View Full Version : Promotion / Relegation Play - Offs 2012
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Iorfa2MaccaJim
19/08/2012, 4:14 PM
Hi lads.
I was just wondering what is the Play - Off format now that Monaghan have withdrawn from the league ?
NeverFeltBetter
19/08/2012, 5:32 PM
The same: Winner of FD takes Mons old place. 11th in the top tier faces the winner of a play-off between second and third in the lower tier. Both two-legged affairs I assume. All subject to change depending on how the FAI wants to mess with the structure of the league.
nigel-harps1954
19/08/2012, 8:15 PM
Be some craic if we had a 7 team first division next season.
NeverFeltBetter
19/08/2012, 8:19 PM
They'd just have to bite the bullet and let someone else in (if they retained a two league structure). If SD Galway can be a LOI team, plenty of non-league teams could be too.
nigel-harps1954
19/08/2012, 8:23 PM
If rumours are anything to go by (which they usually aren't) Mervue and Salthill are both considering dropping out of the league to be replaced by GUST.
NeverFeltBetter
19/08/2012, 8:29 PM
I dunno. I have a feeling Salthill will struggle on beyond all reason.
blue til i die
19/08/2012, 8:36 PM
The same: Winner of FD takes Mons old place. 11th in the top tier faces the winner of a play-off between second and third in the lower tier. Both two-legged affairs I assume. All subject to change depending on how the FAI wants to mess with the structure of the league.
Play-off between the two First Division teams in just one leg. Match with Premier team is two games.
Martinho II
19/08/2012, 9:02 PM
Play-off between the two First Division teams in just one leg. Match with Premier team is two games.
are you sure about that? I am adamant that the playoff between 1st div sides is two legged!
nigel-harps1954
19/08/2012, 9:22 PM
He's 100% right. The First Division play-off is one leg.
Longfordian
19/08/2012, 9:48 PM
Thought that myself. 2nd plays 3rd at home. Given our home form as opposed to our away form part of me would prefer to play away. Though a play off wouldn't be like a normal league game, more of a cup tie. Hard to know really, wouldn't fancy either ourselves or Waterford against UCD or Dundalk anyway. Playing better teams week in week out is a big advantage.
If rumours are anything to go by (which they usually aren't) Mervue and Salthill are both considering dropping out of the league to be replaced by GUST.
I dunno. I have a feeling Salthill will struggle on beyond all reason.
Talks between the FAI, GFA, GUST, Mervue and Salthill are ongoing.
Spencer707
07/09/2012, 12:40 PM
Cant see galway having 2 teams last season , especially with them both sharing a bottom 2 position between them. Like many have said maybe a 1 Galway team but i can see the same happening with that ...
holidaysong
09/09/2012, 1:45 PM
are you sure about that? I am adamant that the playoff between 1st div sides is two legged!
Well according to the fixture list from the league website, the First Division play-off is two leg this year:
http://www.airtricityleague.ie/images/stories/2012_Airtricity_League_first_Division_Fixture_List .pdf
nigel-harps1954
09/09/2012, 3:49 PM
Well according to the fixture list from the league website, the First Division play-off is two leg this year:
http://www.airtricityleague.ie/images/stories/2012_Airtricity_League_first_Division_Fixture_List .pdf
Hard to trust that website this year. Absolute disgrace. Best to check with extratime.ie, least they have correct information usually.
citybone
10/09/2012, 3:51 PM
Will there be a playoff? I know the FAI are a shambles but i dought even they would force a 6 or 7 team First division. I would guess a 18 team league next year with Gust being the only team in Galway.
bluewhitearmy
10/09/2012, 3:58 PM
Have GUST got anything put together to even have a club?
harps1954
11/09/2012, 3:09 PM
He's 100% right. The First Division play-off is one leg.
He (and yourself Nigel) are 100% wrong. The First Divison play-off is over two legs.
One of the reasons for this is because the FD ends two weeks before the PD. FD ends on 13th October. So, while the PD clubs are playing their last two games of the season on weekends of 19th October and 26th October, the two FD clubs in the play-offs will be playing the two legs of the play-offs. This has been in the fixture list since the start of the season.
FD play-off dates are:
Fri/Sat 19th/20th Oct - 3rd v 2nd
Fri/Sat 26th/27th Oct - 2nd v 3rd
No dates in the fixture list for the play-off final though.
NeverFeltBetter
11/09/2012, 10:25 PM
If the table finishes the way it is now, I could see Limerick and Waterford in the top tier. If Maguire plays to form anyway.
L.T.F.C.
12/09/2012, 9:47 AM
:(
Come on the town!
oriel
12/09/2012, 11:16 AM
I think the FD club will be at a major disadvantage. First they will have to negotiate their way through either a one or two leg game from their own Div, then they are at home first in another 2 game series, so they could have four games to get through, and the final one will def be away.
Then again, will there be a need for a FD next year ?
blue til i die
12/09/2012, 1:35 PM
He (and yourself Nigel) are 100% wrong. The First Divison play-off is over two legs.
One of the reasons for this is because the FD ends two weeks before the PD. FD ends on 13th October. So, while the PD clubs are playing their last two games of the season on weekends of 19th October and 26th October, the two FD clubs in the play-offs will be playing the two legs of the play-offs. This has been in the fixture list since the start of the season.
FD play-off dates are:
Fri/Sat 19th/20th Oct - 3rd v 2nd
Fri/Sat 26th/27th Oct - 2nd v 3rd
No dates in the fixture list for the play-off final though.
According to two clubs I've spoken to about it, it's been changed to just one leg between the FD teams, as I've said. FAI don't want to confirm anything about it yet tho.
Then again, will there be a need for a FD next year ?
There will be a need.. whether there will be enough clubs is the real question.
blue til i die
12/09/2012, 2:46 PM
There will be a need.. whether there will be enough clubs is the real question.
They need to make a decision very early. Fear is (as always) that the FAI will wait and wait and wait, then made a decision last minute and mess teams around. Cant see Premier Division teams wanting the FD teams in a one league system so there'll definitely be a need for a FD next season imo.
It'd be pretty funny to see Dundalk lose a play off and stay up, having previously won a play off and not been promoted
holidaysong
12/09/2012, 6:06 PM
And possibly also against Waterford.
adamd164
12/09/2012, 9:15 PM
If it's staying as a 12 team PD for next year, then I'd like to see Waterford up.
As it is, we are the only team from Munster (or indeed anywhere south of Bray) in the division which is ridiculous. It'd cut down on our travel costs to have Limerick and Waterford in there.
Longfordian
12/09/2012, 9:30 PM
Limerick are certs for automatic promotion. Not optimistic on us beating Waterford, and/or Dundalk or UCD. We're certainly capable of beating Waterford if we play to our best but it seems a long time since we turned in a 90 minute performance and we've a lot of injuries. Dreading the thoughts of another year in the First.
nigel-harps1954
12/09/2012, 11:19 PM
If it's staying as a 12 team PD for next year, then I'd like to see Waterford up.
As it is, we are the only team from Munster (or indeed anywhere south of Bray) in the division which is ridiculous. It'd cut down on our travel costs to have Limerick and Waterford in there.
Try having Athlone, Longford and the 2 galway junior teams as your local derbies and then get back to me. It's a lot quicker to get from Cork to Dublin than from Ballybofey to Galway.
NeverFeltBetter
12/09/2012, 11:55 PM
If the two tiers are retained I'd put money on Finn Harps going up in 2013.
Longfordian
13/09/2012, 12:28 AM
If two tiers are retained I'd put money on all teams going up in 2013. Unless there's a sudden surge in interest in joining the league.
harps1954
13/09/2012, 11:34 AM
I heard at the Harps match on Saturday night that the FAI are looking at making up the numbers in the First Division with three 'Reserve Premier Divison teams.' So, next season we could be looking at Harps playing the likes of Shamrock Rovers reserves in a senior League of Ireland game. A senior FAI official (don't want to name him here) said that there will definitely be two divisions next season, and the PD will have 12 teams as thats what is in the Participation Agreement. It's what they do with the First Division that is toughest and the reserve team option is a likely option.
NeverFeltBetter
13/09/2012, 12:26 PM
If it's a choice between that and a 7 (or 6) team division I'd take it. Speaks to the disdain the lower tier is victim of though.
A face
13/09/2012, 12:56 PM
I heard at the Harps match on Saturday night that the FAI are looking at making up the numbers in the First Division with three 'Reserve Premier Divison teams.' So, next season we could be looking at Harps playing the likes of Shamrock Rovers reserves in a senior League of Ireland game. A senior FAI official (don't want to name him here) said that there will definitely be two divisions next season, and the PD will have 12 teams as thats what is in the Participation Agreement. It's what they do with the First Division that is toughest and the reserve team option is a likely option.
Could a player play for the Prem Div team one week and with the First Div team the next i wonder?
Charlie Darwin
13/09/2012, 1:23 PM
If it's a choice between that and a 7 (or 6) team division I'd take it. Speaks to the disdain the lower tier is victim of though.
How so? Barcelona and Real Madrid's reserve sides compete in Spain's second tier, and it's arguably one of the reasons so many of the former's youth players rise through the ranks. If there are teams with big squads and players not getting experience, it could easily be a success and help the league as a whole.
Spudulika
13/09/2012, 1:38 PM
There are equal positives and negatives for allowing reserve teams in the 2nd tier, imagine the sniggering from the nodding heads if 3 reserve teams filled the top 3 spots and the 4th placed team went up.
imagine the sniggering from the nodding heads if 3 reserve teams filled the top 3 spots and the 4th placed team went up.
If its not that it'll be something else, so **** what they think
Sam_Heggy
13/09/2012, 2:01 PM
Does the Spaniards not allow reserve teams into the lower tiers?
As has been said, if there's going to be 2 Divisions then allow in 3 or 4 reserve teams into the 1st Div what have we to lose?
You would obviously have to name 2 separate squads for it though.
bluewhitearmy
13/09/2012, 2:21 PM
If its not that it'll be something else, so **** what they think
Spot on, I wouldnt be worrying about people that will only ever complain about the league complaining.
Spudulika
13/09/2012, 2:30 PM
BWA and Dodge, you're both right. Supporting a LOI team is like cross dressing, it's a minority thing, you know others who do it and meet regularly and the central complaint is that nobody understands why you do what you do. Or something like that.
It was mentioned in the restructuring thread about letting reserve teams into the pyramid, it is good in a short term way, though if there is to be a greater restructuring in Irish football it will have to change, but there are always ways to accommodate. Most countries in Europe allow reserve teams (usually age group specific) into the national leagues.
Sam_Heggy
13/09/2012, 2:37 PM
I think we can all agree, the most worrying thing about this thread is not only the structure of the league but the fact that we are now being likened to Cross-dressers.
Supporting a LOI team is like cross dressing
It's pretty distressing seeing a perfectly normal if slightly unpopular activity compared to something that's frankly somewhat deviant and weird.
I hope none of the cross dressers on the forum are too upset by it.
Charlie Darwin
13/09/2012, 3:41 PM
Does the Spaniards not allow reserve teams into the lower tiers?
As has been said, if there's going to be 2 Divisions then allow in 3 or 4 reserve teams into the 1st Div what have we to lose?
You would obviously have to name 2 separate squads for it though.
Why? In Spain they can move up and it causes no problems. It would be silly to stop players from progressing within the season - it would defeat the point of the exercise to a large extent.
on the other hand it would disrupt the integrity of the league. One team might face almost a full premier side if perhaps that club were out of the cup or some such, while the next week it's be back to reserves and youths.
D1 is awful enough without adding that to it.
bluewhitearmy
13/09/2012, 3:45 PM
As far as i know there is a limit on how many can move between the two in Spain.
Charlie Darwin
13/09/2012, 3:53 PM
on the other hand it would disrupt the integrity of the league. One team might face almost a full premier side if perhaps that club were out of the cup or some such, while the next week it's be back to reserves and youths.
Why would they do that? That would be a ridiculous thing to do.
Longfordian
13/09/2012, 3:59 PM
I believe that in Spain once a player appears a certain amount of times for the first team they can't play for the second team again that season.
harpstilidie
13/09/2012, 4:03 PM
Don't know if I like that idea or not. So what happens if say for instance the 3 reserve teams finish 1st and 2nd, and 3rd. Does that mean that there is no promotion whatsoever or does the 4th team go up automatically? Does the 5th and 6th teams earn a play-off spot? So it may actually be possible to finish 6th in a 10 team 1st Division and still get promoted?
Also, what happens if say Derry get relegated and they have a reserve team in the 1st Division. I assume Derry Reserves would have to pull out of the league then?
Why would they do that? That would be a ridiculous thing to do.
Say the first team is out of the cup, the manager may choose to play the first team in the reserve fixture to keep them sharp. I agree it's somewhat unlikely it would happen to that extreme- but the point is that the strength of the team fielded would vary more than at other clubs.
Also, what happens if say Derry get relegated and they have a reserve team in the 1st Division. I assume Derry Reserves would have to pull out of the league then?
Depends on whether Derry reserves earned promotion or not .. maybe the first team would have to pull out and the reserves continue. :)
Charlie Darwin
13/09/2012, 4:10 PM
Say the first team is out of the cup, the manager may choose to play the first team in the reserve fixture to keep them sharp. I agree it's somewhat unlikely it would happen to that extreme- but the point is that the strength of the team fielded would vary more than at other clubs.
Very unlikely and very easy to legislate against.
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