RTE Panel

[osarusan]

Indeed, the rules are the rules and those playing the game should fully comprehend them, but rules can always be amended (and have been on plenty of occasions throughout the history of the game) if it is felt the game is being hampered by their implementation. I still feel a double-whammy of red card and penalty is a disproportionate punishment to the offending team.

This was my post on this from another site:


I am one of those who thinks that a red card can be too harsh, and the rule could be changed.

Giles' suggestions could never work - as somebody suggested, we'd have situations where the keeper would not want to save penalties, or takers didn't want to score.

I don't really agree with arguments that the player's intention is relevant, as that doesn't mean much to the team denied a chance. The chance is gone either way, whether it was a mistimed tackle or a cynical foul.

Imo, the issue is whether the punishment fits the crime. It's not about what a player intended to do, it is a question of whether or not the opportunity denied the attacking team merits a certain punishment.

For me, any obvious goal-scoring opportunity denied by a foul outside the area should be punished by a red card, as the resulting free-kick isn't as a good a chance as the chance the foul denied them. But for fouls where penalties are given, I think that there are situations where the double-whammy of a red card also is too harsh.

The only thing I can think of is to come up with terminology to change (or add to) 'clear goal-scoring opportunity' or whatever the wording is. Perhaps something like 'denying an inevitable goal' being deemed a red-card offense, to cater for the Suarez handball situations or similar.

The argument that 'the players know the rules' is pretty empty by itself too. Players are always aware of the rules, but rules are changed if it is believed a change will improve the game. Offside rules, backpass rule, are examples of this.

[geysir]

Defenders should get better at defending and not rely on last ditch tackles to save the day!

Don't think Ballack was in the league of Suarez, Young and Gerrard when it comes to falling over. I'm struggling to think of him having a 'diving' incident. I'm sure there will be one out there but he was a fairly honest player.
The last ditch tackle is not always so black and white, yet the rule doesn't discriminate. It's not always an ignorance of the rules or an ignorance of the art of defending, sometimes collisions just happen with a goalie making an honest attempt, sometimes the onrushing attacker shifts direction to get taken out by a goalie's hand or a defender's foot.

No, Ballack was not in the first division of divers but he was a persistent enough offender for Bayern, Germany and when he first came to Chelsea, probably was shamed into cutting it out of his game. I remember one or two of his dives early on in the epl caused great controversy. An irony was, when he was with Bayern and dived to win Bayern a late penalty in a CL knockout game against Chelsea, he was heavily criticised by Chelsea players and called an effin' cheating diver :)

[DeLorean]

For me, any obvious goal-scoring opportunity denied by a foul outside the area should be punished by a red card, as the resulting free-kick isn't as a good a chance as the chance the foul denied them. But for fouls where penalties are given, I think that there are situations where the double-whammy of a red card also is too harsh.

I think that's a bit too harsh on the guy who committed the foul outside the box, compared with the guy who fouled inside. Why should he deserve a red card because he fouled the attacker further from goal?

What about a penalty being awarded for all professional fouls, regardless of whether it's committed inside or outside the penalty area? A yellow card should suffice for the defender unless the foul was dangerous also. That way, the team isn't denied their excellent goal scoring opportunity and the game isn't ruined i.e. no double-whammy.

[DannyInvincible]

But for fouls where penalties are given, I think that there are situations where the double-whammy of a red card also is too harsh.

Couldn't have worded it better myself! :p

[IsMiseSean]

What do people make of Tommy Martin on TV3? Since Bill is retiring after the WC, I reckon he would be a good replacement...

[geysir]

It's Darragh's to lose.

[Charlie Darwin]

What do people make of Tommy Martin on TV3? Since Bill is retiring after the WC, I reckon he would be a good replacement...
When was the last time you saw a sports broadcaster jump from TV3 to RTE? Apart from Dunphy, of course. I do think Tommy Martin is very impressive, but RTE is a very tough place to get into, or out of.

[osarusan]

I think that's a bit too harsh on the guy who committed the foul outside the box, compared with the guy who fouled inside. Why should he deserve a red card because he fouled the attacker further from goal?


The difference for me is the liklihood of the resulting free kick or penalty. If a penalty is an equal or even better opportunity than the opportunity denied by a fould, then I think a red on top is too harsh.

If the resulting free kick is not as good a goal-scoring opportunity, then the player should be sent off.

If the penalty isn't as alikely to lead to a goal as the chance denied by a foul, that should be a red card also.

As examples:

Suarez handball: red card and penalty, as the liklihood of scoring a penalty is less likely than the occurance of a goal if he hadn't handled it.

Demichelis foul on Messi: penalty and yellow card, as I think the penalty is as good a chance as Messi would have had anyway.

Demichelis foul on Messi if it had happened 5 yards further up the pitch: red card, as the resulting free kick isn't as good a chance as Messi would have had.



What about a penalty being awarded for all professional fouls, regardless of whether it's committed inside or outside the penalty area? A yellow card should suffice for the defender unless the foul was dangerous also. That way, the team isn't denied their excellent goal scoring opportunity and the game isn't ruined i.e. no double-whammy.

Awarding penalties for fouls outside the box: do we need to redefine professional fould for this? Are we differentiating between deliberate foul and mis-timed tackle?

[IsMiseSean]

When was the last time you saw a sports broadcaster jump from TV3 to RTE? Apart from Dunphy, of course. I do think Tommy Martin is very impressive, but RTE is a very tough place to get into, or out of.

I agree, it's very unlikely to happen. Especially when Ryle 'I can't get enough eggball on RTE' Nugent in charge...

[Real ale Madrid]

I agree, it's very unlikely to happen. Especially when Ryle 'I can't get enough eggball on RTE' Nugent in charge...

It's eggchasing - not eggball.

I've stuck up for the rte panel on numerous occasions on this thread - but even I had to turn Dunphy off last week after the Arsenal / Munich game. Appalling!

[TheOneWhoKnocks]

It's eggchasing - not eggball.

I've stuck up for the rte panel on numerous occasions on this thread - but even I had to turn Dunphy off last week after the Arsenal / Munich game. Appalling!

Let me guess. Talking about how crap Bayern Munich's players are, particularly their defenders, as if the lack of quality defenders isn't endemic in football in general.

[IsMiseSean]

It's eggchasing - not eggball.


The ball is shaped like an egg and they chase it. Both work!!

[tetsujin1979]

It's eggchasing - not eggball.

I've stuck up for the rte panel on numerous occasions on this thread - but even I had to turn Dunphy off last week after the Arsenal / Munich game. Appalling!some classics from him at the weekend after the draw was that Germany are not guaranteed to win the group (they are) and that we should write off the last seven years of Irish international football. He didn't mention if that should include the first qualification for a tournament in a decade, but I presume so.

[Mr A]

Classic Dunphy, at the start of a manager's reign you put on the green shirt and build up expectation. Then you turn on them later getting increasingly hysterical throughout.

He even did it during Noel King's brief reign, which was hilarious to watch unfold.

[KK77]

Classic Dunphy, at the start of a manager's reign you put on the green shirt and build up expectation. Then you turn on them later getting increasingly hysterical throughout.

He even did it during Noel King's brief reign, which was hilarious to watch unfold.

So true. Heard him on radio one when Noel King was put in charge and announced the squad and it went along the lines of......Noel is a good guy, Noel is a football man, Noel has picked a squad Trap should have been picking, Noel has done the ground work for the new man and then........if Noel does well he could be in for the job and why not. We know what happened next. All the manager's go the same way from start to finish under Dunphy as you say.

[geysir]

RTE panel's intrepid sideline reporter Tony O'Donoghue (http://www.rte.ie/sport/player/813/506961/)was at it again last night, this time his target was Mourinho who found himself caught between a wall and a manically grinning midget waving a huge microphone. Straight off the bat, somewhere in a 10 line scatterbrained question, Tony blatantly stated that Chelsea were not a good team, like the other good teams. After a considered,intelligent and honest assessment of the Chelsea performance by Mourinho, a reply that went way over Tony's head,
he (Tony) accused some 3 or 4 players of being silly because they picked up yellow cards,to which Mourinho could only shrug and say "that's life".

Tony was momentarily stunned by the brevity but saved by the clipboard, he managed to mutter the third question and alluded to Chelsea being bog standard in a bog standard league, a statement which rendered Mourinho almost speechless, 'I have nothing to say on that, I do my job and you experts do yours'.

RTE sent a full commentary team (including O'Donoghue and a camera operator) to Turkey for this 'highlight' of their night.

[Charlie Darwin]

Gilesy showing admirable restraint as per usual


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ks8JjSBcQAo

[NeverFeltBetter]

RTE panel's intrepid sideline reporter Tony O'Donoghue (http://www.rte.ie/sport/player/813/506961/)was at it again last night, this time his target was Mourinho who found himself caught between a wall and a manically grinning midget waving a huge microphone. Straight off the bat, somewhere in a 10 line scatterbrained question, Tony blatantly stated that Chelsea were not a good team, like the other good teams. After a considered,intelligent and honest assessment of the Chelsea performance by Mourinho, a reply that went way over Tony's head,
he (Tony) accused some 3 or 4 players of being silly because they picked up yellow cards,to which Mourinho could only shrug and say "that's life".

Tony was momentarily stunned by the brevity but saved by the clipboard, he managed to mutter the third question and alluded to Chelsea being bog standard in a bog standard league, a statement which rendered Mourinho almost speechless, 'I have nothing to say on that, I do my job and you experts do yours'.

RTE sent a full commentary team (including O'Donoghue and a camera operator) to Turkey for this 'highlight' of their night.

He's an utter troll. I cannot watch him anymore after the way he accosted Noel King.

[Grafter]

=

RTE sent a full commentary team (including O'Donoghue and a camera operator) to Turkey for this 'highlight' of their night.


Why in Gods name was O' Donoghue in Turkey, it's not as if it was a match filled with Irish interest?

[geysir]

Why in Gods name was O' Donoghue in Turkey, it's not as if it was a match filled with Irish interest?
Nobody needs to go there, RTE can just do what any other small tv network does, save a small fortune and do the commentary in a sound studio over the live feed. It can just sound the same to the viewer, it can even sound better if they have a half decent sound engineer.

[DeLorean]

As examples:

Suarez handball: red card and penalty, as the liklihood of scoring a penalty is less likely than the occurance of a goal if he hadn't handled it.

Demichelis foul on Messi: penalty and yellow card, as I think the penalty is as good a chance as Messi would have had anyway.

Demichelis foul on Messi if it had happened 5 yards further up the pitch: red card, as the resulting free kick isn't as good a chance as Messi would have had.

Yeah that's interesting and good examples. I'm just not sure referees can be trusted to decide what the better chance would be, a penalty or a guy running through on goal. Devil's advocate here, but that could even vary from team to team. Fernando Torres, for example, was a lethal finisher in his time at Liverpool, but a poor penalty taker. If Liverpool were notoriously poor from spot kicks, does this mean that Torres running through on goal is always a better bet than a penalty, therefore professional fouls on Torres are always denying a more probable goal than a resulting spot kick?

And the other extreme, say Southampton in the Le Tissier days... well I think Le Tissier's penalties would always have been a more reliable bet than Neil Shipperley racing towards goal in a one on one! Taking that into account, the only red cards issued for offenders against Southampton would be as a result of a Suarez handball type incident.

Fair enough if you believe they can avoid individual factors like that but, even so, I think it might open a can of worms. Very few incidents are as clear cut as the Suarez handball, for example, and a huge percentage are fairly subjective. I think the more clearly defined it is, the better for everybody.


Awarding penalties for fouls outside the box: do we need to redefine professional foul for this? Are we differentiating between deliberate foul and mistimed tackle?

I don't think so really. As it stands red cards are issued in both cases, accidental or not. If they are being punished for denying a clear goal scoring opportunity (regardless of whether it was outside or inside), then surely the logical leveller for the attacking team is to be awarded a clear goal scoring opportunity i.e. a penalty. As for the punishment to the offending player, perhaps a yellow card is enough in all circumstances with the exception of dangerous play. Either that or have a yellow, or even nothing, for non-cynical and a red for cynical.

[DeLorean]

Was Soccer Republic any good last night? Does anybody know if it's repeated?

[paul_oshea]

Paul McGrath was on.

[Dodge]

Was Soccer Republic any good last night? Does anybody know if it's repeated?

Not repeated. On the RTE player (island of Ireland only). Show was 90% LOI related. 3/4 minute interview with Martin O'Neill at the end. They spoke to McGrath about various things but mostly used as an analyst rather than an interviewee.

Fprmat OK but not much in it for non-LOI heads

[Lionel Ritchie]

I thought McGrath did quite well on it actually. According to the man himself he is very, very nervous when speaking in front of a camera or into a microphone but it didn't come across that way -nor did it appear he'd had anything of a liquid nature to steady his nerve. Hope it works out for him. I know very few people with a bad word for that guy. I think people just like to see him kick on and look after himself.

[DannyInvincible]

I know very few people with a bad word for that guy.

Is there anyone? He's the epitome of humility.

[bennocelt]

Anyone know how i can get to see it here in mainland europe, a torrent, link or how to use a proxy, cheers?!

[Closed Account]

Anyone know how i can get to see it here in mainland europe, a torrent, link or how to use a proxy, cheers?!
For chrome and firefox you can download the MediaHint (https://mediahint.com/) extension. Works for someone in Spain with both RTE and BBC.

[paul_oshea]

It works as a proxy?

[Closed Account]

It works as a proxy?

Yes.
_

[Crosby87]

they mentioned these two sitting with e/o last week.
http://f3.thejournal.ie/media/2014/03/keanegiles-2.jpg

[DannyInvincible]

For chrome and firefox you can download the MediaHint (https://mediahint.com/) extension. Works for someone in Spain with both RTE and BBC.

Doesn't seem to work now. According to a recent review, it's stopped working since it was added to the Chrome Web Store. So, what else does it actually do?

[Sheridan]

Lads, Hola Unblocker (for Firefox and Chrome) is generally the most user-friendly plug-in for circumventing geoblocking.

[DannyInvincible]

Lads, Hola Unblocker (for Firefox and Chrome) is generally the most user-friendly plug-in for circumventing geoblocking.

Gave it a try but doesn't seem to work for RTÉ Player either, unfortunately.

[Closed Account]

Doesn't seem to work now. According to a recent review, it's stopped working since it was added to the Chrome Web Store. So, what else does it actually do?
It still works for me for BBC, ITV, Hulu, etc. Can't test it on RTE Player though so apologies for suggesting it for that.

[geysir]

It still works for me for BBC, ITV, Hulu, etc. Can't test it on RTE Player though so apologies for suggesting it for that.
I find Media Hint (https://mediahint.com/)works with RTE and BBC, you don't have to apologise, you can tell Danny to eff off :)

But my usage is conditional, I'm using Macos and I can only get it to work on Chrome.
And it didn't work to begin with, I needed to restart.
Firefox is weak on Macos to begin with and just goes into an infinite loop when trying to use the proxy extension, but that maybe just my experience.

[KK77]

Have last nights recorded. Enjoyed last weeks and the interview with Keith Fahey.

[DannyInvincible]

Bill quotes made-up stats (http://balls.ie/football/bill-oherlihy-quotes-guardians-made-stat-david-moyes-gospel/) from Daniel Harris' tongue-in-cheek transfer gossip column (http://www.theguardian.com/football/2014/mar/18/the-rumour-mill-diego-simeone-costa-manchester-united?CMP=twt_gu) as fact last night:


By now we’re all familiar with Billo’s penchant for throwing out a random quote from the sports section of a newspaper and seeing what the panel say in response. It sometimes produces great debate and TV gold, but last night he may have had the wool pulled over his eyes by Daniel Harris of The Guardian.

Harris wrote in his tongue-in-cheek transfer gossip column that ‘The former Manchester United manager David Moyes spent 10 months watching 39,432 players a total of 5,097,301 times, only to sign Marouane Fellaini and Juan Mata.’

Now this is obviously a joke – a throwaway remark. Unfortunately not everyone realised this…


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k05L2ghFxqc

[geysir]

George also struggled with the maths in the commentary. When Man Utd were leading 3-0 (3-2 on aggregate), George said a number of times, 'if Olympiakos score one, then United have to score 2'.

[DeLorean]

Yeah, I think he takes the common expression "the away goal is worth double" too literally.

My biggest away goal pet hate though - When the away team win the first leg 1-0 and they say it was vital to score an "away goal", even though that away goal can't possibly count as anything other than a regular goal.

[pineapple stu]

Heard someone down the pub during the Greek leg of the Olympiakos-United game saying that if United pulled one back (to 2-1 down), the tie would be level as away goals count double.

That phrase just needs to be eradicated from football, tbh.

[DeLorean]

I would just eradicate the away goal rule.

[Charlie Darwin]

I would just eradicate goals.

[geysir]

I would change pubs.

[tetsujin1979]

I would eliminate speaking

[Junior]

Barstoolers!

[DannyInvincible]

George also struggled with the maths in the commentary. When Man Utd were leading 3-0 (3-2 on aggregate), George said a number of times, 'if Olympiakos score one, then United have to score 2'.

He's a struggler. I walked past a sandwich eatery in Spinningfields this afternoon on the way to work and happened to spot George, of all people, through the window struggling to gobble up a freshly-stuffed baguette for lunch.

[geysir]

He'd be struggling anyway if all the high stools were occupied.

[John83]

Barstoolers!
I, too, would just eradicate barstoolers.

[OwlsFan]

The senior analyst for the PSG vs Chelsea game last night said "Eamon tells me that PSG are running away with the French league". Surely this is something the senior analyst should be aware of himself without relying on someone else to tell him. My wife's nephew, who was watching the game with me, thought it was an unbelievable comment from a so-called expert about to give us the low down on PSG so it wasn't just me.