Predict the Squad/ Starting Lineup for Macedonia

[geysir]

The only closest thing is the fact that O'dea hasn't played at all he cant get his game for ipswich, ........I really think it must just come down to trust.
Can we trust your facts Paul?
Hasn't O'Dea has been playing regularily for Ipswich since the time of the Norway game?

[Stuttgart88]

or experience. Clark hasn't even had one full season of first team footy and less than half of that has been at CB. He's prone to the odd rash challenge. We're playing against an in form Inter Milan striker.

Sometimes people here can only see things in black or white terms.

Either player is a risk. We're missing SSL and JO'S FFS. All I can say is thank Jaysus we're not relying on McShane.

Just a thought: does anyone reckone Dunne would have been consulted?

[Stuttgart88]

Can we trust your facts Paul?
Hasn't O'Dea has been playing regularily for Ipswich since the time of the Norway game?Including keeping Arsenal scoreless for 150 minutes, albeit at left back I think.

[SwanVsDalton]

Yes stutts but these things are often forgottten, and sadly a loss is whats required to force the managers hand - a lot of the time.

O'Dea may not be the favoured choice - and I don't agree with it - but, as Stutts said, there's every chance he'll put in a performance tomorrow. And we could still lose. What then?

Don't agree with the selection but let's save the doom-mongering until after the game.

Also from Ken Early's Twitter:

Ken Early
trap irate at suggestions he tells full-backs to stay back. he cites cabrini and brehme. expect similar from foley and kilbane

[Stuttgart88]

Surely Dunne and other senior players must be wondering how a player who can't get his game at Ipswich is being selected ahead of a player who plays alongside Dunne at Aston Villa.I thought Collins plays beside Dunne at Villa?

Tets, dig out the last 12 weeks' appearance stats please!

[paul_oshea]

Can we trust your facts Paul?
Hasn't O'Dea has been playing regularily for Ipswich since the time of the Norway game?

My Facts, i only put up what is the case:
1-Feb-2011 Championship Derby County 1-2 Ipswich Unused Substitute.
5-Feb-2011 Championship Ipswich 3-0 Sheffield United Unused Substitute.
12-Feb-2011 Championship Barnsley 1-1 Ipswich Started on bench, introduced on 86 m.
15-Feb-2011 Championship Doncaster Rovers 0-6 Ipswich Unused Substitute.
19-Feb-2011 Championship Ipswich 1-1 Hull City Unused Substitute.
22-Feb-2011 Championship QPR 2-0 Ipswich Unused Substitute.
26-Feb-2011 Championship Ipswich 0-2 Portsmouth Unused Substitute.
5-Mar-2011 Championship Cardiff 0-2 Ipswich Started on bench, introduced on 29 m.
8-Mar-2011 Championship Ipswich 1-3 Reading Started, played whole game.
12-Mar-2011 Championship Leeds United 0-0 Ipswich Started, played whole game.
15-Mar-2011 Championship Ipswich 0-3 Watford Unused Substitute.
19-Mar-2011 Championship Ipswich 2-0 Scunthorpe Unused Substitute.

2 full games in 2 months pretty much....hardly every game now geysir.

I'm sure if DUnne was consulted he is going to select his team mate given how comfortable he would be with him. I doubt it happened, it would completely undermine trap to be asking senior players who they want playing/who they prefer playing.

[Fixer82]

I don't remember oslo, but why henrys free kick as being a sick one? Cos we were still in with a chance of qualification or because it ruined our 10 year competitive avoiding defeat streak(unbeaten)?

Henry's goal wasn't a free kick. It was sublime but not a free.

Re starting line-up I think it's ludicrous having O'Dea in centre back. He looked very shaky in last friendly and is not playing regularly. Clark in there as Dunne's team-mate at Villa is the obvious choice.

Didn't realise O'Shea and St.Ledger were both injured
:pumpkin:

[SwanVsDalton]

More Twitter:

Ken Early
trap explains that gibson is preferred to green because macedonia like to defend a line on the pitch that is just inside DG's shooting range

[TrapAPony]

Surely Dunne and other senior players must be wondering how a player who can't get his game at Ipswich is being selected ahead of a player who plays alongside Dunne at Aston Villa.

Trapattoni would sicken you. Wouldn't be surprised to see Green & Keogh brought on at half time.

[paul_oshea]

I thought Collins plays beside Dunne at Villa?

Tets, dig out the last 12 weeks' appearance stats please!

He has played alongisde Clark in a few games also, more cup games.

[paul_oshea]

Henry's goal wasn't a free kick. It was sublime but not a free.

Re starting line-up I think it's ludicrous having O'Dea in centre back. He looked very shaky in last friendly and is not playing regularly. Clark in there as Dunne's team-mate at Villa is the obvious choice.

Didn't realise O'Shea and St.Ledger were both injured
:pumpkin:

Oh ya it was outside the box wasn't it, did oshea given away the ball or hold back off him?

[Noelys Guitar]

Can we trust your facts Paul?
Hasn't O'Dea has been playing regularily for Ipswich since the time of the Norway game?

He was dropped after Ipswich played Leeds and has not played a minute in Ipswich's last two games.

[paul_oshea]

Can we trust your facts Paul?
Hasn't O'Dea has been playing regularily for Ipswich since the time of the Norway game?

Can we trust your assertions or questioning?

[ifk101]

So we have three competitive debutants in our back five (Westwood, Foley and O'Dea)? And Dunne and Keane are lacking in match sharpness. If you were supporting Macedonia you'd have to fancy your chances.

[Junior]

Also from Ken Early's Twitter:

Ken Early
trap irate at suggestions he tells full-backs to stay back. he cites cabrini and brehme. expect similar from foley and kilbane

He obviously reads my posts on here:D:D

[geysir]

I'd prefer Clark, but I'd be way more concerned with Gibson at CM.
I hope both come through fine and vindicate Trap's selection.

[DeLorean]

I really don't see the big deal about playing O'Dea ahead of Clark. I haven't seen Villa all that often this season but hasn't Clark played at full back and midfield more often than he has played centre back (open to correction?). It has been a shambolic season for Villa into the bargain. There were no more options really and although I would have like to have seen Clark start, I would have preferred if it was at Kilbane's expense, and taken a little step towards the future.

I'd have a much bigger problem with Gibson starting in a position where McCarthy has excelled over a decent period of time.

[Stuttgart88]

The point is that Clark hasn't had many career games at CB. He's been played in midfield and LB at least as much as CB I reckon, without reverting to stats.

As I said, I'd have gone with Clark myself, but O'Dea could be looking good in training and either player is a risk. I'm not being a Trapologist, I just think it's a relatively marginal call. We have a full back and a GK making competitive debuts, so having a CB making a competitive debut too might have been a determining factor.

(DeLorean types faster than I do, obviously!)

[Sullivinho]

Republic of Ireland starting team v Macedonia :

Westwood (Coventry City); Foley (Wolves), Dunne (Aston Villa), O'Dea (Celtic - on loan at Ipswich Town), Kilbane (Hull City - on loan at Huddersfield Town); McGeady (Spartak Moscow), Gibson (Manchester United), Whelan (Stoke City), Duff (Fulham); Keane (West Ham United), Doyle (Wolves).


Hope the guy plays a blinder but I can't say I'm enthusiastic about that selection.

[paul_oshea]

I really don't see the big deal about playing O'Dea ahead of Clark. I haven't seen Villa all that often this season but hasn't Clark played at full back and midfield more often than he has played centre back (open to correction?). It has been a shambolic season for Villa into the bargain. There were no more options really and although I would have like to have seen Clark start, I would have preferred if it was at Kilbane's expense, and taken a little step towards the future.


All we can hope at this stage is kilbane and gibson make way for mccarthy and clark at some stage. I don't see it happening but it would let us see Traps longer term intentions(if they exist).

[Stuttgart88]

I don't give a fcuk how Trap's longer term intentions manifest themselves on Saturday. I want 3 points regardless of how they come.

[paul_oshea]

The point is that Clark hasn't had many career games at CB. He's been played in midfield and LB at least as much as CB I reckon, without reverting to stats.

As I said, I'd have gone with Clark myself, but O'Dea could be looking good in training and either player is a risk. I'm not being a Trapologist, I just think it's a relatively marginal call. We have a full back and a GK making competitive debuts, so having a CB making a competitive debut too might have been a determining factor.


You can't make that statement though and then use it as defence for picking O'Dea. O'dea is not match fit and hasn't been selected for his team in teh last 2 months bar a couple of games, whatever about "career" games..

[SwanVsDalton]

I thought Collins plays beside Dunne at Villa?

Tets, dig out the last 12 weeks' appearance stats please!

There's been very little consistency in Villa's selections over the past 12 weeks due to injury and suspension. But it's been Collins/Dunne with Clark at LB when everyone's been fit generally.

Villa CB's last 12 games:
Wolves - Baker/Cuellar
Bolton - Clark/Young
Man City - Dunne/Clark
Blackburn - Dunne/Clark
Fulham - Dunne/Collins (Clark LB)
Man Utd - Dunne/Collins (Clark LB)
Blackburn - Clark/Cuellar
Wigan - Dunne/Collins
Man City - Dunne/Collins (Clark LB)
West Brom - Dunne/Collins (Clark LB)
Sheff Utd - Dunne/Cuellar (Clark LB)
Sunderland - Dunne/Collins (Clark LB)

[paul_oshea]

I don't give a fcuk how Trap's longer term intentions manifest themselves on Saturday. I want 3 points regardless of how they come.

And i dont give a fcuk about whether or not you give a fcuk about traps longer term intentions but at least it gives some reasoning to his thinking, or shows some logic, because yes those intentions could come to the fore at the end of this campaign.

[paul_oshea]

There's been very little consistency in Villa's selections over the past 12 weeks due to injury and suspension. But it's been Collins/Dunne with Clark at LB when everyone's been fit generally.

Villa CB's last 12 games:
Wolves - Baker/Cuellar
Bolton - Clark/Young
Man City - Dunne/Clark
Blackburn - Dunne/Clark
Fulham - Dunne/Collins (Clark LB)
Man Utd - Dunne/Collins (Clark LB)
Blackburn - Clark/Cuellar
Wigan - Dunne/Collins
Man City - Dunne/Collins (Clark LB)
West Brom - Dunne/Collins (Clark LB)
Sheff Utd - Dunne/Cuellar (Clark LB)
Sunderland - Dunne/Collins (Clark LB)

So thats a quarter at CB ONLY, and how many in total has he played, the full 12? Thats double the amount O'dea as played in CB in the same period!

[Charlie Darwin]

I can only assume O'Dea has been doing more in training. And given how much Trap talks about discipline, a yellow card machine like Clark is going to have to show something extra special to get selected.

[paul_oshea]

It's a strange selection alright but still relatively marginal. O'Dea has played against good quality non-UK players much more than Clark, for example..

Thats another weak point stutts to back up Trap. He played a few champions league games 4/5 seasons ago. Scotland is in the UK.

[SwanVsDalton]

Just a few thoughts on Clark:

Without resorting to stats I'm fairly sure he's played LB more than any other position, followed by CB and then CM (which was a real hail mary selection in which he never looked particularly comfortable, despite two goals against Arsenal).

While he's acquitted himself well at full-back, I don't believe it's his natural position. He's game going forward but doesn't attack the ball with any intent. And he's comfortable on the thing, because he's a natural footballer, but not comfortable in the sense a true FB could be. His selection there almost as much to do with Warnock falling out with Houllier and being demoted to the reserves. Clark's done well but I'd be surprised if Houllier (or, more likely, his replacement) doesn't bring in a natural left-back this summer.

Moreover his performances at CB, for me, have been more assured and impressive. I don't have a problem with him lining up at LB, but I believe in future seasons he'll be playing for Villa (or whoever) and Ireland at CB.

This isn't an argument either way for this selection. Just jotting out some thoughts. It's also worth saying he's one of the few players to, so far, emerge from this season at Villa with much credit.

Oh - and as has been pointed out, it's a guarantee Clark will be good for at least two dangerous free kicks and a booking. Not sure what O'Dea's form is like in that regard, but it might have come into Trap's reckoning.

[AlaskaFox]

As a Villa fan who has seen every minute of Clark this season, I think Trap may have made the right call with O'Dea. He knows O'Dea, and he also knows O'Dea isn't going to do a rash challenge on Pandev - something Clark would undoubtedly do.

It's just a pity St. Ledger isn't fit.

[Junior]

I can only assume O'Dea has been doing more in training. And given how much Trap talks about discipline, a yellow card machine like Clark is going to have to show something extra special to get selected.

Yep and crocking a few players in training probably added a further leetle doubt in Traps mind.

[Lionel Ritchie]

He was dropped after Ipswich played Leeds and has not played a minute in Ipswich's last two games.

Ipswich kept a clean sheet in that game

[TrapAPony]

I'm actually thinking one day we will see six of the lads coming out of the tunnel carrying Kilbane in his coffin for the match the way things are going. It seems he will never be dropped.

[Junior]

Ah come on, he's decent enough in the box.

[paul_oshea]

Hahah good one Trap, that gave me a laugh.

They will probably carrying him on for set pieces too, put him upright in the box geddit?

ah even after the edit junior has it in there...

[irishultra]

westwood, dunne, o'dea, gibson and whelan as the spine of the team...i fear the worst

[noddy102]

Disappointed that Clark isn't playing instead of O'Dea.

I think it is important to have Kilbane in the back four, when we are missing Given, O'Shea and even St Ledger's experience.

Kilbane's cool head will be needed tomorrow evening to settle the nerves of Foley, O'Dea and probably even Westwood. No doubt Westwood will be happy having a cool head in front of him.

[Kingdom]

Surprised O'Dea is starting - equally surprised Clark is not starting at all!
There seems to be conflicting stats here re: O'Dea; if he has played all but the last two games for Ipswich, then he is going to be match-fit for this game. He'd want to be some langer not to be fit after not being selected for two matches in a row!
The guy has shown real potential (albeit some time ago) at the highest level at centre back. More of us are confused as to why his career hasn't progressed in the meantime. I wouldn't be too concerned about him starting considering he has the Honey Monster beside him.

I think we're all disappointed that Clark isn't selected due to his impressive debut vs the Taffies. It's amplified given that Killer has long been a weaklink defensively in the team, and we're probably a bit desperate to see him replaced. This really should be his swansong given the amount of friendlies we now have coming up.

AS for Gibson, well you can see the reasoning - he has been there or thereabouts for United since Xmas, and to be fair it was the stick which Trap beat him with for long enough, so in a way it's put up or shut up time. That said I'd have preferred Fahey myself. He hunts for the ball more, has a better passing range and crucially offers more from a dead ball in my opinion. But it is nice to see an explanation from Trap (re the line at which the Macedonian's defend) - that's what he's paid to do, and if it comes off well then well done.
On reflection he is playing the McCarthy situation correctly. To give him his first start for his country in the pivotal position on the field (at 19), where he has no rapport (yet) with his teammates, in a game we must win, would be putting an unfair burden on the lad. I could definitely see him coming on for Robbie and going 5 in midfield if we're up by 2 goals come the 70th minute. That would definitely suit him.

Anyone know the subs yet?

Now the team is picked, I'll say what I've been thinking all week - I think we're going to run riot on Sat. We've two wingers that are on an equal footing at present, and both are playing exceptionally well. We've a centre midfielder that loves to take the ball forward and keept the play progressing and taking pot shots all day long, and we've a totem up front that is having perhaps his best season in the most pressurised league in the world, and we've our record scorer back fit and itching for a game. Finally we've a group of supporters that will raise the roof given the day and time the match takes place. I think we're underestimating just how forward thinking this team is that's been picked.
I think we could lay down a marker tomorrow night. I think we're gonna win by 3. McGeady could break his duck too.

Anyone who's around from mid afternoon, take a wander over to scruffy murphy's, the atmosphere there should be a good indication as to what the Lansdowne end will be like a few hours later.
Éire abú!

[Stuttgart88]

Paul, who says I'm backing up Trap? Rather than backing up Trap I'm refuting the notion that it's clearly a bad call. I've said myself - this will be the third time - that I'd go with Clark.

Either player is a risk.

We're down to the bare bones defensively.

Managers are allowed to make judgment calls in marginal cases.

We've got 3 friendlies before we play Macedonia away. That's the time for Trap to think for the longer term. The only timespan I'm interested in right now is 10pm on Saturday.

[Kingdom]

Have to agree with Stutts. The important thing come 10pm on Sat is that we've the three points. After that however, he needs to give time to the fellas that he's going to turn to in the case of the next injury crisis - because it's not the kids that are pulling out through injuries in the main, it's the old reliables, Given, O'Shea, Keane, Dunne and even Duff has been prone.
Westwood, Randolph, O'Dea, Clark, Wilson, Foley, McCarthy, Treacy, Long all need significant game time between Uruguay, NIron, Scotland, Italy and Another.
There is enough reason, I believe, for Dunne and Duffer to be excused Tuesday night - Keane too.

[SwanVsDalton]

Don't necessarily share it, but loving the optimism Kingdom. The excitement's flowing now...

Taking a stab at the sub's bench: Forde; Clark; Kelly; McCarthy; Green; Lawrence; Long.

That's what I think he'll go with though I'd have Fahey in there instead of Green. Also read on RTE Walters won't make it due to his wife, selfishly, not giving birth yet. Would have had him on the bench for physical plan B option.

[paul_oshea]

kingdom.go back a couple of pages where i posted odeas starts in the last 2 months.

i really don't know how you think we are going to win by 3.the excitement of a new arrival and your hormones are playing havoc!

[tetsujin1979]

I thought Collins plays beside Dunne at Villa?

Tets, dig out the last 12 weeks' appearance stats please!
Of Villa's 13 games so far this year, Dunne and Clark have started together 9 times: http://irish-abroad.appspot.com/ClubDetails?clubID=154

[geysir]

i really don't know how you think we are going to win by 3.the excitement of a new arrival and your hormones are playing havoc!

Good things happen in threes.

[Kingdom]

Don't share it, but loving the optimism Kingdom. The excitement's flowing now...

Taking a stab at the sub's bench: Forde; Clark; Kelly; McCarthy; Green; Lawrence; Long.

That's what I think he'll go with though I'd have Fahey in there instead of Green. Also read on RTE Walters won't make it due to his wife, selfishly, not giving birth yet. Would have had him on the bench for physical plan B option.

I'm a romantic SvD, if nothing else!

I'd be very surprised if Keith doesn't make the bench, given he is an option right across the middle. Lawrence could be the fella to miss out there. Kelly & Clark looked nailed on, McCarthy too, and Long is a certainty. So it's between Fats, Lawrence and Green for the last two spots.
Ooh I'd forgotten about Walters and the totally selfish 'er indoors that he has to endure (joke!). Mmmm then there is every chance that McCarthy on in an advanced role (as envisaged by Trap months ago) will be a substitution if all is going to plan and Doyle has done his usual magic trick as a battering ram (particularily so given the mention of Westwoods boomers as an attacking tool)


kingdom.go back a couple of pages where i posted odeas starts in the last 2 months.

i really don't know how you think we are going to win by 3.the excitement of a new arrival and your hormones are playing havoc!
As I said Paul, I'm a romantic. But I do believe we have a set of wingers that will tear the Macedonian back 4 a new one, and will create numerous chances for the front two (and themselves of course). Whether people want to believe it, with the front 6 that he has picked, there is a goal threat from each one, incl McGeady even though he can't score himself, he has enough assists for both Ireland and Spartak over the past year, too many for the begrudgers to ignore. We are a credible threat from set pieces as well with Dunne, Doyle, Kilbane all major threats in the box.

Paul, I may be metrosexual, but I haven't the ability to carry offspring* so the hormones are grand thanks. Sure, there might be a tear on due day, but it's not like I breakdown into a blubbering mess at the sight of a babygro with in-stitched mitts. I save those tender moments for Croke Park.

*yet

[SwanVsDalton]

I'm a romantic SvD, if nothing else!

I'd be very surprised if Keith doesn't make the bench, given he is an option right across the middle. Lawrence could be the fella to miss out there. Kelly & Clark looked nailed on, McCarthy too, and Long is a certainty. So it's between Fats, Lawrence and Green for the last two spots.
Ooh I'd forgotten about Walters and the totally selfish 'er indoors that he has to endure (joke!). Mmmm then there is every chance that McCarthy on in an advanced role (as envisaged by Trap months ago) will be a substitution if all is going to plan and Doyle has done his usual magic trick as a battering ram (particularily so given the mention of Westwoods boomers as an attacking tool)

I think Lawrence's favour with Trap will swing it his way - the versatility works out about the same way, since either winger can switch and there'll be two other CM's on the bench. Though I suppose Fahey would offer the least disruptive sub option. He'll be unlucky to miss out in fairness.

[tetsujin1979]

kingdom.go back a couple of pages where i posted odeas starts in the last 2 months.

i really don't know how you think we are going to win by 3.the excitement of a new arrival and your hormones are playing havoc!
just out of curiosity, why did you exclude his January games? He played quite a bit then

[Kingdom]

Obvously March is the month he's most likely to lose his fitness if not playing regular football, Shrove Tuesday, Lent, Pats Day, he's Irish - never stood a chance. D'uh!

;-)

[Closed Account]

Nearly 600 posts and nobody got the starting lineup correct.(Almost impossible) Giovanni you evasive, unpredictable old fox.
Would've liked to have seen Clark at either left back or center back but hopefully the game won't be won or lost on this.
We should give O'Dea the benefit of the doubt, he must've impressed Trap more than Clark, I doubt Trap is out to sabotage his own campaign although he has given some ammo to his detractors should we lose.

Considering the tactics we employ, I predict a 1-0 or 2-1 win.

[Charlie Darwin]

I predict we'll start out strong, overwhelm them with quick tempo football and score within the first 10 minutes. We'll create plenty of chances and convert none of them and escape with a much-needed 1-0 win.

Joe, I called O'Dea in the starting line up a couple of weeks ago. Although that was on the assumption that it would be Dunne and not Sledge to miss out.

[EastTerracer]

Knowing how conservative Trap is I do think he will pick Kilbane over Clark for the Macedonia game - I think he'd prefer to see Clark get a few more caps before making him first-choice full-back. As a result I predict a very familiar line-up assuming Dunne is fit.

Westwood
O'Shea Dunne St.Ledger Kilbane
McGeady Gibson Whelan Duff
Doyle Keane

Average age of 28, over 50 caps on average and a total of 82 international goals. I think McCarthy and Long are almost certain to get a run as well.

Think I got 9 of the 11 right 12 days ago but that was before the injuries to O'Shea and St.Ledger - Trap is seriously conservative and will make changes very gradually. Clark and McCarthy will get into the team over time but with 1 cap each I never seriously thought Trap would pick them. Having said that, O'Dea does surprise me slightly.