Ireland V Sweden(A) 22 March & Austria(H) - 26 March 2013 - World Cup 2014 Qualifiers

[Crosby87]

If you look at the way the remaining schedule shakes out, and assuming Germany is not going to roll over for SWE on 15 OCT, it shakes out do-able for us.
http://www.uefa.com/worldcup/season=2014/standings/round=2000294/group=2001658/index.html

[Closed Account 2]

I think we would have lost that under Stan, I agree Trap's not setting Irish football alight and to say he's doing an average job is a bit generous, but Stan was many rungs further down the ladder.

[brine3]

If you look at the way the remaining schedule shakes out, and assuming Germany is not going to roll over for SWE on 15 OCT, it shakes out do-able for us.
http://www.uefa.com/worldcup/season=2014/standings/round=2000294/group=2001658/index.html

Of course it is still doable, that's why all is not lost if we get somebody who is positive and has basic communication skills in charge of the team.

[geysir]

We needed to win to make it doable, We didn't, we are out of the running. And we deserve to be out of it.

[Closed Account 2]

Who though? I don't see any credible candidates save Brian McDermott and even he would be a risk

[Grafter]

This campaign has eerie similarities with World Cup 2006 campaign.... and tonight's match with Israel 2-2 home game ....

[NeverFeltBetter]

Not worth sacking Trap now. Time for that, if they were going to do it, was October. Might as well let him see out this campaign, encourage him to blood new players. Still that faint hope it can all come right, but requires Ireland to do things they haven't been able to do under Trapattoni.

[geysir]

What's the panic with finding a new manager, there's plenty of time. This campaign is a write off.

[zero]

surprised at the number of people who think we are 'still in the running' after that.

i suppose we are if we have a succession of miracles. you could see it coming a mile off, sitting further and further back in the second half. the bizarre substitutions did not help.

no real point sticking with trap for the remainder - he'll be what, 77 come the next euros? just going through the motions til the end of this campaign now hoping to finish 3rd.

[SkStu]

I think we would have lost that under Stan, I agree Trap's not setting Irish football alight and to say he's doing an average job is a bit generous, but Stan was many rungs further down the ladder.

I dont think Stans tenure is what we should be comparing our expectations against. That trap is many rungs above Stan says more about how terrible Stan was than how great Trap is.

Trap is a failure.

[BonnieShels]

Massive setback, almost feels as bad as Macedonia in 99, but only ourselves to blame. After going a goal down we really got at them and it was obvious that while they are good technical footballers they were a pile of **** at the back. I thought we'd try and stay a bit more positive in the 2nd half but we sat back waiting for the inevitable. You might get away with it sometimes against teams like Armenia and so forth but if you keep sitting back eventually it comes back to haunt you. The substitutions or lack thereof were disappointing. Sammon was so bad he was useful for 60 minutes or so because Austria didn't know what to do with him. However, he needed to be called ashore at that stage. After winning the free kick in the corner on 90 minutes we made a serious hash of it when we could have at least run down the clock by a minute. We got away with home draws against Bulgaria, Slovakia etc. because they were so poor but Sweden are seasoned qualifiers and this result will give Austria hope so this result imo is fatal to our hopes.

This is it. I haven't felt so low in a while. As I said after the Swedish match I'm sick of drawing when we should win and going out and getting gutsy draws. We can play when we're allowed.

Sammon was useful as the Austrians hadn't a clue how to handle him and Long was magnificent in taking on the knockdowns when they came.

McClean had is best game in an Irish shirt. McCarthy's ability to spot some of the passes he made was something to behold at times.

But once we had them on the ropes we tired and Plan A wasn't gonna work when we were tired. Wessi or Doyle needed to come on at that stage. I had no issue with Green coming on or even Long going off but how the formation went at that stage was unacceptable.

For some people to write off that goal as bad luck or a bad deflection is a cop-out. When you allow a player the space that Alaba had to take a shot through a crowded box you end up with something like that. We had done everything right and again an Irish team failed to kill off an inferior opponent. So what that they can pass the pall, so could the Armenians but we were better than them tonight and changing our tactics from 60' onwards would have won that game handily.

I wanted to wait to see tonight out before making my judgement and we need a change at the top. NOW!
The only thing that Alaba's goal did was make me feel ill it hasn't affected my judgement on Trap.

That last 30' was why Trap should go. Not the equaliser. A pox.

[geysir]

I think we would have lost that under Stan, I agree Trap's not setting Irish football alight and to say he's doing an average job is a bit generous, but Stan was many rungs further down the ladder.
I don't know. We got Germany as second seeds in that Euro Qual draw, that meant we were basically fcked before a ball was kicked. We beat Wales and Slovakia at home and drew with the Czech rep. we were playing 3 dead rubbers after the 2 away games. For sure Stan was a few rungs down the ladder but the qualitative differences between his results/performances and Trap's, were not that great.

[BonnieShels]

This campaign has eerie similarities with World Cup 2006 campaign.... and tonight's match with Israel 2-2 home game ....

Exactly what it felt like.

GAH to EASTER games!

[ArdeeBhoy]

Bah, surely?

[Murfinator]

We needed to win to make it doable, We didn't, we are out of the running. And we deserve to be out of it.

We're 2 points ahead of Austria (dropped to kazakh) and 1 behind Sweden (gained at germany) in the mini table with 4 games to go. We're in as good a position now as we were ever likely to be in and the exact same as every other campaign. We were never able to beat Slovakia or Bulgaria home or away either who were both weaker to Austria or Sweden. Stop the hyperbolic nonsense.

[born2bwild]

What's the panic with finding a new manager, there's plenty of time. This campaign is a write off.
Yes, this campaign is a write off. So Trap out now to give A N Other a chance to bed in before the campaign for the next Euros begins.

[zero]

We're 2 points ahead of Austria (dropped to kazakh) and 1 behind Sweden (gained at germany) in the mini table with 4 games to go. We're in as good a position now as we were ever likely to be in and the exact same as every other campaign. We were never able to beat Slovakia or Bulgaria home or away either who were both weaker to Austria or Sweden. Stop the hyperbolic nonsense.

barring more than one miracle, we're out. deal with it.

[BonnieShels]

We're 2 points ahead of Austria (dropped to kazakh) and 1 behind Sweden (gained at germany) in the mini table with 4 games to go. We're in as good a position now as we were ever likely to be in and the exact same as every other campaign. We were never able to beat Slovakia or Bulgaria home or away either who were both weaker to Austria or Sweden. Stop the hyperbolic nonsense.

If we had beaten Austria tonight like we should have we would be in an infinitely better position. We wouldn't now be under pressure to get 6 points against them in the remaining matches. Stop your faux-realistic nonsense.

geysir is right, we f**ked it up!

[elroy]

I think this is the night I finally lose patience with Trap. We have been here several nights before - Georgia, Cyprus, Slovakia, Macedonia are just three examples, where the fact pattern was very similar, but we got away with it each of those nights.

The vast majority of us freezing our balls off in the ground could see the change in approach from 65 mins or so. We stopped attacking, gave away the ball constantly and let the Austrians come on to us. And you know what the most annoying thing is, they were quite weak at the back and we were causing them serious trouble with set pieces. Why not keep attacking, keep an offensive attitude.

Changes were long overdue and when they were made, they were not up to scratch. For me, Long shouldve stayed on. I think Sammon offered very little and is a very poor mans Doyle. I wouldve liked to see Hoolahan on for a very tired Whelan, there was also a case for Wilson to be taken off as he looked unfit/tired in last 20 mins. Also wouldve liked to see either Keogh or Brady on for last ten mins to run at them while hitting them on the break.

A massive opportunity missed to really set us up in the group. We need to break this hoodoo of not winning at home. We cant rely on others this time - we must beat Sweden at home and possibly Austria away but certainly the Sweden win is a must. Looks like it will either be our group or group E that wont get a playoff spot.

[ArdeeBhoy]

Faux-realism? Now there's a concept...

[BonnieShels]

I think this is the night I finally lose patience with Trap. We have been here several nights before - Georgia, Cyprus, Slovakia, Macedonia are just three examples, where the fact pattern was very similar, but we got away with it each of those nights.

The vast majority of us freezing our balls off in the ground could see the change in approach from 65 mins or so. We stopped attacking, gave away the ball constantly and let the Austrians come on to us. And you know what the most annoying thing is, they were quite weak at the back and we were causing them serious trouble with set pieces. Why not keep attacking, keep an offensive attitude.

Changes were long overdue and when they were made, they were not up to scratch. For me, Long shouldve stayed on. I think Sammon offered very little and is a very poor mans Doyle. I wouldve liked to see Hoolahan on for a very tired Whelan, there was also a case for Wilson to be taken off as he looked unfit/tired in last 20 mins. Also wouldve liked to see either Keogh or Brady on for last ten mins to run at them while hitting them on the break.

A massive opportunity missed to really set us up in the group. We need to break this hoodoo of not winning at home. We cant rely on others this time - we must beat Sweden at home and possibly Austria away but certainly the Sweden win is a must.

Every time we swung in a ball they were like u10s. They couldn't deal with crosses.

A few more in swingers would have killed them.


Faux-realism? Now there's a concept...

That's what post-Ireland game clarity is for.

Murf is practicing a realism I don't think he can honestly believe in.

[ArdeeBhoy]

Agree with Elroy, but we're probably more 'likely' to win in Austria than at home to the Swedes.
I can see another two draws, even now.

Who knows how they'll play v.each other. Obviously two draws are preferable...
But can also see our group having the 'worst' 2nd. place and automatic elimination for whoever, regardless.

[BonnieShels]

Well, regardless if second doesn't get us into the play-offs I still want to finish second.

[Closed Account 2]

I don't know. We got Germany as second seeds in that Euro Qual draw, that meant we were basically fcked before a ball was kicked. We beat Wales and Slovakia at home and drew with the Czech rep. we were playing 3 dead rubbers after the 2 away games. For sure Stan was a few rungs down the ladder but the qualitative differences between his results/performances and Trap's, were not that great.

We lost 5-2 in Cyprus under Stan, we nearly came unstuck in San Marino of all teams, we lost to the Czechs in Prague Under Trap weve drawn too many but the teams we've lost to (h France, h Germany, h Russia) have all been top tier. I think Trap has been significantly better than Stan and also Kerr. I'd like us to be playing better football and converting the draws into wins but I don't think there is any point in getting rid of Trap where there are ZERO credible better alternatives who would take the job. A lot of people have said "Trap out" but who could we get in?

[Real ale Madrid]

You would have to think that given Sweden's recent results , their performance against us was below what they normally produce. Looking at how brutal Austria were tonight in the first half, especially regarding set pieces, I'd expect Sweden to beat them twice.

Tonight was a must win. We are now out barring a miracle.

[SwanVsDalton]

Agree with most of what I'm reading here. Trap blew it and when you ride your luck for four years you're bound to get slapped eventually. Fully deserved. We needed more leadership. When James McClean is the one screaming at players to step out then it's obvious there's an issue.

Players blew it through a lack of composure and management blew ultimately for once again fostering a system which allowed the opposition back in.

My only decision issue was leaving Sammon on for 90. Thought he was well out of his depth but, regardless, he was off his feet after 65. Pressing from the front was clearly Trap's thinking but one of our striker's was puffed. Ridiculous.

[elroy]

Interesting to hear Brady at HT warn that we must not "back off" in the second half and protect the lead.

[Olé Olé]

Few interesting bits in the RTE post-match coverage. Tony O'Donoghue stated that Shane Long told the press that he wasn't tired. This wasn't expressed during his interview following the man of the match awarding so I'm assuming it was communicated by Long when pressed by a journo somewhere in the mix.

It can't possibly be that Long is less fit that Conor Sammon who worked admirably and got on plenty headers and knock-ons but his touch was constantly laboured and didn't improve with fatigue. Furthermore, where is the logic in replacing Long up front with Walters who had run his heart out and, in effect, played in two positions or more? So there was two players who should have made way if Trap did want to bring in Green. Why he wanted to bring in Green is beyond me anyway. Even if his goal-scoring form has been mitigated, that game was tailor-made for someone with the industry and application of Kevin Doyle, although that wasn't going to happen either.

Liam Brady put in quite an exhibition in studio. He deemed our players completely inferior to the Austrians (I didn't see it) and showed his displeasure with O'Donoghue, with Billo taking umbrage with this immediately. I hadn't agreed with the aggressive and vindictive line of interviewing O'Donoghue had been taking of late but, from my own perspective as a fan, Tony was indeed posing the questions that the public did want answers to.

[geysir]

I don't think there is any point in getting rid of Trap where there are ZERO credible better alternatives who would take the job. A lot of people have said "Trap out" but who could we get in?
At some stage between now and november, the decision will be made to look for a replacement. It's an inevitability. Trap should anyway step down when it's mathematically impossible to qualify. Who will replace him is another question, but it will be the only question, not the question of wondering if there's anybody better than what we have now.

[BonnieShels]

Brady shouldn't be near the RTÉ studio whilst Trap is in charge. It's maddening.

[NeverFeltBetter]

Long seemed to get knocked over and didn't get a free, and then immediately raced back and barged into what I think was the same player who had (possibly) fouled him. He did it cynically and right in front of the referee. There may have been a worry that he had lost his head.

Putting Green on for him was fine, but Green needed to be in the middle, where Abara wound up for his shot at goal.

[tricky_colour]

True that, can't blame McCarthy though. What's he supposed to do? Pass the ball to himself? He can't run the entire midfield by himself. At Wigan he plays in a functioning system.

You are allowed to run with the ball.

[zero]

i'm over the initial disappointment of the late leveller and now i'm just depressed.

the idea of going to work in the morning is galling. why do i do this to myself! euro 2016 qualifiers seem a long long way off...

[born2bwild]

Liam Brady comes across as aggressive and willfully, thick-headedly stubborn on those panels - of course, Dunphy's sensationalism winds him up but the thought Brady might be in line to take over from Trap is not a pleasant one for me.

[Eminence Grise]

A lot of people have said "Trap out" but who could we get in?

Coco the f***ing Clown.
Tony Robinson so his time team can carbon date Trap's tactics.
Abraham Maslow - I know he's dead, but he's still one hell of a motivator.

Basically anybody, with or without a pulse, is an improvement. Somebody who has the ability to recognise that players like Hoolahan and Brady may not be world beaters, but they're a step up from the kind of knuckle-dragging anti-football that Trap has us playing. Somebody who won't s**t on the bit of footballing tradition we have: who knows that for every Glen Whelan, we've had a Chippy or a Giles; for every Sammon, a Stapleton or a Quinn - and that that means something to us.

Ciao, Gio. Arrivederci. Time to go - a piu non posso.

[BonnieShels]

i'm over the initial disappointment of the late leveller and now i'm just depressed.

the idea of going to work in the morning is galling. why do i do this to myself! euro 2016 qualifiers seem a long long way off...

We're only half way through this campaign and then some summer 2014 friendlies to play before then. Probably against inferior teams who made it to Brazil.
I'll never forget that sickening feeling beating Paraguay and Algeria in the RDS and thinking the whole time, "What if...?"

[BonnieShels]

Coco the f***ing Clown.
Tony Robinson so his time team can carbon date Trap's tactics.
Abraham Maslow - I know he's dead, but he's still one hell of a motivator.

Basically anybody, with or without a pulse, is an improvement. Somebody who has the ability to recognise that players like Hoolahan and Brady may not be world beaters, but they're a step up from the kind of knuckle-dragging anti-football that Trap has us playing. Somebody who won't s**t on the bit of footballing tradition we have: who knows that for every Glen Whelan, we've had a Chippy or a Giles; for every Sammon, a Stapleton or a Quinn - and that that means something to us.

Ciao, Gio. Arrivederci. Time to go - a piu non posso.


When he's angry. You certainly feel it. With you 100%.

[Bungle]

Trap has to go. I don't understand how anybody can promote him staying on with us. As predicted by pretty much every person around me, we sat back and let Austria get the goal. We deserved that donkey kick in the teeth. They were there for the taking.trap takes off long who had a very good game and leaves on sammon who was absolutely knackered after 60 minutes. He baffled me by not starting wes hoolahan, but him not bringing him on in the 2nd half was a disgrace. Surely, you should get players on the pitch who can keep possession and you certainly shouldn't take off the striker who has good energy and ball control.

As I left the stadium, I had some comfort from the fact that we have a batch of young lads there who are going to be very good players for us. In the case of Coleman and McCarthy, they can go to the very top in my opinion. Both those two and Wilson should be seasoned internationals by now. Anyhow, we have a good team in the making there and with the right manager, we can have far more good days than bad in the future.

[BonnieShels]

I'm going to bed now. I look forward to that empty feeling in the morning.

I last had it hmmmmmm, about 930am on 19 November 2010.

At least there's no hangover this time.

[PatJR]

totally sickened. Side note - cannot understand people leaving at 90 mins when a qualifier is at 2-1!! Why were they there?

Anyway, for me what lost it was not Conor sammon or subbing green for long. It was to instruct Walters to go up front and keep 4-4-2 shape with 5 mins to go when you have already conceded possession in the game. Just makes no sense at all. When I saw green being ready I thought, at last an extra body in there, if you're not going to take them on playing then at least flood midfield!!

However playing sammon for the 90 was just pure stubbornness. I heard one "fan" remark on leaving, "baldy headed ****". So unfair on the lad really, he did ok first half but his game was over after 50 mins.

[Crosby87]

I'm going to bed now.
At least there's no hangover this time.

Yeah but as usual when you are like this, there is no way in hell you will be able to figure out what happened to your pants.

[Closed Account]

https://fbcdn-sphotos-h-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-snc6/10104_10151568970821323_1457749159_n.jpg
Heaven knows they're miserable now.

[Crosby87]

At least he stayed til the end!

[elroy]

Ugghh that sickening disappointed feeling that comes with the course of been an Ireland fan, and my hopes werent even that high coming into these two games. Ah well here we go again............time will pass by, we will beat the Faroes and suddenly the optimism will kick in again weeks ahead of the Sweden game. That could be a great night for us.........................

Or just plain deluded...

[elroy]

Oh and one more thing, anyone else think Robbie wouldve made a difference tonight. I think he would. There were a few times where we didnt make the best of our attacks or the striker was ahead of the play etc. The goal poaching instincts of Keano may well have got the third we did need in the end.

[BonnieShels]

Yip. He defo would.

Would be nice not to have to rely on him you know, for once though.

[mark12345]

Coco the f***ing Clown.

Basically anybody, with or without a pulse, is an improvement. .[/I]

Couldn't have said it better myself.

Let's get these mixed feelings out of our minds about Trap. If there is a bit of sentiment out there for the Italian still, then just remind yourself that McCarthy would not have played in Stockholm had Whelan been fit. There's a thought. Look what Wheland did tonight against Austria. He is a pathetic footballer, no ifs or buts. Sammon was a joke. Hoolahan was the choice - we would have beaten them with him in the team, or even Robbie Brady. How can so many people see it and the manager not?

I lost respect for Trap when he didn't follow on after Paris and have the team play the way they were capable. And then he publicly promised to change tactics after the Euros. But it has been and always be the same old drivel under this manager. Ok we are a limited team but we have two or three who can play and bring the best out in the others, but they're just swept under the carpet by a now clueless manager

[mypost]

Brady shouldn't be near the RTÉ studio whilst Trap is in charge.

Only for him, there would be no balance on the panel, which would be a fault in the coverage.

We have the same points after the weekend as the other contenders, and it took a 30-yard deflected effort 65 seconds from time to rob us of an important win. It could be better, but it's certainly not over.

[DannyInvincible]

Sickening result. Saw the Austrian equaliser coming a mile off. My heart was racing for the last ten minutes; my head begging Trap to do something to relieve the pressure. Putting Green on the right wing was just bizarre. Long played a blinder. Walters and McClean also did well and it was pleasing to see us stage such an impressive comeback by half-time after the shaky start. If we'd continued in that mould, rather than regressing to the negative tactics and inviting on an ultimately insurmountable amount of pressure, we'd be celebrating three points, but we threw it away, as is so typical. Nobody to blame but ourselves, or Trap, to be more precise. Indefensible mismanagement. He made it very clear himself before the game that anything less than three points from this wasn't good enough. Fair play to the Austrians; they kept plugging away, took advantage of our neanderthal tactics and fully deserved their equaliser.

[DannyInvincible]

We have the same points after the weekend as the other contenders

C'mon, don't kid yourself. Sweden have a game in hand.


and it took a 30-yard deflected effort 65 seconds from time to rob us of an important win.

They all count. And that one has cost us very dearly. No way in hell you can claim we were robbed.


It could be better, but it's certainly not over.

Barring a miracle. Are you genuinely optimistic?...