret Service has a budget for stays in hotels be they Trump's or anyone else's.
But the larger point was you saying that Trump is bought and paid for by Putin. You still think that?
Remember the Russia hoax that paralyzed Trump for 3 years of his first tenure? That really bore fruit didn't it?

[tetsujin1979]

Seems like you don't know much about the ownership of BlackRock and Fox either
From https://www.politifact.com/factchecks/2023/apr/26/facebook-posts/blackrock-fox-and-tucker-carlson-untangling-a-web/

BlackRock, a large financial investment management company, owns shares of Fox Corp., but not Dominion Voting Systems.

BlackRock owns about 59 million shares of the company Dominion Energy. We found nothing to suggest that the energy company and voting technology company were connected beyond sharing a similar name.

[mark12345]

Bessent brought a draft to Kyiv, not the final agreement. It was rejected because it would have meant signing 50% of Ukraine's mineral wealth to the United States.
There's no indication it was going to be signed in Munich
https://www.smh.com.au/world/europe/security-shield-us-hands-zelensky-draft-deal-on-rare-minerals-20250213-p5lbxo.html
https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/politics-news/zelenskyy-tells-aides-reject-trump-pitch-ukraine-mineral-reserves-rcna192426
https://kyivindependent.com/us-treasury-secretary-meets-zelensky-passes-draft-agreement-on-critical-minerals/
https://time.com/7260890/zelensky-minerals-deal-trump-us-ukraine-peace-negotiations/

Bessent has a slightly different take on it. And it begs the question if Zelensky wouldn't sign it in Kiev or Munich then why the heck did he go to Washington on Friday? Looking more and more like a publicity stunt to me.

I have a hunch, and it's only that, but I would say we will see plenty of favorable references to Zelensky at tonight's Oscars, and possibly a satellite link up with him? Who knows? He tried to get on the show in 2023. I would also suggest there will be condemnation of Trump in equal measure and the whole deal will be all over our TV's tomorrow morning.


Seems like you don't know much about the ownership of BlackRock and Fox either
From https://www.politifact.com/factchecks/2023/apr/26/facebook-posts/blackrock-fox-and-tucker-carlson-untangling-a-web/

You are a man of sources, I'll give you that. Problem is many of them are bogus.
The picture is becoming quite clear at this point. You, who live in Ireland, are right about everything that goes on in America.
And I, who live in America, am wrong about everything that goes on here.
I bow to your superiority.

[John83]

Nice appeal to authority there. Seems very on-brand these days.

[mark12345]

Nice appeal to authority there. Seems very on-brand these days.

No idea what you are saying there, or if it's even directed at me?

Any chance you could talk about Tucker Carlson (without using sources - just like we were sitting in a pub and talking man to man)?
Why did FOX News stop him from airing the J6 tapes he was in possession of?
Why did Chuck Schumer stand on a podium in front of the country and advise Fox in the strongest terms possible, not to air any more of the tapes?
Why have they been kept under wraps since?
If Tucker is not a credible person, why not go ahead and expose him for the fraud / fool that he is? Simple enough right?

[tetsujin1979]

What if you knew these facts before you got into the pub? Can you still use them in a conversation with a randomer at the bar?

It's not like some of his claims about January 6th have been discredited is it?
https://www.factcheck.org/2023/03/explaining-the-missing-context-of-tucker-carlsons-jan-6-presentation/

[mark12345]

What if you knew these facts before you got into the pub? Can you still use them in a conversation with a randomer at the bar?

It's not like some of his claims about January 6th have been discredited is it?
https://www.factcheck.org/2023/03/explaining-the-missing-context-of-tucker-carlsons-jan-6-presentation/

You got the floor.
Let's hear what you have to say relative to the above questions, or are we going to keep beating around the bush?

Looks like Mr Harris in Ireland is pledging hundreds of millions of euros of Irish taxpayers' money to Mr Zelensky. And the initial reaction from Irish people, on social media at least, does not appear to be too favorable.

[seanfhear]

Looks like Mr Harris in Ireland is pledging hundreds of millions of euros of Irish taxpayers' money to Mr Zelensky. And the initial reaction from Irish people, on social media at least, does not appear to be too favorable.Is this Simon Harris's own money ? !

[tetsujin1979]

According to this - https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/congress/schumer-slams-mccarthy-tucker-carlsons-access-jan-6-security-footage-rcna71878 - Schumer included his reasons for not releasing the tapes

“The footage Speaker McCarthy is making available to Fox News is a treasure trove of closely held information about how the Capitol complex is protected and its public release would compromise the safety of the Legislative Branch and allow those who want to commit another attack to learn how Congress is safeguarded.”

Releasing the security video discloses the locations of security cameras across the Capitol grounds, “making it harder and more dangerous for our brave Capitol police officers to do their job,” Schumer said. It also could reveal “highly guarded plans for the continuity of government” in the event of an attack.
Basically, that the video footage would give away the security protocols in place in the capitol building, and the footage could be used to identify weaknesses in that same security.

That statement came out in February 2023, two months before Carlson was let go from Fox. There's no official statement from the network why he left.

[Razors left peg]

You're wasting your time Tets. Mark is deep in the Trump Cult. I see his like over here daily and they will blindly follow him. One of the only things Trump has said that wasn't a lie is that he could shoot someone in the face and not lose his followers.

[mark12345]

You're wasting your time Tets. Mark is deep in the Trump Cult. I see his like over here daily and they will blindly follow him. One of the only things Trump has said that wasn't a lie is that he could shoot someone in the face and not lose his followers.

Really Razor? Calling names? You're a better person than that, don't you think?

I have no doubt that if I walked into a pub in Ireland I could sit down in your company and have a quiet meaningful conversation with you over a drink or two. As Irishmen I would think we have a lot in common. I grew up in Dublin, played football like every other kid at the time, and emigrated to America over 30 years ago.

I didn't have the slightest interest in politics until 9/11 happened. Ever since that I have witnessed the erosion of the American media and the values they are supposed to uphold.

The only thing that separates us is our opinions on one topic in particular. As you say there are plenty like me over there. There are also plenty of your persuasion over here. Otherwise decent people at odds with one another. Don't you think what the media tells us (or doesn't) has a lot to do with it?

[Razors left peg]

Really Razor? Calling names? You're a better person than that, don't you think?

I have no doubt that if I walked into a pub in Ireland I could sit down in your company and have a quiet meaningful conversation with you over a drink or two. As Irishmen I would think we have a lot in common. I grew up in Dublin, played football like every other kid at the time, and emigrated to America over 30 years ago.

I didn't have the slightest interest in politics until 9/11 happened. Ever since that I have witnessed the erosion of the American media and the values they are supposed to uphold.

The only thing that separates us is our opinions on one topic in particular. As you say there are plenty like me over there. There are also plenty of your persuasion over here. Otherwise decent people at odds with one another. Don't you think what the media tells us (or doesn't) has a lot to do with it?


I didnt call you any names Mark, I simply said that you a rooted firmly in the Trump Cult and that I see enough people like you where I live to know that theres nothing the man could ever do to change your mind. Hes a convicted fraudster and yet you believe everything he says.

I emigrated here 12 year ago and as I said previously I think the news here is shameful. Its all rage bait intended to sell ads and the people that tune in are only there to have their opinions reinforced. You have said you watch Fox. This is a company that had to pay $787 Million for Libel against Dominion and in a previous slander trial against Tucker Carlson their defense was "that you shouldnt take him literally."

So yes I do think the news media has a lot to do with what happens over here, but mainly because people are stupid enough to tune in a watch it. I havent watched cable news over here in years. I think the last straw for me was after there were attacks in nightclubs in Paris I put on the news to see what happened and they were interviewing a band from the US who were supposed to be playing in one of the clubs and didnt go or something like that. There was no actual coverage of the events.

You talk about values eroding in the media, what about values in Politics? The Republicans are supposed to be the "family values" party, but yet now have a man as their king who is divorvced multiple times and has affairs with porn stars.

Trump talked about WW3 the other day in the Oval office with Zelenskyy. If WW3 was to suddenly break out the US right now would be on the side of Russia and against the Allies of the past.... thats some erosion of values!

[mark12345]

I didnt call you any names Mark, I simply said that you a rooted firmly in the Trump Cult and that I see enough people like you where I live to know that theres nothing the man could ever do to change your mind. Hes a convicted fraudster and yet you believe everything he says.

I emigrated here 12 year ago and as I said previously I think the news here is shameful. Its all rage bait intended to sell ads and the people that tune in are only there to have their opinions reinforced. You have said you watch Fox. This is a company that had to pay $787 Million for Libel against Dominion and in a previous slander trial against Tucker Carlson their defense was "that you shouldnt take him literally."

So yes I do think the news media has a lot to do with what happens over here, but mainly because people are stupid enough to tune in a watch it. I havent watched cable news over here in years. I think the last straw for me was after there were attacks in nightclubs in Paris I put on the news to see what happened and they were interviewing a band from the US who were supposed to be playing in one of the clubs and didnt go or something like that. There was no actual coverage of the events.

You talk about values eroding in the media, what about values in Politics? The Republicans are supposed to be the "family values" party, but yet now have a man as their king who is divorvced multiple times and has affairs with porn stars.

Trump talked about WW3 the other day in the Oval office with Zelenskyy. If WW3 was to suddenly break out the US right now would be on the side of Russia and against the Allies of the past.... thats some erosion of values!

Good to see that we have some things in common. The media, for me, is an absolute disgrace in America and in Europe and even FOX which I watch along with Newsmax, will only tell you about 70% of the story. They are at corporate entity first and a news station second.

And....this may surprise you but I have little or no time for the Republicans and their supposed values. Why? Because they are supposed to be the antithesis of the Democrats but both parties are in bed together and have been for a very long time. Meanwhile the regular Joe is paying taxes for all sorts of things which have no bearing on his life.

You might be right about the US and Russia partnering in the event of a war but I'm left wondering how it came to this? Europe and the US should be rock solid together militarily but the US has bankrupted itself while protecting Europe we're told. The real enemy for all of us is China.

Lastly Trump has said he wants peace around the world and yet he continues to be criticized. At present we have a ceasefire in Gaza and apparently the peace deal with Ukraine is back on. But Trump will never ever be given credit for that by those people in America who profit from endless war.

[Razors left peg]

Good to see that we have some things in common. The media, for me, is an absolute disgrace in America and in Europe and even FOX which I watch along with Newsmax, will only tell you about 70% of the story. They are at corporate entity first and a news station second.

And....this may surprise you but I have little or no time for the Republicans and their supposed values. Why? Because they are supposed to be the antithesis of the Democrats but both parties are in bed together and have been for a very long time. Meanwhile the regular Joe is paying taxes for all sorts of things which have no bearing on his life.

You might be right about the US and Russia partnering in the event of a war but I'm left wondering how it came to this? Europe and the US should be rock solid together militarily but the US has bankrupted itself while protecting Europe we're told. The real enemy for all of us is China.

Lastly Trump has said he wants peace around the world and yet he continues to be criticized. At present we have a ceasefire in Gaza and apparently the peace deal with Ukraine is back on. But Trump will never ever be given credit for that by those people in America who profit from endless war.

Trump has said a lot of things and yet some people continue to believe him. Wheres the heathcare plan he promised to roll out in 2 weeks, about 5 years ago? Today hes talking about Cryptocurrency on his social media a few days after his son had given a heads up something like that was coming. Its all a grift to fill his own pockets. This is a man who has never cared about people his entire life and now all of a sudden hes supposed to be this saviour of World Peace? How about the AI video he shared the other day showing Gaza turned into a holiday resort and gold statue of himself at the heart of it. Last week hes sharing a picture of himself in a crown with "God Save the King".

This whole thing is about enriching himself and his buddies like Elon.

[mark12345]

Trump has said a lot of things and yet some people continue to believe him. Wheres the heathcare plan he promised to roll out in 2 weeks, about 5 years ago? Today hes talking about Cryptocurrency on his social media a few days after his son had given a heads up something like that was coming. Its all a grift to fill his own pockets. This is a man who has never cared about people his entire life and now all of a sudden hes supposed to be this saviour of World Peace? How about the AI video he shared the other day showing Gaza turned into a holiday resort and gold statue of himself at the heart of it. Last week hes sharing a picture of himself in a crown with "God Save the King".

This whole thing is about enriching himself and his buddies like Elon.

The Healthcare plan was sabotaged by his own party members, chief of which was Paul Ryan. He was sabotaged a million times during his first term, surely you agree? But ultimately he wasn't able to deliver on his promise.

About Gaza, I myself wondered aloud, about a year ago, why it couldn't be turned into the next Dubai? Surely that would be better for the people than what they currently have? If peace was to be achieved - wonderful. But that has to be the goal? And there is no one stopping any of the Arab nations from stepping in to help rebuild the place. What none of us want (and that includes Trump) is a repeat of October 7 and its aftermath.

As far as him lining his pockets, I just don't see it. He wants what's best for America evidence of which is the current minerals deal on the table for Ukraine. It's a great deal for America and Ukraine and (correct me if I'm wrong) Europe as well.
And if he was doing anything untoward there are a million vultures out there only waiting to take him down.

[Razors left peg]

The Healthcare plan was sabotaged by his own party members, chief of which was Paul Ryan. He was sabotaged a million times during his first term, surely you agree? But ultimately he wasn't able to deliver on his promise.

About Gaza, I myself wondered aloud, about a year ago, why it couldn't be turned into the next Dubai? Surely that would be better for the people than what they currently have? If peace was to be achieved - wonderful. But that has to be the goal? And there is no one stopping any of the Arab nations from stepping in to help rebuild the place. What none of us want (and that includes Trump) is a repeat of October 7 and its aftermath.

As far as him lining his pockets, I just don't see it. He wants what's best for America evidence of which is the current minerals deal on the table for Ukraine. It's a great deal for America and Ukraine and (correct me if I'm wrong) Europe as well.
And if he was doing anything untoward there are a million vultures out there only waiting to take him down.


Dude out of his own mouth in this years debates he said he has "the concepts of a plan" when asked about healthcare. Thats nothing to do with Paul Ryan or anyone else.

As for Gaza, you do understand that to achieve what Trump suggested it would mean following through on Israels plan for a complete ethic cleansing first. This is a man who last week didnt understand that his golf course in Doonbeg is not in the UK, but yet you expect us to believe his great plan for World peace.

[mark12345]

Dude out of his own mouth in this years debates he said he has "the concepts of a plan" when asked about healthcare. Thats nothing to do with Paul Ryan or anyone else.

As for Gaza, you do understand that to achieve what Trump suggested it would mean following through on Israels plan for a complete ethic cleansing first. This is a man who last week didnt understand that his golf course in Doonbeg is not in the UK, but yet you expect us to believe his great plan for World peace.

I followed most of what went on prior to the debate but don't remember him talking about a health plan? Not saying it didn't happen. I mentioned Paul Ryan because I thought we were were discussing 5 years ago. Anyway I don't think for one second that Trump wants to see an ethnic cleansing. He mentioned a rebuild of the strip with America owning it (something I would have no interest in), but an ethnic cleansing?

There is far too much killing going on in Gaza and in Ukraine. Trump has consistently talked about achieving peace. Let's hope he achieves it.

[Razors left peg]

I followed most of what went on prior to the debate but don't remember him talking about a health plan? Not saying it didn't happen. I mentioned Paul Ryan because I thought we were were discussing 5 years ago. Anyway I don't think for one second that Trump wants to see an ethnic cleansing. He mentioned a rebuild of the strip with America owning it (something I would have no interest in), but an ethnic cleansing?

There is far too much killing going on in Gaza and in Ukraine. Trump has consistently talked about achieving peace. Let's hope he achieves it.

Firstly here is his concepts of a plan answer... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8p6zZZ3DPGE

Secondly, how do you think this Gaza idea would happen if they dont get get rid of the people who actually own the land... you know those pesky Palestinians who are in the way and Netanyahu is try to wipe out. If destroying a whole nation of people isnt ethnic cleansing then what is? Trump wants to build hotels on someone elses land here. He is not discussing this with Palestine, hes discussing it with Israel. Can you imagine if the Brits decide that they want Ireland back and that the whole West Coast is going to be one big golf resort. Would the Irish people get a say in this or should they just be moved out of the way or killed?

Thats not peace!

[mark12345]

Firstly here is his concepts of a plan answer... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8p6zZZ3DPGE

Secondly, how do you think this Gaza idea would happen if they dont get get rid of the people who actually own the land... you know those pesky Palestinians who are in the way and Netanyahu is try to wipe out. If destroying a whole nation of people isnt ethnic cleansing then what is? Trump wants to build hotels on someone elses land here. He is not discussing this with Palestine, hes discussing it with Israel. Can you imagine if the Brits decide that they want Ireland back and that the whole West Coast is going to be one big golf resort. Would the Irish people get a say in this or should they just be moved out of the way or killed?

Thats not peace!

There is nothing about Donald Trump, nothing ever in his past, not a single thing, to suggest that he would want anything to do with ethnic cleansing. Really, come on? To the contrary, he is working for peace in Ukraine, and, as insanely difficult as it may prove to be, between Gaza and Israel as well. Does he want to build on that land - yes. Did he say at any point that he was going to permanently displace the Palestinians? If he did, I did not hear it. I'm pretty sure I heard him suggest that others in the region could take them in while the country is rebuilt. He did say he would like to turn it into a resort and America would own it (like I said, I don't think this is a good idea on America's part, not one bit, and there are many Americans, I'm sure, who think likewise). His supporters have labelled him the President of peace due to the fact that no new wars were started on his watch (last time around) which is a lot more than can be said for the warmongers who have sat in the same White House seat. And, at the end of the day, there is nothing stopping others in the region (and European countries could also weigh in) from rebuilding Gaza. But for some strange reason, everyone else has stayed quiet on the subject. So if he is the only offer in town then shame on others for not stepping up.

[Razors left peg]

I should have taken my own advice when I said the discussion was pointless. Hes working for Peace in the Ukraine by picking a fight with the leader there who is actually fighting in a war to defend his country, and in Gaza talking about building a holiday resort in a place that people are fighting to stay alive while one of Trumps mates is trying to wipe them out... PEACE!

[CraftyToePoke]

Did he say at any point that he was going to permanently displace the Palestinians? If he did, I did not hear it. I'm pretty sure I heard him suggest that others in the region could take them in while the country is rebuilt.

Thing is he did :: https://www.foxnews.com/video/6368924186112

No right of return, no clarity on how to move them. Other countries in the region not wanting any part of it.

[mark12345]

I should have taken my own advice when I said the discussion was pointless. Hes working for Peace in the Ukraine by picking a fight with the leader there who is actually fighting in a war to defend his country, and in Gaza talking about building a holiday resort in a place that people are fighting to stay alive while one of Trumps mates is trying to wipe them out... PEACE!

It is indeed bordering on pointless.
People can stay alive a lot easier in a resort which is bent on conducting commerce and business instead of engaging in gunfights.
Anyway, something I just heard which may interest you - before he went to the White House on Friday, Zelensky had a meeting with a number of Democrats in Washington? Why?

It is obvious to me (from having watched about 2.5 hours of news opinion just now) that the Dems don't want any peace agreement in Ukraine. It would show Trump in too good a light.

Let's just agree to disagree and see how things unfold in the next few weeks.

[Razors left peg]

So you watched 2.5 hours of opinion on Fox and Newsmax and came to the theory that it's the Democrats fault. I'm shocked I tells ya!!

[tetsujin1979]

It is indeed bordering on pointless.
People can stay alive a lot easier in a resort which is bent on conducting commerce and business instead of engaging in gunfights.
Anyway, something I just heard which may interest you - before he went to the White House on Friday, Zelensky had a meeting with a number of Democrats in Washington? Why?

It is obvious to me (from having watched about 2.5 hours of news opinion just now) that the Dems don't want any peace agreement in Ukraine. It would show Trump in too good a light.

Let's just agree to disagree and see how things unfold in the next few weeks.
You didn't think to maybe check if there was a record of who was at this meeting?
It took me less than ten seconds to Google that meeting and find this
https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/trump-zelenskyy-meeting-with-democrats/
Republicans Lindsey Graham, Chuck Grassley, and Roger Wicker all attended the same meeting, with documented evidence provided to support their attendance including photos and videos of the event.

[mark12345]

According to this - https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/congress/schumer-slams-mccarthy-tucker-carlsons-access-jan-6-security-footage-rcna71878 - Schumer included his reasons for not releasing the tapes


Basically, that the video footage would give away the security protocols in place in the capitol building, and the footage could be used to identify weaknesses in that same security.

That statement came out in February 2023, two months before Carlson was let go from Fox. There's no official statement from the network why he left.

So essentially, you pulled up a link to an NBC story and regurgitated it in your own words. It's clear you don't have the same life experience as someone who lives on the ground in the country you are writing about.

Anyway, the article you posted very conveniently forgets to speak about the actual footage from inside the building which Carlson released on his show. It shows a completely different story to the one they were telling us at the time. People walking around taking selfies, chatting and laughing with the police, and the police even opening doors for one of them. The powers that be are supposedly worried about security but never bothered to ask who opened the fortified front doors from the inside. For his part, Carlson fully admitted that the vandals who damaged the building that day deserved prosecution.

And then of course there were the five police officers killed by the "rioters." The killing of five police officers, with not even one of those acts caught by the plethora of TV cameras and cell phones present? One of the officers was reportedly beaten to death with a fire extinguisher - remember? But that same officer was having dinner with his family the next evening (he did die of a stroke apparently the following day). And the funerals for the five officers. Do you remember seeing them on CNN or RTE? No, neither do I, and neither does anyone else. A monumental screw up wouldn't you say by a media which would move mountains just to have some mud to throw at DT. Hopefully, by now Tets, you can see that the gullible public in America and the world, was sold a bill of goods with the reporting that day.

The larger point about TC's credibility is that the man was a living legend on cable TV for a good number of years in America. He broke stories that none of the networks did, and he had the highest ratings of anyone in cable news. FOX loved him then and paid him a massive amount of money annually. FOX fired him for a reason. He was on a mission to bring the truth to the screen and if than meant exposing lies and deception on a grand scale, as it often did, then so be it. But FOX didn't want to go down that road with him.

[Razors left peg]

I have the same life experiences of someone living in the country as you Mark and as Ive said previously you worship at the altar of Fox, Carlson and Trump. Yet have the gall to say that Irish news is biased when you by your own words only watch the equivalent of North Korea state tv in how they fawn over Trump.

[tetsujin1979]

So essentially, you pulled up a link to an NBC story and regurgitated it in your own words. It's clear you don't have the same life experience as someone who lives on the ground in the country you are writing about.I never claimed to have the same life experience as anyone, anywhere. I searched for Chuck Schumer's statement on the video files, that story contained them. Did you read the quotes from Schumer?



Anyway, the article you posted very conveniently forgets to speak about the actual footage from inside the building which Carlson released on his show. It shows a completely different story to the one they were telling us at the time. People walking around taking selfies, chatting and laughing with the police, and the police even opening doors for one of them. The powers that be are supposedly worried about security but never bothered to ask who opened the fortified front doors from the inside. For his part, Carlson fully admitted that the vandals who damaged the building that day deserved prosecution.I posted this link one page ago - https://www.factcheck.org/2023/03/explaining-the-missing-context-of-tucker-carlsons-jan-6-presentation/ - and it contains the following(note the claim is a quote from Carlson in his report)


Claim: “The tapes show the Capitol Police never stopped Jacob Chansley. They helped him. They acted as his tour guides.”

Facts: This is false. Chansley, also known as the “QAnon Shaman,” who was sentenced to 41 months in prison for obstructing an official proceeding on Jan. 6, 2021, signed a plea agreement acknowledging that he entered the Capitol through a door broken by other rioters and that he ignored Capitol Police officers who asked him to exit the building multiple times.

On his show, Carlson played video of a shirtless Chansley — in face paint and wearing a horned headdress — walking through the halls of the Capitol, mostly being trailed by one or more Capitol Police officers.

“Capitol Police officers take him to multiple entrances and even try to open locked doors for him,” Carlson claimed in the segment. “We counted at least nine officers who were within touching distance of unarmed Jacob Chansely. Not one of them even tried to slow him down. Chansley understood that Capitol Police were his allies. Video shows him giving thanks for them in a prayer on the floor of the Senate.”

But Capitol Police Chief Thomas Manger disputed Carlson’s description of the events in a staff memo (https://perma.cc/LF4K-H9C4) issued the day after Carlson’s show aired. Manger said officers tried to resolve the situation without violence.

“One false allegation is that our officers helped the rioters and acted as ‘tour guides.’ This is outrageous and false,” Manger wrote. “This Department stands by the officers in the video that was shown last night. I don’t have to remind you how outnumbered our officers were on January 6. Those officers did their best to use de-escalation tactics to try to talk rioters into getting each other to leave the building.”

One of the officers seen walking with Chansley, Capitol Police Officer Keith Robishaw, who has red hair and was wearing glasses and a light blue face mask, explained his thinking in the 2021 HBO documentary “Four Hours at the Capitol.”

In one of his first encounters with a group of rowdy protesters, including Chansley, who was armed with a spear affixed with an American flag, Robishaw said he knew he and his fellow officers had to try to get them to leave peacefully.

“We were standing on that line, and there was the six of us. Meeting violence with violence at this time would not be safe for me and my fellow officers,” Robishaw said about 36 minutes into the film. “The sheer number of them compared to us, I knew in my head there was no way that we could all get physical with them, so I took it upon myself to try and talk to them.”

“No attacking, no assault, remain calm,” Robishaw told the men.

Later, when Chansley had made his way to the Senate floor, Robishaw saw him and followed him inside, by himself, and tried to get Chansley and others already in the chamber to leave.

“I walk in behind him, and that’s when I realized I was alone now. I was by myself,” Robishaw told the documentarians. “I was like, ‘I can’t do anything.’ You know? I can only do is, you know, shout orders, and if they listen, great, if they don’t, I can’t force them. I’m all by myself.”

In video filmed by a New Yorker reporter, Robishaw is shown saying to the men: “Any chance I could get you guys to leave the Senate wing?” At one point, a protester says, “You should be stopping us.” Robishaw responds that he is outnumbered.

According to court documents, Chansley and others did not exit the chamber until additional law enforcement officers arrived to back up Robishaw.



And then of course there were the five police officers killed by the "rioters." The killing of five police officers, with not even one of those acts caught by the plethora of TV cameras and cell phones present?There's no footage because none of them died at the scene. Brian Sicknick died in hospital, four others(Howard Charles Liebengood, Jeffrey Smith, Kyle Hendrik DeFreytag, and Paul Hashida) died by suicide following the events - https://www.reuters.com/world/us/officer-who-responded-us-capitol-attack-is-third-die-by-suicide-2021-08-02/



One of the officers was reportedly beaten to death with a fire extinguisher - remember? But that same officer was having dinner with his family the next evening (he did die of a stroke apparently the following day).The fire extinguisher aspect of the story was disputed and later withdrawn
from https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/brian-sicknick-fire-extinguisher/

Law enforcement officials initially said Mr. Sicknick was struck with a fire extinguisher, but weeks later, police sources and investigators were at odds over whether he was hit. Medical experts have said he did not die of blunt force trauma, according to one law enforcement official.You should read the official statement from the capitol police, he did not have dinner with his family - https://www.uscp.gov/media-center/press-releases/loss-uscp-colleague-brian-d-sicknick

He returned to his division office and collapsed. He was taken to a local hospital where he succumbed to his injuries.



And the funerals for the five officers. Do you remember seeing them on CNN or RTE? No, neither do I, and neither does anyone else. A monumental screw up wouldn't you say by a media which would move mountains just to have some mud to throw at DT. Hopefully, by now Tets, you can see that the gullible public in America and the world, was sold a bill of goods with the reporting that day.Why would anyone, anywhere, want to see the funerals of five men? It's exceedingly rare for any network to broadcast such an event.



The larger point about TC's credibility is that the man was a living legend on cable TV for a good number of years in America. He broke stories that none of the networks did, and he had the highest ratings of anyone in cable news. FOX loved him then and paid him a massive amount of money annually. FOX fired him for a reason. He was on a mission to bring the truth to the screen and if than meant exposing lies and deception on a grand scale, as it often did, then so be it. But FOX didn't want to go down that road with him.He was(and is) more of a showman than a reporter. He gamed the system by reporting aspects of a story that would get higher ratings, even if it meant leaving out relevant points. There was no confirmation from the network on why he was fired, various reports from around the time all give different reasons.

[joey B]

1904205971779408052

A completely mental situation,crazy stuff happening over there….

[Razors left peg]

1904205971779408052

A completely mental situation,crazy stuff happening over there….


He hires only the best people dont you know.

[dahamsta]

This thread should just be a laundry list of MAGA idiocy. Let's start with the dismantling of the Department of Education.

[tetsujin1979]

Adding a journalist to a group chat would have ended the careers of other security chiefs. Now it's just what happened on Monday

I found this to be interesting: https://www.project2025.observer/

[Razors left peg]

Further details of the group chat were released by the Atlantic today. Its clear in black and white the monumental fcuk up this was.... whatever about conducting national security by group chat, adding someone accidentally is incredible. Instead of taking ownership of it thought we are just getting the usual deny and deflect. Attacking The Atlantic, saying its a failing magazine, saying the editor who was added to the group chat is a liar. The lack of accountability would be beyond belief in any other time in politics.

Meanwhile in a completely separate issue, there was a congress woman from Texas who called the Governor " Governor Hot wheels" in a jokey speech. The man is in a wheel chair, so it was definitely an insensitive joke ( even if the guy is a pr1ck), but the faux outrage from MAGA land is incredible. Coming from the people who elected a President who has horrible nicknames for everyone, and openly mocked a disabled journalist at one of his rallies ... they want to have an official censure from congress for the insult. Its mindblowing!

Theres a World Cup in this country next year and I genuinely hope fans from the rest of the world boycott it. Its going to be a sh1tshow anyway. Match tickets will probably be about $500 each, just like every other event here, but it will be the perfect opportunity for the world to make their feelings known about this current administration.

[dahamsta]

Adding a journalist to a group chat would have ended the careers of other security chiefs. Now it's just what happened on Monday

I found this to be interesting: https://www.project2025.observer/

Jesus, it's incredible to see it in black and white.

[pineapple stu]

Why would you break up the Department of Education, of all things? Or roll back the goal of making the air easier to breathe?

It's mental how quickly he can action these things. Imagine how useful the office of President of the US could be if it wasn't filled by a deranged looney.