FAI Invites First Division Expressions of Interest

[gufct]

Interesting saying that the announcement and prospective withdrawal has actually been a motivation for the players. If Mervue do reach those play-offs, it might just be one more nail in the Galway FC coffin. There must be people involved with the club who don't want to leave the LOI.

There is only one member who wants them to stay in. Their stay in the LOI has financially crippled them as it has salthill where another ego maniac is the reason they are still in the league. Last weeks game against Longford Town saw a crowd of Approx 200 to see Mervue's biggest ever game and Lonford had the majority of supporters.

[El-Pietro]

I don't think there'd be many takers for those. If it was free, aye, or maybe a joint first/reserve team season ticket could be an option.

Depending on when the fixtures are, I'd make an effort to Derry ones. I couldn't see many people being willing to pay into the games though. As it is at the minute, our reserve/U21 games are free in, and get a handful of people. I'd only get to a few a season myself, though would certainly attend more if we were playing First Division teams.

Taking a leaf out of the GAA's book, having a double header (reserve match, followed by first team match) could work. Not sure how practical it would be for Friday night games though.
our u19 games are a fiver. We'd get a couple of hundred some days. I try and get out to see them but Sunday afternoons usually don't suit me - I'm currently at work. I'd make an effort to get out and watch a City reserve team if they played on Saturdays.

[legendz]

Just a question for fans of the clubs who would be in a position of entering a reserve team into the first division if it came to that.

As ye would now have a club with 2 teams in the senior divisions, would ye be going to see both teams play or just the 1st team?

What's the usual set-up of B teams as in are players registered to play for one team or both? Is the B team treated as if it were a different club. If you play for the first team, you're unable to play for the B team unless you're registered during a transfer window etc.?

[nigel-harps1954]

What's the usual set-up of B teams as in are players registered to play for one team or both? Is the B team treated as if it were a different club. If you play for the first team, you're unable to play for the B team unless you're registered during a transfer window etc.?


The way it works for Harps with the Ulster Senior League, is that after you make a certain number of appearances for the first team, you're deemed a 'senior player' as opposed to a reserve, so you'd be ineligible.

[TheBoss]

There is a recently setup Twitter feed about a possible team from Meath based in Navan entering the League of Ireland: https://twitter.com/meathsoccerteam

It is mentioned on they were contacted by the FAI yesterday, so maybe the wheels might be in motion?

[Charlie Darwin]

There is a recently setup Twitter feed about a possible team from Meath based in Navan entering the League of Ireland: https://twitter.com/meathsoccerteam

It is mentioned on they were contacted by the FAI yesterday, so maybe the wheels might be in motion?
Looks like a spoof to be honest.

[gufcfan]

Looks like a spoof to be honest.

Thought it was kids myself who are actually serious about it, so I didn't take the p iss.

[nigel-harps1954]

There's two of those pages, both on Twitter and Facebook. Seems like kids who haven't a clue really. When I enquired as to where they were getting the money and the facilities, and all within the year timeframe they're giving themselves, they didn't have any answers only "we're just trying to get LOI football to Meath".

[gufcfan]

In fairness, the LOI has seen worse plans!

[NeverFeltBetter]

I suppose every team has to start somewhere. FB page says they want to enter a team in the LSL, which is probably a more realistic ambition.

[Eminence Grise]

No mention of Champions League group stages, 20,000 all seater stadium in Kells, full-time pros. Not even a DVD for cryin' out loud.

I want to see all of that before I start to take them seriously.

[NeverFeltBetter]

It is so hard to get an LOI team going in such an area. Even if such a project had major financial backing you'd wonder if it would ever have the local support to make it viable.

[ATFC-1887]

It is a spoof page set up by a group of clowns of twitter who doe nothing but talk absolute scutter. They have a laois fc one too i think.

[Sheridan]

Yeah, clearly a feeble wind-up, although the Canadian dude behind this (http://foot.ie/threads/37197-Is-this-a-joke-Dublin-City-Mark-II?p=502964&viewfull=1#post502964) was entirely serious, but totally deluded. Tried to enter the LSL and got laughed out of it.

[Charlie Darwin]

Yeah, clearly a feeble wind-up, although the Canadian dude behind this (http://foot.ie/threads/37197-Is-this-a-joke-Dublin-City-Mark-II?p=502964&viewfull=1#post502964) was entirely serious, but totally deluded. Tried to enter the LSL and got laughed out of it.
How did I never hear of this before? That is absolutely hilarious.

[BonnieShels]

But Meath already have a club...


How did I never hear of this before? That is absolutely hilarious.

It was way before our time Charlie.

[GCdfc]

Are Drogheda planning to move again?

[adamd164]

John Caulfield hinted in his press conference this week that we might be considering entering a First Division team, he kept it vague but said the 'rumblings' were that the FAI were looking for clubs to consider it.

He mentioned cost was a factor but that he wants it to happen so the door seems to be open for it.

[Charlie Darwin]

John Caulfield hinted in his press conference this week that we might be considering entering a First Division team, he kept it vague but said the 'rumblings' were that the FAI were looking for clubs to consider it.

He mentioned cost was a factor but that he wants it to happen so the door seems to be open for it.
But I thought the FAI only wanted to help Shamrock Rovers at the expense of everybody else :confused:

[Dodge]

But I thought the FAI only wanted to help Shamrock Rovers at the expense of everybody else :confused:

Yes. this season. Pay attention Charlie...

[Charlie Darwin]

Ah right, mission accomplished so. Hopefully our mates at the FAI will force a couple of clubs into administration to allow us to compete.

[sadloserkid]

It is so hard to get an LOI team going in such an area.

Explain if you would. :confused:

[adamd164]

http://www.irishexaminer.com/sport/soccer/caulfield-envisages-cork-city-b-side-playing-first-division-266390.html


Caulfield envisages Cork City ‘B’ side playing First Division

By Denis Hurley

Cork City manager John Caulfield is in favour of the club following Shamrock Rovers and fielding a second team in the First Division of the SSE Airtricity League.

Keen to ensure players not in the first team retain match sharpness, Caulfield is keen to explore all avenues and believes a B team — as Rovers have this season — would best suit the club’s needs.

“People talk about the Munster Senior League being an option for us to get into and it possibly would, however that’s not the answer in the long term because you can’t play professional players,” Caulfield said.

“Even if we asked them if we could get in, we couldn’t play any of the fellas who are on the bench, so it’s not helping their situations.

“The ideal situation is either that there’s an U20 or 21 league or that we try to get into the first division. It looks as if the FAI are looking at expanding the First Division with reserve teams and if they are, that’s the way we should go. The problem is that the cost factor is huge, but in my opinion I would love it as it would be the answer to our problems.

“We could keep the U19s after their season ends and, as well, I believe that we would get about four or five hundred people at games.”

Caulfield will be forced to dip into his pool of reserves for tomorrow night’s clash with Bohemians at Turner’s Cross (kick-off 7.45pm) as Darren Dennehy misses out through suspension. The centre-back was red carded in Monday’s win over UCD, and Caulfield had no qualms with the decision.

“I had a bit of a chat with him and he thought he’d get a toe-poke away,” he said. “It was a bit of a clumsy challenge. We looked at it and he realised that it was a stupid challenge and that getting a red card put us under pressure.

“The lads know how tough I am about keeping our discipline. Darren knew he deserved it but the main thing is that he learns from it, as if you want to be competing at the top of the table you have to be able to choose from all your best players.”

Tonight’s game will be City’s fourth Friday game in a row at home. The average home gate this season is above 4,000 and Caulfield knows how important it is to continue to attract big crowds.

“I keep saying it to the lads that it’d be great for the season to stay up at the top and the crowds keep coming. As a player, you want to be playing in front of 5,500 people. The atmosphere has been electric, coming off against Drogheda last week after the late goals was tremendous. Long may it continue, but we need the supporters every week, that vocal ferocity. At 1-1 against Drogheda, the crowd sensed it was a tight match and kept right behind us. There’s no doubt that they play a huge part.”

[luiz]

This would be potentially bad for Cobh Ramblers no? Both in terms of attendances, loaning young players, sponsors, etc. Perhaps ideally Cobh could be a de facto Cork City B. Or maybe the plan is precisely to substitute Cobh Rambers.

Plus having 9 clubs is a quite tricky number to have a decent schedule. That leaves you with 36 rounds with each team playing 32 times which would be too much. Or 27 rounds with 24 matches in case teams play each other 3 times which might be too little. You would need one more (or, as it's usually the case in Ireland, one less) team to come up with a good schedule.

[nigel-harps1954]

Slowly bringing the death knell to the First Division and gives more fuel to an extended 18 team Premier Division.

[gufcfan]

Single-tier LOI would be death-knell of the LOI.

[Mr A]

Why so?

[NeverFeltBetter]

I'd imagine they'd look for at least two more reserve teams next year - out of Cork, Pats, Sligo maybe - to get an even ten in the division (if no new clubs come forward that is).

[gufcfan]

Why so?

So many teams with nothing to play for, many before a ball is even kicked, realistically.

[nigel-harps1954]

So many teams with nothing to play for, many before a ball is even kicked, realistically.

As opposed to the teams already with nothing to play for? Shockingly poor argument against it really.

[gufcfan]

As opposed to the teams already with nothing to play for? Shockingly poor argument against it really.

No promotion, no relegation. Nonsense of an answer imo.

[nigel-harps1954]

No promotion, no relegation. Nonsense of an answer imo.

Yet slowly strengthening what's there and giving other teams who haven't a chance something worth playing for. What sense is it for the likes of Cobh to remain in the league at the minute when they're going to stay rooted to the bottom of the First Division anyway, when at least in an extended Premier they'll get a home game every year against the likes of St. Pat's, Shamrock Rovers, Cork City and others who will attract a decent crowd.

The argument can be made for the weakening of the Premier, but the strong teams will remain strong, and they'll remain battling amongst each other for the league title, let the teams with nothing to play for worry about that themselves, besides the greater prize money for finishing higher up the league table being a bit of incentive.

Should the English Premier League be shortened to 10 teams because half the sides in it have nothing to play for? Same to be said for La Liga, Bundesliga, etc. Absolute nonsense.

An extended Premier is more attractive to sponsors, makes derby matches a bit more special, and most importantly, makes everyone equal.

[Dodge]

Yet slowly strengthening what's there and giving other teams who haven't a chance something worth playing for. What sense is it for the likes of Cobh to remain in the league at the minute when they're going to stay rooted to the bottom of the First Division anyway
As much as sense getting slaughtered by other teams


when at least in an extended Premier they'll get a home game every year against the likes of St. Pat's, Shamrock Rovers, Cork City and others who will attract a decent crowd.
This is the worst argument about a one team division. Bringing an extra 1,000 or so people in will not help how Harps, or any club, is run.


The argument can be made for the weakening of the Premier, but the strong teams will remain strong, and they'll remain battling amongst each other for the league title, let the teams with nothing to play for worry about that themselves, besides the greater prize money for finishing higher up the league table being a bit of incentive.
Are you seriously arguing for a one division league on the basis of "let the teams with nothing to play for worry about that themselves"


Should the English Premier League be shortened to 10 teams because half the sides in it have nothing to play for? Same to be said for La Liga, Bundesliga, etc. Absolute nonsense.
The only nonsense here is you selectively comparing the LOI to the 3 biggest leagues in the world. Look I can do it too; they have relegation/promotion....


An extended Premier is more attractive to sponsors,
What basis do you think it's more attractive to sponsors? You're guessing and talking about your club aren't you. I'll guess that sponsors of other clubs are happy enough with the way it is.


, and most importantly, makes everyone equal.
Football isn't about equality. It's a meritocracy.

[Charlie Darwin]

I'd imagine they'd look for at least two more reserve teams next year - out of Cork, Pats, Sligo maybe - to get an even ten in the division (if no new clubs come forward that is).
Sligo wouldn't have the numbers for a reserve team I don't think. Cork and Pats would make sense, if Pats can afford it.

[Macy]

Single-tier LOI would be death-knell of the LOI.
The league survived from 1921 until 1985 as a single division league.

If people really brought into the "giving teams something to play for", there'd be more relegation and promotion places. Have it 3 down from the premier (suck more teams into that) and 3 up from the first. 4th from bottom could play off with 4th in the first as well. Lots of teams with lots to play for, all season.

[nigel-harps1954]

As much as sense getting slaughtered by other teams

I don't see how this is a given at all.


This is the worst argument about a one team division. Bringing an extra 1,000 or so people in will not help how Harps, or any club, is run.

Never suggested it would help how any club is run, but it would make more games attractive to more teams.


Are you seriously arguing for a one division league on the basis of "let the teams with nothing to play for worry about that themselves"

Selective quoting. Classic foot.ie. My main point is that there's currently half the teams in both leagues that have as good as nothing to play for already. Anyone genuinely believe Athlone won't get relegated now, or anyone genuinely believe Cobh will get promoted? Don't forget Shamrock Rovers B who have nothing to play for since game one.



The only nonsense here is you selectively comparing the LOI to the 3 biggest leagues in the world. Look I can do it too; they have relegation/promotion....

My point is as valid as any of the rest. I only compared the LOI to those leagues because there's still 7 or 8 teams that play for absolutely nothing in each of those leagues, which seems to be the widest used argument against an extended League of Ireland Premier. Irrespective of the strength of those leagues, I could have used any terrible league in the world with a large Premier Division with the same argument.


What basis do you think it's more attractive to sponsors? You're guessing and talking about your club aren't you. I'll guess that sponsors of other clubs are happy enough with the way it is.

I've already stated why it's more attractive. Bigger derby games happening less frequently, wider spread location in the same division. Those two reasons alone make for a more attractive league.


Football isn't about equality. It's a meritocracy.

Of course it is, I do agree, but when things simply aren't working as they are, something has to give.

Try spending a few years in the First Division with St Pat's and you'll automatically realise how desperately bad it is. You honestly have no idea how little anyone cares about it. It simply needs to be scrapped, and the whole League of Ireland revamped.

[Charlie Darwin]

You honestly have no idea how little anyone cares about it.
If it was a competitive league people would care. Cork and Shels certainly cared when they were battling for promotion. The problem is the general apathy towards Irish soccer.

[Dodge]

You honestly have no idea how little anyone cares about it. It simply needs to be scrapped, and the whole League of Ireland revamped.
Sounds way too much like 'we can't get promoted, so help us out here' to me

In real terms no one cares about the premier division either.

Do you want revamping, or do you want a simple change to one division? Moving to one league won't help anyone if that's all that happens. There's been loads of tinkering with the league make up

The whole basis for your argument above seems to be 'we're **** with nothing to play for, why can't we be **** with a couple of games against Rovers and Cork?'

[gufcfan]

I sincerely hope it's against some UEFA rule that you have to have at least one division below the top flight. Then again what are UEFA rules to the FAI...

[Charlie Darwin]

I sincerely hope it's against some UEFA rule that you have to have at least one division below the top flight. Then again what are UEFA rules to the FAI...
As far as I know, it's not written in law, but UEFA's policy is that all league systems should have multiple tiers and any deviation from that would cause problems for entering teams into European competition.

[Longfordian]

As far as I know, it's not written in law, but UEFA's policy is that all league systems should have multiple tiers and any deviation from that would cause problems for entering teams into European competition.

I believe they can waive such a rule where the non promotion of certain clubs contravenes the European Convention On Human Rights. Apparently more than eh..8.. years consecutively in such a hellhole breaches the Convention.

[Charlie Darwin]

I believe they can waive such a rule where the non promotion of certain clubs contravenes the European Convention On Human Rights. Apparently more than eh..8.. years consecutively in such a hellhole breaches the Convention.
I believe they can choose not to waive that rule when in such cases where it's funny :)

[outspoken]

I would have to agree with dodge that promotion and relegation is part of football and scrapping the first division would take that away. Last seasons play-off campaign was the best I've ever witnessed on terms of both the football on show and the atmosphere and build up around the games. The crowds were impressive too so why take that experience away from supporters even if they do have to watch a lot of sh1te before that, but Trust me it's worth it and that's coming from a fan who saw his team lose in the final!

[nigel-harps1954]

I'd like to know what the alternatives are then? Including a load of B teams in the First Division? The First Division isn't working as it is. I've been around for several promotions and relegations as a Harps fan, I know the joy of getting promoted, and the devastation of relegation. Obviously a league isn't the same without it, but I feel that it's completely irrelevant when you consider how the First Division is going further and further down the sh!tter as each season passes.

Everyone seems so very opposed to scrapping the First Division, but nobody seems to be able to come up with a better alternative other than adding in more B teams.

[Dodge]

Everyone seems so very opposed to scrapping the First Division, but nobody seems to be able to come up with a better alternative other than adding in more B teams.

The Premier Division is hardly setting the world on fire. You might want to fix that too while you're searching for answers

[Nesta99]

Hows about the very original idea of having one league for all and then splitting after one round on merit in to a top ten trophy and a bottom half graveyard - Harps get a visit from the mighty and wealthy and then the mighty and wealthy get to scrap for inclusion at the business end of the season. Those not in the upper section might spend a season in fear of the grim reaper but no more so than those in the 1st division now. And think of all the fun with say Waterford trawling through player registrations if they dont make the top ten or Galway with a stack of DVD's ready to disperse and during the season too! Would win the best soap opera/drama at all the tv awards - and if Shamrock Rovers A and B ended up in the also rans that would BE the bonus feature on the DVD!

Ok maybe not then!

[nigel-harps1954]

The Premier Division is hardly setting the world on fire. You might want to fix that too while you're searching for answers

The Premier Division is a damn sight better than the First Division, despite it's flaws.

[Dodge]

The Premier Division is a damn sight better than the First Division, despite it's flaws.

We're getting back to my point about the better clubs being in the higher division here...

[bluewhitearmy]

I'd like to know what the alternatives are then? Including a load of B teams in the First Division? The First Division isn't working as it is. I've been around for several promotions and relegations as a Harps fan, I know the joy of getting promoted, and the devastation of relegation. Obviously a league isn't the same without it, but I feel that it's completely irrelevant when you consider how the First Division is going further and further down the sh!tter as each season passes.

Everyone seems so very opposed to scrapping the First Division, but nobody seems to be able to come up with a better alternative other than adding in more B teams.

I'd like to know what actual benefits one league would have?

[Mr A]

The league is in bad shape- never before have we been in a situation where a reserve side had to be invited in just to make the first division up to eight teams. Survival in the first division is incredibly tough- I know Harps walk a tightrope just to survive year to year. I'm sure it's the same at Waterford, Shelbourne, Wexford, Cobh. Galway are just back and being debt free with major sponsors is a huge advantage while Longford seem to have enough backing to tick over. But no doubt the people running both clubs know how difficult just surviving is- and the scary thing is you don't have to do too much wrong to find yourself in a world of hurt. You only half to fall short once and your club could slip under. And the longer you're down there the harder it gets and the finer the margins become. Certainly the likes of Harps and Waterford are paying for past sins as well as for being in the graveyard- but it's not good when good clubs who have brought a lot to the league are struggling simply not to die.

The irony here is that most of the clubs that the league has lost have actually come from the premier division.

But in any case the depressing thing is the lack of a plan. We know the clubs aren't going to come up with it- each will protect their own interests. The FAI have shown no interest in strategy- simply dealing with each crisis as it arises instead. I don't have all the answers by any means, but it's a sad situation when there is no evidence that the governing body have a vision for the league. Unless hoping the problems go away counts as a vision. Perhaps things will improve if O'Neill can get the national team playing and the financial situation of the FAI improves. But at the moment it seems to me just a matter of time before we lose more clubs.