Dan Crowley M MK Dons b.1997

[tricky_colour]

Very confusing thread to read, obviously he is a good player, but he is not committed until he has played a full international, correct?
Having said that, it looks like we have lost him to the Ireland B-team..

[liamoo11]

http://www.hackneygazette.co.uk/football/arsenal/arsenal_starlet_dan_crowley_faces_a_decision_betwe en_england_and_ireland_1_3708120

sorry just seen its already postered in the kevin nolan tread by trapapony apologies

worth seeing how our british equivalents view crowleys possible switch http://forums.bigsoccer.com/threads/england-u-19-discussion-thread-3-r.1672065/page-94

[paul_oshea]

TOWK will like that smack of realism, how they read the whole keeping the options open.

"If he's not good enough he will go to play for Ireland"

Jack grealish. Discuss

[Olé Olé]

I'd suggest it's very positive that he's unwilling to commit to England, particularly when he's being asked the question by a small and local English publication.

Hopefully somebody from the FAI is following this one up because it sounds as though he just went along to the England trials as a young kid looking to play a bit more football.

[TheOneWhoKnocks]

http://www.squawka.com/news/arsenal-star-daniel-crowley-signs-first-professional-contract-with-the-club/152628

Daniel Crowley signs first professional contract at Arse.

[paul_oshea]

I'd suggest it's very positive that he's unwilling to commit to England, particularly when he's being asked the question by a small and local English publication.

Hopefully somebody from the FAI is following this one up because it sounds as though he just went along to the England trials as a young kid looking to play a bit more football.

That is not what it sounds like at all and that is not what our compatriots in England think either. Wake up and smell the coffee. He doesn't want to alienate the Irish side incase things dont work out with England. Some seem to have a very insular or perverse method of thinking when it comes to these players.

He is theirs to lose.

[DannyInvincible]

If he's with England already and they continue selecting him, I don't see why he'd go out of his way and force a move to change the status quo.

[paul_oshea]

cos he considers himself irish or in the case as some across here put it "more irish than english".

surely that's the whole eligibility debate there.

[DannyInvincible]

I'd be surprised if Crowley switched so long as things are rosy for him in the England set-up. If he's happy playing with them for the mean-time, in spite of being well aware of his Irish heritage and having previously played for us at an earlier level, you'd imagine he'd be happy to let things continue that way rather than upsetting the apple-cart. He sounds to be more in tune with his Irish roots than the likes of Jermaine Pennant, but if he genuinely harbours ambitions of playing for us, you'd expect him to accept a call-up. Have the FAI been in touch with him of late? In saying that, interest from England didn't stop Ciaran Clark from switching aged 20/21, so you never know... Clark went from being England's under-20 captain one year to being a senior Irish international the next.

I don't think a comparison with the situation of Jack Grealish is appropriate at all. Grealish has been playing for us (and not England) since the age of 14. He has never declared any positive interest in switching to England. He's always demonstrated commitment to us.

[DannyInvincible]

cos he considers himself irish or in the case as some across here put it "more irish than english".

surely that's the whole eligibility debate there.

In what sense does it embody the whole debate?

I'm guessing your first line there is sarcasm? Or does he actually consider himself primarily Irish despite having been born in England to England-born parents?

[paul_oshea]

That eligibility should be first and foremost about the want and desire to play for a country obviously the papers and qualification are involved in the process and procedure but the kernel of eligibility in the sense being able to play for ireland is desire. The rest will follow.

its unlikely we will get an iranian with desire to play for ireland who could not in fact because he didn't have the papers for example.

as fans and irishmen that's how we should see eligibility. granted I'm all for shoe-Horning in a paul Gascoigne or potential tally Dan crowley :D

[Olé Olé]

Just saw a comment on Facebook under an article about Crowley. It states that all his family are from Waterford and he played Gaelic football with Roger Casement's in Coventry as a kid.

He's clearly really, really English though if he's packed in the Gaelic for the Garrison game!

[Olé Olé]

That is not what it sounds like at all and that is not what our compatriots in England think either. Wake up and smell the coffee. He doesn't want to alienate the Irish side incase things dont work out with England. Some seem to have a very insular or perverse method of thinking when it comes to these players.

He is theirs to lose.

The lad has just turned 17. Of course he's not going to slam any doors shut because he presumably doesn't know who he wants to play with.

Maybe it's you that is doing too much perverse thinking about 'these players' if you expect a kid to have a concrete sense of identity and take the definitive and brave decision to switch his allegiance back to Ireland so lightly.

[DannyInvincible]

its unlikely we will get an iranian with desire to play for ireland

Don't tell that to Neil Yadolahi! :p

Where is he playing these days anyway?

Isn't what you say all fairly obvious though. I mean, would you really expect any able footballer who wasn't either Ireland-born or of immediate Irish heritage (a non-national, in other words) to have a serious interest in representing us? Where's the debate exactly? I suppose, if the League of Ireland was had stronger pedigree with greater pulling power, maybe you'd get the odd foreign-born player coming through the ranks, blossoming into a player of potential international ability and acquiring Irish nationality (akin to Diego Costa acquiring Spanish nationality or Eduardo acquiring Croatian nationality).

[Charlie Darwin]

Englishman Mitch Hancox tends to naturalise and become a full international in my Football Manager game. Might be worth a look.

[Charlie Darwin]

Crowley will choose Ireland, according to his former GAA coach: http://balls.ie/football/dan-crowleys-youth-gaa-coach-thinks-hell-play-for-ireland/

[DannyInvincible]

Despite being part of the English underage set up last year, Crowley qualifies to represent Ireland by virtue of the grandparents rule. He made appearances for the Boys In Green at u-15, u-16 and u-17 level before switching allegiances last year.

I assume none of his appearances for Ireland were competitive then? Actually, have any of his appearances for England to date been competitive?

[DannyInvincible]

Very positive things coming from his former GAA coach, by the way. Might Paul's 100 per cent record of being right on everything be ever-so-slightly under threat?

[Predator]

I assume none of his appearances for Ireland were competitive then? Actually, have any of his appearances for England to date been competitive?Yep, he has played competitively for England at U17 level.
http://www.uefa.com/under17/season=2013/teams/player=250058214/index.html

I think, but I would have to check, that he played U16 for Ireland in the same season. Effectively, however, as far as eligibility rules are concerned, he didn't play at all.

[Charlie Darwin]

Very positive things coming from his former GAA coach, by the way. Might Paul's 100 per cent record of being right on everything be ever-so-slightly under threat?
Not at all. Even when he's wrong (which is often), Paul is right.

[paul_oshea]

No charwin you're having an episode again. That's you.

that one time about seamie I was wrong.

[Olé Olé]

That is not what it sounds like at all and that is not what our compatriots in England think either. Wake up and smell the coffee. He doesn't want to alienate the Irish side incase things dont work out with England. Some seem to have a very insular or perverse method of thinking when it comes to these players.

He is theirs to lose.

I will say that Crowley still hasn't reverted to us. But I'll bump this post anyway.

[paul_oshea]

And if Mr. Crowley turns out to be an Arsenal wonderkid and plays for Ireland then I will gladly accept I was wrong.

IF he and grealish end up in the first division or lower premiership without much prospect and turn out for Ireland, I will not be surprised either.

This lad probably does have a bit more about his Irish "credentials", but lets wait and see.

[ArdeeBhoy]

The, er, Facebook lobby don't share your confidence...
https://www.facebook.com/ballsdotie?fref=nf

[Stuttgart88]

IF he and grealish end up in the first division or lower premiership without much prospect and turn out for Ireland, I will not be surprised either.

Paul predicts statistically highly probably event. A career as an astrologist or psychic medium beckons :)

[ArdeeBhoy]

Tbf his middle paragraph about Crowley and Grealish is about right. Somehow, we need a lot more than that.

[paul_oshea]

No, its as simple as it sounds stutts, what happened that bramford fella anyway? Being seduced by chelsea first team talk and lots of transfer speculation, and he no longer plays with us. Someone will paint a different picture but he is no longer with us either.

My point is simple, if these lads play top football for top clubs I don't believe they will line out for Ireland. If they aren't playing at the very top then they are less likely to get selected for England and will obviously then line out for us. Its pretty simple nothing to do with predicting an event like them not making it.

[ArdeeBhoy]

The irony is Bamford probably won't play for either then...like numerous other 'candidates'.

[Charlie Darwin]

Bamford only played for us once, while he was at Nottingham Forest, and didn't continue to. You can't say he was ever 'with' us.

[Olé Olé]

But as Trap would have said, he can still 'come with us.'

[ArdeeBhoy]

If only they would, but for all MO'N's 'noises' on the topic, Crowley, Bamford & Redmond show no sign of being available...

If he/they were serious, he'd fast-track all three in for the Gibraltar home game and job done. But it won't happen.

[Stuttgart88]

I agree AB, although I'd add that MON has clearly been sending the feelers out, talking to players or their agents and I think he has a fair idea of who intends doing what.

McGoldrick looks the most likely and right at this point in time he also looks the most useful.

Bamford scored a few nice goals last season but, despite the concerns (or worse) over his longevity, I'd back Robbie Keane to be a 20 goal a season guy at that Derby team in that league. I'd say Long wouldn't be far off it either.

All this talk of desperately seeking a few granny rulers is really grating with me. Germany will win the group, no doubt. That's not to say there isn't a point or three to be got from them - that's what the players must be made to believe anyway - but realistically we are in a straight battle with Scotland and Poland.

I don't see any new granny rulers being necessary. Despite my loathing of his attitude I'd have Stephen Ireland back.

Andy Reid will be a new recruit in effect. So too will Gibson. So too will Brady. We will hopefully see McGeady deliver consistently, benefitting from full fitness and consistent first team football. Coleman and McCarthy can cut it with the best.

Hoolahan's demotion won't matter a jot. He was excellent for Ireland when not playing at all for Norwich. How can he be any worse if playing regularly?

And so on...

Cheer up all. This squad is good enough to get second place. If I was to bet on it, I'd say they won't but it's marginal.

[Olé Olé]

Thanks for the positivity Stutts. Some would have you believe a Scotland side containing Alan Hutton, Russell Martin, Grant Hanley, Barry Bannan and Ikechi Anya are exponentially better than us. I'm getting tired of the negativity.

As regards the potential players you've mentioned, I suppose they're much more relevant in a long-term context. Bamford, Redmond, Kane and Crowley are all very young and boast as much potential as most Irish players their age (give me Brady over Redmond though).

[ArdeeBhoy]

Appreciate the positivity too, but until proven otherwise still feel Scotland have more of a settled (& efficient) 'team', so a dose too of reality.

As for us, we need to look at the long-term, so cap who can v. the Gibbers...

[TheOneWhoKnocks]

Be patient lads. For God's sake the boy is only 17 years old; barely old enough to tie his shoe laces. He is a dual-identity. When he is 24 years old and playing for Scarborough, he may discover that he wanted to play for us all along.

@ Ole Ole

Ireland and Scotland are at the same level there or thereabouts but you have to admit that is slightly disconcerting that 8 or 9 Scottish players have moved up to the PL and another 2 or 3 have moved to Champions League caliber teams on the continent; this includes a couple of very young left backs. I don't even include James McArthur who has had a £4m bid for him by Burnley rejected by Wigan.

We do have Lenihan but he is ostensibly being signed for an U-21 team, like Sam Byrne.

[Stuttgart88]

...true, but I'd have thought we have note players already at a level at least as good as they do, if not better. We have 3 or 4 players at Everton for example. I'd be happier about the medium term future if our young players were. Owing up the ladder, sure.

Anyway, the World Cup us barely over and we're falling into the trap that we think good international teams must all contain top level players, or players all at top clubs. Chile had a left back released by Nottm Forest.

I'm not fussed where our players play, but my own eyes tell me that Ward is a weakness, but just as much as my own eyes tell me that Reod and Hoolahan are more than capable of causing Scotland and Poland trouble.

Right now I'd say a "best of" XI from both countries would be roughly half and half. I'd bite your hand off for Mulgrew although AB will probably know better.

They have a year's more momentum behind them but I think we have every chance of building our own momentum with the games against Oman, Georgia and Gib. If we can win those games having played well then all of a sudden we have form and momentum too. No matter what the paying punters say, the choice of Oman in the next friendly is a good one.

[ArdeeBhoy]

Mulgrew's probably playing better for Scotland than Celtic right now. Thought he was a bit of a totem club-wise, but he's been shocking recently.
Let's hope he's like that in November.

Or biggest problem, besides the Crowleys of this world is MO'N even knowing his best XI. Which I doubt has ever played for him, but there is a good bit of dead wood that could be potentially jettisoned...

[Olé Olé]

Be patient lads. For God's sake the boy is only 17 years old; barely old enough to tie his shoe laces. He is a dual-identity. When he is 24 years old and playing for Scarborough, he may discover that he wanted to play for us all along.

@ Ole Ole

Ireland and Scotland are at the same level there or thereabouts but you have to admit that is slightly disconcerting that 8 or 9 Scottish players have moved up to the PL and another 2 or 3 have moved to Champions League caliber teams on the continent; this includes a couple of very young left backs. I don't even include James McArthur who has had a £4m bid for him by Burnley rejected by Wigan.

We do have Lenihan but he is ostensibly being signed for an U-21 team, like Sam Byrne.

I could be completely wrong in stating this, but isn't there a higher saturation of Scottish players in England? Hence, they're more likely to have more upwardly mobile players? Either way, I agree with your assertion that we haven't had many move up from Championship to PL. But, I don't think we had that many candidates playing Championship football to move up. And, anyway, try applying the logic to Stephen Ward getting a move into the PL whilst Hendrick is still in Championship.

As Stutts stated, there are some good Irish players at some good PL sides already. Furthermore, I haven't seen any Scottish player garner a fee of £12m!

These things go in swings and roundabouts. I wouldn't be concerned at players being settled at their clubs.

[DannyInvincible]

Furthermore, I haven't seen any Scottish player garner a fee of £12m!

Not since Ross McCormack signed for Fulham last month (http://www.theguardian.com/football/2014/jul/08/fulham-sign-ross-mccormack-leeds) anyway! :p


Be patient lads. For God's sake the boy is only 17 years old; barely old enough to tie his shoe laces. He is a dual-identity. When he is 24 years old and playing for Scarborough, he may discover that he wanted to play for us all along.

https://p.gr-assets.com/540x540/fit/hostedimages/1380370905/723854.gif

[Olé Olé]

Not since Ross McCormack signed for Fulham last month (http://www.theguardian.com/football/2014/jul/08/fulham-sign-ross-mccormack-leeds) anyway! :p


My tongue was in my cheek with that one. Both inflated but McCormack's probably more so. Either way, £12m is a whole £1m more than £11m. Think about what you would do with £1m and you'll realise my point still stands :p

[Closed Account]

I could be completely wrong in stating this, but isn't there a higher saturation of Scottish players in England? Hence, they're more likely to have more upwardly mobile players?
Suprisingly there are more Irish players playing in the English leagues than any other nationality (excluding English).
232 Irish players http://www.football-lineups.com/country/IE/Players/Playing_in/?q=E1
155 Scottish players http://www.football-lineups.com/country/E2/Players/Playing_in/?q=E1

Despite a few Scottish players joining the Premier League this year, they lost the same amount to relegation and have the same amount as last season (23)
There's consistently been more Irish players (ROI) in the top division in the last 15 years. However it has dipped in recent years. The actual amount of players doesn't bother me though, it's the quality of player which we should be worried about.

Breakdown of Irish V Scottish nationalities in the Premier League (98-15)
Year Irish Scottish
14/15 31 23
13/14 29 23
12/13 35 24
11/12 46 26
10/11 43 23
09/10 42 27
08/09 33 16
07/08 37 22
06/07 28 22
05/06 34 22
04/05 30 22
03/04 39 31
02/03 46 21
01/02 32 26
00/01 32 37
99/00 37 34
98/99 32 36

[tricky_colour]

Crowley will choose Ireland, according to his former GAA coach: http://balls.ie/football/dan-crowleys-youth-gaa-coach-thinks-hell-play-for-ireland/

But switching to England seems an odd route to take on the path to playing for Ireland.

[gastric]

But switching to England seems an odd route to take on the path to playing for Ireland.

Pressure from his club, managers, possibly friends as well as English background would have played a part in his decision to play for England. Teenagers will always give in to peer pressure! Hopefully, he will consider his decision more carefully over the next while.

[DannyInvincible]

But switching to England seems an odd route to take on the path to playing for Ireland.

He didn't technically switch as far as the rules are concerned as he never played competitively for the FAI, so wasn't officially registered with us. He is registered with England at present though, having played competitively for their under-17s, so his next decision would have to be a considered one as it'll be permanent if he decides to effect his right to make a single switch. TOWK may mock, but he's not yet an adult and has plenty of time to decide. Even if he does stick with England for a bit, I wouldn't feel that insulted if he eventually came calling our way. It's not because of "lower standards" or due to a willingness to accept any oul' chancer; it would be in recognition of his dual national status and the fact he seems very much in tune with his Irish heritage despite being born in England to England-born parents. That's not to say that he will do that either. I initially said I'd be surprised if he switched, but in light of information since, I think it's a realistic possibility. It sounds like a large chunk of his heart might be with us. His former GAA coach did allude to club politics having significant bearing, however. If Arsenal, who'll be paying his wages, would rather he stuck with England, it may be difficult for him to over-rule such pressure.

[paul_oshea]

Maybe he is a mercenary and using England to further his career.

[Olé Olé]

He didn't technically switch as far as the rules are concerned as he never played competitively for the FAI, so wasn't officially registered with us. He is registered with England at present though, having played competitively for their under-17s, so his next decision would have to be a considered one as it'll be permanent if he decides to effect his right to make a single switch. TOWK may mock, but he's not yet an adult and has plenty of time to decide. Even if he does stick with England for a bit, I wouldn't feel that insulted if he eventually came calling our way. It's not because of "lower standards" or due to a willingness to accept any oul' chancer; it would be in recognition of his dual national status and the fact he seems very much in tune with his Irish heritage despite being born in England to England-born parents. That's not to say that he will do that either. I initially said I'd be surprised if he switched, but in light of information since, I think it's a realistic possibility. It sounds like a large chunk of his heart might be with us. His former GAA coach did allude to club politics having significant bearing, however. If Arsenal, who'll be paying his wages, would rather he stuck with England, it may be difficult for him to over-rule such pressure.

We haven't had much luck with players at some of the bigger clubs i.e. the Keane brothers, Crowley and Bamford. Also, Rhys Murphy played with us then England before reverting back to us. Conor Henderson did a little dithering too. Sean McGinty was also heavily linked with a switch to England before his career trajectory and conduct began to negate his prospects of England selection (not saying that was his only consideration or if he was destined to switch but he was linked with it).

[geysir]

And if Mr. Crowley turns out to be an Arsenal wonderkid and plays for Ireland then I will gladly accept I was wrong.

IF he and grealish end up in the first division or lower premiership without much prospect and turn out for Ireland, I will not be surprised either.

This lad probably does have a bit more about his Irish "credentials", but lets wait and see.
There's been a (slight) predictive upgrade, from not only does he have to declare for Ireland, but now he also has to turn out to be one of the best players in the world, ranking with previous Arsenal stars,
before you will accept you were wrong.

[tetsujin1979]

We haven't had much luck with players at some of the bigger clubs i.e. the Keane brothers, Crowley and Bamford. Also, Rhys Murphy played with us then England before reverting back to us. Conor Henderson did a little dithering too. Sean McGinty was also heavily linked with a switch to England before his career trajectory and conduct began to negate his prospects of England selection (not saying that was his only consideration or if he was destined to switch but he was linked with it).
really? when?

[Predator]

We haven't had much luck with players at some of the bigger clubs i.e. the Keane brothers...Ironically, Michael cannot make the switch back to the FAI but his brother Will, who hasn't ever played for Ireland, could.

[Olé Olé]

really? when?

Played under 17 for England anyway. I don't mean he was dithering back and forth, I mean he played for both and, by deduction, appeared uncertain for a period.